[01:40] <lfaraone> dfarning: for ankur, you should say "use whcihever is the most recent"
[02:02]  * lfaraone will be back in 1h30.
[03:43] <lfaraone> Anybody around?
[03:45] <dfarning> Ian_Daniher, how are you?
[03:46] <dfarning> Ian_Daniher, anything interesting going on?
[03:47] <lfaraone> dfarning: I saw your additions to the tasks page. Is there a reason you included activities already present in Debian in the table?
[03:48] <lfaraone> dfarning: "Sugar Activities" is under "New packages", there's a section above (untabilized) named "Package updates" which might be more suitable, but I'm not sure what you're looking for.
[03:49] <dfarning> lfaraone, yes -- this a meant as a semi-long term task tool.  So manu and I can keep track of who is doing what and how they are coming.
[03:49] <lfaraone> dfarning: okay. that might belong under a separate table that is more suited to the task (no pun intended)
[03:51] <dfarning> lfaraone, did you look at the table again recently?
[03:51] <lfaraone> dfarning: I'm looking at it right now.
[03:52] <lfaraone> dfarning: a table with things like "ITP number" and "Ubuntu Version" isn't really well-suited to what you're looking for, right?
[03:54] <lfaraone> dfarning: I'm not saying that's not the right page, I'm just not sure it's the right table for that information.
[03:57] <dfarning> lfaraone, we can just leave ITP and Ubuntu version blank where they don't apply
[03:58] <dfarning> lfaraone, Yah I think I expanded the table beyond what you intended.
[03:59] <dfarning> lfaraone, Is the a reason for keeping track of 'ubuntu version'?
[04:00] <lfaraone> dfarning: well, it origianlly provided us with the information as to what we wer basing our work off of.
[04:02] <dfarning> lfaraone, yes and now all of those packages have been started by someone.
[04:03] <dfarning> dipankar, good morning:)
[04:04] <dipankar> dfarning, good evening :).
[04:04] <lfaraone> dfarning: right. what I saw the table as was a list of activities / software / packages we were trying to get into debian, get reviewed, etc.
[04:04] <dipankar> lfaraone, hi.
[04:06] <lfaraone> hey dipankar .
[04:07] <dipankar> lfaraone, what is the use of debian/install then?
[04:08] <dipankar> lfaraone, * just went through your review
[04:08] <lfaraone> dipankar: if you didn't use CDBS, debian/install tells debhelper (a collection of scripts used by CDBS and by maintainers direcly) where to manually install files into a package direcotry
[04:08] <dfarning> lfaraone, yes I think it still does that well....  I am going to add another colume with a link to the existing package if it all ready exists in debian.
[04:08] <lfaraone> dfarning: maybe a modification of http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/multidistrotools/sugar.html would be more useful?
[04:16] <dipankar> * sorry was going through mails and links
[04:25] <dipankar> lfaraone, dfarning : we have not been assigned any activities on the Sugar/tasks page. Any reason?
[04:26] <dfarning> dipankar, I just put it together about and hour ago -- manu will assign tasks -- but feel free to volunteer.
[04:28] <dipankar> dfarning, okay. I was thinking of the taking up the browse-activity.
[04:29] <dipankar> dfarning, also the sugar-presence-service; as I packaged it for ppa too :)
[04:32]  * dipankar is away: I'm not here
[04:33] <dfarning> dipankar, on second thought -- we better wait til we hear from manu.
[04:41] <dfarning> kandarpk, good morning.
[04:42] <kandarpk> dfarning: good morning
[04:43] <dfarning> kandarpk, what do you have planned for today?
[04:44] <kandarpk> dfarning: Manusheel sir had sent some links for studying Network management
[04:44] <kandarpk> dfarning: will go through them right now, and will ask you my doubts next morning when you get back
[04:44] <dfarning> kandarpk, sounds good.
[04:45] <kandarpk> dfarning: hope it works out
[04:59]  * lfaraone is out for the night. See you all in the morning.
[05:04]  * dipankar is back (gone 00:32:39)
[05:05] <dipankar> kandarpk, good morning
[05:05] <kandarpk> dipankar: good morning
[05:06] <dipankar> dfarning, ok. Lets wait for Manu Sir's e-mail. :)
[05:10] <dipankar> dfarning, continuing work from last night, why tomeu suggested using 'less'? why can't /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-gabble' be opened through gedit?
[05:13] <dfarning> dipankar,  real hackers use less, cat, vim, and sed.  People lie me use gedit:)
[05:13] <dfarning> dipankar, people like me use gedit:)
[05:14] <dipankar> dfarning, can't I use gedit too? :(
[05:15] <dfarning> You are a much better hacker than I every will be.... So the use or hacking tools will help you become more effective.  gedit is fine for now, but with in a couple of months you will be using the experts tools.
[05:16] <kandarpk> dfarning: what topic do I pick up first for studying networking ?
[05:16] <kandarpk> the list has presence service, telepathy, network manager ....
[05:17] <dipankar> kandarpk, just go in the order manu sir sent you the lins
[05:17] <dipankar> *links
[05:18] <kandarpk> ok.
[05:18] <dfarning> kandarpk, I think I would start at http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy that is the framework which sits below http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service and above network manager.
[05:18] <dipankar> kandarpk, that way you will find the topics related to each other. If taken at random, there will be a problem in relating.
[05:19] <dfarning> dipankar, did you get a chance to read the logs of kandarpk and my conversation from last night?
[05:21] <dipankar> dfarning, going through them.
[05:23] <dfarning> dipankar, for me at least, it make a lot more sense to think of the presence-service, telepathy, connection managers, and network manager as part of a stack similar to the osi model.
[05:26] <dipankar> dfarning, ohk.
[05:27] <kandarpk> dfarning: we do not need to touch telepathy
[05:28] <kandarpk> dfarning: so basically we need to study it to understand its functioning ?
[05:29] <dfarning> kandarpk, yes, but one of the most important points is how telepathy can automatically switch back and forth between connection-managers.
[05:30] <dfarning> kandarpk, see the part under connection managers on the telepathy page.
[05:31] <kandarpk> dfarning: if telepathy is hidden from sugar due to the presence of Presence Service and sugar.presence( on which we need to work), how will the study of functioning of telepathy help ?
[05:31] <dfarning> kandarpk, depending on the situation, telepathy choses between gabble and salut
[05:32] <dfarning> kandarpk, It seems that a lot of the bug are related to gabble and salut.... or they at least show up in the stack trace.
[05:33] <kandarpk> dfarning: I am a bit confused now.
[05:33] <kandarpk> dfarning: if telepathy works ok in other environments, why is it failing in sugar ?
[05:34] <kandarpk> we must be using the same module ?
[05:34] <dfarning> kandarpk, I am not sure -- I think it was orginally created for sugar and is just now moving into gnome.
[05:36] <kandarpk> dfarning: does that mean telepathy too needs some modification ?
[05:36] <kandarpk> I mean which layer do we need to modify assumiong others are working fine ?
[05:37] <kandarpk> sugar.presence -> Presence Service -> Telepathy
[05:37] <dfarning> kandarpk, tomeu sent a link to a telepathy developers manual.... which I can't find right now.
[05:37] <dfarning> kandarpk, We can not assume that any of them are working 100%
[05:38] <kandarpk> dfarning: I mean, which layer needs to be fixed first ?
[05:39] <dfarning> kandarpk, I think it will be an iterative process or gradually improving the entire stack.
[05:40] <kandarpk> dfarning: that is what I thought after asking the question
[05:40] <dfarning> kandarpk, on the plus side the telepathy is pretty sell supported by a strong community.
[05:40] <dfarning> is pretty strong
[05:47] <dipankar> dfarning, ok, last last's discussion was a bit confusing.
[05:48] <dfarning> dipankar, ok which part?
[05:48] <dipankar> dfarning, the part sugar.presence and presence service.
[05:50] <dipankar> dfarning, btw are you looking for this link : http://people.collabora.co.uk/~danni/telepathy-book/
[05:52] <dfarning> dipankar, yes thanks.
[05:52] <dipankar> np
[05:57] <dipankar> dfarning, just curious, is there any link b/w telepathy and empathy? they both have same icon.
[05:59] <dfarning> dipankar, http://live.gnome.org/Empathy  .  It looks like empathy sits on top of telepathy
[05:59] <kandarpk> dipankar: I think empathy uses telepathy just as sugar does
[06:00] <dipankar> yup, it is XMPP alright
[06:00] <dipankar> *is on
[06:07] <dipankar> dfarning, what is the task for today? to through the guide, then?
[06:10] <dfarning> dipankar, yes i would suggest taking another look at the http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service and http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy pages and following the links.  with emphasis on http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy_Gabble and http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Telepathy_Salut
[06:11] <kandarpk> dfarning: is D-BUS just another software which enables message passing between different applications ?
[06:11] <kandarpk> by providing standard modules ?
[06:12] <dfarning> kandarpk,  then when tomeu come on line explain what you have learned and ask for help again.  he will be impress by the preparation you have done before asking for help again:)
[06:13] <kandarpk> dfarning
[06:13] <kandarpk> sure
[06:14] <dfarning> kandarpk, oops typo I didn't dipankar and tomeu work together yesterday.
[06:15] <dfarning> but anyway working together with him will be good.
[06:16] <dfarning> kandarpk, yes, dbus is just another IPC system.
[06:16] <dfarning> kandarpk, but it came about as an effort to minimize the differences between gnome and kde.
[06:17] <kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
[06:17] <kandarpk> dfarning: didn't know gnome and kde were so different.
[06:19] <dfarning> kandarpk, historically they were pretty different.  http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/ was a joint project designed to bring them together around certain standards.
[06:19] <dipankar> dfarning, I went through a page on D-BUS(can't remember exactly which one). It mentioned there that D-BUS can also be used for device detection sort. Like if a USB drive is inserted.
[06:20] <dipankar> dfarning, so D-BUS is not limited to networking only, I guess
[06:22] <dfarning> dipankar, http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/dbus dbus  ... does not 'detect' the device rather it passes message that 'something' detected new hardware.
[06:23] <dipankar> dfarning, yup ^^ that is the site :)
[06:23] <kandarpk> dfarning: Sugar provides a wrapper interface to the D-Bus API in the Python module sugar.presence.
[06:23] <kandarpk> what does it mean ?
[06:23] <kandarpk> I am not able to understand the use of sugar.presence
[06:24] <dfarning> dipankar, any service can send a message using dbus.
[06:24] <kandarpk> *functionality of sugar.presence
[06:24] <dfarning> kandarpk, what was the context of your last question.
[06:24] <dfarning> ?
[06:25] <kandarpk> dfarning: http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service
[06:25] <kandarpk> dfarning: the Presence Service is responsible for detecting different users
[06:25] <kandarpk> why can't applications directly interact with presence service
[06:26] <kandarpk> and remove the sugar.presence module layer
[06:26] <dipankar> kandarpk, Python activities (and Sugar) make use of the sugar.presence module to interact with Presence Service. sugar.presence provides an API for accessing Presence Service over the D-Bus session bus. <from the wiki.laptop.org>
[06:27] <dipankar> kandarpk, oops I thought you didn't check the site
[06:28] <dfarning> kandarpk, i believe they can interact directly.. but there are several commonly reoccurring 'things' that activities need to do such as invite, share ....
[06:29] <dfarning> kandarpk, see http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Activity_sharing
[06:31] <dfarning> kandarpk, check out http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Presence_Service_DBus_API for what api presense_service offers.
[06:33] <dfarning> dipankar, kandarpk good night guys.  thanks for everything
[06:33] <kandarpk> dfarning: good night.
[06:33] <kandarpk> dfarning: pleasure working with you.
[06:33] <dipankar> dfarning, good night. I will go through the links deeply this afternoon IST
[06:34] <kandarpk> dfarning: hopefully I'll have some doubts.
[06:53]  * dipankar is away: I'm not here
[10:31]  * dipankar is away: I'm not here
[13:58] <dipankar> dfarning, good morning
[14:06] <dfarning> dipankar, good morning
[14:07] <dipankar> dfarning, how are you doing this morning?
[14:09] <dfarning> I am good and you.
[14:09] <dfarning> dipankar, tomeu is waiting to go over yesterday bug with you again:)
[14:09] <dipankar> I am also doing good :)
[14:10] <dipankar> dfarning, I still couldn't use less to open up the file.
[14:10] <dipankar> :(
[14:11] <dfarning> dipankar, I would guess that is has something to do with fonts.
[14:11] <dipankar> dfarning, I am going through the manual here since tomeu wasn't sure of my linux knowledge :( http://en.flossmanuals.net/CommandLineIntro/MovingAround
[14:11] <dfarning> dipankar, but you know a lot more today than yesterday.
[14:11] <dfarning> dipankar, good idea.
[14:12] <dipankar> dfarning, I tried a lot to open up the file in 'less' whenever it opened, it shows only '@'s all around
[14:14] <dipankar> dfarning, btw I still don't know what the bug is related to?
[14:14] <dfarning> dipankar, yes that is a font thing.  just used gedit of vim for now:)
[14:14] <ishan> dfarning , hi
[14:15] <dipankar> dfarning, :) thanks.
[14:15] <dfarning> ishan, good morning.
[14:15] <dipankar> * thats was a comforting
[14:15] <ishan> did i miss something
[14:16] <kandarpk> dfarning: good morning
[14:17] <dipankar> kandarpk, hi :)
[14:17] <dfarning> kandarpk, good morning.
[14:18] <kandarpk> dipankar: how is your progress regarding networking ?
[14:18] <dipankar> dfarning, what is the bug you pasted last night (IST)? I am not clear with that.
[14:18] <dipankar> kandarpk, so-so, Its pretty tough to understand thing in one go.
[14:19] <dfarning> dipankar, it was the same one you were working on with tomeu.
[14:19] <kandarpk> same here
[14:19] <ishan> kandarp, hi
[14:19] <kandarpk> ishan: hi
[14:19] <kandarpk> ishan: how are you ?
[14:20] <ishan> kandarp, fine
[14:20] <ishan> trying to understand networking
[14:20] <kandarpk> ishan: you can use tab to autocomplete the nickname
[14:21] <ishan> kandarpk, okay
[14:21] <dipankar> dfarning, I mean, what is the bug on Sugar? What does it affect? :)
[14:23] <dfarning> dipankar, I think it prevents me from connecting to a jabber server on my computer:(
[14:23] <dipankar> dfarning, ohk.
[14:24] <kandarpk> dfarning: I found studying the manuals very hard
[14:24] <dipankar> kandarpk, +1
[14:24] <ishan> kandarpk,  +1
[14:24] <kandarpk> dfarning: they have too much info.
[14:25] <dfarning> Yes, I suggest a couple of hands on debugging sessions with tomeu:)
[14:27] <kandarpk> dipankar: what do you say ?
[14:28] <dipankar> kandarpk, dfarning I am up for it. But last night's interaction with tomeu really set me back a bit
[14:28] <kandarpk> dipankar: can me and ankur join from where you left in debugging with tomeu ?
[14:29] <dipankar> kandarpk, As far as I know ankur is assigned with networking
[14:29] <kandarpk> dipankar: oh yes, not ankur but ishan
[14:29] <dipankar> kandarpk, sure why not. There is nothing to ask in that
[14:30] <kandarpk> dipankar: I mean did you make any progress that we might find hard to catch up ?
[14:32] <dipankar> kandarpk, ishan : Till nothing much has been covered. I was advised by tomeu to go through 'Linux command line' tutorial first.
[14:32] <dfarning> dipankar, don't worry about it.  It is an iterative learning process and we all understand that.  We are all just glad you guys are taking on these tasks.   One thing to remember.... on IRC we are often doing several things at once.  So frustration can easily be misdirected:(
[14:33] <ishan> dipankar, any particular tutorial adviced by tomeu
[14:34] <dipankar> dfarning, I was thinking of that only. I guess tomeu was involved deeply in some other thing :)
[14:35] <dipankar> ishan, nope. But walterbender did suggest using flossmanuals.net
[14:35] <dfarning> dipankar, +1
[14:35] <dipankar> dfarning, hows is tomeu today? I hope he is _really_ free...
[14:35] <ishan> dipankar, okay
[14:36] <dfarning> dipankar, you will just have to ask:)
[14:36] <dipankar> dfarning, aww. thats tough!
[14:37] <kandarpk> dipankar: don't worry
[14:37] <kandarpk> I know some command line
[14:37] <kandarpk> you just ask
[14:38] <dipankar> ok, here goes nothing.
[14:39] <dipankar> dfarning, oh. I lost the link to the paste. Can you please provide it again?
[14:40] <dfarning> dipankar, http://pastebin.org/390195
[14:42] <dipankar> * guys please join in #sugar. I am feeling lonely
[14:43] <dipankar> :P
[14:53] <kandarpk> dfarning: what should we do now ?
[14:53] <kandarpk> dfarning: studying tutorials and understanding them will take a lot of time
[14:53] <dfarning> kandarpk, one moment
[14:59]  * lfaraone waves.
[15:00] <dipankar> hi lfaraone :)
[15:01] <kandarpk> lfaraone: hi
[15:01] <lfaraone> hey dipankar, kandarpk.
[15:02] <dipankar> lfaraone, how are you this morning?
[15:02] <lfaraone> dipankar: decent, you?
[15:03] <dipankar> lfaraone, I think good :), its just we are having a tough time in networking.
[15:30] <lfaraone> dipankar: okay. let me know if there is anything I can help with.
[15:32] <dipankar> lfaraone, sure. I saw you are also busy on #sugar
[15:32]  * ishan is away for dinner
[15:47] <dfarning> dipankar, kandarpk, did you follow my conversation on #sugar?
[15:47] <dipankar> dfarning, I am trying. its a bit tough
[15:49] <dfarning> dipankar, me too:(
[15:49] <dfarning> dipankar, I think the next step is to figure out what ---- this looks to me as a wart in dbus+dbus-python: PS wants to call gabble, dbus starts gabble, gabble dies shortly after, dbus-python tries to introspect, introspection fails, dbus-python tries anyway to call it, marshalling fails because it's guessing the signature wrongly, logs confusing error
[15:49]  * ishan is back
[15:49] <dfarning> means:)
[15:51] <kandarpk> dfarning: Its very confusing
[15:51] <dfarning> dipankar, kandarpk I am going to take a short break... be back in a few minutes.
[15:52] <dipankar> dfarning, no problem
[15:55] <dfarning> kandarpk, dipankar does everyone have plenty of tasks in the queue to stay productive....
[15:56] <manusheel> dfarning: Yes. Luke has provided good code reviews.
[15:57] <manusheel> dfarning: Improvements need to be made in packages accordingly.
[15:57] <kandarpk> dfarning: and we can take up other activities when we finish the ones we are working on
[15:58] <manusheel> kandarpk, dipankar: The networking related tasks will require regular effort from our side.
[15:58] <manusheel> Let us take things step by step.
[15:58] <dipankar_> dfarning, did I miss anything
[15:58] <dipankar_> ?
[15:58] <manusheel> In the beginning, things might look hard and difficult to gather.
[15:59] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: networking seems to wide to cover
[15:59] <manusheel> No one is expecting a 100% understanding of the context. We'll take things step by step.
 dfarning, I was just viewing the shell.log while sending a friend request to ishan and got this:
[15:59] <dipankar_> 1279031604.881226 DEBUG s-p-s.server_plugin: friends subscribed
[15:59] <dipankar_> 1279031604.881913 DEBUG s-p-s.server_plugin: friends group synced
[15:59] <dipankar_> 1279031618.053936 WARNING s-p-s.presenceservice: Error fetching aliases: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
[16:00] <manusheel> kandarpk: It is actually not very wide to cover.
[16:00] <dfarning> manusheel, kandarpk +1 networking/collaboration is the single most unique feature and benefit of Sugar.... OLPC and SL have been working on it for several years and not gotten it to work.
[16:00] <dipankar_> manusheel, Sir the problem is with lack of hands on session
[16:01] <manusheel> dipankar: Hands on session will come. We just need to be patient and work towards whatever we have. No one has developed hands on session in networking related development.
[16:02] <manusheel> Perhaps, that is an opportunity too.
[16:02] <manusheel> dipankar: It is very much like a research problem, where we have a set of resources available.
[16:02] <dipankar> manusheel, ok..
[16:02] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: I found it tough because
[16:03] <kandarpk> we need to work on sugar.preservence, Preservence service, Telepathy, D-BUS
[16:03] <manusheel> We need to develop an objective statement and an approach. We'll be able to do it once we try and analyze the different parameters involved in the context, their use-cases and importance. We'll define priorities accordingly.
[16:03] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: each one being big enough to study
[16:04] <manusheel> kandarpk: It is way too early to say it is tough.
[16:04] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: you are right
[16:04] <kandarpk> we haven't put in much yet
[16:05] <dipankar> manusheel, Sir I would put it, its tough for first go.
[16:05] <manusheel> kandarpk: You'll need to spend time. Take things as they come. Accept it, reject it or wait till you have a better answer. Get to the level of details step by step or adhoc depending upon the resources available.
[16:05] <manusheel> And, then arrive at a defined approach and implementation steps.
[16:06] <manusheel> dipankar: This is one step forward from packaging. Some challenges ought to be there. We should like challenges and develop an approach as we work.
[16:07] <dipankar> manusheel, ok Sir.
[16:07] <manusheel> dipankar: Some of the areas will remain open to analysis and debate. We'll need to focus on what we can gather and put it into perspective accordingly.
[16:08] <dipankar> ok
[16:08] <manusheel> dipankar, kandarpk: So, be patient. Networking is a core research area. You'll need to spend time and energy on this aspect along with your ongoing tasks.
[16:09] <manusheel> I personally feel you'll enjoy this experience.
[16:09] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: actually, being completely new to networking, we found it a bit challenging
[16:10] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: but I am sure we will learn a lot with time
[16:10] <manusheel> kandarpk: You are not new to networking. You are new to this paradigm of networking in reference to Sugar.
[16:12] <manusheel> kandarpk: Well, everyone is, in the beginning. No one comes with a whole set of tools available. Networking in reference to Sugar is an area of importance. I would like you to learn what you can, and try to put this into context through assignments, bug fixing and documentation.
[16:12] <manusheel> We'll then move into feature enhancement requests.
[16:13] <manusheel> You'll need to get comfortable with these things, before we start focusing on the design and feature enhancement requests.
[16:13] <dipankar> makes sense Sir
[16:14] <manusheel> dipankar, kandarpk: Great. Good luck.
[16:14] <manusheel> dipankar: Also, discuss amongst yourselves as you learn things. Will help you build up that base, which is very much required.
[16:15] <manusheel> kandarpk, dipankar: After all, we are working on collaborative models :-)
[16:15] <dipankar> manusheel, thanks Sir. will try our best :)
[16:15] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: :)
[16:23]  * dipankar is off for dinner
[16:23]  * dipankar is away: I'm not here
[16:59] <dfarning> ankur ankur_ hello
[16:59] <dfarning> how is your connection today
[16:59] <ankur> dfarning,  hello . good morning :)
[17:00] <ankur> well it seems good as far .i didn't got disconnected .
[17:00] <ankur> how are you?
[17:00] <dfarning> ankur after debugging with tomeu, I needed a nap:)
[17:01] <dfarning> ankur the networking/collaboration stuff makes my head spin:(
[17:01] <kandarpk> dfarning: you had proper rest ?
[17:01] <dfarning> kandarpk, yes:)
[17:02] <dfarning> kandarpk, I guess we will do a bit more reading and try again tomorrow.......
[17:02] <dfarning> kandarpk, how is the packaging coming?
[17:03] <kandarpk> dfarning: Networking kept me too busy
[17:03] <ankur> dfarning,  i just came , and i will be working till late today , can you help me catch up on what we did today ?
[17:05] <dfarning> kandarpk, Let's put networking on a lower priority for a day or so...... We will be working on the for the next 12 months and we have plenty of other pressing tasks.
[17:05] <kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
[17:06] <dfarning> ankur tomeu helped us debug a problem.... but none of us understood enough to know what he was talking about:(
[17:07] <ankur> well working on it help us get it in future i hope, i was not there so i cannot comment much :(
[17:07] <dfarning> ankur so I was going to go over the logs this afternoon and try to understand it betters so we can return with smarted question in a couple of days.
[17:08] <ankur> dfarning,  i too will go over the log and see what i can understand :)
[17:08] <dfarning> kandarpk, does everyone have a good queue of packages?  Are there things I can do to help anyone who is stuck?
[17:09] <kandarpk> dfarning: most of us have some practice of packaging now
[17:10] <kandarpk> dfarning: I don't think packaging should be a problem now
[17:10] <kandarpk> dfarning: let me correct the packages I've already pushed
[17:10] <kandarpk> will seek your help if I get stuck somewhere
[17:10] <dfarning> kandarpk, did you see I added some more packages to http://wiki.debian.org/Sugar/tasks#preview
[17:11] <kandarpk> dfarning: yes, I saw them
[17:11] <kandarpk> dfarning: that is why I think we have plenty of work at hand
[17:12] <kandarpk> dfarning: you've added read-activity as well, which Jonas is maintaining
[17:12] <dfarning> kandarpk, these activities are all ready packaged in debian. They will just need to be updated and added to collob-maint
[17:13] <kandarpk> dfarning: we need to merge the activity present at collab-maint with the latest one ?
[17:13] <dfarning> kandarpk, and some from seeta to 'maintain' or be responsible for them.
[17:14] <dfarning> kandarpk, You will need to talk to lfaraone about the exact process.
[17:15] <ankur> dfarning,  also chat activity was packaged by jonas (and it was latest version)
[17:15] <kandarpk> dfarning: ok, but the activities( outdated ) are present at collab-maint ?
[17:16] <dfarning> kandarpk, these are debain issues that we will have to work out with lfaraone.
[17:16] <kandarpk> lfaraone: around ?
[17:16]  * lfaraone will be back, lunch.
[17:17] <dfarning> kandarpk, at this point the list represents the packages that I think we want to ship.
[17:17] <kandarpk> dfarning: ok, got your point
[17:18] <kandarpk> dfarning: we need to have latest packages of these activities at collab-maint
[17:18] <kandarpk> ?
[17:18] <dfarning> kandarpk, they may be en various states of packaging by different people.  But, I would like to see if we can work with jonas and lfaraone to get them on collab-maint.
[17:18] <dfarning> kandarpk, yes... i type too slow.
[17:19] <kandarpk> dfarning: ok.
[17:19] <dfarning> kandarpk, by moving them all to collab-maint and packaging them all in a uniform manner we can reduce our future maintaince burden (cost).
[17:22] <dfarning> kandarpk, can you assign and track work until we hear back from Manu?
[17:24] <kandarpk> dfarning: I'll assign one activity each till Manu sir replies
[17:26] <dfarning> kandarpk, Ok great, I am going to try to come up with a better plan for how to learn about collaboration.
[17:27] <dfarning> kandarpk, I'll talk to you again in the morning.
[17:39] <ankur> lfaraone,  are you around?
[17:39] <lfaraone> ankur: for a little while, what?
[17:40] <ankur> okay , i needed to ask some questions , some quickies
[17:40] <ankur> when you mention "*" rule
[17:40] <lfaraone> ankur: okay.
[17:40] <ankur> you refer to the portion where we have written Files : *
[17:40] <ankur> in copyright file ?
[17:42] <lfaraone> ankur: yes.
[17:42] <kandarpk> ankur, ankur_ : Neeraj has packaged write and record ?
[17:42] <lfaraone> ankur: see http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/#index2h3
[17:43] <ankur> and you mentioned to include years as well
[17:43] <ankur> so in that case where i have not mentioned year or say i have not got year, i will take or assume it as 2010
[17:43] <ankur> like in case of setup.py
[17:43] <ankur> of in "*" case
[17:44] <ankur> kandarpk,  i dont have any idea about that . i will see if i can find him online
[17:45] <manusheel> kandarpk: around?
[17:46] <kandarpk> lfaraone: after specifying 3.0 (quilt) source package format, do I need to build the package again ?
[17:46] <lfaraone> kandarpk: well, you should do so if only to verify the package still builds, no?
[17:46] <kandarpk> lfaraone: right.
[17:49] <ankurkhurana_> lfaraone,  can you answer about year that when we are not provideed with years then i should take it as 2010?
[17:49] <ankurkhurana_> i got disconnected :(
[17:49] <ankurkhurana_> in case you answered
[17:49] <lfaraone> ankurkhurana_: use "first release date of the package"/
[17:50] <ankurkhurana_> okay. and i do not have a debian/source folder
[17:50] <lfaraone> ankurkhurana_: you should create one.
[17:51] <ankurkhurana_> lfaraone,  thanks :)
[17:51] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: hello sir
[17:51] <manusheel> kandarpk: Hi Kandarp.
[17:52] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: You were looking for me ?
[17:52] <manusheel> kandarpk: I would like you to work on Read and Pippy package after you complete your current set of packages.
[17:53] <manusheel> Please add your name.
[17:53] <manusheel> ankur: Around?
[17:53] <kandarpk> manusheel sir: Ok, I worked on read before as well, so no problems
[17:54] <manusheel> kandarpk: Great.
[17:54] <manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : Ankur, have you completed your set of packages?
[17:55] <ankurkhurana__> manusheel sir after the review i am changing my packages accordingly , there were some mistakes . So rectifying them.
[17:56] <manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : How long do you think it will take you to complete these tasks?
[17:56] <manusheel> An estimation only.
[17:56] <ankurkhurana__> I will be able to complete them today , in case some technical problem arise which i am not able to do by myself , by tommorow afternoon at max
[17:57] <manusheel> Ok, great.
[17:57] <manusheel> Let me assign you the next set of packages.
[17:58] <manusheel> ankur: You'll be working on Write and Record activity.
[17:58] <manusheel> i.e. packaging these activities.
[17:58] <ankurkhurana__> manusheel,  it will be great :0 . packaging can get bit monotone :)
[17:58] <ankurkhurana__> sir , i think neeraj have already packaged them as i talked to him last night
[17:58] <ankurkhurana__> he hasn't pushed them yet
[17:58] <ankurkhurana__> if not
[17:59] <manusheel> ankurkhurana__: Ok.
[17:59] <ankurkhurana__> i will push them up
[17:59] <manusheel> Sure.
[18:00] <manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : I would like you to get started on Sugar's human interface guidelines.
[18:00] <manusheel> Let me send you the link - http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Human_Interface_Guidelines
[18:00] <ankurkhurana__> will be glad to do so , sir you said you will send a link of the guidelines .
[18:00] <ankurkhurana__> okay , i am bit late :)
[18:01] <manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : I would like you to study them in detail. Once you are ready, we'll touch base with Gary on UI paradigm of Sugar.
[18:02] <manusheel> You'll be first solving UI bugs. Then working on feature enhancements.
[18:02] <ankurkhurana__> manusheel right sir . I will start working on them once i upload these packages .
[18:03] <manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : Sure. Please also confirm the current status of Read and Record activities.
[18:03] <ankurkhurana__> neeraj is here :)
[18:04] <manusheel> neeraj: Hi Neeraj.
[18:05] <neeraj> hi manusheel sir
[18:05] <neeraj> hi ankurkhurana__
[18:05] <manusheel> neeraj: What is the status of packaging of Read and Record activities?
[18:05] <manusheel> Have you submitted them for review?
[18:06] <neeraj> Sir just doing that.. got struck while filling ITP that day..
[18:06] <neeraj> ankur is helping me in that
[18:06] <manusheel> ankurkhurana__ : The next activity that I would like you to package after completing this set of activities is Paint.
[18:06] <manusheel> neeraj: Ok.
[18:07] <ankurkhurana__> manusheel,  will do it :)
[18:14] <manusheel> ankur: Thanks Ankur.
[18:15] <kandarpk> lfaraone: around ?
[18:15] <ankur> manusheel sir, for ?
[18:18] <manusheel> ankur: For starting with paint activity package. I am sure it is going to be an interesting effort.
[18:18] <manusheel> :-)
[18:19] <ankur> manusheel sir , thank you sir :) . i will be glad to do so .
[18:24] <kandarpk> lfaraone: getting error while pushing : http://pastebin.org/392283
[18:25] <lfaraone> kandarpk: did you pull in my changes before you started working?
[18:25] <kandarpk> lfaraone: yes
[18:25] <lfaraone> kandarpk: the "non-fast-forward" bit says otherwise.
[18:26] <kandarpk> lfaraone: I used
[18:26] <kandarpk> git pull git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git
[18:26] <kandarpk> before working
[18:26] <lfaraone> kandarpk: okay. run that command again now.
[18:27] <kandarpk> lfaraone: it says already upto date
[18:27] <kandarpk> From git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity
[18:27] <kandarpk>  * branch            HEAD       -> FETCH_HEAD
[18:27] <kandarpk> Already up-to-date.
[18:28] <lfaraone> kandarpk: I'm looking at http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git;a=summary, ant it appears your commits are there.
[18:28] <kandarpk> lfaraone: yes, commits are present
[18:29] <kandarpk> lfaraone: what errors were reported then ?
[18:29] <kandarpk> http://pastebin.org/392283
[18:29] <lfaraone> kandarpk: in pristine-tar and upstream.
[18:30] <lfaraone> kandarpk: "git pull git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git pristine-tar" then "git pull git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/sugar-memorize-activity.git  upstream"
[18:31] <kandarpk> lfaraone: do I need to push again after running the above two commands ?
[18:38] <lfaraone> kandarpk: you shouldn't since you didn't make changes.
[18:38] <lfaraone> kandarpk: but see if you still get the error.
[18:38]  * lfaraone will be back later.
[19:12] <ankur> dfarning,  one problem is coming in packaging
[19:13] <ankur> when i generate copyright_hints file
[19:13] <ankur> using
[19:13] <ankur> DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build
[19:13] <ankur> i am not able to open the copyright_hint file
[19:13] <ankur> Gedit says format not recognised
[19:14] <dfarning> ankur what is the result of ls -la
[19:15] <ankur> dfarning, http://paste.ubuntu.com/463093/
[19:15] <ankur> oops
[19:15] <ankur> i done it in aactivit folder
[19:15] <ankur> not in debian folder
[19:15] <ankur> where was i supposed to give that command in debian folder?
[19:16] <ankur> pasting that also
[19:16] <ankur> dfarning,  http://paste.ubuntu.com/463094/
[19:16] <ankur> this is in debian folder
[19:17] <dfarning> ankur I don't  see a copyright_hint file
[19:18] <ankur> dfarning,  one min , i will paste new one .
[19:19] <ankur> i might have deleted it while checking
[19:20] <ankur> dfarning,  i am not able to again create copyright_hints file
[19:20] <ankur> if you excuse me for some time
[19:20] <ankur> i will get back to you
[19:20] <dfarning> ankur sure
[19:23] <neeraj> dfarning, while submitting itp I made one mistake http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?msg=5;bug=588949
[19:23] <neeraj> pls see ur inbox..
[19:24] <dfarning> neeraj, what is wrong with it?
[19:25] <neeraj> see the url part
[19:26] <dfarning> neeraj, Don't worry about that.  An ITP is just a notice that you send to the list to let others know you will be working on a particular package.
[19:27] <neeraj> dfarning, ok..
[19:28] <kandarpk> ankur: around ?
[19:28] <ankur> yes
[19:29] <kandarpk> ankur: how do we generate copyright_hint ?
[19:29] <dfarning> neeraj, and it is also a reminder.  If you let a ITP sit too long without completing the package, people will start to bug you:)
[19:29] <ankur> kandarpk,  DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE = 1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build
[19:29] <ankur> then rename copyright_newhints file
[19:30] <ankur> to copyright_hints
[19:30] <ankur> kandarpk,  i learned this from reading the conversation between you and luke in logs :P
[19:30] <kandarpk> ankur:do we need to add pre-build to debian/rules ?
[19:30] <ankur> no
[19:30] <kandarpk> ok
[19:30] <ankur> everything is done autmatically
[19:30] <kandarpk> ok.
[19:30] <ankur> i want able to see where the arguement of pre-build go in rules file
[19:31] <ankur> may i didnt inspected it fully
[19:31] <ankur> kandarpk,  were you able to push your changes
[19:31] <kandarpk> yes
[19:31] <ankur> as i was getting same problem as you
[19:31] <ankur> of fast forwareded packages
[19:31] <ankur> that you just asked luke
[19:31] <kandarpk> Ok, I didnt try the same package again
[19:31] <ankur> did pulling from both and master and upstream worked
[19:31] <ankur> ?
[19:32] <ankur> okay
[19:32] <ankur> when you try
[19:32] <ankur> please do tell me
[19:32] <ankur> as
[19:32] <ankur> i pushed some package to git
[19:32] <kandarpk> ankur: I didn't push the same package again
[19:32] <ankur> kandarpk,  will ask you later then
[19:32] <ankur> what are you working on as of now?
[19:33] <kandarpk> ankur: correcting the packages I had pushed
[19:33] <ankur> kandarpk,  ok
[19:33] <kandarpk> poll, connect, memorize
[19:34] <ankur> kandarpk,  did you fully understand the conceot of copyrights?
[19:34] <ankur> i am confused int that
[19:34] <ankur> may you can help me out if you asked luke some of the same questions i wonder
[19:34] <kandarpk> ankur: I just list down all the files
[19:34] <kandarpk> nothing else
[19:34] <ankur> can you send me your copyright file after you work out your package
[19:34] <ankur> how do you do that?
[19:35] <ankur> any particular procedure
[19:35] <ankur> do you check all files personally
[19:35] <kandarpk> wait
[19:35] <ankur> ?
[19:36] <kandarpk> ankur
[19:36] <kandarpk> http://paste.ubuntu.com/463097/
[19:37] <ankur> kandarp try this
[19:37] <ankur> in your activity folder
[19:37] <ankur> licensecheck --r -copyright *
[19:37] <ankur> and do these match with copyright_hints
[19:37] <ankur> actually i was confused
[19:37] <ankur> because they show somewhat different things
[19:38] <ankur> and luke also said to make sure that we dont miss out on one
[19:38] <neeraj> dfarning, in control.in depends field $(python-abiword:Depends) will be fine?
[19:38] <ankur> file
[19:39] <ankur> kandarpk,  around?
[19:39] <kandarpk> ankur: yes
[19:39] <dfarning> neeraj, I think that you just need to replace EXTRA_DEPENDANCIES with python-abiword
[19:40] <neeraj> while building I used only python-abiword..
[19:40] <dfarning> neeraj, did it give and error.
[19:40] <neeraj> ok.. I was just trying to modify all file acco to lfaraone reviews to other packages
[19:41] <kandarpk> neeraj: its correct
[19:41] <dfarning> the ${...} is bash for a calling a variable.
[19:41] <kandarpk> python-abiword
[19:41] <kandarpk> just use this
[19:41] <ankur> dfarning,  so we use   ", python-abiword"
[19:42] <ankur> or " , ${python-abiword:Depends}"
[19:42] <ankur> or even EXTRADEPENDENCIES
[19:42] <dfarning> ankur, the firstone
[19:42] <kandarpk> Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${python:Depends}, python-abiword, ${misc:Depends}
[19:42] <neeraj> dfarning, kandarpk I was just trying to modify it acco to this comment of lfaraone http://paste.ubuntu.com/463108/
[19:43] <neeraj> kandarpk, yes.. initially I used only this :)
[19:43] <ankur> neeraj,  that means that you have to give ' '(space) after
[19:43] <ankur> the ','
[19:43] <kandarpk> neeraj: you might have put commas in wrong places
[19:43] <ankur> dfarning,  copyright thing is still confusing . :(
[19:44] <dfarning> ankur i agree.
[19:44] <neeraj> kandarpk, I am not getting ny error.. I am just asking whether that method is correct or not..
[19:44] <neeraj> anyways.. leave it as of now :)
[19:44] <kandarpk> neeraj: put commas in correct places
[19:44] <kandarpk> I think rest all is fine
[19:49] <ankur> dfarning,  can you help me find the correct version of paint
[19:49] <ankur> :)
[19:49] <ankur> http://activities.sugarlabs.org/en-US/sugar/addon/4082
[19:50] <ankur> here it says 27
[19:50] <ankur> and i cannot find any other info abt version
[19:50] <ankur> dfarning,  got it in activity.info
[19:50] <ankur> it is 27
[19:51] <ankur> i will be proced with it . It will be right ? , just confirming though
[19:53] <dfarning> ankur I belive so.... just to be on the safe side please send an email to godiard@gmail.com and Ashita Dadlani <ashita@seeta.in> they are the current maintainers of paint.
[19:53] <ankur> well that git is maintained by Manusheel sir, wont he know
[19:53] <ankur> ?
[19:55] <kandarpk> dfarning, ankur, neeraj : good night
[19:55] <ankur> kandarpk, good night
[19:55] <dfarning> ankur manusheel passed maintains off to the two people I just listed above:)  he has not had time to hack for a while
[19:55] <dfarning> kandarpk, good night and thanks
[19:55] <neeraj> kandarpk, good night
[19:55] <ankur> dfarning,  i will send a mail to Ashita then.
[19:56] <kandarpk> dfarning: dont say that, feels embarrassing
[20:00] <neeraj> ankur, what change should I make in copyright file?
[20:01] <ankur> neeraj , well what i do was to run thin sommand
[20:01] <ankur> *command
[20:01] <ankur> DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot debian/rules pre-build
[20:01] <ankur> then it lists all the copyright holder name
[20:01] <ankur> i copied them from terminal in proper forma
[20:01] <ankur> t
[20:01] <neeraj> ok
[20:02] <ankur> thought i have to confirm about this from luke that if i follow this procedure i will follow in right side of rule
[20:05] <ankur> i have sent Ashita a mail to confirm though
[20:05] <ankur> i wil find if bert is available at this or not. :)
[20:06] <ankur> dfarning,  he is not available as of now.Shall i send a mail to him as of now as i need to confirm about it's version as well
[20:09] <dfarning> ankur yes, and just introduce yourself devs like to know the people who package their work.
[20:10] <ankur> well what will be the proper way of introduction ? if you dont mind
[20:12] <dfarning> ankur Hi, i am packaging paint for debain and ubuntu.  I just wanted to say hello:)
[20:12] <ankur> dfarning,  i will compose a mail and send it to you and and again send it  to Bert after you nod on it. :)
[20:13] <dfarning> ankur sure
[20:22] <ankur> dfarning,  http://paste.ubuntu.com/463125/
[20:22] <ankur> Does it require any changes ?
[20:23] <dfarning> ankur looks good
[20:23] <ankur> dfarning,  then i am sending it :)
[20:32] <ankur> df
[20:32] <ankur> dfarning,  http://paste.ubuntu.com/463129/
[20:32] <ankur> again the copyright_hint file error
[20:32] <ankur> i produced it by method luke told
[20:34] <dfarning> ankur try 'less copyright_hint'
[20:34] <ankur> it worked
[20:34] <ankur> but is less an editor
[20:34] <ankur> ?
[20:35] <ankur> dfarning,  i will fix the copyright issue of all the packages later when luke returns tommorow
[20:35] <ankur> as of now it is bit confusing
[20:35] <dfarning> ankur rather then gedit I suggest that you get in the habit of using vim.
[20:36] <dfarning> ankur it is a little confusing to learn.... but very fast to make quick edits.
[20:36] <ankur> dfarning,  i know that vi is used by most of the core developers
[20:36] <ankur> i tried to learn it but then gedit seemed mush easier
[20:36] <ankur> dfarning,  i will learn
[20:36] <dfarning> ankur great
[20:36] <dfarning> ankur great
[20:37] <ankur> will start working on vim :)
[20:37] <ankur> dfarning,   i was little confused by packaging commands so i created some scripts to help me out :)
[20:38] <ankur> it works wonder
[20:38] <dfarning> ankur very nice.  a nice library of personal scripts is incredibably handy.
[20:44] <ankur> dfarning,  i will be waiting for bert and ashita reply
[20:44] <ankur> and put them in queue as well tommorow
[20:44] <ankur> i have uploaded other activities as of now
[20:44] <ankur> will learn more abt copyright tomorrow from luke
[20:44] <ankur> good night
[21:10] <lfaraone> dfarning: so, anything else on the docket for reviews? right now I have log and flipsticks (re-review) in the queue. aside from that, I'm working on python-elements so we can get physics in.
[21:13] <neeraj> lfaraone, I will push write activity now..
[21:14] <dfarning> neeraj, nice.
[21:14] <neeraj> lfaraone, dfarning please see this http://paste.ubuntu.com/463146/
[21:14] <dfarning> lfaraone, and several people have expressed confusion about copyrights....  Could you clarify that with neeraj?
[21:15] <neeraj> If I have tried my best to make changes as per lfaraone reviews to packages push by other members
[21:19] <neeraj> dfarning, did u tried the record activity on ur lucid?
[21:19] <dfarning> neeraj, no not yet.  did you send it to me and I missed it?
[21:21] <neeraj> yes i sent that on the same day when I packaged write
[21:21] <neeraj> lemme send u again
[21:32] <dfarning> neeraj, awesome both write and record worked on lucid.
[21:33] <dfarning> neeraj, did lfaraone help you with http://paste.ubuntu.com/463146/
[21:34] <neeraj> I think he is not around.. Now i m creating a repository for sugar-write-activity
[21:35] <dfarning> neeraj, nice work.
[21:35] <neeraj> he can review it and tell me the changes which are required
[21:47] <neeraj> dfarning, approximately after how much time sugar-write-activity repository will be available on git?
[21:47] <dfarning> Should be just a few minutes.
[21:48] <dfarning> neeraj, ^^
[21:48] <neeraj> dfarning, ok