[00:09] morning everyone [00:14] godbyk: how easy would it be to work out what is missing from the packages? I expect the answer is very hard [00:14] ubuntujenkins: it's not so much what's missing.. we just need more recent versions, I think. [00:16] ok then if the text live source finishes downloading soon I might try and build a set of packages. the only other problem is ppas are limited to 2.0gb at least the ones on my user [00:17] all its downloaded is 250mb the svn server must be slow [00:22] I am off night all [00:25] good night ubuntujenkins [01:16] godbyk, !! [01:16] Hey, daker_ [01:16] what i need you to do [01:17] is to point test.ubuntu-manual.org to lp:ubuntu-manual-website/test [01:17] and [01:17] is to point ubuntu-manual.org to lp:ubuntu-manual-website/main [01:18] now wait til i pushed the test folder [01:20] daker_: okay, just tell me when to make the switch. [01:31] Welcome back, daker. [01:31] back [01:33] should i delete this branch https://code.launchpad.net/~adnane002/ubuntu-manual-website/website ? [01:34] daker: Why don't you leave it there for a while -- just in case. [01:34] oki [01:34] We can delete it later, after everything else is up and running. [01:35] so first point the test.ubuntu-manual.org to lp:ubuntu-manual/test [01:39] okay. let me run the update script to make sure everything's up to date. [01:40] do you mean lp:ubuntu-manual/test or lp:ubuntu-manual-website/test? [01:41] lp:ubuntu-manual-website/test [01:41] :D [01:41] daker: okay, done. [01:41] what's next? [01:41] okey one sec [01:41] k [01:45] point the ubuntu-manual.org to lp:ubuntu-manual-website/main [01:45] wait til lp get updated [01:45] daker: done [01:47] great [01:52] godbyk, question [01:52] "with Ground Control were were able to slice the barrier to entry to our project without sacrificing the benefits of a revision control system" [01:52] the "were were" is correct ? [01:52] daker: it should be 'we were' [01:53] that's what i thought [01:53] now everything in place [01:54] cool. so what's new? [01:55] new icons at right [01:55] new page => http://ubuntu-manual.org/quickshot/help [01:56] a lot of bug fixes [01:56] cool [01:57] let me know if you have any problems with the database stuff [01:57] oki [01:57] if you could pls create the structure for the files.ubuntu....org asap [01:58] oh, sure. just a moment. [02:11] okay, daker. I have the directory structure set up. I think it's how I want it. [02:11] ???!!! [02:12] so under the files.ubuntu-manual.org domain, there's the following structure for the manuals. let me know if it makes sense or if you think I should change something: [02:12] manuals/ [02:12] `-- getting-started-with-ubuntu [02:12] |-- 10.04 [02:12] | `-- en_US [02:12] | |-- print [02:12] | `-- screen [02:12] |-- 10.04-2e [02:12] `-- 10.10 [02:12] great [02:13] print and screen are folders ? [02:14] daker: yeah, though they'll really only contain one pdf file each. [02:15] the pdf should probably be named 'Getting Started with Ubuntu 10.04.pdf' (translated per language). [02:15] oki [02:28] daker: on the quickshot page, the tagline 'Taking screenshots has never been easier' is so light that it's unreadable. can we make it darker? [02:30] brb [02:30] that's what humphreybc says to me [02:31] brb [02:35] godbyk, another thing before i go to sleep, i need you to updated the website pot file [02:36] because i saw that people still translate string in the ubuntu-manual page [02:36] I don't know how to update the website's pot [02:37] but I can email dutchie and have him do it when he wakes up [02:41] very easy [02:42] just get the pot file from lp:ubuntu-manual-website/main/includes/languages/ubu_man_website_translations.pot [02:43] and replace it in [02:43] lp:ubunt-manual/website/daker-test/includes/languages/ubu_man_website_translations.pot [02:44] daker: ah, I see what you mean. [02:45] the translators aren't translating the ubuntu-manual-website stuff, only the ubuntu-manual stuff, so you want me to copy over the pot file to the ubuntu-manual repository. [02:45] I can do that. [02:45] yes [02:48] bzr is being slow again. [02:48] daker: did you see the new video that humphreybc uploaded yesterday? [02:48] yes [02:52] daker: I've updated the pot file. [02:52] translators should see it soon (launchpad has to process it first). [02:54] great [02:57] i am not present [02:57] i don't see my self on the video :s [02:59] oki time to sleep :) [02:59] good night all [07:57] * ubuntujenkins is still downloading the textlive source 1.9gb done but the svn server is slow [07:59] ubuntujenkins, now got a good grip on glade :) [08:00] ubuntujenkins, if you still have my branch, please can you pull and check if its ok [08:03] hemanth: works for me [08:04] ubuntujenkins,thanks, now i can dive into quickshot :O) [08:04] possiblly put some padding on the label to move the text from the edge. just a thought [08:04] okies will do that [08:06] Red_HamsterX: ping [08:07] ubuntujenkins, can the entry text have an action lister to enter key, or the search button respond to enter key and on click as well? [08:07] yep [08:07] just finding it [08:09] on signals tab for the button. under clicked it says enter add on_find_clicked [08:14] on_find_enter? [08:14] no use the same thing on_find_clicked [08:15] it says Could not lookup object enter on signal clicked [08:16] http://imagebin.org/94625 is how you want it [08:17] ubuntujenkins, yup the same i have done [08:22] hey thorwil, I see Iain still hasn't emailed that SVG through :S [08:22] it's like the design team have no concept of deadlines [08:25] hi humphreybc1. from the outside, their way of working seems to be horrendously chaotic. one always hears how they are so terribly busy, but one might wonder about the efficiency, looking at the output :/ [08:25] heh [08:25] yeah [08:25] (they should just hire me to sort their shit out) [08:25] ;) [08:25] hemanth: I am not sure why it doesn't work, it works for me [08:25] humphreybc1: sure, you're job would be to set realistic goals ;) [08:26] * ubuntujenkins wow the wepad does open office [08:26] thorwil: :) [08:26] ubuntujenkins, o ok will re-check it, i added padding to the button [08:26] * hemanth +1 to wepad :) [08:43] I haven't had any more bugs reported on this final draft, so I'm left with the conclusion that it's perfect and ready for print. [08:44] apart from the cover [08:44] humphreybc1: When did you want it on lulu? If we don't get the logo asap, we may have to go in without it for this first edition. [08:44] the design team will just be getting into work now, i'll see what I can do [08:44] okay. [08:45] Iain just came online now [08:45] I think lulu processes the submissions pretty quickly, but it's still good to get it in early so we can make sure everything's good. (and get the links in to daker et al.) [08:45] humphreybc1: pounce! [08:46] one step ahead of ya [08:47] thorwil: do you think we should have a bastard title page? [08:48] apparently we are waiting for Mark to sign it off [08:51] should be in the next couple of hours, hopefully [08:53] Also the UK Translation is now finished. [08:53] yay!!! [08:53] yey!!! [08:53] * humphreybc1 checks the translations [08:54] there are still 67 untranslated strings? [08:54] * ubuntujenkins the texlive svn server is o slow [08:54] really [08:54] according to https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual [08:54] I just finished them [08:55] they are for the website [08:55] oh nice! [08:55] so it looks like we'll have UK english, US english, German, Greek and Galician versions available either on release or very shortly after [08:55] hmmm [08:55] i was doing https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual [08:56] hmm [08:56] godbyk [08:56] please explain what's happening [08:56] if you click on uk, it then says it has none [08:56] yeah [08:56] whats wrong? i think every thing is fine [08:57] from the link you provided [08:57] hmm [08:57] okay [08:57] so howcome we have two different links? [08:57] what am I looking into? [08:57] every thing is ok, the link that ChrisWoollard gave was a direct one to lucid-e1 only the link humphreybc1 gave was all the manual translations [08:57] why the translations here (https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual) are different to here (https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/+pots/ubuntu-manual) [08:58] the first on shows the website as well [08:58] ubuntujenkins: oh so my link covers all our branches, like websites/maverick/e2/e1 etc [08:58] is that right? [08:58] yes [08:58] ah ha [08:58] clikc on a language [08:58] well, it covers a single series, I think. [08:59] but it includes both the website and manual translations. [08:59] (which, btw, I just updated the website translations a few hours ago, so you might make sure they're updated) [08:59] Yes, there are more [08:59] never ending Chris :P [09:00] never mind. only 67 [09:00] the website shouldn't be too hard [09:00] German is all green :D [09:02] godbyk, what about the text on the website front page? [09:03] you know [09:03] what about it? [09:03] when the countdown timer disappears [09:03] we have a different front page [09:03] the one I mocked up [09:03] lemme find it [09:03] http://www.flickr.com/photos/humphreybc/4396509529/sizes/o/ [09:03] I think we just edit the router file and say that 'homepage' is the new homepage instead of 'countdown'. [09:04] but I haven't looked at the code for quite a while. [09:04] okay [09:04] so daker has actually made the new homepage? [09:04] shit have I made a new image for that with the new title page? [09:04] I swear I did [09:04] ah, i have [09:04] oh no wait [09:05] we had the flash fading thing [09:05] that's right [09:05] it faded between four iamges [09:05] images* [09:05] where's that gone? [09:05] is the site going to switch over to that page when the countdown reaches zero? [09:05] and have the strings on that page been translated? [09:06] I assume the home page has been created and we just have to switch to it. but I don't know. [09:06] i'm pretty sure it's been created [09:06] he was testing the fading images in different browsers, remember? [09:06] I don't think it switches automatically; I think we have to do it manually. [09:07] you can poke around the branch and see. [09:07] okay, figure out how to do it manually so we're ready. I don't like having to rely on one person for our entire release. [09:07] which branch is the site in? [09:07] ubuntu-manual or ubuntu-manual-website? [09:07] the ubuntu-manual-website branch [09:07] in the main/ dir [09:07] the pages are in the main/pages dir [09:07] so can we delete the website folder from the ubuntu-manual branch? [09:08] and do we even have write access to ubuntu-manual-website? [09:09] Ok, Now it is clear [09:11] https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-manual-website [09:11] did daker create a team? [09:11] humphreybc1: if you join the website team yes but daker has to aprove you first [09:11] oh [09:12] humphreybc1: yes, we can delete it but let's wait 'til we have the site up and whatnot. just to be safe. also, we're still using the manual branch for translations (since the translators haven't been translating the -website stuff) [09:12] right [09:12] humphreybc1: also, we should have write access to the repository now (though I haven't tried it yet) [09:12] that's... overly complicated. [09:13] what's overly complicated? [09:13] the fact that the translations for the website are being done from one branch, but the website is stored elsewhere [09:13] also we have like, a tonne of old files from other people who worked on the site [09:14] well, yes. we'll move the translators over, but right now they're heads-down working. [09:14] okay [09:15] and next week (when we can all catch our breaths), we'll want to wipe out the maverick branch probably and build a new one with just the manual files in it (so it's not carrying around the bloated history of everything before it including the website) [09:15] \o/ [09:15] I just added two new document class options: screen and print. [09:15] yup, okay, good [09:15] next week will be all hands to the pumps setting everything up for maverick [09:15] so if I compile with the 'screen' option, the links are in color. if I compile with the 'print' option, the links are black text. [09:15] * godbyk is pleased with himself. [09:16] nice [09:16] * humphreybc1 is pleased with godbyk! [09:16] but yeah, next will be all setting up infrastructure, specifications and getting help for the next 6 months [09:16] actually, the maverick stuff isn't quite top priority. we'll have to get lucid-e2 going first and deal with whatever comes of the release. [09:16] well that's what i mean [09:16] lucid-e2/maverick/same diff :P [09:17] godbyk: bastard title page? [09:17] also, we need to talk with Ilya to figure out some research [09:17] also known as a half title page. [09:17] thorwil: basically it's a really simple title page that comes before the nice title page. [09:18] since it's abutted against the cover with the book is closed, it's what catches any damage. [09:18] (at least that was the original idea centuries ago. now they're not quite as necessary.. I'm just old-fashioned.) [09:18] godbyk: i think no, as it's one of those things that makes a book feel big [09:19] 'kay. [09:21] godbyk: in german, we call that a schmutztitel, literally "dirt title". no wonder i had to look up bastard/half title [09:22] hooray for information technology's lack of specific native german terms [09:22] heh.. well, it's not really an IT term -- just a publishing term. [09:23] But I like scmuztitel. It clearly defines its purpose. :) [09:24] godbyk, an example of a half title? [09:24] (picture) [09:24] godbyk: that's what i mean. IT does not have that native language baggage typography or other old fields have, making it a lot easier for bi-linguals [09:26] ah, I see. [09:26] humphreybc1: sure, one sec. [09:27] humphreybc1: http://kevin.godby.org/ShinyHappyUsersWithCover.pdf [09:27] so the first page is the cover. the second is the backside of the cover. ignore those. [09:27] then you have the half-title page. [09:27] then there's a frontispiece (it's there because there were two title page proposals and that was part of the losing one. so I put it there as a compromise) [09:28] then you have the full title page (with all the authors) [09:28] then the copyright page [09:28] then the contents, main matter, back matter, etc. [09:32] what's the easiest way to extract a single page out of a pdf? [09:33] (just so you don't have to download to full copies of the book when I show you this page) [09:38] thorwil, humphreybc1, et al.: what do you think of this text that I added to the copyright page? (it differs slightly for print and screen versions.) [09:39] http://kevin.godby.org/private/junk/copyright-screen.pdf [09:39] http://kevin.godby.org/private/junk/copyright-print.pdf [09:45] Hey, komsas. How's it going? [09:47] hi godbyk, I'm good, thanks [09:51] godbyk: do you know where is better to translate web page, there is ubuntu-manual-website project and ubu-man-website-translations template in the ubuntu-manul? [09:51] yeah, it shouldn't actually matter -- they're the same translations in both (and launchpad will copy them across the two projects) [09:51] godbyk, looks good [09:51] we copied the translations into the ubuntu-manual project so that translators would see them and translate them. [09:52] (since we started the -website project a bit later and it seemed like the translators hadn't noticed it yet) [09:52] right [09:52] i have avatar on blu ray and a tonne of snacks [09:52] i'm going to watch it now [09:54] godbyk: firefox/wget hang on connecting to kevin.godby.org [09:55] really? [09:56] godbyk: according to the last comment on https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/570377 , i just need to fix a lsight accidental transparency that shouldn't be there in the first place to get correct pdf export [09:56] Launchpad bug 570377 in inkscape "Erroneous PDF export of scaled rectangles" [Undecided,New] [09:56] thorwil: it worked okay here. [09:57] thorwil: nice.. that's an odd bug, isn't it? [09:59] godbyk: yes. that i ended up with 98% transparency is likely related to the tools remembering last used options. though even then i don't know how i can have one reactangle at 100 and the other on 98 in my test file, where i didn't touch that slider at all [10:03] godbyk: unfortunately, none of the elements in the UMP logo is at less than 100% opacity :< [10:03] hmm.. [10:06] godbyk: just did an export with the vector icon included and it comes out fine, now. but i happen to be using the latest inkscape bzr, so i don't know what fixed it now [10:06] insanity here i come [10:07] wonderful. [10:07] I guess I can try converting your svg here and see what blows up, too. [10:07] well, actually, this is the cover. [10:07] so it doesn't matter. [10:07] still no luck with Connecting to kevin.godby.org [10:07] you can do whatever you want, as long as you give me a PDF in the end. :) [10:08] thorwil: maybe try kevingodby.org? it should be the same site. [10:08] godbyk: yeah, i will of course commit svg and pdf for this one [10:08] (in case it's a weird dns thing that only affects the godby.org domain) [10:08] same [10:08] weird. [10:08] okay, I'll just email 'em to ya. [10:08] resolution to 69.163.168.200 is correct? [10:09] thorwil: sent. [10:10] thorwil: yep, that's it. [10:11] got the mail [10:12] godbyk: good [10:12] 'kay. I'll go with those then. [10:12] anything else important that should go on the copyright page? [10:13] I fixed the blank pages before the index (it was adding an extra blank page). [10:13] now the pdf is sitting at 164 pages, which is quite handy as it's evenly divisible by 4. [10:14] though I'm still considering the schmutztitel. [10:20] godbyk: i just exported the lulu cover from inkscape to a 300 dpi png and rendered a pdf of the same via gimp to do a visual diff. they are identical [10:20] couldn't be sure about that anymore [10:20] heh [10:20] I don't blame yout. [10:20] you, rather. [10:21] I just finished surveying the perfect bound books on my shelves and all but two of them had half-title pages. [10:21] humphreybc1, godbyk: once i get that ubuntu logo, shall we run with just the current design with this single addition, or do you still want quotes on there? [10:22] I'm okay with the current design. I don't know if humphreybc1 still wants quotes or not. I'm not sure if he got more than the one. [10:22] I think the quotes probably aren't necessary for the hard copy, since it's not sitting on a shelf hoping someone buys it. [10:22] if you're looking at a hard copy, then you (or someone) has already bought it. [10:23] thorwil: how strongly against half-title pages are you? [10:23] I'm proposing to use them in the printed book, but not in the on-screen pdf. [10:23] godbyk: strong like the hut of the first of the 3 pigs [10:24] lol! [10:25] thorwil: okay, let me whip one up real quick and we'll see how it looks. [10:25] are you at all tempted by colophons? [10:26] you mean production notes? [10:26] basically, yeah. typefaces used, any special production notes, etc. [10:27] nice to have. shows some respect/support to the projects we benefit from [10:27] typefaces first, inkscape last or not at all ;) [10:28] at this point, I'm almost loathe to mention inkscape at all with as much trouble as it's given us! [10:28] I'll type up some notes and run 'em past ya. [10:30] yeah, there's just really no alternative for the work i did on the titlepage. could have assembled the parts in scribus, perhaps, but created them [10:31] yeah, inkscape has sucked away a lot of our time. [10:31] we *could* have done it in LaTeX itself, but that brings its own problems -- namely, that you're fiddling with numbers all the time instead of just moving things around and aligning them by eye. [10:38] this is strange irc still works the textlive download is still going but I can't view any webpages [10:43] thorwil: were the icons on the cover designed by us or did we snag those from somewhere? [10:44] godbyk: the globe and the pseudo-text have shapes taken from the Humanity icon set. rest from scratch [10:45] thorwil: do we need to cite that (or should we)? [10:45] godbyk: actually, the mouse pointer is from that set, too, i mean to recall [10:45] vish: ^ what do you think? [10:46] godbyk: i think it's the right thing to do [10:46] meh , i dont know squat about copyrights! [10:47] vish: what license are the icons under? [10:48] "This package is licensed under GNU General Public License version 2." [10:49] from the authors file ^ , still dont know what it means though ;p [10:49] okay. [10:49] so we're not required to cite the source. [10:49] so the question is just 'should we?' :) [10:51] I think it would be nice to if we have some where good to put it [10:51] thorwil: I've emailed you the colophon as it looks right now. [10:51] for those who can actually get to my website, it's online at: http://kevin.godby.org/private/junk/colophon.pdf [10:51] ubuntujenkins: we've got someplace to put it now. :) [10:52] can you mail it to me i cant get onto webpages but can recive e-mails [10:52] sure. what address, ubuntujenkins? [10:52] godbyk: now i can get that pdf [10:52] in that case put it in as I would apreciate it being put in if it was my work. ubuntujenkins@googlemail.com [10:53] ubuntujenkins: sent [10:53] thorwil: great! [10:54] Also, I would normally mention that, say, the title page and cover was designed by thorwil, the book interior was designed by blah, etc. [10:54] Do we want to call out individuals or just let them reside in the credits with everyone else? [10:54] (I'm leaning toward the latter, as I don't suppose the designers are more important than the authors and translators, but that's just me.) [10:55] godbyk: I like it, especially the quickshot one :) [10:55] (since we're not listing authors on the title page like you normally would to give them more prominence.) [10:55] :) [10:55] I think all in the credits [10:55] godbyk: "The pointer arrow, globe and the documents pictogram on the title page are made of or contain shapes taken form the Humanity icon set."?? [10:55] are there other tools that we relied on that should be mentioned? [10:55] thorwil: sure. works for me. do we have a url for the humanity icon set? [10:56] (since I'm linking to everyone else) [10:56] ubuntujenkins: you guys should get quickshot.ubuntu-manual.org (or quickshot.org or whatnot) set up sometime. :) [10:56] godbyk: yep I will speak with everyone soon about it letting this release of the manual roll through [10:56] godbyk: wait, "The title page pictograms contain shapes taken from the Humanity icon set." [10:57] thorwil: I like that better. More concise. [10:57] godbyk: https://launchpad.net/humanity [10:58] vish: there's no project homepage for Humanity, besides the LP page, right? [10:58] nope.. [10:58] also godbyk do you know how big the texlive svn repo is? [10:58] ubuntujenkins: no clue. I'm guessing it'd be huge, though. [10:59] godbyk: i don't think calling out individuals belongs in the production notes [10:59] Are there any other tools we used that I've left out of the list? [10:59] thorwil: fair enough. [11:00] godbyk: bzr? [11:00] godbyk: it is at 2.9 gb so far but its going at 18kiB/s the sever is so slow. [11:00] I think svn has built-in throttles so it's always slow. At least it seems that way with all the servers I've used. [11:01] that sucks [11:04] I've updated the colophon.pdf file at the url above if you want to double-check my spelling and everything. [11:06] godbyk: both lines refering to the title page should be paired [11:06] godbyk: easiest to achive by moving "e screenshots were captured using ishot," one up [11:06] thorwil: good call [11:06] should we promote Quickshot or demote it a line? [11:07] promote it :) we need the advertising [11:07] promote [11:07] ubuntujenkins: works for me! :) [11:13] I've just uploaded the latest draft to http://builds.ubuntu-manual.org/builds/ubuntu-manual-final-draft.pdf [11:13] (I'm going to regenerate the half-title page PDF on my lucid laptop so it doesn't look so crappy) [11:14] whoops.. forgot to set it to print instead of screen. [11:14] one moment [11:16] okay, now the print version is uploaded [11:16] er.. uploading.. in progress. [11:16] *Now* it's uploaded. [11:26] okay, fixed the half-title page. [11:27] assuming that aren't any horrible bugs that cause me to add or remove pages, we're sitting at 168 pages. [11:28] so let me plug those numbers into lulu and get thorwil his final dimensions for the cover. [11:30] thorwil: final cover dimensions are: [11:31] Spine width: 27.08 Postscript points wide (0.376") [11:31] Spine begins 621 Postscript points (8.63") from the left. [11:31] Total cover width: 1269.08 X 810 Postscript points (17.63" X 11.25") [11:31]