[02:23] <eggonlea> NCommander: Great! Could we use NFS root with default uImage/uInitrd/rootfs now?
[02:23] <NCommander> eggonlea: you have to rebuild the uInitrd for NFS mode
[02:23] <NCommander> eggonlea: its not difficult
[02:23] <NCommander> eggonlea: once you do that, it should just work
[02:24] <NCommander> eggonlea: basically, you'll have to TFTP a boot.scr file that will download a uImage and uInitrd, set the command line, and boot
[02:24] <eggonlea> But why? I've looked into the initramfs which should have the ability to mount NFS already.
[02:24] <NCommander> eggonlea: it does, but you need to flip the switch to tell it to actually try and do that ;-)
[02:24] <eggonlea> And actually I've tried that before with default initramfs. It did work.
[02:25] <NCommander> eggonlea: hrm, interesting. Where'd you run into problems then?
[02:25] <eggonlea> the problem is in 1) /etc/fstab; 2) /etc/network/interface; and 3) /etc/init/network-manager
[02:25]  * NCommander got tripped up by finding out you have to set rw on the command line
[02:25] <NCommander> 1 is easy
[02:25] <NCommander> 2 is easy
[02:25] <NCommander> ah
[02:25] <NCommander> 3 needs an off switch
[02:25] <eggonlea> yes
[02:26] <NCommander> Here's the fstab I'm using on my board
[02:26] <eggonlea> by specifying "nfsroot=xxx" and "boot=nfs" at the same time, I could use the default initramfs.
[02:26] <NCommander> eggonlea: http://paste.ubuntu.com/410807/
[02:26] <NCommander> eggonlea: ooh, thats good to know, that means the documentation is out of date
[02:26] <eggonlea> and I commented out all items in fstab to use NFS.
[02:26] <eggonlea> Yes, the doc is really old.
[02:27] <NCommander> You can force network-manager to off by specifying the interface in manual mode in/etc/interfaces/network
[02:27] <NCommander> auto eth0
[02:27] <NCommander> iface eth0 inet manual
[02:27] <NCommander> Put those lines in, and NM will ignore eth0
[02:27] <eggonlea> Once "boot=nfs" is there, initramfs would deal with "nfsroot=xxx" correctly.
[02:27] <NCommander> eggonlea: seems your one step ahead of me
[02:27] <eggonlea> Yes, I deal with interface eth0 as manual
[02:28] <NCommander> hrm, that should turn NM off
[02:28] <NCommander> If it doesn't, that's a bug
[02:28] <NCommander> and can be worked around with apt-get remove network-manager :-)
[02:28] <eggonlea> It doesn't work until I remove NM from init.
[02:28] <NCommander> eggonlea: is your eth device 0?
[02:28] <eggonlea> y
[02:28] <NCommander> sometimes it likes to move to eth1, eth2, etc.
[02:28]  * NCommander got as high as eth37
[02:29]  * NCommander was personally interested in seeing what happened when it got to eth255 ...
[02:30] <eggonlea> http://paste.ubuntu.com/410808/
[02:30] <eggonlea> see line 25-53 of my /etc/init/mountall.conf
[02:30] <eggonlea> It's a bug.
[02:30] <eggonlea> We could follow up this.
[02:31] <NCommander> eggonlea: if interfaces.nfs doesn't exist, it should work properly, my /etc/network/interfaces persists reboots
[02:31] <eggonlea> I'm wondering if standard Ubuntu could integrate something like that to deal with NFSROOT and normal boot smartly. :)
[02:32] <NCommander> eggonlea: integrate in which way?
[02:32]  * NCommander notes that except for LTSP, we don't do a lot of network booted except for Mythbuntu
[02:33] <eggonlea> but the current initramfs DOES include NFS support already.
[02:33] <eggonlea> why not make one step forward to complete it?
[02:34] <NCommander> eggonlea: definately something we can look at fixing although its too late for said work to land for 10.04. We can have a spec at UDS and look at improving the existing NFS support there
[02:34] <eggonlea> if ethx is configured already, just have NM leave it there (don't re-configure again).
[02:34] <eggonlea> That's fine.
[02:34] <NCommander> eggonlea: NM is designed for normal users. We're not normal users :-/
[02:35]  * eggonlea agrees.
[02:36] <eggonlea> Could NM be dynamically switched off (when initramfs detects "boot=nfs") by passing some parameter easily?
[02:36] <NCommander> eggonlea: what do you use NFSroot for specifically?
[02:37] <NCommander> eggonlea: hrm, it won'tbe hard to extend its init script to do extactly that. If your doing NFS root, its unlikely to want network-manager (unless you want to configure a WLAN device, but thats really pushing the usecase)
[02:37] <eggonlea> I use NFSroot the most time I use Ubuntu. It helps a lot when I transfer files between my development PC, share the powerful utilities in PC, etc.
[02:38] <eggonlea> I could even restore a broken rootfs easily by just tar and untar a backup.
[02:39] <eggonlea> I only use HD as root when installing a fresh one from livecd and release customized Ubuntu to customers (the released tarball would contains the scripts I pasted just now to support both of HD and NFS).
[02:40] <NCommander> eggonlea: that's true. You can even do squashfs over NFS to get a clean environment every time
[02:58]  * DanaG wishes networkmanager wouldn't ignore usb0 ("can't determine driver")
[03:43] <persia> DanaG: Please file a bug about that: it's surely fixable.
[03:44] <DanaG> I know why it can't determine driver: /sys/class/net/usb0/device/driver symlink doesn't exist.
[03:45] <persia> Then that's a kernel bug (and still fixable) :)
[04:06] <eggonlea> NCommander, I cannot even launch Chromium browser here (instead of rendering wrongly). Just install it from archive. Would try it on a latest fresh livecd.
[04:06] <MartinB> I can
[04:06] <NCommander> eggonlea: can't test it on Dove ATM (my PSU is MIA ATM), but I'll put it on a TODO item
[04:06] <MartinB> eggonlea : What plaform are you testing on?
[04:07] <NCommander> MartinB: he's on Dove ;-)
[04:07] <MartinB> NCommander : I've got a tegra2 working here...
[04:07] <eggonlea> Dove.
[04:07] <MartinB> thanks .. one sec
[04:07] <MartinB> Y0, right?
[04:07] <NCommander> MartinB: X0
[04:07] <eggonlea> X0
[04:07] <NCommander> There are issues with Y0/Y1 on Lucid
[04:07] <MartinB> Sure ... MAKE me go to the garage to get it.
[04:07] <MartinB> sigh
[04:07] <NCommander> as in, it doesn't work :-)
[04:07] <MartinB> 2 mins
[04:07] <NCommander> MartinB: where'd you get a dove board?
[04:08] <MartinB> NCommander : Asked nicely after last UDS
[04:08] <NCommander> MartinB: wow
[04:08] <MartinB> NCommander : remember, I /live/ in Austin
[04:08] <NCommander> MartinB: that's true
[04:08] <MartinB> BRB
[04:08] <eggonlea> MartinB, so you are running Karmic on Y0?
[04:09] <MartinB> eggonlea : No, I'm running something custom on the Y0, but I can always switch the image .. I just got the X0 out of the garage
[04:09] <MartinB> I need to run an aptitude update and safe-upgrade, then we'll be in good shape
[04:10] <MartinB> okay, done
[04:10] <MartinB> what's the issue?  Chromium doesn't run?
[04:11] <MartinB> I use a SATA rootfs
[04:11] <eggonlea> Nothing happened after I clicked the icon.
[04:11] <eggonlea> no GUI launched, no segfault.
[04:11] <MartinB> which build of chromium?
[04:13] <eggonlea> that in archive.
[04:13] <eggonlea> not PPA
[04:14]  * eggonlea reinstall it in case it's broken.
[04:14] <eggonlea> Get:1 http://10.38.164.98/ubuntu-ports/ lucid/universe chromium-browser-inspector 5.0.342.7~r42476-0ubuntu1 [598kB]
[04:14] <eggonlea> Get:2 http://10.38.164.98/ubuntu-ports/ lucid/universe chromium-codecs-ffmpeg 0.5+svn20100326r42726+42573+42890-0ubuntu1 [251kB]
[04:14] <eggonlea> Get:3 http://10.38.164.98/ubuntu-ports/ lucid/universe chromium-browser 5.0.342.7~r42476-0ubuntu1 [15.1MB]
[04:15] <eggonlea> 10.38.164.98 is my local mirror to ubuntu-ports
[04:15] <MartinB> p   chromium-browser                                                                      - Chromium browser
[04:15] <MartinB> got it
[04:15] <MartinB> installed ... and I'm assuming you're using the default gnome desktop?
[04:16] <eggonlea> Netbook by default.
[04:16] <MartinB> I've got both a server image, and a full desktop
[04:16] <MartinB> I'll boot the desktop to check
[04:19] <MartinB> works
[04:19] <MartinB> no issue at all
[04:20] <eggonlea> Then, there must be something wrong with my rootfs.
[04:20] <MartinB> *** glibc detected *** aptitude: double free or corruption (!prev): 0x002a1198 ***
[04:20] <MartinB> hmm .. new error with aptitude install though
[04:20] <MartinB> haven't seen that before
[04:21]  * eggonlea drop the current rootfs upgraded by apt-get update/upgrade and is going to install a fresh one from livecd
[04:24] <MartinB> good idea
[04:25] <MartinB> in fact, I should probably do the same
[04:25] <MartinB> this one was built mid-Feb
[04:25] <MartinB> I just hate wiping the hard disk :)
[04:25] <MartinB> but with all these ARM devices around now, I can more easily create a rootfs
[04:26] <eggonlea> It would help if Ubuntu provides a mode to install automatically.
[04:26] <DanaG> interesting... is the chromium ffmpeg-nonfree supposed to do h.264?
[04:27] <persia> eggonlea: How do you mean?  Do the dailies not work?
[04:27] <eggonlea> DanaG: Personally I don't think so because of license. But I'm not sure until I got it running here.
[04:28] <DanaG> hmm, but I would've thought "nonfree" meant "includes things you're not supposed to install... but probably will install anyway."
[04:28] <eggonlea> persia: To install a Ubuntu to SATA from Livecd.
[04:28] <DanaG> as in all those medibuntu things.
[04:28] <DanaG> Alternately, we just need an ARM medibuntu.
[04:29] <MartinB> I also just verified the chromium package works remotely
[04:29] <persia> eggonlea: That should just work from the live images.  How does it fail?
[04:29] <eggonlea> persia, e.g. record the install information on one machine and then apply this on all of the other machines.
[04:30] <persia> eggonlea: That's installer preseeding, which should be well supported (and bugs are appreciated if it doesn't work)
[04:30]  * persia hunts up some docs
[04:30] <eggonlea> persia, sorry, I don't know our livecd support that already.
[04:31] <MartinB> http://www.igotu.com/snapshot.png
[04:31] <persia> So, there's a bug :)  https://help.ubuntu.com/9.10/installation-guide/armel doesn't exist.  https://help.ubuntu.com/9.10/installation-guide/i386/ should be mostly the same for most preseeding.
[04:32] <MartinB> Running chromium remotely via X from the X0 to my mac :)
[04:32] <eggonlea> MartinB, looks good. I did not see any rendering error there.
[04:32] <MartinB> works great
[04:33] <MartinB> I'm also browsing the filesystem, as well as looking at images
[04:33] <eggonlea> MartinB, it's said rendering abnormally on Dove.
[04:33] <MartinB> Hmmm.
[04:33] <MartinB> worth verifying again tomorrow, but I'm not seeing an issue
[04:34]  * eggonlea reading...
[07:06] <siji> Anbody from Compulab is here
[07:11] <persia> siji: If nobody answers after a while, you might try asking the question you had intended to pose to someone from Compulab: it may be that someone else also has the answer.
[07:11] <siji> persia,am really sorry
[07:12] <siji> I was trying to get somebody from Compulab
[07:12] <siji> earlier one mike used to be here alive
[07:12] <siji> :)
[07:13] <siji> I just want to knw more details abt compulab's omap based COM
[07:13] <siji> specially performance point of view
[07:13] <siji> with Ubuntu
[07:14] <persia> No need to be sorry.  I just believe in generalised questions :)  I would have asked "Does anyone have any pointers to information about compulab's OMAP based COM, especially any information about performance?"
[07:14] <persia> Unfortunately, I don't have any such pointers.  Sorry.
[07:20] <siji> persial, not only that, I posted a query to compulab last week and till havent got any reply (abt the pricing etc)
[07:27] <persia> siji: If I were you, I'd be increasingly tempted by other solutions :)
[07:30] <siji> :)
[10:42] <hrw> morning
[11:11] <hrw> guys: how much builds you do on your x86(-64) boxes and how much on arm boards?
[11:12] <amitk> all builds are done natively
[11:12] <amitk> we might cross-compile _occassionally_ for quick compile-testing..
[11:12] <hrw> ok, so next question
[11:13] <hrw> how much you compile at all and how much take from repositories?
[11:13] <ogra> everything
[11:13] <hrw> I am trying to find out build power requirements
[11:13] <ogra> at least in lucid we recompiled the whole archive for v7 and thumb2
[11:14] <persia> No.
[11:14] <ogra> no ?
[11:14] <persia> We recompiled *most* stuff.  There's still stuff that hasn't been updated since warty.
[11:14]  * persia digs up automated lsits
[11:14] <ogra> i thought that fell under the "dont build it" policy
[11:14] <persia> hrm?
[11:15] <ogra> i.e. did we have a policy to remove binaries for stuff that wasnt built in lucid ?
[11:15]  * amitk guesses that all of 'main' was native compiled?
[11:15] <persia> We recompiled everything listed at http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/multidistrotools/unchanged/changed_since_karmic for lucid
[11:15] <persia> We didn't recompile anything listed at http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/multidistrotools/unchanged/unchanged_since_karmic (yet)
[11:15] <ogra> amitk, everything was native compiled ... either in ubuntu or debian :)
[11:15] <persia> No.  Everything was native compiled in Ubuntu.
[11:16] <ogra> debian does native too
[11:16] <ogra> at least as far as i know
[11:16] <amitk> ogra: I meant all of 'main' was native (RE)compiled (for armv7)
[11:16] <persia> Yes, but we don't use those results (which is part of why we don't, for example, have a working fpc today)
[11:16] <ogra> amitk, right
[11:16] <persia> amitk: That is believed to be true, but I'm not sure anyone did confirmation.
[11:17] <ogra> persia, its only not true if asac made a mistake assembling the give back lists
[11:17] <persia> A script was used that *tries* to identify ELF2 images to target which packages needed recompile.  The script may have been buggy.
[11:17] <ogra> theoretically all of main should have been recompiled
[11:17] <persia> Right.
[11:18]  * amitk guesses hrw has too-much-info now :)
[11:18] <ogra> plus everything that was uploaded during the cycle in universe
[11:18] <ogra> or synced
[11:18] <persia> Inded.  Everything in the first URL I posted above.
[11:18] <asac> we recompiled everything thats in main and that isnt arch all
[11:19] <persia> Did we?  Did we recompile libx86 for armel?
[11:19] <ogra> persia, we tried to :P
[11:19]  * persia expects the answer is (slightly) more complicated
[11:19] <persia> Oh, heh.  12th March.
[11:19] <ogra> given that it cant build on armel thats a moot point
[11:19] <hrw> ;)
[11:20] <ogra> libx86 should really be in PAS
[11:20] <persia> That's kinda why I picked it.  I thoguht the pointless-to-recompile ones were intentionally skipped.
[11:21] <persia> Anyway, doesn't really matter.
[11:21] <asac> right ;)
[11:21] <persia> hrw: The real answer is that most stuff has been recompiled, and anything that can be demonstrated to have a bug that would be solved by recompilation can be trivially recompiled.
[11:21] <hrw> amitk: on 26th April I start Ubuntu/ARM work and try now to find out which kind of build will I use. now I do all on my desktop (+ potential VMs if needed) and sometimes run configure scripts on boards to check for strange variables. With Ubuntu/ARM I suspect more builds to be done on arm boards (beagleboard for example) but it takes much more time
[11:22] <persia> We do all compilation in the repositories, but most of us test-compile before uploading.
[11:22]  * persia glares at asac
[11:22] <asac> persia: libx86 was tried to recompile ;)
[11:22] <asac> last attempt 3rd marc
[11:22] <asac> i skipped stuff that was ftbfs since the beginning
[11:22] <persia> 12th according to my logs, but sure.
[11:22] <ogra> hrw, get an XM :)
[11:22] <ogra> the 512M will really help
[11:23] <hrw> ogra: I have b7/c3/c3 here
[11:23] <ogra> not enough ram to be speedy
[11:23] <hrw> ogra: and would prefer armv7 with 1GB ram
[11:23] <persia> hrw: Other commercially available stuff that can build is Efika MX and Netwalker, but there aren't kernels for those
[11:23]  * ogra wouldnt seriously build on a B or C beagle
[11:23]  * persia really approves of unified-omap kernels
[11:23] <ogra> persia, for 10.10 probably
[11:24] <persia> ogra: Sure.  Both of those are ARMv7
[11:24] <hrw> ogra: thats why I do builds on my x86-64
[11:24] <ogra> but have different (and sometimes conflicting) peripherials on the SoC
[11:24] <ogra> and we dont have any time left
[11:25] <persia> hrw: Lots of packages *can't* cross-compile.  Many of them can compile with qemu-system-arm or qemu-static-arm, but that's not that much faster than native (but RAM helps).
[11:25] <hrw> efika mx uses i.mx chip from freescale... that company and their linux support....
[11:25] <hrw> persia: name one of them?
[11:25] <persia> hrw: gcc
[11:25] <hrw> persia: I crosscompiled gcc yesterday
[11:25] <ogra> beyond that you need the same toolchain to be sure your binaries are sane
[11:26] <persia> hrw: Not the Ubuntu package, you didn't, or you intentionally disabled the test suite.
[11:26] <hrw> persia: and then build vim with it on armv7a
[11:27] <persia> And history aside, my Netwalker runs Ubuntu just fine (and ships with it).
[11:28] <persia> hrw: Anyway, the general issue with cross-compilation in Ubuntu is that lots of packages need to run the results of the compile post-build/pre-install and so those need to run either natively or in emulation.  Packages without test-suites are (wishlist) buggy.
[11:28] <hrw> how open and current is efika mx?
[11:29] <hrw> I have i.mx31 devices here and very bad kernel experience with them
[11:29] <persia> From what I've heard, userspace is stock Ubuntu 9.04, the kernel source is available (but not upstream).
[11:29]  * persia doesn't have an Efika MX
[11:29] <hrw> freescale...
[11:29] <hrw> netwalker use which SoC?
[11:29] <persia> i.MX51
[11:29] <ogra> imx51
[11:30] <hrw> argh
[11:30] <ogra> imx51 is currently our best supported arch
[11:30] <persia> In terms of retail, cetainly.
[11:30] <ogra> at least it has the least glitches atm
[11:30] <hrw> ogra: with 5MB patch applied on mainline kernel?
[11:30] <persia> Other SoC vendors need design wins :)
[11:31]  * ogra is expecting omapo to take that role in 10.10 but omap in 10.04 is still young and to late for making it sexy
[11:31] <ogra> *omap
[11:31] <hrw> ogra: :D
[11:31] <persia> Especially with the unified kernel: it should almost auto-port to all sorts of retail stuff.
[11:47] <ogra> lool, Unsupported ioctl: cmd=0xc020660b have you seen that in arm chroots ?
[11:49] <lool> ogra: Yes
[11:49] <neurre> hi
[11:49] <neurre> i've got a beagle board
[11:50] <neurre> should i try ubuntu on this?
[11:50] <ogra> lool, seems to not do any harm, do you think we could quieten it for release ?
[11:50] <persia> neurre: Of course :)
[11:51] <persia> neurre: Be warned that you may find the memory a bit low for the standard installs though.
[11:51] <neurre> how easy it is to try?
[11:51] <persia> neurre: Very.  Download the omap image from http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-netbook/ports/daily-live/current/ , dd to SD, and boot it.
[11:52] <ogra> dont do that on a rev B board !
[11:52] <persia> I believe it's currently buggy in a couple annoying ways (like broken USB support), but it ought boot.
[11:52] <ogra> it wont boot in 128M
[11:52] <persia> Oh :(
[11:52] <neurre> i have 256MB
[11:52] <persia> Do we have anything that boots on rev B?  Server maybe?
[11:52] <ogra> server might boot
[11:52] <neurre> so this is rev C i suppose?
[11:52] <ogra> yes
[11:52] <neurre> hmm
[11:52] <ogra> the board should ahve a little sticker
[11:52] <ogra> next to the USB port
[11:52] <neurre> how do i get the thing to sd card?
[11:53] <ogra> use dd
[11:53] <persia> There are some graphical tools too
[11:53]  * persia hunts a link
[11:53] <neurre> i need sdcard thing for my pc i suppose?
[11:53] <persia> Yes.
[11:53] <hrw> ogra: easier check is availability of normal USB connector - Bx lacks them, Cx have
[11:53] <neurre> gotta go get one, then..
[11:54] <hrw> ogra: or placement of hdmi connector. Cx have hdmi/svideo/audio, Ax/Bx have hdmi on same side as expansion connector
[11:54] <ogra> my B6 has a USB connector
[11:54] <hrw> ogra: EHCI one?
[11:55] <ogra> oh, i lied
[11:55]  * ogra hasnt looked at the B board for a while
[11:55] <hrw> I just unoacked B7 to compare
[11:55] <neurre> will lucid-netbook-armel+omap.img boot on beagleboard?
[11:55] <ogra> i always mix up the HDMI for USB
[11:55] <lool> ogra: I didn't look into it
[11:55] <neurre> just like that, without need to do some boot time setenv stuff?
[11:55] <persia> neurre: On rev C, yes.
[11:55] <neurre> does it include PVR drivers?
[11:55] <hrw> neurre: it will boot but default kernel does not have usb working yet
[11:55] <ogra> neurre, it will just boot, but still has lots of issues we hope to resolve before release
[11:56] <neurre> ok..
[11:56] <persia> neurre: If you don't like dd for some reason, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/FromImgFiles has some other options (although I don't know how well tested they are with SD targets instead of USB targets)
[11:56] <neurre> how about anything older?
[11:56] <ogra> hrw, it wont install either :)
[11:56] <hrw> ogra: yep
[11:56] <ogra> i still need to find the right installer magic ... but that requires a working kernel that lets me start the installer at all :)
[11:58] <persia> neurre: Unfortunately, support for omap is very new in Ubuntu.  There are some self-build instructions on elinux.org for older releases, but helping test the upcoming release helps make it great :)
[11:58] <persia> ogra: You could always just add a hack in casper that added ubiquity to the session (in 10adduser) for testing purposes :)
[11:59] <ogra> persia, doesnt help if i hit OOM because of missing compcache :)
[11:59] <ogra> i can also boot with only-ubiquity to not load the desktop
[12:00] <ogra> (which is my fallback if compcache isnt sufficient actually)
[12:00] <persia> heh, OK.
[12:22] <ogra> lool, why did we never use genext2fs for image building ?
[12:22]  * ogra is really thankful hrw pointed him to that
[12:23] <hrw> ;)
[12:26] <lool> ogra: Because we didn't need it so far?  no idea really
[12:26] <ogra> its quite awesome for creating ext2/3 images without root privileges
[12:39] <hrw> http://marcin.juszkiewicz.com.pl/2010/04/08/what-makes-a-good-developer-board/
[12:51]  * persia reads avidly, and discovers the dual meaning of "board" :)
[12:51] <hrw> ?
[12:52] <persia> There's a session starting in #ubuntu-classroom in about 10 minutes entitled "Q&A about the Developer Membership Board"
[12:52] <hrw> ah
[12:53] <persia> Just an amusing coincidence, really.
[12:54] <hrw> ;)
[13:04] <persia> hrw: Reviewing that post: why uboot only?  Shouldn't OF or UEFI be also suitable?
[13:07] <hrw> persia: so far I used arm (armv4/v4t/v5te/v6/v7a), avr32, x86 devboards/embeddeddevices. most of them used u-boot, 2 were redboot (one migrated to u-boot later), x86 were standard bios
[13:07] <lool> hrw: Did you try sheevaplug?
[13:07] <hrw> lool: have one under desk
[13:07] <hrw> lool: want to buy?
[13:07] <lool> hrw: I wonder why you listed 2 serial ports and a JTAG connector on your wishlist after having used a sheevaplug
[13:07] <lool> I really liked having the serial console and JTAG FTDI on the USB bus myself
[13:07] <persia> hrw: I'll agree that redboot can be limiting :)  I just was under the impression that OF and UEFI both were even more friendly than uboot when it came to nice flexible boot systems.
[13:07] <hrw> lool: sheevaplug is not devboard
[13:08] <hrw> lool: and usb serial/jtag on sheeva unregister from usb bus when you press reset
[13:08] <lool> hrw: Still, it's a single USB cable to multiplex pretty much everything; uncluttered my desk
[13:08] <hrw> persia: did not used any of them
[13:08] <hrw> lool: agreed - I even got one or two devices move to that scheme
[13:08] <lool> hrw: So you find it a problem that the JTAG has to be reconnected across reboots?
[13:09] <hrw> lool: but my desktop has 7 real serial ports ;D
[13:09] <ogra> while redboot is limiting, its very fast ....
[13:09] <persia> Indeed.
[13:09] <lool> Which is increasingly rare; laptops are now more numerous than desktops!
[13:09] <hrw> ogra: not if you have to load kernel from tftp on ep9301 cpu ;(
[13:10] <ogra> indeed, i meant for loading from local media
[13:10] <hrw> lool: I do not remember when last time I used my laptop for development... but it is so old that it has one real serial port
[13:12] <persia> New laptops sometimes have real serial.
[13:12] <hrw> and costs extra for it
[13:13] <amitk> lastlog ioctl
[13:13] <amitk> oops
[13:13] <persia> Well, maybe.  I've never seen two models that were identical except for presence/absence of the port :)
[13:14] <persia> And there's USB octopus serial cables with DB9/RJ48 on the ends.
[13:19] <lool> amitk: You mean dmesg | grep oops
[13:21] <amitk> lool: no, I was doing a search in my irssi log about your discussion about ogra> lool, Unsupported ioctl: cmd=0xc020660b have you seen that in arm chroots ?
[13:24] <lool> amitk: Yes, using qemu
[13:24] <lool> amitk: qemu syscall emulation that is
[13:25] <amitk> ok
[13:27] <lool> amitk: I was just kidding with the grep BTW   :)
[13:28] <amitk> :)
[13:41] <ogra> yippie
[13:41] <ogra> my d-i fixes work, server gets further than the kbd selection
[13:42] <ogra> to sad it doesnt fins a target disk now :(
[13:42] <ogra> *find
[13:43] <ogra> hrm
[13:43] <ogra> it doesnt find ubuntu.seed ....
[13:44] <ogra> indeed because we build -server
[13:53] <persia> heh
[13:53] <ogra> hmm
[13:54] <ogra> so do i default to ubuntu-server.seed for *all* alternate omap images now ?
[13:54] <ogra> we dont have a way to differentiate wrt cmdline
[13:54] <lool> ?
[13:55] <ogra> lool, we stopped building normal alternate images and the debian-cd code defaults to file=/cdrom/preseed/ubuntu.seed atm
[13:56] <lool> You mean alternate desktop images?
[13:56] <ogra> the server images we build use /cdrom/preseed/ubuntu-server.seed
[13:56] <ogra> lool, right
[13:56] <lool> I don't understand why there would be any ARM specificity here though, it's just package selections and files in the image?
[13:56] <ogra> i wonder if we might care for desktop alternate images again at some point
[13:56] <lool> Yeah, well if it's not desktop it might be netbook or something else
[13:57] <ogra> lool, the bootloader setup and cmdline code is arm specific
[13:57] <ogra> not the image
[13:57] <lool> In any case, you can set the seed to the server one for server builds, but not for anything else
[13:57] <ogra> well, i cant
[13:58] <ogra> boot-armel+$subarch doesnt know its building server or desktop
[13:58] <ogra> it only makes a distinction if its live or alternate atm
[13:58] <ogra> and sets the seed based on that
[13:59] <ogra> and given that we dropped alternate desktop completely (since we dont support desktop on armel anymore) the seed thats getting added to the cmdline is wrong
[14:03] <lool> ogra: Don't we build alternate desktop images on i386?
[14:03] <ogra> lool, we do
[14:03] <ogra> but we dont on armel targets
[14:03] <lool> Why can't we use the same logic to set the seed?
[14:03] <ogra> heh
[14:03] <ogra> why didnt we ?
[14:05] <lool> What I see currently:
[14:05] <lool> data/lucid/preseed/ubuntu/ubuntu.seed
[14:05] <lool> data/lucid/preseed/ubuntu-server/ubuntu-server.seed
[14:05] <lool> data/lucid/preseed/ubuntu-server/amd64/ubuntu-server.seed
[14:05] <lool> data/lucid/preseed/ubuntu-server/i386/ubuntu-server.seed
[14:05] <lool> data/lucid/preseed/ubuntu-netbook/ubuntu-netbook.seed
[14:05] <lool> So there's a base ubuntu-server seed and per subarch overrides if needed
[14:05] <ogra> not in the scripts
[14:05] <lool> there's a base ubuntu seed (desktop), no override needed
[14:06] <ogra> i'm talking about boot-armel+$subarch here
[14:06] <ogra> we never added any logic to be selective based on $PROJECT
[14:06] <ogra> and if you build ubuntu-server it will still default to /preseed/ubuntu/ubuntu.seed
[14:06] <lool> ogra: Apparently there's a simple macro you can call to get it
[14:06] <lool> I suspect it's what "default_preseed" computes
[14:07] <lool> Right, exactly, see tools/boot/lucid/common.sh for its code
[14:07] <lool> So just source that and call default_preseed, then use $DEFAULT_PRESEED on the cmdline
[14:07] <ogra> ah, sweet
[14:08] <ogra> i thought i'd need to add a ton of "if [ "$PROJECT" = ubuntu-server ]; then"
[14:08] <ogra> which is why i brought it up here
[14:09] <lool> (Perhaps not the best channel to discuss cdimage stuff though)
[14:09] <ogra> well, its debian-cd
[16:07]  * XorA wishes there was an ubuntu for his n810
[16:08] <persia> 9.10 ought be installable.
[16:08] <persia> I know the Mer folk spent a lot of time working on that as the basis for their releases.
[16:09] <ogra> XorA, i had jaunty running on my n800, karmic should also work
[16:10] <XorA> ogra: but how would I install it?
[16:10] <XorA> Mer is sort of based on ubuntu, but touching apt-get leaves you with unbootable system 100% of the time
[16:10] <persia> XorA: http://blog.linuxniche.net/?p=16 or similar is probably a sane place to start
[16:10] <ogra> well, i instealled the bootmenu stuff from maemo that enables you to run your rootfs from SD
[16:11] <persia> Mer is more than sort-of based on Ubuntu.
[16:11] <ogra> then just created a chroot on the SD
[16:11] <persia> The main reasons Mer wasn't *part* of Ubuntu for 9.10 were 1) issues with finding a way to handle the GTK+ patch, and 2) issues with the overhead of creating flavours in Ubuntu.
[16:11] <prpplague> XorA: ping
[16:11] <ogra> and installed ubuntu-desktop in it (which wasnt a good idea, if you try that, take rather something like lxde :) )
[16:12] <XorA> ogra: I just install lxde into Mer, now Ive got an unbootable system :-)
[16:12] <persia> Hrm?  That shouldn't be possible.
[16:12] <persia> How did you install lxde?
[16:12] <ogra> unbootable or do you just dont have any X
[16:12] <XorA> persia: apt-get install lxde
[16:12] <XorA> ogra: dont have any X
[16:12] <persia> This really shouldn't affect kernel config.
[16:13] <persia> What's the Xorg.0.log say?
[16:13] <XorA> persia: I cant get to it
[16:13] <XorA> persia: no ethernet on n810
[16:13]  * XorA will extract the MMC card and fiddle with it on desktop
[16:14] <persia> If anything, you might have a wonky Xsession, but just installing lxde *really* shouldn't break X.
[16:16] <prpplague> XorA: when you have time, i want to pick your brain on a beagleboard case
[16:17] <XorA> prpplague: can do now
[16:18] <XorA> Ive always found Mer to be really delicate, which is a real pity as the default maemo sucks these days
[16:18] <Stskeeps> XorA: look into what tricks we use to boot and getting a ubuntu running should be trivial
[16:19] <prpplague> XorA: see /msg
[16:25] <prpplague> ogra: ping
[16:25] <ogra> here
[16:26] <prpplague> ogra: hey, quick question regarding out discussion on a dev case for the beagle and beagleXM, how important would it be to provide a power switch(true power disconnect) on the case?
[16:27] <ogra> well, assuming you have a socket where you plug in a power brick i wouldnt really think its that important ...
[16:27] <ogra> the question is though what kind of users are you adressing
[16:27] <ogra> my mother would definately not get the concept if there was no power button
[16:28] <prpplague> ogra: targeting canonical developers
[16:28] <ogra> for developers you dont need a power button as long as there are other ways to make the device powerless
[16:31]  * persia likes power buttons
[16:32] <ogra> you are special
[16:32] <ogra> you also talk into hamster coffins when phoning :)
[16:32] <persia> prpplague: And unless you have some reason for restriction: please make these available (even for money) to any Ubuntu developers, regardless of their affiliation (or an even wider audience)
[16:32] <persia> ogra: I've not ever made even one phone call from that :p
[16:33] <ogra> oh, i thought it was fixed so you *could* make calls with it
[16:33] <prpplague> persia: they will be available to everyone, but my first priority is to satisfy canonical developers
[16:34] <persia> ogra: I can make calls in Windows.  I've never booted Windows on it.
[16:35] <persia> prpplague: Fair.  The rest of us can wait (but I hope not too long) :)
[16:35] <prpplague> persia: all of TinCanTools products are available to everyone
[16:36] <prpplague> persia: (with regards to the beagle related items)
[16:36] <persia> Now I just have to get a Beagle (but I'm waiting for more RAM) :)
[16:37] <prpplague> persia: beagleXM's should be available soon
[16:37] <persia> That's what I hear.
[16:37]  * prpplague beagle has more ram that i will ever use
[16:38] <persia> I like to do lots of test-builds.  1G+ will still make me swap.
[18:50] <hrw|gone> beaglexm is supposed to be in June
[21:19] <prpplague> ogra: ping
[22:08]  * opotin 
[22:39] <Olivier83> echo
[22:42] <Olivier83> notice
[22:44]  * Olivier83 is happy
[22:48] <persia> Why, particularly?