[06:44] <ripps> Hmmm.... I'm considering upgrading to Maverick already. I'm getting antsy not having anything to upgrade and debug
[07:11] <nikolam> HM, I was thinking.. Could kernel be xen-enabled and with realtime options, at the same time?
[08:00] <LLStarks> stupid question. does openoffice need to be huge? could its functionality be replicated at 20MB or less?
[08:05] <Sensiva> LLStarks you may remove unneeded packages of openoffice
[08:06] <LLStarks> yeah
[08:06] <LLStarks> but it still occupies a lot of space on the iso
[09:13] <mrsun> ok im freakin tired of this
[09:13] <mrsun> computer starts working from the harddrive and the whole freakin OS is unusable for 5 minutes?
[09:13] <mrsun> even disconnected some internet connections etc
[09:13] <mrsun> WTF IS WRONG :/
[10:22] <Ian_Corne> mrsun: i'm guessing hardware failure?
[10:26] <mrsun> Ian_Corne, in what ? ... the compute rwas in perfect health before i installed ubuntu on it
[10:26] <mrsun> had same problem with ALL ubuntu machines
[10:26] <mrsun> whole os goes to hell as soon as hd starts working hard
[10:30] <SwedeMike> you have AHCI set for the sata controller in BIOS?
[10:56] <nikolam> I have similar problem on LTS 8.04 Whenever hig disk-intensive task is done, computer is useless. I run software raid1 on 2 sata partitions, 64bit
[10:57] <nikolam> someone told me its something sbout process priority thing or something and it partially fixed during package installs in new lts 10.04
[10:58] <nikolam> But talking about disk usage cheduler on other Os`es it is a general problem on all OS today, how to prioratize disk acces bandwith not to starve system/apps
[11:00] <Trewas> ext4 is very slow when a program uses fsync() a lot, like dpkg does
[11:00] <nikolam> mrsun,
[11:00] <nikolam> I had it with ext3
[11:01] <SwedeMike> yes, generally interactive performance goes to crap with lots of disk io, that's why I have separate system and data drives
[11:01] <vega> btw 10.04 discussion is in #ubuntu.. this chan switched to 10.10
[11:01] <nikolam> Think we would need for about 4 years at lease to have Btrfs and all goodies like additional flash drive for disk operations speedup etc
[11:02] <SwedeMike> I use SSDs for system drives, makes a huge difference.
[11:02] <nikolam> SwedeMike, you use NAS?
[11:02] <SwedeMike> nikolam: no.
[11:02] <nikolam> aha, separate drives in same computer
[11:02] <SwedeMike> nikolam: yes.
[11:03] <nikolam> vega, I heard about plans for Btrfs in 10.10 Hope till 11.x tere will be default etc
[11:04] <nikolam> SwedeMike, I was thinking, would something about that change if I use rt-kernel
[11:04] <SwedeMike> question is if btrfs will solve any of this, I'm sceptical.
[11:04] <SwedeMike> nikolam: I doubt -rt would fix anything.
[11:04] <SwedeMike> -rt is only for high precision local events.
[11:05] <nikolam> SwedeMike, yep, i was thinking to say 5 years for Btrfs to give significant and stable, but 4 sounded more optimistic
[11:06] <SwedeMike> interactive performance under load is all about speed/interactivity compromise, when they increase interactivity people complain about speed going down
[11:07] <Trewas> btrfs can't do any magic tricks to improve performance, but in 5 years most of the harddrives will be SSD which solves most of the problems
[11:07] <mrsun> nikolam, ive had it with every freakin filesystem ive tried
[11:07] <nikolam> Anyway, its only way to go now, so by end of 2011, I suppose it will be default
[11:07] <nikolam> Maybe best thing could be its ability to updafe FS version on diks, with existing system/data
[11:07] <mrsun> SwedeMike, wells tuff in RAM etc should not go to hell when the disk reads
[11:07] <mrsun> like network stack
[11:08] <nikolam> mrenouf, no sweat, its more of architectural/kernel problem and fs only add to it
[11:08] <mrsun> that it goes down so bad that it even disconnects internet sometimes cause of disk io ?
[11:08] <SwedeMike> mrsun: disconnects internet? how does that manifest itself?
[11:08] <nikolam> sounds to me separating disks to Nas/other machine and using iscsi to main machine might improve it or something
[11:08] <mrsun> SwedeMike, disk starts reading or writing or whatever, everything just halts
[11:08] <mrsun> cant even move mouse
[11:09] <mrsun> then it disconnects chat networks etc
[11:09] <SwedeMike> mrsun: if you get disconnected from irc then it just means the processes are not responding to keepalives, so yes, computer is busy with other things, it doesnt mean it disconnects your internet connection
[11:09] <nikolam> mrsun, internet have nothing to do with it, my net apps works fine during disk chalks
[11:10] <mrsun> nikolam, well mine dont
[11:10] <mrsun> it just halts the whole damn system
[11:10] <mrsun> nothing works more then the hd writes/reads that is going on
[11:10] <nikolam> mrsun, i guess something is wrong on your comp.
[11:10] <yofel> hm, maybe try to increase swappiness a bit instead of decreasing it, that should prevent the system from suddenly going completely useless as it will swap things that aren't used that often out in advance
[11:10] <nikolam> what ubuntu version do you run
[11:10] <nikolam> also how much ram and what apps etc
[11:11] <mrsun> nikolam, have same problem with two other computers with ubuntu
[11:11] <mrsun> 10.04 now
[11:11] <nikolam> because it is ubuntu+1 here, mainly for dev versions
[11:11] <mrsun> 2gb ram
[11:11] <mrsun> yes i saw you have moved the support
[11:11] <nikolam> #ubuntu might be beter place for release supported versions mrsun
[11:11] <mrsun> but to move to another channel and start asking same things again is just stupid as you are all knowing my problems now :P
[11:12] <SandGorgon> also try vm.overcommit_memory and overcommit_ratio
[11:12] <nikolam> dunno, I like to talk about future, Btrfs, such stuff :)
[11:13] <SandGorgon> I'd like to talk about future of linux sound - is it going to be Pulseaudio or does a low-latency framework like Jack make sense .. from a gaming + media standpoint
[11:13] <yofel> hm, I wonder if I should open a SDD trim thread on the forum, I set discard in fstab, but I don't really get how to check if it works, the only howto I can find results in me thinking it doesn't work
[11:14] <yofel> SandGorgon: we had a long thread about that a week ago on the ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list, add you 2 cents there
[11:14] <yofel> erm... *SSD
[11:14] <SandGorgon> yofel, all right
[11:14] <nikolam> I witnessed several times people uninstalling pulseaudio just to get audio working. I guess Apps are not doing good job catshing up with pulse or something
[11:15] <yofel> SandGorgon: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2010-May/thread.html
[11:15] <SandGorgon> yofel, gotcha.. thanks
[11:16] <yofel> nikolam: most things work fine as long as apps use pulseaudio, once they try to ignore it we get a mess...
[11:17] <nikolam> I never got to like those web-displayed mailing lists. I SO miss one frame on left, to browse messages in UsenetNews-like manner, like in Mail client
[11:18] <nikolam> yoasif, problem is those things get often dessynchronized, Development of system parts and all Apps etc
[11:18] <SandGorgon> yofel, ahh.. i saw the thread. I am more concerned with audio servers rather than low level audio (OSS4, alsa). However that a sound server is needed is a foregone conclusion  (http://linuxplumbersconf.org/2009/slides/Paul-Davis-lpc2009.pdf might be interesting )
[11:20] <yofel> oh, nice document, will read it later
[11:20] <SandGorgon> yofel, the more interesting post is this one - http://braid-game.com/news/?p=364 - written by Jonathan Blow of Braid. The comments are most illuminating w.r.t problems of game development in linux vs other platforms
[12:44] <BUGabundo> happy Sunday fellowers Mavericks
[13:02] <zniavre_> thank you BUGabundo
[13:03] <BUGabundo> zniavre_: for?
[13:23] <zniavre_> BUGabundo_lunch, bugGabundo> happy Sunday fellowers Mavericks
[13:39] <BluesKaj> Hey all
[13:51] <BUGabundo_lunch> zniavre_: :)
[13:51] <BUGabundo_lunch> hey blue-frog
[13:51] <BUGabundo_lunch> oops
[13:51] <BUGabundo_lunch> blueskaj is gone :(
[15:29] <BUGabundo> !ping
[15:29] <BUGabundo> !controls
[15:49] <alex_mayorga> join /ubuntu+bugs
[15:53] <BUGabundo> eheh alex_mayorga
[15:53] <alex_mayorga> BUGabundo: hello there!
[15:53] <BUGabundo> too many errors to fix with a simple sed :)
[15:54] <alex_mayorga> BUGabundo: ??
[15:54] <BUGabundo> (2010-05-16 15:49:16) alex_mayorga: join /ubuntu+bugs
[15:54] <alex_mayorga> oh! you mean my silly join
[15:55] <alex_mayorga> I guess it's just a sleepy Sunday morning :)
[15:55] <alex_mayorga> BUGabundo: already on meerkat?
[15:57] <BUGabundo> of course
[15:59] <alex_mayorga> BUGabundo: anything fancy or worth the move?
[15:59] <BUGabundo> sure... breakage :)
[15:59] <alex_mayorga> oh! yeah I miss that
[16:00] <alex_mayorga> but I still have slight breakage on lucid, so I'll stick around until it's fixed I guess
[16:00] <alex_mayorga> namely Bug #551668
[17:29] <yoasif> hey guys -- anyone around?
[17:29] <yoasif> i need some help/ideas on how to report a gdm/xorg bug
[17:39] <charlie-tca> yoasif: in maverick?
[17:49] <yoasif> charlie-tca, yeah -- lucid too
[17:50] <charlie-tca> This is what I use - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs
[17:51] <charlie-tca> If you know the package, in lucid you could try "ubuntu-bug PACKAGE"
[17:51] <charlie-tca> I don't know if it will work for Maverick yet
[17:51] <yoasif> yeah i know how to do that
[17:52] <yoasif> issue is that i don't know when to do that, and with no xorg accessible, there is no gui for ubuntu-bug
[17:55] <charlie-tca> so, you need to file it manually?
[17:55] <charlie-tca> You can go direct to launchpad to file it without ubuntu-bug using https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug/?no-redirect
[17:55] <charlie-tca> Here is a format I use for that - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Bug-Report-Layout
[17:56] <charlie-tca> It helps to get all the information in that is needed
[18:41] <xnguard> Is there a way I can add Maverick as a repo, but only consider it for certain packages?
[18:47] <arand> xnguard: With a lot of apt pinning, it might work, but I don't think it would be simple, downloading separate packages from LP/packages.ubuntu.com might be better.
[18:48] <xnguard> arand: Right, but the only way I can sorta keep up to date with newer releases is to set loads of pages up in Update Scanner and hope it catches new releases, then go download them. :D
[18:48] <xnguard> I'm doing it for Debian sid right now (much, much newer crypto libs), and, well... I was hoping there was a less horrible way.
[18:50] <arand> Ubuntu generally doesn't do mixed systems with different releases, looking for backports or PPAs is generally what works
[18:52] <xnguard> I know.  Sadly, no backports immediately visible for libnss3-1d or libncurses5 or some of the other stuff I'm looking for.
[18:54] <xnguard> I just suddenly wondered if I could do something clever and semi-elegant to mix in Maverick not-backports plus maybe some sid.
[18:58] <arand> It's likely possibly, but likely not elegant nor simple, nop safe.
[18:59] <xnguard> I can live without safe.
[18:59] <xnguard> Well, so far.  I mean, I run use Gentoo for a firewall. :D
[19:00] <xnguard> Ack.  "...use Gento ~x86..."
[19:00] <arand> Well, I'm not much help with my handwavey guesses though.
[19:02] <xnguard> I kind of suspect there actually isn't a way to do it in a semi-clean way.  I've spent the morning looking through the likely suspects, like the sources.list(5) manpage, forums, and so on.
[19:07] <nishanth> what does this mean.....(EE) VESA kernel modesetting driver in use refuse to load, it comes with a prompt saying ubuntu running in low graphics mode
[19:19] <nishanth> what does this mean.....(EE) VESA kernel modesetting driver in use refuse to load
 it comes with a prompt saying ubuntu running in low graphics mode
[19:20] <nishanth> is everyone dead?
[19:23] <SwedeMike> are you running 10.04 ?
[19:24] <nishanth> SwedeMike ; just upgraded to lucid
[19:24] <SwedeMike> nishanth: then you shouldn't ask in here ,this is for 10.10 only.
[19:24] <nishanth> isn't it a lucid support channel?
[19:25] <penguin42> nishanth: This channel is for the next ubuntu, since Lucid is now current it is now in #ubuntu
[19:25] <penguin42> nishanth: When Maverick becomes current it will also move to #ubuntu
[19:26] <nishanth> just a tangential question is it recommended to upgrade to meerkat now?
[19:26] <penguin42> no
[20:00] <DanaG> !find kdecorationbridge.sh
[20:01] <DanaG> !find kdecorationbridge.sh lucid
[20:01] <DanaG> er
[20:01] <DanaG> !find kdecorationbridge.h lucid
[20:02] <DanaG> ah
[20:07] <arand> DanaG: There's always apt-file you know ;)
[20:09] <jetole> Hey guys. Does anyone know where I can find a search engine applet like the one in the pic? http://www.canonical.com/files/masthead/ubuntu-light/light.jpg
[20:37] <kklimonda> engine applet?
[20:37] <kklimonda> ach, search engine :)
[20:37] <kklimonda> jetole: it's a unity-only feature for now
[20:37] <BUGabundo> ehe
[23:18] <Ken8521> are maveric iso's available for download yet?
[23:20] <duffydack> Ken8521, June 3rd
[23:20] <Ken8521> oh ok
[23:20] <Ken8521> will testdrive let me try one of the current ISO's?