[05:42] <humphreybc> heh, docbook made the "hate" wall at GUADEC. http://www.flickr.com/photos/qense/4849380478/in/photostream/
[08:02] <thorwil> morning!
[08:02] <humphreybc> hey Thorsten
[08:02] <humphreybc> up early
[08:03] <thorwil> heh, well it's 9 here
[08:18] <nisshh> humphreybc: hey, got a minute?
[08:33] <humphreybc> nisshh: yea
[08:35] <nisshh> humphreybc: oh, wait nevermind, you already added a testimonial to my wiki page, oops :)
[08:36] <humphreybc> heh
[08:36] <humphreybc> i have to do a few of those
[08:36]  * nisshh is not entirely awake yet :)
[08:36] <nisshh> yea
[08:36] <humphreybc> isn't it the evening?
[08:37]  * nisshh slept during the day today, all nighter last night
[08:37] <nisshh> its 3:37PM here
[08:39] <humphreybc> right
[08:46] <thorwil> if aquarius joins, does that mean that the moon is in the seventh house and jupiter aligns with mars?
[08:47] <nisshh> thorwil: hehe
[08:47] <nisshh> thorwil: i thought it meant we had to congregate and chant "the end is near!"
[08:48] <thorwil> nah, time for harmony and understanding, sympathy and trust abounding
[08:49] <nisshh> lol
[08:50] <nisshh> thorwil: you sound like a pacifist :)
[08:54] <vish> nisshh: right , he just 'sounds' like one ;p
[08:55] <nisshh> vish: hehe
[08:55] <humphreybc> ha
[09:01]  * thorwil hands vish a flower for his hair, so he can go to san francisco
[09:02] <nisshh> heh
[13:57] <nisshh> aquarius: hey, quick question
[14:04] <aquarius> nisshh, hey
[14:08] <nisshh> aquarius: iv been thinking about using desktopcouch attachments in my pytask app, but i cant test to see if the attachments themselves get synced along with the databases, do they?
[14:08] <aquarius> they do
[14:08] <nisshh> ah cool
[14:08] <nisshh> wasnt sure
[14:09] <nisshh> aquarius: also, i assume that the attachments can be any sort of file?
[14:09] <nisshh> text, image, etc?
[14:10] <aquarius> yes
[14:10] <nisshh> cool
[14:10] <nisshh> aquarius: thanks dude, thats all i needed to know
[14:11] <aquarius> if you're storing lots of stuff in attachments or large files you may want to think about storing those files in Ubuntu One file sync and just storing the paths in Dc
[14:11] <nisshh> ah yea
[14:12] <nisshh> aquarius: well, thats a per user thing, i was thinking of adding a neat little feature that allowed users to add attachments to tasks, but yea i guess large files qould be a problem
[14:22] <nisshh> aquarius: ok, thanks, this has given me alot to think about and some code to write
[14:22] <nisshh> :)
[14:25] <aquarius> no problem :)
[15:51] <vish> aquarius: lol! "one of Pavlov's dogs" :)
[15:53] <aquarius> indeed. :)
[20:36] <jenkins> evening all
[20:39] <nisshh> jenkins: well, 4am in my case :)
[20:46] <jenkins> nisshh: good luck tomorrow I will not be there unfortunatly
[20:47] <thorwil> nisshh: membership board? what time (utc)?
[20:58] <nisshh> jenkins: thanks, im not sure that ill get membership, but im hoping
[20:59] <jenkins> well you can only find out :)
[20:59] <nisshh> thorwil: 10am UTC on tuesday (today or tomorrow, depends on your timezone)
[20:59] <nisshh> in #ubuntu-meeting
[20:59] <nisshh> jenkins: yea
[21:00] <nisshh> thorwil: hope to see you there if you can make it
[21:00] <nisshh> thorwil: if not, no worries, there should be a few others coming :)
[21:00] <thorwil> hmm, we'll see :=
[21:01] <nisshh> hehe
[21:05] <jenkins> daker: whats the status of the quickshot website?
[21:06] <daker> 75%
[21:06] <jenkins> cool thanks, we have www.quickshot.org now
[21:07] <jenkins> an act of kindness from someone
[21:07] <daker> Woow
[21:08] <daker> flan, and you ?
[21:09] <thorwil> good night!
[21:11] <flan> o.o
[21:12] <flan> No updates from me.
[21:12] <daker> flan, what ?
[21:12] <daker> :D oh cool
[21:12] <flan> Still in a random state of no-Internet-at-home.
[21:12] <flan> If this persists once I actually have my network set up again, I'll just write code offline and commit it from work.
[21:13] <flan> It's been over a month since I last did anything. :(
[21:47] <jenkins> nisshh: did you know pytask has been mentioned in a blog post? http://www.johnhamelink.com/2010/07/linux-apps-freelancers/ I think this was also linked to on omgubuntu
[21:48] <nisshh> jenkins: yea, i saw that earlier today
[21:48] <nisshh> pretty cool
[21:48] <nisshh> that link was down most of today, but its back up now
[21:48] <nisshh> finally
[21:49] <jenkins> yea just spoken to the site owner his vps crashed because of it
[21:49] <nisshh> hehe
[21:50] <nisshh> jenkins: why is it that the criticism about Pytask is always about features im about to release in the next version?
[21:50] <nisshh> seriously, why is that? :)
[21:50] <jenkins> well it shows that you are devloping in the right direction
[21:50] <nisshh> yea true
[21:50] <nisshh> :)
[21:51] <nisshh> jenkins: was funny last night
[21:52] <nisshh> jenkins: me and rick were talking about the dev manual on irc
[21:52] <jenkins> go on..
[21:52] <jenkins> o right what did you discuss
[21:52] <nisshh> and we were working on a chapter together
[21:52] <nisshh> simplifying it
[21:52] <jenkins> cool
[21:52] <nisshh> and he said
[21:52] <nisshh> "should we remove this word and this word?"
[21:53] <nisshh> and at the EXACT same second i said "we should remove that word and that word"
[21:53] <jenkins> lol
[21:53] <nisshh> and we were talking about the same words
[21:53] <nisshh> so
[21:53] <nisshh> iv concluded that i have the gift of foresight :)
[21:54] <jenkins> I think you may do :)
[21:54] <nisshh> hehe
[21:55] <nisshh> jenkins: also, im working hard to get as much done by maverick release as possible, have you any idea when you can get some content written?
[21:56] <jenkins> I will try to do some later this week, whats the page with the chapters on? Also how are we liking this in with the sample program
[21:56] <jenkins> *linking
[21:57] <nisshh> jenkins: you can get the chapters that rick wrote at his website: www.rickspencer3.com
[21:58] <nisshh> jenkins: i am still thinking about how we are going to link the sample app and the chapters, need to do it right the first time i think
[21:59] <jenkins> I think that untill we get our heads around how to link it in then there is not much point writting as we will just end up adjusting so much.
[21:59] <nisshh> well, yea
[21:59] <nisshh> BUT
[21:59] <jenkins> I am not sure that the app idea works in comparison to the level of these chapters
[21:59] <nisshh> explain
[22:01] <jenkins> well the app is relatively  simple on the scale of things but the existing chapters by rick are very detailed there needs to be a blance between the two
[22:01] <nisshh> yea
[22:01] <nisshh> iv been working on the python crash course chapter
[22:01] <nisshh> the initial version by rick was complicated as hell
[22:02] <nisshh> had words like nesting and main base class
[22:02] <nisshh> among other more complex words
[22:03] <nisshh> jenkins: so your saying we need to simplify the chapters more so they fit with the app better?
[22:03] <nisshh> provide only the necessary information to create the app?
[22:03] <jenkins> good that does need simplifying, I think with such a simple app we will not be teaching enough detail to people about the main fetures of glade. I think we may be scrap the app or make it more complex or make the manual even simpler
[22:04] <jenkins> or other python stuff
[22:04] <jenkins> I am just not sure we have the target audience right
[22:04] <nisshh> go on...
[22:04] <jenkins> the app is aimed at novices right
[22:05] <nisshh> well, according to rick last night the first chapter (intro to python) is aimed at programmers migrating to python
[22:05] <nisshh> which i was a bit confused about
[22:05] <jenkins> but the chapters so far go into lots of detail expecting people to know stuff already. They either need more explination or it needs two manuals, intorduction and advanced
[22:05] <nisshh> because i thought this was supposed to be ultra simple the the other manual
[22:06] <jenkins> yea thats where I am confused.
[22:06] <nisshh> yea
[22:06] <nisshh> i think the target audience should primarily be new programmers
[22:07] <nisshh> with a secondary being existing programmers who want to learn about glade/python/gtk
[22:07] <nisshh> but probably not two manuals
[22:07] <jenkins> well yes thats what has to be decided, but just to play devils advocate how much detail do you go into in the second part?
[22:08] <nisshh> a fair bit
[22:08] <nisshh> it has examples of things like for loops without first explaining what a for loop is
[22:08] <nisshh> explains lambda
[22:08] <nisshh> basic math
[22:08] <jenkins> prehaps we could do an intorduction to python recomend some free online books for further reading, then go into the different programs avalible
[22:09] <nisshh> jenkins: at the start of the chapter 2 books and the python docs are mentioned
[22:09] <jenkins> cool fair enough
[22:09] <nisshh> all free books
[22:09] <nisshh> yea
[22:10] <nisshh> i think the intro to python chapter should focus on examples and code that are required to create and code up the example app
[22:11] <jenkins> so we are trying to write a book with two aims, encorage new devlopers and get people who are devloping else where to work on ubuntu?
[22:11] <nisshh> but rick did say that i did not intend to just hand the reader the required code and be done with it
[22:11] <nisshh> and i agree with that
[22:11] <nisshh> yes, essentially
[22:12] <nisshh> id say the main aim is to attract new developers though, thats what rick and jono always talk about
[22:13] <nisshh> jenkins: i think we need to have a talk about this with rick
[22:14] <jenkins> I agree that we should not give people the exact code, I am just thinking that there is so much to know when writing an ap I learn something new every time I work on quickshot.
[22:14] <nisshh> yea
[22:14] <nisshh> but we had that same problem with the other manual
[22:14] <jenkins> I am not trying to be difficult just need a better understanding of the aim/direction
[22:15] <jenkins> thats kinda my point
[22:15] <nisshh> your not being difficult, your making my brain think more
[22:15] <nisshh> :)
[22:15] <jenkins> I think we need a definitive list of what topics should go in each chapter, ket me find my example
[22:15] <nisshh> yea...
[22:17] <nisshh> jenkins: i should go to bed soon, ill stay on for another 15 minutes, but then i need to go to sleep :)
[22:17] <jenkins> cool it was somthing ila asked me to do for my chapters in the manual
[22:17] <nisshh> yea
[22:17] <jenkins> ilya*
[22:17] <nisshh> its on the wiki isnt it? i did the same for mine
[22:18] <jenkins> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-manual/Blueprints/DefaultApps
[22:18] <nisshh> ah yes
[22:19] <jenkins> I did not see yours it is on an old wiki page
[22:19] <nisshh> mine is there somewher
[22:19] <jenkins> we do have some stuff on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/10.10/DeveloperManual but it all refers to old chapters
[22:19] <nisshh> yea
[22:20] <jenkins> I will let you go to bed anyway
[22:20] <nisshh> i havent cleaned that up yet
[22:20] <jenkins> I will make sure i do the wuickly chapter and have a look at the existing stuff for galde
[22:20] <nisshh> jenkins: yea, its nearly 6am here, so ill get about an horus sleep then i have to go to tafe anyway :)
[22:21] <jenkins> night o/
[22:21] <nisshh> ok thanks jenkins
[22:21] <nisshh> ill talk to you later today/tomorrow :)
[22:21] <jenkins> thank you
[22:21] <nisshh> hehe
[22:21] <nisshh> gnight :)
[22:22] <jenkins> has anyone seen ben recently
[22:26] <dutchie> not really
[22:31] <jenkins> I have just sent him an e-mail
[22:34] <jenkins> daker: i loved the statistics about the website how did you make them?
[22:36] <daker> jenkins, it's google analytics
[22:38] <daker> jenkins, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Analytics
[22:38] <jenkins> they are very cool I like stats, we will have to sort that out for www.quickshot.org
[22:39] <daker> sure
[22:40] <jenkins> o man I just rembered what I was doing last in quickshot. I have to work out how to do that
[22:40] <daker> \o/
[22:42] <jenkins> no its not good I need to learn about  windows inheriting properties from a python file so that they all have the same menu bar. I have not done quickshot work in ages
[22:43] <jenkins> we have apport support but I need to work out how to package that so that it goes to the right place.
[22:43]  * jenkins starts a list
[23:39] <jenkins> well this is interesting if i do sudo find / -name quickshot-crashdb.conf it returns etc/appot/crashdb.conf.d/quickshot-crashdb.conf if I navigate to the folder in nautilus i don't see the file doing ls in the folder shows the file is not there so is it there?
[23:40] <dutchie> is it readable only by root or something?
[23:41] <daker> jenkins, have you tried : ALT+F2 then gksu nautilus /etc/appot/crashdb.conf.d/   ?
[23:42] <jenkins> daker: its there! I had not thought of that, now I have to work out why the package is doing that
[23:42] <jenkins> thanks
[23:43] <daker> good
[23:44] <dutchie> i suspect it's a security thing to do with not showing $RANDOM_USER the contents of your core dump
[23:45] <jenkins> hmm well I *think* every user has to be able to see the file, I need to work out why another file is not being packaged at all