[09:40] <tjaalton> RAOF: hmm, don't see xorg-server uploaded yet?-)
[09:40] <RAOF> tjaalton: GAH!
[09:41] <tjaalton> need a sponsor?
[09:41] <tjaalton> those input drivers need a rebuild then
[09:41] <RAOF> tjaalton: Once I've got all the reverse dependencies in order, yeah.
[09:41] <tjaalton> RAOF: ok, ping me when done, I'll be around
[09:42] <RAOF> They were *meant* to go to my staging area, but this box hasn't had my “ubuntu is not the default upload location” dput.cf
[10:01] <tjaalton> ah, hehe
[10:03] <RAOF> No, more grr.  Frustrating.
[10:10] <tjaalton> well, that happens ;)
[10:15] <vish> tseliot: hi , any news about Bug #386017 ?
[10:15] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 386017 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "Brushing right-edge of trackpad causes clipboard to paste text (affects: 7) (dups: 2) (heat: 57)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/386017
[10:34] <tseliot> vish: no, sorry, I'm not working on it
[10:34] <vish> tseliot: oh , ok..
[10:34] <tseliot> I'm too busy with other work
[10:35] <tseliot> it's not that I wouldn't like to fix that bug
[10:35] <vish> ;)
[10:44] <RAOF> tseliot: Do you have any news on when the proprietary drivers will be available that work against Xserver 1.9?
[10:44] <tseliot> RAOF: yes, can we discuss this in private
[10:44] <tseliot> ?
[11:03] <RAOF> ”glx: dri2InvalidateBuffers() needs the X drawable XID not the GLX one.  This never ceases to entertain.”
[13:07] <RAOF> cnd: You wanted a -dbg package on xserver-xorg-input-evdev.  Is there something that the -dbgsym packages don't provide?
[13:41] <RAOF> tjaalton: www.cooperteam.net/Packages is almost ready for your sponsoring pleasure.  You know the order things need to go in.
[13:44] <cnd> RAOF, no, I didn't know there was a -dbgsym for it
[13:44] <cnd> are you sure it's there?
[13:45] <RAOF> cnd: Everything in the archive gets a -dbgsym for free, and the long-standing “build -dbgsym packages in PPAs” bug has just moved to fix-committed.
[13:45] <cnd> ahhh!
[13:45] <RAOF> You need to add the dbgsym repository, though.  wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash is the documentation, I think.
[13:45] <cnd> yeah
[13:46] <cnd> I thought I looked there and couldn't find it though
[13:46] <cnd> but maybe my problem was just the ppa issue
[13:46] <cnd> RAOF, have you uploaded xorg-server yet?
[13:46] <tjaalton> RAOF: ok, the server is missing?
[13:47] <RAOF> ...of course it is.
[13:47] <tjaalton> hmm?
[13:47] <RAOF> Let me just push that, and xorg, and the final 3 DDXs.
[13:47] <tjaalton> ah
[13:49] <tjaalton> so the order is xorg-server, drivers, and finally xorg
[13:49] <tjaalton> if there are no libs/protos to upload?
[13:49] <tjaalton> i'm sooo behind all of this :)
[13:49] <RAOF> There are no libs/protos required.
[13:49] <tjaalton> good
[13:49] <RAOF> Yup, that's the order.
[13:53] <RAOF> I'll be going to bed about now, so if you don't have time or would like me to be around during the upload process it can wait 'till tomorrow morning when I bug people in my own timezone for sponsorship.
[13:54] <tjaalton> I can upload them, but would like to know when they all are there first ;)
[13:55] <tjaalton> the server seems to have appeared
[13:56] <tjaalton> or: what are still missing, so I'll know when to upload
[13:56] <tjaalton> I'll wget the whole dir then
[13:57] <RAOF> I'm just uploading xorg now; then I'll double-check that everything's there.
[13:57] <tjaalton> cool
[14:14] <RAOF> That looks like it!
[14:15] <RAOF> tjaalton: That looks like everything, except for (re)rebuilds for the 3 input drivers I accidentally uploaded earlier.
[14:15] <RAOF> Go for your life - I'm off to bed.
[14:15] <tjaalton> ok, no-one uses those anyway ;)
[14:15] <tjaalton> night!
[14:19] <cnd> RAOF, so you've uploaded xorg-server 1.9?
[14:20] <cnd> I'm looking at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server
[14:20] <cnd> maybe it just lags?
[14:21] <tjaalton> not uploaded yet
[14:21] <tjaalton> I'm on it
[14:21] <Sarvatt> he meant uploaded to his site for sponsoring
[14:22] <Sarvatt> RAOF: dang ya did it all! :) evdev and synaptics actually built?
[14:24] <cnd> tjaalton, Sarvatt, RAOF, where would RAOF have uploaded it to?
[14:24] <cnd> somewhere I can get to?
[14:24] <Sarvatt> http://www.cooperteam.net/Packages/
[14:24] <tjaalton> cnd: so are you uploading them?
[14:25] <Sarvatt> i don't think evdev and synaptics are going to work, they wouldn't build after some input abi changes in 1.8.99.0 unless i'm remembering wrong
[14:25] <cnd> Sarvatt, why is it still 1.8.99.905?
[14:25] <cnd> shouldn't it be 1.9 at this point?
[14:25] <tjaalton> not released yet
[14:25] <cnd> tjaalton, oh really?
[14:25] <cnd> I thought it had been
[14:25] <Sarvatt> 1.9 isn't out yet?
[14:26] <tjaalton> nope
[14:26] <Sarvatt> sorry didn't mean that as a question, i was checking to make sure it didn't come out this morning and didn't see ya beat me to it tjaalton :)
[14:27] <tjaalton> heh .)
[14:27] <tjaalton> :)
[14:46] <Sarvatt> crazy phoronix..
[14:46] <Sarvatt> NVIDIA's binary driver is compatible with X.Org Server 1.9 and ATI's Catalyst driver that is usually months behind in supporting X.Org Server updates should actually work with the 1.9 release at this point. 
[15:05] <tjaalton> xorg-server uploaded, once it's built and published I'll upload the drivers
[15:24] <tseliot> Sarvatt, tjaalton: does the synaptics driver contain the quirks that I uploaded last week? I'd rather not lose them again
[15:24] <tseliot> (I'm referring to the new synaptics driver that you plan on uploading)
[15:32] <Sarvatt> i've got a x11-xserver-utils merge that could use sponsoring as well - http://sarvatt.com/downloads/merges/x11-xserver-utils/
[15:32] <Sarvatt> tseliot: looks like he based it off the archive source package instead of origin/ubuntu git (ubuntu2) so it does
[15:33] <tseliot> Sarvatt: ah, that's good news
[15:33] <tseliot> Sarvatt: have you tested that package extensively?
[15:33] <Sarvatt> i'm not sure it's going to work though, pretty sure synaptics and evdev didn't build against xserver 1.9 when I did the update a few months ago in edgers and synaptics needs patches refreshed if we do a newer release
[15:34] <Sarvatt> no, i haven't tested what raof uploaded to his page for sponsoring yet
[15:34] <Sarvatt> got everything building now but it takes ages on this atom
[15:35] <tseliot> Sarvatt: wait, would the old x11-xserver-utils work with the new X?
[15:37] <Sarvatt> tseliot: yeah the libs and protos are all up to date, it doesn't use xserver directly
[15:38] <tseliot> yes, I was referring to the old X stack (protos included)
[15:38] <tseliot> but if they are up to date, then ok
[15:39] <tseliot> Sarvatt: I'll sponsor the upload for you
[15:39] <tseliot> I'll build it here first
[15:41] <Sarvatt> thanks tseliot
[15:41] <Sarvatt> phew, purged xorg-edgers on my machines in time this time around, wont be able to purge it for a few days
[15:52] <Sarvatt> it's going to be another 2 hours or so until xserver is done building on all arches
[15:53] <tseliot> Sarvatt: uploaded
[15:55] <Sarvatt> thanks!
[16:16] <tseliot> np
[16:17] <cnd> Sarvatt, tjaalton, RAOF, do you know if xserver-xorg-input-evdev will be updated beyond 2.3.2 for maverick?
[16:19] <Sarvatt> cnd: almost positive it's going to need a git snapshot for 1.8.99.905, i'm waiting for the i386 -dev package to be published to try building the stuff against it since i'm looking into mesa demos
[16:26] <cnd> Sarvatt, ok, so the drivers essentially haven't been ported yet...
[16:28] <Sarvatt> i imagine he test built them but i could swear evdev and synaptics didn't build against xserver 1.9 when i first moved xorg-edgers to it, will know in about an hour
[16:56] <cnd> Sarvatt, so are you going to be doing the packaging for evdev?
[16:56] <cnd> or are you just test building
[16:58] <Sarvatt> if it needs updating yeah i'll do it, unless you want to? :) it's building now
[16:58] <Sarvatt> oh it builds!
[16:59] <Sarvatt> could use an update to 2.4.0 at any rate anyway
[17:18] <Sarvatt> jcristau: mind if i merge evdev 2.4.0 in git?
[17:19] <Sarvatt> hmm theres not really much point is there
[17:25] <Sarvatt> yeah nevermind, might as well wait for 2.5.0 which has the big changes and will probably release the same time as xserver 1.9 :)
[17:28] <Sarvatt> xserver is done building on all arches, ia64 is the only one not published yet - https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/2:1.8.99.905-1ubuntu1/+build/1910763
[18:00] <tjaalton> meh, gnome-terminal doesn't recognize ":" as a valid character in an url
[18:02] <tjaalton> Sarvatt: I'll upload the drivers once ia64 is 'DONE'
[18:02] <Sarvatt> it's taking quite some time to publish, 56 minutes now :(
[18:03] <Sarvatt> maybe it's the character encoding you're using? it works fine here
[18:04] <sithlord48> hello ubuntu-X community,,, im looking to replace my video card (its an ati R770LE chipset) with a better supported by open source ati driver and with at least opengl 2.0 support anysuggestions?
[18:07] <Sarvatt> the only ati's with opengl 2.0 or higher at the moment are r600-r700, a faster HD 4xxx series is the only option really but its not going to be better supported
[18:07] <Sarvatt> unless you go gallium :)
[18:07] <Sarvatt> and there you want something < r600 because >= r600 gallium isn't in good shape
[18:08] <sithlord48> well im looking for a card that will work , my 4830HD works ok w/ the open driver but is still lacking..(the ati driver they provide breaks my compositing..)
[18:08] <sithlord48> i was looking at an 4350HD its fairly inexpencive.
[18:09] <Sarvatt> all of the hd 2xxx-hd4xxx share the same 3D driver so if anything the downgrade would work the same only slower
[18:10] <Sarvatt> are you using lucid?
[18:10] <tjaalton> Sarvatt: 'plonk', there we go
[18:10] <sithlord48> yes. lucid 64 bit, kde 4.4.5 (yes kubuntu)
[18:11] <tjaalton> drivers uploading
[18:11] <Sarvatt> i'd recommend trying out the xorg-edgers PPA if so because the newer mesa should be a good bit faster
[18:11] <Sarvatt> tjaalton: \o/ thanks so much for sponsoring all of those!
[18:11] <tjaalton> my pleasure
[18:11] <sithlord48> its not even slow. its basicly compositing is on , but in the system settings it tells me its not supported. so i can't change any of the settings (other then that it works ok)
[18:12] <Sarvatt> sithlord48: sounds like you have some remnants of the proprietary drivers still hanging around
[18:12] <sithlord48> i have formated. the system only my /home remains..(and i nuked the .kde folder...)
[18:13] <Sarvatt> can you pastebin your /var/log/Xorg.0.log?
[18:13] <sithlord48> well i can't atm since im not at that machine..
[18:14] <sithlord48> is there something i should look for in the log?
[18:17] <sithlord48> i know its using the radeion driver.. (according to lsmod)
[18:17] <Sarvatt> it could be a *ton* of things, if you could run ubuntu-bug xorg from a terminal after booting it it'll upload all of the logs and file a bug report so we could look into it (or just pastebin the log if you're on irc)
[18:17] <sithlord48> ok i can do that in about 3 hours when i get home..
[18:18] <Sarvatt> does it still enable even though it says unsupported? i know KDE hardcodes some opengl vendor strings but I'm pretty sure its only used for enabling effects automatically
[18:19] <sithlord48> its enabled..
[18:20] <sithlord48> just if i go to the kcm module to change the settings it says its not supported and all my options are unselectable..
[18:23] <sithlord48> also for some reason under glxinfo it shows my current opengl version as 1.5 ... i think its a failure on the open ati driver. and r700 chipsets.. 
[18:23] <sithlord48> how can i help w/ dev for my card (im not skilled enuff in the coding arts to write the drivers..)
[18:32] <sithlord48> sarvatt, is there a recommened video card  for lucid ?
[18:33] <Sarvatt> sithlord48: yeah r600-r700 needs mesa 7.8 for opengl 2.0, forgot about that
[18:34] <sithlord48> i don't get it/
[18:34] <sithlord48> so i need to install mesa 7,8 for me to have opengl (any idea when that would be possible)
[18:34] <Sarvatt> lucid has mesa 7.7, you can use the xorg-edgers ppa for newer mesa that has opengl 2.0
[18:35] <Sarvatt> no i doubt thats related to your not being able to enable effects
[18:36] <bryceh> sithlord48, best thing you can do to help development is file bugs upstream at bugzilla.freedesktop.org and help with testing there
[18:36] <sithlord48> ok then when i get home first thing i will do is try the edgers ppa..
[18:37] <sithlord48> bryceh , thanks for that  info i'll be sure to report bugs 
[18:39] <Sarvatt> tjaalton: can you sync video-chips from unstable and trident/sisusb/dummy/apm/tseng from experimental?
[18:39] <sithlord48> thanks very much guys.. i'll be back to let you all know how it goes..
[18:39] <Sarvatt> oh shoot wait, all of the experimental ones weren't uploaded
[18:57] <Sarvatt> alf__: maybe you should make libcairoscript-interpreter2 and cairo-perf-utils Suggests: for libcairo2 instead of hard dependencies for -dev and -dbg?
[19:02] <tjaalton> meh, missing tarballs 
[19:03] <Sarvatt> video-geode can be synced from unstable
[19:06] <tjaalton> rendition, sisusb, trident, tseng, voodoo, omapfb are missing a tarball
[19:12] <tjaalton> RAOF: if you wake up early and fix those, I can upload them before going to bed ;)
[19:17] <Sarvatt> so he's got them in git as xserver-xorg-video-sisusb (1:0.9.4-1) UNRELEASED; in git, what'd be the right way to get those in ubuntu? dch -a with 1:0.9.4-0ubuntu1 instead?
[19:22] <Sarvatt> starting to put some up here but i haven't test built yet - http://sarvatt.com/downloads/merges/xserver1.9/
[19:32] <Sarvatt> just gotta do rendition and i'll test build them all, looks like the lighttpd footer text doesn't have enough space to have all of the .changes in it :)
[19:48] <Sarvatt> tjaalton: http://sarvatt.com/downloads/merges/xserver1.9/ - i uploaded the buildlogs as the _i386.build files too
[20:11] <tjaalton> Sarvatt: ok thanks, but wget doesn't seem to work there..
[20:12] <Sarvatt> hmm, it does here, odd
[20:12] <tjaalton> with -r I only get the index and robots.txt
[20:12] <Sarvatt> oh
[20:14] <tjaalton> well, true blood continues, bbl
[20:19] <Sarvatt> i'd have to turn off directory listings i guess for a plain wget -r to work, wget -r -l1 -nd --no-parent -A.dsc http://sarvatt.com/downloads/merges/xserver1.9/ (also changing .dsc for .gz and .changes) would work
[20:32] <Sarvatt> tjaalton: for foo in dsc gz changes ; do wget -r -l1 -nd --no-parent -A.$foo http://sarvatt.com/downloads/merges/xserver1.9/ ; done
[20:48] <alkisg> Hi, are 3d apps like e.g. glxgears supposed to be working with remote X? I've read about aiglx, but it's not working out of the box for me, is some special setup needed?
[20:50] <Sarvatt> it should unless you're using binary drivers or gallium from xorg-edgers where you might have trouble
[20:52] <alkisg> Sarvatt: I'm getting this: http://pastebin.com/V0LmeLML
[20:52] <alkisg> (not using binary drivers nor xorg-edgers)
[20:53]  * alkisg also is going to try with an intel client now...
[20:55] <Sarvatt> are you trying to connect to a xephyr display remotely or something?
[20:56] <alkisg> Yes, something like XDMCP (thin clients, LTSP)
[20:57] <Sarvatt> pretty sure dri2 doesn't work with xephyr
[20:57] <Sarvatt> does LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1 glxgears work?
[20:57]  * Sarvatt is just curious
[21:01] <tjaalton> Sarvatt: thanks, uploading
[21:02] <Sarvatt> openchrome needs an xsfbs update, boo!
[21:02] <alkisg> Thanks Sarvatt, trying... (damn intel 855 needs a patched kernel, it's going to take a while :-/)
[21:09] <alkisg> Sarvatt: yup, it works! Thanks a lot!
[21:32] <alkisg> Tried with a client with an ati card (radeon), glxgears remotely said 400fps, but the gears were just trembling and googleearth produced about 5 fps, while on the same client with the same driver locally I got 276 fps with glxgears (less, but it was working smothly) and googleearth produced about 30fps
[21:33] <alkisg> So maybe it's some software emulation after all? Or the network delay is so big that it makes remote 3d acceleration so much worse than the local one?
[21:34] <Sarvatt> for ati you can just boot with nomodeset on the client to not use dri2
[21:34] <johanbr> is there any way to disable the intel driver with a kernel boot parameter?
[21:34] <johanbr> so that X falls back to vesa?
[21:34] <alkisg> I tried both with and without nomodeset, I didn't see any difference to 3d acceleration
[21:35] <Sarvatt> did you use indirect both times?
[21:35] <Sarvatt> cus ya should try without with nomodeset
[21:35] <alkisg> No, with that ati driver it wasn't needed
[21:35] <alkisg> So both times I tried without it (and once, with nomodeset I tried with it, but again no difference)
[21:35] <Sarvatt> johanbr: i915=foobar works, any kind of invalid module parameter
[21:36] <johanbr> Sarvatt, great, thank you!
[21:38] <Sarvatt> alkisg: maybe try LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1 yourapp?
[21:38] <alkisg> (btw two other people trying the same thing now report that it only works for them with LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1, so they put that into /etc/profile :))
[21:38] <alkisg> Sarvatt: I've tried `LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1 glxgears` with nomodeset, should I also try it without nomodeset?
[21:38] <Sarvatt> ~/.XSession would probably be a better place
[21:39] <alkisg> It has to be done for all users
[21:39] <alkisg> (they also put a `test -n $LTSP_CLIENT` in front of it so that it doesn't affect local users)
[21:39] <Sarvatt> nah i was just curious if it was any faster, it was a shot in the dark
[21:40] <Sarvatt> i've never had gl at anywhere near a usable speed remotely
[21:40] <alkisg> Is 3d acceleration over network supposed to be close ... yup, that ^^
[21:40] <Sarvatt> maybe try vblank_mode=0 glxgears?
[21:40] <alkisg> I was worried that I wasn't doing something correctly and it did some kind of software acceleration, but maybe that's as fast as it goes over the network...
[21:41]  * alkisg tries that
[21:41] <Sarvatt> its still hardware acceleration its just the latency is too much i believe
[21:42] <alkisg> Hmm I should try it with a gigabit network when I get a chance then
[21:44] <Sarvatt> of course i say that and now i'm getting 100fps in glxgears remotely and its smooth
[21:45] <Sarvatt> its just a forwarded x display over ssh though
[21:46] <Sarvatt> over wifi, from lucid to maverick on intel
[21:46] <alkisg> Urm. Is that on a good cpu? Maybe it's just software acceleration?
[21:46] <Sarvatt> atom
[21:46] <alkisg> (no difference with vblank_mode)
[21:46] <Sarvatt> yep you're right -- OpenGL renderer string: Software Rasterizer
[21:46] <Sarvatt> OpenGL version string: 2.1 Mesa 7.9-devel
[21:47] <alkisg> Anyway thanks a lot Sarvatt, you were a great help. I'll do some benchmarks with different hardware to see how it goes. :)
[21:48] <Sarvatt> no worries, you got me curious now will let ya know if i figure anything out :)
[21:51] <alkisg> Thanks - if you got any good pointers we're all ears in #ltsp 
[22:36] <sithlord48> hello, i was here eariler with the RV770LE , looking for opengl 2.0, well i poped on the xorg-edgers ppa and opengl 2.0 Mesa 7.9-devel is now my version but the kcm for desktop effects still say "compositing not supported on your system" (and yes my effects are on and do work i just can't configure them)
[22:37] <sithlord48> Sarvatt: hello, would u still like me to pastebin my xorg log?