/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/06/23/#ubuntu-manual.txt

humphreybcalright05:31
humphreybctime to get shit done05:31
humphreybcOkay, i just tallied up all the bug reports05:55
humphreybcso far, we've had 5 people meet the 10 confirmed bugs requirement05:56
humphreybcMarc Stewart far exceeded that, with about 50 reported(!)05:56
humphreybcAnd we have two people, Martin Lukes and "Andrew" who have 9 reported.05:56
Zeikehumphreybc, what is the prize?07:17
=== topo is now known as Guest85497
humphreybcZeike: If you win, it's a copy of the manual08:50
humphreybcflan, you around?09:39
humphreybcthorwil: you need to make a new logo for the Quickshot team :)09:39
thorwilhumphreybc: i have that on my list, although with low priority. hoping to get a good idea out of the blue. didn't happen so far09:42
thorwilvish: any ideas for the quickshot logo?09:43
humphreybcI've pretty much finished the Quickshot website design09:45
humphreybcdidn't take long :)09:45
humphreybcJust have to run it past Luke and flan09:45
vishthorwil: /me thinking09:50
humphreybcsomething with the right colour palette09:50
humphreybcie, orange, aubergine and shades of gray09:50
* humphreybc is tempted to make thorwil re-do the UMP logo to make it more ubunt-ey 09:51
* thorwil wonders if humphreybc likes to run into a wall, head-first09:51
thorwilgood morning, ubuntujenkins09:58
ubuntujenkinsmorning thorwil09:58
ubuntujenkinsthey added a link to our website on ubuntu geek! http://www.ubuntugeek.com/download-free-ubuntu-10-04-lucid-lynx-pdf-guide.html#more-625310:01
ubuntujenkinshttp://www.ubuntugeek.com/download-free-ubuntu-10-04-lucid-lynx-pdf-guide.html10:01
ubuntujenkinsthats link ^10:01
thorwilbut why that messed up thumbnail with ump logo added?10:02
ubuntujenkinsI did not even expect a response. For some reason they want to collect loads of info to give out the manual like the page be found10:03
ubuntujenkinsben10:03
ubuntujenkinsyea I have it solved :)11:33
ubuntujenkinscheck this out! http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/89110/quickshot_008_B1bPsK.png I have it at last11:42
ubuntujenkinsIt has taken ages to get this correct11:42
* ubuntujenkins nudges flan to look at ^ when he gets up11:43
ubuntujenkinsdaker:  check this out! http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/89110/quickshot_008_B1bPsK.png11:44
dakerbeautiful11:45
ubuntujenkinsI know it has taken days to get it right.11:45
ubuntujenkinsI fell like i am on a roll no11:45
ubuntujenkinsnow11:45
thorwilubuntujenkins: the text on top is redundant, you should drop it12:18
ubuntujenkinsWhich bit? "quickshot"12:19
thorwilubuntujenkins: "Please fill in ..."12:19
thorwilespecially the 2nd sentence, as the checkbox label tells you the same12:19
ubuntujenkinsvery true12:20
thorwilubuntujenkins: everything is clear, except for the Project/Description area. what is that about?12:20
ubuntujenkinsYou have to choose which project that you want to take screenshots for.12:21
thorwilubuntujenkins: consider to add a label to it. like "Projects to take screenshots for:"12:23
ubuntujenkinsdone :) just doing a picture to show you12:23
ubuntujenkinshttp://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/89126/quickshot_009_zKd44q.png12:24
ubuntujenkinsthoughts now please12:24
thorwilubuntujenkins: consider to remove the Close button. but if it stays, and if the next page has a Previous button, make sure each button stays in the same position on all pages12:24
thorwilubuntujenkins: such that the Previous button will not be there where Close is on the first page12:24
ubuntujenkinsI had not thought about a previous button if i move the close to the far left and add a pevious12:25
thorwilubuntujenkins: ok, so the long from with "Choose ...". you have a . instead of : at the end12:26
ubuntujenkinshttp://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/89128/quickshot_011_M7WnSf.png what about now12:27
thorwilubuntujenkins: good. make it a tiny bit wider, or switch to the shorter "Projects to take screenshots for:" or even better "Take screenshots for:" label12:29
thorwildang12:29
thorwilubuntujenkins: good. make it a tiny bit wider, or switch to the shorter "Projects to take screenshots for:" or even better "Take screenshots for:" label12:30
ubuntujenkinschnaged12:31
ubuntujenkinsthanks thorwil I will run some more past you when i have done them if thats ok12:31
thorwilubuntujenkins: that's fine12:32
ubuntujenkinscool12:32
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: quickshot is now www.facebook.com/quickshotteam and www.twitter.com/quickshotteam12:51
dakerflan, ping14:21
dakerubuntujenkins, ping14:22
dakerhttp://gomockingbird.com/mockingbird/index.html?project=5e8d3e0ab985024303b05b7d791f686f16f4209814:27
ubuntujenkinsdaker: pong14:33
dakerhttp://gomockingbird.com/mockingbird/index.html?project=5e8d3e0ab985024303b05b7d791f686f16f4209814:34
ubuntujenkinsthats really cool, what is the mockingbird a mock up site?14:35
ubuntujenkinswhy the facebook logo in several places?14:35
ubuntujenkinsI like it, what does your comment say in the comment box? just interested14:37
daker_the facebook logo is there just t represent the application logo14:39
ubuntujenkinsthats what i guessed14:41
ubuntujenkinsIs the large grey bar at the top of the browser part of the website or part of mockingbird?14:42
daker_yes14:43
daker_mockingbird14:43
=== daker_ is now known as daker
ubuntujenkinsI look forward to the real thing14:44
ubuntujenkinsengland vs slovina starts in 15 minutes14:45
dakerUSA vs Algerie in 15minutes14:46
ubuntujenkinslets hope england can win14:47
daker\o/14:48
dakerhttp://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=10241614:48
ubuntujenkinsbrilliant14:49
flanThat mockup scares me.15:13
ubuntujenkinshey flan, why?15:14
flanIt scares me because it is absolute overkill and far, far from the sense of minimalism I want.15:14
ubuntujenkinsthat is just the page that every one sees not that admin stuff15:14
flanFacebook? Ratings? Tags? Links to the project manual before it's even been compiled?15:14
flanWell, yes, perhaps, but it's a task-based system. The public interface exists only so people can get an idea of what still needs to be done.15:15
flanAlthough this could work well for the central server.15:16
flanIf repurposed a little.15:16
ubuntujenkinswell the facebook is ment to be our logo. We would nto have contbiutors pictures as we have no way to get them.  we could have a link to builds.ubuntu-manual.org15:16
ubuntujenkinssaying they are draft versions15:16
flanBut not every project will be following out build model.15:17
flanour*15:17
ubuntujenkinsyea thats true I keep forgetting that15:17
ubuntujenkinsI am getting there wiht the gui http://www.ubuntu-pics.de/bild/89128/quickshot_011_M7WnSf.png is a page it like15:18
ubuntujenkinsone lable has changed on that so that screenshot is slighlty out atm15:19
flanI'd like to suggest separating that into two steps.15:19
ubuntujenkinsI can do, I will give it a go15:19
flanThe first time Quickshot starts up, the user should be prompted to enter personal information (and this prompt should be made available from a menu at any later time).15:20
flanMore information that that will be desired. I'll link to the database definition in a moment.15:20
ubuntujenkinsso a prefernces option15:20
flanYeah.15:20
flanLike have a Project | Preferences | Help set at the top menu level.15:21
ubuntujenkinsyea something like that works well15:21
flanThe second screen, which becomes the default once personal information has been set (stored in ~/.quickshot/contributor_profile or something), would allow for project selection.15:22
ubuntujenkinsGGGGGOOOOOOOOOOALLLLLLLLLlll15:22
ubuntujenkinsyea i see makes sense.15:22
flanA list that contains references to all things pulled fromt he central server, a list of recently opened projects (~/.quickshot/recent_projects), an input field for entering a web address to pull project information, and a browse field for finding a .qsproj file.15:23
flanI'll write a library for that which will take any form of input and output a server-session object.15:23
flanWhich can be used for all interactions with the server,15:23
ubuntujenkinscool that sounds great, I will finish what i have and show you it all15:23
ubuntujenkinsI think i need to rearage what i have15:24
flanThere'll probably be a lot of tuning.15:24
flanGlad to see you got the Gnome HIG stuff worked out, though.15:24
flanJust padding around the hboxes?15:24
ubuntujenkinsyea, we want to get this right. I do a hbox which had the menu bar in and then in the other part of the hbox but a hbox with a 12 pixel border is the best way i have found15:25
ubuntujenkins*but > put15:25
flanIt definitely looks natural as it's laid out right now.15:26
flanhttp://bazaar.launchpad.net/~quickshotdevs/quickshot/server/annotate/head:/quickshot/quickshot/model/__init__.py15:27
ubuntujenkinsI was pleased when i cracked that this morning15:27
flan168-171 is all I've come up with for trackable information.15:27
flanIf you can think of anything else, just add it to that table and the one below it.15:27
ubuntujenkinsyep i have that saved some where15:27
ubuntujenkinswill do15:28
flanIt's really the same as what you have, only with an extra website field.15:28
flanWhich will be exposed in the project information, if provided.15:29
flan(E-mails will only be visible to owners)15:29
flan(So it'll be up to them to decide whether the e-mail address goes into the final document or not)15:30
flan(They're just necessary unique identifiers)15:30
humphreybcI have the draft of the new QS website to show you guys :)15:30
flanOoh.15:30
flanAnd we have screenshots of the in-development server.15:30
* ubuntujenkins nods at flans comments15:31
ubuntujenkinshey humphreybc15:31
flanAnd daker's mockup, from which I think I can draw stylistic inspiration (but which is total overkill for an admin-oriented backend).15:31
humphreybchave a looksie, http://humphreybc.homeip.net/files/quickshot-pngs.zip15:31
humphreybcbe back in a sec15:32
flanI'm thinking a .sqproj file will, at this point, really just be a URL pointing to a config path on the server.15:33
flanWhich means the recent projects file can be as simple as a series of names paired with URLs.15:33
ubuntujenkinsyep15:34
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: I don't like the orange of blue/green not sure its quite right15:34
humphreybcubuntujenkins: It's meant to follow similar styles to our site and the Ubuntu site15:35
flanThe three pages all look a little too similar, what with the image on the right...15:35
flanJust a placeholder?15:35
humphreybcnope, the idea is that the text just fades in and out15:35
humphreybcwhen you change page15:35
flanAh.15:35
humphreybcbut I'm happy to have more images15:36
ubuntujenkinsour facebook is www.facebook.com/quickshotteam to match our twitter15:36
ubuntujenkinsflan: are you on facebook so i can add you as a page admin?15:36
flanhttp://uguu.ca/ The first two posts talk about the QS server, with actual screenshots. (Though I'm making lots of tweaks)15:36
flanI am now.15:36
flanhumphreybc just set it.15:36
flanOh.15:37
flanWait.15:37
flanNo.15:37
flanNot on Facebook.15:37
ubuntujenkinsfair enough15:37
flanI'm not a fan of social media.15:37
flanIt is evil.15:37
ubuntujenkinslol :)15:37
flanEVIL.15:37
* flan hisses.15:37
humphreybcwell when we have more solid screenshots, we can put them on the site15:37
humphreybcnothing's happening yet, we don't even have a domain name :)15:37
ubuntujenkinswell we have facebook and twitter, I hope to get lots of people testing by taking screenshots of quickshot for our docs15:38
humphreybcBut I have about half a dozen design things to do so I'm nailing the UMP related ones first15:38
flanI'm projecting full functionality by early July, with testing and client-side libraries (so people could start building Qs server access into their own applications) by mid-July.15:38
ubuntujenkinsI like this site http://ground-control.org/15:38
flanBut I'm moving in mid-July, so that might get pushed back a little.15:39
humphreybcubuntujenkins: I wanted to make it simpler than that15:39
humphreybcthere's far too much text :)15:39
ubuntujenkinsbut its shiney :)15:39
humphreybclol15:39
ubuntujenkinsmoving far flan ? england ?15:39
humphreybcalso, the get involved link will take you to ubuntu-manual.org/getinvolved and will be on the "Programmer" role15:40
flanNo. Within Calgary.15:40
ubuntujenkinswe should have a manual team meet at some point15:40
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: I think that the manual site shoudl point at us no the other way around15:40
humphreybcwhat do you mean?15:41
humphreybcquickshot is going to get www.quickshot.org15:41
flanIt is?15:41
humphreybcyes indeed15:41
flanI thought we were taking quickshot.ubuntu-manual.org.15:41
ubuntujenkins"the get involved link will take you to ubuntu-manual.org/getinvolved and will be on the "Programmer" role" I think it should be on our site that you get linked to. from the manual site15:41
humphreybcjust temporarily15:41
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc has big plans as always :)15:42
humphreybcubuntujenkins: no, because Quickshot isn't the only programming project UMP has15:42
flanIs there a good reason for launching an independent site when we're really just producing a tool for a niche audience?15:42
flanA niche audience that we'd want to have contribute to UMP wherever possible?15:42
humphreybcflan: the idea of its own site is to try and widen the audience15:42
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: but then quickshot will not only be used by the manual team15:43
humphreybcexactly15:43
flanBut widen it to whom? Granted, I have no intention of building anything so it's only usable on Ubuntu, but I don't see a problem with having hosting association between the two projects.15:43
humphreybcother teams within Ubuntu, other distros15:43
humphreybcThe links will still be there, from the text at the bottom, cross-linking and obviously the style will be similar15:44
ubuntujenkinshumphreybc: the word quickhsot on http://ubuntu-manual.org/getinvolved/programmers should link to the quickshot get invloved page15:44
flanWell, yes, but it's not like having a different URL will instantly spread word-of-mouth.15:44
humphreybcubuntujenkins: I don't want to have multiple get involved things when people are mainly coming to the same place to ask how they can help15:45
humphreybcflan: No it won't, but I still think the project needs its own URL15:45
flanPolitically, we're supportng UMP and UMP is providing us with traffic to boost our exposure. (Even though, practically, we'd be working on other projects within UMP and other parts of the greater community)15:46
ubuntujenkinsthe page i linked has almost nothing on quickhsot when someone joins i tell them lots of things15:46
flanAnd then they get scared and run away. =P15:46
ubuntujenkinslol15:46
humphreybcjust trust me15:46
humphreybc:)15:46
ubuntujenkinsI tell then to look at15:46
ubuntujenkins?style15:46
quickshotdevsThe Quickshot code base tries to follow some conventions  a list of them is here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/quickshot/style .15:46
flanI want to, but I think your ambition may be a little misguided on this point.15:47
humphreybcwe can always quite easily hack up a get involved page on quickshot.org15:47
ubuntujenkins?branch15:47
quickshotdevsFactoid 'branch' not found15:47
ubuntujenkins?help15:47
quickshotdevsUseage: ?<factoid> Examples: ?website , ?blueprint , ?qssource , ?involved , ?question , ?style , ?use , ?ppa , ?quickshot , ?code , ?launchpad , ?bug15:47
ubuntujenkins?qssource15:47
quickshotdevsThe main development focus for the gui can be viewed by doing "bzr branch lp:quickshot"  . The server source is "bzr branch lp:quickshot/server ".  You can browse it here https://code.launchpad.net/quickshot15:47
ubuntujenkins?code15:47
ubuntujenkinsetc you get the ides :)15:47
humphreybcyep15:48
flanMaybe it's sentiment, but I kinda want to make it seem like the Quickshot project is closely associated with UMP and that UMP is demonstrating its intention to share its resources with everyone.15:49
flanAnd that using quickshot.ubuntu-manual.org would do that better than an independent domain.15:49
humphreybcquickshot.ubuntu-manual.org is far too long15:49
flanFar too long for who, though?15:50
humphreybcmaybe qs.ubuntu-manual.org or ubuntu-manual.org/quickshot15:50
humphreybcor /qs15:50
humphreybcmemorability15:50
humphreybcubuntu-manual.org isn't particularly good either15:51
flanIt's not a page people will be visiting every day, though...15:51
humphreybcno I know15:51
ubuntujenkinsI think in our meeting a while ago we said quickshot.ubuntu-manual.org would do untill we got bigger15:51
* flan AFKs for thirty minutes, but wants to continue this discussion.15:51
humphreybcI've got to go to bed, it's almost 3am15:52
ubuntujenkinsnight then humphreybc15:52
humphreybcwe should have a meeting this weekend, yeah15:52
ubuntujenkinsggggrrr off side16:04
nisshhubuntujenkins: my dad is asking ME to get on the fifa site and check the score, just coz he cant be bothered to get off his ass16:06
ubuntujenkinswhat can't he watch telly? of do it him self16:07
ubuntujenkinsthank goodness david james is good16:07
nisshhubuntujenkins: no, my dad is a lazy bloke, and he is watching his favourite show over the soccer right now :)16:08
ubuntujenkinshehe16:08
ubuntujenkinsgodbyk: ping16:21
flanBack.16:44
ubuntujenkinshey flan ben went to bed it was 3am for him16:45
ubuntujenkins3 minutes left on the england game16:45
ubuntujenkinsplease waste time england16:46
ubuntujenkinsyeeeeesssss16:48
flanI saw.16:58
flanHim.16:58
flanNot the game.16:58
flanYour game is silly.16:58
ubuntujenkinslol16:58
* flan disses sports.16:58
* flan expects to die.16:58
ubuntujenkinsjust because canada is no there :P16:59
ubuntujenkins*not16:59
flanNo, I just dislike sports.16:59
flanThat applies to hockey and whatever else we play in Canada, too.16:59
flanLacrosse, I guess.17:00
dakercongratulations ubuntujenkins17:05
ubuntujenkinsdaker: thanks, I thought my defending was good :P17:06
flanThanks for the mockup, daker. I'll take what I can from it, but I'm afraid our views of the scope of the project differ quite a bit.17:17
flanWhat I'm working on is just the admin backend for the Quickshot server: the thing people like ubuntujenkins will see when managing the screenshots for a project.17:18
flanYour design seems more suited to the Quickshot homepage, where we're planning to centralize a bunch of projects.17:19
flan(User base of about three or four people versus a whole community)17:19
flanI killed him with feedback. D:17:20
ubuntujenkinsbe back later17:30
=== daker_ is now known as daker
thorwil0.o http://html5zombo.com/20:18
c7plol20:20
dakeryep it's HTML520:20
c7phtml5 is enriched html4 ?20:21
dakerhtml5 give more power and more flexibility as you can see here http://zombo.com/ this is a flash annimation20:24
dakerand with HTML5 he can do the same thing http://html5zombo.com/20:24
dakerjust with metatags20:24
dutchieand no flash \o/20:25
dakeryep20:26
c7pcool20:26
dakerdutchie, well you can use flash in your html document but and you can make annimation just by combining HTML+javascript(jquery or Motools)20:28
c7pso the whole animation and sound (very funny btw) stuff in what format is saved ? (sry for silly questions :D)20:28
dutchiedaker: yes, but i wish flash would die, because it is proprietary, insecure, and the performance is terrible20:29
c7pdaker now i see20:29
dakerc7p, .html , the sound is an mp320:30
c7pok ty :)20:31
dakeri can play a sound just like that         <audio autoplay="autoplay" playcount="999" id="looper" loop="true">20:32
daker            <source src="sound.mp3"></source>20:32
daker            <source src="sound.ogg"></source>20:32
daker        </audio>20:32
dakeryou don't have to put any flash player to the sounds :)20:33
c7pI'm impressed :D, I love html5 hehe20:53
dakerhohohoh 2-020:59
daker5 mini between two goals21:00
ubuntujenkinshello all21:05
dakerhi ubuntujenkins21:06
ubuntujenkinsgodbyk: ping21:07
daker2 - 121:10
dakeranother time Jabulani21:10
dakerc7p, Ghana ouep21:20
c7pghana and germany are on 16 ?21:20
dakeryep21:22
dakerUSA and ENG21:23
=== ubuntujenkins_ is now known as ubuntujenkins
dakerdutchie, ping21:26
dutchiepong21:27
dakerdo you know about internalisation in django ?21:28
dutchiei know it exists21:29
dutchiei have never used it21:29
dakeroki21:29
dakerwe should collaborate in the next few weeks21:30
dakercheck that http://www.neatorama.com/2010/06/22/click-here/21:32
daker\o/21:32
dakerSo good check http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_CH9tYHEWnDk/TCC8LKfWJlI/AAAAAAAAM1o/q6R7Q8LVj5Y/s1600/Isabel-MastacheTrouser1.jpg21:42
dakerguys!!! do you think we should install a forum for the project ? forum.ubuntu-manual.org ?21:48
c7pyes for sure21:49
dakeror the ML is enough ?21:49
* dutchie dislikes fora21:49
c7pwell it helps very much, you don't have to search through the whole mess of messages to find some useful info, everything is categorized21:52
dutchiesome people like them21:52
dutchienot for me21:52
dakerc7p, +121:52
c7pon the forum we can have different sections for translators, editors, developers future plans etc ;)21:54
dakersubsections too21:54
c7pyap21:55
dakerwe should detail this point in the next meeting21:55
c7pwe can discuss about it on the next meeting21:55
daker\o/21:55
c7p:p21:56
dakerhttp://www.videocorner.tv/videocorner2/live_flv/index.php?langue=en22:20
ubuntujenkinsdaker: what about making it a docs forum? I would like a quickshot section if possible. the only issue is forums need lots of server space. also the docs team might want a spot22:28
dakerspace & time22:29
dakerAdmins & moderators22:29
ubuntujenkinswell i would happly help where i can. the mailing list does not get much traffic to be fair22:29
dakerwe can discuss about it on the next meeting so everyone can give his opinion22:30
ubuntujenkinsor her :P22:32
ubuntujenkinswhat about asking the current forums people if we can have a part?22:33
c7pwhy don't we ask canonical to pay for the forum services ? We are documenting its product and also we are going to work on their official documentation page (help.ubuntu.com) (right ?)22:39
ubuntujenkinsI am not sure canonical would pay we chose to do the project we can't ask them to pay us. I think we would be best keeping the forums in one place and see if we could get a section on the current ones as a documentaion section. manual/docs/learning teams22:41
c7pi don't ask to pay us. Canonical provide LoCo teams with CDs if they ask, what I'm saying is to provide us the services :). I don't think a medium forum is big deal, it can be hosted on a canonical's server22:48
c7pI have to mention that the forum of our LoCo team is hosted on a server of a university :D22:49
* ubuntujenkins nods22:59
c7pnight all23:01
ubuntujenkinsnight c7p23:03

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