[00:00] Rebrand it with your name and launch lunchpad.net. [00:03] lunchpad lol [00:04] there are lots of useful readme's at least [00:08] hmm, I think we need to do a "Notes for translators", or publicise it or somethign [00:09] why whats been asked? [00:09] it's more people translating bits of the commands that shouldn't have been [00:09] contrary to https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/+question/106598 [00:10] I see, i am off it is getting late. night all [00:10] * dutchie wonders if there are a few errors in godbyk's style guide [00:17] OK, looks like I'll be asleep before godbyk is back, so I'll add what I think is wrong below: [00:18] should the text in \warning be red? same for \advanced [00:19] also, it's probably worth mentioning the plural option to \newglosaryentry [00:19] the style guide needs more publicity too :) [00:22] ooh, the bit mentioning \button in the GUI elements section table is missing a backslash [00:31] if I see "these branches have diverged" one more time, I'm going to hurt somebody [00:36] \o/ pushed successfully [00:36] now, bed [00:52] I'm back now. [00:53] dutchie: what bugs did you find in the style guide? [01:03] fixing 'em now. [01:28] I've uploaded an updated style guide. [01:28] I'll send an email to the list about it soon. [06:52] can someone tell me what happens if you try to start a computer without a processor/broken one? [06:53] humphreybc: the bios will beep at you and nothing will boot [06:54] so the bios will show? [06:54] i think i *may* have fried a processor, i'm not getting anything out of the VGA port [06:54] ie, the monitor reckons there is no connection [06:54] (I had the CPU running fanlessly and then without a heatsink for a bit, it's only a pentium 3 733 mhz) [06:55] any idea? [06:56] i might try the computer hooked up to another monitor, see what happens [06:56] humphreybc: does the computer beep a sequence/code when you turn it on? [06:56] i don't think so [06:56] humphreybc: you ran it with no heatsink!? [06:56] it just beeps once like usual [06:57] nisshh: only without the heatsink for a few seconds, i think the heatsink gel stuff is busted anyway [06:57] make sure you have the monitor plugged into the right port (if you have an on-board and external monitor port/card) [06:57] humphreybc: and if you can access the bios then make sure the inbuilt vga in enabled [06:58] or whichever is supposed to be enabled [06:58] can't access the bios, monitor is plugged into the only port there is [06:58] it was working before [06:58] i pulled it apart because the CPU fan was rattling, turns out it's stuffed [06:58] it appears my motherboard prefers PATA or SATA drives so it refuses to boot my new SATA drive lol [06:58] so i put it all back together without the fan to see how it went fanless [06:59] anyway, it seemed to start up okay but no display [06:59] humphreybc: was it working ok before you fiddled with the cpu? [06:59] yeah [07:00] I reset the bios by removing the power and taking out the battery [07:00] that didn't change anything [07:00] humphreybc: you may have discharged some static onto the motherboard and fired it [07:00] fried* [07:00] mebbe [07:00] or, you changed something else and havent corrected it yet [07:01] go through a checklist and tick everything off as you go [07:01] nah i haven't changed anything else. i've worked on a few computers, never really done much with the CPU thugh [07:01] though* [07:01] i'm looking at a new one now [07:01] http://www.trademe.co.nz/Computers/Components/CPUs/Intel/auction-282110257.htm [07:01] but i'll give it a shot on a different monitor [07:01] it's not a very expensive computer [07:02] what are you planning on using a p3 for? [07:02] i've already got a P3 [07:02] it's a socket 370 so that's the best in that socket [07:02] it's an old dell thing [07:02] what so your main comp is a p3?? [07:02] got it for $50 [07:02] hahaha no no [07:02] this is like my 3rd computer [07:02] hehe [07:02] was a bit worried there [07:02] it serves as a guest PC for my mums bed and breakfast [07:03] ah cool [07:03] i was trying to put lubuntu on it actually but the installer died [07:03] yea i dont know if even lubuntu will work on it [07:03] you might need a non graphical installer [07:03] like DSL or something [07:04] yeah true [07:04] i downloaded arch linux today [07:04] i had ubuntu on it first, that was shit slow, then tried xubuntu, that was worse [07:04] (all installed using alternate CD) [07:04] hehe [07:05] why not install ubuntu and then install lubuntu-desktop and switch it over that way [07:05] i know people running that on p2s [07:05] true [07:05] i could try that [07:05] first i gotta get the CPU working [07:05] how much RAM? [07:05] 512 SD [07:05] lol yea true [07:05] i have to figure out if the mobo is fried [07:05] meh thats not bad for a p3 [07:05] if it is there's no point in buying that 1.4GHz [07:06] if you wanna know if the mobos fried unplug everything and take out the cpu and ram and just power up the mobo on its own [07:06] and then what happens? [07:07] well it should just sit there running [07:07] or not work at all if its busted [07:07] k [07:07] brb [07:07] ok [07:07] cool! [07:08] rainbow text is awesome! [07:08] removed the RAM and CPU and it boots up okay and just stays there [07:08] well [07:08] not boots up [07:09] but the mobo runs [07:09] ok well atleast it runs [07:09] i don't think i've fried the mobo [07:09] yea [07:09] i might buy this 1.4GHz anyway, it's in chch [07:09] i'll pick it up tomorrow (or tonight) [07:10] ok [07:10] it might be the cpu thats trashed [07:10] yeah maybe [07:10] i wonder if stock ubuntu will run on a 1.4 with 512mb ran [07:10] ram* [07:10] well [07:10] run wel [07:10] well* [07:10] it might run but itll be shit [07:11] especially with old SD ram [07:11] true [07:11] Red_HamsterX: I've installed the newly compiled php program, and your zips work now. [07:11] i cant believe my mobo doesnt liek booting from a SATA [07:11] That took more hours than I care to think about. :-( [07:11] useless [07:12] stupid libraries that don't want to compile 64-bit versions suck! [07:12] godbyk: tell me about it just spent 6 hours last night doing reinstalls trying to boot my sata drive [07:13] As a developer, I'm pretty comfortable compiling things. But I hate it when someone else's code doesn't compile because it's missing some dependency that they don't tell me about in the README or INSTALL file. [07:13] It's also frustrating working on a box that I don't have root access to. [07:13] Talk about tying my hands! [07:13] I'd've been done with the whole thing in like 2 minutes if I had root access. [07:13] But no.. can't do that! [07:14] godbyk: sounds tough :) [07:14] Anyway, if you go to http://screenshots.ubuntu-manual.org/, you can download a zip file of all the English screenshots now. [07:14] cool! [07:54] humphreybc: the bzr script is starting to come good now [08:02] nisshh: what bzr script is that? [08:05] godbyk: me and humphreybc agreed to create a script that installed and setup bzr then downloaded the latest code from lp:ubuntu-manual [08:06] godbyk: to make it much easier for noobs to help out [08:06] godbyk: im working on it now [08:07] alot of people seemed to be getting stuck when trying to branch stuff and pull code [08:07] cool [08:07] so this should hopefully fix that [08:08] wouldn't ground control be helpful there, too? [08:08] yes i suppose it would [08:08] i might add that to the wiki [08:10] I don't know how easy it is to get gc running these days, but it seemed somewhat okay when I used it last. [08:11] yea its still pretty new and i know there are alot of bugs [08:11] ill have to test it [08:11] and see how stable it is [08:12] then make a decision [08:22] thorwil: the Biolinum font doesn't have Arabic glyphs, so I think inkscape is falling back on another font. [08:24] godbyk: hmm. the main thing is it works [08:25] thorwil: True. [08:25] thorwil: So if you want to start cranking out title pages, I'm cool with that. :) [08:26] godbyk: need a script to create the SVGs with the right names and translates strings inside. and a list of fonts that i will need [08:27] thorwil: I can probably do something like that. is there a way I can id the svg element/tag that contains the title, author, and edition text? [08:27] godbyk: inkscape can't embed fonts, so i guess we have to export with text converted to paths? [08:28] thorwil: if it can't embed fonts (in PDFs), then yeah, we'll have to export to paths, I guess. [08:28] godbyk: the relevant elements already have IDs [08:29] thorwil: where are the letter and A4 title page SVGs that you created again? [08:31] godbyk: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~t-w-/%2Bjunk/ubuntu_manual_cover/files/50 [08:31] i though i added them to the main branch, but seems i didn't [08:32] godbyk: let me add them to the main branch. i also have to make sure "Second Edition" is hidden [08:33] thorwil: okay, thanks. [08:33] I've downloaded them and am looking through them now. [08:33] I'll see if I can whip up a quick script. [08:33] godbyk: the relevant IDs are "title" and "team" [08:35] godbyk: but i bet a dumb text search-and-replace will be easier than something XML based and entirely sufficient [08:38] thorwil: well, first, it helps if I download the svg files themselves instead the html pretty-print of the svg file. :-/ [08:39] godbyk: there are download links on the far right, the green arrows ;) but nm, i'm about to add them to the main branch [08:40] Looking at the title element, there's font-family and then there's -inkscape-font-specification. think those should always be set equal? [08:40] yeah, I found those links after poring over one of the files. [08:40] I was thinking it looked like the nastiest svg ever, since everything was html-encoded. :-) [08:40] godbyk: yes, they should. i have no clue why there's -inkscape-font-specification but i'm sure it can cause trouble ;) [08:41] lol.. no doubt. [08:41] so here's what I'm thinking for the script as a first approximation: we'll just run the svg's through sed and do a global find/replace on the 'Getting Started with...' and 'The Ubuntu Manual Team' strings. [08:41] godbyk: can i delete the other stuff in the titlepage dir? [08:41] also global find/replace on the font names to the appropriate fonts. [08:42] thorwil: yes, please do. [08:42] you might also want to give a label to the 'Second Edition' text block. [08:43] since we'll be using that soon enough. [08:48] godbyk: pushed [08:48] thanks. [08:48] I'm writing the script now. [08:48] godbyk: added _en to the filenames, even for the RTL one :) [08:49] 'kay. [08:50] godbyk: it has the ID "second_edition" ;) but visibility is controlled via the "second edition" layer [08:51] not a problem. [09:04] morning [09:05] good morning [09:05] hey, ubuntujenkins. I finished compiling php (finally!) and the zip file thing works now. [09:05] yey thanks godbyk [09:05] if you complain that imap-ssl doesn't work I will slap you. hard. [09:06] morning thorwil [09:06] (some stupid dependencies wouldn't compile on 64-bit for some reason) [09:07] strange [09:13] godbyk: can you please delete http://screenshots.ubuntu-manual.org/data/03-wireless-authentication@en@1270155084.png and http://screenshots.ubuntu-manual.org/data/03-evolution-event@en@1270164997.png [09:14] ubuntujenkins: done [09:14] thanks [09:26] thorwil: I've got a script that looks up the string translations. [09:26] now I need to make a table or something that holds the font info. [09:46] cool [10:00] wow this is strange if the screenshot of 03-evolution-enter-password if it is taken with compiz it has close and minimize buttons. But with metacy it only has close [10:11] thorwil: I've pushed the initial script into the branch. [10:11] if you pull the branch, then go to the titlepage/ dir. [10:12] run ./generate-title-pages.sh [10:12] it will barf out a ton of SVGs. one per language. [10:12] open up a few in inkscape and make sure it's change the fonts and translating the text as you'd expect. [10:12] (if should also change some of the pages to RTL) [10:13] I wouldn't bother tweaking the title pages quite yet until we finish filling out the ubuntu-manual-locale database with the properties of all the languages we're translating to. [10:13] godbyk: ok, thanks [10:13] thorwil: I think it's rather impressive, if I do say so myself. :-) [10:13] lol [10:14] Generating 55 title pages in a matter of seconds. [10:14] thorwil: oh, I had to edit the template SVGs to set the 10.04 in lining figures so the translations would work. [10:15] the old-style figures were using private use area characters and so the string didn't match what was in the po files. [10:15] godbyk: the _em files should be renamed to_template or something like that, then. and the pre-edit files be put back as _en versions [10:16] thorwil: good point. [10:16] thorwil: do you want to do that, or shall I? [10:16] godbyk: you, please :) [10:16] 'kay. [10:17] * thorwil gets sqlite3 [10:18] oh yeah, you'll need sqlite3. [10:18] godbyk: msgfmt: error while opening "/home/thorwil/bzr/ubuntu-manual/po//*.po" for reading: No such file or directory [10:18] figured that'd be the easiest way to make a small table of locale info (language code, language name, paper size, fonts, text direction) [10:18] thorwil: oh, right. that's hard-coded. [10:18] at the top of the file, find the POFILES_DIR and edit that [10:19] it should point to ubuntu-manual/po/ [10:19] wherever you keep that. [10:19] I'll be making it a command-line option soon. [10:20] godbyk: does it work with a relative path? [10:21] sure. [10:21] it should, I think. [10:21] :) [10:22] yes, from within titlepage: POFILES_DIR="../po/" [10:22] 'kay. I'll use that for now. [10:22] since we'll be the only ones running it anyway. [10:23] godbyk: could you leave the text figures in for all languages using Biolinum? [10:24] thorwil: maybe. it'll be a special case of sorts. [10:24] because we use that string to pull the translation from the po file [10:24] and the text figures don't use the same unicode chars in the po file and the svg file. [10:25] if you open the svg file with text figs, you'll see they are funky chars. [10:25] but the po file has "10.04" [10:25] so we have to match that exactly. [10:25] *nice* [10:26] yeah. no one's interested in making our lives easier, apparently. :-/ [10:26] the german translation of "ubuntu manual team" feels odd [10:28] godbyk: af and bg, among other, are not translated. i guess that's because the strings are not translated, yet? [10:28] Das Ubuntu-Handbuchteam? [10:28] thorwil: correct. [10:29] thorwil: I reverted to your original English SVGs and made new template SVGs. [10:29] godbyk: i'd consider to not translate Manual Team for German, but then again, i don't won't to get into the translation business at all [10:29] godbyk: excellent [10:30] godbyk: something is wrong with fa. title in BOLD text, english [10:30] might be the font. [10:30] title wasn't translated, but a different font was selected. [10:40] thorwil: I'm going to bed now. But if you come up with anything else the title page generation script should do, let me know. [10:40] I'll try to get more languages in the locale database, too. [10:42] G'night, all. [10:46] k, gnite [13:02] godbyk: Thanks very much for compiling a style guide. So very helpful for writers and editors alike. [14:05] what's the meaning of "conventions" in the manual? [14:05] "Conventions used in this book" for ex. [14:07] yes Ddorda [14:08] ubuntujenkins: what yes? what's the meaning? :P [14:08] I gave an ex. from the manual itself so you'll understand what Im talking about [14:09] I realise now I am just thinking of the best way to explain it [14:12] semioticrobotic: are you able to help explain Ddorda's question i can't think of the right way to. [14:13] ubuntujenkins: maybe it's something ike an agreement between everyone? [14:13] some kind of way of doing things that everyone agrees with it [14:14] yes, its explaining how we always display the text in buttons in the same way. Or the window title text [14:18] convention means treaty, agreement, pact [14:30] I see, just what I thought :D [14:33] and what's typographic? [14:48] hi all [14:48] sorry, I stepped out for a moment [14:49] Ddorda: When we speak of "conventions" most generally, we're talking about acceptable standards and practices -- ways of doing things "correctly" [14:50] semioticrobotic: yea, I understood that. [14:50] When I say "correctly," of course, I mean that the group has agreed on what this means, and everyone is then expected to follow the conventions accordingly [14:50] how about typographic? [14:50] In terms of the manual, this typically refers to stylistic conventions [14:52] we have stylistic guidelines for ways in which certain elements appear in the manual (what's bolded, what's italicized, what's bracketed, etc.), and the ways in which we write (when to use "you" when addressing the reader/user, etc.) [14:52] semioticrobotic: I see, thanks :D [14:52] *translated!* [14:52] you're welcome, Ddorda [14:53] we stand on 21% translated ATM :D [14:53] * semioticrobotic cheers [14:56] I hope we will get to 30% today, even it's sounds a little impossible :P [19:48] * godbyk is alive again. [19:52] * Ddorda is shocked [19:52] :D [19:54] hello godbyk o/ [22:02] hello Ddorda [22:02] * daker [22:02] hi @all [22:06] what's up ? [22:08] the sky :P [22:09] :p [22:09] not much it has been very quite here [22:11] * daker is reading the logs [22:12] that will take two mins then [22:12] is there any progress in the translations ? [22:13] looks like some more than others [22:13] kk [22:14] I have approved some screenshots today. and Red_Hamster-X 's button replacing script works [22:14] cool [22:17] ubuntujenkins: hey [22:18] hello Ddorda I pinged you by mistake. but how are the translations going today? [22:18] ubuntujenkins: not as well as yesterday since I had to study [22:18] o/ [22:18] ubuntujenkins: but if everything will go fine we will finish with the shots [22:18] godbyk, godbyk-android !!! [22:18] I was suppose to study, but I did go for a run [22:18] cool Ddorda [22:19] dutchie: o/ [22:19] daker: ! [22:20] i need you to setup an database [22:20] a* [22:20] does it involve php :P [22:20] yes for the statistics [22:21] daker: okay. do you have the sql or table design? [22:22] one sec :) [22:22] daker: I want to talk to you about making the test site the main site (with the addition of the countdown page as the home page for now). [22:22] daker: also, working on the downloads stuff. [22:22] oki [22:24] brb [22:26] godbyk, check your email [22:27] ubuntujenkins, whats going on with the branches ? is there a new branches ? [22:29] there are new branches not sure which one has the website in. But godbyk was going to work with you to set up a website branch under ubuntu-manaul-website project page [22:29] oki [22:30] he has to change the server over correctly [22:30] night all [22:31] bye [22:42] okay, I'm back now. [22:43] frak. so apparently the default search provider for ubuntu will be switched back to google for 10.04. [22:44] o.o [22:44] o.O [22:45] * ubuntujenkins isn't that tired [22:45] the default search engine has changed again https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2010-April/030589.html [22:46] * ubuntujenkins files manual and quickshot bugs [22:46] ubuntujenkins: I just forwarded the msg to the ubuntu-manual mailing list, too. [22:46] I wish they would make their minds up [22:47] ubuntujenkins: agreed. on a number of issues. [22:50] daker: so fill me in on the two tables you have here. [22:50] bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/+bug/557655 [22:50] Launchpad bug 557655 in quickshot "Default search engine has changed" [Low,In progress] [22:51] it is also filed for the manual project [22:51] ubuntujenkins: do we need to delete some existing screenshots so they're retaken? [22:51] I am just checking but i think that will be the case. we may wait untill the change is in place [22:51] they didn't say when they'd have the new search engine in place.. only that it'd be there by April 15. :-/ [22:54] I think an addition to the button replacemet script may have to change the search engine in the full screen firefox shot its still on yahoo http://start.ubuntu.com/10.04/ [22:55] ubuntujenkins: of write instructions for having the screenshot-taker select google first. [22:57] godbyk: we can for http://screenshots.ubuntu-manual.org/data/03-searchbar-firefox@it@1270306020.png but the start page is customised by cononical [22:57] ubuntujenkins: ah, good point. I forgot about the start page (since it's pretty much the first thing I change). [22:57] 0 [22:57] oops [22:57] same here [22:58] hey, dutchie. [22:58] hi godbyk [22:58] will you make canonical stop changing things after we've documented them? :) [22:58] its so anoying [22:58] I could go and camp out in front of millbank tower :) [22:58] lol [22:58] please do [22:58] we should have a picket line [22:58] lol [22:58] protesting canonical breaking the freezes. [23:07] godbyk, what ? [23:09] daker: explain how you're using these database tables. what's the logs.fireign_id field for? what's the difference between the logs and urls tables? [23:10] urls stores the download urls [23:11] logs stores the log, for each click i store IP, country, referer.... [23:11] what is the urls.clicks field for? won't there be one record per 'click'/download? [23:11] urls.clicks stores the numbers of clicks [23:12] you won't have more than one click per timestamp+ip+url, will you? [23:13] at the moment now [23:13] but i'll do it if you want [23:13] godbyk: can you please delete all of the 03-searchbar-firefox* screenshots EXCEPT http://screenshots.ubuntu-manual.org/data/03-searchbar-firefox@de@1270275743.png http://screenshots.ubuntu-manual.org/data/03-searchbar-firefox@ta@1270543906.png [23:14] ubuntujenkins: done. [23:14] thanks [23:15] daker: will there ever be more than one click per record? [23:15] daker: also, it might be handy to store the language code in there somewhere, too. so we can see how many people are viewing each translated site. [23:18] one click per record wi [23:20] that includes (referrer,user_agent,ip and code country) [23:21] daker: I think the db server has finished setting itself up now. if you email me an updated sql file, I'll create the tables for you and email you the connection info. [23:21] oki [23:22] daker: Also, I'd like to make the 'test' site the main site soon, if we can. We'll need to copy the countdown page and temporarily remove the download link from the nav bar, but otherwise, I think it's working pretty well, right? [23:22] daker: We should probably move the website to its own branch, too. [23:23] now ? [23:23] daker: Whenever you think it's ready. [23:24] but as soon as possible [23:24] ;) [23:24] now [23:24] 'kay. :) [23:26] bloody diverged branches [23:26] dutchie: whatcha working on? [23:26] nothing, just trying to pull [23:27] ah [23:27] stuff merging, bzr pull --overwrite it is [23:29] godbyk, dutchie, how do I process [23:29] daker: process what? [23:30] i got the branch bzr branch lp:ubuntu-manual-website [23:30] dutchie: in a couple minutes, I'll have you generate a new pot for the lucid-e1 branch so the translators can update the yahoo->google thing. [23:30] oh goody [23:30] I think our window controls button order may be wrong, too. I'm trying to find the text. [23:31] and what ? should i delete everything in the branch ? [23:31] I think it is godbyk i filed a bug on it [23:31] arpund the desktop section? [23:31] *around [23:31]