[03:32] popey: sorry for the contentless ping earlier, when you said you'll do the notes for the new members, did that include the meetings for June/July that have already elapsed? [03:41] speaking of inbox control, mine started being more controllable when I stopped sub'ing debian-devel [03:45] nigelb: that's why you put it in a folder and skim it every week! :) [03:46] that's what I do :) [03:46] I also automatically mark bugs as read [03:46] pleia2: well, my laptop crashed. so all my mail rules are lost! *gasp* [03:46] nigelb: yeah :( sadness [03:46] I'm stuck with gmail web [03:47] every hour I'd get close to 10 mails [03:47] I've topped that :) [03:47] I use gmail web anyway because I use multiple computers throughout the day, imap ftw [03:47] +1 [03:47] yesterday I unsubscribed from about 50 mailing lists [03:47] it already feels like a big weight lifted from me [03:48] wow [03:48] paultag: http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Classic-WTF-The-Pie-T-Department.aspx [03:48] elky got me adddicted to that one today ;) [03:49] better than bash.org anyway [03:49] nigelb: haha [03:49] I'm busy fighting with my netbook [03:49] all day [03:49] all freeking day [03:49] * pleia2 gives paultag's netbook a pet [03:49] * paultag 's netbook purrs [03:50] pleia2: I guess the bribe we paid to the guys were worth it. paultag is busy throughout the day "fixing" it :p [03:50] sshh! [03:51] nigelb: you did a darn fine job [03:51] haha [03:51] nigelb: 2.6.3* kernels break [03:51] maybe try a 2.4 kernel [03:52] pleia2: 2.6.2* is OK [03:52] not as funny though [03:52] pleia2: so I'm running an older kernel, but I had to debootstrap it [03:52] lenny has 2.6.26, you can use that :) [03:52] pleia2: long story, it's been one thing after another [03:52] no fun [03:52] pleia2: running squeeze :) [03:52] pleia2: I can't get my b43 working [03:52] I messed something up [03:52] and unlike Ubuntu there is no module backports [03:53] ah [03:53] yeah :( [03:53] b43 is such a pain when it doesn't Just Work [03:53] pleia2: the module is loaded, but the device is still network UNCLAIMED with no logical name [03:54] yuck [03:54] yeah :/ [03:54] doing an STA install now [03:57] Whoh... [03:57] it worked? [03:57] I'm so using Module-Assistant from now on... [03:57] lol [03:58] haha [03:58] Hello, World! [03:58] Woo! It works! [03:58] Well, it's official. I'm back to where I was four days ago. [03:59] paultag is playing http://xkcd.com/349/ [03:59] hahahahaha [03:59] Well, good news is I never went to BSD [03:59] hehe [04:00] Woo! [04:00] running Debian Squeeze, XFCE off a bootstrap. Huzzah [04:01] pleia2: lol, thats funny [04:07] ok, work time. Time to get ready! [04:07] later folks! [04:07] l8r [04:32] doctormo: wow, this packaging guide series of svgs is very impressive so far (you sent me the link 11 days ago, but my brain was full then) [04:34] I only briefly glanced at them. Some of them are a bit outdated, for instance, I would go with the machine-readable format for debian/copyright (not sure if Debian every officially adopted it, but it is easier) [04:36] yeah, it's actually been a while since I've created a package from scratch so I can't speak to the up-to-dateness of it (I might do some of the same steps if I were to make a package today) [04:36] and I've never actually used pbuilder [04:37] whaaaa? [04:37] pbuilder is my <3 [04:37] What do you use to testbuild pleia2 ? sbuild? [04:37] dholbach taught me how to use pbuilder [04:38] in his youtube videos :) [04:39] nhandler: I just build :\ [04:39] pleia2: naughty, naughty ;) [04:39] I am from the past! [04:39] actually, I have been meaning to brush up my skills, a lot has changed [04:40] you guys wana see my new netbook? [04:40] paultag: is it pink? [04:40] paultag: I think I saw a picture of it already [04:40] http://i.imgur.com/R8w6j.png <-- This is my new netbook :D [04:40] nhandler: I just finished this [04:40] nhandler: oh, no, not the case :) [04:41] It's running Debian Squeeze + xfce [04:41] yay mouse! [04:41] paultag: I'm a bit surprised at therelatively basic conky setup you have [04:41] I call it Forkbomb Linux [04:41] nhandler: I'll work on it as I go :) [04:41] It's really nice, actually [04:41] I'm quite happy with it [04:42] I'm glad you are happy. I've had a long couple of days where none of my programs are working the way they should coupled with some boring summer work [04:43] yeah. It was a long day, and it was a bad fight [04:43] I had to install debian off an ubuntu 9.10 cd on a SD card [04:43] erm... that's not normal. [04:45] I'm really stoked [04:45] it came out fantastic. [04:45] :) [04:45] and thank you pleia2 for finally giving a talk that made me consider xfce seriously :) [04:46] woohoo! [04:46] this is the part where I mention that the xubuntu folks are always looking for volunteers [04:46] it's a *tiny* dev team [04:47] I thought the xubuntu install was very comfortable [04:47] I'd be willing to help them when I clear out some of my existing work [04:47] I can't over commit :) [04:47] * pleia2 nods [04:49] I'm off for the night [04:49] 'night all [04:57] Night paultag === jussi is now known as Guest88035 [07:07] good morning! [07:10] Good morning all [07:17] good morning! [08:06] good morning [08:08] morning dholbach :) [08:11] hey nigelb [08:32] morning ! === Tm_K is now known as Tm_T [09:38] can somebody proofread https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Organisation - does it look OK? [09:38] akgraner: does this look OK? [10:00] dholbach: maybe ask in ubuntu-devel too? [10:00] wait, you have motu-mentors thrice [10:03] haha [10:03] nice motu-mentors coverage [10:04] fixed [10:04] dholbach: hehe , say it several times people are bound to listen , ! nice :) [10:04] gorilla marketing [10:15] dholbach: you can probably add kubuntu devel and edubuntu devel there too [10:34] jono: UGJ announce today? [10:46] morning [10:50] LO! [10:50] jono: you have mail from me that is kinda urgent to look into, Turkey have lost their domain name and they do all of their work via their forums which is now a parking site for some domain name [10:51] czajkowski, will get to it ASAP - on my last meeting [10:52] czajkowski, I am amazed IS did not resolve this [10:52] I pinged them [10:52] jono: I had the guy rant/give up/rather upset at me at 12pm last night understandably [10:52] completely understandable [10:53] czajkowski, #canonical-sysadmin [10:53] hey popey, hey czajkowski [10:55] dholbach: hello there [11:25] INBOX 66, this morning it was INBOX 100 [11:27] making progress [11:34] jcastro: I'll postpone all daily builds tuition sessions for now [11:50] Morning czajkowski and dholbach [11:51] hi doctormo [11:51] dholbach: You guys still traveling? [11:51] doctormo: I'm not [11:51] dpm, jcastro and jono are [11:52] ah [11:52] morning dholbach, doctormo [11:52] hey paultag [11:52] * dholbach → lunch [11:52] doctormo: you're up; quite early [11:52] dholbach: :) [11:53] doctormo: rhonda was looking fer ya [11:54] 𝅘𝅥𝅯 we're on the road the nowhere 𝅘𝅥𝅯 [11:54] nigelb: Oh? what about? [11:54] paultag: Got sleep and everything. [11:55] doctormo: german translation for your latest creation [11:55] check scrollback in #ubuntu-motu [12:02] nigelb: Ah it exists? [12:04] nigelb: I checked the backlog, nothing I could see.. [12:22] doctormo: killer [12:30] jono, i see that you wrote an article in LXF about Launchpad, that is outstanding! hopefully this helps a lot of people develop a better understanding of it :) [12:38] thanks ScottL :) [12:38] biab, heading out for lunch [12:39] doctormo: done your daily doodle ? [12:39] doctormo: did you see my netbook? [12:40] doctormo: http://i.imgur.com/R8w6j.png :D [12:47] morning all [12:48] lo :) [13:34] paultag: helllo [13:34] doctormo: hola [13:35] ScottL: I still haven't got my copy of LXF, I think I need to double check with akgraner about it. [13:35] 1GB of ram in a netbook... oh my, what are people using all this ram for. [13:39] doctormo: this thing is rocking out loud [13:39] doctormo: flash! [13:39] doctormo: I have it totally themed [13:40] +1 highvoltage !!! [13:43] doctormo: I have the netbook booting to gdm in under 15 seconds without even touching the startup stuff [13:43] highvoltage: Hey, flash? [13:46] doctormo: you don't use flash? [13:46] paultag: Not really, I'm subjected to it from time to time, but it's not something I active choose to use. [13:47] doctormo: yeah flash. we're talking about "people", aren't we ;) [13:49] highvoltage: Flash the super hero? [13:50] nope, definitely not [13:51] yeah the other flash [14:59] Ubuntu Global Jam announced :) [15:00] :D [15:01] dholbach: did you get any solutions for xwax? [15:02] whoh dholbach [15:02] dholbach: it's really early this year [15:02] paultag: no, around beta time again :) [15:02] scott-work: no, I didn't have much time to dive into it, I need to put more effort into testing it with a couple of different kernels properly [15:03] dholbach: shoot, I'll be in Mass. I'll need to get my team to get this together this year :'( [15:03] scott-work: I at least installed a couple of old ones already and I had the feeling that the lucid-release worked, but that was only 20 minutes of testing [15:05] dholbach: re: lucid-release - hmmm, at least that is promising, can you let either me or abogoni know the results please? [15:06] scott-work: will do [15:06] thanks for your interest in this [15:08] dholbach: your welcome [15:08] dholbach: by the way, you may not be aware (i've kept it slightly on the down low) but i am the current ubuntu studio project lead [15:08] oh nice - was there an announce of the news? :) [15:09] dholbach: i did on ubuntustudio-users and ubuntustudio-devel mailing list, but that was really it [15:10] ok [15:10] so no blog post and mail to ubuntu-devel@ or something? :) [15:10] dholbach: i did it so that they could see that someone was there and actively participating on improveming studio, sort of to build morale and confidence with the users [15:11] * dholbach nods [15:11] dholbach: no, i was unaware about ubuntu-devel@ mail, persia finally told me to announce myself on #ubuntu-release, which i did, but i only scottk and one other person took notice [15:13] although ak.graner is suppose to interview me for the fridge and i got my blog on planet ubuntu [15:13] nice :) [15:20] nhandler: THANKS [15:20] :-D [15:21] dholbach: I was just posting the UDW message on the fridge. For the ical, any reason for keeping it separate? It needs to go on the learning events calendar anyway [15:21] And you are welcome :) [15:21] nhandler: UDW message? [15:21] err, now I'm getting my events mixed up (I posted Global Jam on the fridge ;) ) [15:21] what about which ical? [15:21] I'm confused now :) [15:22] dholbach: Sorry. On the UDW wiki page, you mention an ical that they can subscribe to with all of the events. Why use a separate ical instead of just using the learning events ical? [15:22] nhandler: I have no idea who set it up [15:22] I'm happy with whatever really [15:23] dholbach: Alright. I'll update the wiki link and that should hopefully take care of it [15:23] gracias [15:32] dholbach: http://doctormo.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d2uc0cr Global Jam [15:34] :-) [15:40] hehe , "Age 14" :D [15:51] czajkowski, all ok with the domain issue? [15:53] jono, she's away for some time (1h) and I don't think there is ay new element [15:54] (the last time she exposed it at least) [15:54] thanks huats [15:54] jono: yeah, it's still parked [15:56] thanks paultag - I spoke with IS and got some assigned to providing czajkowski with updates [15:56] jono: thanks, you rock :) [15:57] thanks paultag [15:57] ...and I don't rock :) [15:58] I just help coordinate who do rock [15:58] your shameless humility is quite noteworthy jono :) [16:03] paultag, lol [16:07] aloha [16:07] jono: ticket is gone to private can#t read it but ng said he'd let me know an update [16:07] czajkowski, cool [16:07] czajkowski, hassle Ng about it if there is no progress [16:08] dholbach, your wiki looks great! [16:08] jono: thanks for the help [16:08] czajkowski, np [16:09] akgraner: thanks [16:09] just wanted to see if you were OK with it [16:10] dholbach, yep - I need to transfer the marketing stuff from the googledoc to the wiki - and then I'll add a link to your wiki as well [16:10] sorry - I've just been slammed here the last couple weeks - but I'll get it all caught up ASAP [16:10] :-( [16:10] awesome [16:11] don't worry, take it easy! [16:16] doctormo: stop top posting! [16:20] czajkowski: But it wasn't a response in context! [16:21] doctormo: well, yes it was, you were replying to my mail, giving out about monthly reports [16:21] czajkowski: Top posting is quite ok for this kind of thing. [16:22] no need to include the bottom in that instance [16:22] for when you want to disagree with an entire mail is it? [16:25] czajkowski: Where there is a sufficient insufferably to the entire affair. [16:26] doctormo: wow, don't hold back there [16:27] doctormo: reports should be a 3 min job, doesn't have to be one person doing it [16:27] if it's one person doing everything , it's not really a community is it [16:27] That's right. [16:27] doctormo: it takes like 10 minutes. If you can't do 10 minutes a week to ensure we know what's going on, it's not a good sign either. [16:28] czajkowski: Yes I kept on saying that. [16:29] no you just complained about the council asking for report, it's not just us looking for them, everyone wants to see reports [16:29] paultag: The process is still WORN, tact on. It doesn't flow, it's not elegant. It's all rather an after thought to the work flow of even organisation. [16:29] http://www.jonobacon.org/2010/07/27/ubuntu-global-jam-start-your-engines/ [16:29] doctormo: I disagree totally [16:30] doctormo: I have started to read team reports [16:30] me as well, and if it turns into automated mail, I won't [16:30] and if we don't use it, why do it? [16:31] paultag: I would actually like to read what other teams are up to, but I dare not waste hours digging through a disorganised set of wiki pages. [16:31] It's not like the idea is a bad one, it's not, it's great. Execution though. [16:31] the process is all upstream of the locos anyway in the consolidated page [16:31] huh? [16:31] doctormo: have you seen the consolidated report page? [16:31] there are strict guidelines doctormo [16:31] +1 AlanBell [16:31] dholbach, looking forward to seeing UGJ events added to the loco dir :-) [16:32] jono: the global event for it has been created so just up to teams to link to it [16:32] I am going to add one now [16:32] czajkowski, indeed [16:32] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TeamReports/June2010 is the June report, it is all done with <> moin macros [16:32] AlanBell: +1 [16:32] doctormo: guidelines here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BuildingCommunity/TeamReporting [16:32] aye and we all can follow the nice set up, or get someone to set it up [16:33] OK so not wading through, it's still a wiki though. [16:33] or ASK FOR HELP! [16:33] doctormo: more here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BuildingCommunity/TeamReporting/HowTo [16:33] doctormo: I honestly, think you just have an issue with anything the loco council are trying to do to help locos [16:33] czajkowski: I like the loco directory. [16:34] dholbach, would be cool also if when adding an event for a global jam which has the dates set, if it only showed a date picker within those dates [16:35] jono: aye would be nice, but I think most folks want the timezone issue sorted more so than picking a date, as some teams hold their event the following week depending on loco circumstances [16:35] I can see that if you didn't know about the consolidated report then the team reporting thing would seem a bit pointless [16:35] jono: can you file a bug for that? [16:35] doctormo, the LD is not really drived by the LC [16:35] doctormo: the LD isn't us, we use it and encourage teams to use it also [16:35] huats: Well they didn't start it, but I'm sure the LoCo council fully support it, right? [16:36] dholbach, will do [16:36] ack, dang redirect on the ubuntu wiki to help.ubuntu.com is too fast! [16:36] jono: thanks [16:36] I just added http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/team/223/detail/ :-) [16:36] doctormo, of course [16:36] jono: awesome [16:36] jono: I have to rework my geographic-regrouping fix - I'm on it now and hope we can get another release out afterwards [16:37] since the last page I visited was a redirected page, now when I try to access the wiki I get shot over to the help site instead [16:37] dholbach, perfect, thanks! [16:38] dholbach, if you could land that ASAP it will make it much easier for viewing all the new events :) [16:38] jono: I won't finish it today [16:38] dholbach, np [16:38] dholbach, this week would be sweet if possible :) [16:39] ok [16:42] dholbach, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/loco-directory/+bug/610495 [16:42] Ubuntu bug 610495 in loco-directory "For global events, the new event date picker should be constrained within the date region (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] [16:42] jono: don't forget #locoteams tag whe tweeting [16:43] thanks jono [16:43] czajkowski, I did for the UGJ announce [16:43] wow, the loco directory looks good now! [16:43] jono: you're a keeper [16:43] greg-g, :-) [16:43] czajkowski, ahhh you are the real keeper :) [16:48] dholbach, czajkowski https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/loco-directory/+bug/610498 [16:48] Ubuntu bug 610498 in loco-directory "About page should be about LoCo Teams, not the directory (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] [16:49] added loco council to it [16:52] thanks czajkowski [16:52] no bother shall go poke em [16:52] we're having an extra council meeting next week [16:54] alright my friends [16:54] I call it a day [16:54] see you all tomorrow [16:54] * dholbach hugs you all [16:54] night dholbach [16:54] :-) [16:55] dholbach: nn [16:55] * jono hugs dholbach [16:57] bye guys === Guest88035 is now known as jussi === jussi is now known as Guest14592 === Guest14592 is now known as jussi01 === jussi01 is now known as jussi [17:47] czajkowski: Having had a thought about what I was trying to say and how it came across. I wanted to apologise, what I meant was for a constructive dialog on improving the situation and I'm aware that what I wrote was not a primer for that. Instead I feel I may have put communicated doubt in the good work of the loco council and it's members and that was not my intention. [17:48] Sorry [18:09] doctormo: hmm? doesn't sound like something that happened in this channel? [18:10] highvoltage: loco-contacts list [18:10] pleia2: Should I post that to the list do you think? [18:10] doctormo: I think so, yeah [18:10] ah, I guess it would be more appropriate to apologise directly to czajkowski or on the list then :) [18:11] highvoltage: The after effects appeared here, so I thought this was most appropriate. I'll get it sent to the list now. [18:11] doctormo: ah. yes I just read your mail and couldn't find anything worth apologizing for. ok [18:13] doctormo: don't beat yourself up about it! [18:15] highvoltage, AlanBell: The problem is that I communicate negative aspects by omission a lot. Own worst enemy and all that. [18:15] doctormo: I can relate :) [18:18] doctormo: thank you [19:37] paultag: I just figured out a bug in English. [19:37] paultag: Should I use "Your added" or "You're added"... both seem acceptable if slightly different. [19:38] doctormo: but there needs to be more [19:38] doctormo: right? [19:38] doctormo: you're added to blah, or your added modifications ... [19:39] it depends on the object, I think [19:39] direct object * [19:40] right? [19:40] doctormo: or is your bug unrelated to this use case? [19:40] Yea I guess anyone could have bugs with incomplete sentences. [19:40] haha [20:10] pleia2: With your CC hat on, someone on your blog suggested a "How to Answer Questions" guide for people who want to help (here irc, forums etc). [20:10] What are your thoughts? [20:11] doctormo: I read that question as "how helpers could be nicer" - presumably from someone who felt the helpers were curt with them [20:12] pleia2: Yes, do you think it's not a serious request? Maybe something to ask at the next CC meeting? [20:12] doctormo: if it's IRC-based, I think it's more appropriate for an IRCC meeting [20:12] I am not sure if it's a serious request [20:13] OK, fuzzy thoughts, I'll keep the idea in mind if ever it comes up again. [20:13] I think it depends sometimes in the channel questions that are asked. if there has been 3-4 other questions prior to it, people ae often tired, and want people to get to the point if they've not asked a question correctly or asked to ask a question [20:14] also sometimes you're dealing with a lanauge barrier I find and things can be taken up wrong, as one cannot tell tone over irc [20:14] honestly the IRC support staff does a great job, it's improved a lot over the years [20:15] aye it has [20:15] but I find in ubuntu-namespace at times when channels are quieter it's a bit harder [20:15] namely as there aren't enough people around at a time [20:15] which is just a timezone issue really [20:16] Some of our helpers can be a bit short at times, and others suggest google as their only answer, but we do our best to curb that behavior when we can. [20:16] Perhaps then a guide for helpers wouldn't be so much a repetition of the CoC, but something more based around best practices, useful places to go or keep in your browser bookmarks? Useful practical things? [20:17] Pici: Are you on the IRCC? [20:17] doctormo: I am indeed. [20:18] then perhaps you would be the person to speak to about getting a link to http://doctormo.org/2010/07/26/how-to-ask-for-translations/ perhaps for the #ubuntu topic? [20:18] A short url [20:20] doctormo: I'll propose it to the rest of the IRCC [20:20] Thanks Pici [20:53] Well, I re-learned why I don't like #perl, I can never get answers in there [20:53] what else is new ;) [20:55] nhandler: I used to hang out there way back when [20:55] doctormo: Speaking of that, did you see my last PM about switching to the OO approach (which doesn't work)? [20:56] I did yes, For some reasonI think perl's gettext is broken. [20:56] lol [20:56] I would have thought someone would have noticed (there have to be other apps that use it). And it does look like some people have had it work for them (although that doesn't mean it didn't break recently) [21:20] nhandler: More likely it works if the mo files are in the system directory. [21:20] You could always go through the gettext module and debug it. [21:20] that's what I did with the python one to figure out why I couldn't get it working. [21:42] cjohnston: Woot, I got Hebrew and Polish translations and taught 2 more people how to use ground control. [21:43] awesome! [21:47] cjohnston: You gotta admit, it looks pretty when they're all next to each other http://doctormo.org/2010/07/26/how-to-ask-for-translations/ [21:48] * nhandler is looking forward to having ClassBots available in all languages ;) [21:48] this would be cool :) [21:48] lol doctormo [21:49] nhandler: make it policy to add a meta field for nickserv called lang, and have classbot hit that for the instructor's language [21:49] cjohnston: For some reason spanish, arabic and chinese are hard to get translations for. [21:49] paultag: I need to get translations working properly first normally. Then I can play around with other stuff like that [21:49] nhandler: for sure. [21:50] doctormo: I would think Spanish would be easy [21:50] I have a buddy who speaks arabic.. but he wouldnt be into doing translations [21:50] *shrug* no offers yet. [21:50] doctormo: seek people out :) [21:50] doctormo: ask in #ubuntu-beginners-team, there are quite a few people from S.A. [21:50] doctormo: as for arabic, try the egypt team, they are kinda active ( active enough ) [21:51]