/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/04/21/#ubuntu-manual.txt

humphreybchttp://humphreybc.wordpress.com/2010/04/21/announcing-getting-started-with-ubuntu-10-10-quickshot-v1-0-and-the-ubuntu-quickstart-booklet/00:17
ubuntujenkins"we should have regular help sessions and classes on things like LaTeX and Python to encourage users"00:20
* ubuntujenkins adds it to the think about list :P00:20
ubuntujenkinswhat to teach on python for our project00:20
ubuntujenkinsquickly rules00:21
humphreybcheh00:21
godbykto encourage contributors to the project or what?00:21
ubuntujenkins"of all skill levels and expertise to help out, with the promise of them learning something and having fun while doing so. We want to include everyone and regardless of their skill set or experience level, we will find something for them to do."00:21
ubuntujenkinswhy on https://www.ohloh.net/p/ubuntu-manual/factoids does it say "https://www.ohloh.net/p/ubuntu-manual/factoids"00:22
ubuntujenkins* "Ubuntu Manual is written mostly in Python."00:23
humphreybcno idea00:23
humphreybci guess their code for working out a language confuses python and late00:24
humphreybclatex*00:24
humphreybcso, what do we think about the press release?00:24
humphreybcsound about right?00:25
godbykreading it now00:25
ubuntujenkinsI like it :-)00:25
* ubuntujenkins irc has no thumbe up00:25
ubuntujenkins*thumbs00:25
godbykpretty good00:27
ubuntujenkinsI am off to bed if night00:28
humphreybchey daker00:33
humphreybcthere's a few things we need to do with the website asap00:33
dakerhi00:33
dakerwhat's up ?00:33
humphreybcI'd like to have test.ubuntu-manual.org moved over to ubuntu-manual.org by the 25th00:33
humphreybcwe need to make sure all the links work, we also need to write the code to do the automatic language detection for the download button00:33
humphreybcwe also need to refine the language list for the website so only languages that are translated are shown in the dropdown list00:34
humphreybcotherwise people will choose say, Ancient Greek thinking there is an Ancient Greek site but then be confused when it's in English (coz it hasn't been translated yet)00:34
dakersure00:35
humphreybcgodbyk, what else needs to be done?00:35
humphreybcoh also daker, you need to fix the facebook, twitter and planet UMP buttons so that they stay fixed instead of moving when you scroll down the page00:36
godbykhumphreybc: we should make sure the download counter scripts are working.00:36
humphreybcah, yeag00:36
humphreybcyea*00:36
humphreybcso it'd be great if we could get some scripts up and running that count how many times the PDFs have been downloaded \00:36
humphreybcthen we can see how popular each language is, etc etc00:36
humphreybcI'll get the 2nd video finished by this weekend00:37
humphreybcand then that can be inserted into the Contributors page00:37
dakeri'll send you my mugshut00:37
humphreybcthanks00:38
dakeras we say on the launchpad page the RC should be released today ?00:42
humphreybcI think so, yes00:42
humphreybcIt'll just be a build that Kevin uploads00:42
godbykOh, I guess I can upload something.00:44
godbykI don't know that it's much different. :)00:44
godbykLemme merge in the bug fixes we made to lucid-e1 with my branch and then upload that.00:45
humphreybcthat sounds like it could work00:47
humphreybchey, who here can spare an hour to test Ground Control 1.6?00:58
dakerme00:59
dakerhumphreybc, is there any ppa for the 1.6 ?01:02
dakerhumphreybc, is there any ppa for the 1.6 ?01:03
humphreybci'm just trying to find out from doctormo01:04
doctormohello01:08
humphreybcdoctormo, meet daker, daker, meet doctormo01:08
humphreybcdaker wants to help test01:08
dakerhello01:08
dakerdoctormo,01:09
dakerhow are you ?01:09
dakerhumphreybc, ?01:23
humphreybcdoctormo, it helps if you talk :)01:23
dakerhhhh01:24
dakerhe want talk01:24
dakeror he is just a zombie :D01:25
daker$ kill -9  doctormo01:25
humphreybchaha01:26
godbykI posted the RC to Launchpad.01:40
godbykIf daker or someone would like to update the website, that'd be awesome.01:40
dakeroki01:40
godbyk(I'm not sure how to update the button text.)01:41
godbykYou can download the PDF from here: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual01:41
godbyk(Big green button on the top right)01:41
dakergodbyk,01:49
dakerpage 5101:50
godbyk<sigh>01:50
godbykwhat's wrong?01:50
dakerthe screenshot have to be changed01:50
godbykah, it's using the old screenshot.01:51
godbyksorry.01:51
godbykoh well.01:51
godbykit'll be fixed soon. :)01:51
dakeroki01:51
dakerthe Selecting search engines screenshot too01:51
godbykthey're from when I branched off the main branch.01:52
godbykso I didn't pull in the new screenshots.01:52
dakerswitching to my desktop01:53
dakerbrb01:53
godbykk01:53
godbykWell, that can't be good.02:12
dakerwhag$02:13
dakerwhat*02:13
godbykI scored 100 on the nerd quiz that's been making the rounds on Planet Ubuntu.02:13
dakergodbyk, help02:17
dakerhttps://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubu-man-website-translations02:17
dakerand click 'status'02:17
dakerwhat language should i remove from the list ?02:18
dakerlanguages*02:18
godbykFrom the website dropdown list?02:23
dakeryes02:23
godbykHmm.. I s'pose we should set some threshold and remove anything that has less than that amount translated.02:23
godbykSay, anything less than 75%?02:24
dakeroki02:24
godbykThe language names in the drop-down list should also be the native language names, not the English translations of the language names.02:25
godbykSo Deutsch instead of German, for instance.02:26
dakeroki02:27
dakerhey doctormo !!!02:52
doctormohello02:52
dakerhow are you02:53
daker?02:53
doctormogood, a bit tired, think I'm coming down with something02:55
dakeris there any ppa for the GC 1.6 ?02:55
doctormoyes, there are 202:57
doctormoOne for the release (1.5) which doesn't work and then one for the nightly build02:57
doctormohttps://launchpad.net/~groundcontrollers/+archive/dailybuilds02:58
dakergodbyk, i think we reach our goal 1 139 fans03:01
godbykdaker: cool!03:06
godbykdaker: have you written any of the download counter scripts yet? do you need any help with them?03:06
dakerthat's fine :)03:08
doctormodaker: did you get it working?03:32
dakeryes03:32
dakerdoctormo, how can i describe changes in multiple lines ?03:36
doctormodaker: Do you need to? why do you need to?03:37
dakeri can't write all the bugs fix in one line :)03:38
doctormoWhy are you commiting all bug fixes at the same time? seperate them out.03:39
doctormoDo smaller commits03:39
doctormoThat's the basic way of doing it, it makes each fix a seperatable patch then.03:39
dakeri see03:39
doctormoAlthough I could see a need for adding in something to do multiple lines, it's just not supported right now.03:41
doctormoPerhaps a bug added to launchpad and I could wishlist it.03:41
dakershould i added it as bug or what ?03:50
doctormoIf you think it's important04:01
doctormothanks for testing by the way, you;ve probably got things to say about it.04:08
dakerno problem04:09
dakerdoctormo, question : how can i get a branch with GC ?04:12
doctormodaker: do you have the project directory inside the Projects directory??04:12
dakeryes04:13
doctormothen there should be a button to get code04:13
doctormoor is it get branch04:13
dakeroki04:13
dakerdaker, can i change the dir "Projects" to "ubuntu-projects" and get the buttons at the top ?04:36
dakerdoctormo, humphreybc  can i change the dir "Projects" to "ubuntu-projects" and get the buttons at the top ?04:38
humphreybcnope, i don't think that will work daker04:39
humphreybcunless doctormo has built in customizable folders for 1.6?04:39
dakerthat would be great04:39
humphreybcI think it's on the wishlist04:39
humphreybcjust keep harassing doctormo till he implements it04:39
humphreybc:04:40
humphreybc:)04:40
dakerhttp://test.ubuntu-manual.org04:43
humphreybcwhat am I looking at?04:43
dakerlanguage list, icons04:44
humphreybcthe icons still move when you scroll down, though04:44
humphreybcno they don't04:44
humphreybchaha04:44
dakeroki04:44
humphreybcjust needed to clear the cache04:44
dakeryes04:45
humphreybcso all of these languages are more or less finished?04:45
dakeryes about 75%04:45
humphreybcawesome04:45
humphreybcgreat, and the icons open in a new tab. you never cease to amaze me daker!04:46
humphreybcyou're brilliant!04:46
dakerthanks :)04:46
dakerdoctormo, anthor bug04:46
dakerGC give me a duplicate result04:47
dakerhttp://imagebin.org/9380804:48
dakerhumphreybc, i think you've missed something04:51
humphreybchmm?04:51
dakerwe have 1 141 fans04:51
humphreybcoh yea, i know :D04:51
dakero.O04:52
humphreybcI posted the link on the OMG! Ubuntu! fan page04:52
humphreybcwe got like another 250 fans in 12 hours04:52
dakeroh04:54
dakernight all05:16
doctormohumphreybc: I think you can change the name of the folder, so long as the .groundcontrol file exists in the dir.05:23
humphreybcah05:23
* humphreybc is cracking up at some the stuff people are posting about my uni05:31
humphreybchttp://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=112309325466828&v=wall&ref=nf05:31
vishhumphreybc: hmm, where's daker ?08:17
vishoh , he's off to sleep ;)08:17
vishhumphreybc: do you know about the facebook and twitter icons on the http://test.ubuntu-manual.org/  ?08:18
vishwhere he got them? they seem to be tango icons...08:18
* vish brb08:27
ubuntujenkinsmorning all09:09
thorwilmorning!09:10
humphreybcvish: i got them from google :P09:41
ubuntujenkinshello hemanth I am about to approve you now, I will talk you though our code base/plans for the next release09:43
hemanthubuntujenkins, roger that09:47
ubuntujenkinsif you look at https://code.edge.launchpad.net/quickshot you will see we have three branches09:48
ubuntujenkinslp:quickshot is the main dvelopment focus where all the program stuff is.09:49
hemanthok09:49
ubuntujenkinslp:quickshot/release contains this release in a sub folder09:50
ubuntujenkinslp:quickshot/server is the next server release09:50
hemanthok09:50
ubuntujenkinswe haven't started had coding work on the next release yet we are on the planning stage this is what we aim to include https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/quickshot/next-release-plan this was out last meeting https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/Meetings#Quickshot meeting 18/04/201009:51
ubuntujenkinshttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/Meetings#Quickshot meeting 18/04/201009:51
ubuntujenkinscopy the whole link ^09:51
hemanthsaved09:52
ubuntujenkinswe are planing a major redesign for the next release and I am currently sorting out the gui design. We will be starting almost from scratch for this release but we can't do anything to lp:quickshot untill i know the the server is pointing at the release branch09:53
hemanthok, thats exciting as its coding from starch09:54
ubuntujenkinsif you look at lp:quickshot/release and get your self familier with the code we have so far. We will be using bits of it but we will be rewrting 90% of it09:55
hemanthokies i'm fetching the source09:56
humphreybchey hemanth, are you a new Quickshot team member?09:56
ubuntujenkinshemanth: meet humphreybc the manual project lead09:56
hemanthhumphreybc, yes :)09:56
humphreybcawesome :)09:56
ubuntujenkinsalso hemanth can we try and sort out your bug please?09:57
humphreybcwelcome to the team! Where did you hear about the project?09:57
hemanthi saw an link to ubuntu-manual page on my facebook wall from one of the ubuntu developers don rembr who exactly!09:58
hemanthubuntujenkins, yes that would be fun09:58
humphreybcnice!09:59
ubuntujenkinslooking at it you are trying to run it runing it09:59
ubuntujenkins*in your user09:59
* ubuntujenkins hit enter and not back 09:59
ubuntujenkinsand your not seeing any gui?10:00
humphreybcwell any questions you have, just ask one of us. Luke (ubuntujenkins) is the main Quickshot chap, I'm the team lead, Kevin (godbyk) is all things LaTeX, Thorsten (thorwil) is our artwork chap, Josh (dutchie) manages translations and other miscellaneous things10:00
humphreybcRed_Hamster X and titeuf also work on Quickshot10:00
hemanthhi to all :)10:00
humphreybcand there are a few people not in the channel like daker who's our web developer, Ilya who's our author coordinator and Jamin who's our head of editing who you'll meet soon enough!10:01
hemanth:)10:01
hemanthubuntujenkins, yes i see the UI, after i hit the login button it bombs10:01
humphreybcand with that I'm going to watch some Firefly episodes!10:01
hemanthha ha ok :)10:02
ubuntujenkinshemanth can you run gnome-session-save --logout-dialog on the command line please?10:03
ubuntujenkinsare you using gnome?10:03
hemanthme on kde! have installed all the gnome core also, unable to login to gnome on lucid beta210:04
hemanthFailed to call logout: The name org.gnome.SessionManager was not provided by any .service files10:04
ubuntujenkinsI have a feeling as you are on kde that is the problem, hmmI wonder what package is needed for that10:05
ubuntujenkinscan you please install gnome-session10:05
hemantho! ok, i'm doing a fresh apt-get install ubuntu-desktop10:06
ubuntujenkinsthat works as well :)10:06
hemanthok 8 more mins...10:06
hemanthi m checking out the qucikshot code in bin10:07
ubuntujenkinsthe AIM this release is to try and avoid problems like this and make it run across every linux machine how easy it will be i don't know10:08
hemanthok :)10:08
trijntjeCan someon explain me how this "\menu{Music \then Quit}" is parsed, i'm not sure how to translate it10:08
thorwiltrijntje: does that refer to an application that has no File menu, but a Music menu instead?10:10
trijntjeYes, Rhythmbox10:10
hemanthubuntujenkins, its bombing in the startNewSession method i presume10:10
ubuntujenkinsthats what i thought hemanth which is why i gessed at the gnome-session save bit10:10
thorwiltrijntje: then i surely means go to the Music menu, choose Quit item10:11
ubuntujenkinsgodbyk: correct me if i am wrong but you only translate the "Music" and the "Quit" bit10:11
ubuntujenkinstrijntje: ^^10:11
hemanthubuntujenkins, 1 more min i will be getting all gnome10:11
ubuntujenkinscool,10:11
godbykubuntujenkins: Right.10:11
godbyktrijntje: Just translate 'Music' and 'Quit'.10:12
ubuntujenkinsyey \o/10:12
godbykLeave anything preceded by a backslash (\) untranslated.10:12
trijntjeThanks ubuntujenkins and godbyk10:12
godbykSo \menu and \then are left as-is (along with the { braces }.)10:12
trijntjeI know a bit of LaTeX, but I was wondering if \then was used to escape from the \menu{} or something like that10:13
godbyktrijntje: If you haven't already, take a look at this PDF: http://files.ubuntu-manual.org/style-guide.pdf10:13
godbyktrijntje: Chapter 4 gives a huge list of LaTeX commands and shows what parts should and shouldn't be translated.10:13
godbykIf you have further questions, feel free to ask here or on the ubuntu-manual mailing list.10:13
godbyk(I'm off to bed now, though.  G'night!)10:13
ubuntujenkinsnight godbyk10:14
trijntjethanks godbyk, I hadnt seen that yet10:14
hemanthubuntujenkins, same error again, gnome-session daemon will not be running i blv...10:14
ubuntujenkinsif you log into gnoe i would think it would work, all that button does is log you out to the login screen. I will add a comment to the bug expaling what we have found10:15
ubuntujenkins*gnome10:15
hemanthubuntujenkins, sorry missed ur previous message, guessed it right! gnome-session was not running, ran it and kde went non responsive10:17
ubuntujenkinshemanth: right makes sense, Thats what i thought as well10:19
hemanthubuntujenkins, ya able to login now, so the fix is to check if gnome-session is running, if not try to start it in bg, if failed warn the user to install it or make it complaint with any right?10:21
ubuntujenkinsI hope to make it compliant with any for the next release, as the manual is the only tema using it and they want gnome stuff, its not too much of a concern for the current release.10:22
hemantho ok10:22
hemanthshall i state this observation in the bug report as a comment?10:23
ubuntujenkinsyep feel free to10:23
hemanth:)10:24
TommyBrunnHey guys, what's the preferred editor for LaTeX in Linux?10:25
ubuntujenkinsgedit :-)10:25
ubuntujenkinsthats what is use any way10:26
ubuntujenkins*i10:26
TommyBrunnSure, but I'd prefer it if there was a less cumbersome way to add the markup than to remember every single tag in my head or copy'n'pasting.10:26
ubuntujenkinsI am not aware of a program that does that, I think some of the markups are specific to us. A program/plugin that does it for the manual on the list of things to do.10:28
vishhumphreybc: well , they dont fit the page ;) those two are the only tango icons in that page.. :)  tsk tsk , thorwil  bad designer ;p10:29
thorwilvish: what page are you talking about?10:29
vishthorwil:  http://test.ubuntu-manual.org/   not you i guess, but easier to blame you ;)10:30
vishthorwil: the facebook and the twitter icons10:30
thorwilvish: yes, not mine, but the um-planet one is10:31
TommyBrunnAlright. Thanks anyway ubuntujenkins. I was just looking for an easier way to format papers for my university, without having to manually remember every single damn APA rule.10:31
ubuntujenkinsthere may be one TommyBrunn but i don't know about it.10:31
trijntjeIt seems that teh Artist/Album browser entry is removed from the rhythmbox Control menu10:32
hemanthubuntujenkins, i commented with the workaround i tried now10:37
ubuntujenkinshemanth: I like the work around, ulitmatley we need to find a command that works accross every desktop ui10:40
hemanthubuntujenkins, okies10:40
ubuntujenkinsthat may be rather hard to find though10:40
hemanthlike the gdmflexiserver we have ksmserver right? but what if the user is not use kde nor gnome!10:45
ubuntujenkinsI am not fmiliar with kde, we may have to work out what desktop ui the user is using and run a command based on that10:46
hemanthi was looking into kde tech base http://techbase.kde.org/Development/Architecture/KDE3/Session_Management10:48
ubuntujenkinsIf we can generate a list of all desktop envrioments and the logout command then that might be a way to do it10:53
hemanthyup10:54
hemanthubuntujenkins, collected all the environments, now collecting the commands11:04
ubuntujenkinswow fast mover hemanth11:05
hemanththanks, there are about 12!11:05
ubuntujenkinsreally that many! we have to work out how to detect them all. how many of them use gtk?11:06
hemanthnot sure how many use gtk, where can i share the list?11:07
hemanthpasite?11:07
ubuntujenkinspad.ubuntu-uk.org/qsdesktopenviroments11:07
hemanthubuntujenkins, https://gist.github.com/9f230db910e682a3aad911:08
hemanthis gist fine or should i repaste to earthpad?11:08
ubuntujenkinsIf we use the ether pad we don't have to all login touse it. I haev just pasted it there11:09
hemanthubuntujenkins, see that, had heard much about earth pad using it now11:09
ubuntujenkinsits really good. we aplays put our stuff on pad.ubuntu-uk.org there are other etherpads11:10
hemanthok :)11:11
popey\o/ etherpad :)11:38
hemanthhttp://etherpad.com is down, is it free to host ?11:39
Davieyhemanth: etherpad is free software, http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org is an instance :)11:40
* popey wonders if Daviey has 'etherpad' on hilight11:40
Davieypopey: nope!11:41
popeyor ubuntu-uk ?11:41
hemanthDaviey, on it11:41
ubuntujenkinsDaviey: always pops up when etherpad is mentioned11:41
Davieypopey: yus :)11:41
DavieyWhich i assume yo do to ;P11:41
dakerhi back11:51
ubuntujenkinshello daker11:52
dakerhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5E0W2oGBPA11:57
popeyDaviey: yup :)11:59
humphreybchey, look everyone, it's Matt Griffin!! *applause*12:02
dakerhi mattgriffin :)12:04
mattgriffindaker: hello12:04
ubuntujenkinshello mattgriffin o/12:04
mattgriffinheh12:04
humphreybcmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmattgriffin!12:04
daker!hello12:04
manualbotHi! Welcome to #ubuntu-manual! Enjoy your stay!12:04
humphreybc:D12:05
dakerubuntujenkins, :p12:05
mattgriffinall these smiling faces so early in the morning :)12:05
humphreybcWell, you know, we're cool like that haha12:05
mattgriffinok... off to a meeting. have a great day!12:05
humphreybcsee ya mattgriffin!! have a fabulous day!12:05
dakersee you mattgriffin12:06
mattgriffinttfn12:07
humphreybcapparently quickshot is worth $40,66312:11
ubuntujenkinswhat??!!! where did you get that from?12:11
dakerha12:11
humphreybchttps://www.ohloh.net/p/quickshot12:11
humphreybcbottom right12:11
humphreybcthe Ubuntu Manual Project is worth $152,000 though :P12:11
humphreybc"This calculator estimates how much it would cost to hire a team to write this project from scratch."12:12
ubuntujenkinswheres out pay?12:12
humphreybchehe12:12
humphreybcnothing compared to Open Office though, haha https://www.ohloh.net/p/openoffice12:14
ubuntujenkinswow12:14
dakerWowww o.O12:14
humphreybcVLC is worth 7 and a half million bucks, 139 person years12:15
humphreybchence, the power of open source12:15
humphreybcvish, thorwil, if you guys want to create a better facebook icon and twitter icon for the website, feel free ;)12:17
dakerhumphreybc, +112:18
thorwilhumphreybc: i didn't so far because the icons are well known as the are, even if that makes them stand out a bit much12:18
humphreybcyeah, i don't think it's the end of the world12:19
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc, daker, and hemanth have a look at http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5012868/quickshot-ui.odp that is the latest version of the new quickshot ui. None of it is final.12:20
thorwildaker: but consider to turn off the drop shadows for the those 3 buttons12:20
vishthorwil: we dont have to redesign ;)  just removing the tango inner-outlines would do as well12:20
dakerthorwil, kk12:21
dakerubuntujenkins, question : who is hemanth ?12:21
dakerthis the first time i saw him in the channel ? i am right ?12:21
thorwilvish: you have my blessing to tweak them ;)12:21
ubuntujenkinsdaker: hemanth is a new member he is new to the project12:21
humphreybclooking good ubuntujenkins12:21
ubuntujenkinsany suggestions humphreybc12:21
hemanthdaker,hi :)12:21
vishthorwil: whats wrong with having the drop shadows?12:21
vishdaker: what size icons are required there?12:22
humphreybcubuntujenkins: i'll have an indepth look soon, and do some mockups in photoshop for you12:22
humphreybclater this week, or weekend12:22
vishdaker: rather what is the size of the UM icon?12:22
humphreybcwhat's the bar thing down the bottom? Is that a progress bar?12:22
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: don't worry about photo shop just yet wait untill we have had a quickshot miling list discussion on it. The progress bar only shows when the user is doing something12:23
thorwilvish: the shadows make the area around the buttons too busy. plus i prefer buttons to sit on a surface instead of floating around12:23
humphreybcthorwil: at some point, you might like to design a new quickshot logo :P12:23
ubuntujenkinsoo that would be interesting12:23
thorwilhumphreybc: :p makes me want not to ;)12:23
humphreybcubuntujenkins: okay. If you're going to have a progress bar prominently displayed in the UI, you'd need to have it across all windows to keep consistency12:23
dakervish, 32x3212:24
vishdaker: ty12:24
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: it only shows when needed. its not always there. I think its on nearly all of the windows.12:24
vishthorwil: could you send me the UM icon?12:24
humphreybcthorwil: hehe. well since Quickshot will be able to be used by any projects, we shouldn't have the circle of friends in the logo, and the wallpaper is from karmic... and there's a lot of brown :P12:24
humphreybcubuntujenkins: right. I'll have a closer look in the next few days :)12:25
ubuntujenkinsthorwil: the ultimate aim for this release is to make it cross linux in every desktop enviroment12:25
humphreybcdaker, aren't you going to remove the drop shadows from the website entirely?12:25
humphreybcthey don't work in chrome12:25
dakerbut it works in the others12:26
ubuntujenkinsthats why i don't see them12:26
thorwilvish: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~t-w-/%2Bjunk/ubuntu_manual_cover/files/53  icon-button_planet.svg and .png12:26
humphreybcLooking at Firefox and Chrome side-by-side, I think I prefer the site without drop shadows entirely12:26
humphreybc(I know, crazy coming from me!)12:26
ubuntujenkinssame12:26
dakerso should i remove it ?12:26
humphreybcdaker: yes12:27
dakerhemanth, you are welcome12:27
dakerhumphreybc, oki12:27
hemanthdaker, thank you :)12:27
thorwilhumphreybc: just like the oral and anal phases and puberty, the drop shadow phase usually doesn't last forever12:28
humphreybcLOL12:28
humphreybcthorwil, I've never known you to be so vulgar in a publicly logged chatroom :P12:28
dakerlol12:29
vishhumphreybc: whaaaaat!  thorwil can do better ;p12:29
thorwilhumphreybc: hah, don't ask kwwii bout that. or vish12:29
humphreybcubuntujenkins: when is Quickshot 1.0 slated for release?12:30
* humphreybc has 39mb of mobile data to burn on his android phone in half an hour12:33
* hemanth quick restart trying ati drivers on lucid 12:35
* humphreybc is downloading stuff from the market12:37
semioticrobotic'morning12:55
humphreybchey bryan12:59
humphreybcis it just me, or are most android apps stink?12:59
semioticroboticha!13:01
semioticroboticcouldn't tell you13:01
semioticroboticI don't have an Android phone :(13:01
semioticroboticthe new HTC/Verizon thing (in the States) looks interesting13:01
dakerhemanth, http://test.ubuntu-manual.org/13:07
dakerhumphreybc,  http://test.ubuntu-manual.org/13:07
dakersorry13:07
semioticroboticwow, looking great!13:08
humphreybclooks good daker13:08
semioticroboticthe other day, I was reviewing the "getting started as an author or editor page," and the instructions all pertained to helping with quickshot13:09
semioticroboticglad to see that's been altered, darker13:09
semioticroboticthat countdown timer can't be correct!  8 days!  o_013:09
dakersemioticrobotic, it correct13:09
humphreybcanyone who hasn't seen already: http://humphreybc.wordpress.com/2010/04/21/announcing-getting-started-with-ubuntu-10-10-quickshot-v1-0-and-the-ubuntu-quickstart-booklet/13:10
semioticroboticoh, I know :)13:10
semioticroboticI was just commenting on how quickly the release is approaching13:10
humphreybcI downloaded the RC just now13:10
humphreybcgodbyk has done a good job touching up some of the formatting issues13:10
humphreybclike where screenshots would interrupt in bad places13:10
semioticrobotichaving a look right now13:10
semioticroboticyes, I see13:11
semioticroboticvery nice indeed13:11
semioticroboticthe glossary seems to be showing some odd spacing13:12
semioticroboticoh!  I see now13:12
semioticroboticit's grouped by letter13:12
semioticroboticmake sense13:13
semioticrobotichumphreybc: Would it be best for editors to got through their chapters and identify a few concrete areas to be addresses for lucid-e2?13:14
semioticroboticwhat's our plan of attack, so to speak?13:14
humphreybcum13:14
humphreybchmm13:14
semioticroboticer, addressed13:14
humphreybcthe first thing we should do after the release is set up a couple of methods for people to give feedback13:15
semioticroboticI know we're adding content only in dire cases (a good idea), but it may still be a good idea to generate a few to-do lists13:15
humphreybcso we should have a survey13:15
semioticroboticok13:15
humphreybcwith some questions like "What do you think is missing?" blah blah etcetera13:15
semioticroboticok13:15
humphreybcand also, we should encourage people to report bugs13:15
humphreybcIf we do those things, the to do list will be made for us ;)13:16
semioticroboticideally, it'd be nice to have a feedback system that funneled all comments into a general inbox, which was subsequently managed by someone who could delegate those tasks/suggestions to individual chapter editors13:16
semioticroboticgotcha13:16
humphreybcyeah, that would be great13:17
semioticroboticof course, that's "ideally"13:17
humphreybcwhen we set up our bug reporting/feedback form with the Launchpad API13:17
semioticroboticI noticed that in your "State of the Manual Address" :)13:17
humphreybcwe'll have something like that, and basically recruit someone as a full time triager and assigner13:17
humphreybcso people will always have stuff to do ;)13:17
humphreybchehehe13:17
semioticroboticwhat kind of custom Launchpad stuff are we thinking about?13:17
semioticroboticawesome13:18
humphreybcdid you like it? I was trying to emulate Mark. I showed Mark it, he said it's awesome13:18
semioticrobotichaha13:18
semioticroboticthen you succeeded13:18
humphreybcwell not so much doing anything with LP itself but rather making our own form that uses the API to report bugs under our project13:18
semioticroboticthe zeal is there -- "100 percent error free"13:18
semioticroboticgotcha, gotcha13:18
humphreybcthe front end would be a customized pretty form13:18
semioticroboticthat would be truly amazing, and so helpful13:18
humphreybcback end would just be what we see now, Launchpad13:18
humphreybcAlso, by Maverick I want to have everything shifted off the wiki13:18
humphreybcMost of it is already13:19
semioticroboticthe GDocs solution worked for lucid-e113:19
semioticroboticbut it was a bit chaotic13:19
semioticroboticshifted off the wiki, yeah13:19
humphreybcWe also will need to look at the website in depth, analyze the instructions, create scripts where we can automate some instructions, use apt:urls and stuff more, so it's super simple13:19
semioticroboticyes, mostly everything has been transferred already (thanks to the excellent work by the Web team)13:19
humphreybcat the moment our instructions are a bit lengthy and off putting13:19
semioticroboticsure, understandable13:20
humphreybcthe only thing we use the wiki for at the moment is to post meeting related stuff13:20
semioticroboticI can attest to that somewhat.  As a relative noob, I struggled (as you know) to catch up to the project when I first started13:20
semioticroboticbut now that I'm in synch, everything is running smoothly13:21
humphreybcthere's no reason why we can't keep using the wiki as a team, but I don't want any *customers* / readers seeing the wiki13:21
semioticroboticso the fewer barriers to entry, the better13:21
humphreybcyeah, exactly13:21
humphreybcI can't imagine how difficult it would be to join our team now13:21
semioticroboticright -- wiki for "internal use" only13:21
semioticrobotic:)13:21
humphreybcexactly13:21
humphreybcso the main wiki page will have a big phat button that says "REDIRECT ME TO THE WEBSITE"13:21
humphreybcor something13:21
semioticroboticI learned a lot about Linux, Ubuntu, and RSA encryption during that initiation period!13:22
semioticroboticright13:22
humphreybceventually we'll phase out the wiki link, most people will never see it13:22
semioticroboticperhaps the website could just contain a blog or other CMS that would allow you to post meeting times?13:22
humphreybcnot using the wiki gives a lot more flexibility on appearance, content, image placement and translations13:22
semioticroboticyes, definitely13:22
thorwildaker: looks pretty good, except the footer. "Some rights reserved" and a CC license is odd. if it stays 2 lines of text, they should have the same alignment and both be either the last thing on the "page", or sit below it13:22
humphreybcyeah I was thinking about that, I don't see the benefits of developing a CMS just for meetings at the moment when the wiki works fine as is13:23
humphreybcbut in the future, if we find we need it, we'll definitely be doing something like that13:23
semioticroboticvery true13:24
humphreybci'm just looking at the instructions for getting started as an author now13:24
humphreybcit's way too complicated13:24
dakerthorwil, in what language ?13:24
thorwildaker: English13:24
* humphreybc is going to start creating some work item b-b-blueprints for lucid-e2 and maverick!13:25
semioticrobotichumphreybc: Taking it one step at a time, it isn't TOO bad ... but it LOOKS complicated, and that's a barrier to entry13:25
humphreybcyeah13:25
humphreybcwe can make it a lot better13:25
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: I have targeted the release of quickshot for 21/08/201013:25
semioticroboticb-b-blueprints!13:25
semioticroboticexciting stuff13:25
dakerthorwil, capture pls13:25
* ubuntujenkins needs to do quickshot blueprints13:26
humphreybcwhen we get packaged in the Software Center, we should also have a package that people can install that basically does everything13:26
humphreybcdoes everything, ie, everything needed to help13:26
semioticroboticthe manual will be packaged in the software center?13:26
humphreybcthen we can just instruct wannabe contributors to install that package13:26
thorwildaker: http://www.foopics.com/showfull/099afff23b35db0fc65ba852a7d0b96813:26
humphreybcI'm hoping it will be available in the SC for maverick, yes, and I'll be talking to chaps at UDS about that13:27
semioticroboticthat's great13:27
semioticroboticso while we may not be able to get it "on the desktop" for 10.10, there's a good chance it'll be easily attainable13:27
dakerthorwil, is this firefox or what ?13:28
thorwildaker: yes, FF 3.5.913:28
dakerwhat resolution ?13:28
humphreybcget ready for blueprint emails galore13:29
semioticrobotic(site is looking good in Safari 4.0.4, by the way)13:29
dakerthorwil, i think is due to your resolution13:30
thorwildaker: it's independent of browser window size. the offset of the last line varies between languages. it's zero for German13:30
thorwildaker: 1280x1024, but there would have to be something very odd going on for that to have an effect13:32
dakerthis is very odd13:36
daker:D13:36
semioticroboticokay friends, gotta run13:37
semioticrobotico/13:37
semioticrobotictake care13:37
ubuntujenkinsbye semioticrobotic13:37
dakerbye semioticrobotic13:37
humphreybcsee ya Bryan13:40
dakeroh yo yo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D1xwtv2HRyc13:45
hemanthubuntujenkins, in the list we made most of them have no info on save and logout!13:48
ubuntujenkinshemanth:hhmm, there must be some command somewhere but it must be very hard to find. We will just go with what we have at the moment and keep looking into it13:49
hemanthubuntujenkins, gnome,kde and xfce i have collected13:49
hemanthubuntujenkins, √Čtoil√© i'm hearing it for the first time13:49
dakerbrb13:50
ubuntujenkinscan we find the best way to tell which one is running? I guess looking at the proccess list.13:51
humphreybcLaunchpad being slow isn't that great when trying to create a zillion blueprints13:51
hemanthubuntujenkins, ya that way it can be done13:51
hemanthubuntujenkins, but i think there must be some generic work around or some library in py to manage this13:52
ubuntujenkinsI guess there might be, something to look into13:53
hemanthyup13:53
humphreybc...aand the blueprint emails start pouring in13:54
humphreybcit's always funny when this happens. We get a tonne of new blueprints, I seem to get a tonne of karma, and we usually have about half a dozen people leave the team due to the spam on the ML hahaha13:55
ubuntujenkinsI was about to say that13:55
hemanthubuntujenkins, no one responded from #python also hmm...13:55
ubuntujenkinshemanth: its abit hit and miss if they give a response. also try #ubuntu-app-devel they are helpful it can take a while for someone to respond13:56
hemanthok, joined #ubuntu-app-devel13:57
nisshhwhats up everyone?13:57
ubuntujenkinsthere are not many people in there hemanth but they are alwasy helpfull13:57
humphreybchey nisshh, not much. wanna help me sort out some blueprints?13:57
nisshhhumphreybc: sure13:59
nisshhnot doing much atm13:59
humphreybcsweet. could you go through all the blueprints for the 1st edition (ie, one we've been working on) and make sure their statuses reflect the real status, so for example, chapter 3 has "Needs code review" when in actual fact it should be "Implemented"13:59
humphreybcactually, ALL of the chapter blueprints should now be "Implemented" because we're past the writing freeze14:00
nisshhright14:00
humphreybcyou'll get a crapload of karma!14:00
nisshhyea, i could use some too!14:00
nisshhis it just me or does launchpad.net load WAY faster>14:05
humphreybcway faster than..?14:05
nisshhthan a a week or two ago14:06
trijntjeubuntujenkins: I think you adviced me to install ubuntu to a usb-disk to capture the screenshots of the installation, but this is a bad idea ias it will still install grub to the primary HDD14:06
trijntjeJust for your information14:07
nisshhhumphreybc: what about chapter6--old?14:07
humphreybcget rid of that14:07
humphreybcalso stuff that we've already passed, like beta-release for lucid and stuff14:07
nisshhok14:08
humphreybcpretty much anything that's targeted to the lucid-e1 series needs to be either set to "implemented" or re-targeted to lucid-e2 if we haven't finsihed it14:08
nisshhok14:08
humphreybcanything you're not sure about, ask me and i'll tell you where to re-target it14:09
ubuntujenkinstrijntje: I hadn't thought about that, thanks for letting me know.14:09
humphreybcyou just do the lucid-e1 stuff, i'm working on lucid-e2 and maverick blueprints14:09
nisshhright, what should i mark chapter6--old as then?14:09
humphreybctrijntje: it won't do that if you install it using the USB Disc Creator in Ubuntu14:09
humphreybcnisshh: mark it obsoleted by something, chapter614:09
humphreybcor just implemented to get rid of it14:09
nisshhok cool14:09
trijntjehumphreybc: will that also show the slideshow etc? I cant recall i saw that14:10
humphreybcfor the next release we're not going to have blueprints for each chapter14:10
nisshhright, whats going to happen then?14:10
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: trijntje means when you do the install from the live cd you need to choose somewhere to install the os to get the partioning screenshot14:10
humphreybcubuntujenkins: oooooooooohhhhhhhh14:10
humphreybcnisshh: probably just a blueprint for writing, then we can use the whiteboard to assign authors14:10
nisshhok14:11
humphreybcre-target editing, formatting, translations, glossary, referencing and credits to lucid-e214:14
humphreybcre-target optimization to maverick14:14
nisshhok14:14
humphreybcdid you change the milestones as well?14:19
humphreybcmost of them should be RC14:19
humphreybc(for maverick)14:19
humphreybcthere aren't any milestones for lucid-e214:19
humphreybcwe're not going to have an alpha/beta/etc for that14:20
nisshhright14:20
humphreybcwell, we might do14:20
humphreybcwe might have a writing freeze14:20
nisshhwriting freeze is good14:20
nisshhkind of like ubuntus feature freezr14:20
humphreybcawesome, so after 20 minutes of blueprint editing, we now have a list of current blueprints targeted to stuff in the future!14:20
nisshhhehe14:20
nisshhill update all the milestones next14:21
humphreybceveryone, go and look here, see if we've missed anything for lucid-e2/maverick14:21
humphreybchttps://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual14:21
nisshhhumphreybc: what about final-release-lucid? iv left it at e1 for now14:22
humphreybcyeah, it has to be left at e1 till it's actually released ;)14:23
nisshhoh yea , silly me!14:23
nisshhhumphreybc: which milestones need updating>14:24
nisshh?14:24
humphreybcum14:24
humphreybcpretty much everything you've already changed14:24
nisshhah right14:25
humphreybcmake sure they're targeted to the correct milestone. If it's for Maverick, ask me what milestone (there are four: alpha, beta, RC and final)14:25
humphreybcdaker: what's your launchpad username?14:25
nisshhok14:25
humphreybcnvm, found it14:26
dakerdone14:26
humphreybcadnane002 :)14:26
humphreybcalso, nisshh, the blueprints that have been re-targeted need to have their status updated, ie, reset to zero14:26
humphreybcfor example, translations haven't started on lucid-e2 yet14:27
nisshhhumphreybc: what should editing, formatting, etc, be? e2 or maverick?14:27
humphreybce214:27
nisshhright yea14:27
nisshhhumphreybc: optimizing? its for maverick, but which milestone?14:30
humphreybcfinal14:30
nisshhyep14:31
dakerhumphreybc, question14:32
humphreybcshoot14:32
dakerwhy autodetection language when i click on the button ?14:32
humphreybcbecause we want to reduce the number of steps people need to do to get the manual14:33
humphreybcif we can do something automatically for them, we should14:33
humphreybcmakes their life easier14:33
dakeroki14:33
humphreybcbut we need to make sure we have a plan B if the auto-detected language isn't what they wanted14:33
humphreybcfor example, if they're on a shared computer at an airport or something14:34
humphreybcor maybe they want to give it to a friend14:34
dakerwhat button ? on the home page or the downloads page N14:34
daker?14:34
humphreybcin most cases, the auto detection should work well, if not, we should have another way for them to select a different language14:34
humphreybcon the home page only14:34
humphreybcthe downloads page button should take into the settings they've chosen14:34
humphreybclike the mockup14:34
dakerits already done :)14:34
humphreybcnice!14:35
nisshhi really love docky!14:35
humphreybcwhen it doesn't crash on ya14:35
humphreybc:P14:35
humphreybcnow, to clear all these emails14:35
humphreybc26 in fact14:36
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: any idea why the quickshot blueprints are not being mailed to the quickshot mailing list?>14:36
humphreybcnot sure14:36
humphreybcask in #launchpad14:36
humphreybcsay I sent you :P14:36
nisshhhumphreybc: i *think* im done14:38
humphreybchehe14:39
humphreybci'll have a look tomorrow, probably create some more blueprints for maverick and e214:39
nisshhright14:39
nisshhanything else fun for me to do?14:39
nisshh:)14:39
humphreybcnot really :P14:39
nisshhaawwwww!14:40
humphreybctake a look at the latest Ground Control branch14:40
humphreybcdo some testing, daker has done some, he can help14:40
humphreybcreport bugs14:40
humphreybcAlso you can check out the Quickshot user interface design idea from ubuntujenkins, he'll give you the link14:40
nisshhhmmmm14:40
ubuntujenkinsnisshh: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5012868/quickshot-ui.odp14:40
humphreybcyou can also go through the bugs that have been reported on launchpad and make sure their status is correct, also if they're targeted correctly14:41
humphreybcanswer any questions we may have14:41
nisshhok14:41
dakersometimes GC takes a long time to open the window14:42
dakerlike now14:42
dakermore than 4min14:42
humphreybcsign up to ohloh.net and https://openhatch.org14:42
humphreybcfind our projects, mark yourself as a contributor, look at stats :P14:42
nisshhyep14:43
humphreybclots of stuff to do!14:43
nisshhhehe14:43
humphreybckeep pestering daker every 5 minutes till he sends me his mugshot14:43
nisshhid like to help out alot more than i have been to be honest14:43
humphreybcthen pester me every 5 minutes to put his mugshot into the video and re-render it14:43
humphreybcwell, you can help with research and feedback actually14:43
nisshhoooh, bad daker!14:43
humphreybci'm sure Ilya will need help14:43
humphreybcwe need to create a survey after this release to get some feedback14:44
humphreybcstart thinking of some questions we'd need to answer14:44
humphreybcask*14:44
nisshhwhats the survey collecting information about?14:44
nisshhgenerally14:44
nisshhubuntujenkins: nice looking ui mockup14:46
dakerf***14:46
nisshhdaker: what was that?14:46
ubuntujenkinsthanks nisshh any thoughts?14:46
nisshhubuntujenkins: ill let you know, still looking through i14:46
nisshhit14:46
ubuntujenkinsThe progrsess bar will only show when the program is doing14:47
ubuntujenkinssomething i.e. setting up a user account or checking the server.14:47
dakerGC freezes my ubuntu and i was forced to restart it14:48
humphreybcnisshh: if you're looking for extra stuff to do there is always logistical things, we need more people triaging bugs, targeting blueprints, assigning bugs, answering questions, replying to emails in the ML etc14:48
humphreybcdaker: sounds like a bug to report ;)14:48
humphreybcthe surveys would have the goal of figuring out what we can improve on for lucid e2, and what we need to add14:49
dakerwell i think it's due to my connexion14:49
nisshhok, ill think about it14:49
humphreybclook at Ilya's previous survey14:49
humphreybcit's on our wiki somewhere14:49
humphreybchttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/Research/SurveyJan201014:49
humphreybchey gnarly, the next Ubuntu Bug Day is targeting Evince14:51
humphreybcokay i'm off to bed to read for a bit15:09
humphreybcnight all15:09
ubuntujenkinsnight humphreybc15:09
dakernight humphreybc15:09
humphreybcalso, you know that memory leak I had?15:10
humphreybcit's this bug here15:10
humphreybchttps://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/56598115:10
manualbotLaunchpad bug 565981 in xorg-server "[KMS] gem objects not deallocated" [Critical,Confirmed]15:10
dakerubuntujenkins, google gravity http://bit.ly/dBqCXD15:23
ubuntujenkinsdaker: that is AMAZING it moves when you move your window as well15:24
ubuntujenkinsand you can even search with it15:24
dakerhhhhhhhhh15:25
dakerbrb15:25
ubuntujenkinsbrb15:59
* ubuntujenkins grrr my internet keeps diying17:04
ubuntujenkinsdid i miss anything whilst th uni interent failed?18:19
godbykubuntujenkins: Nope, you didn't miss anything.18:23
godbykMy Internet may be down for a bit this afternoon if the cable guy shows up.18:23
ubuntujenkinsok thanks godbyk, ok lets hope he fixes it this time18:23
godbykI'm going to make a sandwich.  brb.18:23
godbykMe, too.18:23
godbykTired of it being down all the time.18:23
dakerubuntujenkins, http://test.ubuntu-manual.org/quickshot/help18:44
ubuntujenkinsdaker: thats good there is one thing that needs to go on there18:46
daker?18:46
ubuntujenkinsto follow still typing it18:46
dakeroki18:46
ubuntujenkinsyou can do screenshots in other languages you will need to have other language packs installed. Log out of the quickshot user, choose the quickshot user and you can change the langauge in the bottom left corner. Quickshot will remain in english but the rest of the desktop will be in the langauge you choose18:50
ubuntujenkinsdaker: ^ something like that please. I may have made a typo in that so please check it18:50
Steve^hi18:51
dakerubuntujenkins, i am not good in english :)18:51
ubuntujenkinsok daker let me double check it18:52
dakerSteve^, hi18:52
ubuntujenkinsdaker: To do screenshots in other languages you will need to have other language packs installed. Log out of the quickshot user, then choose the quickshot user. You can change the language in the bottom left corner. Quickshot will remain in English but the rest of the desktop will be in the language you choose18:54
dakeroki18:54
dakershould i add it at the end ?18:55
ubuntujenkinsthanks, people ask that question allot18:55
ubuntujenkinserm..18:55
ubuntujenkinsyes the end will be fine18:55
ubuntujenkinshello Steve^18:55
dakeroki18:55
ubuntujenkinsthanks18:56
Steve^I write a lot of documentation for my team at work and I like Ubuntu, so I figure this might be a good way to give back to the project18:56
ubuntujenkinscool, are you farmiliar with laytex?18:56
ubuntujenkinswe always need more people18:56
ubuntujenkinslaytex is easy to get the hang of18:57
Steve^yea, used it for my dissertation18:57
ubuntujenkinscool let me find the style guide18:57
ubuntujenkinshttp://files.ubuntu-manual.org/style-guide.pdf is the style guide,18:58
Steve^just following the startup guide, found a mistake already :)18:59
ubuntujenkinswhere? have you looked at http://ubuntu-manual.org/getinvolved/authors18:59
Steve^yea, can't branch without telling bzr my launchpad id first19:01
dakeryes19:01
ubuntujenkinswe all work on the main branch but please don't touch lucid/e119:01
ubuntujenkinssorry dontt touch lp:ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1 its on a wrtting freeze19:02
Steve^ok, my bzr is too old aswell19:03
Steve^which is because I'm running 9.0419:03
ubuntujenkinsyou can't compile the manual with out texlive 2009 its about 2gb to download btw19:04
dutchieonly if you get all of it19:04
Steve^that's quite large19:04
dutchienot sure what the minimal size of latex is, godbyk may know19:04
ubuntujenkinsor you could do a dutchie and cause lots of problems :P19:04
dutchieubuntujenkins: oh, thanks19:04
ubuntujenkins:-)19:04
Steve^latex for windows was just under 200 meg I believe19:04
godbykI'm not sure what the minimal installation size is. Sorry.19:05
Steve^which I thought was ridiculous19:05
dutchieubuntujenkins: are you oggcamping?19:05
ubuntujenkinsdutchie: i want to but the train tickets are really expensive and I have no where to stay19:06
dutchie:(19:06
dutchiebring a sleeping bag, it'll probably be warm and there are loads of parks19:06
dutchieif you start walking now, you'll have loads of time19:06
ubuntujenkinsits a 4 hour train journey, I like walking long distances but thats too far19:07
dakergodbyk, ubuntujenkins, dutchie Lucid RC hasn't been released yet ?19:08
ubuntujenkinsdaker: no not yet the anoucment isn't out19:08
dutchietomorrow iirc19:08
dutchiehttp://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucidReleaseSchedule19:08
ubuntujenkinsSteve^: give a shout in here if you get stuck btw.19:09
ubuntujenkinsdutchie: I hope ogg camp is near home next time19:10
dutchiethe rumour is that it'll be on the south coast in uupc land19:11
dutchiethere, or germany19:11
ubuntujenkinsno oxford or nottingham area is good <<cough>> popey19:11
Steve^ubuntujenkins, "create symlinks to standard directories", what am I making symlinks to?19:12
Steve^I need to know in order to decide where to put the links19:12
ubuntujenkinsgodbyk: will give the best answer, I am not 100% sure only 90%19:13
dutchieSteve^: /usr/local19:13
dutchieusually a good idea19:13
dakerubuntujenkins, i think we migrate all the wiki to the website19:15
godbykSteve^: Definitely make the symlinks.19:16
ubuntujenkinsWE need to work on the quickshot content19:16
ubuntujenkinssorry about the caps19:16
godbykSteve^: Your other option is to add the lengthy texlive binary dir to your PATH.19:16
ubuntujenkinsI knew we needed to make the symlinks but not 100% sure where too19:17
dutchiedefault's fine :)19:17
dutchiesticks manpages and things in the right place too19:17
doctormohumphreybc: thanks for the good writeup of the manual teams direction and posting it to learning19:18
dutchiedoctormo: he is asleep19:19
dutchiegive it a few hours, and he'll show up19:19
doctormodutchie: I'm sure that he'll get the message in the either of time.19:19
dutchienot when he's not online19:20
dutchieI'll pass it along if you like19:20
trijntjeis 29th of april also the translation deadline for the manual or is that the 22th?19:37
dutchiethere is no translation deadline19:38
ubuntujenkinshttps://answers.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/+question/106356 trijntje19:38
trijntjethanks ubuntujenkins, so the manual will not be included in the live-cd?19:40
dutchietoo big, unfortunately19:40
Steve^why was tex chosen over HTML?19:50
dutchiebecause we wanted a single pdf19:50
Steve^why?19:51
Steve^I suppose you can convert tex to HTML but not the other way around19:51
dutchiethe point of the project is to produce a single, easy-to-access file that has all the content in one place19:53
dutchieHTML is not "all in one place"19:53
Steve^oh19:54
Steve^so actually, you are writing a book19:55
Steve^then I'm probably wasting my time here19:56
godbykSteve^: Yeah, we're writing a book.  We'll be making printed copies available soon, too.19:56
godbykSteve^: What are you interested in doing?19:56
Steve^something lower level than what is currently in your PDF19:57
godbyk"lower level"?19:57
Steve^for example, would it ever include information about services?19:58
Steve^or how the things in /etc/rcx.d work?19:58
dutchieno19:59
dutchiemore "how to install a printer"19:59
Steve^then that's too boring for me19:59
Steve^I wanted to make the geeky side of Linux more accessible19:59
dutchiewell, we are planning an advanced manaul20:00
Steve^I think you have placed a massive restriction on it having to be in a book format20:00
ubuntujenkinsdutchie: where is the link to the etherpad that contains that?20:01
Steve^someone is always going to be in charge of a table of contents, that no author can go outside of20:01
Steve^Sure, there is a basic set of checkboxes that have to be ticked, but there is absolutely no scope for articles on top of that20:01
dutchieoh20:01
dutchieUbuntu Contributors Manual (Scratched)20:01
dutchiehttp://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/MaiZTb4Fjd20:01
* dutchie wishes people would tell him these things20:01
ubuntujenkinsi didn't know either, are well more time to focus on programming quickshot20:02
Steve^What is that pad and why is it so slow?20:02
ubuntujenkinsthanks dutchie20:02
Steve^ah, it has loaded20:02
Steve^that's pretty cool20:03
Steve^anyway20:03
ubuntujenkinsSteve^: do you hav any php or python knowledge?20:03
Steve^yes20:04
ubuntujenkinswhich one? have you heard of quickshot?20:04
Steve^I understand that it makes screenshots of things and I have knowledge of both20:04
Steve^by trade, I am a programmer20:05
dakerhttp://test.ubuntu-manual.org/quickshot/20:05
Steve^strangely enough I thought this project was a good idea because I could contribute by writing rather than programming20:05
ubuntujenkinswell we have a new release planned, these are the features we aim to add https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/quickshot/next-release-plan20:06
Steve^dutchie, is the Ubuntu Contributors Manual the same as the advanced manual?20:06
dutchieyes20:06
dutchieand "was"20:06
Steve^then there is no hope20:06
godbykSo much despair! :)20:06
dakerubuntujenkins, godbyk , dutchie  do you have any good tutorials about pygtk ?20:08
ubuntujenkinsI do it all the ui in glade. bit of a cheat really20:09
Steve^I really hoped this was a project to bring all the articles on blogs together20:09
Steve^so they could be a proper, reliable resource20:09
dutchiedaker: http://www.pygtk.org/pygtk2tutorial/index.html20:10
godbykAh, I see.  Well, we're just starting out.  Our first project is the beginner's guide to Ubuntu.  As we get time, we'll look into writing other material as well.20:10
* ubuntujenkins bookmarks it i need to learn that stuff20:10
ubuntujenkinsdutchie: have you looked at the latest ui ideas for quickshot?20:11
dutchieubuntujenkins: no, not really20:11
dakerdutchie, thanks20:11
dutchiehaven't been keeping up with quickshot20:11
Steve^I've cancelled my download, left the mailing list20:11
dutchiedaker: np20:11
Steve^bye guys20:11
dutchiebye Steve^20:11
godbykOkay, the cable Internet tech is on his way, so my connection may drop out for a bit while he tests things.20:11
ubuntujenkinsok dutchie if you get bored all thoughts are welcome20:12
dutchieubuntujenkins: do you have a link to look over?20:12
ubuntujenkinshttp://dl.dropbox.com/u/5012868/quickshot-ui.odp20:12
* ubuntujenkins is bored rally should revise20:26
ubuntujenkins*really20:27
* ubuntujenkins always misses a letter out some where20:27
ChrisWoollarddutchie: That EtherPad looks really cool.20:42
dutchienowt to do with me20:42
dutchieblame Daviey20:42
popey#blamedaviey20:43
dakerubuntujenkins, look at this http://itaka.jardinpresente.com.ar/20:43
popeyubuntujenkins: will people be booting quickshot on real hardware or in a vm?20:45
ubuntujenkinsthanks daker looking now20:45
ubuntujenkinspopey: i think mostly on real hardware why?20:46
popeyif its a clean install from the cd and they have _not_ installed the nvidia driver then you can use xrandr to resize the screen20:46
ubuntujenkinsI know but people like me have the testing disto ages before its release. Also we aim to allow for other projects in the next release who may not need to do it on the latest release.20:48
ubuntujenkinsthanks for the thought popey :-)20:48
ubuntujenkinsdaker: I can't find any proof its still going20:51
dakerwhat ?20:51
ubuntujenkinshttp://itaka.jardinpresente.com.ar/20:52
ubuntujenkinsthe link you gave me20:52
ubuntujenkinslooks cool though20:52
dakerit provide the server and the client in the same app20:52
ubuntujenkinsI am reading about it20:54
godbykWell, hopefully that'll fix my Internet woes.  We replaced a couple splitters (that didn't need to be splitters).21:03
ubuntujenkinsdidn't they do that last time?21:03
godbykubuntujenkins: <sigh> yeah.  but there were a couple that they missed.  (the previous techs didn't look in the attic.)21:04
godbykThis guy actually tested the signal along the way instead of blindly crimping on new connectors.21:04
godbykWe'll see if it holds up, though.21:04
ubuntujenkinswell lets hope that does it.21:04
dakergodbyk, ping21:23
godbykdaker: pong21:23
dakerubuntu-manual.org should point lp:ubuntu-manual-website21:24
dakerwhat do you think ?21:25
godbykOoh.. are we ready?21:26
dakeri think21:26
godbyklp:ubuntu-manual-website is what test.ubuntu-manual.org points to currently, right?21:27
dakeryes21:27
dakerlet it to another day :)21:27
dakerdon't change anything oki ?21:28
godbykokay21:28
dakerbrb21:28
godbykhow is the download counter script coming along?21:29
ubuntujenkinsgodbyk: with the release candidate, what branch was it built from? The images are not the same as the ones that are in lucid-e1 I put them in a while ago21:29
godbykubuntujenkins: yeah, I know. that's my bad.21:29
godbykubuntujenkins: I branched from lucid-e1 a while back so I could move strings around and fiddle with some detailed latex stuff without pestering the translators.21:30
ubuntujenkinsno problem i thought i had put them in the wrong place.21:30
godbykubuntujenkins: I just merged in a lot of the .tex file changes manually, but forgot about the screenshots.21:30
godbykI'm going to do some more editing on it and pull in the screenshots and whatnot.21:30
ubuntujenkinsThats fine. have you had time to switch the quickshot server?21:31
godbykthen I'll email a copy of it to everyone for one final check before we publish the final version and book.21:31
godbykubuntujenkins: I wasn't sure if you were ready. One of your comments made me think I was to hold off.21:31
ubuntujenkinsIt is ready, let me find the branch21:32
godbyk'kay.21:32
godbykyeah, just tell me what to point to and I'll set it up for ya.21:32
dutchieooh, rev 80021:32
manualbothttp://bazaar.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/revision/800 | http://bazaar.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual -r 80021:32
dutchiehow exciting21:32
godbyk:)21:32
ubuntujenkinslp:quickshot/release and in the folder called 0.0.8 is the same stuff as the current branch21:33
godbykdutchie: One of the Romanian translators just yelled at me:21:33
godbyk"I am writing to ask what have you done to the Romanian translation of the manual. The last time I worked on it we had almost 10% of it translated and now I see that most of the translations I made or approved are set to be approved again. There are only 8 days left and now someone has to start over."21:33
godbykdutchie: Can you help me see if I did something stupid or what's up?21:33
ubuntujenkinsdutchie: can you set the bot to do quickshot revsions as well please maybe with qr100 or something21:34
dutchiehmm21:34
ubuntujenkinsplease21:34
ubuntujenkinsI could have a go but i don't know where to find the bot to update21:35
ubuntujenkinsor how to do it21:35
dutchieyou'd need bot access21:35
dutchiewhich I have forgotten how to do21:35
dutchieI'll sort this ro thing out first thoug21:36
dutchieh21:36
ubuntujenkinssure21:36
dutchiegodbyk: do you know which revision this was?21:36
godbykdutchie: He just emailed me an hour ago.21:37
dutchiehmm, probably rev 797 then21:38
manualbothttp://bazaar.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/revision/797 | http://bazaar.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual -r 79721:38
godbykIf you look at the Romanian translation, it lists my name as the last person to edit the translation (on 2010-04-12).21:38
godbykI imagine that's why he's harping at me.21:38
godbyk(Though I don't recall actually editing the Romanian translation, per se.)21:38
dutchieis lp down for anyone else?21:38
godbykdutchie: just worked for me: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+lang/ro21:39
ubuntujenkinsthe bzr link doesn't work21:39
dutchieubuntujenkins: that's what I meant21:39
ubuntujenkinsthe one the bot gave21:39
ubuntujenkinsthe rest works21:39
ubuntujenkins!enter | ubuntujenkins21:39
manualbotubuntujenkins, please see my private message21:39
godbykoh, you're right.. the bzr link there doesn't work21:41
* dutchie wishes lp would go faster21:47
godbykI have to go shopping for groceries and whatnot.  I'll be back in a couple hours, probably.22:06
ubuntujenkinssee ya22:06
godbykdutchie: if you figured out what (if anything) I've done to the (Romanian) translations and how I can fix it, let me know.22:06
c7phello22:10
ubuntujenkinshello c7p, how are you22:10
c7pfine ;) i'm looking forward to the final release of the manual and the translated one22:12
ubuntujenkinsthat will be exciting, what language are you working on22:13
dutchiethese diffs are really quite inflated by po4a and lp fighting over po file format22:13
c7pubuntujenkins: greek22:14
ubuntujenkinshow is it going c7p ?22:15
c7pwell it's around 70% completed22:15
ubuntujenkinsnice :-) and not many screenshots to go.22:15
c7pi will take them tomorrow if i remember to :p22:16
ubuntujenkinshehe  I will aprove them as soon as i see them22:17
c7pok :D22:18
dutchiegodbyk: I can see no reason that the translations have disappeared. Nothing seems to have been deleted from the po file, but there is a huge diff due to LP and po4a disagreeing on how to format po files22:19
dutchieI cannot believe I used to merge these files manually22:19
dutchiegodbyk: afaict, nothing was deleted between 796 and 79722:22
ubuntujenkinsdutchie: what do other projects do for translations? ie non launchpad ones22:23
dutchiehave people use traditional po editors like emacs' po-mode22:23
dutchieI think if we move away from LP, we move away from gettext22:24
ubuntujenkinsbut that means that, muliple people can't work on it at the same time.22:24
ubuntujenkinswhat is gettext I get cnfused22:24
dutchiethat's the main advantage of LP/rosetta22:24
dutchiegettext is the program originally written to translate software applications that we've hijacked to translate the manual22:25
ubuntujenkinsI see.22:25
c7pi think we should keep translation process as simple as possible and of course online22:26
ubuntujenkinscopy and paste the po in etherpad?22:26
dutchieheh22:26
dutchieI'm too tired to make sensible suggestions22:26
ubuntujenkinshehe silly ones are sometimes the best22:27
* dutchie is very close to writing a script to check for deleted translations22:27
dutchieright, it's going on the todo list22:29
ubuntujenkinsdo it, the translators would be pleased with any help in improving it22:29
dutchieI will definitely do it at some point22:29
ubuntujenkins\o/22:30
dutchiebut not now22:30
c7pubuntujenkins, the sentence "You can talk to people nearby by entering you information." is right? or the second 'you' should be 'your' ?22:34
dutchieg2222:34
ubuntujenkinsc7p: it should be your please file a bug22:35
c7phttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/+bug/56809822:39
manualbotLaunchpad bug 568098 in ubuntu-manual "wrong word on string 836 " [Undecided,New]22:39
ubuntujenkinsthanks c7p22:40
c7pno problem , part of my job :)22:40
* ubuntujenkins heads to bed23:13

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