/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/06/14/#ubuntu-manual.txt

ubuntujenkinsnight all00:28
godbykflan: I never logout or shutdown unless I have to.00:29
flanI mean for websites.01:06
flanI should have been more clear.01:06
flanI'm planning to leave it out as an option for the Quickshot server admin role, since only one person should ever hold that access level (the system's physical owner) and it only applies to one page in the entire system.01:07
flanI could make it an option easily, but I'm not sure about the itilitive value of having two 'logout' links on a page.01:08
flanOne for the OpenID (which may change within a session) and one for the admin (which is purely unique).01:09
flanintuitive*01:09
dakergodbyk-sagan, i need you to clean up the test.ubuntu-manual.org02:28
godbykdaker: What, precisely, do you need me to do?03:52
dakerclear the folder03:53
daker"test"03:53
dakerwe are going to switch to https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual-website/0.203:54
godbykdaker: Right now test.ubuntu-manual.org just points to the test folder in the bzr repository.03:54
godbykdaker: So if you want to do something with the stuff in that folder you can.03:54
godbykdaker: If you want me to point test.ubuntu-manual.org to some other folder, I can do that, too.03:54
dakerjust put a blank page03:55
godbykdaker: So you want me to just break the link for now?03:55
dakeryes03:55
godbykdaker: Okay, done.03:56
dakerright :)03:57
dakerwe are going to switch to django03:58
godbykOoh, fancy!03:59
dakertime to sleep04:02
dakersee ya04:02
godbykSee ya, daker .04:03
flanAnyone want to try to break the Quickshot server admin interface?04:07
flanIt's ugly, with no CSS (though classes have been defined) and, while it validates stuff, it doesn't prompt you before allowing you to do stupid things.04:08
Zeikei can try to break it04:14
flan'Kay.04:14
flanhttp://stellvia.uguu.ca:5000/manage_admin04:16
flanThe key is 'qsdev'.04:16
Zeikeok, I'm in04:16
flanIf you can get it to produce an error that looks unhandled, PM the details at me.04:16
flanPlease don't play witht he error console.04:16
Zeikealright04:17
flanIt's a live interpreter.04:17
flanAnd that's dangerous.04:17
flanSince I need this system for stuff.04:17
godbyk'kay.04:17
flanComments on ways to display errors are welcome, but I know it's far from finished. This is mostly just a test to make sure I've got the basics down for Pylons and SQLalchemy before going further.04:18
godbykflan: what things would you like me to try breaking?04:19
flanWeird strings, unicode, adding and removing projects/owenrs, making sure only the one you specified disappears...04:19
godbykokay.04:20
flanNote: the admin interface is supposed to be minimalistic, since it has to display a lot of data in rather limited space. The individual project interfaces will have a lot more content.04:20
godbykFresh builds are up at http://builds.ubuntu-manual.org/.04:21
flanIf you don't encounter any erros within about five minutes, that's good enough for an intro test.04:21
flanI'll be writing unit tests aginst this after I've finalized the functionality that should be exposed here.04:21
godbykflan: I can't use capital letters for the short name?04:23
Zeikenor unicode04:23
godbykApparently the short name can be indefinitely long, though. :)04:24
Zeikethe long name as well04:24
Zeikeand the openids04:26
Zeikeone minute04:27
godbykI don't have my handy tools installed to make it easy for me to bypass the html form elements and submit POST data manually.04:28
godbykBut someone should give that a shot, too.04:28
Zeikeok, back04:30
Zeikeyou can have multiple projects with identical friendly names04:32
godbykIt certainly gets slow drawing the page now. :)04:34
Zeikehaha yes it does04:34
ZeikeIf you put in an OpenID url with unicode it gets all jarbled up04:35
Zeikeflan ^^04:35
Zeikeoh I see it is 'punycode'04:37
ZeikeIt should be fine then04:38
flanI think I capped both fields at 255 characters.05:01
flanJust not in the web interface.05:01
* flan caps them now.05:01
flanAs for random input, I'll be running a fuzzer on this once I'm sure it handles all the basic cases correctly. (Which is why I wanted human testing)05:02
flanThanks. :)05:02
flanAh. So it automatically sanitizes HTML entities.05:08
* flan removes his filters.05:08
flanAs for having multiple projects with identical friendly names, that's intentional. It didn't seem like something that should be prevented, although I couldn't think of a good reason why anyone would want to do it.05:13
Zeikethats what I was thinking.  The only reason I could think of somebody doing that was accidentally05:13
flanI see the normal usage scenario being one project per server.05:14
flanWith us being an exception.05:14
flanSince we may end up hosting things like the developer's manual, which doesn't belong in the UMP family.05:15
flan(Since it's a separate group)05:15
flanThere's another layer below families.05:15
flanEach family can have multiple projects.05:16
flanLike 10.04 and 10.10 for us.05:16
flanAnd USLC with milestones or a continually evolving screenshot capture list.05:17
flanAh. Blank value. I didn't think of that.05:19
flanThanks a lot for your feedback and testing, both of you.05:26
Zeikehaha no problem, not like it was hard work05:27
flanI'll try to get that page finished this week (with styling) so I'll have a reference for implementing the rest of the server.05:27
humphreybcAlright07:17
humphreybchttp://www.flickr.com/photos/humphreybc/4698519305/sizes/l/in/set-72157624139515783/07:18
thorwilgood morning!07:19
humphreybchey thorwil07:19
humphreybcI got your email :)07:19
humphreybcthorwil: http://twitpic.com/1wo4rs/full07:19
thorwilhumphreybc: the thing with the shadows is that the shadow of the header is the same on the ground and the search box. this suggests that box and ground are at the same level. but then the search box casts a shadow on the ground that is the about same as the one of the header, suggesting the same distance from the ground07:22
humphreybcthe idea is that the search box pops out from under the header07:23
humphreybcI did try it with it being the same level as the header, but it didn't look right07:23
thorwiloh, and the shadow of the search box suggests light from top, while the header suggests straight-on lighting07:24
ZeikeI'm not a designer but my suggestion would be to lessen the shadow beneath the search bar07:25
thorwilhumphreybc: better make it a static element, so people will see it's there instead of falling in the trap of not expecting the presence of something they can't see07:25
humphreybcit is going to be static07:26
humphreybcidea is that it's peeping out from under07:26
humphreybcthe drop shadow underneath looks quite harsh compared to the header because you can't see a drop shadow above07:26
humphreybc(the two shadows are actually identical in size, direction and opacity)07:26
humphreybcbut lessening the size of the search shadow will probably improve things07:26
Zeikehumphreybc: they may be the same size, but if the search bar is 'under' the header, wouldn't its shadow be smaller?07:27
thorwilhumphreybc: the shadow the header casts on the box should be narrower and/or lighter as the one on the ground07:27
humphreybcyeah07:29
* humphreybc tries to figure out how to do that 07:29
thorwilhumphreybc: regarding friendliness, the new design comes with more gray and less color. the old seems brighter, overall07:30
humphreybcyeah, but it's more professional07:30
thorwilubuntu-manual.org seems to be down07:31
humphreybctoo much colour makes us look like a chldren's project :P07:31
Zeikethorwil: works for me07:31
ZeikeMaybe consider putting some color in the header icons?07:32
ZeikeMaybe not07:32
thorwilsure, it's far from unfriendly and if we are *serious business* now, alright :)07:32
nisshhhumphreybc: thats a nice getting involved page07:47
ubuntujenkinsnisshh: can you link them so i can see please07:55
Zeikeubuntujenkins: http://twitpic.com/1wo4rs/full07:55
ubuntujenkinsthanks Zeike07:55
Zeike3am here, time for bed07:55
Zeikenight07:55
ubuntujenkinsnight07:56
Zeike..morning07:56
ubuntujenkinslol morning07:56
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: that page is great07:56
humphreybc:)07:59
nisshhhumphreybc: when is the new site planned on being put up?08:05
humphreybcnisshh: Well, it has to be coded first08:05
nisshhhumphreybc: yea, i knew that :)08:06
humphreybcso I guess in a couple of weeks depending on how fast daker works08:06
nisshhoh cool08:06
humphreybc:P08:06
humphreybcI have a couple more pages to do08:06
humphreybcand then it's on to the Quickshot website08:06
nisshhright08:06
humphreybcOh yeah, and I'm going to be studying design at uni now08:06
humphreybcI'm changing my major :)08:07
nisshhweb design?08:07
humphreybcjust design for now, probably specializing in communication or interaction design next year08:07
nisshhah right08:07
humphreybccommunication is like marketing and web08:07
nisshhawesome :)08:07
humphreybcshould be fun08:07
* nisshh is doing his Diploma for IT and Networking next semester08:08
nisshhok, im off to replace my front gutters, ill see you guys a bit later :)08:09
humphreybcsee ya08:09
* nisshh waves08:10
* ubuntujenkins quickshot has 10 twitter followers and 17 facebook fans08:23
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: I was thinking that after the colaberation meeting we should make it so that when people join #ubuntu-manual they actually end up on #ubuntu-doc08:31
humphreybcwhat do you mean?08:32
ubuntujenkinsso all the doc stuff is in one channel08:32
ubuntujenkinsso if i typed /join #ubuntu-manual it would join me into #ubuntu-doc08:32
ubuntujenkinsubuntu-doc is a better overall name for the teams08:33
nisshhaquarius: can i ask you a quick question about desktopcouch?10:02
aquariussure10:04
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aquariusnisshh, go ahead :)10:10
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nisshhaquarius: sorry, yep, about desktopcouch, so i have an app that uses quickly, if i have some database that my app creates in desktopcouch, does that automatically get synced accross all my computers, do i need U1 installed or what?10:35
aquariusby default, if you don't have U1 installed, then your data will not be synced10:36
aquariusthe easiest way to get it synced is to install U110:36
aquarius(although there are some server issues being worked on right now meaning that desktopcouch syncing is disabled)10:36
nisshhah right10:36
nisshhaquarius: are they likely to be fixed before maverick?10:37
aquariusbut you can also individually connect two desktopcouches on the same LAN together without using U1 at all -- this is called "pairing"10:37
aquariusif you don't want to use U110:37
aquariusyes, the server issues will be fixed before maverick :)10:37
nisshhok, cool, im happy to use U1, i just needed to know more about how what was required10:38
nisshhaquarius: do i actually need to add support for U1 into my app though, or does U1 automatically just sync the whole lot of databases?10:39
aquariusu1 automatically syncs databases unless you explicitly tell it not to for your database, so it's automatic with no work from you at all. You just store data in desktopcouch and never have to think about syncing10:39
aquariuswe do the hard work so you don't have to :)10:40
nisshhoh, awesome10:40
nisshhthats easy then, thanks aquarius :)10:40
aquariusif it's not easy then I've done it wrong :)10:42
nisshhright10:42
dakerhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1286170/Laptop-suicide-riddle-brilliant-students-dead-hotel-room.html12:04
nisshhaquarius: i have another question if thats ok12:42
aquariusnisshh, go for it12:42
aquariusasking questions is always OK :)12:43
nisshhaquarius: sure thing, ok, if say U1 synced my database called 'foo' then a week later it re-synced the same database, but the records and other data inside that database had changed, does it just update the already existing database?12:44
aquariuscorrect12:44
nisshhah good, was worried that hardcoding the name of my database into my code would couase problems12:45
nisshhcause12:45
aquariusnope! that's how you're meant to do it12:48
aquariusdon't call it "foo", though. :)12:48
aquariusyou already know about http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/desktopcouch/Documentation, yes?12:50
nisshhyes12:50
nisshhi was only using foo as an example12:50
aquariusI thought so :)12:52
nisshhhehe12:52
nisshhaquarius: https://edge.launchpad.net/pytask12:52
nisshhonce i evetually get around to getting myself a netbook or second machine ill be able to finally test all this out proplerly12:53
aquariusnice. If you clearly define the task record type, then it would be possible for, say, getting things gnome, or evolution, to have a desktopcouch back end which writes tasks to the same database in the same record format12:53
aquariusso that they'd all share tasks12:53
aquariusand you could switch from evolution to pytask and still have all your data12:53
nisshhah12:54
nisshhcross-application type stuff12:54
aquariusyep. One of the benefits of desktopcouch is sharing data between applications12:54
nisshhhmmm, this could be a feature, ill definitely look into it12:56
aquariusif you can say to people "use pytask without losing any of your existing tasks", that helps people migrate12:57
nisshhright12:57
nisshhalthough gtg has formatting and tags and stuff in their task data, so wouldnt that make a difference?12:58
aquariusyep. This is one of the things that needs thinking about. :)12:58
nisshhyea12:58
humphreybcubuntujenkins: you there?13:18
ubuntujenkinsI am13:19
humphreybcskype?13:19
ubuntujenkinsyep13:19
humphreybcyou've gone offline :)13:19
ubuntujenkinsso have you i am online13:19
humphreybcweird13:19
ubuntujenkinsI have closed and repoend still don't see you13:20
nisshhoh my god! your both invisible!13:20
ubuntujenkinsmy headset is not working13:22
humphreybcubuntujenkins: I'm ringing ye13:22
ubuntujenkinsI will jsut reboot pulse autiod is rubbish13:22
humphreybchaha13:22
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: I don't see you13:24
humphreybcmy skype is fucked13:25
humphreybchang on13:25
ubuntujenkinsmy laptop is on massive fail today13:25
humphreybcokay, it's ringing now13:25
ubuntujenkinsthnaks humphreybc sorry it was quick just one exam left :)13:38
humphreybcno worries13:38
humphreybcexam > ubuntu :P13:38
dakerhumphreybc, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual-website/0.313:42
humphreybcdaker: nice13:43
humphreybcvish: Icons?13:44
humphreybcicons!13:44
humphreybcICOOOONNNNNNNNNS13:45
dakerwell give him a chance13:46
dakerhumphreybc, so you want me to implement the new design for the Lucid e2 ? or for Maverick ?13:48
humphreybcdaker: as soon as you can :P13:48
humphreybcthere's no huge rush13:48
dakerhumphreybc, i think it will for Maverick, so we will got new website, new content, bug form, new theme for the planet14:01
humphreybcdaker: yeah14:01
humphreybcthat's a good target :)14:01
dakerso i want you to put somewhere a place for news14:02
dakerwe can pick them from lp14:02
nisshhooh, a new lanet theme14:02
nisshhplanet14:02
nisshhcool14:02
dakerhumphreybc, are kicking your wife out from the channel :p14:03
dakeryou*14:03
humphreybchahaha14:03
dakerhumphreybc, can you design the new planet theme ?14:07
humphreybcSure14:08
* humphreybc adds that to his list of shit to design14:08
humphreybchey vish!14:10
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: whats this "secret" app?14:12
humphreybcShhh!14:14
humphreybcThey'll get you...14:14
ubuntujenkinsnow I am very inerested14:15
humphreybclol14:15
ubuntujenkinsshame i did not see th ecomment eailier14:15
dakerwhat secret app ? are working with NASA ? hahaha14:16
humphreybclol14:16
humphreybcI will say no more14:16
* humphreybc zips lips14:16
nisshhoh, now im enterested as well, humphreybc14:21
humphreybcanyone know any lawyers? We should get a cease and desist on these bad boys: http://www.lockergnome.com/it/2010/06/09/a-complete-beginners-manual-for-ubuntu-10-04-lucid-lynx/14:22
nisshhhumphreybc: hahaha!, a complimentary guide!14:28
nisshhhumphreybc: write them an email saying that you will sue them if they dont take it down or something14:29
popeyhumphreybc: left a comment14:30
popeyhowever I suspect my comment will stay waiting moderation14:30
* popey notes he's not breaking any laws14:31
* ubuntujenkins likes popeys tweet14:39
popey:)14:39
nisshhubuntujenkins: hmmm? link?14:42
ubuntujenkinsto what?14:42
nisshhpopey's tweet14:43
popeytwitter.com/popey14:43
ubuntujenkinsthanks popey I don't know how to get to peoples profiles in gwibber14:44
popeyyeah, thats a fault in gwibber imo14:44
popeyyou can get to it if someone replies to you, because you can click "in reply to" which opens a browser14:45
* nisshh uses identica, twitter is spam central14:45
* daker needs a Vuvuzela14:48
popeyidentica is starting to be too14:48
nisshhpopey: true, but atleast everyone who uses it can admit that and isnt a dipshit14:49
popeyhah, you dont really 'use' it though to be fair nisshh :)  3 dents in 2 months :)14:49
popeyo_O14:49
nisshhpopey: i still dont get the point of it to be honest14:49
popeyheh14:49
nisshhpopey: i feel that its kind of sad that everyone needs to share what they just ate on twitter every 20 minutes14:51
popeythats not what twitter is for14:51
popeyand if people do that, dont follow them14:51
nisshhpopey: enlighten me :)14:52
popeythats the same argument everyone trots out about why microblogging is bad14:52
popeyno, i dont need to enlighten you14:52
nisshhpopey: hehe, yea i suppose, microblogging has a bad image to newcomers like me14:52
nisshhpopey: your not getting passionate about microblogging are you?14:53
popeyI'm not doing anything14:53
nisshhmeh14:53
popeyI'm merely countering your misguided impression that all its for is to tell people what you ate14:53
nisshhok14:53
popey(which it isnt)14:54
nisshhim not saying thats what its for, im just saying that alot of people post shit like that on there14:54
nisshhnot you though14:54
popeythey do14:54
popeyand you dont have to follow them14:54
popeyin the same way that I wouldn't read the blogs of people who wrote that kind of rubbish either14:55
nisshhgood point14:55
nisshhim young :) you cant blame me for being ignorant :)14:55
nisshhblame my age :)14:55
vishhmm,14:56
vishno humphrey :s14:56
dakerno14:56
hannieI wonder if this is correct: enter your password and click \window{OK}.14:57
vishdaker: has be finished the design? i got two icons14:57
hannieThere is a /button{OK}, but is there a /window{OK}?14:57
vishone for download and for contribs14:57
dakervish, i don't think he was waiting for  you14:57
ubuntujenkinshannie: I guess it should by \button{ok}14:58
hannieSo I should send a bug message?14:58
ubuntujenkinsplease also fix it in the translation14:58
hannieI will14:58
vishdaker: anyways , http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1325768/contribs-1.png and http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1325768/download3.png14:59
vishor http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1325768/download4.png ,looks a bit thin14:59
ubuntujenkinsthanks hannie15:00
dakervish, nice15:00
vish:)15:01
dakervish, send him a email15:01
shriniteam: getting good comments on tamil manual15:01
vishdaker: ha , you will be the one using it anyway ;)15:01
shriniis there any way to justify the text?15:02
ubuntujenkinsshrini: I guess i will add it to my todo list for after my exam15:06
shriniubuntujenkins: thanks15:07
dakerhttp://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/RJuOwfEiDO15:26
hannieI'm not sure if this is correct: Once you select a message by clicking it, etc. You select a message in Evolution by double clicking it.15:37
hannieOnly then can you reply the message.15:37
ubuntujenkinshannie: can you link me the string please15:38
hannieA moment, please15:38
dakerJapan 1 vs 0 Cameroun15:39
hannieString 707: Once you select a message by clicking it, you can click on the  \button{Reply} button in the toolbar...15:39
ubuntujenkinshannie: of what you have typed irc it reads fine . I can't go on the inernet as my laptop has locked up I will try in a moment15:43
ubuntujenkinsbrb15:44
hannieShouldn't it be: Once you select a message by double clicking it, you can click on the  \button{Reply} button in the toolbar... ?15:45
ubuntujenkinshannie: I will look at the full string now15:46
ubuntujenkinshannie: 707 is fine15:49
hannieWith one click the contents of the message will be displayed; double clicking it gives you the menu Reply, Reply to All etc.15:49
hannieOK, I leave it as it is15:49
hannieI am translating e1 (translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/lucid-e1/) at the moment. Is this still ok? When I change something here the previous string is packaged as a suggestion.16:13
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thorwilvish: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1325768/contribs-1.png made me think pigtails/bunches (http://www.minutus.net/mt32/pam/mt32/pam/ponytails.jpg)17:28
thorwilvish: lower placement and wider spread should fix that17:29
vishthorwil: lol!17:43
vishthorwil: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1325768/contribs-ponyless.png ?17:52
thorwilvish: better. maybe tweak the right head for a better balance18:17
vishthorwil: yeah , i tried that , that turned out to look like a hairstyle again! , not sure what it is called , the one with the hair till the ears18:19
vishand curls on the sides18:19
thorwilvish: yeah, twiddly business18:20
dakerubuntujenkins, ping19:34
ubuntujenkinsdaker: pong19:35
dakeryou know how to change the label of an existing item in gtk.Menu() ?19:36
dakerself.menu = gtk.Menu()19:36
dakerself.item = gtk.MenuItem("Test", True)19:36
dakerself.item.show()19:36
dakernext i want to change the label from "Test" to something else19:37
ubuntujenkinshmm... so by doing that you see a menu called Test? I have not done it in pygtk before i use glade. does this not work19:38
ubuntujenkinsself.item = gtk.MenuItem("Test", False)19:38
ubuntujenkinsself.item = gtk.MenuItem("Hello", True)19:38
ubuntujenkinsself.item.show()19:38
ubuntujenkinsjust a guess19:39
dakeroki i'll try19:39
dutchiedaker: it doesn't seem like that MenuItem is part of the Menu19:39
dakerdutchie,  self.menu.append(self.item)19:40
dakerthat's ok ?19:40
dutchiethink so19:40
dutchiecheck the docs19:41
dakeroki19:42
* ubuntujenkins plans to learn pygtk soon19:50
dakeri can't find the docs for the appindicator module :s19:51
dakerand i can't find how to edit a Menuitems19:51
dakermy app will not work as supposed :s19:57
vishdaker: for the contribs you can use this one instead , minor tweak> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1325768/contribs-ponyless.png19:58
dakervish, email them to humphreybc19:59
thorwilrename that file, unless we want to hint at an aversion against contributors who do have a pony!!19:59
thorwil;)19:59
vishdaker: sent20:03
dakergood20:03
vishthorwil: hehe , great minds ;)20:03
ubuntujenkinsdaker: I will look into it a bit with you tomorrow ask in #ubuntu-app-devel they may be able to help20:03
* ubuntujenkins starts more revison20:03
ubuntujenkinslast exam tomorrow20:03
thorwilubuntujenkins should change nick to revisionist ^^20:04
=== ubuntujenkins is now known as revisionist
thorwilawesome20:05
dakerrevisionist, self.menu = gtk.Menu()20:06
dakerself.item1 = gtk.MenuItem("Test1", False)20:06
dakerself.item1.show()20:06
dakerself.item2 = gtk.MenuItem("Test2", False)20:06
dakerself.item2.show()20:06
dakerself.menu.append(self.item1)20:06
dakerself.menu.append(self.item2)20:06
dakerafter showing the menu i want to edit the labels of item1 & item220:06
vishlol20:06
revisionistdaker: sitll guessing but does doing the samething but changing "Test1" and "Test2" and False to true not change the values? If you e-mail me your work on the bzr info I cna help tomorrow20:08
dakerno20:09
revisionist*or the vzr info20:09
revisionist*or the bzr info20:09
dakeroki20:10
revisionistsorry just need to get this exam sorted20:10
dakeri know :)20:10
=== revisionist is now known as ubuntujenkins
c7phey godbyk21:37
ubuntujenkinsnight all see you after my exam o/22:48
c7pnight all23:03

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