m1ndctrlanyone around?05:48
m1ndctrlI have a quick question about gnome-settings-daemon and xserver-xgl05:48
RAOFm1ndctrl: Oooh, that's a blast from the past!05:52
m1ndctrlglad to see someones up :)05:53
m1ndctrlActually, I'm working on gettings xgl running across 4 monitors in one x session05:53
m1ndctrlI've had this running no problem in 8.0405:53
m1ndctrlI'm on 10.04 now05:53
m1ndctrland I'm 95% there.05:53
m1ndctrlI can get compiz working, and indeed xgl is running - however, gnome won't start.05:54
RAOFXgl has been *entirely* dead for quite some time.05:54
m1ndctrlbut it's the only way it will work.05:54
m1ndctrlunless you know of another way?05:54
RAOFUnless those 4 monitors are all being driven by a single GPU, no.05:55
m1ndctrlindeed the problem is that I'm running two seperate gpu's05:56
RAOFRight.  XRandR doesn't yet address that use-case.05:56
m1ndctrlany idea why gnome fails though with xserver-xgl?05:57
RAOFOooh, boy.  Not without logs, no.05:58
m1ndctrlcan you point me where to look other than xsession-errors?05:59
m1ndctrlthe error mentions debugging in gdb.. but i'd prefer to not venture there if possible05:59
RAOFOh, something's died with a X error?06:00
m1ndctrlmind if I paste what it says here?06:00
RAOFYes.  Use a pastebin instead.06:00
RAOF(It's the right thing to do anyway :))06:00
RAOFpaste.ubuntu.com is one such service.06:00
m1ndctrli just dumped my entire .xsession-errors06:02
RAOFThat's better than fine, that's good.  It's almost always undesirable to paste less than the full log ;)06:03
m1ndctrli execute this script in the gnome session I have configured (i just added a new entry as xgl.desktop to execute the following: http://pastebin.com/q5GNbged06:04
m1ndctrli've tried ommiting the --display=:0, i've also tried changing DISPLAY=:1 and doing --display=:1 but no luck.06:04
m1ndctrland as a random, sligtly humourous sidenote - when i execute glxgears X dies and i'm back at the login after it restarts.06:07
m1ndctrlnot sure if that tidbit is worth anything, but thought I'd throw it out there.06:07
RAOFHm.  That suggests that you're using nvidia… what drivers?  All but the oldest nvidia drivers should be able to handle what you're doing without Xgl06:08
m1ndctrli'm using 195 drivers06:08
m1ndctrlif i try it without xserver-xgl and i try and boot with each 2 twinviews and xinerama enabled I simply get a black screen and nothing else06:09
m1ndctrli'm thinking it's not a driver issue.. maybe I'm wrong,  I don't know - before it was running on the 173 drivers06:11
m1ndctrlmaybe i should give that a go06:11
m1ndctrlbut i'm not getting any X errors - just gnome...06:12
m1ndctrlRAOF: still there?06:16
RAOFm1ndctrl: I am now.06:16
m1ndctrlah k06:16
m1ndctrlin case you missed:06:17
m1ndctrl m1ndctrl> i'm using 195 drivers06:17
m1ndctrl01:09 < m1ndctrl> if i try it without xserver-xgl and i try and boot with each 2 twinviews and xinerama enabled I simply get a black screen and nothing else06:17
m1ndctrl < m1ndctrl> i'm thinking it's not a driver issue.. maybe I'm wrong,  I don't know - before it was running on the 173 drivers06:17
m1ndctrl01:11 < m1ndctrl> maybe i should give that a go06:17
m1ndctrl01:12 < m1ndctrl> but i'm not getting any X errors - just gnome...06:17
RAOFm1ndctrl: Those errors were gnome trying to use X features unsupported (or incorrectly supported) by Xgl.06:18
m1ndctrlawww crap. that sounds bad.06:18
m1ndctrlperhaps I could try downgrading gnome to the 8.04 version?06:19
RAOFYou could, I guess.  You might as well stay on 8.04 if you wanted to do that, though.06:20
m1ndctrlagreed :) a realization that's coming to form now.06:21
m1ndctrlhowever, my main reason for upgrading was due to transcoding issuse06:21
m1ndctrlI transcode 1080p files to my ps3 across my network06:21
m1ndctrland 8.04 is slow06:21
m1ndctrlmy issues are resolved on 10.0406:21
m1ndctrltranscodes much better06:21
m1ndctrli'm not sure why exactly... it's weird...06:23
m1ndctrli truly don't care about the xgl effects however running the regular metacity non composite session results in horrible refresh rates and rendering when i have a bunch of programs open06:28
m1ndctrlsomething that simply doesnt happen with xgl06:28
RAOFThere might be some other craziness in your setup causing this.  What happens if you just run 2 separate X screens, each TwinView'd up?06:32
m1ndctrlwith xserver-xgl or without?06:32
RAOFWithout xserver-xgl06:33
m1ndctrlwith - nothing, same issue - xgl works - i can open all programs - but gnome wont start06:33
m1ndctrlwithout - i get black screens across all four monitors06:33
m1ndctrlthey receive an input06:33
m1ndctrli see them all switch to dvi06:33
m1ndctrland then nothing - black screen - system idles06:33
RAOFAnd if you only use two of the screens?06:33
m1ndctrlworks fine06:33
RAOFAnd if you use three screens?06:34
RAOFOr one screen from each GPU?06:34
m1ndctrl2 screens per gpu  - 4 screens total.06:34
m1ndctrlso i do 2 x twinview then combine with xinerama06:34
m1ndctrlso that I can move windows across all four.06:34
RAOFI was under the impression that you could actually just use twinview for all four, although I've never had a dual-gpu system.06:36
m1ndctrli've tried it without using xinerama and it will work - however i'm limited to using the screens in pairs and not across all four06:36
m1ndctrlthis is why i use xinerama to bind them all together06:37
m1ndctrlif i try with the regular xserver i receive the Xlib: missing RandR extension06:37
m1ndctrlwhich i'm assuming is RandR not knowing how to handle two gpu's?06:37
RAOFm1ndctrl: No, that's Xinerama disabling RandR.06:42
m1ndctrlhmmm okay.06:42
m1ndctrlI'm trying to revert to an older nvidia driver06:44
m1ndctrljust to see if that resolves the issues06:44
m1ndctrlif not - i'm gonna head to bed06:44
m1ndctrlthanks for the help RAOF06:44
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seb128pitti, hello08:13
pittibonjour seb12808:13
seb128pitti, how are you?08:14
pittiI'm great, thanks!08:14
pittinice to be here08:14
seb128"here" being? ;-)08:14
pittiin Leuven, meeting my friends again08:15
seb128pitti, can you cancel today's meeting btw?08:15
seb128oh, right08:15
pittiI was going to ask you about it08:15
seb128pitti, there is not a lot to discuss and half the team is not there or travelling08:15
pittiseb128: want me to send an announcement?08:15
seb128rick said to cancel the meeting08:15
* pitti sends08:15
seb128so if you could just drop an email to the team about it08:15
* seb128 hugs pitti08:16
* pitti hugs you back08:16
didrocksgood morning seb128, pitti08:17
pittibonjour didrocks!08:18
seb128lut didrocks08:18
baptistemmHello good morning08:19
didrockssalut baptistemm08:19
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seb128so one user states the gnome-panel corruption is not ubuntu specific09:11
seb128which is somewhat good to know, still no clue how to debug this one though09:11
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rodrigo_where is the explanation for how to obtain a backtrace with apport?09:32
rodrigo_to point a user to it09:32
pittididrocks: FYI, we do have util-linux-ng; we have nothing else :)09:34
pittididrocks: I'm interested in those udev-rules-netbook, how much black magic they do; I'm happy to review them and commit sensible changes to udev upstream09:34
didrockspitti: thanks for the feedback ;) I'm updating the list now (my apt-cache search betrayed me ;))09:35
didrockspitti: you mean util-linux is util-linux-ng in fact?09:37
didrocksok, thanks for the info ;)09:38
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rodrigo_seb128, I remember seeing comments from you on bugs pointing users to a page to get a backtrace, where is that page?09:48
seb128hey rodrigo_09:50
rodrigo_hi seb128, btw :)09:50
seb128rodrigo_, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash09:50
rodrigo_ah, cool09:50
seb128or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/ApportRetraces09:51
chrisccoulsongood morning everyone10:01
didrockshey chrisccoulson, how are you?10:02
chrisccoulsonhey didrocks, yeah, good thanks10:03
chrisccoulsonjust catching up on e-mail now10:03
seb128hey chrisccoulson10:05
chrisccoulsonhey seb128, how are you?10:05
seb128I'm good thanks10:06
seb128how are you?10:06
chrisccoulsonseb128 - yeah, good thanks. had quite a busy weekend10:06
seb128work busy or real life busy? ;-)10:07
chrisccoulsonseb128 - real life busy ;)10:07
chrisccoulsoni went to a wedding in scotland on saturday10:08
chrisccoulsonso there was quite a lot of driving10:08
seb128I see10:08
seb128good to spend a weekend away from computers before UDS ;-)10:11
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chrisccoulsonseb128 - yeah, i didn't go near my computer for 4 whole days ;)10:15
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chrisccoulsonwhich is the longest i've been away for a long time10:15
pittihey chrisccoulson, how are you?10:21
chrisccoulsonhey pitti, yeah, i'm ok thanks. how are you?10:21
pittiI'm great, thanks!10:25
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tseliotpitti: bug #573557 seems like a serious issue to me and we have a patch from upstream. Do you mind if I file an SRU about it?11:27
ubottuLaunchpad bug 573557 in nvidia-graphics-drivers "nvidia-current 195.36.15 + kernel 2.6.32 + dual cards crashes system" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/57355711:27
pittitseliot: that'd be great, thanks! (well "file" -> use that bug)11:39
tseliotpitti: yes, of course, I really meant to say "request" rather than "file"11:40
pittithanks tseliot11:40
pittilunch, bbl11:47
gicmomvo, sorry forgot to send logs yesterday11:54
gicmomvo, is it mvo@ubuntu.com?11:54
gicmomvo, should be out11:56
gicmo*should*, I was fighting the LRZ yesterday ;-)11:56
mvothanks gicmo!11:57
mvogicmo: did you manage to recover it?11:57
gicmomvo, yep, sent from the recovered machine11:58
gicmomvo, thanks a bunch for the help11:58
mvogicmo: my pleasure12:00
mvogicmo: thanks, I have the logs12:00
mvogicmo: was there no newer kern.log ?12:02
mvoMar 13 is a bit outdated :)12:02
gicmooh, did I manage to add the wrong kern log?12:04
gicmoMay  3 14:44:38 wachtler3 kernel: [  168.772213] python[1886]: segfault at 7f253031c190 ip 00007f253031c190 sp 00007fffdebc9bc8 error 15 in libQtGui.so.4.6.2[7f2530309000+3f000]12:05
gicmoahh that is more like it12:05
gicmomvo, should be out12:08
tseliotpitti: ok, I have requested an SRU for #573557 and uploaded to lucid-proposed12:10
mvogicmo: many thanks!12:12
mvoMay  3 18:40:19 wachtler3 kernel: [14309.822181] python[2307]: segfault at 0 ip12:12
mvo+(null) sp 00007fffaa6fb728 error 14 in python2.6[400000+21c000]12:12
mvogicmo: but nothing in /var/crash?12:12
gicmolet me check12:13
gicmomvo, ah, that was the thing during my recovery process12:13
mvogicmo: aha, 18:00 is later, right12:14
gicmomvo, global.0.crash  nvidia-new-kernel-source-envy.0.crash12:14
mvogicmo: there is another one here:12:14
gicmoare there12:14
gicmomvo, want both?12:14
mvojust global.0.crash12:14
mvogicmo: that was a upgrade with kubuntu running?12:14
mvogicmo: or ubuntu running?12:14
gicmomvo, kubuntu dist but GNOME running12:14
* mvo nods12:15
gicmomvo, I also got an error from the nvidia package during upgrade12:15
gicmomvo, I clicked it away and  a bit later (not immediately) the machine crashed12:15
mvo2010-05-03 11:45:22,753 ERROR got an error from dpkg for pkg: 'nvidia-glx-new-envy': 'subprocess installed post-removal script returned error exit status 212:15
gicmowell froze12:15
gicmoI'll get you both ;-)12:15
gicmomvo, are out12:17
mvogicmo: thanks, you rock! the info from the nvidia error is  helpful12:19
gicmomvo, I used to rock, I am more like an advanced-user currently ;-)12:22
gicmomvo, thanks for your help ;-)12:23
mvotseliot: hi, what can we do about the following error from nvidia-glx-new-envy for hardy -> lucid ugprades? http://paste.ubuntu.com/427588/ - the package is no longer in the archive, should we add u-m quirks for it?12:27
mvotseliot: bug #57507712:50
ubottuLaunchpad bug 575077 in linux-restricted-modules-envy-2.6.24 "postrm script fails on hardy -> lucid ugprades" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/57507712:50
tseliotmvo: yes, maybe some logic in u-m would help13:26
mvotseliot: I think I have a simple workaround, testing it now13:27
tseliotmvo: great, thanks13:27
mvodid I ever mention that I dislike diverts ;)13:27
tseliotmvo: which is why I removed them in lucid ;)13:28
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didrockstaking the train, see you guys!13:42
pittibye didrocks13:42
pittididrocks: going to .be already?13:43
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seb128pitti, he is, joining the dx sprint tomorrow13:44
seb128pitti, representing the desktop team there while we are at somehand then13:45
seb128pitti, when do you arrive?13:45
seb128tomorrow evening?13:45
pittiseb128: probably around afternoon13:46
pittiit's a local train from Leuven, just an hour13:46
pittiI could almost come by bike :) (if I wouldn't have my luggage)13:46
seb128book a taxi in advance, the hotel is not really walkable to13:46
seb128and the train station is a small town one13:46
seb128without waiting cabs13:46
pittithey said there would be a shuttle tomorrow13:46
seb128ok, good then ;-)13:47
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pittiseb128: do you still remember the gnomevfs equivalent of gvfs-monitor?13:55
pittignomevfs-monitor wants an URI already13:55
pittioh, I figure I can use gthumb for testing13:56
dpmArneGoetje, pitti, seb128, I've scheduled a session for a roundtable Desktop-Translations at UDS. As you are the ones most involved with translations, may I ask you to subscribe and join the session? If you can't, feel free to propose someone else, it would be good to have a couple of people from the desktop team at least. The bp is here: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-m-desktop-translations-roundtable Feel free to add new top13:57
dpmics or comments to the whiteboard as well13:57
seb128pitti, gnomevfs-monitor ;-)13:57
seb128pitti, what are you trying to do?13:58
pittiUsage: gnomevfs-monitor <location>13:58
pittiand if I do computer:/// or /, I don't get any changes with an USB stick13:58
seb128pitti, oh you mean to monitor one file?13:58
pittino, monitor for new/removed drives/volumes13:58
seb128I'm not sure those monitors do that13:58
pittithat's what I figured13:58
seb128they are file and directory monitors13:58
pittianyway, gthumb will do fine for testing13:58
seb128dpm, thanks13:59
pittisudo dpkg -P libhal-storage114:03
pittiand just two remaining rdepends for libhal114:03
pittiargh, someone forgot to commit the last gnome-vfs change14:05
* pitti fixes14:05
seb128pitti, if you want to do the pending update you can drop the change ;-)14:10
seb128it's in the new version14:10
pittiseb128: "pending update"?14:10
seb128pitti, there is a 2.24.314:10
pittiseb128: two seconds after I pushed the debcommit -r :)14:10
* pitti uncommits14:10
seb128pitti, you are on maverick merging mode already?14:11
pittiargh, and needs to be merged as well14:11
pittiseb128: some bits, yeah14:11
pittidid cdbs and debhelper yesterday (toolchain)14:11
pittiand fixed up gcc-4.514:12
seb128rock on :-)14:12
seb128I SRU-ed the libgdata fix btw14:12
pittiseb128: de-halification is on my personal TODO list, so I wanted to look into that now :)14:12
seb128if you want to review that14:12
pittiyep, saw it14:12
pittiseb128: I'm inclined to drop our less important changes to the package, since it's barely used any more anyway; ok with you?14:17
seb128pitti, yes, I want to try to get it out of the CD this cycle14:18
pittiseb128: it's by and large evolution14:18
seb128pitti, or don't bother merging with debian14:18
seb128just do the update ;-)14:18
dpmhey Keybuk, on the UDS session I was mentioning earlier I've also added a topic on what you pinged me about some days ago: "Common approach for building POT template on non-desktop packages using plain gettext instead of intltool, e.g. mountall, in the same way as CDBS GNOME packages use langpack.mk" Feel free to subscribe to https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-m-desktop-translations-roundtable and join the session as well14:27
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milanbvwhat's the policy regarding the migration from network-admin/ifup to NetworkManager in Lucid?14:30
milanbvsince interfaces aren't shown anymore in network-admin, people are complaining14:30
milanbvshouldn't we remove network-admin on upgrade?14:30
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looldidrocks: heya15:59
looldidrocks: The mobile team seeks improvements to panel memory consumption or a replacement, especially for ARM; I wouldn't want this to be ARM-only, ideally all our netbook images would benefit; I've added you to the proposed spec https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-arm/+spec/arm-m-lightweight-panel-for-efl could you check with ogra whether you folks need to discuss anything before UDS?16:00
seb128lool, he's in the train to Brussels16:01
ogranote though that we might possibly only have plain framebuffer graphics and no HW accel16:01
loolseb128: Pff these French guys always have cheap excuses16:02
seb128lool, it doesn't seem something we would say no to but neither somebody we are likely to work on16:02
seb128lool, note that GNOME has a gnome-panel dbus version in the work16:02
seb128lool, could be worth to try how it behaves16:03
loolseb128: Since 3 years?   ;-)16:03
seb128lool, no, it's in git, it has been done in the previous months it seems16:03
loolseb128: What I care about here is more that we don't end up with desktop's panel and mobile's panel16:03
seb128vuntz said he wanted to land that around now16:03
waltersi'd be shocked if the IPC had much to do with memory consumption16:11
waltersbut apparently no one actually sits down and analyzes the heap, they just run "ldd | wc"16:11
walterseasy, simple, and wrong16:11
ograwalters, no its surely not IPC ... there is just a lot of bloat started we dont need in the above case and while we want some of the indicator apllet stuff we dont really need gnome-panel or all of the libs sitting in ram on a 256M system without accelerated X16:14
waltersif you haven't done any actual measurements, you're very likely to be wrong about what's taking up space16:15
ograi have bootcharts that show the efl launcher being up after 15secs while the panel still loads things maxing out the CPU16:16
ogranote that the stuff i'm talking about is nearly static and doesnt load much external libes16:17
waltersnow you're talking about startup speed, which is totally different from memory consumption16:17
ograi'm talking about both :)16:18
ograthere is some connection on an ARM system with 500MHz, 256M ram and running from SD ;)16:18
rickspencer3hi Nafai16:41
pittihey rickspencer316:42
NafaiHi rickspencer3, pitti16:42
rickspencer3pitti, turns out tremolux started yesterday!16:43
rickspencer3I thought he was starting next week :/16:43
pittitremolux: oh, welcome!16:43
tremoluxpitti, rickspencer3:  thanks!16:44
pittitremolux: you'll be the new software-center hero, right?16:44
rickspencer3tremolux, can you fill pitti in on your plans for this week?16:44
Nafaitremolux: new on our team?16:44
tremoluxpitti: hehe, that's the plan  :)16:44
tseliottremolux: hey, is this permanent?16:44
tseliotor a rotation?16:45
tremoluxNafai, tseliot: yep, at the end of my rotation I moved full-time to desktop to continue working on software-center16:45
seb128tremolux, hi!16:45
tremoluxseb128: howdy!16:45
* ogra applauds tremolux 16:45
tremoluxhaha, thanks everyone16:46
tseliottremolux: ah, congrats then :-)16:46
tremoluxI'm very pleased to be here, thanks everybody16:47
Nafaitremolux: Awesome, welcome!16:47
NafaiLook forward to meeting you next week!16:47
chrisccoulsonwelcome tremolux :)16:47
tremoluxNafai: me too  :)16:47
tremoluxchrisccoulson: thanks Chris  :)16:47
pittigood night everyone!17:05
chrisccoulsongood night pitti17:05
seb128'night pitti17:05
glatzorbye pitti !17:06
seb128time to go there too17:06
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dobeykenvandine: ping?18:56
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dobeypitti: are you around, or travelling (or preparing to travel) to BRU?19:44
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jcastrochrisccoulson: have you seen rick?19:56
chrisccoulsonjcastro, he was online earlier19:57
jcastrothere's a desktop Q+A session for openweek in 4 minutes19:57
dobeyjcastro: he's probably on a plane?19:57
seb128jcastro, we are there19:57
jcastrooh ok19:57
seb128jcastro, rick tries to get online19:57
jcastrowho is representing the team so we can add voice?19:57
seb128jcastro, we do a desktop team joined session19:57
seb128didrocks, rickspencer, me19:58
seb128jcastro, rick is there20:00
jcastrowhoo hoo!20:00
jcastrook the +v's will get fixed here in a minute20:00
ccheneyanyone know if bug 574050 is an upstream issue or something to do with our integration?20:40
ubottuLaunchpad bug 574050 in totem "totem detects HDV video but doesn't seem to know it can play it" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/57405020:40
ccheneyi'm pretty sure its not really totem at fault but is it gstreamer in general, or something else?20:40
Nafaino clue from me :)20:41
Nafaithough it does seem related to gstreamer20:41
ccheneywould it be gstreamer at fault for not knowing it already could play the file and then in totems case actually play it anyway20:42
ccheneyseems like maybe pitivi may be doing some additional checking and refusing to import, instead of just going along like totem does20:42
seb128ccheney, upstream issue in any case we do no change there20:45
ccheneyseb128: ok20:46
seb128try #gstreamer for questions though or #pitivi if that's a pitivi issue20:46
ccheneyseb128: seems to be rooted in gstreamer issue and pitivi probably is just using return codes from gstreamer properly while totem isn't (pure guess on my part)20:47
ccheneyit complains but works in totem and complains and refuses to do anything in pitivi20:47
dobeyseb128: hey. do you think it would be possible to get ubuntuone-client 1.2.1-0ubuntu2 into -updates from -proposed? the bug has been changed to verification-done20:47
seb128dobey, when did it get uploaded? pitti reviews the queue almost daily but standard delay is 7 days20:48
dobeyseb128: originally on Apr 21, as the patch was supposed to go into lucid final, but apparently there was some confusion with the upload queue then, and the older verseion got accepted to lucid. i think it made it to -proposed "5 days ago" according to LP20:49
seb128ok, so 2 extra days20:50
dobeyok :-/20:50
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asachmm ... do we know if mvo disabled the hardy -> intrepid upgrade path?21:52
asaci mean intrepid is EOL ... does its archive still exist?21:52
jpdsasac: It's been moved to old-releases shortly.21:53
asachmm ... but do we still offer the hardy->intrepid>jaunty ... upgrade path?21:55
asacor just hardy -> lucid LTS/LTS upgrades?21:55
jpdsasac: Interesting point.21:57
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