jdongajmitch: hmmmm hmmmmmmm, well I remember watching in amusment when temugen was figuring out what muttrc only changed colors of some emails...00:28
jdongbut I don't know how I can qualify that as serious data loss, denial of service, etc etc etc00:28
jdongbut at the same time the patch is so simple I can't fathom what'd go wrong (famous last words)....00:29
jdongI'd say ask for a second opinion for the SRU00:29
jdongif this were an esoteric Universe package I'd honestly say yes, but given that this is mutt, I'm a bit more careful.00:29
ajmitchbut given that it's a patch that's from upstream, and in lucid via debian?00:31
=== wgrant_ is now known as wgrant
jdongajmitch: if I say yes, would you have my back if someone WTFs me? :)00:46
* ajmitch uses mutt every day, but not on karmic :)00:47
jdongawesome :)00:48
jdongmutt hasn't exactly changed in the last decade *ducks*00:48
temugenthere were a lot of other upstream patches, though :P Not sure what for since mutt is usually rock solid. I can't believe I actually ran into that coloring bug00:48
jdongtemugen: hahaha I'd rather not go candy-picking, let's just take care of ones people stumble into.00:49
temugenjdong: I agree :)00:49
jdongtemugen: it's no fun to fix a bug until you can point and laugh at someone who was affected00:49
jdong(KIDDING, kinda)00:49
jdong(don't quote me exactly)00:49
* ajmitch pastes that into the LP bug00:50
TheMusojdong: You still using a macbook?01:02
jdongTheMuso: yes sir01:02
TheMusojdong: Are you aware that grub2 now allows an easier way of setting the intel SATA controller to AHCI?01:03
TheMusoThat is, if you still use a machine with an Intel SATA controller.01:03
jdongTheMuso: oh, said Macbook with the Intel chipset has been retired to the folks01:04
jdongTheMuso: but that's awesome to know01:04
jdongTheMuso: new Macbook Pro has far more amusing gripes about jack sense and those fun topics :)01:04
TheMusojdong: Yeah, the setpci command/module allows things to be adjusted so.01:04
TheMusojdong: I am sure.01:04
jdongTheMuso: ah, nice. Yay GRUB201:06
jdongTheMuso: have you ever been scared about all the functionality they're putting into bootloaders these days? :)01:06
TheMusojdong: No.01:06
jdongTheMuso: 5 years ago it would've been a joke, but now.... how long will it be before my bootloader supports ssh'ing or a busybox shell?01:07
TheMusoAnyway, I now use grub2 for my 2008 mbp to enable AHCI.01:07
directhexi wish grub2 would stop adding non-functional osx entries01:11
TheMusodirecthex: Yeah, we should try and address that somehow...01:11
jdongI've never tried any of those entries but assumed they hilariously don't work.01:11
directhexgarbage IME01:12
directhexi chain load grub2 from refit01:12
jdongI don't like the switch of hotkeys either for bringing up the menu01:12
jdongI was doing technical review for a new edition of a Ubuntu book...01:12
jdongand now there's a hilarious number of "if you're using Legacy GRUB.... if you're using GRUB2....."01:13
RAOFjdong: Yeah, they hilariously don't work.01:14
jdongwhoo! hilarious! :)01:14
directhexdid anyone see my tinkering?01:15
imbrandonwhat tinkering ?01:16
RAOFThe themeing tinkering?01:18
directheximbrandon, http://imgur.com/AHlSI01:18
* imbrandon looks01:18
directhexRAOF, precisely01:18
imbrandondirecthex: grub2 ?01:18
directheximbrandon, aye01:18
imbrandonnice, i was tinking with some animated plymoth things01:19
imbrandonuntill i unterly broke my booting01:19
imbrandonshould have done it in a VM01:19
imbrandondirecthex: isnt grub2 hidden by default in lucid though ?01:19
directheximbrandon, yeah, unless you re-enable it, or have multiple OSes01:20
mannyvwhat would be the new version  for an SRU on opendchub 0.8.0-5?01:21
imbrandondirecthex: :)01:21
directhexmannyv, you generally wouldn't SRU directly to lucid, you'd have a fixed version in maverick01:22
mannyvdirecthex, there is an exploit in opendchub 0.8.2 that will give a shell, in 0.8.0 it will not give a shell but it does crash the deamon01:25
directhexmannyv, have you filed a security bug? that's a good start01:25
ScottKWith a patch is even better.01:29
mannyvits been fixed upstream, and in sqeeze and I wanted to try brining the fix into lucid01:29
mannyvmaverick should be fine because the patch will be autosynced01:30
ScottKDoes the new upstream release just fix this issue or does it include other stuff too?01:30
mannyvScottK it is a new version, moves from 0.8.0 to 0.8.201:31
ScottKHow about 0.8.1 to 0.8.2?01:31
ScottKFor a post release update we need just the fix for the security issue.01:31
mannyvScottK, I don't see a 0.8.1 either in LP or BTS01:33
mannyvso should I will file a bug report with the patch and a schroot test build/install against lucid?01:33
ScottKmannyv: How about upstream?01:34
ScottKYes.  That would be great.01:34
mannyvok i will do that then come back =)01:34
mannyvI still dont quite get what you are asking about 0.8.101:34
imbrandonwe try to make sru's as little as possible, only fixing the issues, new versions are fro -backports normaly01:35
imbrandonbut if its security its a whole nother ball game01:35
imbrandonspeaking of ball games, nixternal, you watchin the sox and royals playin ?01:36
psusitemugen, I can't get a mouseover to work on that svg, though I can see the file names when I look at the raw svg01:49
jdongpsusi: browser?01:55
psusijdong, chromium or firefox01:55
jdongwhich chromium?01:55
* jdong grumbles about more browser fun01:55
psusididn't know there was more than one01:56
jdongpsusi: ah so many builds of chromium01:56
temugenhehe my chromium renders it on mouseover :-/01:56
jdongstable (windows-only), beta, dev, SVN nightlies, ... ... ...01:56
jdongI'm guessing temugen runs the dev channel01:56
jdongpsusi: add-apt-repository ppa:chromium-daily/dev?01:56
imbrandongoogle-chrome ftw ;)01:57
psusihrm... ok01:57
temugenpsusi: view-source:http://svg-whiz.com/svg/Tooltip2.svg or you can add that <script> tag to the svg01:57
temugenthat will use the title tag that's already on all of the blocks and give you a big and pretty tooltip :)01:57
* jdong can't wait for the HTML5 browser disparities to start happening01:58
jdongand wow what's up with the PPA lagtime01:58
jdong(err, OT)01:58
temugenpsusi: or I can have it autoadd the script for you, but it seems like something that the SVG renderer should take care of and not us01:58
* jdong semi-sarcastically brings up the idea of cashing in LP karma points for buildscores01:59
psusiI'm not quite sure what to do with that02:00
temugenpsusi: the script tag?02:00
psusicut everything in the script tag and put it where in the svg?02:01
temugenpsusi: http://pastebin.com/6G0CpedZ You should be able to copy and paste that just above the first <path element02:01
temugenI should probably test it out first to not send you on a goose chase :)02:02
psusididn't work... hrm...02:04
temugenpsusi: yea that's going to take a little more work :-/ hang on02:04
temugenlooking into it02:04
jdongpsusi: or you can just use a shinier newer chromium....02:05
* jdong has no idea what explains the same software not working on two machines the same way :)02:05
psusiohh?  let me update02:05
jdongpsusi: yeah that'd be my guess to the difference between your setups.02:05
jdongplus chromium is one of those things that does awesomely improve overnight (tm), running the dev channel on Linux is really nice.02:06
temugenpsusi: but if not, I just got the big tooltips working too (3 things to add, or I can add them in the template and you can bzr up, your choice)02:06
psusiok, upgraded to the new chromium, still no popup02:09
temugenpsusi: it's like a tooltip, you have to let the mouse sit there for a second02:12
temugenbut I assume you tried that already02:12
temugenso I'll start adding the script to the template02:12
psusithat other example page worked02:13
psusichromium sure does burn up a lot of cpu whenever I move the mouse over this thing though02:14
temugenpsusi: yes it does :P ok, you can update. I really prefer to keep this up to the renderer in the future, though02:18
temugenand note collision detection/whatever still burns through a core on my machine02:19
wgrantjdong: Er, the PPA build queues appear to all be under 90 minutes. Am I missing something?02:19
wgrantjdong: That's still bad, but not as utterly deplorable and inexcusable as it has been for the last couple of weeks.02:20
psusithere we go!02:20
jdongwgrant: oh is it still 90 minutes?02:20
jdongwgrant: I was uploading last week to 2 of my PPA's and the builds got estimated for 3 days and built in 2 or so02:21
wgrantIt should be down to 0 soon.02:21
jdongwgrant: and I noticed https://edge.launchpad.net/~chromium-daily/+archive/dev still has packages waiting for build?02:21
jdonguploaded 33hrs ago02:21
wgrantIt's still processing the backlog from the buildd-manager breakage this morning.02:21
jdongbut ah, glad to hear the queue is clearing up02:21
wgranti386 is still well behind.02:22
jdong"start in 9 hours"02:22
wgrantI guess there are tonnes of superseded dailies still to go, so it won't really be that long.02:22
wgrantIn a couple of months the dailies will be shuffled off into their own build pool, so they will disrupt and be disrupted less significantly.02:23
jdongah okay, cool02:23
psusison of a bitch!02:23
psusithey are bloody symlinks ;)02:23
temugenpsusi: OH DAMMIT02:23
psusithe file names listed in ureadahead --dump are symlinks, and the files they point to are left on the outer areas of the disk02:24
psusiI optimized the symlink instead of what it points to02:24
ajmitchobvious fix is "Don't Do That"?02:24
* psusi searches for ls flag to follow symlinks02:24
jdongtemugen: maybe it should upon encountering a symlink list.append(mentioned file)02:24
lifelesspsusi: realpath ?02:24
jdongtemugen: and ok actually getting ureadahead-like data on symlink (e.g. calling FIEMAP) is an exercise left to the reader.02:25
temugenjdong: well this isn't a problem with the grapher since the grapher reads directly from ureadahead02:25
psusilooks like I want ls -H02:25
psusinow let me try again with a -H thrown in02:25
jdongtemugen: oh ureadahead gives the name of symlinks but actually reads the right files?02:25
temugenjdong: that's what it sounds like02:25
* jdong slaps himself for doubting Keybuk.02:25
ScottKjdong: Aren't you supposed to be studying or something?02:25
jdongScottK: gah, the downside of a multitasking laptop. Thanks mom!02:26
temugenjdong: well, I'm not terribly certain actually...02:26
psusino, ureadahead reads the real file because that's what you get when you open() the symlink02:26
temugenpsusi: ok, that makes sense02:26
psusibut it gives the symbolic name in the pack file, which I was running ls -i on to get the inode number02:26
psusiand that got me the inode number of the link rather than what it pointed to02:27
temugenwell, you got half of the link types right!02:27
psusithere, put THAT list in your defrag and smoke it02:28
temugenpsusi: hrm?02:35
psusithe picture didn't change much...02:36
psusiwhen it says at ##### what is that number?  the block number?02:36
psusiI need to rebuild the pack file ;)02:36
temugenyes you do :P02:36
psusiit's not checking their actual location, rather just going with the pack file02:36
temugenyes exactly02:37
psusiwell, looking at it in debugfs, it certainly looks like this file is where it should be... guess I'll go reboot and rebuild the pack file, hehe02:37
psusinow that is a thing of beauty02:51
psusiand damnit, imageshack doesn't like .svg02:51
psusihad to convert it to png... http://img15.imageshack.us/img15/8039/afterl.png02:54
psusioh, and I think I found a bug in the sound system it booted too fast... only heard the last half of the startup sound02:55
psusilike it started trying to play it before the sound card was fully initialized02:55
ScottKI think we aren't going to slow the boot so you can hear the sound.02:56
psusilol... no, but it should wait to start playing the sound until it actually is initialized ;)02:57
psusilooks like ureadahead is now spending half of its total execution time in the big open() hole.. need to get that fixed and oh boy, total time spent in ureadahead should be less than 2 seconds02:58
=== nobawk is now known as nobawk|away
psusioh yea, forgot to throw my modified ureadahead into the mix...03:04
psusivery nice.... getting there now... just a little bit further to the 10 second mark03:13
psusiumm.... whoa...03:17
psusiI actually got it booting faster from the old rotational drives than my new ssd03:17
psusithat's.... fubar03:17
=== nobawk|away is now known as nobawk
pace_t_zuluhey guys i am trying to build gcc-4.2.3 on lucid ... i get the following error03:25
pace_t_zulupbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy: Depends: gcc-4.3-base which is a virtual package.03:26
pace_t_zuluobviously i am using pbuilder03:26
pace_t_zului can understand how a depend that depends on a later version of the package being built might be an issue03:27
nixternalimbrandon: I hate the sox!03:32
ScottKlucas: I think now'ish would be a good time for a baseline rebuild on Maverick.  It looks like the toolchain is mostly in place.  Any chance of that soon?  Will you be at UDS again?03:35
imbrandonnixternal: lol03:40
psusithere we go... keybuck was right... ureadahead was in hdd mode... had to fix that and now bootchart shows 5.1 seconds ;)03:48
ajmitchpsusi: 5.1 from grub to desktop?03:49
psusiajmitch, that's the time on the top of the bootchart... I think it stops counting once you log in03:49
ajmitchnot too bad anyway, I guess03:50
psusioddly, it was 5.1 seconds the first time, then I turned on auto login and tried again and it went to 7 seconds03:50
psusiI am GOING to get it down under 10 seconds on the rotational disks ;)03:50
* ajmitch would be happy to see < 30 seconds some days03:50
ajmitchthough I don't run bootchart, so I can't really tell what the actual time is03:51
psusiyou don't get that now?  outch...03:51
psusiapt-get install bootchart ;)03:51
ajmitchfrom 0.000000 to seeing fglrx spam in /var/log/dmesg is 38 seconds, I think03:51
psusinow I need to go file a bug about the login sound playing before the hardware is initialized, hehe03:51
psusiomg, do you not have ureadahead enahbled?03:51
* psusi doesn't use fglrx03:52
ajmitchthis is solely going from /var/log/dmesg, assuming that it's seconds in the left-most column03:52
psusiyea, that's the kernel monotonic time03:52
ajmitchso I don't know how much I can trust the numbers03:52
ajmitch[    3.986695] EXT3-fs: mounted filesystem with ordered data mode.03:52
ajmitch[   36.602443] udev: starting version 15103:52
ajmitchwhen it has lines like that (30-second jump there?)03:53
psusithis is lucid right?03:53
ajmitchit doesn't really make sense to me, and overall the laptop doesn't feel too slow03:54
psusiohh... laptop... SLOW hd03:54
ajmitchureadahead is installed, fwiw :)03:54
ajmitchprobably 5400 RPM, 320GB03:54
psusibut with a good defrag, and ureadahead, should be able to get down to ~10 seconds ;)03:55
ajmitchwhere good implies stable & tested :)03:55
ajmitchyou need to get your crack into maverick soon03:55
ajmitchalso, still on ext3 here, no ext403:55
psusiahh, that's another reason03:56
psusiupgrade to ext403:56
ajmitchwhich to do properly, involves moving all data off, mkfs, and move it back on?03:56
ScottKAh, the fun of moving back to syncing from Unstable.03:56
psusiureadahead gets slowed down by indirect blocks on ext3.. extents for the winz03:56
* ScottK went from 4 pending Universe merges to 25.03:57
* psusi smacks xchat for autocorrecting his use of "teh"03:57
ajmitchScottK: MoM is running?03:57
ScottKajmitch: Apparently.03:57
psusiajmitch, naw, you can use tune2fs to enable most of the new features and get most of the benefits... especially if you follow it with a chattr -R +e03:57
ajmitchpsusi: nice, I might grab a live CD & try it out03:58
psusibasically the only thing you can't flip on is flex_bg, which just makes fsck a bit faster03:58
* ajmitch doesn't seem to have many merges03:58
ajmitchand it looks like we need to go through & clean out the old comments from last time about sync bugs, etc03:59
ScottKFeel free to take libxml2.  I'm probably the last person here who should be caring about the Gnome xml library.04:01
temugenpsusi: heck yes!04:01
psusiajmitch, actually you don't need a livecd04:02
ajmitchI think I even uploaded that at one point in the distant past04:02
psusiajmitch, just flip on the bits with tune2fs and force a fsck on reboot04:02
psusitemugen, eh?04:02
ajmitchpsusi: that sounds too easy04:02
temugenpsusi: I just got a change to look at the fragraph and the bootchart; awesome job!04:02
jdongpsusi: *WOW* impressive graph!04:03
temugenpsusi: are you moving symlinks to the front as well?04:03
psusijdong, which one?04:03
jdongpsusi: your fragraph04:03
psusitemugen, no... since unless they are very long, they don't actually have any blocks04:04
jdongpsusi: now interesting question: What if you turn off ureadahead?04:04
psusijdong, ohh, right04:04
jdongpsusi: or.... replace it with a simple dd from start_block to end_block of=/dev/null?04:04
psusijdong, then it won't speed up your boot? ;)04:04
jdongpsusi: but your files are already so closely packed.04:04
psusijdong, basically that's what ureadahead should result in...04:04
jdongpsusi: butt what about your open() overhead?04:04
psusijdong, yea... so ureadahead should be able to slurp them up real fast04:04
jdongpsusi: or.... what about backgrounding ureadahead?04:05
jdongpsusi: tricking it to think that it's a SSD04:05
psusijdong, going to rework it to not bother open()ing at all04:05
jdongpsusi: but won't the next time the file need to be open()ed the same overhead be incurred once?04:05
psusinaw, backgrounding not good since you will get out of order reads while other things try to access stuff04:05
jdongpsusi: will seeking around that tiny ring be that big of a deal?04:05
jdongpsusi: your OS and disk firmware both have readahead/elevators ;-)04:05
psusiI need to modify the tracer to map the raw disk blocks each file uses, then append the directories those files live in to the list04:05
psusithen at boot time, call readahead() on the raw block device to slurp up the directories, AND the files04:06
psusiall in one gigantic sequential read04:06
psusirather, right now it maps the raw blocks to figure out the order in which the files should be read04:07
psusiI just need to use the raw address to pass to readahead() on the raw block device during boot instead of passing the file relative addresses to readahead() on the file04:07
psusibut yea, you still want the directory blocks read too so that when the file is really open()ed it is there... so need to get the tracer to add the directories themselves to the pack04:08
psusithen it should be about 1-2 seconds of pegging the disk as max, and done.04:08
* psusi beats the hell out of lp04:09
psusiany idea how to search for a bug that mentions foo AND bar?  not OR?04:10
psusineither foo AND bar nor +foo +bar work04:10
ScottKpsusi: Google.04:10
temugenpsusi: so how exactly are the symlinks laid out in ext3/4? I thought they were generic files unlike hardlink inode additions04:11
psusitemugen, ext2+ stores the link destination in the inode if it is short enough to fit, no external blocks needed04:12
temugenpsusi: ah, awesome! I didn't know that. thank you :)04:12
psusithink it was 30 or 40 characters04:13
ScottKYokoZar: Would you please look at Spring and either upload a merge or request a sync.05:59
YokoZarScottK: will do05:59
persiaOr better, go push anything outstanding into DG VCS, request an upload and *then* request a sync.06:00
gladkHi, all06:10
gladkSorry, I am new in packaging, and I am a little embarrassed with a very short debian/rules file, which was created by dh_make. Can anybody give me a link, where I can see an example of this new debian/rules? Thank you06:11
RAOFgladk: That'd be a debhelper 7 rules file?  It's pretty awesome, and, as you can see, pretty short :).06:15
gladkhttp://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ch-dreq.en.html#s-defaultrules it is here described06:15
gladkbut no examples06:15
gladkall faqs, what I have found are with long rules file06:16
RAOFSo, debian/rules is Just A Makefile™ with some defined rules.  The dh7 mini-rules file takes advantage of fallback rules.06:18
RAOFThe “%:” rule is “I'm a rule that matches anything.  If you can't find a more specific rule, call me”.06:18
arandIs the "Packaging and MOTU Q&A" session happening?06:19
RAOFIn the mini rules file, that just calls “dh $@”.  The $@ is a special variable, which contains the target of whatever the rule should be.06:19
micahgarand: 1 more hour06:20
RAOFSo, in this makefile, when you call “debian/rules build”, make goes “can I find a build: rule?  No.  Can I find a fallback that would match build?  Yeah, the %: rule.  That tells me to call ‘dh build’”06:20
persiaarand: In -classroom?  If it's scheduled now, the instructor may be busy: try asking questions here.06:20
micahgarand: or rather 40 minutes06:20
arandmicahg: Ah, ( right.. UTC != BST)06:21
dholbachgood morning06:40
micahgdholbach: do you have a few minutes to chat about daily builds?06:41
dholbachno, I'm sorry06:41
dholbachbut later on we can - I have not much experience with the topic yet06:41
dholbachthere might be others who know much more about it than I do06:41
micahgdholbach: I saw you scheduled the blueprint for the daily builds discussion for lucid06:41
dholbachjames_w for example, but I guess he's not up yet06:41
dholbachmicahg: yes, I need to prepare myself for these06:42
micahgdholbach: not about making them, about integrating into Ubuntu workflow06:42
dholbachyes, the idea being that lots of teams benefit from them already, so we try the spread the word about them and see if we can improve things, etc.06:43
dholbachI haven't investigated the procedure much yet06:43
micahgdholbach: well, we were thinking of building a release type picker for mozilla products (daily, beta, stable) and I was wondering if this is something to discuss as a global thing at your session or if I should make a separate session06:44
dholbachmicahg: I think we should talk about it there06:44
dholbachmicahg: it'd be great to hear more about best practices and this seems to work well for you guys06:45
micahgdholbach: k, then I'll plan to attend your session then and bring it up06:46
micahgdholbach: thanks06:46
dholbachmicahg: thank YOU :)06:46
YokoZarScottK: did you have any insight into the Wine issue I showed you earlier?07:24
* imbrandon wakes up07:44
imbrandoni hate it when i only sleep for 3 hours and then wake, makes for a long day07:44
imbrandonmoins dholbach07:45
dholbachhi imbrandon07:45
ajmitchhi dholbach, imbrandon :)07:46
imbrandonheya ajmitch07:47
imbrandonajmitch: havent heard anything from "jak" yet :(07:47
ajmitchthere's no rush there07:48
imbrandonoh i know, was more to let you know, i'm the impatient one :)07:48
imbrandoni still havent touched software-center though and am hesitant to put up a "repo" to test without it07:49
imbrandonhas openweek already started today ?07:52
imbrandonbzr lp-open ?07:54
ajmitch:0:> bzr help lp-open07:55
ajmitchPurpose: Open a Launchpad branch page in your web browser.07:55
ajmitchUsage:   bzr launchpad-open [LOCATION]07:55
imbrandonhrm, what if it wasent a on lp to begin with ?07:56
ajmitchthis is for working with ubuntu package branches07:56
ajmitchif it's not on LP, you don't need to do that to submit merge proposals :)07:56
ajmitchsince you'd just be pushing a new branch07:57
imbrandonguess it would work for things that have upstream mirrored on LP too07:59
ajmitchif the branches have a common ancestor to merge08:00
persiait's Patch Day!  Anyone with time to help review patches, please come to #ubuntu-reviews and join in!08:00
* imbrandon will come review some in a few, goona check whats going on in -classroom incase he is intrested08:01
=== baddog is now known as Guest27073
=== Guest27073 is now known as baddog
Laneypersia: please add me to ubuntu-sponsors08:40
toabctli want to build modemmanager from the git-repository. i cloned the repository and copied the debian/ dir from modemmanager-0.3 to the git-reprository. if i try to build with "dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc -rfakeroot" i got the following error:config.status: error: cannot find input file: `po/Makefile.in.in'08:41
toabctlmake: *** [config.status] Fehler 108:41
toabctl 08:41
toabctlany ideas?08:41
imbrandontoabctl: is there an autoget.sh ? rcs checkouts are normaly not prepared to build right away without some prep work, like autogen and/or configure08:44
imbrandondepending on the type of source08:44
toabctlimbrandon, yes, there's a autogen.sh08:44
imbrandonrun it, then try to build08:45
toabctlimbrandon, should i first execute ./autogen.sh and then try to build the package?08:45
imbrandonyes, since you did a checkout instead of using the upstream tarbal08:45
persiaLaney: done.  Thanks!08:46
toabctlimbrandon, now it works. thanks!08:47
toabctlnext question is how to name the package in debian/changelog . it's a git-checkout so i should mention this in the version? is there a version-name-guide anywhere?08:48
persiaThere isn't a version guide.08:48
persiaMost people tend to do things like 1.2.3+gitYYMMDD or similar.08:49
persiaWhere 1.2.3 is the last released version.08:49
toabctlpersia, ok. thanks.08:49
toabctlpersia: and then without 0ubuntu1 or something like this?08:49
persiaOh, the stuff after the '-' is the same.08:50
toabctlwould be "modemmanager (0.3+git20100506) lucid; urgency=low" correct=08:50
persiaSo 1.2.3+git20100506-0ubuntu1 would work.08:50
imbrandonand your new tar you carefuly craft would be modemanager_0.3+git20100506.orig.tar.gz for version modemanager (0.3+git20100506-0ubuntu1~tobactl1) lucid;08:54
=== nobawk is now known as nobawk|away
=== nobawk|away is now known as nobawk
Rhondabug #576287 needs someone from the ubuntu-sponsors team to look at it :)09:27
ubottuLaunchpad bug 576287 in wesnoth-1.8 "Sync wesnoth-1.8 1:1.8.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/57628709:28
sebnerRhonda: depending on how long you can wait :P09:39
toabctlhow can i configure if modemmanager starts or not? when i kill it, it will be restarted every time. i want to start it manually with the --debug option.09:46
Rhondasebner: Not for you to be approved into the team. ;)09:47
* persia notes that sebner *is* a sponsor09:48
RhondaI can be your Debian sponsor, sebner :P09:49
=== mathiaz_ is now known as mathiaz
persiasebner: So, are you looking at that (or will you soonish?), or ought someone else?09:55
sebnerpersia: I'm willing to look but I can't create a maverick  pbuilder :(10:22
sebnerRhonda: ;D10:23
persiasebner: What's not working?10:24
Rhondasebner: What's the problem?10:24
sebnerpersia: I: Installing core packages...10:24
sebnerW: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/cache/pbuilder/build/2062/. dpkg --force-depends --install10:24
sebnerE: debootstrap failed10:24
RhondaCan you create a lucid pbuilder, do a pbuilder --login --save-after-login and change the sources.list?10:24
* persia tries a schroot build10:25
* sebner tries10:26
RhondaWhen I can't bootstrap directly I usually take the chroot from the former release, copy it and change the sources.list and then do a regular --update10:27
sebnerRhonda: well, I never had problems, OTOH I never created a pbuilder that soon in the dev cycle (toolchain not ready etc)10:31
ograpersia, are you aware that http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/ftbfs/ still points to lucid ?10:44
ograsomeone should probably change the default :)10:44
ograbecause maverick is of intrest now ?10:45
persiaUntil the archive opens, there's little point, and it's better to focus on SRUs.  http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/ftbfs/maverick.html is boring.10:45
persiaShortly after archive-open, all the lucid FTBFS packages will get retried, and that page will be interesting again.10:45
persiaAnd then it makes sense to change the default.10:46
persiaSo, unless something strange happens, the default will probably change sometime this weekend.10:46
persiaBut needs stable toolchain first, which, if nothing else, probably needs a fix for eglibc on armel :)10:47
persia(but that''s already being investigated by the toolchain folks)10:47
persiaOh, and gcc on ia64 would be helpful :)  I'm not sure why kdeplasma-addons was tried: seems early for that.10:48
l3onHi all... I'm trying to packaging a lib for ubuntu (karmic) but I have some problems with SHLIB in amd64 (i386 is fine). There are known issue for SHLIB in amd64?10:49
imbrandonpersia: you are a schroot user correct ?10:49
persial3on: Not for me.  Could you be more verbose?10:50
persiaimbrandon: Yes.10:50
persiasebner: My maverick schroot created fine.  Maybe try a different debootstrap-mirror?10:50
sebnerpersia: bah, kk. Will try later10:51
imbrandonpersia: i'm trying to get it to export DISPLAY=:1 on schroot login, i cant figure out a way to acatualy make it work, do you auto set your display for X programs ?10:51
persiaimbrandon: Have you tried with just `schroot -p ...` ?10:52
imbrandonyes :(10:52
l3onpersia: yes of course... take a look at build logs here -> https://launchpad.net/~l3on/+archive/dtn2/+packages10:52
persiaHow didn't that work?10:52
l3onpersia: in particular liboasys10:52
persial3on: oasys?10:52
imbrandonpersia: i';m not sure, probably because outside the chroot i the DISPLAY is not :110:52
imbrandonand -p preserves the env10:53
l3onpersia: yes10:53
persiaimbrandon: How about `DISPLAY=:1 schroot -p ...`10:53
imbrandonthat was the next step, then there was putting "export DISPLAY=:1" inside a script and calling schroot /path/to/script/inside/chroot10:54
imbrandonalso failed to set it ( or even run the script )10:54
persial3on: So, which variable isn't being set, and how?10:54
l3onpersia: in Makefile I see this:10:54
persiaimbrandon: OK.  If you set DISPLAY=:1 manually inside the schroot, does it work?10:55
sebnerpersia: same failure with lucid, I guess my connection is bad as it failed to retrieve some packages10:55
persiasebner: Aha.  That makes sense.  Best of luck!10:55
carstenhimbrandon: DISPLAY=xy schroot -c sid -p works10:55
imbrandonpersia: yes10:55
imbrandoncarstenh: hum ...10:56
l3onpersia: this is the Makefile -> http://dtn.hg.sourceforge.net/hgweb/dtn/oasys/raw-file/375fcbb4b5c4/Makefile10:56
l3onpersia: look for "installlibs"10:56
l3onehm... installlib10:56
persial3on: So, how is SHLIB_EXT defined?10:57
carstenhimbrandon: though I'm still using 1.2.x, newer version might behave different10:57
l3onpersia: this is realy funny. The configure script could enable-shlibs, but there is no effect. SHLIB_EXT is defined in Rules.make as "" (null). This in amd64, in i386 instead all works fine, and I have shlibs without do give to configure --enable-shlibs option.11:00
imbrandonpersia / carstenh: http://paste.ubuntu.com/428866/11:00
persial3on: You may want to add a bunch of echo statements, and then compare the two build logs carefully.  Something is arch-specific, and it's specific to that code.11:01
sebnerpersia: Rhonda , DktrKranz is willing to do it after lunch :)11:01
l3onpersia: I'm not so expert in packaging, have you 5 minutes trying to find out the problem?11:02
imbrandonpersia: we ever hear anymore from the fella doing the linux-rt stuff? i offered to review his stuff , gave him my email and such and never heard anything yet11:03
persial3on: It would take me ~20 to prepare the environment to compare.  You needn't be an expert: just compare the build logs side-by-side until you find a difference.  Then add `echo ${SHLIB_EXT}` in a few places to try to narrow down where it is/isn't being set.11:04
persiaabogani: imbrandon is looking for you ^^11:04
l3onOk persia :)11:04
persial3on: Once you find the part that is different, come back, and we can probably help you find a way to fix it.11:05
imbrandonpersia: thanks11:05
carstenhimbrandon: schroot has a debug option11:08
persiaimbrandon: I can't replicate (and I've tried lots of different ways).  http://paste.ubuntu.com/428871/ demonstrates my experience.11:09
imbrandoncarstenh: k i'll look for it now, i have to run for a few hours ( maybe shorter ) thanks for the input though ( its anoying to export the display every time , lol )11:09
persiaimbrandon: You might want to look at dropping some scripts in /etc/schoot/ then :)11:10
imbrandonpersia: k, might be something buggy with my homedir mounts too, since i have the same use and home inside and out of the chroot so .Xauthorty might be finky11:11
persiaimbrandon: Play with echo first.  Once you are sure you're setting the variables you need, then try to use them :)11:11
imbrandonyup yup11:11
imbrandonk got to run, thanks for all the great pointers11:12
lucasScottK: I will be at UDS. will do a rebuild during it11:13
sebnerRhonda: bahhhhh, 1.8.1 not in unstable ... *waiting*11:16
ricotzLaney, hello, any response on the docky SRU?11:16
sebnerhio ricotz :)11:16
ricotzsebner, hi11:16
sebnerricotz: .3 will be bugfix only I guess, if important stuff I guess there is no problem with a SRU11:17
ricotzsebner, yes, 2.0.x are bugfix-only releases and indeed it includes important fixes ;-)11:18
sebnerricotz: heh, I know, I uploaded 2.0.1 :P11:19
sebnerricotz: btw, suggestion: Theme changes should include also the docky dock icon, I want to have the blue one, not the brown one but I don't want to use clearlooks theme in ubuntu :P11:22
ricotzsebner, hopefully directhex finishes soon ;-) and an SRU member confirms it for lucid :P, until the same game for 2.0.4 ;-)11:22
directhexoh, docky11:23
directhexfine fine11:23
* sebner waves at directhex :D11:23
ricotzdirecthex, hi, yes, docky git tree seems to be ready ;-)11:23
sebnerricotz: git tree? Our git tree is up to date (2.0.2) but you use bzr on LP, or am I missing something?11:24
directhexupdaing my pbuilder11:24
ricotzsebner, http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-cli-apps/packages/docky.git;a=shortlog11:24
sebnerricotz: yeah, that's our git tree ;)11:25
ricotzsebner, the docky icon is colored with the selection color to better blend in, not sure we gonna change that, it is possible to change the color with a gconf-key11:28
sebnerricotz: ohh, I totally missed that is already out :D why the .1 btw?11:29
* sebner searches gconf key11:29
sebnerricotz: value 187 is brown? What's blue then?11:30
ricotzsebner, there was a problem with 2.0.3 release11:30
ricotzsebner, this value shifts your selection color, so you need to try11:31
* sebner tries11:31
sebnerricotz: with clearlook the value is 7 but it doesn't change when using my theme :(11:34
directhexsebner, you want to update to .1 before sponsoring i guess11:35
directhexoh, Laney did it already11:35
directhexman, i'm just crap at computers11:35
sebnerdidrocks: yep, Laney is our speedy gonzales :D11:35
ricotzsebner, try a negative value11:36
sebnerricotz: no change11:36
directhextest building11:36
sebnerdirecthex: lucky you, I can't even set-up a pbuilder ¬_¬11:37
ricotzsebner, we dont have gconf live updates, so docky should not run while change values manually - http://wiki.go-docky.com/index.php?title=GConf_Settings11:38
sebnerricotz: ohoho!11:38
* sebner kills docky11:39
* sebner hugs ricotz :D11:40
sebnerricotz: works now, had to use a negative value though11:40
ricotzdirecthex, how strict is the debian cli policy since docky is started with "exec mono ..." instead of "exec /usr/bin/cli ..."?11:40
ricotzsebner, good :)11:41
sebnerricotz: well, we can patch it (or are we doing it already?)11:41
ricotzsebner, it is not patched yet, just a thought11:42
sebnerricotz: policy is law :P http://pkg-mono.alioth.debian.org/cli-policy/ch-appendix.html#s-wrapper-script-example11:43
directhexricotz, it's not something i ever remember to check11:52
directhexmeebey on the other hand may notice and grump at you11:52
aboganiimbrandon: I'm just start to work on linux-rt for Maverick. :-)11:55
Rhondasebner: What, not in unstable?? Is.12:08
Rhondasebner: What is http://packages.debian.org/unstable/wesnoth-1.8 otherwise?12:09
sebnerRhonda: bah, QA site sucks :P12:09
Rhonda… or did you fall into the pit of the different source package again?12:09
sebnerRhonda: my tools pulled 1.6.5 though :P12:09
Laneyricotz: is there already another version planned?12:09
Rhondasebner: wesnoth != wesnoth-1.812:10
LaneyI don't want to keep updating lucid all the time12:10
sebnerRhonda: ohohoo! You have to tell me such things :P12:10
sebnerLaney: 0.3.4 says LP12:10
Rhondasebner: The bugreport said wesnoth-1.8. I thought it would be useful to put it in there. :P12:10
Laneywe don't routinely update12:10
sebnerRhonda: /me = stupid, 300 MB?!?!?!?!?!?12:11
sebnerRhonda: bah, *that* will take some time12:11
ricotzLaney, hi, there is a milestone set, but without plans to release12:11
Rhondasebner: Good art isn't for free. ;)12:11
Laneyok then12:12
Laneyricotz: you can fix the wrapper upstream, no hurry12:12
sebnerLaney: btw, imho the last remaining bits for pinta is copyright. Bareftp is more urgent now so you would have to wait 1-2 days if you don't want to do it12:12
Laneywhat do you want to do with the copyright?12:12
sebnerRhonda: bah :P12:12
sebnerLaney: update12:12
Rhondasebner: No, for real. But yes, the music is most of the size, images are also a fair amount.12:13
sebnerLaney: maaaaaaaany new files, http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-cli-apps/packages/pinta.git;a=commitdiff;h=1f2ff34f970d97d2df9e776e80efccba49fa660a12:13
ricotzLaney, sorry, the wrapper wont be updated, we not only support debian12:13
sebnerricotz: then we have to patch it12:13
Laneywhat's the problem?12:13
sebnerRhonda: well, takes some time time12:13
Laneysebner: you can do it, i'm not interested in that12:14
sebnerLaney: I thought you :P lazy Laney12:14
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Laneywell they should be covered by the default12:14
sebnerLaney: new author ;)12:14
Laneylike i said, not fussed12:15
* sebner throws rotten tomatoes at Laney :P12:15
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Breaking_PittHello guys13:10
Breaking_PittI have a lot of packages to do so every time I try a new one it comes with a different error13:11
Breaking_Pitthow can I avoid this error file-in-unusual-dir usr/local/lib/python2.5/site-packages/13:11
POXBreaking_Pitt: --prefix=/usr13:13
POXbut first of all, you have to use python2.5 from package, not the local one13:14
Breaking_Pittsorry POX ?13:18
POXBreaking_Pitt: Please paste output of: ls -la `which python2.5`13:18
Breaking_Pittone moment please13:19
Breaking_PittPOX -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 1175796 2010-01-24 17:09 /usr/bin/python2.513:22
POXplease pastebin your debian/rules13:22
=== effie_jayx_ is now known as keffie_jayx
l3onpersia: hi... around? :D13:37
Breaking_PittPOX I have decided that I will buil it from scrach when you want to build a package for a library using dh_make you select single binary or library?13:40
=== Breaking_Pitt is now known as Breaking_Lunch
POXBreaking_Lunch: depends on the type of package :P, `man dh_make` should have some info about it (I don't use dh_make), for python modules it will be single binary most probably (I'd use py2dsc instead of dh_make, though)13:44
ScottKlucas: Glad to hear you are coming.  It'll be good to see you again.13:49
ScottKYokoZar: No.  Got distracted.13:49
philpsanyone know how to programmatically determine what disks are usb flash drives14:54
philpsor maybe this is the wrong room.  let me know.14:54
ScottKIt may be that #ubuntu-app-devel (or something close to that) is better.14:55
philpssounds good14:56
lavluhi, i want to submit one package to ubuntu repository. the .deb package is fully functional. install fine and work fine. what should i do now ?15:05
ScottK!REVU | lavlu15:05
ubottulavlu: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU15:05
lavluthanks ScottK15:06
sebnerpersia: around for a SRU question?15:17
ScottKnhandler: Did you get a chance to look at that patch?15:21
sebnerThere is a crasher bug in bareftp 0.3.1 (which we have in lucid),  0.3.2 is bugfix only except translation updates, new 0.3.3 fixes this crasher bug but has also new features, what do you suggest?15:23
sebnercherry pick the crasher bug fix or go with 0.3.2+fix?15:23
lfaraonesebner: what sort of bugs?15:24
sebnerlfaraone: http://pastebin.com/imE1q9Ux15:26
ScottKsebner: I suggest just the crash fix.15:29
sebnerScottK: sure?15:29
lfaraonesebner: "    + Improved drag'n drop. More user friendly on multiple selection" reads like a new feature.15:30
ScottKMinor bug fixes don't fit SRU criteria.15:30
sebnerlfaraone: that's a bug for me :P15:30
sebnerScottK: aye aye then15:30
lfaraoneHow should a debian package handle depending on iceweasel? (should it be "iceweasel | firefox | abrowser" ?)16:01
micahglfaraone: yes16:03
micahglfaraone: be careful with version requirements of firefox if appropriate16:04
ScottKmicahg: Why can't firefox provide iceweasel?16:05
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ScottKNo versioned provides would be one good reason, bit it'd save a lot of modifying packages.16:06
micahgScottK: That's a good question, I defer to asac or chrisccoulson16:07
micahgspeaking of asac: (10:05:39 AM) ScottK: micahg: Why can't firefox provide iceweasel?16:08
chrisccoulsoni don't see any reason why firefox couldn't provide iceweasel16:09
ScottKThat would certainly cut down on the number of packages that need merging.16:10
micahgchrisccoulson: should I add that to the general team discussion for UDS?16:11
chrisccoulsonmicahg - yeah, can do16:12
micahgchrisccoulson: just subscribed you also16:12
Breaking_PittI'm getting this error some advice? make[1]: *** No rule to make target `clean'.  Stop.16:39
lfaraoneScottK: maybe I'm missing something: how can we SRU something if it can't be fixed in the development release until maverick opens up?16:40
ScottKlfaraone: pitti will pocket copy from lucid-updates to maverick when it does.16:41
Breaking_PittI'm getting this make[1]: *** No rule to make target `clean'.  Stop.17:04
Breaking_Pittsome advice please?17:04
ScottKYou need to have that target.  Why make thinks you don't is impossible to know without seeing the makefile in question.17:07
Breaking_Pittis the debian/rules created by default by the dpkg-buildpakage17:08
Breaking_Pittand has a clean: entry17:08
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
Breaking_PittScottK, http://pastebin.com/94kAsFCe this is my rules file17:11
ScottKThat's a fragment of your debian/rules file and not your debian/rules file.17:13
Breaking_Pittok here it goes again http://pastebin.com/ksyGQ8DE17:14
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Breaking_PittScottK, can you see something wrong?17:19
ScottKSorry, I'm tied up with something else ATM.17:19
alketthe current version of Bluefish in Ubuntu Universe is 1.*.* but in 15 March Blufish 2.0 came out17:29
alketwhen it is going to be an update ?17:29
alketanyone ?17:31
astraljavaMight take a while. Debian unstable still has 1.0.7, so syncing to Maverick won't make it. Someone should package the latest version.17:32
alketastraljava thank you for response17:33
astraljavanp :)17:34
mannyvI have had a go at my first potential security update if anyone has a moment would you mind providing feedback? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/opendchub/+bug/57650718:09
ubottuLaunchpad bug 576507 in opendchub "OpenDcHub 0.8.1 Remote Code Execution Exploit" [Undecided,New]18:09
persiamannyv: For security-specific feedback (and procedures), #ubuntu-hardened may be more appropriate. (although I'm looking now)18:10
mannyvpersia, ok thanks18:10
persiaI'm not 100% sure, but I *think* you want -5ubuntu1 for maverick and -5ubuntu0.1 for lucid.18:12
persiaAlso, I *think* you want to target lucid-security18:12
keesboth true18:12
persiaThe patch itself would benefit from application of http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep3/18:12
mannyvyeah i was pretty certain i got the versions wrong18:13
persiaBased on the disclosure, it looks like prior versions are unaffected, but I believe it's best practice to attempt the exploit and see if they also need patching.18:14
persiadapper has 0.7.14 and the rest have 0.7.1518:14
mannyvok so next steps for me would be to a) attempt on 0.7.{14,15}, b) create a seperate debdiff for each affected version, c) fix patch tagging ?18:16
lfaraoneIs "lshell impropely handles shell expansions" a SRU-worthy fix? ("ll -a" -> "ls -l-a" rather than -> "ls -l -a")18:18
lfaraone... at the same time, there's a security flaw in lshell that needs fixing apparently. Should these be separate uploads to the different pockets?18:19
ScottKlfaraone: Ask the secuirty team in #ubuntu-hardened.  I had one recently they said to put throught the SRU process first and then they'd also put it out through -security.18:24
RainCTgeser: uhm good question, now that you mention it I have no idea what resolution those screens have. In any case, way more than enough :P19:54
persiaNo such thing.19:56
* RainCT is confused. persia: was that for me?19:57
RainCTah that there is not enough resolution?19:57
persiaHuman vision is about 60750x40500 pixels.19:58
persiaNobody makes displays like that.19:58
persiaActually, more like 80000x40000, but as two overlapping 60000x40000 fields.19:59
RainCTWell, I suppose there isn't much to gain with 40.000 pixel displays20:01
persiaWell, you only need that resolution if you've built a 1" display and have it against your eye.20:02
persiaFor a standard monitor position, you only need about 9000x45020:03
persiaErr, 9000x4500.20:03
persiaAnything less and it's distinguishable from non-rendered objects.20:03
persia(well, depends on display size, distance, etc.)20:03
* persia fails at math *again* : ~9000x6750 (at 4:3)20:04
steevhey all, I've got an issue with WINE and I need a newer openal (1.12.854 which was released in March) No problem I thought, I did a builddep of libopenal1, grabbed the patches and the 1.12.854 sources... but now for the life of me, I cannot seem to get it to create packages with the correct version # - what am i missing that I need to change?20:08
persiasteev: I'd recommend starting from the Ubuntu openal sources, and running `uscan` in the package directory.  This will create a new source package with the new openal.20:10
ScottKYokoZar: I answered your wine question in the bug.20:34
steevpersia: is there a 1.12.854 sources somehow?20:36
persiaupstream.  All the packaged ones I know about got deleted.20:37
persiaBut like I said, it's one command to create a packaged 1.12.854 source.20:37
persiaJust download the current lucid source, and run `uscan` in the package directory.20:37
anotengAnybody care to enlighten me on why a precompiled binary in the source, installed with debian/install file gets corrupted? The size of the file is reduced from 2,7mb to 208 bytes? according to file, it's still a 32bit ELF binary though...20:38
persiaThis will download the upstream sources, and prepare a (separate) packaged directory with the udpated sources.20:38
persiaanoteng: dh_strip maybe?20:38
* anoteng reading manpage20:38
steevpersia: hot.  that is awesome20:40
ari-tczewwhile using command 'dch -i' output target is lucid - is it correct (instead of maverick)? my distro is lucid20:41
persiaari-tczew: In my experience, it defaults to the target of the distribution you're running.  You want maverick if you are trying to upload to maverick.20:41
imbrandonprecompiled binary in the source ? eww, why would you do that20:44
anotengpersia, adding export DEB_BUILD_OPTION="nostrip" to the top of the rules file should do the trick then right?20:44
anotengimbrandon, i know it's not a good thing, but upstream insists...20:44
imbrandoncant be put in te archive either iirc20:45
persiaanoteng: Something like that.20:45
imbrandonnot just "not a good thing" but like very very very very very bad in 99% cases ( unless you are bootstrapping a new compiler )20:46
anotengI know, I'm just trying to get the package working for know, then I'll make a policy compliant package later..20:46
ScottKimbrandon: If it's distributable, it could go in Multiverse.20:46
persiaanoteng: Under what license is this source?20:46
ScottKThen don't use the pre-compiled binary.20:47
imbrandonjust out of curiosity what software is it ?20:47
persiaanoteng: Typically GPL3 software can't be distributed in compliance with the license with precompiled binaries.20:47
anotengDamnVid, a python application.20:48
anotengok, maybe I'll try again to talk him out of it then..20:48
persiaanoteng: The only way I know that would make it possible would be to compile another copy of the precompiled binary at build time, do a bitwise comparison to ensure the created binary was the same artifact as the precompiled binary, and then fail the build if it wasn't.  Otherwise, you can't know that the sources you distribute create the binary you distribute, which is a requirement of GPLv3.20:49
imbrandonanoteng: what is the precompiled binary ? ffmpeg ?20:49
persiaNote that the original authors of software are *not* bound by these requirements, as they hold licenses other than those they offer to their users.20:49
imbrandonanoteng: no no no no, dont include ffmpeg in the source, esp precompiled20:49
imbrandonno no no20:49
* imbrandon chants more20:49
anotengmkay... will drop it then. But the application has some paths hardcoded. Do I need to patch the source, or can I simply make links?20:51
imbrandonanoteng: is there a reason it cant link against the normal ffmpeg ?20:51
imbrandonanoteng: patch it20:51
imbrandonand repack the tarbal +dfsg if it has the ffmpeg binary in the upstream tar20:52
anotengI guess it's just to make life easier for the author, debugging etc.20:52
psusianyone got any idea what could be causing this? Unable to obtain lock lp-69637264:///~psusi/ubuntu/lucid/ureadahead/mine/.bzr/branch/lock held by psusi@bazaar.launchpad.net on host crowberry [process #19287]20:52
imbrandonmakes life hell for everyone else though20:52
anoteng+dfsg ???20:52
psusilocked 5 hours, 13 minutes ago20:52
persiapsusi: Ask in #launchpad, but bzr break-lock seems to be the commonly-suggested solution.20:52
psusihrm... k... the help file says not to use it unless you are sure the process is dead20:53
imbrandonanoteng: debian free software guidelines , e.g. remove the non-free bits from the tar, its a sticky situation for a first package20:53
persiaanoteng: Debian Free Software Guidelines: used to indicate that you've packaged a special derived version of the upstream source that has been modified to comply with http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines20:53
anotengok, thanks everyone...20:54
imbrandonanoteng: now that you have peaked my intrest if you have any problems getting this "right" lemme know i should be mostly avail to help ya20:55
anotengimbrandon, thanks...20:55
ari-tczewI'm preparing a merge @maverick, and I want to use a bazaar instead deprecated debdiffs. What I must to do? get current ubuntu branch or debian branch?20:58
ScottKari-tczew: debdiffs aren't deprecated.20:58
ari-tczewScottK: ok, so now is trend on bazaar20:58
ScottKShifting to distributed development via bzr is a long term goal.  The current tool set works better for some aspects of development than others.20:59
ScottKThere's decent wiki documentation on merging with bzr, but personally I find it a lot more complex.  Don't let me stop you though.21:00
geserari-tczew: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment/Documentation has some documentation on how to merge with bzr21:00
imbrandonScottK: open the maverick archives already mr admin , lol j/k i konw you have -0- control over that21:08
ScottKimbrandon: Pleanty of SRUs one could do in the meantime if you need your upload fix.21:09
imbrandonive looked through some, most are packages i wouldent feel comfortable touching /me looks again21:10
persiaimbrandon: There's a few hundred FTBFSs, plus RCBugs that always needs attention.21:10
persiaSame as prerelease rush, except SRUs.21:10
imbrandontrue, i forgot ftbfs was a valid sru21:10
persiaFTBFS is a fairly critical bug, especially as all the binaries got deleted :)21:11
* persia was given a hint on dvipsk-ja today \\o/21:11
imbrandonis lucas's list fairly updated or is the one on qa.uw.o better ?21:11
ScottKari-tczew: In Bug 576592 you said that a sync was appropriate because all changes have been forwarded to Debian.  It would be appropriate if all changes have been incorporated in the Debian package you're asking to have sync'ed, just forwarding them isn't enough.  I suspect this is a language issue and that's what you meant.  Please clarify in the bug.21:13
ubottuLaunchpad bug 576592 in twisted-conch "Sync twisted-conch 1:10.0.0-3 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/57659221:13
ScottKimbrandon: Lucas' list shows everything that failed a rebuild test.  Ubuntuwire just shows onese where the last in archive build failed.21:14
geserimbrandon: both lists should be pretty up-to-date21:14
ScottKMost of the removed binaries are in lucas' list, but not the uw one.21:14
geserimbrandon: or do you mean the FTBFS page for the rebuild archive on qa.uw.o?21:14
ari-tczewScottK: so do I have to change explanation to: all changes have been incorporated in the Debian package ?21:14
ScottKari-tczew: A comment in the bug is fine.21:15
ari-tczewScottK: I thought about explanation: 'Packages are the same' as well, would be good?21:16
ScottKari-tczew: "all changes have been incorporated in the Debian package" is clearer.21:16
ari-tczewScottK: ok, I'll remember21:17
bilalakhtarwhat is the process to become a motu?21:23
ubottumotu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU21:25
bilalakhtarpeople, what is the process of becoming a motu?21:29
sebner!motu | bilalakhtar  ;)21:29
ubottubilalakhtar  ;): motu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU21:29
ari-tczewbilalakhtar: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU#So%20you%20want%20to%20be%20a%20MOTU?21:30
pochu!motu | ubotu21:31
ubottuubotu: motu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU21:31
pochu!motu | ubottu21:31
ubottupochu: motu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU21:31
pochuheh, I wanted to DoS it :-)21:31
ari-tczewpochu, you're hardcore :D21:31
bilalakhtarsebner: I mean after a person becomes a contributor, what is the process after that?21:32
bilalakhtar!motu > ubottu21:32
ubottubilalakhtar, please see my private message21:32
ari-tczewsebner: please throw red tomatoes at ... :P21:33
sebnerari-tczew: nah, only at hyperair and Laney :P21:34
bilalakhtarred tomatoes?21:34
ari-tczewyhy :(21:34
sebnerbilalakhtar: nah, rotten ones21:34
bilalakhtaris this an !ot going on?21:35
sebner!OT | bilalakhtar21:35
ubottubilalakhtar: #ubuntu is the Ubuntu support channel, for all Ubuntu-related support questions. Please use #ubuntu-offtopic for other topics. Thanks!21:35
ari-tczewbilalakhtar: did you found how to become a motu?21:35
bilalakhtarari-tczew: somewhat21:35
hyperairsebner: why meeeeeeeeeeeeeeee21:35
ajmitchhyperair: why not?21:36
sebnerhyperair: you can take it :P21:36
bilalakhtar!ot | sebnar21:36
ubottusebnar: #ubuntu is the Ubuntu support channel, for all Ubuntu-related support questions. Please use #ubuntu-offtopic for other topics. Thanks!21:36
bilalakhtarI wanted to send that to you21:36
bilalakhtari mean sebner21:36
hyperairajmitch: meanie.21:36
hyperairsebner: 20 points if you can aim tomatoes into my mouth.21:36
hyperairsebner: -100 if you hit anywhere else.21:37
* bilalakhtar throws a tomato into hyperair's mouth on behalf of sebner 21:37
* bilalakhtar gets 20 points21:37
hyperairom nom nom21:37
sebnerhyperair: hmm, rotten tomatoes are not consistent enough during the flight, You'll get hit all over your body :P21:37
bilalakhtarhyperair: you like rotten tomatoes?21:37
hyperairbilalakhtar: er i've got a time machine embedded in my mouth that reverses the time of the tomatoes.21:38
bilalakhtarbye then, so long21:38
sebnerhyperair: I added black magic to them, your time machine doesn't work! :P21:39
ari-tczew!OT | $ALL21:39
ubottu$ALL: #ubuntu is the Ubuntu support channel, for all Ubuntu-related support questions. Please use #ubuntu-offtopic for other topics. Thanks!21:39
hyperairsebner: i've got a magic nullifier integrated in the said time machine21:40
persiaUm, let's not do that again.21:40
sebnertz tz tz, bad hyperair21:40
persiaThe right answer is something like "Well, you apply to the DMB to be MOTU.  See the bottom of the wiki page".21:40
ari-tczewbilalakhtar: I saw that you didn't make any package, so just start contribute to ubuntu21:40
sebnerari-tczew: hrm, too late ;)21:41
ari-tczewsebner: heh, too young21:41
ari-tczewhmm, I tried to merge package using bzr, please someone who is the mastermind in bzr merging to check my work bug 52139021:44
ubottuLaunchpad bug 521390 in junitperf "Merge junitperf 1.9.1-7 (main) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/52139021:44
ajmitchari-tczew: it may not matter for that one, but we're grabbing stuff from unstable again for maverick21:45
ajmitchlooks like it's -7 in testing & unstable anyway21:46
ari-tczewajmitch: I know, but this is residue from lucid development. I'm lazy for changing it due to the same package in testing / unstable21:46
* hyperair redirects the blame to sebner21:47
ajmitchari-tczew: ok :)21:47
* ajmitch just wishes the generated diff was against the debian branch21:48
sebnerhyperair: EHHHHHHHH????21:48
ajmitchbut I don't know if there's anything we can do to change that, it only makes sense for these merges21:48
* hyperair chuckles21:49
ari-tczewajmitch: I did following: bzr branch lp ubuntu... then bzr-merge lp debian... then do changes necessary for merge sense then bzr add resolve commit... then push and request a merge. is it ok?21:50
persiaajmitch: There's a way to get LP to give you that (assuming the branches are imported as I think they are), but it takes something like 14 clicks (at least last time I tried, with different branches).  It's often easier/faster to generate locally.21:50
ajmitchari-tczew: I don't know, I'm still not familiar enouugh with it all ;)21:50
ajmitchafaik there are various tools like bzr merge-package, debcommit which we're to use21:51
ari-tczewajmitch: yea, massacre21:51
ari-tczewI think that my merge is OK, but I'm waiting to response from mastermind of bzr21:52
ari-tczewmaybe geser?21:52
ajmitchit looks to be ok21:52
ari-tczewajmitch: do you will take it to sponsor? ;-D21:53
ajmitchthough when I click on the diff, I don't see the change in debian/ant.properties listed in the changelog21:53
ari-tczewajmitch: because diff which you saw is based on current ubuntu branch, so in current ubuntu's delta we have debian/ant.properties file21:54
ari-tczewI think that, maybe I'm wrong, so correct me21:55
ari-tczewdebdiffs are not hard like bzr :(21:55
ajmitchyeah, I think you're right there21:56
ajmitchthe general case for making packaging changes is that we want to see changes against the current ubuntu branch, it's only here that I want to see the diff against debian21:56
* ajmitch grabs branches to check21:56
ari-tczewajmitch: before doing a bzr merge, I'm doing merge based on debdiffs dsc dsc > .debdiff, then I'm applying debdiff to bzr branch21:58
ari-tczewso I got a debdiff, I can attach to bug, but I think that is beside the point21:58
ajmitchthat sort of defeats the purpose of trying to use branches21:59
ari-tczewhonestly I don't see a sense to merging bzr.22:02
ajmitchI'm sure there is a point, we're probably just doing it wrong :)22:02
ari-tczewThis extends the time of our work22:02
maxbKeeping full history of packaging changes can be very useful22:02
maxbI'm really liking merging in bzr now22:02
maxbSure, it takes some time to absorb the bzr koolaid22:03
ari-tczewmaxb, my question: merging bzr is a merge code of source package? or merge a revisions as well?22:04
maxbI'm afraid I can't understand your question22:04
ari-tczewlol, so, you've got a 2 bzr branches. In ubuntu and in debian right?22:05
ari-tczewyea cool, maxb please look at:22:08
ari-tczewbzr is splitted on: revisions changelog and source code22:09
ScottKmaxb: Since each upload to the archive is a separate commit in bzr, even if you ignore bzr for merging, updating, etc, we are now keeping a full history.22:09
ari-tczewwe're merging a source code right? but what about revisions changelogs?22:09
persiaari-tczew: WHat do you mean by "revision" in that question?22:10
maxbari-tczew: I'm still having difficulty understanding what you mean. I have no idea what you mean by "bzr is splitted on: revisions changelog and source code" at all22:10
* ari-tczew doing like rageman22:11
ari-tczewI mean revision's changelog like22:11
ari-tczewRecent revisions22:11
ari-tczew5. By Thierry Carrez on 2009-09-0222:11
ari-tczew    * debian/control, debian/rules: Build with default-jdk22:11
ari-tczew    * debian/control: Runtime depend on headless JREs22:11
ari-tczew    * Added debian/ant.properties to force java2 code generation22:11
ari-tczew    * debian/control: Policy fixups:22:11
ari-tczew      - Bump debhelper to version 5 (also in debian/compat)22:11
ari-tczew      - Add ${misc:Depends} to Depends22:11
ari-tczew      - Set default section to java22:11
ari-tczew      - Move clean target deps to Build-Depends:22:12
* ajmitch points to mr pastebin for your problems22:12
ari-tczewok, please close this discuss thread, you won't understand what I mean22:14
persiaari-tczew: Do you mean the data from `bzr log` or the data in debian/copyright?22:14
ari-tczewpersia: yea bzr log, that's right!22:15
maxbThe merge looks fine to me, except that "Force java2 code generation" is a poor way to describe "Compile with Java 1.4 source and target version."22:15
maxbFurthermore, it would be useful to have some indication of whether using 1.4 is a higher or lower version that would be used by default, and when that ubuntu-local change could be dropped22:16
ari-tczewmaxb: is modeled on the antecedents22:16
maxbIt is part of the job of anyone doing a merge to look for opportunities to discard Ubuntu-specific changes where reasonable22:17
ScottKand make sure ones that are appropriate to Debian have been sent there.22:18
ScottKnhandler: Did you get a chance to look at that patch?22:18
ari-tczewpersia: who will decide about MOTU applications on next DMB agenda 11th May?22:20
persiaSame folk as usual.22:20
sebnerpersia: *you* created a maverick shbuild successfully, right?22:23
persiasebner: Yes, a nice fresh one, just when you asked.22:23
sebnerpersia: it seems there is a general problem with pbuilder. As I'm a little bit ill I'm heading to bed now, would you mind doing the sync request of wesnoth? (In fact just needs a testbuild, rest is fine)22:24
persiasebner: http://people.ubuntu.com/~persia/pull-soyuz-chroot needs a pbuilder hint, but can be a shortcut to get a chroot.22:25
persia(but yeah, I'll testbuild)22:25
* sebner is off then22:25
maxbari-tczew: So in summary, your branch is fine, you just need to provide the debdiff between the debian version and your branch, and explain that the launchpad diff in the merge proposal is the diff between the existing ubuntu version and your merge, not what the reviewers have assumed it to be22:26
persiaReally no.22:27
persiaIf one is going to use the bzr method, one should use it entirely, and do a merge-proposal.22:28
maxbpersia: There *is* a merge proposal22:28
ari-tczewmaxb: I don't believe.22:28
persiaThe sponsor should then *completely ignore* this merge proposal, and use bzr diff between the Ubuntu and Debian remote branches.22:28
persiaOr rather the *candidate* and Debian remote branches.22:29
ari-tczewthen I f|_|ck this due to too long work. don't have time for statistic22:29
persiaIf one uses the debdiff method, there's not much point to fiddling with bzr in the first place, unless one happens to like how bzr merges work.22:29
persia!ohmy | ari-tczew22:29
ubottuari-tczew: Please remember that all Ubuntu IRC channels share the same attitude of providing friendly and polite interaction with all users of all ages and cultures. Basically, this means no foul language and no abuse towards others.22:29
ari-tczewpersia and other, sorry22:30
ari-tczewI conclude that bzr merge is theft of time22:30
ari-tczewI like work on bzr with SRUs or security updates22:30
ari-tczewbut merging between distros... sorry, no22:31
maxbbzr merge is fine and good, the problem is when sponsors aren't comfortable with bzr merging22:31
persiamaxb: Rather the annoyance is that the merge proposal is completely useless to the sponsor.22:32
ari-tczewpersia: where can I find a history of DMB  agenda meetings?22:33
persiaari-tczew: ubuntu-devel-announce@ archives is your best source22:33
persiaOr check the wiki history22:33
ari-tczewyea, wiki history is good optin22:35
MTecknologywhat's up with this version number having 2 ubuntu parts to it?
ari-tczewwhat about changes on upgrading jaunty -> lucid? can I drop it for maverick?22:42
maxbMTecknology: someone Doing It Wrong? :-)22:43
MTecknology!info snmpd | maxb22:43
ubottumaxb: snmpd (source: net-snmp): SNMP (Simple Network Management Protocol) agents. In component main, is optional. Version (lucid), package size 927 kB, installed size 1220 kB22:43
MTecknologymaxb: I'm guessing would have been right?22:44
maxbI see what's going on22:46
maxb  * Repackage upstream tarball to re-add the MIBs: even if they are not modifiable (which is questionable), this is not a reason to keep them out of Ubuntu main.22:46
maxbThat is the critical changelog entry22:47
maxbSo in this case, the version number, despite looking weird, is actually correct22:47
maxbIt means:22:48
maxb[] An upstream tarball22:48
maxb[~dfsg] repackaged by debian22:48
persiaRepackaged to be DFSG-free22:48
maxb[0ubuntu1] repackaged again by ubuntu22:48
maxb[-0ubuntu2] and then packaged by ubuntu22:48
persiaNo, repackaged the *first* time by Ubuntu (otherwise would have been dfsg1)22:49
persiaBit it *should* be
persiaThat's a horrid misuse of ~22:49
maxbpersia: *No*22:49
maxbRepackaged first in debian. Re-repackaged in Ubuntu22:49
persiaWell, then the numbers are not only an annoying example of doing it wrong, but they happen to be the wrong numbers too!22:50
persiadfsg0ubuntu1 *should* mean repackaged in Ubuntu but not (yet) repackaged in Debian.22:50
maxbdfsg0ubuntu1 is the only reasonable thing to do when the debian repackaging is just 'dfsg' with no numeral22:51
persiaNo, that should be dfsgubuntu122:51
persiaAt least according to the way we usually do it.  See my wiki page for at least one way in which I find that completely wrong.22:51
persia(thankfully somewhat obsolete due to process changes in Debian)22:52
maxbNo, because if debian then *do* make a dfsg2, dfsgubuntu1 is still greater than dfsg222:52
persiayeah, but it should have been +dfsg1-1 in the first place.22:53
persiaAnyway, lots of folks doing it wrong, repeatedly, and again.22:53
maxbIdeally yes, but the ubuntu numbering is the best approach consistent with the current versioning in debian22:53
persiaI won't disagree, although it violates our "best practice" recommendations (see prior note about wiki page)22:57
maxbbest practice?22:57
persiaYeah.  It's documented in several places that we're supposed to add "ubuntu1" when first diverging.22:58
persiaWhich is what dch does by default.22:58
persiaSo if you have "1.2.3+dfsg" as a native package, dch will give you "1.2.3+dfsgubuntu1"22:58
maxbThat is an orthogonal issue. This is not a native package22:59
persiaOnly kinda.22:59
maxbOnly completely22:59
maxbInteresting and painful issue you highlight on your wiki page, though, hinging on a very obscure detail of how versions are compared22:59
persiaSo, the first ubuntu1 was added to the upstream version: if we ignore the part after the "-", it's the same as updating a native package.22:59
persiamaxb: It's not as bad anymore, because Debian changed how NMUs work, but yeah.23:00
ari-tczewwhat about changes on upgrading jaunty -> lucid? can I drop it for maverick?23:01
persiaYou suggest the insertion of a "0" as being least bad, which might be true, but it's different than just adding "ubuntu1", which is the recommendation in the context which was presumably used as an analogue to determine the version to select.23:01
persiaIn practice, most folk repacking in Ubuntu just use an upstream version following the rules that Debian would, without much regard for how it syncs/merges23:02
* persia has a list of several hundred packages with the *same* apparent version, but different orig.tar.gzs23:02
persiaari-tczew: Depends on the nature of the change.  If it's still required for someone with an original jaunty install, no.23:03
persiaAny upgrade from jaunty would have been lucid at some point, so if that takes care of everything so that the next upgrade doesn't need it, it can be dropped.23:03
ari-tczewpersia: ok so I'll drop it, I thought so. thanks23:04
maxbThe 'append ubuntu1' recommendation is regarding packaging changes rather than repacks, and incorporates the assumption that most/all version strings end with a numeric component, or, if they don't, the likelyhood of a numeric component being appended is very slim23:04
fabounetHello !23:05
fabounetwe have some bugs-fixs for Cairo-Dock, and we'd like to see them integrated on Lucid.23:05
fabounetHere is the bug report on LP :23:05
ubottuLaunchpad bug 576647 in cairo-dock-plug-ins "Please update Cairo-Dock with the following patches" [Undecided,New]23:05
maxbThe additional zero in the repacked tarball version here is insurance against the possibility of a second debian repack being labelled dfsg2 or somesuch23:05
persiaari-tczew: I didn't say drop it.  I said investigate and test.23:05
persiafabounet: With lucid released, the process gets a lot more complicated.23:06
ubottuStable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates23:06
persiafabounet: So, you need to show that a bug meets one of the SRU criteria, and provide test cases, etc.23:06
fabounetthey do :)23:06
persiaBased on the bug you show, I think you've a chance, but be aware it's complicated, and will need a lot of handling.23:06
fabounetwe have uploaded thepatches23:06
fabounetand give some indications on their critical level23:07
persiaRight, but you need to document the test cases, etc.23:07
persiaSee the procedure documentation.23:07
fabounetdo you have an example ?23:07
fabounetah, I see there are 2 examples23:08
fabounetso basically we just need to add a test case ?23:08
matttbepersia: who can verify our modifications? SRU Verification team?23:09
persiamatttbe: They will review the code changes, yes.  The process is (quickly): 1) update the bug with justification, details, test case, etc. 2) get it uploaded, 3) hear from the SRU team and address their concerns, 4) undergo the verification process, 5) get the update released.23:12
persiaBut see the wiki page for details.23:12
matttbepersia: thank you for this explanation!23:12
fabounetthanks, I've added the test cases23:17
persiaOK.  Next is a minor nit: you want to target "lucid-proposed" instead of "lucid" for a proposed SRU.  If maverick weren't frozen, you'd want to target "maverick" first, and *then* lucid-proposed (have to fix the latest release first)23:19
persiaYou wanted to have described "ubuntu-sru" rather than "sru-verification" (so subscribe "ubuntu-sru" now)23:21
persiaAnd be sure to nominate for lucid.23:21
matttbepersia: thank you, ubuntu-sru has been subscribed but I don't understand what I've to do in order to update Lucid and Maverick versions23:23
matttbeshould I have to add a tag lucid-proposed?23:24
persiamaverick is frozen right now, so no need to worry about that.  Next week, you'll want to fix any bugs in maverick before they can be approved to be fixed in lucid.23:24
persiaNope, you want the "nominate for release" link.23:24
persiaand then nominate for lucid there.23:24
matttbeok, I see23:25
persiaHeh.  The test case description doesn't make it easy for the verification team.  Is there any way to construct some artifical data that will force a crash?23:25
matttbefor most of them, it's easy to do the verification23:26
fabounetI think it's easier to just read the patch, than trying to reproduce the bug ^^23:27
fabounetthe patches are indeed very straightforward23:28
persiaOK.  Be warned the verification team may have comments :)23:29
fabounetok thanks for the advice :)23:30
fabounetI'll take the time to explain them then23:30
persiaThe key is that some members of the verification team are just testers, and may not be good at reading code.23:31
matttbeSo we just have to wait now? :)23:31
persiaIf there's a clear test case, that makes it easier for them, so it's faster to get verified.23:31
fabounetok, well 2 bugs are definitely not easy to reproduce (actually I couldn't reproduce them myself, I just guessed the cause thanks to the different bug-reports soem users made)23:34
matttbebut for these two bugs, we've just added a new test for some special case (e.g. if the WM is launched after Cairo-Dock)23:35
ubuntujenkinshello I have a package that I have made using a dir2deb script that someone suggested (i did check it first). I would like these two commands as the last thing when the package is configured sudo texhash /usr/share/texmf-texlive' then updmap --enable Map ccicons.map . How/where would i add them to get them to run?23:37
ubuntujenkinsany suggestions welcome23:38
persiaubuntujenkins: http://wiki.debian.org/MaintainerScripts23:41
ubuntujenkinsthanks persia I will get reading23:42
persiafabounet: matttbe: Looks like your bug is in a good state.  Now you just need a sponsor, so subscribe the sponsors team ("ubuntu-sponsors").23:44
=== nobawk|away is now known as nobawk
matttbepersia: thank you, I will do that23:44
persiaSomeone will upload, and then the SRU team will review, and then the verification team will verify, and then it will be published (or someone will comment along the way)23:44
ari-tczewwhen maverick will be open?23:45
ari-tczewI'm very impatient :P23:45
matttbeari-tczew: it's open :)23:46
matttbeari-tczew: http://uppix.net/9/9/0/0565c5d1be002bcfc7a10271afa3e.png23:46
ari-tczewmatttbe: are you sure? [00:24] <persia> maverick is frozen right now23:47
matttberepositories are open, I just have some updates like gcc23:48
matttbebut the upload is maybe frozen now23:49
matttbeI don't know23:49
maxb    Pre-release Freeze23:49
persiaRight.  Frozen.23:49
persiaUpoads work, but aren't required to be publised before pushing SRUs.23:49
ari-tczewbefore pushing SRUs? I don't understand. I'm interested in merges and syncs23:51
maxbI don't think you need to even upload to maverick to do a SRU, until the archive opens23:51
micahgpersia: also pitti has said that -proposed can be pocket copied to maverick if nothing newer has been uploaded23:51

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