robert_ancellTheMuso, can you sponsor libgweather from bzr?01:03
TheMusorobert_ancell: sure thing01:04
TheMusorobert_ancell: I don't seem to have /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/python-autotools.mk on my system, and installing libgweather's build dependencies doesn't grab it either. Do you know what package its from?01:16
robert_ancellTheMuso, Mavericks cdbs01:22
TheMusooh ok01:23
robert_ancellmakes the debian packages _so much better_ but yeah, can't build them on Lucid01:23
* TheMuso uses a chroot then.01:23
robert_ancellRAOF, bryceh: How fast can you get an xserver to start on boot?01:34
RAOFrobert_ancell: You mean - what service dependencies does the xserver have?01:35
brycehrobert_ancell, depends on hardware01:36
robert_ancellboth dependencies and what the state is now - i.e. is lucid booting x as fast as it can?01:36
brycehrobert_ancell, if you mean "is there anything we can change in xserver to make the xserver portion of the boot faster", I think we pretty much squeezed everything out of it we knew to do01:37
brycehrobert_ancell, however if you mean "Are there other things in the boot process that could get us to a working X session faster"... maybe, I'm not sure there though.01:38
RAOFYou could start X sooner in the boot if you didn't have to start it from gdm.  I'm not sure how useful that would be, though.01:38
robert_ancellbryceh, so how long does it take to start on a cut down system, e.g. a dell mini01:38
robert_ancellI'm asking because I've been working on a new display manager which is as fast as possible.  I was wondering how fast you could get X running so then you could run an X app as the boot splash01:39
brycehrobert_ancell, xserver itself takes a second or two on a dell mini with ssd (exact time varies boot to boot, but seb128 and scott had some detailed numbers as proof)01:39
brycehrobert_ancell, if you use xdm and boot into a non-gnome X session using the -vesa driver, you can get things up and running in about a second01:39
brycehmaybe less01:40
robert_ancellnice, that would be fast enough.  run a static image on the fb before that01:40
brycehrobert_ancell, also there is a timing patch floating around for xserver (check the debian/patches/ dir, I think it may be just commented out)01:41
brycehrobert_ancell, if you are able to use fbdev, that may give equivalent performance as vesa01:41
robert_ancellI'd want to use the same drivers as the desktop would run on, so you don't have to reload anything later in the boot01:42
brycehah gotcha01:42
brycehok, was going to mention some other "well if you can lock down the hardware, then you can drop..."01:43
RAOFbryceh, robert_ancell: The upstream server now timestamps its logs, as of 1.8.01:43
brycehRAOF, know if that patch is backported to lucid?  (and if it's better than the one we were toying with last release?)01:44
RAOFI certainly haven't backported it to Lucid.  I'm not sure if it's been backported to 1.701:44
brycehanyway, I had gone through the timing data myself and didn't spot any obvious optimizations we could do, so might not be worth the trouble, but patches are available if xserver boot seems slow01:46
brycehrobert_ancell, these days a lot of the goopy stuff amenable to optimization (like edid probing) is done in the kernel side via kms01:47
brycehedid caching is a big win, and that's a kernel thingee01:48
Sarvattno we can squeeze at least another 400ms out of the xserver startup time by dropping the pci vendor and card name lookup01:48
brycehit's probably worth testing to be sure it's functioning properly01:48
brycehSarvatt, well that's what I was going to mention when I said "if you can lock down the hardware"... ;-)01:48
Sarvattwhich will probably be done in 1.901:48
RAOFSarvatt: We'll pick up those patches for free in 1.901:48
robert_ancellooh, that sounds nice01:49
brycehSarvatt, robert_ancell: but that depends a lot on if you are going to always know ahead of time what the hw is01:49
Sarvattits parses the huge pci id list just for mapping the vendor/device name at the very start, the driver prints its own identifying message so its not really useful01:49
brycehSarvatt, can you link robert_ancell the patch for that?01:50
RAOFbryceh: No, this is basically just for printing the vendor ID (which most of the DDXs do anyway, in a better way) in Xorg.0.log.01:50
Sarvattjust the one line - [  6357.749] (--) PCI:*(0:1:0:0) 1002:94c3:174b:e370 ATI Technologies Inc RV610 video device [Radeon HD 2400 PRO] rev 0, Mem @ 0xd0000000$01:50
Sarvatthttp://patchwork.freedesktop.org/patch/989/ http://patchwork.freedesktop.org/patch/990/01:51
TheMusorobert_ancell: uploaded01:55
Sarvattit's about 400ms for the lookup here on my netbook, about 150ms on a faster core 201:56
TheMusorobert_ancell: What is this display manager you are working on?01:57
robert_ancellTheMuso, lp:lightdm02:01
TheMusoah ok02:01
robert_ancellit's pre-alpha at the momeny02:01
RAOFWould anyone like to sponsor a mesa upload?  http://cooperteam.net/Packages/mesa_7.8.1-3ubuntu1_source.changes and http://cooperteam.net/Packages/mesa_7.8.1-3ubuntu1.dsc .  I'm going to have some lunch, so if anyone wants to sponsor it I'll be back at about the time your build has finished :)03:29
TheMusoRAOF: will take a look.03:38
SarvattRAOF: should do libdrm first?04:15
RAOFSarvatt: Doh!  Of course!04:27
RAOFStupid local packages.04:27
RAOFThat said, mesa builds fine against 2.4.2004:28
TheMusoRAOF: should I wait?04:30
RAOFLet me double check.  I _think_ it doesn't matter.04:30
TheMusoRAOF: ok04:31
RAOFTheMuso: You can proceed.  Mesa builds fine against 2.4.20, and doesn't use any symbols from 2.4.21 as determined by the dpkg dependencies.04:32
TheMusoRAOF: ok04:33
Sarvattthe mesa change is insanely huge to review TheMuso, I'm sorry and thanks for doing it :)04:33
TheMusoSarvatt: np04:33
RAOFWe'll want the new libdrm for a new -intel DDX, but that can wait and doesn't need to block mesa.04:34
Sarvattspeaking of which i should update that in debian04:34
TheMusoRAOF: uploading05:05
RAOF_Who pinged me?  Things are a little bit weird with the electricians rewiring stuff.05:13
lifeless15:34 < RAOF> We'll want the new libdrm for a new -intel DDX, but that can wait and doesn't need to block mesa.05:16
lifeless15:34 < Sarvatt> speaking of which i should update that in debian05:16
lifeless15:59 -!- tedg [~ted@pool-71-96-212-220.dfw.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #ubuntu-desktop05:16
lifeless16:05 < TheMuso> RAOF: uploading05:16
lifeless16:05 -!- RAOF_ [~RAOF@ppp105-211.static.internode.on.net] has joined #ubuntu-desktop05:16
lifeless16:13 < RAOF_> Who pinged me?  Things are a little bit weird with the electricians rewiring stuff.05:16
RAOF_lifeless: Thank you, valiant IRC proxy.05:16
=== almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan
robert_ancellTheMuso, can you sponsor poppler from bzr?05:46
TheMusorobert_ancell: uploaded06:10
robert_ancellTheMuso, thanks06:10
didrocksgood morning08:03
didrocksRAOF: hey, did you see my question about nvidia?08:03
RAOFdidrocks: Good morning.  I did not see your question, no.08:04
RAOFWould you like to fix it by sponsoring a rebuild of nvidia-graphics-drivers? :)08:04
pittiGood morning08:05
didrocksRAOF: that maybe the cause of that, right: http://paste.ubuntu.com/449524/ ?08:05
RAOFdidrocks: Yes, exatly.08:06
didrocksRAOF: if you have something to be sponsored, I will be pleased to do so :)08:07
RAOFdidrocks: http://cooperteam.net/Packages/nvidia-graphics-drivers_195.36.24-0ubuntu2_source.changes is available for your sponsoring pleasure.08:08
didrocksRAOF: sweet :)08:08
* TheMuso worked on the 185 variant at some point in the past, the packaging is interesting. I refer more so to now NVIDIA package the drivers than the Ubuntu/Debian/dkms packaging.08:11
didrocksRAOF: signed and uploaded for your (and mine) pleasure :)08:13
didrocksbaptistemm: salut!08:13
baptistemmsalut didrocks08:17
robert_ancelldesrt, ping08:18
didrockshey robert_ancell, how are you?08:19
robert_ancelldidrocks, hey, good08:19
pittihey robert_ancell, good morning didrocks08:21
RAOFOk.  I'm off to the hardware store to buy some lights for the electricians to put in tomorrow.  I think seb's looking for me; I'll be back on later this evening.08:21
didrocksGuten Morgen pitti, how are you?08:21
pittisplendid, thanks08:21
seb128hey there08:26
didrockssalut seb128, ça va ?08:27
Sarvattfta: your script rocks, thank you! http://sarvatt.com/xorg-edgers/08:27
seb128lut didrocks, nickel, et toi ?08:27
didrocksseb128: ça va bien, merci :)08:28
seb128so mclasen started trolling as well08:28
seb128robert_ancell, hey08:29
robert_ancellseb128, morning08:30
seb128robert_ancell, how are you today?08:30
robert_ancellbusy :)08:30
seb128robert_ancell, to reply to your email, new poppler depends on cairo 1.908:30
seb128do you think we should update cairo?08:30
seb128I had that discussion with upstream yesterday08:30
pittididrocks, seb128: are bug 528557 and bug 229187 fixed in maverick? I can't copy the lucid-proposed08:31
seb128they plan their next stable in august08:31
ubot2Launchpad bug 528557 in evolution (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 3 other projects) "cannot turn on alarm for meeting received via email (affects: 4) (heat: 28)" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/52855708:31
ubot2Launchpad bug 229187 in evolution-data-server (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 2 other projects) "Evolution mailing list does not render accents correctly (affects: 3) (heat: 22)" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/22918708:31
seb128but they did plan it in january before08:31
robert_ancellI would say yes, as long as they don't plan anything crazy08:31
seb128so I don't really trust them for their schedule08:31
seb128other distro had to go back to cairo 1.8 previous cycles08:31
didrockspitti: it's in trunk, we still didn't upload the new version there, but in any case, I'll keep an eye on them08:32
robert_ancellseb128, hmm, annoying08:32
Sarvattcairo 1.10 is a myth! :)08:33
seb128robert_ancell, upstream would like us to get the new cairo in the xorg-edger ppa for testing08:34
seb128robert_ancell, if you are interested to get that happening ;-)08:34
robert_ancellseb128, If there's no specific reason for upgrading, and a risk of it not being ready we should hold back08:34
robert_ancellI'm willing to do the packaging08:35
seb128it's in debian experimental08:35
seb128so it's basically merging our lcd filter change08:35
seb128I think getting it in the xorg-edget ppa would be a nice start08:35
seb128it would be there for testing with other xorg edge versions08:35
robert_ancellI'll put it on the low priority list, and have a look if everything else is working08:36
Sarvattis it? i'll put it in the ppa then, i've been building it seperately for over a year now08:36
seb128robert_ancell, do you read d-d-l?08:36
seb128Sarvatt, that would be nice, thanks!08:36
robert_ancellseb128, no08:36
seb128robert_ancell, ok, that's wise ;-)08:36
robert_ancellseb128, yes, I had heard legends of how much time it takes to read, so I've never bothered to subscribe08:37
Sarvattthe lcd filter stuff won't apply i'm sure though08:37
seb128Sarvatt, so it needs to be updated to apply ;-)08:38
seb128pitti, what didrocks said08:45
pittididrocks: ok, thanks08:46
seb128I replied to mclasen troll08:58
* didrocks didn't read d-d-l still today09:00
seb128not missing anything09:01
seb128he's trolling us for shipping desktopcouch and saying that shipping 2 gtk versions is a CD space issue09:03
seb128then trolling us for not shipping GNOME3 this cycle09:03
didrocksurgh :/ I'm not eager to read this, preferring working first, that's more positive09:03
seb128saying that we basically don't contribute to it but work on ayatana things at the same time and that we should stop pretending09:03
didrockshow nice this is…09:04
seb128didrocks, ignore the troll ;-)09:04
hyperairhrmm? where's this post?09:05
seb128pitti, if your libusb upload fixes the crash we talked about before lucid that would rock really09:07
robert_ancelllater all09:11
RAOFseb128: You wanted to talk about my work-items?  They might look slightly more scary than they are.  I've knocked off two of the bigger ones today, a number of them are for tools outside the archive which won't be affected by the A2 freeze, and some more are documentation WIs.10:34
seb128hey RAOF10:36
seb128RAOF, well, we are mid milestone and you have ticked 2 items on 2110:36
seb128the maths says you are well behind so I wanted to check if we should delay things ;-)10:36
seb128it seems those are mostly small tasks though10:37
seb128so you might have them under control but I wanted to check with you10:37
RAOFYup.  I've now got 4/21 done, and the X server transition is done, as is mesa.10:37
seb128I also wanted to know if you are tracking the kernel team items10:37
seb128I've noticed, great work on the transitions btw!10:37
RAOFI haven't been tracking the kernel team items very closely, just every now and then.10:38
seb128those seems investigation rather than maverick changes10:39
seb128could you still try to get an update to know if they still have those on their radars?10:39
seb128no hurry, when you have time in the next week10:39
RAOFI'll talk to apw.  There are a couple of maverick changes that could come as a result of their investigations.10:40
seb128RAOF, do you need some help on anything or should we look at moving some work items to alpha3 or do you think you have things under control?10:40
RAOFI think I've got things under control.10:40
seb128ok, great10:40
seb128I was mainly checking in case you need help or to have some item rescheduled10:41
seb128RAOF, thanks10:41
seb128we are on the trend line today ;-)10:41
RAOFThe biggest remaining WI deliverable to the archive is the -intel DDX for i8xx cards, either forward-porting an old DDX and throwing it in universe or re-adding an old codepath to the new DDX so that 8xx cards don't die.10:41
seb128seems wayland could be quite some work as well10:43
RAOFWayland is the thing most likely to slip, yeah.10:43
seb128that would be fine, we don't rely on it for maverick10:43
seb128so if we get it a bit later that's fine as well10:43
RAOFRight.  It's only going to end up in a PPA for developers to play with.10:43
seb128and other changes seem mostly investigation, talking to other people, updating tools and documentation10:44
RAOFThere's at least one intel hacker interested in re-introducing an old, non-flaming-death codepath for the poor old i8xx cards, so we might get a better outcome than we were dreading at UDS :)10:44
RAOFThat's right.10:44
seb128which shouldn't be an issue either for alpha210:44
seb128RAOF, nice for the i8xx cards ;-)10:44
seb128RAOF, anyway it seems things look good for alpha2, great work10:45
RAOFOoh!  Dinner has been called!10:45
seb128RAOF, thanks for the update10:45
seb128RAOF, enjoy your dinner10:45
RAOFCatch you later :)10:45
seb128see you10:45
seb128 10:45
seb128who knows hiw way with dh7 there?10:46
seb128how do you make it call dh_girepository10:46
pittiseb128: as an addon? or in a particular package?10:47
seb128pitti, in a package10:47
pittiif you wnat to run it after e. g. dh_install, you could write something like10:48
pitti    dh_install10:48
pitti    dh_girrepository10:48
seb128trying that10:48
pittiseb128: "man dh", FTR10:49
seb128pitti, thanks, I tried man dh7 and man debhelper10:52
seb128the first one didn't work and the second didn't have what I wanted10:53
Sarvattickle seems open to taking that lcdfilter patch for cairo upstream by the way11:19
Sarvatt(Chris Wilson)11:20
seb128Sarvatt, oh, nice11:28
seb128it was briefly upstream11:28
seb128and they reverted it because it was breaking some testsuite cases11:28
seb128that was before 1.811:29
asacRiddell: hey, can you ping me and alf__ when you have a few minutes to talk about qt and embedded packaging ;)?11:44
Riddellasac: ping11:45
asacRiddell: hey11:52
asacRiddell: so ... we are thinking what we can do for qt-embedded packaging this cycle ... and of course need your input on our ideas11:52
asacRiddell: so qt-embedded needs a different soname - upstream said they will suggest one so that fine. i wonder if you would feel comfortable to make a two run build out of the qt package11:53
asacor rather want this to live in a separate source package (copied source)11:53
=== cking_ is now known as cking
Riddellasac: my initial thought is that qt takes quite long enough to build as it is so separate source packages would be best12:05
=== MacSlow is now known as MacSlow|lunch
asacRiddell: so ... our idea is to make the basic embedded qt stack available in the archive, but then run a ppa for now that has the apps ported to it (probably until lighthouse comes out ... which upstream said they will do a proper sonaming for  etc)12:22
asacRiddell: however, i wonder if there some kind of "inner-ring" libraries that you would think are essential and we should also make available as embedded packages12:23
Riddellasac: do you have paticular apps in mind?12:24
Riddellasac: qtwebkit is split out into a separate source package in maverick so that's an obvious inner-ring12:24
Riddellpossibly phonon too since that's a supported Qt API12:24
asacRiddell: havent decided on that yet; we first want to bring the dev/sdk environment up to speed12:24
asacRiddell: but alf__ tested a few qt apps and they apparently just built and worked12:24
asacwe havent went up to kde yet obviously12:25
asacguess kdelibs would be inner ring too ;) ... though i doubt thats really easy to do ;)12:25
asacalf__: ^^ ... so we should also keep qtwebkit in mind and phonon12:25
asacRiddell: did the qtwebkit split already happened?12:25
asacRiddell: do you expect that the libs etc. from maverick are easy to backport for lucid (during alphas having alucid packages for arm often helps as there are times where you cannot produce images etc. from the moving dev release)12:26
Riddellasac: they're easy to backport yes, we have backports in kubuntu-ppa/beta for KDE 4.5 beta backports12:27
asacgreat. that makes things even easier12:27
asacRiddell: should i send alf__ to you or someone else from your team for reviewing/sponsoring when he is done with the qt-embedded lib etc.?12:27
asac(i will take a first look before, but i think its better if some "qt" expert does the sanity checking)12:28
Riddellasac: sure, he's always welcome on #kubuntu-devel12:29
asacnice ;)12:30
asacdidrocks: do you have good connections to mutter devs for upstreaming?12:31
didrocksasac: I 've post some patches to them, but I don't personnally know them, why?12:32
asacdidrocks: just wonder if we have an established channel or if should rather go on my own ;)12:32
didrocksasac: you can go on your own, will be the same than me trying :)12:32
asacheh ok12:33
mptmdz, hi, you asked on design.canonical.com why Ubuntu didn't offer to install Flash for the user test participants. The answer is bug 161818.12:51
ubot2Launchpad bug 161818 in ubufox (Ubuntu) "firefox flash-plugin automatic installation fails on youtube (affects: 6) (dups: 2) (heat: 46)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/16181812:52
didrocksmpt: hey, did you have some time to work on oneconf USC design yesterday?12:54
mptdidrocks, no sorry, it was #3 on my list and I didn't get to it, but it's now moved up to #212:55
didrocksyeah \o/ ;)12:55
didrocksmpt: no worry, it was just to get this moving as alpha2 is pretty closed now. As long as you can give it a look this week, it will be ok, I hope :)12:56
mdzmpt: ah, thanks. so they always encountered flash first on Youtube, eh?12:57
mptmdz, I don't know (I wasn't in the test), but the bug affects people visiting any Web site that uses Adobe's recommended method of detecting Flash.12:58
mptNot just YouTube.12:58
sorenmpt: do you have a link to those recommendations?13:00
mptsoren, it's in the bug report13:00
sorenmpt: ah, thanks.13:01
sorenmpt: So it seems that people always get pointed to http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/. Perhaps we could intercept people's attempts to access that and offer them the better way?13:05
didrockssoren: some kind of "if url ==". That sounds sweet :)13:07
asacdidrocks: one question: why is mutter packaged as a native package :(13:08
mptsoren, ideally we'd intercept it earlier than that, but that would certainly be better than nothing.13:10
didrocksasac: hum, you mean? the version is 2.31.2-2ubuntu3 and the debian directory is in mutter_2.31.2-2ubuntu3.diff.gz, no?13:10
asacdidrocks: whatever i copied from the unity ppa was a native package :(13:10
asacif you say its ok in archive then i am fine ;)13:11
didrocksasac: previous one was, because of dx packaging, but last one shouldn't, let me check13:11
didrocksasac: hum, ok, I didn't push the last version to the UNE ppa (it's the same level of patch though), so yeah, it was native for dx daily build as patch inlined13:12
didrocksasac: I will update this Thursday mutter in the UNE ppa with maverick version. Same level of functionality (same patches), but at least, a real working version13:13
asacok let me know. i will happily adopt that ;)13:13
asacdidrocks: is there a good way to test mutter without unity that you would suggest?13:14
didrocksasac: you can run it into your GNOME session with mutter --replace13:14
asacok will try that13:14
asacwonder what happens if i do that in efl ;)13:14
didrocksthat can be nice to test ^^13:15
asacdidrocks: how can i re-replace that back?13:15
asacmetacity --replace?13:15
didrocksmaybe in a tty is safer for killing the process easily with DISPLAY=:113:15
didrocksor even compiz --replace if you trust the non working 3D card :)13:15
asacdont ask for too much ;)13:16
asacit works!!!13:24
asacartifacts and weird focus issues13:24
asacbut it works ;)13:24
asacnot really that many artifacts; just the mouse pointer/caret has a background colored box around it and isnt transparent13:25
didrocksasac: sounds awesome :)13:27
didrocksasac: how does the shiny effects are behaving?13:27
didrocksnot too slow?13:28
asacdidrocks: i dont know if i see the shiny effects ;)13:28
didrocksasac: you have some zoomout/zoomin while reducing/maximizing windows13:28
asacdidrocks: hmm. i have -efl... there is no minimizing13:29
didrocksasac: closing maybe? you have a zoom out IIRC13:29
asacnow my board hangs ;)13:29
didrocks(on the window itself)13:29
didrocksurgh :-)13:29
asaclet me reboot and try to log into a gnome session or something13:29
asacwonder if i have gnome session installed13:29
asac(this thing only has 256m)13:30
didrockshum… let's cross the fingers it will start ^^13:30
=== MacSlow|lunch is now known as MacSlow
asacdidrocks: zooming in and out works with desktop session ;)13:42
didrocksasac: awesome! :)13:42
asacbut killing mutter kills the board reliably ;)13:42
* didrocks cross fingers for unity to behave the same so :)13:42
didrocksargh :)13:42
asacfor unity we have to make clutk a decent piece of software first ;)13:53
didrocksasac: ask to njpatel :)13:55
asacdidrocks: already did. he redirected me to jay ;)13:56
didrocksahah ^^13:56
asacbut jay seems to hide today ;)13:56
asacas if he knew what was coming13:56
didrocksdon't trust French people running away from France, they can feel when things can go badly for them :-)13:57
didrocksseb128: rhythmbox upstream has a fix in trunk for the crash we saw yesterday14:00
seb128didrocks, a workaround, yes14:00
seb128didrocks, the issue seems a pygobject one14:00
didrocksright, a workaround14:01
seb128didrocks, don't bother backporting it14:01
seb128I will do a rhythmbox snapshot update in the next days14:01
didrocksseb128: ok, perfect! Thanks :)14:01
seb128didrocks, thank you for bringing that upstream and the f-spot issue as well14:01
seb128and yes I'm watching you ;-)14:01
pittichrisccoulson, seb128: so what's the status of firefox and those langpacks? do I have a todo item for copying those to -proposed/-updates or who will?14:01
* didrocks returns and look at his back14:01
seb128pitti, they need to go to security14:02
didrocksseb128: no, you aren't there! How do you do?14:02
seb128didrocks, ;-)14:02
seb128pitti, but when firefox 3.6.4 will be available from mozilla which is still not the case I think?14:02
seb128chrisccoulson, ^14:02
pittiseb128: ok, so those are on hold for now; the copying to the moz ppa was done, I take it?14:02
seb128pitti, I would appreciate if you could do the copy on time14:03
seb128pitti, yes14:03
seb128pitti, they are in the moz ppa right now14:03
seb128pitti, they will be copied with the security update14:03
pittiseb128: I can, but I'd appreciate if someone could poke me when ffox gets copied over14:03
seb128I guess jdstrand or whoever does the copy will copy all together14:03
pittiseb128: it'd be the very same process as copying ffox itself14:03
pittiright, that seems easiest14:03
pittiinstead of doing it by two different persons, I mean14:04
seb128pitti, so no todo item for you ;-)14:04
pittiok, thanks14:04
pittiI was just wondering what to do with ArneGoetje's mails, but seems that it's being handled14:04
* pitti hugs you all14:04
pittiyou see, nobody is missing me :)14:04
* seb128 hugs pitti14:04
seb128oh, we do!14:04
* didrocks hugs pitti, we miss you14:05
seb128pitti, but good point about ArneGoetje's emails, chrisccoulson said he would reply to those some days ago14:05
seb128chrisccoulson, ^ did you copy the extra langpacks from those emails to the mozilla ppa? could you reply to the email saying where we stand with those updates?14:06
pittiseb128: I did reply with "waiting for fffox to go to -security"14:06
desrtrobert ancell and myself are in incredibly incompatible timezones...14:07
chrisccoulsonhey pitti - i don't think you need to do anything with the langpacks do you? they're currently in the u-m-s PPA, and they just get copied to -security with the security update don't they?14:07
chrisccoulson(i think that's how it's working)14:07
seb128chrisccoulson, right, that's we concluded as well there14:08
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i uploaded those extra langpacks but forgot to send an e-mail ;)14:08
seb128chrisccoulson, could you confirm you did grab the updated ones ArneGoetje listed some days ago?14:08
seb128chrisccoulson, ok14:08
seb128chrisccoulson, no news of the update from mozilla yet?14:08
chrisccoulsonnot yet, but i think it will happen quite soon14:08
chrisccoulsoni'm hoping to have karmic in a state that can be tested by tomorrow14:09
rickspencer3tremolux, hey14:33
tremoluxrickspencer3: hey Rick14:34
rickspencer3tremolux, I see mpt created a design for new apps14:34
rickspencer3and you have a work item to implement it14:34
rickspencer3does it seem feasible to get it done for A2?14:34
tremoluxrickspencer3: looking14:36
tremoluxrickspencer3: yep, it's feasible for A214:40
kenvandinesucks not being able to read twitter dev docs because of fail whale!14:41
=== al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away
tremoluxrickspencer3: I should qualify that; we may not have it pixel-perfect for A2, but to have the section there displaying the apps should be doable14:46
rickspencer3tremolux, could you add a work item such as "refine implementation to match specs" to A3?14:47
tremoluxrickspencer3: yes, good idea14:47
jcastrohey kenvandine, have you been following the twitter api thing ryan is concerned about?14:49
nessitahello everyone14:51
rickspencer3hi nessita, 'sup?14:51
nessitarickspencer3: hey there! just now I remember chipaca told me to talk with you about the agenda in the next sprint in prague14:52
nessitaseb128: about the package I uploaded yesterday (ubuntu-sso-client), do I have to do any further steps? I uploaded an update to https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/maverick/ubuntu-sso-client/maverick14:53
kenvandinejcastro, yes... we are stressed about getting that resolved and SRU'd14:53
nessitaseb128: would you be able to sponsor it?14:53
nessitarickspencer3: not sure what "talk about the agenda" means, but maybe you know :-)14:53
rickspencer3I don't know :/14:54
seb128nessita, hi, sorry I'm quite busy with other things right now14:54
nessitaseb128: no problem, would you know who can be able to do it?14:54
nessitarickspencer3: heh, I ask Chipaca then14:54
ftaSarvatt, excellent. let me know if you have ideas to improve it, or if you need more info on the page16:09
blue_annaI'm having a problem with empathy client crashing on incoming voice calls (but not outbound)16:11
blue_annasomeone suggested upgrading libpurple, another libtelepathy -- do you know if I should try one, or the other, or both?16:12
didrocksalf__: I would say, don't bump the ABI if upstream doesn't do it. Can you convince them to remove the exposal of json_*, force the external dep and so bump the soname?16:13
ftaSarvatt, i will probably add a popup for the Repositories, instead of just an "X". and i probably need to cache the data between sessions, so it's faster to update. btw, how often do you update it?16:14
blue_annawell I'm just going to guess16:16
alf__didrocks: I can try :) but I don't expect they will. According to them, the internal json-glib is not supposed to be used by distributions.16:17
didrocksalf__: another solution is to look at rdepends :)16:17
didrocksblue_anna: try on #ubuntu16:17
alf__didrocks: To see if anyone really uses the exported json_* functions?16:17
blue_annaI did -- but since I got conflicting advice about which libs were involved I thought I'd try to get it clarified here16:18
didrocksalf__: right, in the internal dependency16:18
alf__didrocks: internal dependency?16:19
didrocksalf__: sorry, I meant "to check if they use the internal json-glib"16:19
didrocks apt-cache rdepends libclutter-1.0-0 is not that scary16:20
=== bjf[afk] is now known as bjf
tremoluxrickspencer3: ping for a question about the Software Center update section of the weekly status16:36
rickspencer3tremolux, sure?16:36
tremoluxrickspencer3: would you like that to be more a summary of the status of things, or just to highlight what's happened during the week?16:37
tremoluxrickspencer3: meaning, if it's a summary, then unchanged items will be repeated16:37
rickspencer3tremolux, what happened during the week16:37
rickspencer3share info people need16:37
tremoluxrickspencer3: ok, sounds good16:37
tremoluxrickspencer3: thx16:38
didrockstremolux: for "hiding non app" by default, once you are in the featured app view, you get "19 other technical item", and when you click on it, nothing happen (I just think there is no technical item in the category and apps are counted as such). Known bug?16:47
tremoluxdidrocks: yes, known bug  :(16:47
tremoluxdidrocks: I have to write it up still16:47
didrockstremolux: ok, just to be sure, thanks :)16:47
tremoluxdidrocks: thanks!16:48
didrocksyou're welcome ;)16:48
rickspencer3seb128, thanks for handling the meeting17:23
rickspencer3I'll be back online for a bit in like an hour or less17:23
seb128hey everybody17:30
didrockshey seb12817:30
seb128ArneGoetje, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, pitti, tkamppeter: hello17:30
seb128did I forget anybody?17:31
tremoluxhi everybody17:31
seb128rick is not available for the meeting today17:31
seb128so I'm going to lead this one17:31
seb128I hope everybody had a good weekend and start of week ;-)17:31
chrisccoulsonhi :)17:31
seb128let's get started17:31
seb128so, previous meeting actions, oneconf17:32
seb128I guess everybody has been busy and there was not happening there?17:32
seb128didrocks, ^ did you get any feedback this week?17:32
didrocksI saw tremolux did some testing17:32
didrocksbut I hadn't any feedback, unfortunately17:32
seb128tremolux, thanks for helping didrocks there ;-)17:32
seb128didrocks, you might want to try emailing the ubuntu-desktop list17:33
tremoluxyes, I started some testing but got bogged with other things, I will do more this week tho17:33
seb128or ubuntu-devel-discuss17:33
seb128I guess it will be easier to get feedback this way17:33
didrockswill email the list so :)17:33
pittiTBH it's the first time I hear "oneconf"17:33
seb128pitti, it's on the meeting agenda for 3 weeks now17:33
tremoluxdidrocks: I realize it's important that I test it because of the integration with s-c, so I will make it a priority17:34
seb128pitti, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneConf/Testing17:34
pittiseb128: sorry17:34
didrockstremolux: thanks a lot :) users seem more interesting than developers :)17:34
* kenvandine waves... sorry mission-control-5 had my laptop pegged17:34
seb128pitti, no need to be sorry, you don't have to watch what's happening there ;-)17:34
seb128hey Riddell, kenvandine17:35
seb128ok, moving on17:35
seb128kenvandine, just on time, it's your turn17:35
kenvandineok, for DX... appmenu stuff is in main... yay17:35
kenvandineand hopefully will be by default in UNE this week17:35
seb128thanks tedg, bratsche, kenvandine, jcastro for the work on this17:35
kenvandineand seb128 :)17:36
kenvandineindicator-network should make it to universe this week, but we won't put it in main yet17:36
kenvandineit lacks any way to control settings if you have problems17:36
kenvandineso that will happen in a317:36
seb128let's see how it goes when it's universe17:36
kenvandineindicator-sound goodies should land this week, should be nice17:37
kenvandineon to OLS, their first week of weekly releases went well afaik17:37
kenvandinethey uploaded everything they planned to :)17:37
seb128rock on!17:37
seb128go ols go!17:37
kenvandinethey will be decommitting some of their a2 WIs17:38
kenvandinemore to come soon17:38
kenvandinestill discussing it17:38
kenvandinei think that is all i have for now17:38
kenvandineany questions/comments?17:38
seb128thanks kenvandine17:38
seb128just a note, current appmenu is in main but still quite buggy17:38
seb128they are working actively on it17:38
seb128so maybe wait for next update round to test it17:38
kenvandineseb128, you getting that gtk patch in maverick?17:38
kenvandinei uploaded it to the une ppa for lucid17:38
seb128kenvandine, yes, will upload after the meeting17:39
seb128does anybody has questions or comments?17:39
seb128I guess it's a no17:39
seb128let's move on17:39
seb128Riddell, hey17:39
seb128Riddell, kubuntu update?17:39
Riddell - KDE SC 4.5 Beta 2 in, still compiling on arm17:40
Riddell - MIRs needed: avogadro, openjpeg, librcps, create-resources, rekonq, pstoedit, getfem++, libspnav, plotutils17:40
Riddell - pulseaudio added to Kubuntu by default17:40
Riddellwould be nice to get those MIRs before alpha 217:40
seb128I don't know if rick managed to get anything done for those17:40
seb128asac, pitti: ^ where do we stand for mirs? I guess not active reviewer right now?17:40
Riddellsome of those asac looked at in lucid but we never completed because we decided to keep koffice in universe17:41
seb128we waved in the unity stack since it's work coming from us but other items are queuing17:41
pittiI gave up on MIRs since I still have to do a lot on SRUs; asac kindly agreed to take over the role of assigning incoming MIRs to reviewers17:41
seb128Riddell, I will check with rickspencer3 and asac after meeting what we can do to unblock those17:41
seb128does anybody has comments or questions for Riddell?17:42
seb128pitti, ok, fair enough17:42
seb128ok, moving on17:42
seb128didrocks, hey17:42
seb128UNE update?17:42
didrocksUnity is now the defaut on UNE maverick CD!17:42
didrocksThe transition should be effective for lucid -> maverick UNE upgrade and lucid UNE ppa -> maverick17:43
didrocksThe CD size is scary though, considering that we even don't have all the components in place (and most of them will land post alpha2 :/) (same size than amd64 image btw)17:43
didrocksNew release on Thursday (late), the release will be a little bit sooner and backport to UNE lucid ppa on Friday.17:43
didrocksApart from that, there is a wiki page stating how to test Unity on lucid and on maverick: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Unity17:43
* didrocks will add a oneconf link to it (kidding) :)17:43
kenvandineoff topic... holy crap my ~/.mission-control/accounts.cfg file is 512M!17:43
seb128unity \o/17:43
seb128kenvandine, -> #telepathy ;-)17:44
didrocks(that's it for me, if nobody has questions :))17:45
seb128didrocks, thanks17:45
seb128nicely done for unity17:45
didrocksthanks :)17:45
seb128the upgrade went just fine there17:45
tremoluxvery cool didrock17:45
seb128ok, moving on17:45
didrocksyeah, if anybody has some issues in upgrading scenario, do not hesitate to bug me!17:45
seb128tremolux, hey17:45
seb128software center update?17:46
seb128I see you copied one on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-06-1517:46
tremoluxsure, warning, wordy paste incoming:17:46
tremoluxNew Apps on a Stable Release: mpt has completed the design and spec for discovery/presentation of new apps here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter#Lobby%20screen17:46
tremoluxwe can begin implementing the new functionality this week17:46
tremoluxBuy Something: we had an overview of the payments API from Ricardo Kirkner including a walkthrough of the process, it was really helpful17:46
tremoluxI've started prototyping a payments widget to learn/test/use the API17:46
tremoluxAlso, mvo's basic LP integration is in place now (in the most recent release), it's still in-development so will be hidden by default at next Software Center release17:46
tremolux(sort of summarizing)  ;)17:46
* didrocks is eager to play with that :)17:47
seb128nice summary17:47
seb128and nice changes coming ;-)17:47
tremoluxyeah, lots of stuff starting to happen for these  :)17:48
seb128thank tremolux17:48
seb128that's great work!17:48
seb128does anybody has comments or questions for tremolux?17:48
tremoluxthanks seb12817:49
seb128ok, let's say it's a no, moving on17:49
seb128chrisccoulson, hey17:49
seb128chrisccoulson, I forgot to ask you before, but could you do an update on the firefox work for us?17:49
seb128where do we stand? what issues do we still have?17:49
chrisccoulsonyeah, i can give a brief update17:49
chrisccoulsonhardy is pretty much done, with the exception of a few xulrunner rdepends yet to be ported. micahg is working on those, although they aren't high priority17:50
chrisccoulsonall the issues i know about are either now resolved or have a fix in waiting17:50
seb128the font issue got fixed then?17:50
chrisccoulsoni hope to be able to get karmic in to a state to start testing tomorrow17:50
chrisccoulsonyeah, i've got a fix for the font issue17:51
seb128karmic ready for testing, nice17:51
chrisccoulsoni'm just getting the langpacks for karmic uploaded now17:51
seb128so we are almost "there"17:51
chrisccoulsonfirefox, xulrunner 1.9.2 and ubufox were uploaded today17:51
seb128I'm sure you will be glad once those will be out ;-)17:51
chrisccoulsonyeah, we're pretty much there now. i hope to be able to start winding down from this at the end of the week17:52
seb128is there still versions to land or test after karmic?17:52
chrisccoulsonthere will be jaunty too, but firefox is already uploaded for jaunty17:52
seb128thanks chrisccoulson17:53
seb128great work!17:53
chrisccoulsonthanks for helping out with the testing too :)17:53
tremoluxchrisccoulson: I think you know; I did some upgrade testing on my hardy netbook, it all worked fine for me17:53
seb128chrisccoulson, do you still need extra testing for those updates you think? do we need to do another call for testing?17:53
chrisccoulsonyeah, we should do another call for testing when jaunty and karmic are ready, but i think hardy is ok now17:54
tremoluxthat's cool, gotta feel good17:54
seb128thanks chrisccoulson17:54
seb128let's move on17:54
seb128hum, seems it's my turn17:55
seb128so we are approching alpha217:55
seb128and we just got back on the trend line17:55
seb128thanks everybody for updating your workitems!17:55
seb128the line goes until july 1st but changes should land for next week17:56
seb128ie june 24th17:56
seb128then we have some margin for tweaking, fixing and documentation17:56
seb128seems we are on shape for a2 though17:56
seb128I've already discussed workitems with team members out of the meeting mostly so no point to go through specs again there I think17:56
seb128if anybody has anything you want to discuss you are welcome to comment or ask questions now though17:57
seb128questions? comments?17:57
* didrocks yeah for being on the trend line \o/17:57
seb128ok, let's move on17:58
seb128who plans to go to GUADEC there?17:58
seb128seems we lag a bit behind on organization but I talked to rick today17:59
seb128we will get an update for the team about registration and organization details17:59
kenvandinenot me17:59
seb128I would just like to have an idea of who is going now17:59
seb128so didrocks18:00
seb128I'm going as well18:00
seb128rick is going18:00
seb128chrisccoulson, not sure if you planned to go?18:00
jcastro(remember guadec starts on wednesday this year!)18:00
seb128the 2 days before are conference days as well though18:00
seb128but not real GUADEC days18:01
chrisccoulsonseb128 - i hadn't thought about it actually18:01
chrisccoulsondo you think it's worth for me to go?18:01
seb128chrisccoulson, well, this week would be time to think about it ;-)18:01
seb128chrisccoulson, not so much for your main tasks18:01
seb128but you have bit doing quite some desktop and GNOME work18:01
seb128and it's in Europe18:02
seb128so it's close enough18:02
seb128chrisccoulson, let's chat after meeting if you want18:02
seb128I think that was it from me or the agenda18:03
seb128is any having anything to add?18:03
seb128questions, comments, announces?18:03
didrocksI want to speak about banshee by default on UNE18:03
didrocksjust to grab some inputs18:03
didrocks(no jcastro it's not the time to say +1, want 2 minutes ;))18:03
didrocksso, from the tests this week:18:03
didrocksIMHO banshee is feature-wise like for netbook user I guess (some corner cases like Upnp support missing, but netbook user can be considered having less need than desktop ones)18:04
didrocksThere is an indicator integration (currently broken in maverick because of indicator sharp bindings) and Bertrand will work on SoundMenuV2 integration18:04
didrocksThere is also the ubuntu music store plugin, it misses the "first time mp3 support download support" though.18:04
didrocksThere is an extension which gives a netbook interface (used in meego). This one is great but needs some tweaking to get to our needs. For instance, you can't import music from there18:04
didrocksYou have also the two interfaces (netbook and traditional ones) launched in the same time, which isn't great18:04
didrocksSo, little tweaking needed to integrate that to ubuntu (maybe something like 3/4 days of work). That can worth it into my mind.18:05
didrocksThose are basically a switcher between the 2 modes, not showing both interfaces per default, rename of the panel title, activate some library by default, and some lavels, ubuntuone plugin adjustement, and radio music list per default.18:05
didrocksThey can be some issues with exporting the menu (they are using there own tweaks), but we'll have to figure this out in any case.18:05
didrocksso, for me, banshee by default on UNE is a +1, any other thoughts/remarks?18:05
didrocksjcastro: do you think there a way we can encourage the community to make the netbook panel more integrated to ubuntu?18:06
kenvandinejcastro, if anyone can get it done.. it's you man!18:07
didrockss/lavels/labels of course :)18:07
* didrocks feels lonely suddenly ;-)18:09
seb128do you think we could get input from design or user testing on the netbook ui?18:09
jcastrodidrocks: sure, I just need a list of things you need (which I think we discussed last week for a minute)18:09
seb128I guess the netbook frontend is the main reason why we would like to use banshee18:09
didrocksseb128: design is very busy from what I understood, I would maybe go for some hacks, and then, have some feedback to get things moving18:10
didrocksjcastro: right, I have a more detail list, I will make it understandable and forward it to you tomorrow18:10
didrocksfor the netbook ui18:10
didrocksit's really good for small screen18:10
didrocksit doesn't handle video by design though, only music18:10
kenvandinedidrocks,  and good for touch screen, right?18:11
didrockskenvandine: better than rhythmbox or default ui. But it will require still some work18:11
didrocksbut for instance, by default, you have nothing listed in it18:11
bcurtiswxkenvandine: looking at bug #590619, I'm wondering how long you've had since last reboot. My file is only 3.4K.18:11
ubot2Launchpad bug 590619 in telepathy-mission-control-5 (Ubuntu) "Unreasonable memory usage (affects: 1) (heat: 488)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/59061918:12
didrockssaw, enabling the "auto import from Music and Videos" and write: "drop some files in Music/ so that it appears here" is an easy patch18:12
kenvandinei think almost all of the file is one line from the old haze plugin implementation of the facebook chat plugin18:12
seb128didrocks, I guess we can try to enable banshee by default on UNE and wait on comments?18:12
didrocksseb128: yeah, seems reasonable. I want to hack for the end of the week on what I can do for the ui18:13
didrocksso, seeding it eow or beginning of next seems ok18:13
didrocks(and so, alpha2 with it)18:13
bcurtiswxkenvandine: OK, so workaround being to remove accounts.config and setup your accounts again.  or is there something less destructive of that file?18:14
kenvandinebcurtiswx, i tried that it and it fixed the problem... but not sure if that entry was the problem18:14
seb128seems there is not a lot of comments18:15
seb128and bcurtiswx and kenvandine are hijacking the meeting now to discuss bugs18:15
kenvandinesorry :)18:15
seb128so let's wrap up18:15
seb128didrocks, thanks, let's try to get banshee by default and see how it goes18:16
seb128only for UNE18:16
seb128don't misquote that ;-)18:16
bcurtiswxseb128: apologies, didn't know there was a meeting18:16
didrocksseb128: sweet, will do :-)18:16
* kenvandine only hears what he wants to hear18:16
seb128bcurtiswx, no worry18:16
seb128thanks everybody18:16
didrockskenvandine: fix the indicator mono binding first :p18:16
seb128see you next week18:16
kenvandinethx seb128... banshee by default :)18:16
tremoluxthanks everyone!18:16
seb128keep rocking, alpha2 shapes to be a solid alpha version ;-)18:17
didrocksthanks everyone :)18:17
seb128kenvandine, lol18:17
* didrocks marks evaluate banshee by default on UNE as DONE :-)18:17
tremoluxdidrocks: \o/18:18
jcastrodidrocks: I will make the U1 banshee eval as done!18:18
seb128didrocks, waouh!18:18
didrocksjcastro: sweet :)18:18
rickspencer3kenvandine, so I don't think my desktopcouch databases are syncing between my lucid netbook and maverisk desktop18:19
rickspencer3is there a known problem, or should I troubleshoot when I get home?18:19
kenvandinerickspencer3, not known18:22
rickspencer3kenvandine, ok, I'll poke at it later18:22
seb128oh, rickspencer3 is back18:23
seb128hey rickspencer3 ;-)18:23
kenvandinebcurtiswx, how big is accounts.cfg for me?18:23
rickspencer3seb128, I'll be here for a few minutes, then gone again18:23
rickspencer3just here long enough to be disruptive and randomizing18:24
seb128rickspencer3, be as disruptive as you want, we finished the meeting ;-)18:24
* bcurtiswx wasn't any help to that18:24
rickspencer3seb128, can you repeat the main points of the meeting?18:25
seb128rickspencer3, we agree that everybody would be on holidays for the next 2 weeks and that you would handle alpha218:25
rickspencer3thanks seb12818:25
seb128rickspencer3, that was about it I think ;-)18:25
seb128yw ;-)18:25
rickspencer3I knew I could count on you18:26
seb128always happy to serve you and the team!18:26
didrocksI agree, my logs clearly state that :)18:28
chrisccoulsonright, karmic langpacks are uploading now18:29
chrisccoulsonthat will take a while, so I'm going to disappear for a bit to go and buy some network cable18:30
rickspencer3chrisccoulson, nice!18:30
tremoluxchrisccoulson: man, you surely do know how to have a good time!  ;)18:30
tremoluxchrisccoulson: (network cable adventure)18:31
chrisccoulsonlol ;)18:31
chrisccoulsoni need to try and hook my printer up to my router, and i thought i could also do with hooking my docking station up to the router too (in preparation for breaking networking i start testing connman)18:32
=== Amaranth_ is now known as Amaranth
sabdflhi seb128, i've bumped https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/16492 to high, would you review unclutter for MIR and CD and provide feedback and thoughts?18:39
ubot2Launchpad bug 16492 in gtk+2.0 (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 3 other projects) "Mouse pointer should disappear when keyboard is in use and mouse isn't (affects: 18) (heat: 111)" [High,Triaged]18:40
seb128sabdfl, hey18:41
seb128sabdfl, unclutter is in main already it seems18:41
seb128sabdfl, I will review it for default installation18:41
sabdflthanks seb128, much appreciate feedback either way18:42
sabdflonly complication is it needs to be in the session to be effective by default, aiui18:42
sabdflopen to other/better solutions to the bug18:42
seb128well, it seems something xorg itself should handle to me18:43
seb128but I don't know enough about the topic to comment on why it's not the case and what it would take to get xorg doing it18:44
seb128I will review what unclutter is doing and talk with our xorg team about that though18:44
seb128sabdfl, I will keep you updated, thanks for raising the topic18:44
seb128rickspencer3, did you have time to do something about the mir issue?19:02
seb128rickspencer3, seems kubuntu is blocked on it for alpha2 work19:02
ftatedg, kenvandine: i have the power manager set to never display its icon, yet, the indicator applet recently started to display one (it's a real desktop, i don't need a battery indicator). is that already a known bug?19:09
seb128fta, yes19:09
seb128fta, if you use maverickf19:09
seb128fta, the set_icon call has been broken in the most recent indicator-application update19:10
seb128ie icons will not change in the indicator right now19:10
ftaseb128, ok, thanks. if it's already tracked, i'm happy :)19:10
seb128it is19:11
* kenvandine eats... bbiab19:12
seb128didrocks, https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-une-app-selection19:22
didrocksseb128: yes?19:22
seb128didrocks, where did you get a request to evaluate nautilus?19:22
dobeyhey seb128; do you know what rule to specify in debian/rules to run "make check" under during the build, for example?19:22
didrocksseb128: it was a question on the "request feedback" LP features. However, when you answer those, it removes the question apparently19:23
seb128dobey, what packaging system?19:23
didrocksseb128: the question was "will nautilus still be there?"19:23
seb128didrocks, oh ok19:23
dobeyseb128: hrmm? cdbs19:23
dobey(i guess that's what you're asking)19:23
seb128dobey, yes ;-)19:23
ftadobey, DEB_MAKE_CHECK_TARGET=check19:26
ftaor test, or whatever your check target is called19:27
seb128dobey, what fta says19:27
dobeyfta: what about for python then?19:27
seb128fta, thanks, I was searching for it ;-)19:27
ftanot sure python has that, let me check19:28
sorenDEB_MAKE_CHECK_TARGET is defined by class/autotools.mk19:29
ftanope, it's just implemented for makefile, autotools and perl19:30
sorenit's not there if only debhelper and python-distutils are included.19:30
sorenErr... I'm full of it.19:31
sorenIt's used in class/makefile.mk19:31
ftaboth autotools and perl* include makefile.mk and it's there19:31
soren...but still, if only debhelper and python-distutils are included, it's not used.19:31
sorenfta: Right.19:32
ftait's trivial to add though19:32
ftabut it's often not needed for python as it could be done in setup.py19:34
bcurtiswxmaverick uploads from debian-unstable or -experimental?19:36
micahgbcurtiswx: auto-sync is from unstable19:37
seb128chrisccoulson, do you have any time for a non firefox task?19:37
bcurtiswxmicahg: do you know how a package makes it from -experimental to -unstable?19:38
micahgbcurtiswx: do you want to merge something?19:38
bcurtiswxthe new empathy is in -experimental19:38
micahgbcurtiswx: stuff can be merged from experimental as needed, but seb128 or someone else would have to approve that I think19:40
seb128bcurtiswx, we don't plan to update GNOME this cycle19:41
seb128bcurtiswx, we will get GNOME3 over 2 cycles19:41
seb128bcurtiswx, we will take empathy later on if they clarify they will not require gtk319:41
dobeyseb128, fta: thanks, it at least put me in the right place to look to do it for my python package :)19:42
bcurtiswxseb128: OK, hmm.  Thx.  Maybe I'll learn to package from a source build and provide empathy for those interested in a PPA until it requires GTK319:45
seb128bcurtiswx, isn't the empathy team doing that?19:45
bcurtiswxseb128: the telepathy team you mean.. right?19:45
bcurtiswxseb128: the telepathy team has a PPA, yes.19:46
seb128isn't that the same team?19:46
seb128but right, them19:46
bcurtiswxseb128: yeah, i guess i never heard it referred specifically as the empathy team.. but its the same..19:46
seb128I think they will do 2.31 builds if we don't19:46
baptistemm_hi there19:53
baptistemm_pedro_, hi, could you renew my membership to ubuntu-bugcontrol ?19:54
pedro_baptistemm_, hey, yes let me have a look19:55
baptistemm_when you have time19:55
pedro_baptistemm_, renewed19:56
baptistemm_thanks a lot19:57
pedro_you're welcome19:57
dobeywhy the heck is my clock applet freezing20:01
bcurtiswxlocal temporal anomoly in subspace?20:05
bcurtiswx</being a goof>20:05
LaserJockdidrocks: is there a particular reason why the UNE PPA has a newer Qt?20:07
didrocksLaserJock: it's for the appmenu testing20:10
LaserJockI see20:11
LaserJockdidrocks: geeze, it's almost impossible to "uninstall" Unity on lucid20:21
didrocksLaserJock: what do you mean? you have to downgrade the upgraded package, and remove unity packages, isn't it?20:23
LaserJockyeah, but it won't downgrade20:24
LaserJocktoo many interdependencies that want to wipe out all of gtk20:24
LaserJockit must be the "transition" plan for the new world order ;-)20:25
didrocksLaserJock: well, the appmenu things brings a lot, right :-)20:25
LaserJockperhaps it should have its own PPA20:25
didrocksbut apt-cache policy and apt-get install lib=<…> FTW :)20:25
didrockswe discussed that a lot, but we think that people wanting to test should have the full maverick experience20:26
didrocks(an easy way to get it)20:26
jcastroLaserJock: I should make a note in the wiki about that.20:27
didrocksjcastro: some big red blinking warning? :)20:28
LaserJockfrom that PPA I have 129 .debs listed20:28
LaserJockthat's a rather large PPA20:28
bcurtiswxseb128: Zdra in #empathy on gimpnet  says he doesn't think they will require gtk3.0 this cycle20:29
didrocksyeah, but there are binary one whith different version20:29
didrocksoh qt…20:29
didrocksmaybe it has a lot of packages20:29
bcurtiswxseb128: but its my word, idk what you would need to make desktop team feel better about including empathy this cycle20:29
didrocksLaserJock: right, qt ones have a lot, so if you have a qt app, it will upgrade a lot20:30
didrocks(away for half an hour, bbiab)20:30
bcurtiswxcya didrocks20:30
didrockscia bcurtiswx20:30
jcastroLaserJock: didrocks: how's this? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Unity20:32
jcastrooops, pages->packages20:33
didrocksjcastro: sounds great :)20:33
LaserJockjcastro: I guess that'd work20:34
didrocksthe missing script is really a script to "clean" from a ppa for you, as xorg-edgers have. But as we don't really support downgrading, it should work for most cases20:34
LaserJockI had to do: sudo apt-get install gtk2-engines-pixbuf=2.20.1-0ubuntu1 libgail-common=2.20.1-0ubuntu1 libgail18=2.20.1-0ubuntu1 libgtk2.0-0=2.20.1-0ubuntu1 libgtk2.0-dev=2.20.1-0ubuntu120:34
didrocksbut we can still have cornercases where the behavior isn't exactly the same20:34
LaserJockthe rest I could remove/downgrade OK in synaptic20:34
didrocksLaserJock: right, you can't say "for this source package, downgrade all binary ones to <version>"20:35
didrocksthat would be sweet as well :)20:35
LaserJocknormally I use synaptic20:35
LaserJockbut it wouldn't let me do those at the same time20:35
didrocksI don't really know how that works with synaptic TBH20:35
LaserJockI didn't know you could do = with apt20:36
didrockswell, now you know :)20:36
didrocks(really away now)20:36
Zdrabcurtiswx, seb128: Unless something force us to use gtk3.0 (which I doubt since libunique is going to be ported) I don't think we'll hard-dep on gtk320:42
ZdraIMO being shipped in ubuntu is by many order of amplitude more important for us than requiring gtk320:43
seb128Zdra, thanks20:46
seb128Zdra, I think we will update, if you really needs to depends on gtk3 we will figure what to do20:46
seb128Zdra, we can distro change to not require gtk3 or you can keep ifdef in the code maybe for this cycle20:47
Zdraseb128, maybe wait for cassidy's confirmation as he is maintainer, but I think he agree with me on this :)20:47
seb128there is no hurry for it20:47
Zdrasince today we dep on gtk 2.21.2 and we build with GSeal and everything20:47
Zdraso we should be gtk3-ready :p20:48
Zdraonce all our deps get ported too20:48
seb128Zdra, right20:50
TheMusoGood morning.23:09
RAOFTheMuso: Good early morning!23:33
TheMusoIndeed. Tis a lovely morning here in Sydney.23:36
RAOFIt's quite cold here (2℃, apparently).23:42
RAOFHm.  Time to shift locations.  Apparently the electricians will want to be pulling the power up and down a lot today.v23:42

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