| daskreech | Riddell: Want to be more clear as to the version for Amarok on Lynx? | 00:09 |
|---|---|---|
| Riddell | I'm afraid not, konqueror crashes now when I try to edit it :( | 00:11 |
| daskreech | svn up? | 00:12 |
| daskreech | Riddell: Any points missing from Kubuntu LTS that you would like to see there? | 00:55 |
| === rdieter_ is now known as rdieter | ||
| LaserJock | if I kill virtuoso is it going to do bad things? | 04:14 |
| LaserJock | ScottK: so I installed kubuntu-netbook | 04:20 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: I'm guessing virtuoso is not your friend. | 04:20 |
| LaserJock | ScottK: since I logged in this virtuoso/nepomuk process is taking all my CPU | 04:20 |
| ScottK | Lovely. | 04:21 |
| ScottK | I think if you kill it it won't affect much. | 04:21 |
| ScottK | JontheEchidna is our expert, IIRC. | 04:21 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: How much RAM does your netbook have? | 04:21 |
| ScottK | We should have a patch that keeps it from running on systems with 1GB or less. | 04:22 |
| LaserJock | 1 GB of RAM | 04:22 |
| LaserJock | so I killed it | 04:23 |
| ScottK | JontheEchidna: I thought it wasn't supposed to run on 1GB systems? | 04:23 |
| LaserJock | nepomuk processes are still taking a fair amount, but at least it's no 100% | 04:23 |
| ScottK | You would think by now upstreams would have learned the lesson that searching is not so cool it gets to steal all the CPU. | 04:24 |
| LaserJock | especially on first start-up | 04:24 |
| LaserJock | I was about to start my review with "performance is not so great" | 04:24 |
| ScottK | Yeah. I can imagine. | 04:24 |
| LaserJock | but I've been through this enough to know to check top first ;-) | 04:25 |
| ScottK | IIRC that running on a 1GB system is a bug. | 04:25 |
| LaserJock | when I first got my netbook and put UNE on it I was really disappointed | 04:25 |
| LaserJock | only to realize Gnome-Do was killing it with 100% CPU usage the entire time | 04:26 |
| ScottK | Nice. | 04:26 |
| LaserJock | I almost wonder if some sort of "Hmmm, a process seems to be taking a lot of your CPU" notification | 04:27 |
| LaserJock | would be helpful | 04:27 |
| daskreech | ScottK: I have 600MB and it runs on my computer | 04:27 |
| ScottK | daskreech: I think that's not good. | 04:28 |
| LaserJock | it's sort of like a full hard drive | 04:28 |
| ScottK | Yeah. | 04:28 |
| daskreech | And I have near 700 GB of Data | 04:28 |
| LaserJock | is this only used for strigi? | 04:28 |
| daskreech | So I just started nepomuk and left it running overnight | 04:28 |
| ScottK | I'm not sure what an ordinary user would know what to do about it. | 04:28 |
| daskreech | LaserJock: It's the culmination of strigi | 04:28 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: No, also for nepomuk (semantic desktop stuff) | 04:28 |
| LaserJock | is that related by chance to these "open desktop" widgets? | 04:29 |
| ScottK | No. It's wired more deeply into the system than that. | 04:30 |
| LaserJock | k | 04:30 |
| ScottK | KDE is going full force for sematic desktop (whatver that means). | 04:30 |
| LaserJock | I just wondered because the "open desktop" and "knowledgebase" widgets didn't seem to work for me | 04:31 |
| LaserJock | well, I don't know, they didn't do anything so I wondered | 04:31 |
| ScottK | The knowledgebase one is somewhat flaky to me. | 04:31 |
| ScottK | We didn't customize that at all, just went with upstream defaults. If you decide you care about widgets on the desktop you'll change them anyway. | 04:32 |
| LaserJock | sure, I already did ;-) | 04:32 |
| LaserJock | there are *so* many widgets these days | 04:32 |
| ScottK | The twitter/identi.ca one seems to finally work this cycle. | 04:32 |
| ScottK | There are. | 04:33 |
| LaserJock | the Remember the Milk one works, very slick looking too | 04:33 |
| ScottK | Cool. | 04:33 |
| LaserJock | not sure I'm crazy about scrolling the screen for widgets, but there's not a lot you can do on such a small screen | 04:34 |
| ScottK | I think it's a decent accomodation to the form factor. | 04:35 |
| ScottK | One package I really like is akonadi-kde-resource-googledata. | 04:35 |
| ScottK | With that I get automatic sync between my Google account and local addressbook/calendar data. | 04:36 |
| * rgreening is installing KNR now on Acer One... | 04:36 | |
| ScottK | Since I also have an Android phone, it works out very nicely. | 04:36 |
| LaserJock | well, I have to say the interface is better than what I thought from looking at screenshots | 04:38 |
| ScottK | I guess that's good. | 04:38 |
| LaserJock | autohiding panel is a bit difficult when dealing with apps with menus | 04:39 |
| ScottK | When I demo'ed the tech preview at the last UDS a lot of people said they thought it was similar to UNR. | 04:39 |
| LaserJock | but you get a lot of screen real estate | 04:39 |
| ScottK | Agreed. | 04:39 |
| ScottK | It's not ideal, but I think it's a good trade off. | 04:39 |
| ScottK | Maximizing available screen real estate was a big design focus. | 04:39 |
| LaserJock | UNE has a persistent panel | 04:40 |
| LaserJock | but it's a bit small | 04:40 |
| LaserJock | some similar ideas, different ordering | 04:40 |
| LaserJock | the launcher is pretty nice, I like that it as a search (missing in UNE) | 04:41 |
| ScottK | AFAIK they were done fairly independently . | 04:41 |
| LaserJock | yeah, I imagine | 04:41 |
| LaserJock | it's interesting to see where independent designs converge | 04:41 |
| ScottK | Some early prototypes of the KDE U/I were demonstrated at the joint desktop summit in Gran Canaria. | 04:42 |
| ScottK | I know there were some Canonical Ux people there. | 04:42 |
| ScottK | So it may not have been completely independent. | 04:42 |
| * daskreech shrugs. They seem to be pulling best of breed in and forging | 04:43 | |
| ScottK | Plaigarism is the sincerest form of flattery. | 04:43 |
| daskreech | Fairly certain at some point Ubuntu will be a loose approximation of GNOME | 04:43 |
| ScottK | It will be interesting to see what happens when Gnome shell lands. | 04:44 |
| LaserJock | I don't exactly look forward to that :( | 04:44 |
| ScottK | From what little I understand it, it seems like Canonical is headed in a bit of a different direction. | 04:45 |
| daskreech | LaserJock: Why not? | 04:45 |
| LaserJock | I haven't tried it yet, but I hope they don't force usage before it's stable enough | 04:45 |
| LaserJock | well, because new things generally suck :-) | 04:45 |
| LaserJock | until things get worked out | 04:45 |
| ScottK | daskreech: Think KDE 4.0 and wonder why he might be worried. | 04:46 |
| LaserJock | well, something like that | 04:46 |
| LaserJock | KDE had 4.0 and is very very well organized | 04:46 |
| LaserJock | GNOME is much more haphazard | 04:46 |
| daskreech | ScottK: Gnome SHELL isn't KDE 4.0 | 04:47 |
| daskreech | It's a rough bump into KDE 3.0 | 04:47 |
| ScottK | daskreech: We'll see. It seems to have some similar concepts to what plasma had for 4.0 behind it. | 04:48 |
| daskreech | They aren't rewriting anything they are adding a new option that will phase out the still maintained new one | 04:48 |
| ScottK | Right, so not so hard a transition. | 04:48 |
| LaserJock | well | 04:49 |
| daskreech | Gnome 3.0 is for most intents and purposes a pushpin in the timeline that arbitrarily says Look this is a new version | 04:49 |
| daskreech | If they didn't do Gnome Shell there would be no other real visible changes to Gnome | 04:49 |
| ScottK | Sure. | 04:49 |
| LaserJock | I'm worried that it will be harder a transition than people are letting on and it will not be independent (so it'll ripple through the desktop) | 04:49 |
| daskreech | LaserJock: I'm not sure what you think will happen but it won't destroy anything | 04:50 |
| ScottK | I don't understand Canonical's strategy for it. At least from what I've seen (not that I look really hard) they are pressing on with their own vision and not worrying about it. | 04:50 |
| LaserJock | I think it'll very likely suck developer time/energy away from other things that are maybe more needed | 04:51 |
| ScottK | So I think concern that where Ubuntu is going will end up cross threaded with where upstream Gnome is going is not unreasonable. | 04:51 |
| LaserJock | and then it won't really add much of anything | 04:51 |
| daskreech | ScottK: Canonical will soon be it's own software stack I'm sure | 04:51 |
| ScottK | daskreech: Maybe that's the plan. | 04:51 |
| daskreech | They have already started saying things like if you would like the Ubuntu users to enjoy your application now would be the time to make patches | 04:52 |
| daskreech | ScottK: they aren't quite that dumb but they are that stubborn | 04:52 |
| daskreech | There is huge value to networking and community effects. | 04:53 |
| daskreech | It's how they pulled from Debian and made an Ubuntu experience | 04:54 |
| daskreech | No possible way that the plan is to sever that with the rest of the Linux world. But if they divine that this is a valuable path they are going to chase it and promote others follow by including the changes they make | 04:55 |
| ScottK | I'm curious how this no systray thing will go. | 04:55 |
| daskreech | I'm sure they are too | 04:55 |
| ScottK | My favorite being the one that was sure it wouldn't be a problem to expect Skype to accomodate it. | 04:55 |
| daskreech | I'm just glad that it can be done. I can't fathom trying to do this kind of thing in Microsoft and getting it to ship in WIndows | 04:56 |
| ScottK | Agreed. | 04:56 |
| LaserJock | I find it also interesting to see how "we are our own upstream" works out | 04:57 |
| ScottK | Yeah. | 04:58 |
| daskreech | I like the merging of Gnome Apple an Windows 7 in having persistency of applications and actions even if they are not running | 04:58 |
| daskreech | Some good stuff happening | 04:58 |
| ScottK | So far I think they have a mix of good ideas and bad ones. | 04:58 |
| LaserJock | as long as things can "shake out" and don't get stuck in "we have to keep this just because" | 04:59 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: I haven't seen a lot of openness to revisit previous decisions so far. | 04:59 |
| LaserJock | not particularly no | 04:59 |
| LaserJock | not on the design level | 05:00 |
| ScottK | I am still completely boggled at the notion that if I click on a notification it's bad if something useful happens. | 05:00 |
| daskreech | LaserJock: So far I can't think of an Idea they have vocally dropped but then I don't know if that's because they have a stubborn we must stick to it agenda or what they have done so far has been good | 05:00 |
| daskreech | I know that people in general who are getting the end release distro seem to be pretty accepting of whatever comes | 05:00 |
| LaserJock | ScottK: I get it in practice. it means I don't have to freak out if I miss a notification | 05:00 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: That's exactly how they have it wrong. | 05:01 |
| ScottK | They solved the wrong problem. | 05:01 |
| LaserJock | well, they solved part of the problem, IMO | 05:01 |
| ScottK | The problem isn't having actions, the problem is having actions be the only way to do something. | 05:01 |
| daskreech | LaserJock: I've had two different experiences with that. Either I find notifications very very distracting or I stop looking at them altogether which after an hour makes me wonder why they are there | 05:01 |
| LaserJock | I don't have a problem not click on notifications | 05:02 |
| LaserJock | it does seem a bit too difficult to deal with actions though | 05:02 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: An example: with my Quassel IRC, I get a notification when I get highlighted. If I click on it, I get taken to that channel. If I miss it and still want to respond, I click on the systray icon and I still go to the channel. | 05:02 |
| LaserJock | right | 05:03 |
| ScottK | I think the design goal of the user not being rushed is very good. | 05:03 |
| LaserJock | I go straight to the window either way | 05:03 |
| ScottK | I think that they drew a poor implementation to reach that goal and then insisted it was the goal. | 05:04 |
| LaserJock | there is still a sense of having different modes (go straight to window or go to messaging menu) | 05:04 |
| LaserJock | hmm | 05:04 |
| daskreech | LaserJock: Aslo Empathy is broken | 05:04 |
| LaserJock | I actually like that notifications aren't actions | 05:04 |
| ScottK | I have the KDE version of the messaging menu (it's still an indicator) and I also like it. | 05:04 |
| LaserJock | but I didn't find notifications that were actionable very annoying in the first place | 05:05 |
| ScottK | I think it's great when I've been away from my computer and come back to a bunch of highligets. | 05:05 |
| ScottK | So I want a complete list. | 05:05 |
| LaserJock | I have more problems with having the notification menu disconnected from the app | 05:05 |
| ScottK | For reacting real time when I'm at the computer though I think it's far inferior to just clicking on the notification or the icon. | 05:06 |
| LaserJock | so if I go straight to the apps window, it doesn't clear the notifications necessarily | 05:06 |
| LaserJock | I just go to the app though | 05:06 |
| ScottK | The KDE one does that sometimes, but it usually works out. | 05:06 |
| LaserJock | it's a click either way | 05:06 |
| LaserJock | either click on the notification or click on the app | 05:07 |
| ScottK | Yes, although going via the menu can take you to the right spot in the app. | 05:07 |
| LaserJock | right, but that's why you can minimize to systray anymore | 05:07 |
| LaserJock | you always have the apps there (for better or worse) | 05:07 |
| ScottK | I really like the fact that in Quassel the icon/notification takes me to the right channel. | 05:07 |
| verbalshadow | i like the message indicator, mostly because it gets rid so about 4 different icons in the systray | 05:07 |
| ScottK | It didn't get rid of any yet for me. | 05:08 |
| ScottK | I get enough out of the Quasel and Kmail icons that I prefer to have them around still. | 05:08 |
| LaserJock | so far for me it's a net loss in total | 05:08 |
| verbalshadow | just need a plugin in for choqok | 05:08 |
| ScottK | I don't IM, so that doesn't enter into it. | 05:08 |
| LaserJock | I have 3 icons (gwibber, evolution, and empathy) rolled into one, but I have 2 new ones for the session that are wide | 05:09 |
| LaserJock | what bugs me the most is that there are no preferences, no options | 05:09 |
| ScottK | The fact that I can control which icons I see and don't see on an icon by icon basis now in KDE made the most difference for me on the systray | 05:10 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: I told you before you want to be a KDE user. | 05:10 |
| ScottK | Then you can have preferences. | 05:10 |
| verbalshadow | :) | 05:11 |
| maco | i have the message indicator plasmoid but its useless to me as it just shows all 100-or-so of my kmail folders *all the time* | 05:11 |
| maco | LaserJock: come on jordan, come to the darkside. kubotu will give you cookies ;-) | 05:11 |
| LaserJock | ScottK: I want preferences, not every possible combination and permutation of possible configurations ;-) | 05:11 |
| ScottK | LaserJock: KDE has started to realize that an infinitude of preferences is not idea. | 05:12 |
| maco | yeah kde4 is actually usable, unlike kde3 | 05:12 |
| * maco runs | 05:12 | |
| ScottK | But just on the topic of system tray, I could easily run without one if I wanted to and I can decide on an icon by icon basis if they should be shown, hidden, or left to the app to decide. | 05:13 |
| LaserJock | you know, I just started to like KDE when KDE3 was killed off | 05:13 |
| ScottK | So it's very easy to get exactly what I want. | 05:13 |
| ScottK | The stuff that was annoying me about taking up too much space is now pretty well resolved. | 05:14 |
| ScottK | BTW, I totally agree about Chromium. I'm liking it a lot. | 05:15 |
| ScottK | I'm a little worried about using a browser that's in Universe. I need to look into how it's going to be kept up. | 05:15 |
| LaserJock | perhaps | 05:15 |
| LaserJock | it's long been more stable than Firefox ever was for me | 05:16 |
| ScottK | It's not stability I'm worried about, it's security. | 05:16 |
| LaserJock | I'm really surprised that a browser this good could be this good so fast | 05:16 |
| ScottK | AFAIK there are no really secure web browsers. | 05:16 |
| LaserJock | it's almost an oxymoron | 05:16 |
| maco | i have choqok, quassel, and skype set to "auto" yet all three stay in the tray full time when running :-/ | 05:17 |
| ScottK | At the last UDS, shtylman was asking everyone "Have you tried Chromium". | 05:17 |
| ScottK | maco: The app needs to be designed to do something with the auto setting. | 05:18 |
| maco | i see | 05:18 |
| ScottK | Witness the device notifier will hide itself if it didn't detect stuff now. | 05:18 |
| maco | right | 05:18 |
| ScottK | It used to be both not in the tray and always present. | 05:18 |
| ScottK | Took up a huge amount of space. | 05:18 |
| ScottK | It would be nice of Akregator would autohide when there were no unread posts. | 05:19 |
| LaserJock | is the ordering of elements in the panel come from upstream? | 05:23 |
| LaserJock | s/is/does/ | 05:23 |
| ScottK | Except we added the lock/logout widgets | 05:24 |
| ScottK | Panel configurability is not on par at all with plasma desktop yet. | 05:24 |
| LaserJock | it's a bit weird having the window control all the way on the right | 05:27 |
| ScottK | Agreed. | 05:27 |
| LaserJock | I'm used to having it next to the launcher area (center of panel) | 05:27 |
| LaserJock | on the other hand, the X is in the top right corner where you'd expect :-) | 05:28 |
| ScottK | They put it on the left initially, but concluded it should go on the right so the X to close windows would be where people expect it. | 05:28 |
| ScottK | Yes, exaclyt. | 05:28 |
| ScottK | Rather ironic given Ubuntu's configuration now. | 05:28 |
| * maco giggles | 05:28 | |
| LaserJock | in UNE it seems more like a tab | 05:28 |
| LaserJock | so the X is on the right side of the tab | 05:29 |
| maco | like in firefox? | 05:29 |
| LaserJock | yeah | 05:29 |
| LaserJock | so it doesn't feel like a window decoration context, IMO | 05:29 |
| LaserJock | it feels more like closing tabs | 05:29 |
| maco | firefox switched from a single close button to one-per-tab after eye tracking testing showed that people would look at that button, pause, then dismiss it and keep looking for a way to close the tab | 05:30 |
| LaserJock | yeah | 05:31 |
| LaserJock | so I like in UNE I have, from left to right, 1) the place I start apps 2) the place where apps live 3) the title of current app 4)X to close that app | 05:32 |
| LaserJock | for Kubuntu netbook 1 is on the opposite side of the window as 3 & 4 and 2 is hidden in 3 | 05:33 |
| daskreech | LaserJock: Chrome was built by Google buying nearly all the Mozilla dev heads. So the stuff they had planned for Firefox they just did it 2-3 years earlier since they didn't have to work around Cruft | 05:33 |
| LaserJock | daskreech: ah, that make sense | 05:34 |
| daskreech | ScottK: +1 on akregator | 05:34 |
| ScottK | daskreech: It might be worth filing a wish on b.k.o if there isn't one. | 05:35 |
| LaserJock | how has the bug forwarding thing worked out? | 05:36 |
| ScottK | JontheEchidna is probably the one with the best view on that. | 05:36 |
| ScottK | I know that for me filing tracebacks upstream has resulted in a lot more of my crashes getting fixed than filing them on Launchpad ever did. | 05:37 |
| daskreech | ScottK: Shall I? | 05:38 |
| ScottK | daskreech: Yes. Please. | 05:38 |
| daskreech | ScottK: Ok I'll drop it on my To-do | 05:38 |
| ScottK | Thanks. | 05:41 |
| jussi | ScottK: hei! Any idea when those backports will be done? | 10:05 |
| === yofel_ is now known as yofel | ||
| Quintasan | hello | 10:32 |
| larsivi | you gents know if a nepomukfilewatch memory leak has been reported? | 11:25 |
| === Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan | ||
| JontheEchidna | ScottK: Strigi will not start on 1 GB if machines, but only if it's the first start of nepomuk ever. (So on the live cd, and then on the first login) | 13:24 |
| JontheEchidna | I couldn't think of a way to make it happen for existing installs without destroying user config | 13:25 |
| JontheEchidna | or destroying freedom to choose whether or not they wanted strigi on their 1GB or less machines | 13:26 |
| JontheEchidna | (People did complain when a bug accidentally caused the patch to always disable strigi on 1GB systems, period) | 13:30 |
| Quintasan | JontheEchidna: http://kde-look.org/content/show.php/Kubuntu+Lucid?content=123354 | 13:58 |
| Quintasan | why we are not using it >_< | 13:58 |
| Quintasan | :P | 13:58 |
| JontheEchidna | Quintasan: there is the part about us being in every freeze ever when it was released ;P | 14:07 |
| Quintasan | who cares | 14:07 |
| Quintasan | :P | 14:07 |
| Quintasan | it looks awesome | 14:07 |
| Quintasan | goes with our plymouth theme | 14:07 |
| Quintasan | well, I think it's time to start reading some Qt development books | 14:08 |
| Quintasan | I still don't get why we want KPackageKit, I think Shaman2 could be ready | 14:11 |
| Quintasan | for Maveric ofc | 14:11 |
| JontheEchidna | KPackageKit is, at the least, certain to work. (Even if a bit suboptimally) | 14:12 |
| JontheEchidna | Shaman2 on the other hand doesn't have a backend that can install stuff on a debian system aside from Packagekit | 14:12 |
| JontheEchidna | Going to shaman2 is making the same mistake that going to KPackagekit was | 14:12 |
| Quintasan | well, it has, but I will need to poke the guy to get to work or even try helping him (lol no knowledge of C++) | 14:13 |
| JontheEchidna | e.g. the jump to the new, shiny tech that promises to be the Ultimate Solution (tm) | 14:13 |
| JontheEchidna | Quintasan: I'm working on a shaman backend, as it happens :) | 14:13 |
| JontheEchidna | http://websvn.kde.org/trunk/playground/sysadmin/shaman/libshaman/backends/qapt/ <- requires playground/libs/libqapt otherwise you'll get the other/old apt backend | 14:14 |
| JontheEchidna | Currently it's read-only, with the exception that you can check for updates | 14:15 |
| Quintasan | awesome | 14:15 |
| Quintasan | I thought we'd like packagekit backend better | 14:15 |
| Quintasan | I have submitted a patch some time ago | 14:15 |
| JontheEchidna | well, PackageKit is most of the reason KPackageKit sucks :P | 14:15 |
| Quintasan | agreed | 14:16 |
| JontheEchidna | we'd just be trading one face of fail for another | 14:16 |
| Quintasan | anyways I can help? | 14:16 |
| JontheEchidna | Quintasan: Know anything about the libapt-pkg library? | 14:17 |
| JontheEchidna | As it stands, if I can get support for installing/removing packages in libqapt, it'd be a fairly complete library | 14:17 |
| Quintasan | JontheEchidna: not really but if it is not really complicated I think I could try to play around with it | 14:18 |
| * JontheEchidna giggles a little | 14:18 | |
| JontheEchidna | the api is horrible | 14:18 |
| Quintasan | JontheEchidna: let me get it stright, libqapt uses libapt-pkg libs? | 14:22 |
| Quintasan | and libqapt is used by shaman? | 14:22 |
| JontheEchidna | Quintasan: libqapt is a Qt wrapper over the ugly libapt-pkg api | 14:22 |
| JontheEchidna | which is then used to implement the shaman backend | 14:22 |
| Quintasan | oh | 14:22 |
| Quintasan | JontheEchidna: are there any docs for libapt-pkg? | 14:22 |
| JontheEchidna | mwahaha | 14:23 |
| JontheEchidna | if you're lucky, some of the libapt-pkg headers may have a bit of docs in the class headers | 14:23 |
| Quintasan | oh crap | 14:23 |
| Quintasan | @_@ | 14:23 |
| JontheEchidna | That's the beauty of libqapt. It does all the ugly stuffs, giving you a nice, sane, documented api | 14:24 |
| JontheEchidna | and it's not limited to shaman. You could conceivably make a standalone package manager with it | 14:24 |
| Quintasan | libapt-pkg-doc | 14:24 |
| Quintasan | ? | 14:24 |
| JontheEchidna | ^Eh, mostly design stuff | 14:25 |
| === jjesse__ is now known as jjesse | ||
| JontheEchidna | "How we can make this library suck the most" | 14:25 |
| JontheEchidna | I've been looking at other things that use libapt-pkg such as synaptic, apt-get and the aptcc packagekit backend for examples | 14:26 |
| Quintasan | and it sucks? | 14:26 |
| JontheEchidna | libapt-pkg? No doubt. The libarary was grown, not designed | 14:26 |
| JontheEchidna | oh, libept is another libapt-pkg wrapper, but not object-oriented enough for my tastes | 14:27 |
| JontheEchidna | good example though | 14:27 |
| Quintasan | @_@ | 14:31 |
| Quintasan | really | 14:31 |
| Quintasan | wtf | 14:31 |
| Quintasan | d(new BackendPrivate) | 14:32 |
| JontheEchidna | that's common practice | 14:32 |
| JontheEchidna | that way you can add/remove new private members later without breaking binary compat | 14:32 |
| JontheEchidna | http://techbase.kde.org/Policies/Binary_Compatibility_Issues_With_C++ | 14:33 |
| persia | JontheEchidna: libcupt-perl is yet another interface, if you're looking at options. No idea whether it matches your design preferences. | 14:34 |
| Quintasan | JontheEchidna: okay, I rage quit, I'm too green for this | 14:35 |
| * Quintasan wonders how to actually start | 14:35 | |
| JontheEchidna | Quintasan: Thanks for the interest anyhow. :) | 14:35 |
| Quintasan | JontheEchidna: your code just made me go "lol wtf is this, I don't get it >_<" | 14:37 |
| Quintasan | 5 WTF's per second | 14:37 |
| Quintasan | really | 14:37 |
| Quintasan | :O\ | 14:37 |
| neversfelde | I get an akonadi self test everytime I start kontact, someone else experienced the same problem? | 15:19 |
| _scottl | neversfelde: yeah it was solved in 10.04 for me | 15:22 |
| neversfelde | _scottl: this is 10.04 | 15:22 |
| ScottK | apachelogger is the akonadi fixing guru. I don't have this problem. | 15:41 |
| apachelogger | entirely depends on what neversfelde's selftest says | 15:51 |
| apachelogger | also I suspect a one minute timeout for the eventloop to return is still not enough | 15:51 |
| apachelogger | especially when akonadi/mysql did not shut down properly and does recovering magic | 15:51 |
| ScottK | If there's something one can do, it seems like decent release note material. | 15:54 |
| apachelogger | note: mysql is the crap, so akonadi sometimes comes up with weird issues | 15:56 |
| * apachelogger was talking about krake with this and he also agreed that like 99% of the akonadi issues one might encounter are mysql related | 15:57 | |
| apachelogger | s/about krake with this/about this with krake ;) | 15:58 |
| debfx | could we add to the release notes that one needs to install kmozillahelper to get the kde integration for firefox (except when using the firefox installer)? | 16:04 |
| ScottK | debfx: Yes. That's a perfect release note item. | 16:17 |
| neversfelde | apachelogger: I messed up my system, have to fix it first and after that I will have a look at the selftest again | 16:18 |
| ScottK | debfx: claydoh is, IIRC, the person to talk to. | 16:19 |
| shtylman | ScottK: are you a chromium converter now? :) | 16:38 |
| === michaelk is now known as Guest67848 | ||
| ramanK_ | Hi there | 16:58 |
| ramanK_ | I have a problem with the brightness of the screen | 16:59 |
| neversfelde | apachelogger: http://pastebin.kubuntu-de.org/149 The problem is gone after deleting my Akonadi config, so it is probably my fault | 16:59 |
| ramanK_ | If The power profile be the performance mode , and I decrease the brighness , then every minute it increase my display brightness to the maximom | 17:01 |
| ramanK_ | what should I do? | 17:01 |
| ramanK_ | It's vey vey annoying !!! | 17:04 |
| ramanK_ | very very* | 17:04 |
| debfx | ramanK_: this doesn't happen with other profiles? | 17:05 |
| ramanK_ | debfx: no | 17:05 |
| debfx | ramanK_: does it only happend when the system is idle? | 17:06 |
| ramanK_ | debfx: no , it's happening all the time | 17:07 |
| ramanK_ | :( | 17:11 |
| ScottK | shtylman: I'm not fully converted, but I can see the appeal. | 17:18 |
| shtylman | :) | 17:18 |
| shtylman | give it time | 17:18 |
| ScottK | shtylman: Is there a way I can make it so that if I click on a link to a .deb, it just opens in ark instead of downloading the file? | 17:18 |
| shtylman | hmm... not sure... there might be a way, I don't know off the top of my head cause I always have things download to a downloads folder | 17:19 |
| shtylman | that way if I need it again I have it | 17:20 |
| shtylman | I see something called auto open settings | 17:20 |
| shtylman | but it seems grayed out for me | 17:20 |
| shtylman | so might be a feature to come | 17:20 |
| ScottK | It's pretty common for me to need to inspect files like that so I want them to open in ark and not be left laying around afterwards. | 17:20 |
| ScottK | In Konqueror it's just right click, open with .... | 17:20 |
| shtylman | how do you do it now in chrome... just download and then click the downloaded item? | 17:22 |
| shtylman | cause iirc the giant button for the download has an open with option | 17:22 |
| ScottK | I'll check that out. | 17:23 |
| ScottK | Maybe I just missed it. | 17:23 |
| ScottK | I'm seeing a problem here on multiple systems where logoff of a non-admin user fails with some kind of glib error. | 17:31 |
| ScottK | Did anyone else see it? | 17:31 |
| lex79 | need testers for this bug 551290 | 18:35 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 551290 in kubuntu-default-settings "plymouth theme ugly on binary nvidia driver" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/551290 | 18:35 |
| shadeslayer | lemme see | 18:45 |
| shadeslayer | lex79: nope.. but im using the -21 and -20 kernels,so not entirely sure if its reproducable | 18:46 |
| lex79 | uhmm, not sure | 18:47 |
| shadeslayer | lex79: well his kernel boot command shows hes using the -18 kernel,so i cant say if its the kubuntu-default-settings or the kernel | 18:47 |
| shadeslayer | other than that,its not reproducable | 18:48 |
| lex79 | I don't know, it works here and works for another user too | 18:48 |
| shadeslayer | lex79: i had this initially but it was fixed later on... | 18:49 |
| lex79 | slacker_nl: what? the ugly theme with proprietary driver is only fixed in plymouth theme ubuntu, not in kubuntu | 18:50 |
| lex79 | ops sorry, I mean shadeslayer :) | 18:50 |
| lex79 | you should still have that bug, not anymore with my package | 18:51 |
| shadeslayer | lex79: uh whut! i dont have it \o/ | 18:51 |
| shadeslayer | magic.... | 18:51 |
| lex79 | :) | 18:52 |
| shadeslayer | 1:10.04ubuntu23 << version of kubuntu default settings | 18:52 |
| lex79 | shadeslayer: which driver you use? | 18:55 |
| shadeslayer | lex79: well i was using the nvidia driver till i added the xorg edgers ppa and switched to nouveau | 18:56 |
| apachelogger | neversfelde: looks like your database was busted beyond scope anyway | 18:56 |
| apachelogger | 100425 17:22:50 [Warning] Can't open and lock time zone table: Table 'mysql.time_zone_leap_second' doesn't exist trying to live without them | 18:56 |
| apachelogger | 100425 17:22:50 [ERROR] Can't open and lock privilege tables: Table 'mysql.servers' doesn't exi | 18:56 |
| lex79 | shadeslayer: that bug is only with proprietary driver | 18:56 |
| apachelogger | that should not happen with our update and init and whatnot scripts | 18:56 |
| lex79 | shadeslayer: you can't test my fix if you don't use proprietary | 18:56 |
| shadeslayer | lex79: but the fact remains,that i didnt have that ugly screenshot with the proprietary drivers | 18:57 |
| apachelogger | so I must assume it happens because the database is so badly broken that even the system tables are b0rked | 18:57 |
| lex79 | shadeslayer: strange | 18:57 |
| shadeslayer | lex79: yeah,the resolution was 1280x800 something on my 1440x900 LCD | 18:57 |
| neversfelde | apachelogger: I got this problem on two different machines, probably the google akonadi client is the problem, I will have a look at this | 18:57 |
| shadeslayer | but it wasnt that bad... | 18:58 |
| ScottK | No one else has seen problems with non-admin users logging off? I can replicate it on several machines with KDM/KDE, but not with KDM/Gnome. | 19:14 |
| lex79 | no here | 19:19 |
| neversfelde | lex79: I can confirm that this nvidia/plymouth problem is fixed with your packages | 19:20 |
| lex79 | neversfelde: do you like the theme? it's not awesome but at least is watchable :) | 19:21 |
| lex79 | neversfelde: can you write your feedback in LP? thanks | 19:21 |
| neversfelde | lex79: it is better than before :) | 19:22 |
| neversfelde | lex79: sure | 19:22 |
| lex79 | :D | 19:22 |
| ScottK | lex79: What video do you have? | 19:24 |
| lex79 | video card? nvidia gtx 260 | 19:24 |
| ScottK | All my failing machines are Intel. Not sure if it's related | 19:24 |
| lex79 | I don't know... :( I have no problems here with KDM/KDE | 19:25 |
| ScottK | Anyone else with Intel? | 19:26 |
| lex79 | maybe apachelogger... | 19:26 |
| persia | ScottK: Can you replicate on a system that *doesn't* have GNOME installed, or just one with GNOME? | 19:30 |
| ScottK | persia: Both | 19:31 |
| ScottK | i.e. happens whether Gnome is installed or not | 19:31 |
| persia | Hrm. I'll see if I can replicate in a VM. | 19:32 |
| ScottK | It does not, however, happen when I log out of Gnome with KDM and a non-admin user | 19:32 |
| neversfelde | lex79: I have Intel hardware | 19:36 |
| lex79 | neversfelde: see the ScottK's problem with login/out with non admin user ^^ | 19:38 |
| neversfelde | ScottK: I'll try to reproduce the problem | 19:38 |
| neversfelde | :) | 19:38 |
| ScottK | neversfelde: Thanks | 19:38 |
| * ScottK is updating a third machine to see how pervasive it is here. | 19:39 | |
| persia | Wow. I hadn't tried a Kubuntu install in a VM before. It uses *lots* of RAM. | 19:52 |
| ScottK | It'll likely settle down once nepomuk's appetite is satisfied. | 19:53 |
| persia | This is just running the installer on the liveCD, when I thought that was disabled. | 19:54 |
| * persia usually does installs at 512MB, but has given this a bit more | 19:55 | |
| ScottK | Yes, it is disabled on the live CD | 19:57 |
| persia | Looking into it a bit, I suspect the issue is really the 3D stuff: I end up doing it in software in a VM, which then requires memory for render space. | 19:58 |
| persia | (and then apparently hurts performance because of neeting to send the results over the network) | 19:58 |
| persia | (in summary: don't run Kubuntu Desktop in a VM with VNC and expect the experience one gets with a real install) | 19:59 |
| neversfelde | ScottK: KDM crashes after logging out my testuser, but that seems to happen randomly and also with admin users | 20:00 |
| ScottK | neversfelde: OK, so sounds like you get to file a different bug. | 20:01 |
| ScottK | Yep. Happens on netbook too. | 20:07 |
| maco | im being asked on identi.ca to recommend a scanning app for kde. any suggestions? skanlite is all i see in an apt-cache search, and that doesnt seem to do multipage scanning or pdf output, so...? | 20:19 |
| maco | (i use simple-scan or xsane) | 20:19 |
| ScottK | skanlite is the most KDEish one. | 20:21 |
| ScottK | IIRC some KOffice app could do that too. | 20:21 |
| ScottK | maco: gwenview has an import from scanner function. | 20:22 |
| maco | ok | 20:24 |
| neversfelde | ScottK: I get the same error message every second time I logout | 20:28 |
| ScottK | neversfelde: I filed my bug as Bug #569879 | 20:29 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 569879 in kdebase-workspace "Non-admin user logout fails on Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/569879 | 20:29 |
| neversfelde | yes, already seen this | 20:29 |
| neversfelde | I will file a second bug tomorrow, but that might be related | 20:30 |
| ScottK | Riddell: Looks like we have some logout issues that may need to be understood better and release noted if not fixed. | 20:38 |
| persia | ScottK: I'm going to stop trying to replicate. I (finally) managed to get the install complete and the non-admin user created, and X crashes. I'm fairly sure I'd need to test in a more suitable environment (but need to fix my HD on that machine). | 20:40 |
| ScottK | persia: OK. Thanks for trying. | 20:41 |
| ScottK | Don't forget to file the bug about the X crash. | 20:41 |
| ScottK | Changing to nomodeset in the boot options fixes it. | 20:41 |
| * ScottK tries on another machine. | 20:42 | |
| persia | Oops. I already deleted the machine. | 20:46 |
| * persia was deleting at the time of stopping replication, since that was easier than shutting down or anything. Silly virtualisation making things too easy. | 20:46 | |
| neversfelde | ScottK: Bug #569897 | 20:47 |
| ubottu | Launchpad bug 569897 in kdebase-workspace "user logout fails every second time on Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/569897 | 20:47 |
| ScottK | neversfelde: OK. It appears that my problem doesn't happen every time either. | 20:48 |
| ScottK | So I'm going to test some more before declaring I have a workaround | 20:48 |
| neversfelde | good luck and gn8 :) | 20:49 |
| ScottK | OK, so failed on the second try. | 20:49 |
| ScottK | Mine by be every other try too. | 20:49 |
| DarkwingDuck | jjesse: ping | 22:38 |
| apachelogger | fooey | 23:20 |
| * apachelogger forgot about a deadline and just managed to dump a heuristic evaluation because dearest svn discouraged him from commiting that stuff right away :( | 23:21 | |
| apachelogger | life-- | 23:21 |
| apachelogger | ah | 23:22 |
| apachelogger | good thing I have all that stuff in a repo itself ^^ | 23:22 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!