[01:37] <ScottL> i added a patch to the ardour mute bug # 581786
[02:36] <ScottL> persia: i received an email from luis today with a +1
[02:37] <persia> Cool.  Sounds like you've collected the whole set, and win the prize :)
[02:37] <ScottL> lol, yeah, a whole set of responsibilities ;)
[02:40] <ScottL> however, i was also thinking of talking to #ubuntu-desktop tonight about the network-admin bug
[02:40] <ScottL> if there anything in particular i should point out to them persia?
[04:43] <ScottL> persia, TheMuso, jussi, i've almost finished my ubuntu membership application and I was wondering if you would be kind enough to write a testimonial for me
[04:43] <ScottL> i should be done with it either tomorrow or the following night :)
[04:44] <ScottL> lol, i see TheMuso is popular, he just got asked for an endorsement in -desktop as well
[06:19] <jussi> ScottL: well itd actually help if you linked us to your wiki page....
[09:48] <abogani> kernels don't built in PPA! Sgrunt!
[10:14] <abogani> persia: ^ :-(((((
[10:32] <abogani> persia, ScottL : https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/kernel-team/2010-May/010707.html
[11:36] <persia> What!  Why don't kernels build in a PPA?  I thought apw did this regularly.
[11:54] <abogani> persia: I received this error:
[11:55] <abogani> http://paste.ubuntu.com/439296/
[11:58] <abogani> persia: Moreover I don't think than apw really do it.
[11:58] <abogani> They release packages at http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/ (which it isn't launchpad).
[11:58] <abogani> I suppose that "ppa" should be removed for avoid confusion...
[11:59] <abogani> Perhaps kernel-ppa is the user who used for build kernels on Zinc (that is kernel.ubuntu.com)...
[12:04] <persia> abogani: He really does it: https://launchpad.net/~apw
[12:04] <persia> Hrm.  Timeouts suck.  Try uploading the regular kernel, and see if that makes a difference.
[12:04] <abogani> persia: Ok. Evidently their are some type of super powers.
[12:04] <persia> I have a feeling that either there's a special hack in launchpad, or something else is wonky.
[12:05] <persia> These are extendable :)
[12:05] <persia> Just need to track down the cause, and then the folks in #launchpad can sort it.
[12:05] <abogani> persia: I have already done it: If I remove -pae images it build. 
[12:06] <persia> Interesting.
[12:06] <persia> So it just takes too long?
[12:06] <abogani> persia: More than 10 hours.
[12:06] <abogani> On LP.
[12:07] <abogani> Obviously it build perfectly in two hours on my machine with pbuilder (variant=buildd)
[12:07] <persia> Yeah, and it gets killed after 150 minutes.
[12:07] <persia> Ask in #launchpad if there's something special for kernel builds that allows them to take longer.
[12:07] <persia> if not, we can add a script that just prints something every 30 minutes or so to prevent the timeout.
[12:10] <abogani> persia: Asked.
[12:11] <abogani> persia: You mean an infinite loop with a sleep and an echo  inside?
[12:12] <persia> I'd probably not use an infinite loop.  Make it exit after say 36 iterations (gives you 18 hours).
[12:15] <abogani> Sound really nasty trick
[12:18] <persia> It's definitely in the deep workaround category :)  Usually better to figure out why the build didn't print anything for 18 hours.
[12:18] <persia> Most of the time there's some buildsystem flag that makes it more verbose, etc.
[12:21] <abogani> DH_VERBOSE?
[12:21] <abogani> persia: Full log at http://launchpadlibrarian.net/49048008/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.linux-lowlatency_2.6.32-22.38_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[12:22] <persia> DH_VERBOSE only helps for the debhelper bits.
[12:23] <persia> You'd need something that made kernel-wedge copy-modules more verbose at the point where it appaers to hang for 150 minutes.
[12:26] <abogani> It could be very easy: place an "set -x" at top of the copy-modules should be work (and also add that file to the package changing also rules to point on this).
[12:27] <persia> that's a lot cleaner than the while/sleep hack.
[12:27] <persia> And probably more informative as to the cause of the underlying error.
[12:27] <persia> But I'd recommend checking to see if wgrant has any other ideas before just uploading that :)
[12:29] <abogani> If he continue to consider me...
[12:30] <persia> He knows more about the build system than the both of us combined.  You might suggest the -x trick and see what he thinks.
[12:30] <abogani> Ok
[12:30] <persia> he might have a different recomemndation, or want more time to think, or say "Go ahea and try".
[12:37] <ScottL> jussi, here:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ScottLavender
[12:37] <ScottL> i originally was waiting to give the link until i completely finished it, but i cleaned up the bottom of it enough this morning though
[12:37] <ScottL> thank you
[12:38] <abogani> Wow!
[12:38] <abogani> It seems very completed.
[12:42]  * abogani would want give thanks to all who correct his horrible English! Thanks!
[12:50] <persia> ScottL: contributions to Ubuntu Studio *are* contributions to Ubuntu.
[12:50] <persia> There's a reason we're part of a larger project :)
[12:56] <persia> ScottL: I don't sit on the board that will review your application (wrong continent), but excepting the false distinction between contributions to Ubuntu Studio and contributions to Ubuntu, your application is one of the most complete and compelling I've ever seen.
[12:57]  * abogani agrees
[13:00] <abogani> but my opinion don't worth much
[13:01] <persia> abogani: On the contrary.  You're an Ubuntu Member, so your testimonial carries considerable weight with the approval boards.  If you feel that way, please add a testimonial to ScottL's wiki page.
[13:18] <abogani> persia: For sure If someone review my English. :-)
[13:24] <quadrispro> ScottL, why don't you apply for MOTUship?
[13:25] <abogani> MOTUship?
[13:28] <quadrispro> abogani, to become ubuntu-developer
[13:30] <jussi> !motu
[13:30] <abogani> quadrispro: So perhaps it is a mentoring program?
[13:31] <quadrispro> abogani, there was a mentoring program, I think persia knows much more about it than me
[13:35] <abogani> persia: (re -preempt) I suppose than they meant "remove for main git tree".
[13:39] <persia> abogani: I know, and you know, but I want them to know that :)
[13:39] <abogani> persia: :-)
[13:39] <abogani> lol
[13:39] <persia> My fear is that they will decide they get to ignore it just because it's a different source package.
[13:39] <persia> And then leave known bugs in it.
[13:40] <quadrispro> bye guys
[13:40] <persia> I'm kinda against the mentoring program.
[13:40] <persia> I used to be a mentor (one of my mentees is in the channel), but I think folks who want to be MOTU do better just qworking with other MOTU.
[13:40] <abogani> It is exactly what I expect from them.
[13:41] <abogani> persia: ^
[13:41] <persia> That said, MOTU is *not* the only way to become a developer these days.
[13:41] <abogani> quadrispro: Ciao!
[13:41] <persia> abogani: That would be sad, really, but yes.
[13:43] <abogani> persia: I would want let you notice than I totally ignored in #launchpad (for build kernel in PPA) and in #ubuntu-kernel (for new kernel). What you would do in my shoes?
[13:43] <persia> I don't think you were ignored in #launchpad.
[13:43] <persia> I saw some traffic.
[13:43] <persia> That nobody who was around had a good answer is a different matter.
[13:44] <persia> At least two active Soyuz developers did talk to you about the issue.
[13:45] <persia> I've also seen a fair bit of commentary about the new kernel in #ubuntu-kernel.  If they folks there don't sponsor your upload, try pointing imbrandon at it (he said he was interested in that class of kernels)
[13:48] <abogani> persia: I _really_ more and more appreciate imbrandon help but ....
[13:48] <abogani> persia: Did you notice than kernel people have got a very big ego? If I bypass them I can incur in some problems in future...
[13:49] <persia> Most of them can't upload anything at all.
[13:49] <persia> Do you feel that the earlier discussion was sufficient that they expect a new kernel to be uploaded?
[13:49] <persia> Do you really think they care how it gets uploaded, as long as you work with them on it otherwise?
[13:53] <abogani> :-(
[13:53] <persia> What?
[13:53] <persia> It may be because I'm a bit distracted, but I'm not understanding the issue.
[13:58] <abogani> The issue is than I don't know what is the right way to do this things.  So I can't know how answer to your questions.
[13:58] <abogani> Simply I'm trying to do things in most reasonable way.
[14:03] <abogani> By the way, Anyone could review my English for Scott's application?
[14:08] <persia> In my opinion, the right way is to do what it takes to get stuff done, trying to involve as many folks as possible for comment in the process.
[14:08] <persia> And if anyone objects to anything, discuss it reasonably and get it fixed.
[14:08] <persia> Especially at the beginning of a cycle, it's usually better to just do stuff and then fix it.
[14:09] <persia> Things can be undone later, but once freezes begin to arrive, it's hard to do new stuff.
[14:16] <abogani> I agree with you but We should in two for "discuss". For example the last wgrant's suggestion was "abogani: You should prevent it from taking that long." It isn't seems a discussion to me.
[14:17] <abogani> scott-work: Dow you have a minute for me?
[14:18] <scott-work> abogani: certainly :)
[14:19] <abogani> scott-work: Could you review English on my comment about your application? :-)
[14:20] <scott-work> abogani: i am always happy to review your English on anything :)
[14:22] <abogani> scott-work: ;)
[15:50] <scott-work> *sigh*
[15:50] <scott-work> persia, i've attempted to talk to the #ubuntu-desktop people a few times about the network-admin bug and i'm not receiving much response
[15:50] <scott-work> i'm going to look for someone to contact directly unless you have a better suggestion
[17:09] <persia> scott-work: I'd recommend checking with the changelog owner for the changelog entry dropping the patch.
[17:09] <persia> If they don't respond, just do it (as it indicates a lack of interest on their part)
[17:09] <scott-work> i shall
[17:10] <persia> If they object to just doing it, the discussion has started.  As long as you're respectful from that point, the result should remain good.
[18:29] <abogani> persia: smb is volunteer to update linux-rt (in Lucid), apw is volunteer for review and find someone with upload rights for -lowlatency.
[18:30] <abogani> persia: At the moment miss only the right man for upload upgrades in Maverick.
[18:30] <abogani> persia: About -rt I meant.
[18:32] <abogani> persia: Tomorrow I'll try to request that to imbrandon.
[18:32] <persia> The only other kernel uploaders are tgraner and ogarasawa
[18:33] <persia> ogarasawa is busy in the role of primary uploader: I'm not sure she'll have time.
[18:33] <persia> And tgraner is always too busy.
[18:33] <abogani> persia: I don't think to have chance with them.
[18:33] <persia> I'd go with imbrandon, unless you expect someone will complain.
[18:33] <abogani> persia: I am too slow in typing...
[18:33] <abogani> :-)
[18:34] <persia> Given that you're actively working with the security team, I doubt they will have any issues if someone else uploads, as long as it's a good upload.
[18:34] <persia> And I'm fairly certain that by working with these folks, you can improve your developer application, and be able to upload directly in a couple months.
[18:35] <abogani> persia: At the moment I would want only let our users in a better situation (my application could wait).
[18:37] <persia> I know.  It's just awkward hunting sponsors in a narrow domain, because so many folks are afraid to upload kernels.
[18:37] <persia> So things will be easier once that's also sorted.
[18:41] <abogani> I hope.
[18:46] <persia> Indeed.  We'll see.