| === gaj is now known as lag | ||
| === lag is now known as jag | ||
| === jag is now known as jagl | ||
| === jagl is now known as lag | ||
| === lag is now known as Guest77381 | ||
| ogra_cmpc | lool, bug 572882 FYI | 10:14 |
|---|---|---|
| ubot4 | Launchpad bug 572882 in qemu-kvm (Ubuntu) "qemu-debootstrap does not support --variant=fakechroot (affects: 1)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/572882 | 10:14 |
| * ogra_cmpc wonders if we somehow can wrap qemu-arm-static in a fakeroot wrapper inside the chroot if that variant is chosen | 10:15 | |
| ogra_cmpc | preferably without having to change the binfmt handler | 10:16 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: I suspect fakeroot and fakechroot set LD_PRELOAD libraries which are not available in the chroot | 10:33 |
| lool | Because the runtime loader isn't the same on armel and x86 | 10:33 |
| ogra_cmpc | yeah | 10:34 |
| ogra_cmpc | well, its the same binary, differnt link | 10:34 |
| lool | ? | 10:34 |
| ogra_cmpc | at kleast the .so version of the loaders are identical | 10:34 |
| ogra_cmpc | ld-2.11.1.so | 10:35 |
| ogra_cmpc | on both | 10:35 |
| lool | uh | 10:35 |
| ogra_cmpc | but ld-linux.so.2 on x86 and ld-linux.so.3 on armel as links to that | 10:35 |
| ogra_cmpc | yeah | 10:35 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: ldd /usr/lib/libfakeroot/libfakeroot-sysv.so | grep ld-linux | 10:35 |
| ogra_cmpc | /lib/ld-linux.so.2 (0xb7745000) | 10:36 |
| lool | Not sure where you got ld-2.11.1.so, but the loaders have different names | 10:36 |
| ogra_cmpc | ogra@osiris:/var/build$ ls lucid-testxx/lib/ld-* | 10:36 |
| ogra_cmpc | lucid-testxx/lib/ld-2.11.1.so lucid-testxx/lib/ld-linux.so.3 | 10:36 |
| ogra_cmpc | ogra@osiris:/var/build$ ls /lib/ld-* | 10:37 |
| ogra_cmpc | /lib/ld-2.11.1.so /lib/ld-linux.so.2 | 10:37 |
| ogra_cmpc | they use the same binary version for the .so | 10:37 |
| lool | ld-linux has the ABI name, ld-2.x.so is the implementation | 10:37 |
| ogra_cmpc | ah | 10:38 |
| lool | dont look at ld-xxx.so, just at what binaries link to | 10:38 |
| ogra_cmpc | sigh, go-home-applet has a hard dep on netbook-launcher | 10:39 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: So I personally dont see what one can do here | 10:39 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: I'm tempted to wontfix the bug | 10:39 |
| ogra_cmpc | i cant install -efl standalone :( | 10:39 |
| ogra_cmpc | lool, hmm, i have a bug open for rootstock to be able to run it as non-root | 10:40 |
| lool | basically, LD_PRELOAD relies on shared libraries, so a static helper wouldn't help you | 10:40 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: Yeah, and a spec as well | 10:40 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: That would certainly be nice | 10:40 |
| ogra_cmpc | and i'd somehow like to find a way to solve it | 10:40 |
| lool | Sure | 10:41 |
| ogra_cmpc | though since you and hrw|gone seem to concentrate on vm-buildr now i wonder if we cant get that working in there | 10:41 |
| lool | well I dont think qemu-debootstrap is a piece in the puzzle | 10:41 |
| lool | qemu-debootstrap is just a handy hack which works in some cases, the fakeroot/fakechroot cases push it too far I'm afraid | 10:41 |
| ogra_cmpc | if it should replacde rootstock it seems like a waste of time to do it there | 10:41 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: Note that vm-builder requires root as well | 10:42 |
| ogra_cmpc | right | 10:42 |
| lool | and calls into debootstrap | 10:42 |
| ogra_cmpc | not qemu-debootstrap ? | 10:42 |
| lool | no | 10:42 |
| ogra_cmpc | ah | 10:43 |
| lool | well not so far, and hrw's branch reimplements the qemu-debootstrap job | 10:43 |
| ogra_cmpc | though there is no reason it should need root :) | 10:43 |
| lool | there are many actually | 10:43 |
| ogra_cmpc | really ? | 10:43 |
| lool | Well the chown() and chroot() syscalls require root | 10:43 |
| ogra_cmpc | not if wrapped in fakechroot | 10:44 |
| lool | fakechroot will intercept the calls into libc and all the other entry points which test file ownership | 10:44 |
| lool | so that you dont actually use the safe OS chroot() or chown() calls, but fakechroot's emulation | 10:45 |
| lool | Problem is that fakeroot and/or fakechroots are fighting to keep up to date with the eglibc entry points all the time | 10:45 |
| ogra_cmpc | doesnt that abstract me enough from the os to be safe ? | 10:45 |
| ogra_cmpc | hmm | 10:46 |
| lool | All of fakeroot, fakechroot, and qemu are fragile emulators and your command-line tries to combine them all | 10:47 |
| ogra_cmpc | indeed | 10:48 |
| ogra_cmpc | since its the only way to make that usecase work with the current tools | 10:48 |
| lool | qemu-system-arm can be run as non-root and will provide everything within with root rights | 10:48 |
| lool | but it's dead slow | 10:48 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: So overall, I agree it's the right thing to do to aim at not requiring root rights | 10:49 |
| ogra_cmpc | and i cant bootstrap it without root | 10:49 |
| lool | but I dont think you'll be successfully able to combine these three fragile things | 10:49 |
| ogra_cmpc | i thik i can but it would be a gross hack | 10:49 |
| lool | Another thing which makes it even more fragile on Ubuntu is the fact we build eglibc with -Bsymbolic-funcs | 10:49 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: sorry, which use case do you refer to? | 10:50 |
| ogra_cmpc | running a rootfs build without requiring root | 10:50 |
| ogra_cmpc | which is a requirement nicolas expressed in nice | 10:50 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: So I wonder how flexible that requirement is | 10:52 |
| ogra_cmpc | hmm, indeed i could switch rootstock back to its original setup without qemu-arm-static | 10:52 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: One thing I wish we would allow are running libvirt backed environments, such as LXC with qemu-system-arm | 10:52 |
| ogra_cmpc | that wouldnt require root since the second stage runs in the VM | 10:52 |
| lool | It would require permission to access libvirt which runs as root | 10:53 |
| ogra_cmpc | why with qemu-system-arm ? | 10:53 |
| ogra_cmpc | and not with -static | 10:53 |
| lool | it wouldn't with qemu-system-arm, I mentionned that one earlier, but it's really slow | 10:53 |
| lool | There is no doubt that you can do it in qemu-system-arm of course | 10:53 |
| ogra_cmpc | right | 10:54 |
| * ogra_cmpc thought LXC needs a chroot by default | 10:54 | |
| lool | well it does | 11:11 |
| lool | it's basically a super chroot, a container, which abstracts more than just filenames | 11:12 |
| ogra_cmpc | right, thats how i understood it | 11:12 |
| ogra_cmpc | so qemu-arm-static seemed better suited in my view | 11:13 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: It's going to get you there faster, but it's going to provide terrible performance | 11:17 |
| ogra_cmpc | but i probably dont understand enough about LXC yet to imagine how you integrate the vm kernel with the host kernel in LXC if you use qemu-system-arm | 11:18 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: LXC wont allow you to use qemu-system-arm | 11:19 |
| lool | it would be with qemu-arm-static | 11:19 |
| ogra_cmpc | ah, then i misunderstood you above | 11:19 |
| lool | ogra_cmpc: The point of libvirt / lxc is to a) have a slightly better tool than a chroot b) get permission to manage these via libvirt | 11:20 |
| ogra_cmpc | right | 11:20 |
| ogra_cmpc | <lool> ogra_cmpc: One thing I wish we would allow are running libvirt backed environments, such as LXC with qemu-system-arm | 11:20 |
| ogra_cmpc | that one confused me | 11:20 |
| lool | Yeah, that's a typo | 11:20 |
| lool | I meant qemu-arm-static | 11:20 |
| ogra_cmpc | ah | 11:20 |
| lool | it would also be great to have qemu-system-arm integrated in libvirt, but that's another story | 11:21 |
| ogra_cmpc | right, then i'm in full agreement, LXC integration is something i wanted to look at next, though i didnt priorize because it still doesnt solve the mono issues | 11:22 |
| ogra_cmpc | which was always my main concern with the -static implementation | 11:23 |
| lool | This one is apparently a though nut to crack | 11:24 |
| ogra_cmpc | yeah | 11:24 |
| ogra_cmpc | perferably to be fixed in mono itself though | 11:25 |
| ogra_cmpc | by using a more sane GC | 11:25 |
| prpplague | robclark in the office today? | 17:57 |
| robclark | hi prpplague, yeah | 17:58 |
| prpplague | fun fun | 17:58 |
| robclark | at least for a little bit | 17:58 |
| robclark | built new kernel, so need to copy it to MMC and boot up board so I can access it remotely ;-) | 17:58 |
| prpplague | i'm headed into my office later this evening to see if i can find that heat problem | 17:58 |
| prpplague | robclark dandy | 17:59 |
| robclark | ok.. keep me posted.. for now I'm working on other board, but same filesystem should work for both | 17:59 |
| prpplague | yea | 17:59 |
| === rsalveti_ is now known as rsalveti | ||
| === NCommand1r is now known as NCommander | ||
| === NCommander is now known as Guest43091 | ||
| === Guest43091 is now known as NCommander | ||
| sveinse | Hello. Where and how can I find the builtin compile options in gcc? Is it all in the specs file? -- I'm doing a comparison of the lucid gcc vs. a codesourcery cross compiler. | 19:56 |
| NCommander | sveinse: gcc -dumpspecs | 20:25 |
| sveinse | NCommander: Well, I also thought they were, but I cannot find them there | 20:26 |
| NCommander | sveinse: not sure what to tell you. doko is the toolchain expert | 20:26 |
| sveinse | If I do "gcc -o foo foo.c -v" I see a option COLLECT_GCC_OPTIONS with the default build options appended. It's the appended list I'm interested in | 20:27 |
| sveinse | This https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ARM/Thumb2 wiki lists them for Ubuntu, so that's the easy part. However, I don't know what it is for CS GCC... | 20:28 |
| lool | sveinse: Not sure what you mean | 20:45 |
| lool | sveinse: gcc -v outputs how gcc was configured, is this good enough? | 20:45 |
| sveinse | lool: Yeah, I'll stick with that for now | 20:53 |
| DanaG | hmm, say, does anyone know what the default setup of the pins on the beagle expansion header are, with the Ubuntu kernel? | 21:09 |
| sveinse | Anyone familiar with the gcc arm options? (lool?) What is the difference between the -mfpu=vfpv3-d16 and neon. AFAICS they are not mutually exclusive to each other | 21:19 |
| lool | sebjan: neon is a superset of -mfpu=vfpv3-d16 | 22:21 |
| lool | sebjan: the last fpu= arg wins | 22:21 |
| lool | sebjan: err sorry, wrong nick | 22:23 |
| lool | sveinse: ^ | 22:23 |
| lool | sveinse: See the gcc man page | 22:23 |
| sveinse | lool: Thanks. I've been looking at the gcc-info docs, but I couldn't find any info about the superset.. Perhaps I need new glasses 8) | 22:25 |
| DanaG | hmm, I've tweaked my thing to boot ubuntu with root on mmc but kernel in nand... but I still need it to use the initramfs. | 22:27 |
| DanaG | How's that supposed to work, anyway? where is the initramfs in flash? | 22:28 |
| DanaG | ah, it's in the "file system" part. | 22:28 |
| DanaG | Can I point the kernel directly at that memory address as initramfs? | 22:28 |
| sveinse | lool: Perhaps more interestingly: I can compile my own apps using -mfpu=neon on lucid, right? | 22:29 |
| lool | sveinse: sure | 22:59 |
| lool | DanaG: The initramfs needs to be unpacked; I dont know whether it can unpack to RAM from flash | 23:00 |
| DanaG | I also wish the fw_printenv command would indent things. | 23:14 |
| DanaG | that'd make it far easier to read. | 23:17 |
| DanaG | ** Unable to read "boot.scr" from mmc 0:1 ** | 23:18 |
| DanaG | reading uImage | 23:18 |
| DanaG | ** Unable to read "uImage" from mmc 0:1 ** | 23:18 |
| DanaG | Booting from nand ... | 23:18 |
| DanaG | what's weird about that: there's a line-break after the first two... whereas it should be after the first ONE. | 23:19 |
| DanaG | "unable to read uimage" "booting from nand..." | 23:19 |
| DanaG | It should be "reading uimage" "unable to read uimage" | 23:19 |
| DanaG | great... I just accidentally did "nand erase", thinking it would tell me the usage of that command. | 23:27 |
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