[00:28] <shadeslayer_> btw does konqueror ship apturl support by default or did we patch that part in?
[00:33] <ScottK> We patch it in
[00:35] <shadeslayer_> ScottK: which patch is that?
[00:36] <shadeslayer_> ScottK: im working on getting that feature in rekonq ;)
[00:36] <ScottK> shadeslayer_: No idea.  It'll be in kdebase.  I just know it's a distro specific feature.
[00:36] <shadeslayer_> ScottK: hmm.. well i checked kdebase,couldnt find it there
[00:36] <shadeslayer_> ScottK: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kdebase/ubuntu/files/head:/debian/patches/
[00:37] <ScottK> Maybe kde4libs then.
[00:38] <shadeslayer_> nope
[00:39] <shadeslayer_> ScottK: ^
[00:39] <ScottK> I'd guess workspace or runtime next then.
[00:41] <shadeslayer_> i think workspace.. but im checking it out
[00:41] <shadeslayer_> uh.. nope
[00:41] <shadeslayer_> ScottK: any idea who would know?
[00:42] <ScottK> Nope.
[00:42] <ScottK> I'd guess Riddell or apachelogger, but no idea.
[00:42] <shadeslayer_> lex79: any idea where the patch for apturl support in konqueror resides ?
[00:44] <lex79> I never seen a patch for that in ours KDE packages
[00:44] <lex79> you should maybe looking at apturl-kde code
[00:46] <shadeslayer_> lex79: nothing there apart from some code...
[00:47]  * shadeslayer_ thinks patch would be in kdebase
[00:56] <shadeslayer_> well if someone can point me to the patch,ill be really gratefull :)
[00:56] <shadeslayer_> going to sleep for now :)
[01:27] <JontheEchidna> apturl is an external application that registers support for the apt:/ protocol
[01:27] <JontheEchidna> shadeslayer_, ScottK: ^
[01:28] <JontheEchidna> so when you visit a apt:/ link, KDE's existing magic looks for the app registered for the protocol, no patching required
[01:40] <ScottK> Oh.  Even better.
[01:42] <shtylman> bleh... kde 4.5 feels sluggish on my nvidia card
[01:45] <ScottK> If you use the whole machine and not just the video card, it'll probably go faster.
[01:46] <shtylman> funny ScottK
[01:47] <ScottK> ;-)
[02:08] <shtylman> why in the hell does kopete add "user is typing a message" to the notifications
[02:08] <shtylman> what the hell
[02:08] <shtylman> these notifications are getting crazy
[02:08] <shtylman> and useless
[02:09] <maco> hahahaha
[02:09] <lex79> :D
[02:09] <shtylman> seriously
[02:09] <shtylman> what the hell
[02:10] <shtylman> I can't even find where to turn this off
[02:10] <shtylman> who thought this would be a good idea?
[02:10] <shtylman> I want to know
[02:10] <lex79> next step will be "you are moving the mouse"
[02:10] <shtylman> yea
[02:10] <shtylman> seriously...
[02:11] <ScottK> I recently started using kopete again after a long break from doing any IM at all and I agree about the notifications.
[02:11] <lex79> maybe kopete has a settings notification somewhere...I don't use it
[02:11] <ScottK> Not that I found.
[02:12] <lex79> settings -> configure notifications ?
[02:12] <shtylman> lex79: yea
[02:12] <shtylman> I basically disabled all the "show notification" ones
[02:12] <lex79> ;)
[02:12] <shtylman> it is retarded
[02:12] <shtylman> we need to disable some of those by default
[02:13] <lex79> yes we should
[08:06] <apachelogger> ScottK: http://reviewboard.kde.org/r/3274/
[08:07] <apachelogger> ScottK: IMHO this should be taken up with upstream, there is no rationale I can think of that would justify having such notifications on by default
[08:37] <apachelogger> Nightrose: http://imagebin.ca/view/kPjcIpeY.html <-- those are statistics on my knowledge management assignments, clearly I must be knowledge management overlord after 32 pages of that ;)
[08:37] <apachelogger> that is pure text, no empty lines ;)
[08:38] <Nightrose> apachelogger: :P clearly
[08:39] <apachelogger> in my last assignment I even open sourced the showcase company's product ;)
[08:40] <Nightrose> lol
[08:40] <Nightrose> cool
[08:41] <apachelogger> "We are planning to boldly go where few have gone before. We are going to release the core components and a slimmed down version of our groupware as open source software and continue development on the published parts as an open source project."
[08:41] <apachelogger> ^^
[09:27] <apachelogger> http://www.linuxinsider.com/story/Lets-Deep-Six-Facebook-and-Do-Open-Source-Social-Networking-Instead---Pro-Evan-Prodromou-70256.html
[09:34] <nigelb> apachelogger: interesting
[09:43] <Riddell> who's Ernesto Ruge and do I want to be his friend?
[09:44] <nigelb> heh
[09:46] <Riddell> or indeed Robert Frießleben
[09:54] <shadeslayer_> JontheEchidna: ok well with rekonq it doesnt happen
[09:54] <shadeslayer_> JontheEchidna: so i think ill have to hard code that into rekonq :P
[09:55] <shadeslayer_> they have a different URL bar for stuff... when i type apt://rekonq,it googles that part
[09:55] <apachelogger> Riddell: latter is one of the german kubuntu dudes, not sure about the former, though I seem to remember its name ^^
[09:55]  * shadeslayer_ didnt know Riddell was on facebook
[09:55] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: their code is broken, ought to be fixed :P
[09:55] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: localhost:80 will not work either
[09:56] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: hehe... im onto the apturl stuff tho :P
[09:56] <shadeslayer_> adjam gave me a few pointers last night
[09:56] <apachelogger> that is the wrong POV
[09:56] <apachelogger> in KDE you implement once and use it a lot
[09:56] <apachelogger> if you implement the url bar properly once you get free access to all protocols supported by KDE
[09:56] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: which port is CUPS on?
[09:57] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[09:57] <apachelogger> 600 something I think
[09:57] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: btw whats on port 80?
[09:57] <apachelogger> 638 is the web interface at least
[09:57] <apachelogger> 80 == http
[09:57] <apachelogger> you can use any port and rekonq will fail for that matter
[09:58] <Riddell> shadeslayer_: too late. I just did my bi-monthly facebook login, you'll have to wait until I get enough friend requests to be annoyed enough to log in and accept some :)
[09:59] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: nope,cups is on 631,seems to work :)
[09:59] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: lol.... same here...
[09:59] <shadeslayer_> hardly visit fb :p
[09:59] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: if you just enter localhost:631?
[09:59] <shadeslayer_> yep
[09:59] <apachelogger> that is odd
[10:00] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: git clone here
[10:00] <apachelogger> oh maybe they worked around further to support that usecase
[10:00]  * nigelb added Riddell :)
[10:00] <shadeslayer_> tho port 80 does not work
[10:00] <apachelogger> only 30000000 work arounds to go to reach feature equality with konqueror \o/
[10:00] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: supposedly because you have no webserver running ;)
[10:01] <shadeslayer_> yeah :P
[10:01] <apachelogger> if it cant find anything it will google I think
[10:01] <shadeslayer_> nope...
[10:01] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: it shows a sor of 404 page
[10:01] <shadeslayer_> *sort
[10:02] <apachelogger> well, my ISP takes me to the lands of avalon if it cant resolve a name so I dont know
[10:02] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: mind getting a snapshotty of the page?
[10:02] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: http://imagebin.ca/view/Evfjqk.html
[10:03] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: also, if that is the case then localhost:$PORT is still broken, since it behaes differently :P
[10:03] <shadeslayer_> hehe
[10:03] <apachelogger> well *shrug*
[10:04] <shadeslayer_> i dont have a webserver running,but cups is running fine,so i guess thats why i cant connect to 80
[10:04]  * apachelogger does not get to such an error ^^
[10:04] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: yep
[10:04] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: which version?
[10:04] <apachelogger> it is ISP related
[10:06] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: so we dont patch in support for apturl.... hmm
[10:06] <apachelogger> a) if at all this ought to be done upstream
[10:06] <apachelogger> b) it should be done properly and not hardcoded
[10:07] <shadeslayer_> hmm
[10:17] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: btw by hard coding i meant adding another test case to the url bar ;)
[10:18] <apachelogger> I know
[10:53] <Riddell> June 23rd: Tag + release RC 1   a bit of zero day ninja power needed today I fear
[10:54] <shadeslayer_> :)
[10:55] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: tar balls up?
[10:55] <shadeslayer_> dont think so...
[10:55] <Riddell> nope
[11:22] <Riddell> apachelogger: what's the status of Google Gadget Plasma Support  ?
[11:24] <apachelogger> Riddell: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/plasma-scriptengine-googlegadgets
[11:25] <apachelogger> Riddell: one ought to remember updating that via lp:~kubuntu-members/plasma-scriptengine-googlegadgets/ubuntu/
[11:25] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: ^ that probably ought to be added to the ninja wiki page
[11:25]  * apachelogger goes back to preperation for knowledge management exam
[11:27] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: sure will do
[11:27] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: the packaging status page right?
[11:29] <Riddell> shadeslayer_: yes
[11:29] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: ok
[11:29] <Riddell> debfx: slashdot says vlc 1.1 is out, are you planning to package it along with phonon-vlc?
[11:33] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: apachelogger done
[11:33] <Riddell> you rock shadeslayer_ 
[11:34] <shadeslayer_> :)
[12:06] <Riddell> hmm, plasma-mobile doesn't start because of debian/patches/Install_libplasma_bindings_to_plugins_dir.diff
[12:06] <Riddell> that library isn't a plugin
[12:07] <Riddell> alas, no rbelem to poke
[12:13] <JontheEchidna> omg omg
[12:13] <JontheEchidna> http://scifiwire.com/2010/06/nasa-discovers-crack-in-t.php
[12:13]  * JontheEchidna runs around in circles
[12:14] <apachelogger> T
[12:14] <apachelogger> t
[12:15] <apachelogger> cant see no crack
[12:15] <apachelogger> wow, flash pugins jumping at me \o/
[12:15] <apachelogger> omg
[12:15] <apachelogger> omg!!!!!!
[12:15] <apachelogger> the end of the universe is near
[12:15] <apachelogger> omg!!!!!
[12:16] <apachelogger> ...and the doctor is locked away...
[12:16] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: can we please meet friday at stonehenge?
[12:16] <ulysses> :D
[12:16]  * apachelogger would rather not disappear before getting an official A on his knowledge management course :P
[12:16] <JontheEchidna> :P
[12:17] <ulysses> a legion of romans defends stonehenge:P
[12:17] <apachelogger> I intent to free the doctor!
[12:17] <apachelogger> ulysses: surely they rotted away by now
[12:17] <ulysses> unless they were robots
[12:18] <ulysses> I really thought Rory is alive:(
[12:18] <al> $ grep ^Committed_AS: /proc/meminfo 
[12:18] <al> Committed_AS:    4885488 kB
[12:18] <al> is that a common value for a kubuntu workstation?
[12:19] <apachelogger> wha wha wha?
[12:19] <apachelogger> robots?
[12:19] <apachelogger> clearly you need to rewatch and notice that they are plastic :P
[12:20] <apachelogger> so they are rotten away or recycled by the brits 
[12:20] <ulysses> ah, the Nestene-s…
[12:20] <ulysses> does plastic recycled over ~2000 years?
[12:21] <apachelogger> *shrug*
[12:21] <apachelogger> maybe we should bring a flame thrower, just to be sure
[12:21] <apachelogger> melt them away
[12:21] <apachelogger> muhaaha
[12:21] <ulysses> :D
[12:22] <ulysses> what about the daleks? we need a Delta-wave against them
[12:22] <apachelogger> dude
[12:22] <apachelogger> do you see any gigantic battle ships flying around?
[12:22] <apachelogger> why would anyone be guarding that thing
[12:22] <ulysses> not yet
[12:23] <apachelogger> of course it is a possiblity that opening the pandorica would cause a distress signal to be sent *shrug*
[12:23] <apachelogger> flame throwers will not be of much use then
[12:24] <apachelogger> also supposedly it would be difficult for JontheEchidna to sneak one of those through customs anyway
[12:25] <ulysses> we need to call River, she is still alive maybe
[12:27] <JontheEchidna> Doctor is prolly gonna rewrite time in the finale
[12:27] <JontheEchidna> now that things can change
[12:28] <apachelogger> it is going to be epic, thats for sure
[12:28] <ulysses> oh, I forgot that he said, „Time can be rewritten.”
[12:28] <apachelogger> also rory cannot stay dead ^^
[12:28] <JontheEchidna> bbiab
[12:29] <apachelogger> anyhow, one of the most weird things ....
[12:30] <apachelogger> I seem to think that River is actually a doctor in our time
[12:30] <apachelogger> maybe she got stuck here *shrug8
[12:30] <ulysses> She could be a Time Lady?
[12:31] <Riddell> who cares about Rory, he shot Amy, she's far more important not to be dead
[12:33] <ScottK> Riddell: The plasma-mobile thing is no doubt my fault.  If you have a moment to look at it, please drop the patch, rebuild and then look at Lintian's complaints.  Clearly my suggestion wasn't the right one.
[12:33] <apachelogger> ulysses: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/02/Alex_Kingston_as_Elizabeth_Corday.jpg
[12:34] <apachelogger> Riddell: I think the doctor thinks that amy thinks that rory should not be dead either :P
[12:40] <Riddell> anyone know how to find the screen resolution without X?
[12:42] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: bug 325370 doesnt need to be tracked in launchpad
[12:42] <apachelogger> shadeslayer_: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/Specs/LucidBugTriagePolicy
[13:01] <Riddell> I conclude that startkde is probably the best place to decide whether to start plasma desktop or netbook
[13:07] <Riddell> cor, plasma-netbook a bit trippy these days if it's set to the wrong window
[13:09] <Riddell> apachelogger: how come dpkg -L apturl-kde doesn't include any kioslave stuff?
[13:21] <apachelogger> Riddell: because it is no slave ;)
[13:21] <apachelogger> Riddell: the appropriate protocol file however is in apturl-common
[13:23] <Riddell> ah hah
[13:32] <Riddell> how does this look for starting plasma-netbook in startkde?
[13:32] <Riddell> http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/U9C3fYTD
[13:32] <Riddell> shtylman: ^^
[13:35] <txwikinger> For which package do I submit a bug concerning the KDE taskbar?
[13:36] <shtylman> Riddell: what if the user has changed it themselves?
[13:36] <txwikinger> and/or the automatic startup of apps after re-login
[13:38] <Riddell> shtylman: hang on
[13:38] <Riddell> rdieter: that qt assitant tar has been updated to add the things kevin kofler pointed out were missing
[13:39] <rdieter> Riddell: thanks, we'll see if it actually works now. :)
[13:41] <Riddell> shtylman: line 4 ought to take care of that http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/KHUr5Y0S
[13:41] <Riddell> fabo: any plans to package that qt assitant tar?
[13:43] <fabo> Riddell: yes, it is
[13:50] <txwikinger> Riddell: shouldn't there be some way to be able to configure it?
[13:53] <shtylman> Riddell: isn't it better to change the rc file? than to muck around with the kdedirs?
[13:57] <shtylman> bbl... migrating to work
[13:59] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: got it,so should i close the bug? what do i write? :P
[14:06] <Riddell> txwikinger: there is a way to configure it
[14:06] <txwikinger> cool
[14:06] <Riddell> a whole kcontrol module is dedicated to it
[14:17] <Riddell> ScottK: kubuntu-meta README.Kubuntu.update sounds fiddly, can it not be scripted?
[14:21] <ScottK> Riddell: I'm sure it can.  I talked to cjwatson and I'm going to write him an email and explain what we're trying to do and ask for suggestions.
[14:21] <ScottK> Most of the best ways I see to change it inolve germinate changes.
[14:21] <ScottK> So consider that just a work around.
[14:21] <Riddell> plasma-netbook added to the desktop seed
[14:22] <Riddell> kdebase-workspace uploaded with startkde modified to load correct plasma workspace at startup
[14:22] <Riddell> kubuntu-netbook-default-settings no longer sets KDEDIRS, now done in startkde
[14:24] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: btw ill have to implement apturl with kioslaves in rekonq?
[14:25] <Riddell> shadeslayer_: no, apturl is already implemented with ioslaves
[14:25] <shadeslayer_> oh and should i close the poll ? http://www.doodle.com/7b2a2rbdtqb5g3n5
[14:25] <Riddell> rekonq just needs to be fixed so that when it's pointed at an ioslave it uses it
[14:25] <shadeslayer_> hmm
[14:26] <Riddell> shadeslayer_: yes let's do Monday at 18:30
[14:26] <shadeslayer_> ok
[14:26] <Riddell> please announce on kubuntu-devel mailing list
[14:26] <shadeslayer_> sure thing
[14:30] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: Rohan Garg has chosen: Monday, June 28, 2010 5:30 PM
[14:30] <shadeslayer_> apparently theres no 6:30 PM UTC there 0_o
[14:37] <shadeslayer_> neversfelde: did you talk to ofir ?
[14:42] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: done :)
[14:45] <ScottK> alf__: When you're doing builds of big packages like qt4-qws in asac's armel PPA, would you please consider setting the archictecture fields for the arch any binaries to the specific ones you care about (I'm guessing i386 amd64 armel) so that these builds don't take up buildd time on our slow architectures?
[14:47] <alf__> ScottK: Do you mean in the debian/control file?
[14:48] <ScottK> alf__: Yes.  Where is saya Architectecture: any, change it to Architecture: i386 amd64 armel.
[14:48] <ScottK> saya/says.
[14:48] <ScottK> That will reduce the impact your test builds have on the official archive.
[14:49]  * ScottK is, of course, guessing you don't care about powerpc and ia64 (no one cares about sparc anymore, no guess there)
[14:49] <JontheEchidna> Muon screenshot d'jour: http://simplest-image-hosting.net/i0-plasma-desktophd1494-jpg.jpg
[14:49] <alf__> ScottK: Ok, I'll keep that in mind, thanks (although I don't have access to asac's PPA)
[14:50] <ScottK> alf__: OK.  There was a recent qt4-qws upload there that had your name on it.
[14:50] <JontheEchidna> (new statusbar stuff ^.^)
[14:50] <ulysses> JontheEchidna: great:)
[14:51] <alf__> alf__: I guessed asac just copied it from my own PPA, I 'll talk to him :)
[14:51] <JontheEchidna> ulysses: btw, are the strings easy to translate? Any strings that could benefit from added context?
[14:52] <ulysses> JontheEchidna: yes, the context is very helpful (unlike some other KDE stuff:P)
[14:52] <alf__> ScottK: I guessed asac just copied it from my own PPA, I 'll talk to him :)
[15:26] <asac> ScottK: you dont like me spinning qt4-qws in a ppa ;)?
[15:27] <ScottK> asac: Not at all.  I think it's great, it just that your PPA hits all the architectures and so it has a big impact on the slower architectures like powerpc and ia64.
[15:27] <ScottK> Since (I assume) you don't care about those archs, I was just suggesting don't build for them since they are slow enough already.
[15:28] <asac> ScottK: ah. well. those are always behind. and we dont have a way to restrict ppas to just one architecture atm (but we are working on that) ... and i tried to be sensible as i didnt go for the trial and error approach :) ... we tested if the build fiinishes before that
[15:29] <ScottK> asac: If you change the Architecture field from "any" to "i386 amd64 armel" then Soyuz will do the right thing.
[15:29] <asac> ScottK: i know but its not worth the effort ;)
[15:29] <ScottK> OK.  Didn't seem to me like editing debian/control was a lot of effort.
[15:29] <asac> the unsupported ports are really behind anyway. one more or less doesnt matter that much ;) (at least thats my point)
[15:29] <asac> ScottK: i did that for chromium when i needed to do a couple of trial/error builds
[15:30] <ScottK> In general, I agree, but qt4-qws is a really long build.
[15:30] <asac> here i didnt consider it worth the effort
[15:30] <ScottK> OK
[15:30] <ScottK> It was just a suggestion.
[15:30] <asac> ... i just think we have different barriers where we start thinking about it ;)
[15:30] <asac> thanks
[15:31] <asac> just wanted to check if you were directly blocked because of those builds
[15:31] <asac> those builds == that build ;)
[15:37] <debfx> Riddell: Debian started packaging vlc 1.1 in git so I'm waiting until it's uploaded
[15:38] <debfx> do you know if a new version of vlc phonon backend is going to be released sometime soon?
[16:12] <bulldog98> neversfelde: uploaded that plasmoid to revu
[17:41] <shadeslayer> Riddell: poke :)
[17:41] <shadeslayer> well a poke to anyone who can help me with debian/watch
[17:41] <shadeslayer> do i need opts=dversionmangle=s/\+ds// \ in a watch file?
[17:42] <shadeslayer> if im not repacking the stuff
[17:43] <shadeslayer> btw you might want to look at http://shadeslayer.pastebin.com/q5us0Ci4
[18:17] <apachelogger> oh dear
[18:17]  * bulldog98 pokes someone: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=8331
[18:17] <apachelogger> obeying 80 char linebreaks AND using tabs at the same time, I might just have met the single most horrible source code ever
[18:17]  * apachelogger should award a price for that
[18:20] <apachelogger> bulldog98: Maintainer: buntu Developers <ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com>
[18:21] <bulldog98> apachelogger: Kubuntu Developers?
[18:21] <apachelogger> read that line carefully
[18:21] <ScottK> bulldog98: Ubuntu.
[18:23] <apachelogger> me and lintian are unhappy
[18:23] <apachelogger> W: plasma-widget-babeleo: extended-description-line-too-long
[18:23] <bulldog98> apachelogger: I saw that tippo, but I wasn’t sure if kubuntu would be right
[18:23] <apachelogger> bulldog98: debian/rules is no sample anymore is it?
[18:24] <bulldog98> apachelogger: I’ll  fix that
[18:24] <apachelogger> bulldog98: backaging should be licesensed GPL2+ to be in line with upstream
[18:24] <apachelogger> s/backaging/packaging
[18:24] <bulldog98> apachelogger: ok
[18:25] <apachelogger> download url in copyright should not point to particular tarball but a location where one can obtain the (latest) tarball
[18:25] <apachelogger> otherwise one must update it for every update
[18:26] <apachelogger> the url for the homepage field in control should be percent-encoded
[18:26] <apachelogger> Description: A fast translator and web query plasmoid for KDE SC
[18:27] <apachelogger> I would rephrase that to not mention KDE SC and avoid the term plasmoid, since a suer will most likely not encounter either of those terms in his system thus not be able to put it into context
[18:27] <apachelogger> bug #597029
[18:27] <ScottK> IIRC widget would be the preferred term.
[18:28] <apachelogger> otherwise it seems to be fine
[18:29] <bulldog98> apachelogger: how do I add an URL for the latest package on kde-look
[18:30] <apachelogger> oi
[18:30] <apachelogger> or mabye not
[18:30] <apachelogger> bulldog98: just use the regular url you would use for homage (also percent-encoded for course)
[18:30] <apachelogger> ALSO
[18:30] <apachelogger> that icon....
[18:30] <apachelogger> http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://www.linkmatrix.de/icon/128/0128-coelho-babelfish.png&imgrefurl=http://www.linkmatrix.de/icon_128&usg=__0eyMoyIp7iyEyJtClNgxsjbN20M=&h=128&w=128&sz=15&hl=de&start=50&tbnid=_DD3G7qET1D__M:&tbnh=91&tbnw=91&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dbabelfish%26start%3D40%26um%3D1%26hl%3Dde%26sa%3DN%26tbs%3Disch:1&um=1&itbs=1
[18:31] <apachelogger> clearly is not coming from upstream, meaning someone else holds copyright, meaning probably also a license
[18:31] <apachelogger> neither is mentioned
[18:32] <apachelogger> bad bad upstream not giving credit to artists
[18:34] <apachelogger> http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Crystal_Clear
[18:34] <apachelogger> "Icons from the Crystal Clear icon set by Everaldo Coelho. – The icons are licensed under the GNU Lesser General Public License (LGPL)."
[18:37] <dantti> can some python soul give me a hand with this http://pastebin.com/ucVCTi2s  it fails importing the module but update-manager-core is installed here...
[18:39] <apachelogger> http://sommeroida.oebb.at/ sometimes I wonder if austria is so horrible by choice or accident -.-
[18:40] <apachelogger> dantti: is it installing the files in appropriate directories?
[18:41] <JontheEchidna> dantti: that script prints "true" for me
[18:41]  * apachelogger is wondering how that many people gained copyright on so few code ^^
[18:41] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: if i add something at the top of patches,its ignored right?
[18:41] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: at the top of patches? ignored by whom, what, when?
[18:42] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: by the patch system when building a package
[18:43] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: quilt patch files should start with a description of patch. All lines
[18:43] <shadeslayer> N:    before the start of the patch itself are considered part of the
[18:43] <shadeslayer> N:    description. You can edit the description with quilt header -e when the
[18:43] <shadeslayer> N:    patch is at the top of the stack
[18:43] <shadeslayer> oops... i thought that would come in one line
[18:43] <apachelogger> ahhh
[18:43] <apachelogger> yes
[18:43] <apachelogger> ^^
[18:44] <ScottK> dantti: What is "here"?
[18:44] <ScottK> It imports fine for me on Maverick.
[18:45]  * apachelogger thinks that dantti's update-manager-core installs the files to a dir unaccessible by dantti's default python
[18:45] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: you might want to consider http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep3/
[18:45] <dantti> apachelogger: hmm it's probably that, I'm on a debian machine now..
[18:45] <bulldog98> apachelogger: could be the copyright from 2000?
[18:45] <apachelogger> well
[18:45] <ScottK> dantti: Which release?
[18:45] <apachelogger> dantti: dpkg -L update-manager-core
[18:45] <dantti> ScottK: testing
[18:46] <apachelogger> and python --version
[18:46] <ScottK> dantti: Try it with python2.6, not python
[18:46] <apachelogger> bulldog98: I dunno upstream should this be working out really
[18:46] <apachelogger> bulldog98: also the other icons have probably also be derived by someone else than upstream
[18:46] <dantti> apachelogger: http://pastebin.com/rzsvCmDP
[18:47] <dantti> Python 2.5.5
[18:47] <apachelogger> bulldog98: so what upstream needs to do is properly attribute the creator of the images, mention that the images are LGPL (+version) and add a complete copy of that lgpl version
[18:47] <ScottK> dantti: 2.5 is still default in testing, but 2.6 is default in Ubuntu.
[18:47] <bulldog98> apachelogger: ok so we have to wait for some upstream reaction 
[18:47] <apachelogger> ohm
[18:47] <dantti> ScottK: what do I need to change here then? install py2.6?
[18:48] <ScottK> (It's also default in Sid, but that's not directly relevant)
[18:48] <apachelogger> ScottK, dantti: the package is bonkers
[18:48] <apachelogger> MetaRelease.py(c) is not present
[18:48] <bulldog98> apachelogger: I wrote him about that issue
[18:48] <apachelogger> so either debian fiddled it in some other package or does not have it at all or something
[18:48] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: hmm.. ive seen the examples but how do i add that info? where do i add it to?
[18:48] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: top of the patch
[18:49] <apachelogger> http://patches.ubuntu.com/q/qt4-x11/ that is one large patch Oo
[18:49] <shadeslayer> omg
[18:49] <dantti> http://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=contents&keywords=MetaRelease.py&mode=filename&suite=unstable&arch=any
[18:49] <dantti> apachelogger: probably i need to grab the unstable then :P
[18:49] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: 247 MB patch
[18:50] <shadeslayer> chromium now has kwallet support ;)
[18:50] <apachelogger> dantti: it would appear so :P
[18:51] <apachelogger> still the question is of course where the file did go to in testing ;)
[18:51] <dantti> hehe, dam update-apt-xapian bloking my installation... :/
[18:54] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: do we have a full example with description and stuff anywhere?
[18:54] <shadeslayer> in bzr maybe?
[18:55] <shadeslayer> lex79: are new tarballs out?
[18:55] <lex79> nope
[18:55] <shadeslayer> ah ok :)
[18:55]  * shadeslayer was receiving wiki updates
[18:56] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: we do not do dep3 (not yeat anyway, doubt we ever will, well, maybe for large patches)
[18:56] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: https://build.opensuse.org/package/view_file?file=desktop-translations.diff&package=kdelibs4&project=openSUSE:11.2
[18:56] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: hmm... ok
[18:56] <lex79> usually I clean up the wiki and the ppa before the tag
[18:56] <apachelogger> not exactly dep3 but general example
[18:57] <shadeslayer> ill do it to make lintian happy :P
[18:57] <apachelogger> lex79: you are brilliant! \o/
[18:57]  * apachelogger hugs lex79 and while he is at it also everyone else :)
[18:57] <lex79> :-*
[18:58] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: since when does lintian complain about that slimy stuff? did some developer go mad again? :/
[18:58] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: :P
[18:59] <dantti> apachelogger: really weird... but that file still doesn't exist...
[18:59] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: http://shadeslayer.pastebin.com/58uEUdLC
[19:00] <txwikinger> ScottK: Did you feel the earthquake?
[19:00] <apachelogger> dantti: maybe the debian is broken and the packages.debian.org did just not update its cache of brokenness yet
[19:00] <txwikinger> shadeslayer: and you?
[19:00] <shadeslayer> no...
[19:00] <shadeslayer> txwikinger: no earthquake here...
[19:00] <txwikinger> shadeslayer: sorry meant someone else :D
[19:00] <ScottK> txwikinger: What earthquake?
[19:00] <shadeslayer> :P
[19:00] <txwikinger> shtylman:  Did you feel the earthquake?
[19:00] <apachelogger> shtylman: by the way, as I said to ScottK earlier, that complain about typing notifications should be filed with upstream they only recently put that in (there is an appropriate reviewboard entry)
[19:01] <txwikinger> ScottK: Apparently Ottawa and Toronto.. but I have seen something about Ohio and New York on twitter too
[19:01] <ScottK> Maryland is pretty stable as such things go.
[19:01] <ScottK> I'd be suprised if it got to here.
[19:02] <txwikinger> ScottK: http://twitter.com/#search?q=%23earthquake
[19:02] <apachelogger> ohhh
[19:02] <apachelogger> that reminds me on that great comic about tweitter and earthquakes ^^
[19:02] <txwikinger> ScottK: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/reports-of-earthquake-in-ontario/article1614941/?cmpid=rss1
[19:02] <apachelogger> http://xkcd.com/723/
[19:02] <apachelogger> \o/
[19:03] <shadeslayer> lol
[19:04] <txwikinger> http://earthquake.usgs.gov/earthquakes/recenteqsus/Maps/US10/42.52.-80.-70.php
[19:04] <txwikinger> Is even already registered
[19:04] <jjesse> felt in Grand Rapids
[19:04] <jjesse> MI
[19:05] <txwikinger> 5.5 Magnitute
[19:05] <txwikinger> I guess that are the shockwaves for the G8/G20
[19:05] <lex79> apachelogger: where opensuse keep their changes? I mean something like our bzr or fedora cvs
[19:05] <apachelogger> in their build service ;)
[19:06] <apachelogger> I do not think they have a version control (well not public anyway, I know suse used to have internal package repos, though supposedly those were replaced by the buildservice)
[19:07] <lex79> uhm buildservice is a bit confusing...
[19:07] <apachelogger> how so?
[19:07] <lex79> nvm :)
[19:09]  * apachelogger is feeling very darth vader like today
[19:10] <lex79> lol
[19:11] <dantti> is there some small ubuntu cd before lucid so I can finish and test this update-manager script to add support for that in aptcc?
[19:12] <darthvader2point> dantti: small ubuntu cd?
[19:12] <dantti> darthvader2point: yes like debian netinst
[19:13] <shadeslayer> dantti: like the net iso?
[19:13] <darthvader2point> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/MinimalCD
[19:13] <dantti> :D thanks
[19:13]  * shadeslayer uploads to revu
[19:14]  * darthvader2point should go back to knowledge management
[19:14] <darthvader2point> oh my
[19:14] <darthvader2point> I shall be so glad when exams are over -.-
[19:15] <jjesse> darthvader2point working on ITIL stuff?
[19:16] <darthvader2point> no, basically we are just playing buzzword bingo
[19:20] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: btw we decided on a meeting time/Date
[19:20] <shadeslayer> see /topic
[19:20] <darthvader2point> my claendar told me so
[19:20] <shadeslayer> :)
[19:21]  * shadeslayer hopes darthvader2point wont slaughter him with a laser saber
[19:21] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=8334
[19:22] <darthvader2point> it was like "OMG!!!! darthvader2point!!!! you haz things to attend to!!!!" and I was like "..." and my calendar went all intelectual on me and I still was like "..." and then I like opened the calendar and was all suprised
[19:22] <darthvader2point> I shall probably dream about this tonight
[19:22] <shadeslayer> haha :D
[19:23]  * shadeslayer has to learn about kioslaves to get apturl support in rekonq
[19:23] <shtylman> txwikinger: no..wait ... what?
[19:23] <shadeslayer> Quintasan: \p
[19:23] <shadeslayer> uh.. \o :D
[19:23] <Quintasan> shadeslayer: \o
[19:23] <darthvader2point> holy frenchise partner
[19:24] <txwikinger> shtylman: 5.5 earthquake north of Ottawa.. did you feel it?
[19:24] <darthvader2point> shadeslayer: no wonder you get all patchy about patch headers if people tell you that running lintian with -v will output more _errors_
[19:24]  * darthvader2point shakes head
[19:24] <shtylman> txwikinger: nope
[19:24] <darthvader2point> shadeslayer: apturl is no kioslave btw
[19:24] <txwikinger> hmm... news reports seem to be overexcited :D
[19:25] <darthvader2point> they always are
[19:26] <darthvader2point> woosh
[19:26] <darthvader2point> shadeslayer: ./src/.serve_socket.cpp.swp: Vim swap file, version 7.2
[19:26] <darthvader2point> should not be there
[19:26] <darthvader2point> ./src/translations/qipmsg_zh_CN.qm: data
[19:26] <darthvader2point> should even less be there
[19:26] <shadeslayer> uh
[19:27] <ScottK> dantti: If you need that file for Debian, I think you are screwed.
[19:27] <shadeslayer> point to self : never use vim again
[19:27] <darthvader2point> is that coming from you?
[19:27] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: whats the other file?
[19:27] <shadeslayer> yes
[19:27]  * darthvader2point is wondering why it is not in any patch then
[19:28] <dantti> ScottK: kkk :P well I just need to make that thing work so you can make a decision to switch to aptcc 
[19:28] <darthvader2point> shadeslayer: the other file is a binary translation for qt
[19:28] <darthvader2point> like a .mo to .po is a .qm to .ts
[19:28] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: ah ok.. so we do not need that file?
[19:28] <darthvader2point> well
[19:28] <darthvader2point> upstream shall strip it :P
[19:28] <darthvader2point> no point in distrubting binary blob that only bloats the tarball
[19:29] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: ok.. anything else?
[19:29] <darthvader2point> here I am sitting, and wondering why src/qipmsg-xdg-open seems to be a copy of xdg-open
[19:29] <darthvader2point> oha
[19:29] <darthvader2point> debian/copyright does not mention 
[19:30] <darthvader2point> src/qipmsg-xdg-open:9:#   Copyright 2006, Kevin Krammer <kevin.krammer@gmx.at>
[19:30] <darthvader2point> src/qipmsg-xdg-open:10:#   Copyright 2006, Jeremy White <jwhite@codeweavers.com>
[19:30] <darthvader2point> and that this file is the licensed under almighty BSD
[19:30] <darthvader2point> also
[19:30] <darthvader2point> test/alsa/aplay-1.0.16.c:9: *  Copyright (c) by Jaroslav Kysela <perex@perex.cz>
[19:30] <darthvader2point> and same with .15.c
[19:31] <shadeslayer> ah theres where all copyrights are
[19:31] <darthvader2point> ALSO
[19:31] <Quintasan> THE GAME
[19:31] <Quintasan> :P
[19:31] <darthvader2point> those files are licensed under GPLv2
[19:31] <darthvader2point> not mentioned either
[19:31] <darthvader2point> 2+ actually
[19:32] <darthvader2point> also
[19:32] <darthvader2point> ah
[19:32] <darthvader2point> brrr
[19:32] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: brrrrrrruuuuuuuuummmmmmmmmm ?
[19:32] <darthvader2point> upstream should add copyright statements to the files he has copyright on
[19:32] <shadeslayer> :P
[19:33] <darthvader2point> I am not particluarly sure that the way it is done right now is indeed to be considered valid copyright
[19:33] <darthvader2point> for what it is worth one can assume that he has copyright on something, not on which files in particular though
[19:33] <shadeslayer> heh
[19:34] <darthvader2point>   * Initial release. (Closes: LP : #596366)
[19:34] <darthvader2point> that should just be LP: really
[19:34] <darthvader2point> or Closes LP:
[19:34] <darthvader2point> Closes: LP: is just weird :P
[19:35] <darthvader2point> also there is no difference between Closes LP: and LP: from a technical POV so I would recommend the latter since more commonly used
[19:35] <darthvader2point> Description: An IP Messenger implementation for linux
[19:36] <darthvader2point> according to best practise the synopsis should neither start with A or An nor feature particular upcasing (for stuff other than names)
[19:36] <darthvader2point> i.e. IP messenger implementatin for Linux
[19:36] <darthvader2point> or linux ... works too
[19:37] <darthvader2point> " based on TCP / IP (UDP)" so does it TCP/IP or UDP/IP or both? or what?
[19:38] <darthvader2point> in particular it is also considered best praticse to not reuse the app name in its description again IIRC
[19:38] <darthvader2point> " for file/folder transfer  (version 2.00 and above),and supports communication "
[19:38] <darthvader2point> whitespace errors!
[19:38] <darthvader2point> + that version 2.00 and above is rather uninteresting, what matters is if the current version does support it
[19:38] <darthvader2point> long description should probably be ended with a period
[19:39] <darthvader2point> " It can run on multiple platforms and does not require server support,support "
[19:39] <darthvader2point> whitespace errors!
[19:39] <darthvader2point> + wording can be improved "support, support"???
[19:39] <darthvader2point> in general I would rewrite the description :P
[19:39] <shadeslayer> :)
[19:39]  * darthvader2point does not find it very descriptive at all
[19:39] <shadeslayer> i took it from their site
[19:40] <darthvader2point> yeah, that is mostly a bad idea ^^
[19:40] <shadeslayer> had to use google translate
[19:40] <darthvader2point> just describe it yourself
[19:40] <darthvader2point> what it does and why one might want to use it
[19:40] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: oh and one more thing,ever compied qoauth?
[19:40] <darthvader2point> because I do not know either from the curren tone
[19:40] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: i get this : http://pastebin.com/s456rYz8
[19:40] <darthvader2point> qoauth is in patched version in my u1 ppa
[19:40] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: no maverick packages
[19:41] <darthvader2point> well, I think I patched the tests away ;)
[19:41]  * darthvader2point finds building tests in a production release rather ewwww
[19:41] <darthvader2point> steveire: ^^^ grantlee does that too, doesnt it? :P
[19:42] <darthvader2point> steveire: also grantlee should land in lucid-backports today or tomorrow or so
[19:42] <darthvader2point> !info grantlee lucid-backports
[19:42] <darthvader2point> well, not there yet
[19:43] <darthvader2point> shadeslayer: ReleaseProcess.txt should not be installed via debian/docs
[19:43] <darthvader2point> neither should Install.txt
[19:43] <shadeslayer> righto
[19:45] <shadeslayer> IP messsenger is one of popular win-popup style message exchanger in Japan.
[19:45] <shadeslayer>  qipmsg is a kind of IP messenger clone for KDE environment.
[19:45] <darthvader2point> your watchfile does not work
[19:45] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: what do you think of that?
[19:45] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: how did you ascertain that?
[19:45] <darthvader2point> uscan --verbose -> 404
[19:46] <darthvader2point> shadeslayer: it is not for KDE really is it?
[19:46] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: meaning?
[19:47] <darthvader2point> well, it is qt, so it is just a random clone that happens to run on Linux thanks to Qt?
[19:47] <shadeslayer> hmm
[19:47] <shadeslayer> so remove KDE environs at the end
[19:51] <darthvader2point> well
[19:51] <darthvader2point> How about
[19:51] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: http://code.google.com/p/qipmsg/downloads/list
[19:51] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: and new control file : http://pastebin.com/wYR65RHk
[19:51] <darthvader2point> IP messenger clone. In Japan IP messenger is one of various popular win-popup style message exchangers.
[19:52] <darthvader2point> that is of course still implying that one knows what a win-poup style message exchanger is
[19:52] <darthvader2point> I do not know that for example ;)
[19:53] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: basically its a lan messenger
[19:54] <darthvader2point> so maybe bring that in somehow ;)
[19:54] <darthvader2point> IP messenger clone that can be used for message exchange in a local network. In Japan ...
[19:56]  * darthvader2point gets the chills from the pastebin plasmoid  -.-
[19:56] <darthvader2point> shadeslayer: http://paste.ubuntu.com/454075/
[19:57] <shadeslayer> darthvader2point: yeah..
[19:58]  * shadeslayer wonders how to fix that
[19:59] <darthvader2point> url scraping ^^
[19:59] <darthvader2point> see man uscan
[19:59] <darthvader2point> !man uscan
[19:59] <darthvader2point> ohh :(
[19:59] <darthvader2point> !help uscan
[19:59] <darthvader2point> ohhh :(
[19:59] <darthvader2point> !doc uscan
[19:59]  * darthvader2point kicks ubottu
[20:03] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: fixed watch file
[20:07] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: http://pastebin.com/gRxpcybN
[20:08] <shadeslayer> or should i remove last line?
[20:08] <apachelogger> yes
[20:09] <apachelogger> XSBC-Original-Maintainer is usually below the Maintainer field btw
[20:09] <apachelogger> oha
[20:09] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: it is Qt not QT
[20:09] <apachelogger> QT ~= QuickTime (among other things)
[20:10] <shadeslayer> :P
[20:10] <shadeslayer> fixed
[20:13] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: if i modify 2 files with the 2 patches,how can i combine the 2 patches?
[20:14] <shadeslayer> like into 1 patch
[20:21] <apachelogger> quilt push to the first file
[20:21] <apachelogger> then quilt add the files you need to track additionally
[20:21] <apachelogger> then manually patch the second patch in
[20:21] <apachelogger> then quilt refresh to update the first patch
[20:21] <apachelogger> then quilt remove the second patch
[20:24]  * shadeslayer is starting to have a headache :P
[20:24] <shadeslayer> gtg
[20:34] <nixternal> woo, new lappy came with Kubuntu 10.04 pre-installed....gotta love zareason!
[20:34] <jjesse> yayaya
[20:35] <apachelogger> cool
[20:35] <apachelogger> nixternal: time to upgrade then  ;)
[20:35] <nixternal> mav good enough to upgrade to right now?
[20:38]  * apachelogger traditionally only upgrades in beta
[20:39] <ScottK> nixternal: At the moment I find it a lot slower that Lucid.
[20:39] <ScottK> I have it running on my netbook and it does work though.
[20:39] <nixternal> k, i will stick with lucid for the time being
[20:39] <nixternal> need to set up the build stuff and get rocking
[20:40] <nixternal> i am so damn cheap...trying to find a hard drive for this server...i am bit nervous about the drive that is in it right now...it failed once it seems, but it is working now, and no noises...will keep an eye on the logs
[20:40] <nixternal> guess what?
[20:40] <nixternal> new laptop today
[20:41] <nixternal> and the weather outlook for today is tornados
[20:41] <jjesse> nixternal did you feel the earthquake?
[20:42] <nixternal> no i didn't
[20:42] <nixternal> did you?
[20:42] <jjesse> me either :(
[20:42] <nixternal> of course the over reactors are on the news saying "oh it was a loud rumble, like thunder, and then the building started shaking"
[20:42] <nixternal> I call bullshit on all of them
[20:42] <nixternal> i am sitting on a slab of concrete and didn't feel a damn thing
[21:05] <apachelogger> shadeslayer, lex79: btw you might want to consider backporting plasma-scirptengine-googlegadgets this time
[21:05] <apachelogger> so I can go on a promotion tour
[21:05] <apachelogger> \o\o Kubuntu o/o/
[21:06] <JontheEchidna> "We finally have something most distros had back in 4.1" \o/
[21:06] <JontheEchidna> :3
[21:06] <apachelogger> it is not about selling new stuff, it is about making the customer think it is new
[21:06] <apachelogger> iphone 4 can do video telephony !!! OMG !!!
[21:07] <apachelogger> austria had that in flipping 2004 or so -.-
[21:07]  * JontheEchidna tears libept dependency out of libqapt :/
[21:08] <JontheEchidna> They bumped the .so to 1.0 and removed the textsearch class :(
[21:08] <apachelogger> what is libept good for anyway?
[21:08] <apachelogger> !info libept
[21:08] <apachelogger> !info libept0
[21:08]  * apachelogger shakes head
[21:08] <JontheEchidna> It had a nice little class for using xapian search
[21:09] <JontheEchidna> now I have to do this by myself: http://pastebin.com/n5xKSqAg
[21:09] <apachelogger> clone in C ^^
[21:09] <apachelogger> <3 c
[21:09] <lex79> kk
[21:09] <apachelogger> kubotu: np
[21:09] <kubotu> apachelogger is listening to "Space Invaders" by pornophonique [8-bit lagerfeuer, 2006] -- see http://www.last.fm/user/apachelogger for more
[21:09] <apachelogger> SPACE INVADERS!!!
[21:10] <JontheEchidna> ooh, time to go home
[21:10] <JontheEchidna> bbl
[21:11] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: introduce class XapianSearch?
[21:52] <dantti> JontheEchidna: hey :D 
[21:52] <JontheEchidna> o/
[21:52]  * JontheEchidna just got home
[21:52] <dantti> JontheEchidna: goind home now, I have just commited the findDebconfKDE
[21:52] <JontheEchidna> yay :D
[21:52] <dantti> JontheEchidna: pls test/fix :D
[21:52] <dantti> linking works with kpackagekit tough i didn't make use of it
[21:53] <JontheEchidna> dantti: could I see kpackagekit's cmakelists.txt for a reference please?
[21:53] <dantti> find_package(DebconfKDE REQUIRED)
[21:53] <JontheEchidna> thx
[21:54] <dantti> in the target link stuff ${DEBCONF_KDE_LIB}
[21:54] <neversfelde> bulldog98: k, ,I'll have a look
[21:54] <neversfelde> probably not today, but tomorrow
[21:54] <dantti> JontheEchidna: but I think I installed the findDebconfKDE in the wrong place it will work if you copy the file to  your app/cmake/modules
[21:54] <JontheEchidna> dantti: yeah, it does appear to be in the wrong place
[21:54] <JontheEchidna> I'll put it in locally for now
[21:55] <JontheEchidna> dantti: If you find out where to put it, I'm having similar troubles for libqapt
[21:55] <dantti> k, thanks if you can fix you already have my thanks :P
[21:55] <dantti> right :P
[21:55] <lex79> neversfelde: Germany won :)
[21:55] <dantti> i think i copied the place from libqapt.....
[21:56] <JontheEchidna> :D
[21:56] <neversfelde> lex79: yes, watched it together with my father, was great
[21:56] <dantti> cya
[21:56] <lex79> neversfelde: yeah, tomorrow Italy :) uhmmm...
[21:59] <neversfelde> lex79: jep, I cross fingers, would be great to see some better games in the knockout meetings
[22:00] <lex79> yes :)
[22:00] <lex79> poor France btw
[22:00]  * lex79 giggles
[22:02] <neversfelde> hehe
[22:02] <lex79> :)
[22:02] <neversfelde> sad for Ireland, they clearly would have shown a better performance
[22:03] <lex79> right
[22:03] <neversfelde> I have a green hat, to show my support :)
[22:05] <lex79> nahhh you should add white and red to your hat :)
[22:06] <JontheEchidna> \o/ http://simplest-image-hosting.net/i0-plasma-desktopeh1494-jpg.jpg
[22:07] <JontheEchidna> will have to show dantti when he gets back :D
[22:07]  * JontheEchidna wanders off to eat
[22:07] <neversfelde> lex79: haha
[22:07]  * apachelogger has a "I am irish on the inside" tee for paddys day ^^
[22:07] <lex79> :)
[22:08] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: must this dialog be soo large? :P
[22:08] <apachelogger> it is brilliant though!
[22:08] <apachelogger> where is dantti? must tell him that he is brilliant!
[22:09] <apachelogger> JontheEchidna: btw, http://pastebin.com/n5xKSqAg is not implementing the coding style properly
[22:09] <apachelogger> should be if (foo) { and for (;;) 
[22:10] <apachelogger> i.e. space before bracket
[22:10] <JontheEchidna> apachelogger: copypasta from libept
[22:10] <JontheEchidna> will fix after dinner
[22:11] <apachelogger> we need astyle scripty ^^
[22:19] <neversfelde> I guess it is not planned  that my desktop installs kubuntu-netbook-default-settings on a regular update?
[22:20] <neversfelde> and all of kdegames
[22:21] <apachelogger> who knows, maybe ScottK wants to go for world domination with games :)
[22:21] <apachelogger> I am sure no one tried this before... there is probabl a chance of this working out successfully.
[22:22] <ScottK> neversfelde: It's not all of it.
[22:22]  * ScottK is confident Riddell has some magic in mind to know if k-d-s or k-n-d-s should be used.
[22:23] <neversfelde> ScottK: yes, it's the part of kdegames, thats used for netbook edition, right?
[22:23] <ScottK> Yes.
[22:23] <ScottK> Part of the master plan to use one ISO for both netbook and desktop.
[22:24] <neversfelde> k
[22:24]  * apachelogger is really wondreing how this is going to work out
[22:24] <neversfelde> I did not know anything about this plan
[22:24] <apachelogger> spacewise this ought to be a challenge, no?
[22:25] <ScottK> apachelogger: Not really.  plasma-netbook is half a megabyte.
[22:25] <CIA-99> [libqapt] jmthomas * 1141949 * trunk/playground/libs/libqapt/ (CMakeLists.txt src/CMakeLists.txt src/backend.cpp) Libept broke API with version 1.0, and more importantly totally obliterated the Textsearch class. :/ Implement the xapian initialization ourselves, as well as a bit more xapian magics. No more libept dependency.
[22:26] <apachelogger> ScottK: and kdegames? ;)
[22:26] <ScottK> There's the challenge.
[22:26] <apachelogger> Also one ought to think that a netbook edition could feature choqok and blogilo in future versions...
[22:27] <apachelogger> Clearly not the easiest of targets you have :)
[22:27] <ScottK> If we can combine it though, that means netbook is available via shipit and we have a lot less ISO testing to do.
[22:27]  * apachelogger rather sticks with his 400 times more efficient code for kdelibs ^^
[22:28] <neversfelde> hehe
[22:28] <neversfelde> ScottK: I think it would be great to have only one iso
[22:28] <apachelogger> ScottK: I do think that we should not use the CD as primary media anymore really.
[22:28] <CIA-99> [libqapt] jmthomas * 1141953 * trunk/playground/libs/libqapt/ (5 files in 3 dirs) Debconf-KDE support in qaptworker. \o/ Also implement a quick example in qapttest
[22:28] <ScottK> apachelogger: I think that's worth considering, but that's a larger question.
[22:28] <neversfelde> probably a warning about this via ubuntu-status on identi.ca would be great
[22:30] <apachelogger> ScottK: One we have to face at some point. Currently we are spending resources and user satisfaction (missing software/translations) for staying on CDs even though I am not sure our real target audience does/can appreciate that.
[22:30] <ScottK> apachelogger: Discussion for Maverick +1.
[22:30] <apachelogger> This of course leads to the problem that we still have no absolutely formal definition of our target audience, but that is another story ;)
[22:31] <ScottK> Not a bad discussion to start now though.
[22:31] <neversfelde> as long as the users are warned about missing translations after they installed, I do not see a problem with this
[22:31] <ScottK> apachelogger: We did have some discussion about target audience in UDS.
[22:32] <ScottK> Also image size matters for downloads too.  For some people a lot.
[22:32] <apachelogger> neversfelde: Currently we try to fetch translations at installation ... so with the CD you currenlty might end up with an untranslated system
[22:32] <apachelogger> neversfelde: e.g. when no intarwebs is available at installation
[22:33] <JontheEchidna> Even if we move to DVDs, we wouldn't have to get too much higher than a GiB to provide a reasonable experience
[22:33] <apachelogger> ScottK: We would still maintain an alternate CD, just shift the default focus to DVD media.
[22:34] <apachelogger> The thing is... at least in Germany I am quite sure that most of the people whom we try to reach with Kubuntu will have first contact via a media distributed by an IT/Linux magazine.
[22:34] <neversfelde> apachelogger:  I recently installed without a connection and after it, I was warned, that I need additional packages, that is fine for me. CDs do not have enough space for translations
[22:35] <neversfelde> at least for all translations
[22:35] <apachelogger> So we probably want a translated live experience, we probably want it to come with all the cool awesome, we probably want it to be translated right after installation, despite if internet access was available/working at time of installation
[22:36] <ScottK> I
[22:36] <neversfelde> mhh
[22:36] <ScottK> Urgh.
[22:36] <ScottK> I've heard some loco teams respin Ubuntu ISOs for their language.
[22:37] <apachelogger> some ... yet they will probably request shipit CDs and those will not be translated.
[22:38] <neversfelde> apachelogger: we will always frustrate some users with an unstranslated live experience, because we cannot ship all languages. So the best solution from my point of view is that we make it as easy as possible to install the wanted language
[22:38] <apachelogger> Also we have to consider the time the locos put into this to essentially work around a shortcoming we willingly accept for having a CD.
[22:39] <apachelogger> Image the other amazing things people could do if they were not busy doing a respin.
[22:39] <apachelogger> The amount of awesome that could come out of this...
[22:40] <apachelogger> neversfelde: We can actually ship A LOT languages on a DVD ;)
[22:40] <neversfelde> apachelogger: yes
[22:40] <neversfelde> but we are talking about the CD or not?
[22:40] <apachelogger> Also if we come to devine the target audience as 20-30 year old tech savvy living in europe or NA
[22:41] <apachelogger> then it is perfeclty fine to not add any translation that does not match this profile
[22:41] <apachelogger> Certainly people in Japan might want to use it too, but since we do not target them they will have to live with less ideal experience and we have to live with them possible not feeling too welcome in Kubuntu.
[22:42] <apachelogger> neversfelde: we are talking going form CD to DVD
[22:42] <apachelogger> neversfelde: For lucid I think we had en+de+fr+es on the CD (not sure about es actually).
[22:43] <neversfelde> apachelogger: or having a CD without any translations and a DVD with all of them. For the long term, CDs will get outdated and we will switch to another medium.
[22:44] <neversfelde> maybe DVD or everyone is using a usb stick
[22:44] <apachelogger> In my opinion this is nothing but a completely wrong attitude towards localiztion. If we really want to provide good experience for the target audience (granted that we currently do not have a defined target audience) then we should first say that we need the translations for de, fr, es, ru, da, and sv AND THEN add the other stuff that fits on the CD
[22:44] <neversfelde> mhh
[22:44] <apachelogger> neversfelde: magazines do not come with USB sticks
[22:44] <ScottK> For Lucid, the live seed has de es fr ru it xh and ship has de fr es it ru pt
[22:45] <apachelogger> why are thos different?
[22:45] <neversfelde> apachelogger: not yet. Have to think about it, I am not really sure if we need translated CDs
[22:45] <apachelogger> neversfelde: we do not
[22:45] <apachelogger> We need a DVD that is primary distribution media with translations :P
[22:45] <neversfelde> magazines could ship DVDs
[22:45] <apachelogger> magazines do ship wiht DVDs
[22:46] <neversfelde> and they already do
[22:46] <apachelogger> in fact I cant think of any half-decent magazine that comes with a CD these days (well except for an ADDITIONAL CD to the DVD ;))
[22:46] <apachelogger> Anyway.
[22:47] <apachelogger> We first need to properly lay out whom we are targetting with Kubuntu
[22:47] <ScottK> JFTR, on netbook-live we had de fr es ru it pt zh pl ja nl cs sv el hu
[22:47] <apachelogger> ...and not just "some dude who is in his 30's and likes to use an easy KDE"
[22:48] <ScottK> apachelogger: We had a session on that at UDS.
[22:48] <ScottK> You should come sometime...
[22:48] <neversfelde> hehe, I am in the 30's
[22:48] <neversfelde> and I like using KDE
[22:49]  * ScottK can vaguely recall his 30's...
[22:49] <neversfelde> well, at least most of the time
[22:49] <neversfelde> haha
[22:49] <SIR_Taco> Could you not make a program that you could inject your Locale files into and remove one you didn't want/need?
[22:49] <CIA-99> [libqapt] jmthomas * 1141960 * trunk/playground/libs/libqapt/src/CMakeLists.txt Link to xapian
[22:51] <apachelogger> SIR_Taco: Sure if the target audience can, wants to and will do that.
[22:51] <tsimpson> I do wish locales were more specific, there are 16 variants in the -en package which can take a while when initially generating locales
[22:52] <SIR_Taco> apachelogger: True... but it could also be done server-side... once a combination has been done, the ISO would be stored and offered up with that combination
[22:53] <CIA-99> [libqapt] jmthomas * 1141964 * trunk/playground/libs/libqapt/src/CMakeLists.txt Don't link to QtGui or QtXml, not used.
[22:54] <apachelogger> SIR_Taco: That requires the resources and very specific software. Also the way this software would have to look like and work is again dependent on the target audience.
[22:54] <apachelogger> Because compressing a livecd image for example is a quite heavy task AFAIK.
[22:55] <JontheEchidna> ^not to mention the QA burden all the extra images would need (to make sure they work)
[22:56] <apachelogger> well, the software would just be switching stuff, not much that can go wrong there
[22:56] <SIR_Taco> apachelogger: Yes, it can be quite expensive to alter a cd image.  JontheEchidna: That could also be an issue... just with potential problems with images
[22:58] <SIR_Taco> what about having a 'companion' CD, or disk, or file.... something you could put on a USB stick, or slip in during the install, to add your locale?
[22:59] <apachelogger> target audience dependent :P
[22:59] <SIR_Taco> I would suggest having a "download automatically" option... but with wireless being wide-spread, the 'average' user often has no idea how to set that one up :)
[23:00] <SIR_Taco> apachelogger: everything is audience dpenedent :P
[23:00] <apachelogger> We cannot get to any answer on any of these questions without first defining whom we want to use Kubuntu primarily
[23:00] <apachelogger> SIR_Taco: there is a downlaod automatically option
[23:00] <SIR_Taco> apachelogger: Yes, but I wouldn't call it "user-friendly" lol
[23:01] <apachelogger> it downloads?
[23:01] <apachelogger> what is not userfriendly about that
[23:01] <apachelogger> anyhow the thing is that sometimes the intarwebs does not work (broadcom?) or sometimes the user just cannot download that large junks of data (no flatrate) or might not have intarwebs at all (yes that is still possible :P)
[23:02] <apachelogger> which basically renders that download feature completely useless
[23:03] <SIR_Taco> I'm saying that, if you're on a wired connection, it works great (for pretty much anyone). However, on wireless, with encryption, etc. a lot of users couldn't tell you how to set up their network again (after they have it set up to begin with.... with their brother 'Bob' doing it)
[23:04] <apachelogger> My point :P
[23:04] <SIR_Taco> Also, with my install anyway, my settings that were punched in to get my wireless working during install.... they weren't retained after the fact
[23:04] <apachelogger> Thing is IMHO you should not have to download that junk anyway.
[23:05] <apachelogger> Microsoft can deploy Windows with some 14 languages or so and still squeeze in enough spyware to piss off every privacy lover.
[23:05] <SIR_Taco> haha, that is true... but they don't ship MS Office with it do they?
[23:06] <apachelogger> No, OTOH OO.o is actually very small compared to MSOffice
[23:06] <apachelogger> OO.o is no more than 100 MiB (including exclusive dependencies)
[23:09] <SIR_Taco> As true as that is. There is limited software with Windows, in comparison
[23:09] <apachelogger> Well, enough to fill up 10 GiB.
[23:10] <SIR_Taco> Sorry, should have said "useful" and "ubloated" haha
[23:10] <apachelogger> yeah :P
[23:11] <SIR_Taco> I'm sure I could make a 1Gig IRC client lol
[23:11]  * apachelogger notes that we had a 50MiB IRC client at some point ;)
[23:12] <JontheEchidna> accidentally ;)
[23:12] <SIR_Taco> JontheEchidna: I would hope so haha
[23:12] <JontheEchidna> Yeah, they forgot to stop building quassel in debug mode, and released with the huge binary still in place
[23:13] <SIR_Taco> haha, nice
[23:13] <SIR_Taco> it does happen though
[23:14] <JontheEchidna> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/quassel/0.4.1-0ubuntu3/+build/929619
[23:14] <apachelogger> Well, debug symbols are heavily compressed by LZMA, so in the end it made not much of a difference for the distribution itself. It just consumed 50 MiB in decompressed/installed state
[23:17] <SIR_Taco> JontheEchidna: That's a decent sized download, even when compressed (maybe not by todays standards, but still)
[23:18] <JontheEchidna> that was a year ago. (Feels longer though) :)
[23:19]  * apachelogger notes that quassel itself has grown smaller since then it seems
[23:19] <JontheEchidna> yeah, once the debug symbols were stripped ;)
[23:20] <apachelogger> no in general
[23:20] <SIR_Taco> It's often good to have someone pour through the code and trim it back a bit
[23:20] <apachelogger> Compare the karmic sizes to the one in jaunty
[23:20] <apachelogger> they do not add up
[23:21]  * lex79 wants kubuntu on blu ray
[23:22] <apachelogger> we could put the whole flippin archive on there
[23:22] <apachelogger> this would be super
[23:22] <apachelogger> well, actually 
[23:22] <SIR_Taco> 3.6M to 2.8M.... not bad :)
[23:22] <apachelogger> me@osiris:/media/Elements/Fluffy/repo/publish$ du -hs
[23:22] <apachelogger> 20G     .
[23:22] <apachelogger> no sources for bluray
[23:23] <apachelogger> main+restricted binary+source is 20GiB it seems
[23:23] <apachelogger> so universe+multiverse are probably like 40 or more
[23:23] <SIR_Taco> still only 4-5 DVDs.... if you really wanted
[23:24] <apachelogger> that madness made asac leave ^^
[23:24] <lex79> lol
[23:24] <SIR_Taco> haha
[23:27] <lex79> apachelogger: did you download all source packages in main+restricted?
[23:27] <apachelogger> I do think so
[23:27] <lex79> how? :)
[23:27] <apachelogger> magic script
[23:27]  * apachelogger has a repo mirror ;)
[23:28]  * apachelogger shall blog about this magic at some point
[23:28] <apachelogger> actually I have the blog post halfway done or so
[23:29] <lex79> apachelogger: that script can also update the source packages if a new version is published in the archive?
[23:29] <lex79> :)
[23:30] <apachelogger> aye
[23:30] <lex79> magic
[23:30] <apachelogger> its a compete mirror
[23:30] <lex79> ah got it
[23:35] <ScottK> lex79: IIRC Debian ships blue ray images.
[23:35]  * apachelogger kisses Nightrose goodnight and disappears under a blanket
[23:35] <lex79> really? I didn't know
[23:36] <ScottK> I'm not 100% is they are doing it or discussing doing it.
[23:36] <Nightrose> apachelogger: :*
[23:36] <Nightrose> good night
[23:37] <ScottK> Riddell: Did you get a chance to fix plasma-mobile?
[23:48] <ScottK> KNM armel FTBFS is fixed in kdesvn r1141976.  Someone care to look into updating it.