[00:13]  * daker will have an oral examination for his thesis tomorrow :D
[00:14] <dutchie> good luck
[00:14] <daker> thanks
[00:23] <daker> night all
[00:23] <daker> o/
[07:45] <thorwil> good morning!
[07:57] <godbyk> Hey, thorwil!
[07:58] <zkriesse> hey thorwil and godbyk
[07:58] <godbyk> thorwil: I updated the German PDF. Could you glance through it and check to see that the ß and umlauts appear as they should? http://builds.ubuntu-manual.org/builds/ubuntu-manual-de-screen.pdf
[07:58]  * thorwil gets the file
[07:59] <godbyk> If everything looks okay, I'll update the lulu.com edition and the PDFs on our website.
[07:59] <godbyk> (Hopefully no one's been linking directly to the lulu.com url as I think it'll be invalid when I upload a new PDF.)
[08:00] <thorwil> revision number 909? techno party!
[08:01]  * godbyk queues up the music!
[08:02] <thorwil> godbyk: page 9, "Linuxdistributionen", the "distributionen" part is italic?!
[08:04] <thorwil> godbyk: on the same page there's a "(GUIS)". thanks to the small caps, one can't tell if that's a small s. it should be. easy way out would be to not use plural
[08:04] <godbyk> thorwil: Even weird!  Only the 'distribution' bit is italicized.  The code looks like this: Linux\emph{distribution}en
[08:04] <thorwil> awesome
[08:04] <godbyk> Yeah.
[08:06] <godbyk> Regarding the GUIs bug: It is a lowercase 's' because the German translation doesn't have a plural={...} bit for the GUI glossary entry.
[08:06] <thorwil> page 9, 2 times "ähnlichkeiten" should be "Ähnlichkeiten"
[08:09] <godbyk> Looks like the original was ä instead of Ä.  (I wanted to make sure I didn't accidentally convert \"A to ä when I converted from LaTeX to Unicode.)
[08:09] <thorwil> saw a Ubu-ntu hyphenation. that's ... unfortunate
[08:10] <godbyk> I should add that to the German hyphenation list.
[08:10] <godbyk> What kind of weird hyphenation rules do you Germans use that would allow LaTeX to think that 'ntu' could stand on its own line?
[08:10] <godbyk> Weirdos!
[08:11] <thorwil> lots of cases where we could use italics instead of quotation marks
[08:12] <thorwil> godbyk: afaik we used to have rather complicated hyphenation rules, but now it's do it where ever you want and never change spelling before/after hyphen
[08:12] <godbyk> Okay, this is ominous.. searching the German translations on Launchpad shows that it was originally Ähnlichkeiten and not ähnlichkeiten.
[08:12] <godbyk> I think po4a is munging things big time.
[08:13] <thorwil> while getting rid of the special cases is great, hyphens cutting in syllables is weird to read
[08:13] <godbyk> thorwil: You guys used to have cool rules about adding an extra k or g when splitting after a k or g and other fun things.  (Or something like that.)
[08:13] <thorwil> yeah
[08:14] <godbyk> Wait, you guys are allowed to split words at places other than between syllables?
[08:14] <godbyk> That's crazy.
[08:16] <godbyk> Okay, das ist nicht gut.
[08:16] <thorwil> heh
[08:16] <godbyk> There are other Äs that are now ä.
[08:19] <thorwil> godbyk: well, there are cases where it's not obvious what the syllables are and proper hyphenation could depend on the base of a word. more flexibility there i great. no german with any feeling for the language would hyphenate such that the resulting parts are something you can't speak easily. so no Ubu-ntu!
[08:19] <thorwil> godbyk: i guess same for Ü and Ö, then
[08:20] <thorwil> too bad we have no properly rounded corners on the screenshots
[08:20] <godbyk> thorwil: quite possibly.  I don't see any Ö in the .tex file at the moment. that doesn't bode well.
[08:20] <thorwil> flan: ever looked into applying an alpha mask to the screenshots to take care of the rounded corners?
[08:21] <thorwil> godbyk: is there no german editor supposed to be doing QA?
[08:23] <godbyk> Well, there is a German translation editor.  That's who was emailing the list all the time asking if it was ready to be published yet.
[08:24] <thorwil> the umlaut capitalization issue stands out, as our writers seem to do capitalization very well. after writing more english than german, i got rather insecure there. love the english simplicity
[08:25] <godbyk> yeah, the capitalized nouns are a bit much.
[08:26] <godbyk> reminds me of Victorian-era writing where you just capitalize the Important Words as you see fit.
[08:26] <thorwil> the &szlig; is fine, saw no stray slashes so far
[08:27] <godbyk> I just ran po4a and had it generate a new .tex file.  the umlauts, ß, and capitalization have been preserved. so something else changed them.
[08:27]  * godbyk is investigating.
[08:27] <godbyk> that's good, at least.
[08:29] <thorwil> godbyk: page 28, margin note:  "InKapitel 4: Hardware", missing space after "In"
[08:30] <godbyk> Looking at the bzr logs, it appears that the German translation was screwed up when Daniel (the translation editor) added it to the repository.
[08:30] <godbyk> So something that he did during his editing process appears to have mangled the accents and capitalization.
[08:31] <thorwil> godbyk: page 29: "um in ein Verzeichnis mit Beispieldokumenten, -Tabellen und -Multimediadateien zu gelangen.". line wrap happens after "-" and before "Tabellen", but it absolutely must be "-Tabellen"
[08:31] <godbyk> the InKapitel bug is in the original translation.  (Code is "In\chaplink{...}...")
[08:32] <thorwil> godbyk: page 32, "Bearbeiten ‣ Ausschneiden." breaks out of the box
[08:32] <godbyk> that's something LaTeX did, it seems.  we can tell LaTeX to keep the -Tabellen together as one word, though (so it doesn't get wrapped post-hyphen).
[08:33] <godbyk> wow. that one breaks out quite a bit!
[08:33] <godbyk> well, crap.
[08:33] <godbyk> there's a lot more wrong than the ß.  :-(
[08:34] <godbyk> I was hoping it'd be a quick find/replace, recompile, upload, done.
[08:34] <thorwil> godbyk: page 33: "kön̈nen", note n with dots, this ain't some scandinavian language! ;)
[08:34] <godbyk> unfortunately, there's a LOT wrong with this thing.
[08:34] <thorwil> godbyk: and i'm only skimming
[08:34] <godbyk> thorwil: I know!
[08:34] <godbyk> I don't speak German and from my skimming there's a bunch of things I'd want to fix!
[08:35] <godbyk> Since I don't speak all the languages we're translating to, I have to rely on the translation editors to be perfectionists about spelling, grammar, typography, etc.
[08:35] <godbyk> Unfortunately, I doubt that most people are as picky as we are.
[08:35] <thorwil> godbyk: page 34: wrong quotation marks on “Erscheinungsbild”
[08:36] <godbyk> (There's a bunch of things I want to fix in the original English edition for that matter. I just have to find time to do it.)
[08:36] <thorwil> godbyk: page 37, qu.-marks again: “Hilfstechnologie Einstellungen”
[08:37] <godbyk> whoops.. the quotes are my bad. :)
[08:37] <godbyk> all the window captions/titles will have the ``English quotes''.
[08:40] <thorwil> godbyk: page 48, what's with the strange parenthesis on e.g. ⟨Verbindungsname⟩?
[08:41] <godbyk> Ah, the idea is that it's a placeholder/variable.
[08:41] <thorwil> i stop now at about page 50. takes too long
[08:41] <godbyk> I hear ya.
[08:42] <godbyk> I guess I'm going to have to bounce this back to Daniel and have him fix the capitalization of the umlauts.
[08:43] <godbyk> Something he did before uploading the .tex file converted all the unicode characters to latex-style commands (e.g., from ä to \"a).
[08:44] <thorwil> ok
[08:48] <godbyk> thorwil: Are there other major (and consistent) flaws that need to be fixed in the manual besides the capital umlauted letters?
[08:49] <thorwil> godbyk: the quotation marks
[08:49] <godbyk> okay.
[08:49] <godbyk> I'm writing an email to Daniel to have him fix the umlauts. I'll fix the quotation marks myself.
[08:50] <godbyk> I'll have him check that all the glossary entries have proper plurals, too.
[10:10] <nisshh> godbyk: if yuor there, the membership meeting is in 50 minutes
[10:10] <nisshh> thorwil: ^^^ if you can make it :)
[10:11] <thorwil> nisshh: lunch time here, but i'll be around a bit later, likely
[10:12] <nisshh> thorwil: cool
[11:40] <humphreybc> nisshh: you're applying for membership?
[11:40] <humphreybc> slash, you did
[11:40]  * humphreybc just looked at the time
[11:40] <nisshh> humphreybc: yea, but Vantrax is sick, and not many board members have turned up, so its looking like postponed
[11:40] <thorwil> humphreybc: membership board meeting would have been now, but no quorum
[11:40] <nisshh> :(
[11:41] <humphreybc> ok
[11:42] <dutchie> ooh, a humphreybc
[11:42] <dutchie> haven't seen any of those for a while
[11:43] <humphreybc> lol
[11:44] <nisshh> humphreybc: yep, meeting postponed :(
[11:44] <zkriesse> lol
[12:27] <thorwil> http://whatthefuckismysocialmediastrategy.com/
[12:28] <humphreybc> hahaha
[12:54] <thorwil> great: "After 15 minutes of joking around about how OMG! guys are rich, befriended Steve Jobs and like Windows 8 (and GNOME-related trolling) we decided to continue..."
[14:46] <flan> thorwil, yeah. I've actually written a provision into the server's logic (for when I actually have time to start comitting again) that will allow a number of "cleanup scripts" to be executed to transform an image while it's being screened for approval. Drawing borders and masking the corners are part of one such script that'll be included by default.
[14:46] <thorwil> flan: excellent
[15:05] <flan> I hope to have homish Internet by next week.
[15:05] <flan> Early next week.
[15:06] <flan> Life without Internet makes me sad.
[16:09] <thorwil> flan: don't worry, life with internet can be quite sad, too