| lifeless | moin | 05:42 |
|---|---|---|
| mwhudson | lifeless: in transit? | 05:46 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: den haag, GNU Hackers Meeting | 05:47 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: o right | 05:47 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: have you considered xapian for searching btw? | 05:48 |
| lifeless | yes | 05:49 |
| lifeless | gmane use it | 05:49 |
| lifeless | but it has almost zero buzz on internet scale sites | 05:49 |
| mwhudson | ok | 05:49 |
| lifeless | next-rollout instructions are on the main deployments page, right ? | 05:56 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~lifeless/launchpad/librarian/+merge/30880 | 06:17 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: what happens when lazr encounters a new, unknown key? | 06:26 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: i'd have to experiment to be sure | 06:26 |
| lifeless | k | 06:27 |
| * lifeless experiments | 06:27 | |
| lifeless | ah yes, it suicides | 06:27 |
| * lifeless doesn't understand this choking-consistency approach | 06:27 | |
| lifeless | mwhudson: think I could convince you to click on 'approve' twice ? | 06:28 |
| === almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan | ||
| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| === almaisan-away is now known as al-maisan | ||
| james_w | lifeless: hi, could I get your vote on https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~james-w/launchpad/devel/+merge/30887 I'm having trouble submitting it the manual way. | 10:55 |
| nigelb | \o/ installing vm for playing around with LP! | 10:56 |
| lifeless | nigelb: cool | 10:56 |
| nigelb | I wonder if there are some low hanging bugs I could take a look at to figure out how to start. | 10:56 |
| lifeless | james_w: we should make that easier! | 10:56 |
| james_w | lifeless: we should | 10:57 |
| lifeless | nigelb: well, like with most projects thare a lots of bits around | 10:57 |
| lifeless | nigelb: I suggest, pick up something you're interested in, and follow your nose / ask for help dig in etc | 10:57 |
| nigelb | lifeless: hm I'll wait for things to be set up so I can play around | 10:58 |
| bryceh | nigelb, fwiw, I found the easiest things to work on were changing text in templates | 10:59 |
| bryceh | find an error in the UI, grep source code to find where it appears, fix, fix tests, go | 10:59 |
| nigelb | ahhh, like the bug I reported and you fixed. | 10:59 |
| nigelb | I should hunt around around for something like that then | 10:59 |
| bryceh | nigelb, yeppers | 10:59 |
| lifeless | poolie: whats the MP url? | 11:06 |
| poolie | https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mbp/launchpad/flags/+merge/30581 | 11:06 |
| lifeless | kicked off | 11:07 |
| poolie | thanks | 11:08 |
| poolie | what did you type? | 11:08 |
| poolie | ec2 test -b for me gives a weird misparsed url | 11:08 |
| lifeless | robertc@lifeless-64:~/source/canonical/launchpad-repo/devel$ PYTHONPATH=lib python utilities/ec2 land https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mbp/launchpad/flags/+merge/30581 | 11:08 |
| poolie | specifically two urls string joined together | 11:08 |
| poolie | when i tested it i got some failures in codehosting, and i'm pretty sure i didn't break them | 11:09 |
| poolie | how does that work with ec2test? | 11:09 |
| lifeless | I think ec2test merges trunk | 11:09 |
| poolie | you have to keep merging trunk until other people's branches are fixed? | 11:09 |
| poolie | oh right, it does | 11:09 |
| poolie | in this case i want it to merge db-devel, but i guess it can get that from the mp | 11:09 |
| lifeless | https://lpbuildbot.canonical.com/one_box_per_builder will show you if we're recently broken on trunk etc | 11:10 |
| lifeless | poolie: http://ec2-204-236-213-119.compute-1.amazonaws.com/current_test.log should let you track it in tribunal | 11:13 |
| poolie | thanks, i'll have a poke at ec2 test | 11:13 |
| poolie | for the snags i hit | 11:14 |
| poolie | i just didn't want to leave thi stalled any longer | 11:14 |
| lifeless | cool | 11:14 |
| lifeless | I'm glad :) | 11:14 |
| === al-maisan is now known as almaisan-away | ||
| poolie | lifeless, you should paste that email onto the blog | 11:17 |
| lifeless | which one ? | 11:18 |
| lifeless | poolie: ^ | 11:20 |
| poolie | blog.l.n. | 11:20 |
| lifeless | poolie: which email! | 11:22 |
| poolie | architecture overview | 11:22 |
| lifeless | ah | 11:22 |
| poolie | s//architecture reviewe process/ | 11:22 |
| lifeless | hmmm, do you think users will be that interested ? | 11:22 |
| poolie | architecture overview review process methodology definition process | 11:22 |
| poolie | :-P | 11:22 |
| lifeless | perhaps I'll put it on my blog | 11:23 |
| lifeless | that should get the developer orientated types pretty effectively | 11:23 |
| poolie | up to you | 11:24 |
| poolie | i think it will be interesting to users on the edge of being developers | 11:24 |
| poolie | at the moment the lp blog is a bit blah and i'd like to see it built up into something more attractive | 11:24 |
| lifeless | its kindof there to be there | 11:25 |
| lifeless | if you know what I mena | 11:25 |
| lifeless | mean | 11:25 |
| lifeless | I think the shorter iteration cycle will help a lot | 11:25 |
| lifeless | rather than splat per month | 11:25 |
| lifeless | splat per day | 11:25 |
| poolie | istm you are wearing the TA hat for that post | 11:27 |
| poolie | rather than the rbtc hat | 11:27 |
| lifeless | sure | 11:28 |
| lifeless | I'll think on it. | 11:28 |
| lifeless | I don't believe in role-blogs as a concept | 11:28 |
| lifeless | people and roles are not partitionable like that | 11:28 |
| lifeless | I like the blog for communicating with the LP community as a thing | 11:29 |
| lifeless | for widespread stuff, its great; its like | 11:29 |
| lifeless | lp-dev list subset of lp-users list subset of actual lp-users subset of folk interested in lp | 11:29 |
| lifeless | and the blog is pretty far reaching | 11:29 |
| lifeless | (I know they aren't strict subsets, its an analogy) | 11:30 |
| poolie | ah thanks for the buildbot link | 11:32 |
| poolie | interesting to see the build of their bzr integration there | 11:32 |
| lifeless | :) | 11:32 |
| poolie | lifeless, did that vm fail? the url doesn't work | 11:41 |
| lifeless | ec2test probably only opened my ip | 11:41 |
| lifeless | its up to lp.archiveuploader.tests.test_uploadprocessor.TestUploadProcessor.testOrderFilenames | 11:41 |
| poolie | jml! :) | 11:42 |
| lifeless | jml: your diff is empty | 11:43 |
| jml | lifeless, *your* diff is empty | 11:43 |
| lifeless | jml: did thoust push ? | 11:43 |
| jml | lifeless, I did! | 11:43 |
| jml | should be good now. | 11:44 |
| lifeless | jml: up for reviewing my librarian branch ? | 11:44 |
| jml | lifeless, no, sorry. | 11:44 |
| lifeless | jml: adds oops logging to it | 11:44 |
| lifeless | ah well :( | 11:44 |
| jml | lifeless, maybe once I've emptied my physical in-tray | 11:44 |
| lifeless | jml: that would be nice; I would like to kick it off within 22 hours or so | 11:45 |
| jml | lifeless, ok. I'll make a note. | 11:45 |
| === NCommander is now known as NC|Alaska | ||
| lifeless | poolie: fyi https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/malone/+bug/607960 | 13:32 |
| _mup_ | Bug #607960: timeouts on Distribution:+bugs doing searches <fti> <search> <timeout> <Launchpad Bugs:Triaged> <https://launchpad.net/bugs/607960> | 13:32 |
| jelmer | 'morning mwhudson | 21:39 |
| jelmer | mwhudson: do you have any experience with threads in C Python? | 21:40 |
| mwhudson | jelmer: only a little | 21:42 |
| thumper | morning | 22:10 |
| thumper | I'm heading off for a dentist appt shortly | 22:11 |
| jelmer | mwhudson: I'm trying to use pythread.h for a C worker thread without having to rely on pthreads, but I can find much documentation about the API. | 22:17 |
| mwhudson | jelmer: i guess the headers and the source are probably the most reliable documentation anyway :/ | 22:21 |
| lifeless | wb | 23:15 |
| lifeless | what week is it ? | 23:15 |
| wgrant | I suspect week 2. | 23:19 |
| jelmer | I think week 3 | 23:19 |
| wgrant | Or at least I hope so. | 23:19 |
| jelmer | rollout was on the 6th of july | 23:19 |
| wgrant | The Epic was week 0. | 23:19 |
| jelmer | ah, ok - week 2 then indeed | 23:19 |
| * wgrant consults the calendar. | 23:19 | |
| wgrant | https://dev.launchpad.net/Releases/2010Calendar says week 2. | 23:20 |
| === jelmer changed the topic of #launchpad-dev to: Launchpad Development Channel | Week 2 of 10.08 | PQM is open | https://dev.launchpad.net/ | Get the code: https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting | On-call review in irc://irc.freenode.net/#launchpad-reviews | Use http://paste.ubuntu.com/ for pastes | ||
| === lifeless changed the topic of #launchpad-dev to: Launchpad Development Channel | Week 2 of 10.08 | firefighting: buildbot slaves are down | PQM is open | https://dev.launchpad.net/ | Get the code: https://dev.launchpad.net/Getting | On-call review in irc://irc.freenode.net/#launchpad-reviews | Use http://paste.ubuntu.com/ for pastes | ||
| mwhudson | lifeless: re https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~lifeless/launchpad/malone/+merge/30904, it seems mostly reasonably | 23:21 |
| mwhudson | *reasonable | 23:22 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: have you talked to the bugs developers about this? | 23:22 |
| lifeless | no | 23:22 |
| lifeless | why? | 23:22 |
| lifeless | I mean - the tests and code are pretty clear. | 23:22 |
| mwhudson | just wondering really | 23:22 |
| lifeless | I think we're a bit too siloed at the moment, really. | 23:22 |
| lifeless | but maybe thats just me. | 23:22 |
| mwhudson | yeah probably | 23:22 |
| * mwhudson attempts to articulate more clearly | 23:23 | |
| lifeless | mwhudson: while you're around | 23:23 |
| lifeless | perhaps you could review by librarian oops branch | 23:23 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: have you thought about ways to detect if this change will reduce the usefulness of the dup search? | 23:23 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: yes, and - I'm sure it will, to a point. | 23:23 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: the bugs devs that aren't on leave have all expressed their desire for and rather than or, FWIW | 23:24 |
| lifeless | for terms and tags and so on | 23:24 |
| mwhudson | ok cool | 23:24 |
| lifeless | I think though, that as far as dup detection goes, we'll find that we end up with a cluster of dups that indirect to a sane master | 23:24 |
| lifeless | so we'll get a bit more chaff up front to seed it, and then it will be better than it is today. | 23:25 |
| lifeless | fingers crossed. | 23:25 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: i guess what would have made me really happy to review this would be some evidence of pre-implementation discussion in the mp | 23:25 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: I intend to bring up pre-impl as a misfeature of process | 23:25 |
| lifeless | it was instituted to fix a bug we've now fixed other ways. | 23:25 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: maybe | 23:26 |
| lifeless | I think its great, and important, to socialise changes, but pre-impl doesn't do that. | 23:26 |
| mwhudson | i don't mean pre-imp in a formal sense i guess | 23:26 |
| lifeless | this particular change has been discussed in detail with poolie as a teddy bear | 23:26 |
| mwhudson | i just mean 'someone other than me things this is a good idea' | 23:26 |
| mwhudson | *thinks | 23:27 |
| lifeless | various bugs folk on hte list | 23:27 |
| lifeless | a prelude-to-it with francis | 23:27 |
| lifeless | :P | 23:27 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: ok, that's great | 23:27 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: less back and forth if you'd said this in the mp though | 23:27 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: whats at the heart of wanting to know that someone other than you and I think its a good idea? | 23:27 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: I'm open to changing, but the bzr team doesn't have this friction, so the first thing I want to do is understand what it solves. | 23:28 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: the thing here is that there's an element of a design decision here | 23:28 |
| mwhudson | 'is this going to affect dup search quality' | 23:28 |
| mwhudson | if it was just making tests more precise or whatever i wouldn't be quibbling | 23:29 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: go on | 23:29 |
| mwhudson | or if it was in an area i'm more comfortable with | 23:29 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: so it makes me more comfortable to hear there's been discussion about it | 23:31 |
| mwhudson | that's all | 23:31 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: ok; I worry there is something fishy at the bottom of this : a sort of fear of fixing things outside-ones-area, or something. | 23:32 |
| wgrant | Is that fishy at all? | 23:33 |
| wgrant | It's not *good*, but it's the way the team is set up. | 23:34 |
| lifeless | wgrant: yes, we all need to own the stack we work with - top to bottom | 23:34 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: where is your librarian oops branch? | 23:34 |
| lifeless | https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~lifeless/launchpad/librarian/+merge/30880 | 23:35 |
| lifeless | wgrant: its only slightly setup that way | 23:35 |
| lifeless | wgrant: it would be sad if unpaid coontributors felt safer and more able to hack on any part of the system than paid contributors. (Not saying mwhudson feels that way: we're exploring a fear *I* have after all) | 23:36 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: approved both branches | 23:38 |
| lifeless | thanks | 23:38 |
| wgrant | lifeless: I'm happy hacking anywhere, but I always check with a member of the relevant team. That team controls the code, I feel, so everything should go through them. | 23:38 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: to go over my feelings a bit, i don't think it's area-related | 23:39 |
| lifeless | wgrant: this has kindof accreted | 23:39 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: it's just that imho some changes require discussion | 23:39 |
| mwhudson | and some don't | 23:39 |
| mwhudson | discussion in the direction sense | 23:39 |
| lifeless | wgrant: there are unmaintained areas which are kindof a side effect of partitioning. I dunno, its a theory. | 23:39 |
| mwhudson | this one did, and i wanted to make sure such discussion had happened | 23:40 |
| wgrant | lifeless: Are they really a side-effect of partitioning? | 23:40 |
| wgrant | I thought they were quite deliberately completely abandoned and left to rot. | 23:40 |
| wgrant | And by extension make Launchpad look bad. | 23:40 |
| lifeless | wgrant: har har har | 23:40 |
| wgrant | Well, maybe that last bit wasn't deliberate. | 23:40 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: mmm. This is perhaps a beer talk. | 23:40 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: In particular though, I don't want us to confuse 'high risk, needs mitigation' with 'changing an old decision' | 23:41 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: for the search, there is a single if block to totally reinstate the old (fails with timmeout 99% of time) behaviour | 23:42 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: so the change has the ability to be rolled back trivially | 23:42 |
| wgrant | lifeless: Fails with timeout 99% of the time *in some contexts*. | 23:42 |
| wgrant | It's not completely broken. | 23:42 |
| lifeless | wgrant: thats true, its only 50% on launchpad itself. | 23:42 |
| lifeless | and 40% or so on bzr | 23:42 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: i probably made this into a bigger deal than necessary by explaining myself poorly | 23:42 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: it's monday morning :-) | 23:42 |
| wgrant | Hm. I rarely see it time out on LP projects. | 23:42 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: :) sunday am now | 23:43 |
| lifeless | wgrant: turn off edge redirect. | 23:43 |
| wgrant | lifeless: Ah. | 23:43 |
| lifeless | wgrant: you're already running the first iteration of lifeless-tuning on this. | 23:43 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: sorry, I mean, monday am, sunday late evening. | 23:43 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: its not a big deal, its just a background task. | 23:44 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: cool | 23:44 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: j'adore bzr culture, and I want to bring it into LP | 23:44 |
| lifeless | one of those things is to unblock *even on risky things* by finding ways to reduce the impact / reduce the time to recover | 23:44 |
| mwhudson | lifeless: well ok, but i think the launchpad culture of talking about things before doing them is actually not a bad thing | 23:44 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: pros and cons | 23:44 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: I adore getting solid constraints and requirements and set based design | 23:45 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: for things of that scope | 23:45 |
| lifeless | mwhudson: for iterating, I think a simpler model works well. Anyhow, as I say - background task. | 23:45 |
| * lifeless twiddles waiting for spm :P | 23:46 | |
| wgrant | lifeless: When are you flying? | 23:54 |
| lifeless | 1800 | 23:54 |
| wgrant | Ah. | 23:56 |
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