[00:00] <clusty> oettinger: shitty beer's fault :D
[00:00] <serverhorror> oettinger:  well http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=php5 tells me that's the latest karmic version available... 5.3.2 is in lucid
[00:01] <oettinger> Yes, i thought so.
[00:01] <clusty> change mirror
[00:01] <clusty> might solve the issue
[00:01] <serverhorror> it won't
[00:01] <oettinger> Could be. I think the server uses the hosts internal mirrors
[00:01] <p1l0t> ls
[00:01] <qman__> it means he's running karmic
[00:02] <serverhorror> I know that hoster, and the mirror is in sync...
[00:02] <p1l0t> oops lol using to many keyboards at once
[00:02] <qman__> if he wants 5.3 he needs to upgrade again, to lucid
[00:02] <oettinger> Do another release upgrade?
[00:02] <qman__> cat /etc/issue to verify
[00:02] <p1l0t> AGAIN
[00:03] <oettinger> cat /etc/issue -> Ubuntu 9.10
[00:03] <oettinger> "Well there is your problem"
[00:03] <p1l0t> AGAIN
[00:03] <serverhorror> oettinger:  make sure everything is fine with a reboot before upgrading (uptime is overrated compared to the trouble a faulty boot config will give you especially with a hoster where you don't have any out of bands management)
[00:04] <qman__> yeah, if you didn't reboot after the upgrade, you need to
[00:04]  * serverhorror reboots afert any and all updates
[00:04] <serverhorror> just to make sure...
[00:04] <qman__> you only need to reboot after kernel updates and release upgrades
[00:04] <oettinger> Will do. Thank you for you help. Will (hopefully) post my success story a bit later
[00:04] <p1l0t> after updates too?
[00:05] <ScottK> Just kernel updates
[00:05] <qman__> and if you use uptrack, that takes kernel updates out of the equation
[00:05] <SpamapS> crap
[00:05] <SpamapS> launchpad is readonly now.. doh
[00:05] <p1l0t> !language | SpamapS
[00:06] <p1l0t> lol
[00:06] <SpamapS> I meant carp!
[00:06]  * SpamapS loves fish is all
[00:06] <serverhorror> qman__:  not exatly correct. rebooting makes sure all my init scripts are fine. everything is initialized properly. /tmp (and whatnot is cleaned out properly). There isn't some rogue pxe boot server around. The BIOS config is still fine and isn't set to PXE boot. .....
[00:07] <p1l0t> I only reboot after upgrades
[00:07] <qman__> yeah
[00:07] <serverhorror> p1l0t:  yes upgrades.... :)
[00:07] <qman__> you certainly can, but you don't need to
[00:07] <serverhorror> did I mention I'm quite conservative regarding config changes/up[(d)|(gr)]ades :)
[00:08] <qman__> kernel updates and distribution upgrades are where you need to
[00:08] <ScottK> serverhorror: Rebooting when it's not needed is more risky than not rebooting.
[00:08] <serverhorror> no wait. conservative isn't the right word... paranoid (too strong).....
[00:09] <qman__> my router is still running jaunty because I haven't had an opportunity for the downtime
[00:09] <serverhorror> ScottK:  why? pls explain. I want to know on the earlist occasion if something failes. And unfortunately monitoring can't catch everything
[00:09] <p1l0t> Yeah some of the ancient machines I run ubuntu server on I am afriad to boot because they might turn to dust
[00:09] <qman__> uptrack certainly makes things easy
[00:09] <ScottK> serverhorror: rebooting always stresses the system and so doing it when you don't need to has risks (they are small).
[00:09] <serverhorror> ScottK:  of course there are exceptions (hot DB caches being an example)
[00:10] <ScottK> There are also some updates that require services to be restarted, but if you subscribe to Ubuntu Security Notices (and you should), you'll know which those are.
[00:11] <serverhorror> ScottK:  accepted. But if that stuff fails, I'd rather have it fail while I have a maintenance window scheduled anyway (and expect failure) rather than at 2am. Support Contracts will fix failing hardware, but won't give me any piece of mind during night :)
[00:11] <ScottK> Certainly.
[00:12] <ScottK> In that case it may make sense in your situation.
[00:14] <serverhorror> funny detail: we don't have any on-call contracts with the employer. So having things fixed (or broken) during maintenance windows is a lot better. Since stuff that is broken will stay broken and won't cause "unexpected" downtimes. (sounds harsh but I found customers react a lot better to 8h of downtime when they expect it than 5min of unexpected downtime)
[00:15] <p1l0t> Could be a month, if they expect it then its status_quo
[00:16] <oettinger> ahh of course. The last run took me from 9.04 to 9.10
[00:17] <p1l0t> AGAIN
[00:18] <oettinger> :) yes yes yes. It is running.
[00:19] <p1l0t> When is the next one anyway Oct?
[00:19] <p1l0t> it's Oct and Apr or something right?
[00:19] <SpamapS> Never rebooting a system is a huge risk IMO. It makes one think twice about rebooting, and if you have a sudden unexpected power failure, you're stuck with systems that may not come back up in your worst crisis.
[00:20] <SpamapS> After hitting the "this FS hasn't been checked for X days, lets mark it dirty and fsck for 3 hours" time bomb a few times, I learned my lesson and started scheduling server restarts every 120 days.
[00:21] <SpamapS> p1l0t: next what?
[00:22] <p1l0t> Next release
[00:24] <p1l0t> Yeah it's Maverick Meerkat (10.10) October 10th
[00:26] <p1l0t> Is it better to stick with LTS then to upgrade to something with an earlier EOL?
[00:27] <SpamapS> depends on what you plan to do
[00:27] <SpamapS> The next LTS will be out around the same time maverick is EOL
[00:28] <oettinger> Success! Thank you again.
[00:28] <SpamapS> Most server types would rather have a stable known platform and therefore run LTS.
[00:29] <p1l0t> That's what I'll do at work, maybe at home I'll be risky
[00:29] <p1l0t> Because my home server is just for messing around and learning
[00:29] <oettinger> Have a nice timeofday(/you)
[00:30] <p1l0t> You too oettinger
[00:31] <SpamapS> yeah its a good idea to keep your "messing around box" up to date.. you'll be ready for any changes that come in the next upgrade from LTS -> LTS
[00:33] <qman__> SpamapS, that's what UPS and generators are for ;)
[00:33] <chewbranca> any idea how to have an init script run a daemon as a specific user?
[00:33] <p1l0t> My UPS is only good for twenty minutes :(
[00:34] <p1l0t> sudo apt-get install generator
[00:34] <qman__> haha
[00:34] <SpamapS> qman__: I refer you to livejournal's experiences with UPS and generators :)
[00:35] <qman__> where I'm at, power failures are expected
[00:35] <qman__> the electric company doesn't exactly have a good reputation
[00:35] <SpamapS> I expect every single piece of my systems to fail.
[00:36] <p1l0t> Plus UPS keeps the supply stable... This is especially important if you run a server at a machine shop where people power up whatever whenever with no warning
[00:36] <qman__> yeah
[01:07] <giovani> thank god NYC has reliable power
[01:49] <maek> when I install from disk by hand there should be a seed file someplace correct? where is that file?
[01:58] <giovani> maek: I don't believe one is generated
[01:59] <maek> giovani: ok, I wasnt sure. find / -name *seed* didnt turn up anything but the docs have a good example
[01:59] <giovani> maek: I just did the same thing to make sure there wasn't one :)
[01:59] <maek> giovani: thanks
[01:59] <maek> I want to automate network installs. is FAI or rolling my own the only option I have?
[02:00] <giovani> well d-i should handle the install
[02:00] <giovani> what features are you looking for?
[02:01] <maek> well Im used to cobbler for redhat
[02:01] <maek> it lets you add a system with some info like mac and network info, what profile to use etc etc then it generates a kickstart file from a template
[02:01] <maek> d-i is what you use in preseeding right? debian-installer? or is that a seperate tool?
[02:02] <giovani> ah, I haven't used cobbler
[02:02] <giovani> we write our own pxe configs, and use kickstart at work for redhat
[02:02] <giovani> yeah, debian-installer is for preseeding
[02:02] <maek> cobbler maybe over load. I only really have 1 kind of system to install so only 1 preseed file
[02:02] <maek> giovani: you should check out cobbler for managing kickstarts its slick
[02:03] <maek> it manages pxe and all the dhcp entries for hosts
[02:03] <giovani> maek: what does it buy me over plugging the machine in and sleecting which image I want in the pxe menu?
[02:03] <giovani> I mean, dhcp is already handled -- no need to reinvent the wheel
[02:03] <maek> if you installs are that clean cut then not much, just some resuable ness in your kickstarts because they are templates
[02:03] <maek> you can use snippets
[02:04] <giovani> ah
[02:04] <giovani> yeah, we just use kickstart to get the machine usable and on the network
[02:04] <giovani> then rdist out to it
[02:04] <maek> I just liked that I only had to type in 1 place to add a machine to kickstart and it did everything else
[02:04] <giovani> no point in reworking the kickstart constantly
[02:04] <maek> yeah true
[02:05] <giovani> yeah, so cobbler is server-side handling
[02:05] <maek> so sorry to being dumb, is debian-installer a tool or just the d-i bit in the seed files
[02:05] <maek> s/to/for
[02:07] <giovani> maek: you can use kickstart for ubuntu
[02:07] <giovani> debian-installer is the installation tool, like anaconda for redhat
[02:07] <maek> giovani: do I want to do that?
[02:08] <maek> giovani: thanks
[02:08] <giovani> maek: I don't know
[02:08] <giovani> I don't mass-deploy ubuntu, so I'm not up on which is superior
[02:08] <maek> giovani: I mean is it legit, can I do what I could do with preseed?
[02:08] <giovani> I'm sure the wiki has some hints though
[02:09] <giovani> I think preseed is the best supported method
[02:10] <maek> giovani: makes sense.
[02:10] <giovani> configs are simple
[02:19] <twb> preseed also isn't so fugly
[02:24] <gundehest> Hi, i have just installed ubuntu server and configured SAMBA, im about to copy some files over but the troughput is horrible. Its now 17KB/sec. it takes 15min to copy 12MB over :S and i have gigabit network cards in both machines.
[02:25] <gundehest> anyone awake?
[02:35] <Mithos> gundehest:  i dont know the issue with your system, but FYI: we arent always awake and will answer you when we get to it :P
[02:36] <lifeless> win 65
[02:38] <twb> There's no 6.5 release; they're only up to 6.1
[03:19] <MarchHair> What's the current "best practice" for a small office (5 users) migrating to linux workstations & server (file & print)?
[03:20] <MarchHair> I'm guess CIFS for file sharing over NFS, but I'm curious about "disconnected operation." (laptops, etc.)
[03:23] <twb> Either will do if it's homogeneously unix
[03:26] <MarchHair> Is there a generally accepted method of handling the disconnects & reconnects that come with laptop use?
[03:27] <MarchHair> I'm not necessarily looking for synchronization, just a way to easily mount/umount...
[03:27] <qman__> NFS gets really hairy when the server goes down, I assume frequent disconnections would be the same
[03:28] <qman__> CIFS would be the better option there, that or sshfs/sftp
[03:28] <MarchHair> that's what i was thinking too.
[03:29] <qman__> when my NFS server goes down unexpectedly, I have to `sudo umount -l` my directories
[03:29] <qman__> and nautilus usually crashes, requiring a reboot
[03:30] <MarchHair> I've been looking for something that can mount/umount some shares,maybe tie that into laptop suspend or something...
[03:31] <MarchHair> thinking about a workgroup or projects share, not home directories.
[03:33] <qman__> this isn't my home directory
[03:33] <qman__> nautilus just completely hangs, even if you bring the share back up
[03:34] <qman__> have to kill -9 it, and if I just launch it again, desktop icons are missing, and a few other annoying bits
[03:34] <qman__> until I reboot, or at least log off/restart X
[03:36] <qman__> in any case
[03:36] <qman__> sftp is quite a good solution there
[03:37] <qman__> if you use something like nautilus anyway
[03:37] <qman__> because you can mount your shares through the 'connect to' menu, then add them to the favorite places
[03:37] <qman__> and a simple click mounts it, clicking the eject button dismounts
[03:37] <qman__> I suppose CIFS would work the same way
[03:38] <qman__> I guess the point is, easiest depends a lot on client software
[03:38] <MarchHair> That's a interesting idea. Don't even try to set up a "smart" script. Be dumb an let the user attach when they need to.
[03:39] <qman__> the downside to that is, at least with nautilus, I don't really understand where/how it mounts them, so you can't just interact with scripts or the command line easily
[03:39] <qman__> sort of an all-CLI or all-GUI choice to make
[03:40] <MarchHair> Yup. I don't understand that either. I've gone hunting, and there's obviously some Gnome-VFS magic going on, but I can't track it down.
[03:43] <qman__> one thing when doing this, make sure each user has a unique UID/GID
[03:44] <qman__> if you just install all the systems, and add one user, they'll have the same UID
[03:45] <qman__> it won't make much difference with sftp and cifs, but if you use nfs it will
[03:45] <qman__> not sure about sshfs, probably not
[03:45] <qman__> nfs is intended to be used with networks that have directory services
[03:46] <MarchHair> yup. that's true. that's another nail in the NFS coffin. I'm trying to do this without building up a full infrastructure.
[03:55] <giovani> qman__: are you hard or soft-mounting your NFS?
[03:56] <giovani> I mean NFS and CIFS are horrible protocols
[03:57] <qman__> I'm not sure what the difference there is
[03:57] <qman__> it's in /etc/fstab and I'm using the kernel client
[03:57] <giovani> qman__: if you don't specify either, then it's hard-mounted
[03:57] <MarchHair> giovani: what would you use instead?
[03:57] <giovani> hard-mounting NFS hides the lower-level errors/disconnections from the upper layers
[03:58] <giovani> this is helpful if you expect frequent disconnects
[03:58] <giovani> but if you want the higher-level apps to fail properly, then soft-mounting is what you want
[03:58] <giovani> MarchHair: AFS
[03:58] <qman__> 192.168.1.8:/home/public	/home/public	nfs	auto	0	0
[03:58] <twb> soft mounting assumes the high-level app will correctly deal with the error
[03:59] <giovani> twb: indeed
[03:59] <giovani> he's getting nautilis hangs with hard-mounts
[03:59] <twb> Yeah, well, that's it working as advertised :-)
[03:59] <qman__> it doesn't happen very often, only when the server crashes
[03:59] <giovani> twb: heh
[03:59] <giovani> qman__: sure
[03:59] <qman__> but it's quite annoying when it does
[03:59] <giovani> use a better network fs
[03:59] <giovani> Coda, AFS, anything decent
[04:00] <twb> giovani: a better network filesystem won't hang *nor* return an error when the backend store disappears?
[04:00] <twb> Or are you just talking about having a distributivity/caching, so it happens less often?
[04:00] <giovani> twb: well, a better-engineered distributed network fs won't, no
[04:00] <giovani> AFS handles caching on the client properly
[04:01] <twb> It's no good if the file isn't already cached
[04:01] <giovani> and with a distributed fs you're less likely to encounter the downtime in the first place
[04:01] <giovani> caching is only one component, like I said
[04:02] <giovani> Coda and AFS are both distributed
[04:02] <twb> Distributed in the sense that the same data is stored on multiple hosts?
[04:02] <twb> I don't remember reading about that when I looked into AFS
[04:02] <giovani> sure
[04:03] <giovani> it's configurable
[04:03] <giovani> Coda's better at that
[04:03] <twb> It was more like /afs/foo.org is always stored on foo.org, and nowhere else.
[04:03] <giovani> Coda is optimal for high-latency high-downtime links
[04:03] <twb> Coda and AFS are also harder to set up and less widely tested than NFS/CIFS, of course.
[04:04] <twb> If this is just for a LAN, I'd recommend qman__ to instead work out why the server's crashing and fix that
[04:04] <giovani> and yet they're much better
[04:04] <giovani> servers crash, it's inevitable
[04:04] <qman__> it's not a regular thing
[04:04] <twb> giovani: sure; you can either have the thing nobody likes, or the thing nobody uses :-)
[04:04] <qman__> had a NIC fail a couple months ago, etc
[04:04] <giovani> twb: you'd be demonstrating extreme ignorance
[04:04] <twb> giovani: yes, but if the server crashes for five minutes each year, he probably doesn't give a shit
[04:04] <giovani> to claim that "nobody uses" AFS or Coda
[04:05] <giovani> twb: but he'd learn to use a better protocol
[04:05] <giovani> so when he wants to implement something at work
[04:05] <giovani> he knows something more than NFS
[04:05] <qman__> I don't have the budget for multiple servers at this point, so distributed wouldn't provide any advantages
[04:05] <qman__> but a more graceful handling when it crashes would be nice
[04:05] <qman__> one that doesn't require rebooting
[04:05] <giovani> qman__: they have advantages besides the ability to be distributed
[04:05] <giovani> qman__: why are you having to reboot?
[04:06] <qman__> because all of gnome gets messed up after nautilus crashes
[04:06] <twb> giovani: it's just that you sound like a weenie
[04:06] <qman__> desktop icons missing, other weird bugs
[04:06] <giovani> qman__: so maybe just restart X?
[04:06] <qman__> effectively the same, I still have to close all my programs
[04:06] <giovani> twb: just someone who's used NFS, and knows it sucks, and encourages people to learn the better options out there rather than stick with an old standard
[04:07] <qman__> I still haven't rebooted since my server last crashed, about two weeks ago
[04:07] <giovani> qman__: technically if the NFS server is brought back up, your session should be resumably
[04:07] <giovani> resumable*
[04:07]  * MarchHair quietly ducks under the table as the fight he innocently started kicks into high gear...
[04:07] <qman__> it hard locked, never figured out exactly why
[04:07] <giovani> and twb, these symptoms he's describing are EXACTLY what caching prevents
[04:07] <qman__> ran zip on it and it just choked
[04:08] <twb> Shrug.
[04:08] <giovani> hard locks from a network outage are a classic issue with NFS
[04:08] <giovani> we've probably lost countless dollars to them at work
[04:09] <giovani> just saying, when you use NFS in the real world, this stuff bites you in the ass
[04:09] <qman__> giovani, it usually takes a few hours to bring the server back up, since if it crashes, it's configured to fsck the RAID, and if it's a hardware failure, well
[04:10] <giovani> qman__: yikes -- do you know what the cause of the crashes has been?
[04:10] <twb> qman__: buy a UPS
[04:10] <giovani> even if they're infrequent
[04:10] <qman__> the most recent one, no idea
[04:10] <qman__> I have a UPS
[04:10] <giovani> a UPS?
[04:10] <qman__> it'll last about an hour and a half
[04:10] <giovani> how does that prevent server crashes?
[04:10] <twb> Oh, you mean a software crash
[04:10] <qman__> yes
[04:10] <twb> What the fuck are you running on your NFS server that it EVER crashes?
[04:10] <giovani> well if it's his home network, presumably if he lost power, his desktop would also lose power
[04:10] <qman__> the one before that, the NIC failed and I had to shut it down and replace, forgot to umount my filesystem first
[04:10] <giovani> so he wouldn't care
[04:11] <twb> giovani: not if it was a laptop :-)
[04:11] <giovani> presumably :)
[04:11] <qman__> I've got a UPS on that too
[04:11] <giovani> good point
[04:11] <qman__> my network stays up when the power goes out :)
[04:11] <giovani> NFS home directory on a laptop doesn't sound like a good idea
[04:11] <giovani> kind of defeats the purpose of it being a laptop :)
[04:12] <qman__> pretty much everything else just uses CIFS, it just wasn't adequate for this desktop
[04:12] <qman__> lots of lag trying to load music files
[04:12] <twb> That shouldn't happen
[04:12] <giovani> what's the CIFS server?
[04:12] <giovani> samba?
[04:12] <qman__> yes
[04:13] <giovani> well there's your problem ;)
[04:13] <twb> Yeah, is this NAS running Ubuntu LTS?
[04:13] <qman__> and windows clients have no issues using it
[04:13] <qman__> yeah, 10.04 now
[04:13] <giovani> samba is junk
[04:13] <giovani> sorry to say
[04:13] <qman__> had to upgrade from hardy because my replacement NIC didn't have drivers
[04:14] <twb> qman__: I'm in that position; it's fucking me up because I have to port all this in-house juju to 10.04isms
[04:14] <qman__> it had been running great until that NIC failed
[04:14] <qman__> almost a year of uptime
[04:14] <giovani> but a NIC failure shouldn't have required an unclean shutdown and therefore a fsck
[04:15] <twb> Nod.
[04:15] <qman__> no, but I had to order one
[04:15] <qman__> took a week to get here
[04:15] <giovani> what were the issues that caused unclean shutdowns?
[04:15] <qman__> I have lots of spare PCI NICs, but it didn't have any free PCI slots
[04:15] <qman__> haven't figured it out yet
[04:15] <qman__> I ran 'zip' on the server
[04:15] <qman__> and it just choked, out of the blue
[04:15] <giovani> hmm
[04:15] <giovani> disk failure?
[04:16] <giovani> filesystem failure?
[04:16] <giovani> what fs are you using?
[04:16] <qman__> disks are all good, filesystem checked clean
[04:16] <qman__> ext3
[04:16] <giovani> I'm wearing of filesystem checks
[04:16] <giovani> weary*
[04:16] <twb> giovani: switch to btrfs, then, where they're not supported
[04:16] <giovani> you still have the logs?
[04:16] <qman__> SMART is happy, mdstat is happy
[04:17] <qman__> there was nothing logged
[04:17] <giovani> twb: we're evaling btrfs actually
[04:17] <giovani> qman__: nothing?
[04:17] <giovani> no oom?
[04:17] <qman__> like it never crashed
[04:17] <giovani> no watchdog?
[04:17] <giovani> ouch
[04:17] <qman__> I don't know if there's anything special I can configure to help it
[04:17] <giovani> serial console :)
[04:17] <qman__> but it was so far gone there was no kernel panic messages on screen, sysrq commands did nothing
[04:18] <giovani> sounds hardware-related then
[04:18] <giovani> if the kernel doesn't panic but sysrq is no good, 90% chance it was hardware
[04:18] <qman__> not good news, but good to know anyway
[04:19] <giovani> only a few things could cause that
[04:19] <giovani> CPU/Motherboard/RAM
[04:19] <giovani> run some burn-in tests
[04:19] <qman__> it's been operating hiccup free since then
[04:19] <qman__> of any of them, I suspect the motherboard
[04:19] <giovani> who made it?
[04:19] <qman__> but it's all DDR equipment, old hat
[04:20] <qman__> if it failed I'd replace all three
[04:20] <qman__> foxconn
[04:20] <giovani> ah
[04:20] <giovani> yeah, cheap taiwan stuff
[04:20] <qman__> guess that one goes to the top of the 'to-buy' list
[04:21] <giovani> I personally prefer Intel
[04:21] <giovani> for my home systems that don't need something fancy
[04:21] <giovani> every Intel board I've used has been rock-solid
[04:21] <giovani> but they're never on the cutting-edge
[04:21] <qman__> I'm a bit of an AMD fanboy
[04:22] <qman__> I'll probably buy a gigabyte board, though
[04:22] <giovani> you must be hurtign then :)
[04:22] <giovani> since AMD's market share is dropping like a stone
[04:23] <qman__> it needs an upgrade anyway, it's a single core 2.2GHz, 4x512MB in it
[04:23] <giovani> sounds more than adaquate for a home server
[04:23] <twb> That's faster than most of my machines put together
[04:24] <twb> My home server is a 16MB/32MB 200MHz MIPS system.
[04:24] <giovani> heh
[04:24] <giovani> NFS hosted on that? ;)
[04:25] <Hilikus> hey guys
[04:25] <Hilikus> i have a web server at home
[04:26] <Hilikus> that i am trying to access. but i can't seem to find a way to access it through the same name both from within the network and from outside the network
[04:26] <Hilikus> i have a dynip domain that works when i'm not at home, but from home i never works
[04:26] <giovani> an internal DNS server is usually the solution
[04:26] <qman__> well, if you want to access it by any name from outside the network, you need to register a name
[04:27] <qman__> oh, I see
[04:27] <Hilikus> qman__: i already have a name
[04:27] <qman__> the problem is your router
[04:27] <qman__> by default, they will not route packets back into the network
[04:28] <Hilikus> qman__: but how come i use the machines actual name and i do access it from within the network
[04:28] <qman__> so, you'd need to either configure it to do that (bad idea security wise) or set up an internal DNS to answer that query as a local IP instead of your external IP
[04:28] <Hilikus> wouldn that count as routing packets back?
[04:28] <MarchHair> isn't there a redirect feature that some routers use?
[04:28] <qman__> no, because when you use the internal name, it gives you the internal IP
[04:28] <twb> giovani: no, but HTTP and sshfs is
[04:28] <Hilikus> i see
[04:28] <MarchHair> LAN-side requests for the WAN/DMZ IP get icmp-redirected back to the LAN ip
[04:28] <qman__> when you use the internet name, it gives the external IP
[04:28] <Hilikus> how i have a setup a dns server
[04:29] <qman__> and your router is not routing traffic back to the server
[04:29] <twb> The files themselves wouldn't fit into the 16MB of nonvolatile memory; it has a USB key hanging out the back
[04:29] <Hilikus> is a dns server with pretty much no traffic heavy to run?
[04:29] <qman__> not at all
[04:29] <Hilikus> memory and cpu-wise
[04:30] <twb> Hilikus: do you mean a local DNS cache of the internet's A records, or do you mean hosting your own A record for the internet to get?
[04:30] <qman__> I use BIND because that's what I know, but you probably want dnsmasq
[04:30] <MarchHair> Hilikus: what router do you use? See if it supports icmp-redirect.
[04:30] <Hilikus> in my laptop i had to come come up with a script that altered /etc/hosts depending if the SSID was my home's or not
[04:30] <Hilikus> but now with my phone i can't do that
[04:31] <Hilikus> twd i have no idea, don't know much about dns
[04:32] <Hilikus> i just want to be able to use the same name to access my server from the lan and wan, because i have bookmarks, settings and stuff like that that have the name of the server stored, so when i go out and try to access it they don't work
[04:32] <twb> Hilikus: why not just use split-horizon DNS for the router's A record?
[04:32] <qman__> well, if your router supports it, the icmp-redirect will be the easiest
[04:32] <twb> Sorry, bad completion
[04:32] <twb> MarchHair: why not just use split-horizon DNS for the router's A record?
[04:33] <Hilikus> qman__: didn't you say that would be dangerous or you were talking about something else?
[04:33] <qman__> something else
[04:33] <Hilikus> MarchHair: my router is pretty crappy, but i'll look
[04:33] <MarchHair> twb: if he's using something like hilikus.dyndns.org, would split-horizon make the rest of dyndns.org unaccessible from inside the LAN?
[04:34] <twb> MarchHair: I don't believe so; you'd only be splitting hilikus.dyndns.org, not the parent domain
[04:34] <qman__> even what I was thinking of is not inherently dangerous, it just goes against the damage-control ideal should you get a malicious user or program on your network
[04:34] <MarchHair> twb: you can do that without being authoritative for the parent? cool. gonna go look.
[04:34] <twb> MarchHair: I don't know.
[04:35] <Hilikus> so the three options i have is either to run a dns server, to configure icmp-redirect and this split-horizon thing?
[04:35] <twb> $coworker won't let me do any significant split-horizoning due to him being a fuddy duddy
[04:35] <twb> Hilikus: they all require your router to not be shit
[04:35] <twb> FSVO router = dhcp/dns server
[04:35] <giovani>  uhm
[04:35] <giovani> no, if he has internal DNS resolve the external name to an internal IP
[04:35] <Hilikus> twb running a dns server would work anyway, no?
[04:36] <giovani> his router doesn't need anything special
[04:36] <MarchHair> twb, hilikus: just read. yeah. split-horizon will do the trick too.
[04:36] <twb> dnsmasq has a nice option for split-horizon where it'll just magically work out the Right Thing based on interfaces and the requestor's IP and the list of A records in /etc/hosts
[04:37] <MarchHair> sounds like the split-horizon dns is a good option.
[04:39] <twb> Can't find the option now, though :-/
[04:40] <twb> Ah, localise-queries
[04:40] <twb> Doesn't work for IPv6
[04:41] <MarchHair> twb: what does? IPv6 support needs to hurry up.
[04:42] <twb> MarchHair: dnsmasq's split-horizon (--localise-queries) is IPv4 only at present.
[04:42] <qman__> I wouldn't be surprised if I'm telling that to my grandchildren
[04:42] <twb> qman__: tell me about it :-/
[04:42] <Lord_Devi> If a person were to modify /etc/init/samba.conf to tweak samba's initialization, could I expect updates to samba to over ride my alterations? Or would my customized /etc/init/samba.conf file be in danger of being overwritten?
[04:42] <Lord_Devi> errr would it NOT be in danger rather.
[04:43] <qman__> Lord_Devi, all the times I have run into that, it asked me what to do
[04:43] <MarchHair> qman__: yup, as we all huddle around fires talking about how the CIDR block shortage has returned us to the stone age....
[04:43] <qman__> of course, those were during release upgrades
[04:45] <Lord_Devi> Hrm, yeah ok
[04:45] <MarchHair> well, this samba.conf is the StartUpManager conf. How's that tagged in the package?
[04:46] <Lord_Devi> MarchHair: If that's in reference to my question, I don't understand what you mean.
[04:47] <MarchHair> Lord_Devi: in the samba package, /etc/init/smbd.conf can be marked as a config file. If it is, it won't be overwritten at all, because you can "config" it.
[04:47] <MarchHair> if not, it can be overwritten, but apt/dpkg should be smart enough to ask you before doing that.
[04:47] <Lord_Devi> Oh ok! I see. I didn't know that.
[04:47] <Lord_Devi> Is there a way I can check? That would be a handy skill for me to know..
[04:52] <MarchHair> Lord_Devi: I'm sure there is, but I don't know it off the top of my head.
[04:52] <Lord_Devi> Well still very helpful information. Thanks March
[04:53] <MarchHair> NP. I hate to RTFM you, but that's all I can suggest right now. Maybe one of the man pages says how...
[04:57] <qman__> there most definitely is, but I don't know it
[04:57] <qman__> check the apt-cache manual, I think that's the base command for it
[04:58] <qman__> might be a dpkg command too
[05:03] <MarchHair> i thnk dpkg-query has some clues
[05:04] <MarchHair> looks like [ dpkg-query -W -f='${Conffiles}' samba ] will probably list the conffiles.
[05:08] <MarchHair> yup. that works.
[05:09] <Lord_Devi> Hrmmm!! Very cool! Ok thanks March!!
[05:10] <Lord_Devi> Very very handy
[05:10] <Lord_Devi> I'm taking note of that for sure
[05:17] <Hilikus> so from what i'm reading it souynds like split horizon would do what i need, but i can't find info on how to set it up
[05:17] <Hilikus> is there an ubuntu guide for it?
[05:20] <Lord_Devi> Sheesh. Never heard of that before... As if DNS wasn't complicated enough! let's have different tables for different request sources! lol... oh yay, sounds like fun
[05:20] <Hilikus> i know
[05:21] <Lord_Devi> I'm curious Hilikus, what's the scenario that has you interested in such functionality?
[05:21] <Hilikus> i want to access my server with the same name from inside and outside the network
[05:21] <Hilikus> right now i have to use different names based on where i am
[05:21] <Lord_Devi> Hrmm!! Yes yes..I can see that.
[05:22] <Hilikus> but its annoying for apps that store the server name
[05:22] <Lord_Devi> Roaming users are always such a nuisance. ;)
[05:22] <Hilikus> hahaha
[05:22] <Lord_Devi> Sorry I can't be helpful though. Sounds interesting however, I might have to look into that myself..
[05:29] <Lord_Devi> I have an application here hardcoded to be available on localhost:8080, but i wish to make it available to 0.0.0.0:8080. How can I achieve this with iptables? I am told NAT does not work for this usage.(Nor could I get it to myself) but maybe redirect can? (Still no luck from my own sloppy attempts)
[05:30] <twb> You can't.
[05:30] <twb> Maybe socat would work.
[05:31] <MarchHair> what if you changed the port? Map 0.0.0.0:9090 to 127.0.0.1:8080?
[05:32] <twb> I don't think you can DNAT to the loopback interface, no matter how hard you try.
[05:32] <twb> Feel free to prove me wrong
[05:32] <Lord_Devi> twb: That's what I was told by some other fellows. A few seemed to think REDIRECT would work though
[05:33] <twb> Oh, yeah, that looks like it would work
[05:33] <Lord_Devi> Any idea HOW? lol
[05:33] <Lord_Devi> I'm googling, but the examples I'm getting are mostly from port to port, not interface to interface so to speak..
[05:34] <twb> Well, *nat -A POSTROUTING -i isp+ -p tcp --dport 8080 -j REDIRECT --to-port 8080
[05:34] <Lord_Devi> Actually frustrating enough, most google replies are still telling me about DNATTING :P I'd search for NAT if I wanted that! I want redirect! Damn google..
[05:34] <twb> Lord_Devi: so add a -DNAT to the query
[05:35] <Lord_Devi> Yeah you're right =) I could be more finesseful with my googlefu I suppose. Thanks for the pointer though, that'll help my searches a bit..
[05:36] <Hilikus> twd so for split-horizon do i still need to have a dns server running and have the router use it?
[05:36] <Hilikus> twb, sorry
[05:37] <twb> split-horizon is a feature/property of a DNS server, so it requires a DNS server.
[05:38] <Hilikus> ok
[05:38] <twb> Really you could fake it by just hard-coding the IP of the inward-facing interface of your router/whatever in /etc/hosts on your local machines.
[05:38] <Hilikus> i did that, the problem is when i move the laptop of phone outside the network the hardcoded ips don't work anymore
[05:38] <Hilikus> or phone*
[05:39] <twb> Right
[05:39] <twb> So add it to the set of A records that your DNS server exports to the local network
[05:40] <twb> That's effectively split, because OUTSIDE the LAN, there's a different A record hosted on dyndns or whatever
[05:41] <Hilikus> hmmm. i dont know much of DNS. any links i can read, or queries to search for doing this export you're saying?
[05:43] <twb> Given you're dealing with a shitty appliance router, knowing what's going on wont help
[05:44] <twb> You need to go into its stupid web UI and look for a place to add hostname-to-IP mappings
[05:45] <MarchHair> I'm out for the night. Good luck, Hilikus.
[05:45] <Hilikus> it does have a DNS setting, i thought telling it to use my server instead of the ISP dns server would do it
[05:45] <Hilikus> thanks MarchHair , good night
[05:45] <Hilikus> well, at least do part of it
[05:46] <MarchHair> thanks to the rest of the room for hits on my file server woes. it was a help.
[05:47] <twb> Hilikus: yeah, you could do that
[05:48] <Hilikus> all i see is setting fixed ips instead of dhcp, nothing to map hostnames to IPs
[06:23] <twb> alvin: hey, I just had a fucking clever idea
[06:24] <twb> alvin: add nolock to /home's options in fstab, then add a mountall-lock.conf job that starts when rpc.statd is ready, and simply runs "mount -oremount,lock /home"
[06:26] <Hilikus> guys, i'm trying to bind mysql to 192.168.0.100 but when i change the config file it doesn't start at all saying that port 3306 is used. if i change it to 127.0.0.1 it works
[06:26] <Hilikus> could it be that apparmor is blocking the daemon from binding the network address?
[06:28] <sbeattie> Hilikus: if it is, you'd see rejections in /var/log/kern.log
[06:29] <sbeattie> Hilikus: you should look at the output of 'sudo netstat -nltp" to confirm that there's nothing existing listening on 192.168.0.100:3306
[06:45] <Hilikus> i'll try that, thanks sbeattie
[07:13] <MakX> anyone familiar with DAS, NAS, SAN?
[08:05] <rahman> Hi, something wrong with squid_db_auth. I get this: DBI::db=HASH(0x1bcffe8)->disconnect invalidates 1 active statement handle (either destroy statement handles or call finish on them before disconnecting) at /usr/local/squid/libexec/squid_db_auth line 97, <> line 1.
[08:05] <rahman> And it gives ERR login failure
[08:06] <rahman> I modified the squid_db_auth script so it writes the password comparison to console. And I see they match
[08:07] <rahman> So why it gives login error?
[08:23] <lau> I am trying to create an ec2 ami from a running lucid server machine
[08:23] <lau> sudo ec2-bundle-vol -d /mnt/ -c ???.pem -k ???.pem -u ??? -s 1536 --no-inherit
[08:23] <lau> but the command fails when rsyncing
[08:24] <lau> is it possible to create an ami from a ubuntu server machine that is not already an ami ?
[08:59] <RudyValencia> I just transplanted components from my old server into a new server and Ubuntu isn't recognizing the Ethernet onboard.
[09:00] <RudyValencia> (I don't get an eth0 when I type in 'ifconfig'
[09:00] <RudyValencia> it's recognized by lspci, but I get no network interface...
[09:00] <RudyValencia> ...why?
[09:00] <Jeeves_> RudyValencia: What kind of interface is it?
[09:01] <RudyValencia> Intel 82557/8/9/1 PRO/100 Ethernet (rev 10)
[09:02] <RudyValencia> Something like that anyway
[09:02] <RudyValencia> I'm switching between the desktop and server via KVM so I can't exactly copy anything
[09:02] <Jeeves_> And if you type ifconfig -a ?
[09:02] <RudyValencia> there's an eth1
[09:03] <RudyValencia> and lo
[09:03] <Jeeves_> Than that's the one
[09:03] <RudyValencia> How do I change it to eth0?
[09:03] <Jeeves_> edit /etc/udev/rules.d/70-persistant-net
[09:03] <Jeeves_> That's where the interfaces are mapped
[09:04] <RudyValencia> Is there a way to 'redetect' the interfaces?
[09:04] <RudyValencia> like a command I can run?
[09:05] <RudyValencia> I guess I just remove the old line for the prior server's Ethernet adapter and alter the eth1 to eth0?
[09:05] <RudyValencia> right?
[09:05] <Jeeves_> Right!
[09:05] <Jeeves_> (seriously :))
[09:05] <RudyValencia> Anything else I should alter?
[09:06] <Jeeves_> Nope, if you reboot now, you should have an eth0 again
[09:06] <Jeeves_> btw, you can see this by reading the dmesg output
[09:06] <Jeeves_> it says something about 'renaming interface' or zo
[09:06] <Jeeves_> so
[09:07] <RudyValencia> I don't know
[09:07] <Jeeves_> You don't know what?
[09:07] <RudyValencia> but anyway, is there anything else that should be changed as a result of the transplant?
[09:08] <RudyValencia> That's what I was saying "I don't know" about
[09:08] <RudyValencia> as in, I don't know if there's anything else needing alteration
[09:08] <Jeeves_> Nope, probably not.
[09:08] <Jeeves_> Not that I know of, at least :)
[09:09] <RudyValencia> Everything else seems OK
[09:09] <RudyValencia> Time to RMA the old server
[09:10] <Snadder> Anyone know if EUC will store the virtual machine state on both the node and the frontend?..
[09:10] <RudyValencia> This new server is *much* quieter.
[09:10] <RudyValencia> The old one was a generic motherboard in a server case.
[09:10] <RudyValencia> This is a Dell Optiplex repurposed to be
[09:10] <RudyValencia> +a server
[09:11] <Snadder> Wondring what happens with the virtual machines running when I remove a pysical server from EUC..
[09:16] <Roxyhart08> hi there, i need to try to configurate a application that use the file net on gentoo and do it on ubuntu. Somebody know which is the equivalente "net" file of gentoo in ubuntu?
[09:19] <joschi> Roxyhart08: what "net" file do you mean? /etc/conf.d/net? the equivalent in debian/ubuntu would be /etc/network/interfaces
[09:21] <Roxyhart08> tahnks joschi...just wondering in this file there are some configuration about vlans and sme format like config_vlan10 = ... , i am not sure if we can configurate this kind of things in interfaces?
[09:23] <joschi> Roxyhart08: it's the right file for vlan configuration. install the package `vlan` (http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid/vlan) and read its documentation
[09:26] <Jeeves_> kirkland: Awake?
[09:31] <Roxyhart08> thanks joshi
[10:24] <gundehest> Hi, i have just installed ubuntu server and configured SAMBA, im about to copy some files over but the troughput is horrible. Its now 17KB/sec. it takes 15min to copy 12MB over :S and i have gigabit network cards in both machines.
[10:25] <gundehest> And PHP dont work after my LAMP setup, it just show blank pages when i browse to the server
[10:42] <Roxyhart08> hi there i download lucid server but it cant't start with my dvd/cd lector to install...i tried in different machines, somebody know if i need to do something else?
[10:42] <Jordan_U> Roxyhart08: Did you burn the iso as a disk image or did you just put the iso as a file on a CD?
[10:43] <Roxyhart08> as image?
[10:43] <Roxyhart08> i will chek it again ...thanks
[10:47] <qman__> bad downloads and burns happen too, check the md5sum of the CD against the one given on the mirrors
[10:48] <Roxyhart08> ok, i will tahnks a lot!
[10:59] <falktx> hi, I need some help restricting IPs on tomcat
[10:59] <falktx> anyone?
[11:09] <RoyK> falktx: try #tomcat - probably easier to get an answer there
[11:11] <falktx> oh, lol, thanks
[11:48] <kirkland> Jeeves_: hi
[12:19] <Jeeves_> kirkland: Hi, I was wondering if you know where the fix of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/multipath-tools/+bug/571093 is
[12:19] <Jeeves_> I can't find an updated version of libvirt-bin in proposed
[12:42] <alvin> What is the name of the Ubuntu-server installer?
[12:43] <Jeeves_> alvin: ?
[12:44] <alvin> I want to report a bug against the Lucid installer and I need to know the project/package
[12:45] <alvin> Looks like a papercut. /etc/fstab no longer contains a cdrom entry.
[12:49] <alvin> (only on fresh installs. Upgrades do not lose the cdrom entry)
[12:50] <Jeeves_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage#When%20installing%20Ubuntu%20%28or%20Derivatives%29
[12:50] <alvin> Jeeves_: thanks. Looks like it is debian-installer
[12:51] <Jeeves_> Jups
[13:42] <bogeyd6> http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid-backports/  is not a valid url
[13:45] <sommer> morning all
[13:52] <hackeron_> hey, how do I stop grub from showing the menu on failed boot?
[14:02] <a_ok> Is there some documentation on Iscsi(diskless) booting? The installation runs fine but booting gives me an error: ipconfig eth0 SIOCGIFINDEX no such device
[14:07] <Jeeves_> a_ok: Seems like you NIC wasn't found
[14:08] <a_ok> Jeeves_: looks like it but I have no idea how to be sure this is the case. I am using an intel Gigabit ET quad nic. quite common
[14:11] <a_ok> Jeeves_: does this mean that the setup just ignores NIC's when building the initrd?
[14:13] <a_ok> Jeeves_: what stuff do I need in the initrd to get it going?
[14:14] <a_ok> and how am I going to get in in the initrd. Last time I tried makeing an Image manually (using cpio) it did not see it as a valid image
[14:16] <Jeeves_> a_ok: The intelnic should be fine
[14:17] <Jeeves_> strange
[14:20] <a_ok> Jeeves_: if it is not the lack of drivers the iSCSI boot procedure does not work
[14:22] <Jeeves_> a_ok: I don't know. I have never tested that
[14:24] <a_ok> Is there anyone who has done a succesfull iscsi boot with ubuntu 10.4?
[14:28] <Jeeves_> w
[14:29] <Jeeves_> sorry
[14:32] <sommer> I'm having a problem with postfix... I can relay messages on the local LAN, but they're rejected by the internets google, yahoo, etc
[14:33] <sommer> my thought is something with DNS, but messages to through fine... using Google domain for main mail
[14:33] <hallyn> kirkland: bug 601100  is the lxc sync request
[14:34] <sommer> anyone mind if I try sending a message to their domain?
[14:34] <sommer> or help me troubleshoot :-)
[14:36] <a_ok> Jeeves_: yeah I just confirmed it the igb.ko module is in the initrd
[14:36] <a_ok> image
[14:37] <DrPoO> what are your suggestions regarding the automatic updating of an Ubuntu server? Should I simply add an aptitude safe-updrade to the roots crontab?
[14:37] <hallyn> sommer: if you're just asking for somepalce to send mail to, i'm game
[14:38] <sommer> hallyn: awesome thanks, what address should I send to?
[14:42] <Jeeves_> sommer: mark@prevented.net
[14:46] <sommer> Jeeves_: thanks sent a test
[14:54] <sommer> Jul  7 09:53:54 IS postfix/smtp[29263]: connect to mx1.tuxis.nl[213.136.13.201]:25: Connection refused
[14:54] <sommer> Jul  7 09:53:54 IS postfix/smtp[29263]: connect to mx2.tuxis.nl[89.31.102.126]:25: Connection refused
[14:54] <sommer> Jul  7 09:53:54 IS postfix/smtp[29263]: 0980B12C2E1: to=<mark@prevented.net>, relay=none, delay=456, delays=456/0.01/0/0, dsn=4.4.1, status=deferred (connect to mx2.tuxis.nl[89.31.102.126]:25: Connection refused)
[15:00] <Jeeves_> sommer: You're being firewalled
[15:01] <sommer> jeeves_: because of DNS?
[15:01] <Jeeves_> sommer: I'm not firewalling you
[15:01] <sommer> Jeeves_: I have  subdomain MX for the host I'm trying to send through, but maybe it's not configured correctly
[15:02] <Jeeves_> Your router, or your ISP, is firewalling you
[15:02] <sommer> mmmmm, I'll check that
[15:04] <kirkland> hallyn: done ;-)
[15:05] <hallyn> kirkland: thanks!
[15:06] <Jeeves_> kirkland: Do you have any clue on the libvirt bug?
[15:06] <kirkland> Jeeves_: there's only one bug against libvirt?  :-P
[15:07] <Jeeves_> 13:19 < Jeeves_> kirkland: Hi, I was wondering if you know where the fix of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/multipath-tools/+bug/571093 is
[15:07] <Jeeves_> I can't find a new version in -proposed
[15:09] <sommer> Jeeves_: thanks for the help... totally forgot firewall was blocking smtp for all but some hosts, doh
[15:10] <kirkland> Jeeves_: I'm going to have to assign hallyn to this bug
[15:10] <kirkland> Jeeves_: oh wait
[15:11] <kirkland> Jeeves_: i see, it's a mistake
[15:15] <smoser> kirkland, is this right:
[15:15] <smoser> http://paste.ubuntu.com/460234/
[15:15] <smoser> s/right/expected/
[15:15] <smoser> i'm confused by option '2'
[15:16] <kirkland> smoser: hmm, yeah me too
[15:16] <kirkland> smoser: byobu -v ?
[15:16] <kirkland> smoser: definitely a bug...
[15:16] <smoser> byobu version 2.81
[15:16] <smoser> Screen version 4.00.03jw4 (FAU) 2-May-06
[15:16] <kirkland> smoser: okay, i think i know what introduced it
[15:16] <kirkland> smoser: i started naming sessions "byobu"
[15:16] <kirkland> smoser: to make screen and byobu cohabitate better
[15:17] <Jeeves_> sommer: You're welcome
[15:17] <kirkland> smoser: please file a bug, i'll get it fixed asap
[15:17] <Jeeves_> kirkland: What is a mistake?
[15:17] <kirkland> Jeeves_: that it didn't get re-uploaded
[15:17] <kirkland> Jeeves_: thanks for the reminder, i'm on it now
[15:20] <smoser> kirkland, i also find it strange / wrong that if i ctrl-C byobu-launcher i am placed into one of the sessions.
[15:21] <kirkland> Jeeves_: uploaded, awaiting acceptance in -proposed
[15:21] <kirkland> smoser: yeah, file a bug on that too -- you're not the first to say that, but no one has filed a damn bug on it :-)
[15:24] <kirkland> smoser: okay, i see the bug
[15:24] <kirkland> smoser: i'll upload a fix
[15:24] <Daviey> kirkland, I noticed it aswell.. but thought it was intended behaviour :)
[15:25] <|eagles0513875|> i installed ubuntu server on my internet connection at home on this workstation when i took it back to work and getting our internet connectionf or it today the network card for some reason doesnt want to connect to the internet .
[15:25] <|eagles0513875|> hardware in this machine hasnt changed any ideas
[15:27] <smoser> bug 602750 and bug 602753
[15:27] <kirkland> smoser: thanks man
[15:29] <Jeeves_> kirkland: Thanks!
[15:31] <kirkland> Jeeves_: no prob, thanks for the reminder
[15:32] <Jeeves_> yw
[15:35] <alvin> |eagles0513875|: What network card?
[15:36] <Jeeves_> |eagles0513875|: Did you statically configure an ip address?
[15:36] <hallyn> kirkland: damnit, my qemu-within-kvm boot problem turns out to be the libvirt+bios bug where libvirt puts 'boot=on' at the end of an ide drive define and that makes the bios not boot it
[15:38] <hallyn> (bug 591423 that is)
[15:46] <kirkland> hallyn: ah
[15:51] <hallyn> kirkland: basically, https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=579348
[16:12] <a_ok> Jeeves_: what is the best way for me to solve this iscsi boot problem?
[16:15] <a_ok> I mean should I file a bug report or something? can I parse sertain options to the kernel? or is there any documentation on the boot process that might help me pinpoint the problem?
[16:18] <Jeeves_> a_ok: Sorry, I don't know.
[16:19] <a_ok> Jeeves_: thanks anyway
[16:30] <Krazyderek> is it possible to install windows on a KVM on a headless / commandline ubuntu server?
[16:30] <Krazyderek> do i have to load the gui to do that?
[16:42] <Kaffien> how can i determine the UUID of a specific partition?
[16:42] <Jeeves_> blkid /dev/disk
[17:00] <hggdh> !seen mathiaz
[17:00] <hggdh> oh
[18:36] <mathiaz> jiboumans: hi!
[18:36] <jiboumans> hey
[18:36] <jiboumans> there you are :)
[18:36] <jiboumans> i have a call running overtime, ping you asap
[18:36] <jiboumans> mathiaz: ^
[18:37] <mathiaz> jiboumans: ok - np
[18:41] <hggdh> OK. Deutschland ueber alles, the game will start in a few :-)
[18:47] <mathiaz> SpamapS: hi - have you heard of https://labs.omniti.com/trac/reconnoiter?
[18:48] <SpamapS> mathiaz: reading, I had not.. but I have worked with OmniTI for a long time, they're awesome..
[18:48] <mathiaz> SpamapS: right - is this the folks that gave the first workshop at Velocity?
[18:50] <SpamapS> mathiaz: no, they're at http://watchingwebsites.com/
[18:50] <mathiaz> SpamapS: ah ok
[18:50] <mathiaz> SpamapS: one omniTI guy also gave a workshop at velocity
[18:51] <SpamapS> mathiaz: yeah, thats Theo, he started the company
[18:51] <SpamapS> mathiaz: Careercast, who became Adicio later, was one of his earlier clients.
[18:51] <SpamapS> https://labs.omniti.com/trac/reconnoiter/browser/docs/assets/noit-network-arch.png
[18:51] <SpamapS> great pic ;)
[18:52] <SpamapS> mathiaz: this space seems to be exploding
[18:52] <SpamapS> mathiaz: btw I am talking with some guys I met at devops days who are switching from munin -> collectd
[18:53] <SpamapS> mathiaz: munin can't scale beyond 100 servers because of its polling infrastructure
[18:53] <hggdh> mathiaz: would you mind creating another branch (uec-testing-preseeds) under uec-testing-script-dev? I cannot find how to do it
[18:53]  * mathiaz nods
[18:53] <hggdh> mathiaz: and there is an important change in maverick d-i that hit us
[18:54] <mathiaz> hggdh: hm - you should be able to just push a new branch
[18:54] <mathiaz> hggdh: you're part of the ~uec-testing-scripts-dev LP team
[18:54] <SpamapS> mathiaz: the one thing I *don't* like about Reconnoiter is it looks like they're trying to make yet another "everything to everyone" tool instead of something that can easily be plugged into other things.
[18:55] <hggdh> mathiaz: K, will do it
[18:55] <mathiaz> hggdh: bzr push lp:~uec-testing-scripts-dev/uec-testing-scripts/name-of-the-new-branch
[18:55] <hggdh> mathiaz: THANK YOU. bzr is, still, partially misterious to me
[19:28] <soren> mathiaz: Hey, man.
[19:28] <soren> mathiaz: Do you know of a package that uses openldap for its datastore and somehow manages to set it up automatically? I'm needing to do something like that, and I'm looking for prior art.
[19:51] <maek> I have a single package im trying to automate the installation of but it asks 1 question, how do I provide an answer for that?
[19:51] <smoser> maek, debconf-set-selections
[19:53] <maek> smoser: how do I know what the name of the question is?
[19:54] <smoser> look in /var/lib/dpkg/info/<package>.templates
[19:55] <maek> smoser: thanks, so id do debconf chef/chef_server_url mystring
[19:56] <maek> is there a way to tell if a .deb is going to ask questions with out installing it manually?
[19:57] <smoser> not a fool proof one that i know of.
[19:57] <smoser> but possibly /var/lib/dpkg/info/<package>.postinst has
[19:57] <smoser> calls to db_input
[19:58] <smoser> with a priority as the first arg, then, you'll be prompted for that if you have priority set lower or equal to the listed value
[19:59] <maek> you lost me there, where can I read about priority?
[20:23] <mathiaz> soren: hi
[20:23] <mathiaz> soren: try to look at  lp:~asommer/openldap-dit/openldap-dit-split
[20:23] <mathiaz> soren: it's not a package
[20:24] <mathiaz> soren: but has some ideas about how to integrate with the new cn=config stuff
[20:36] <rberger> Using UEC, is there really no way to specify the /dev/sdx device of an EBS Mount? It seems you have to manually figure out which device the instance magically chose by grepping dmesg. Is this really true? It makes it hard to automate.
[20:37] <rberger> ec2-describe-volumes says something like unknown,requested:/dev/sdb but it doesn't mean that its attached to /dev/sdb
[20:50] <soren> mathiaz: Ok, thanks!
[20:50] <soren> mathiaz: That's based on Andreas' work, isn't it?
[20:50] <mathiaz> soren: the key part is to use "-Y EXTERNAL -H ldapi:///"
[20:51] <mathiaz> soren: yes - for the dit
[20:51] <mathiaz> soren: if you use the option below to call ldap* commands you will have access to the whole tree
[20:51] <mathiaz> soren: if run as root
[20:52] <soren> mathiaz: Oh! That looks very interesting.
[20:52] <mathiaz> soren: right - that's the whole point of slapd+cn=config
[20:53] <mathiaz> soren: you don't need to have a "root" account in ldap with a specific password
[20:53] <mathiaz> soren: with proper ACLs you can grant access to root (uid=0) to the whole tree
[20:53] <mathiaz> soren: and do whathever you want
[20:53] <mathiaz> soren: have a look at the acl on the cn=config tree
[20:54] <mathiaz> soren: it grants full access to cn=config to root (uid=0) using peercred=sasl
[20:54] <mathiaz> soren: (or something like that)
[20:54] <Kaffien> why did  ubuntu-server start using  UUID in the fstab?
[20:54] <Kaffien> im just kind of confused
[20:54] <soren> Kaffien: Because device names aren't deterministic.
[20:55] <Kaffien> usually /dev/sda  is the device it was yesterday
[20:55] <Kaffien> and teh day before
[20:55] <Kaffien> and month before ....
[20:55] <soren> On your system.
[20:56] <soren> It was a considreable effort. It wasn't just for fun :)
[20:56] <Kaffien> give me an example in which this becomes necisssary
[20:56] <soren> /dev/sdb and /dev/sda might change plances.
[20:56] <soren> places.
[20:57] <soren> Maybe you switch cables around, maybe it just happens, because the kernel discovers things in a non-deterministic order.
[20:57] <soren> Maybe you insert an extra partition so that /dev/sda3 suddenly becomes /dev/sda4.
[20:57] <soren> there's tons of things that could happen.
[20:58] <soren> The primary motivation back in the day (this changed in edgy (October 2006)), was a specific brand of laptop whose cdrom and harddrive switched places based on whether it was in its docking station or not.
[20:58] <soren> ..but it turned out to solve a /lot/ of other problems (like the ones I outlined above).
[21:11] <soren> mathiaz: I think the peercred things was the missing piece of my puzzle. Good stuff. Thanks!
[21:33] <smoser> cjwatson, do you happen to be around ?
[21:43] <cybrocop> Hi. I'm trying to get my laptop SD card working in Ubuntu 10.04 without any luck. Can anyone help.
[21:43] <cybrocop> The odd thing is that when I insert the card, there are no dmesg messages printed at all.
[21:44] <cybrocop> Shouldn't SOMETHING be logged in dmesg?
[21:44] <ScottK> cybrocop: This is only for server support.  Try #ubuntu.
[21:44] <cybrocop> ScottK, sorry.
[21:46] <gigasoft> how to switch to another group in terminal ?
[22:07] <cjwatson> smoser: slightly
[22:19] <hallyn> kirkland: w00t  finally, managed to live-migrate a debian qemu partition between two maverick kvm vms.
[22:40] <kirkland> hallyn: sweet!
[22:40] <hallyn> mind you this had to be done with qemu.git
[22:41] <hallyn> expect 0.13.0 any day now, so hopefully not a big deal
[23:32] <mathiaz> jiboumans: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.maverick/all
[23:33] <SpamapS> mathiaz: tomorrow can we coordinate around 10:00 Pacific to collaborate on Velocity/Devopsdays trip reports a bit?
[23:44] <mathiaz> SpamapS: hm - I've already published my trip report
[23:44] <mathiaz> SpamapS: https://ubuntumathiaz.wordpress.com/
[23:44] <SpamapS> mathiaz: ah ok cool. :)
[23:45] <SpamapS> mathiaz: I may be agonizing too much over details then. ;)
[23:45] <mathiaz> SpamapS: I haven't written anything special about devops
[23:45] <mathiaz> SpamapS: yeah - I've also wondered about how much detail to put in it
[23:45] <mathiaz> SpamapS: I think I wrote too much for the two blog posts
[23:45] <mathiaz> SpamapS: to much verbose
[23:45] <mathiaz> SpamapS: next time I may change the format to bullet points - key takeaways
[23:46] <mathiaz> SpamapS: and if you wanna more, here is a link to the slides/video
[23:46] <maek> with the limited exposure I have it seems like upstart is more dificuilt then the old servies style init.d files. am I missing something? I do stop mysql and it just sits there for ever. status mysql shows stop/post-start ? what can I read to understand this?
[23:47] <SpamapS> maek: mysql did that with the init scripts too. ;)
[23:47] <maek> SpamapS: not really. I just re installed to 10.04 and a vinalla mysql install doesnt really stop or start correctly. and status is pretty useless :) there has to be something im missing
[23:48] <SpamapS> maek: oh there is a specific bug, I believe, in 10.04 w/ mysql.. but I don't recall the details.
[23:49] <maek> oh no, really? wow do I look stupid. I argue for several weeks to get ubuntu over redhat because it has newer supported php and mysql and now it doesnt work. thanks for the heads up.
[23:51] <SpamapS> maek: mysql is really important to me personally, and to Ubuntu Server in general, so if its broken, please trust that we'll fix it ASAP. :)
[23:52] <maek> SpamapS: ok, thats what I figured. if it broken its just bad timing. Im going to guess its my lack of understanding of upstart
[23:53] <SpamapS> maek: 10.04 is really like 10.04.00 ... you *might* want to try out 10.04.1 first if you are risk-averse. ;)
[23:54] <maek> SpamapS: so since we staretd talking I did "start mysql" and its just sitting there - as root.
[23:54] <SpamapS> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mysql-dfsg-5.1/+bug/566736
[23:55] <SpamapS> mathiaz: ahem, "Won't fix" ? Are we really going to suggest to users that they update their upstart job files?
[23:56] <maek> SpamapS: the default bind-address is 127.0.0.1 - and im not even worried about starting at startup, im having problems starting it anytime.
[23:57] <SpamapS> maek: nothing in the logs about recovering tables or anything like that?
[23:57] <maek> SpamapS: let me check. rebooted just to see what happens after an update.
[23:58] <SpamapS> maek: oi, I just noticed the time, I need to go... but please let me know what happens in here, I"ll check my backscroll later
[23:58] <maek> SpamapS: ok thanks.