[05:29] <pitti> Good morning
[05:33] <TheMuso> Hey pitti.
[07:42] <robert_ancell> pitti, hey, can you have a look at the vala packages in the NEW queue?
[07:44] <pitti> hey robert_ancell, how are you?
[07:44] <robert_ancell> pitti, hey, good
[07:44] <pitti> weird, why are all those new?
[07:44] <pitti> valac has been around for ages
[07:44] <robert_ancell> pitti, because there are new binary packages (vala got versioned in this release so you can run multiple copies)
[07:44] <pitti> ah, valac-0.10, I see
[07:45] <pitti> robert_ancell: but then it should also build some transitional packages
[07:45] <pitti> robert_ancell: or will there be a vala-defaults package which depends on the current version?
[07:46] <pitti> or will 0.9 stay the default in main?
[07:46] <robert_ancell> pitti, there is a 'valac' metapackage - I think that covers it
[07:46] <pitti> ah, can you upload that as well?
[07:46] <robert_ancell> no, there will only be support for multiple versions from 0.10 onwards
[07:47] <robert_ancell> pitti, it's built from the new vala source package
[07:47] <robert_ancell> is metapackage the right word?  It's a package with no contents that depends on the latest one
[07:47] <pitti> right
[07:47] <pitti> it's similar to gcc-defaults
[07:47] <pitti> i. e. gcc depends on gcc-4.4 right now
[07:48] <robert_ancell> ok, but they have a separate sourcepackage for that?
[07:48] <pitti> yes, gcc-defaults
[07:49] <pitti> so right now we have 0.10 in universe and 0.9.4 in main
[07:49] <pitti> and "valac" (main) is 0.9.4
[07:50] <robert_ancell> pitti, the latest version is 0.9.5, which is library version 0.10
[07:50] <pitti> ah
[07:50] <pitti> robert_ancell: but then the 0.10 packages should be in main, and valac updated?
[07:51] <robert_ancell> I've uploaded them, but they're stuck in the new queue
[07:51] <robert_ancell> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vala/0.9.5-2ubuntu1/+build/1920326
[07:52] <pitti> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=vala
[07:52] <pitti> nothing in NEW for vala any more
[07:53] <pitti> robert_ancell: ah, it's accepted
[07:53] <robert_ancell> that's weird.  They definitely haven't hit the mirrors and simple-scan (which I uploaded later) is available
[07:53] <robert_ancell> oh, race condition :)
[07:53] <robert_ancell> right, now it says awaiting publication :)
[09:05] <and471> morning all!
[09:22] <bilalakhtar> seb128: there?
[09:22] <seb128> yes
[09:22] <seb128> hi
[09:23] <bilalakhtar> seb128: the situation is like this: an empathy bug has been fixed upstream. Should I wait for a new upstream release of empathy in Ubuntu or should I backport the patch?
[09:23] <bilalakhtar> I know FF has come
[09:24] <seb128> wait for the next update
[09:24] <seb128> it's due today
[09:24] <seb128> GNOME has a freeze exception
[09:24] <seb128> we will get 2.32
[09:26] <bilalakhtar> seb128: Thanks!
[09:26] <seb128> you're welcome
[09:26] <bilalakhtar> seb128: And, package indicator-session has a similar situation. What should be done?
[09:26] <seb128> that one got an update less than a week ago
[09:27] <seb128> but dx do weekly updates
[09:27] <bilalakhtar> seb128: the other day bdrung advised moving the patch system of the package to quilt
[09:28] <bilalakhtar> sorry
[09:28] <bilalakhtar> its indicator-sound
[09:28] <seb128> no need to patch indicator-*
[09:28] <seb128> dx roll weekly tarballs
[09:28] <seb128> get your changes upstream and they will land in ubuntu in a week
[09:28] <vish> bilalakhtar: that one will get uploaded with the mpris stuff
[09:29] <bilalakhtar> thanks seb128 !
[09:29] <seb128> yw
[09:29] <vish> seb128: hey , i'v filed https://answers.launchpad.net/rosetta/+question/120619 , and looking into not breaking the syncs.. [just incase you want to subscribe there ;)]
[09:34] <devildante> kiwinote: hi and ping :p
[09:34] <kiwinote> devildante: hi
[09:35] <devildante> kiwinote: the bug I told you about yesterday, it seems to also be in trunk
[09:35] <kiwinote> devildante: the aptdaemon one?
[09:35] <devildante> kiwinote: yes
[09:35] <devildante> kiwinote: try removing an application in trunk, that could be just me
[09:36] <kiwinote> devildante: yep, you don't need to worry about that one, I can't reproduce it myself, but I've seen a pile of bug reports about it
[09:36] <devildante> kiwinote: example? :p
[09:37] <kiwinote> devildante: bug LP: #616026 for example
[09:38] <kiwinote> or bug #616026, however the bot works ;)
[09:38] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 616026 in software-center (Ubuntu) "update-software-center crashed with TypeError in _on_property_changed() (affects: 18) (dups: 1) (heat: 86)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616026
[09:40] <devildante> kiwinote: hmm, I see
[09:41] <devildante> yes, that is the exact bug report! thanks kiwinote :)
[09:45] <kiwinote> devildante: just found another bug that you can fix ;)
[09:45] <devildante> kiwinote: oh ya :p
[09:45] <kiwinote> devildante: disable all software sources and then browse to ubufox which should be installed. a crash follows
[09:49] <devildante> kiwinote: okay, fixing it
[09:49] <kiwinote> devildante: nice ;)
[09:52] <devildante> kiwinote: fixed :)
[09:52] <kiwinote> devildante: great
[09:52]  * kiwinote goes hunting for more bugs
[09:52] <devildante> kiwinote: but can't s-c really crash? :p
[09:53] <devildante> kiwinote: each time, it's a little crash that doesn't affect the other bits :p
[09:55] <kiwinote> devildante: found one, the icon for the addon of ACE (unace) is oversized
[09:56] <devildante> kiwinote: you mean qcomicbook? :p
[09:56] <kiwinote> yep
[09:56] <devildante> I don't find it oversized
[09:57] <devildante> kiwinote: maybe I fixed it. Could you go to the firefox app and see if the icons are oversized?
[10:00] <kiwinote> devildante: hm, that did seem to be some sort of race condition, all looks fine now
[10:00] <kiwinote> devildante: then we continue
[10:00] <devildante> kiwinote: what is a race condition?
[10:00] <kiwinote> devildante: something that happens once and never again
[10:01] <devildante> kiwinote: thx :)
[10:01] <kiwinote> devildante: the aclock app still seems to be missing a big icon
[10:02] <kiwinote> devildante: I though you had mentioned that you had fixed that the other day, but either you haven't pushed it, or the fix didn't work?
[10:02] <devildante> kiwinote: I fixed it, but then it returned :p
[10:03] <kiwinote> devildante: aha, let's get rid of it for good now ;)
[10:03] <devildante> kiwinote: draw your sword, warrior, as we shall get rid of this terror for good :p
[10:05] <devildante> kiwinote: the terror has been defeated! the earth shall be in peace again :p
[10:06] <seb128> *shrug*
[10:06] <pitti> seb128: bonjour Monsieur
[10:06] <seb128> lists turned in flameware mode now
[10:06] <seb128> seems people just don't get that backport is different
[10:06] <seb128> hey pitti
[10:07] <devildante> pitti: bonjour Madame :p
[10:07] <pitti> devildante: -EGENDER?
[10:07] <pitti> bonjour devildante
[10:07]  * devildante impersonates pitti as a madame, muhahahaha :p
[10:08] <vish> cassidy: wow! if only all upstreams were as quick as empathy folks! ;)
[10:08] <cassidy> thanks :)
[10:08] <bilalakhtar> cassidy: Congo!
[10:08] <bilalakhtar> No wonder empathy is the default GNOME IM client!
[10:09] <bilalakhtar> All thanks to cassidy ! I was going to write a patch, but when I saw the upstream bug fixed, I cannot help coming here :)
[10:09] <cassidy> np :)
[10:09] <kiwinote> devildante: when selecting a addon the green bar is about 3px high. Not sure if that is just me or not
[10:11] <devildante> kiwinote: I have a normal green bar. care to do some screenshots?
[10:17] <kiwinote> devildante: http://imagebin.org/109894
[10:18] <kiwinote> devildante: originally no addons were selected, then i choose the lowest addon and then that skinny bar appeared
[10:18] <devildante> kiwinote: oh yes that, it has been fixed :)
[10:18]  * devildante should really push its changes :p
[10:18] <kiwinote> devildante: can you push so that I can test the buttons
[10:19] <devildante> kiwinote: okay
[10:21] <devildante> kiwinote: pushed :)
[10:21] <devildante> hey, seems I became popular :p : http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2010/08/update-manager-gets-update-for-maverick.html
[10:29] <kiwinote> devildante: I have had a think about how addons are installed/removed
[10:30] <kiwinote> devildante: I think we don't want to touch the existing install/remove code this cycle as they work rather well
[10:30] <kiwinote> devildante: for that reason I think it is better to modify your code to use the add/remove multiple functions instead
[10:31] <devildante> kiwinote: agreed, plus nobody will have an excuse to not ffe :p
[10:32] <devildante> kiwinote: if I do that, I face a challenge: how to make the progress bar consistent?
[10:32] <kiwinote> devildante: this will mean that all add-ons will become separate instances in the pending view all the time which is not completely by spec, but then we just diverge from the spec slightly
[10:33] <devildante> kiwinote: I've already tried, but mysteriously the progress bar hides and shows for some reason after a transaction
[10:33] <devildante> and we will have more transactions than ever if we just install/remove/install/remove :p
[10:33] <kiwinote> devildante: the biggest issue here is if you use install multiple and then remove multiple, do you get two password dialogs straight after eachother, or does the remove dialog pop up only after the other pkgs are installed
[10:34] <devildante> kiwinote: you get two password dialogs
[10:34] <kiwinote> devildante: straight after eachother, or does the second only come after the first is finished?
[10:34] <devildante> kiwinote: it is the same with commit_packages(), but at least it's only one operation
[10:34] <devildante> kiwinote: straight after each other
[10:35] <kiwinote> devildante: ok, thanks
[10:35] <devildante> kiwinote: if we use commit_packages(), the issue will remain, but we can bug the aptdaemon developer so he treats commit_packages() as a separate operation
[10:35] <asac> seb128: ... shouldnt something using dh_pysupport use ${python:Depends} ?
[10:36] <asac> RE zeitgeist-extensions mir
[10:36] <seb128> I guess it should yes
[10:38] <asac> ok asked for that in MIR ... otherwise its probably ok ;)
[10:40] <kiwinote> devildante: hm, I've just looked at the aptd.py code in your branch and it seems to be less different from trunk than when I last looked
[10:40] <asac> ogra: can you please get info for bug 607291
[10:40] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 607291 in taglib-sharp (Ubuntu) (and 5 other projects) "[MIR] banshee (affects: 1) (heat: 137)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/607291
[10:41] <devildante> kiwinote: should I ping the aptdaemon developer?
[10:41] <kiwinote> devildante: given that, we can just leave it like it is (sorry for changing my mind constantly ;) )
[10:41] <asac> ogra: i subscribed your team ;)
[10:41] <kiwinote> devildante: eventually, but we'll get your branch into good shape first
[10:41] <devildante> kiwinote: okay :)
[10:42] <kiwinote> devildante: we need to do something about changing addons of an already installed application
[10:42] <devildante> kiwinote: what's the problem with that?
[10:43] <asac> chrisccoulson: gyp MIR without chromium-browser mir?
[10:43] <chrisccoulson> asac - i'm working on that ;)
[10:43] <asac> do we really need this in this cycle? if so i guess we want chromium in too
[10:43] <chrisccoulson> asac - yeah, the plan is still to have chromium in main
[10:44] <asac> i will set gyp to incomplete until we have the MIR for chromium
[10:44] <kiwinote> devildante: the in progress view just shows the original app, do we want to show each individual app separately, or embed it in the main app like now?
[10:44] <asac> i want a good explanation about what was done to get chromium security delivered ;)
[10:44] <kiwinote> devildante: I don't really mind which actually
[10:45] <devildante> kiwinote: you may want to ask mpt, he's here :)
[10:45] <mpt> hi devildante
[10:45] <devildante> hi mpt :)
[10:45] <devildante> mpt: <kiwinote> devildante: the in progress view just shows the original app, do we want to show each individual app separately, or embed it in the main app like now?
[10:46] <mpt> What I have at the moment is: "In the “In Progress” section, when installing an item, installing any of its add-ons should be presented as part of the same task. But changing add-ons for an installed item should be presented as a separate task for each add-on."
[10:47] <mpt> Does that make sense, or is there something better we could do?
[10:48] <kiwinote> mpt: I think eventually we would want it all embedded in one app, but I think that that would only make sense once we hide the addons in default views, which is out of scope for this cycle
[10:48] <mpt> kiwinote, as in "Changing add-ons for X"?
[10:48] <mpt> hmm
[10:49] <vish> mpt: what about making the add-on selection/removal as a modal window?
[10:49] <mpt> vish, we're talking about something different here, which is how to present add-on changes in the "In Progress" screen
[10:50] <kiwinote> mpt: yeah, but somewhere we need to define the scope of what we want this cycle so we still get a ffe, versus the ideal situation
[10:50] <vish> mpt: ah , nvm then ;)
[10:50] <asac> Riddell: can we demote install-package for qapt?
[10:50] <mpt> kiwinote, for the purpose of 10.10, I don't think it matters at all whether it's shown as a single task or multiple tasks.
[10:50]  * devildante is relieved that he doesn't do any additional work :p
[10:50] <vish> expanders ftw!
[10:51] <devildante> vish: great idea! (if I know what you mean :p)
[10:51] <kiwinote> mpt: ok, then we may as well leave it as it is, all showing as a transaction of the main app
[10:52] <kiwinote> mpt: the main difference is that we need to call different backend functions depending on how we want it to show in the in progress view
[10:53] <vish> devildante: well we can have a main progress bar, it would need to calculate both for the main app + addons , and use an expander to show the individual progress' , mpt might have other ideas though ;)
[10:53] <devildante> kiwinote, mpt: as vish suggested, in the next cycle, we could show the transaction as a single app, but expanding the transaction should reveal addons
[10:53] <devildante> vish: let's leave this to mpt ;)
[10:54] <kiwinote> mpt: which means that it would make sense to use one set of backend functions (ie always show it as a transaction of the main app) for both newly installed and already installed apps
[10:55] <mpt> That's a good idea for later.
[10:56] <devildante> oh! how am I relieved at the sound of "later"! :p (too lazy)
[10:56] <kiwinote> devildante: it may be nice to add 3 or 4 pixels of padding between the addons icon and the addon title/name
[10:57] <kiwinote> devildante: and a ':' behind 'choose add-ons' may be nice as well ;)
[10:59] <and471> kiwinote, devildante: can I see a screenshot? I am intrigued :)
[10:59] <kiwinote> devildante: there is also a 'free' label in the add-ons action bar. I think it would make more sense to avoid paid apps to show up in the add-ons view
[10:59] <devildante> kiwinote: it's mpt who told me to put the price in there, go bug him instead :p
[11:00] <devildante> and271: one moment
[11:00] <mpt> kiwinote, this is for the case (in future) where free apps may have commercial add-ons.
[11:01] <Riddell> asac: we should be able to remove install-package
[11:01] <kiwinote> mpt: hm, ok, although the add-ons bar is currently not able to purchase apps anyway
[11:02] <devildante> and471: http://imgur.com/mXXjo.png
[11:02] <mpt> that's true, it's for forward compatibility of people's expectations :-)
[11:02] <kiwinote> mpt: aha, then we'd better leave it there ;)
[11:03] <and471> devildante, cool, which branch are you working in?
[11:03] <asac> Riddell: kk. thanks
[11:03] <kiwinote> mpt: and would 'clear changes' make more sense than 'cancel', or is that also just me?
[11:04] <vish> hehe!
[11:04] <kiwinote> devildante: padding looks a lot better now, great!
[11:04] <vish> kiwinote: not just you ;)
[11:04] <devildante> and471: I work on add-ons, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ilidrissi.amine/software-center/addons
[11:04]  * kiwinote is relieved
[11:05] <devildante> kiwinote: np...  any other bugs?
[11:05] <kiwinote> devildante: I think the code is in a state where it works quite nicely
[11:06] <mpt> kiwinote, either would work, but "Cancel" is more common
[11:06] <mpt> and471, are you looking for something to do? :-)
[11:06] <and471> mpt, yeah how could you tell :)
[11:06] <kiwinote> mpt: yep, I just couldn't work out what cancel was referring to when I first saw it
[11:07] <kiwinote> mpt: much like the undo/redo in the edit menu actually ;)
[11:08] <mpt> and471, how about changing the "_N other_ technical items" bar to a "_Show N other_ technical items"/"_Hide N_ technical items" bar that doesn't disappear?
[11:08] <mpt> as I think we talked about before
[11:08] <and471> mpt, sounds good :)
[11:09] <and471> devildante, is most of the code in appdetailsviewgtk.py ?
[11:09] <kiwinote> devildante: it may be worth looking at the diff you make with trunk and trying to tidy up the changes you have made. Ie are all the function names logical, do you constantly put an enter between the functions etc
[11:09] <devildante> and471: yes, but there's some other changes in other files
[11:09] <devildante> kiwinote: okay
[11:10] <kiwinote> devildante: I think most of it looks good, just a few little things every now and then
[11:10] <devildante> kiwinote: thanks :)
[11:10] <kiwinote> devildante: the magic command is 'bzr diff --old lp:~kiwinote/software-center/getting-the-small-things-right'
[11:10] <kiwinote> devildante: and you can merge to that branch as well ;)
[11:11] <vish> mpt: wanted to ask you about Bug 613301 , this is an application which requires GNUstep to work , how should we be handling such apps?  should we hide them until at minimum gnu-base is installed?
[11:11] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 613301 in zipper.app (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Zipper description is confusing (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/613301
[11:11]  * kiwinote goes to have some lunch
[11:12] <vish> it seems kinda seems pointless showing something which user cannot use right now...
[11:12] <mpt> vish, hiding them would be overdoing it, but it would be nice to flag it in some way. Search for "How to prioritize toolkits?" in the spec for previous notes about that.
[11:12] <vish> neat!
[11:12]  * vish searches
[11:13] <mpt> vish, zipper Depends on gnustep-base, so it's not as if it won't work when installed. It'll just look weird.
[11:14] <vish> mpt: yeah , it /does/ call on gnu-step during install, but seems to be an unnecessary change for something which we have better gnome alternatives
[11:15] <and471> devildante, I am trying to adjust the vertical padding in the addonview vbox and SC locks up is it is below 10
[11:15] <pitti> kenvandine: with one of the recent dist-upgrades I lost the messaging and sound indicators; me and session menu are still there; are we under some transition?
[11:15] <and471> is > if
[11:16] <mpt> vish, in the current market (i.e. no popular OS uses Gnustep as its DE), pretty much everyone who has Gnustep installed will know what Gnustep is (which is not true for Gnome or KDE). For that reason, it's reasonable for the description of a Gnustep package to mention Gnustep. It's informative for people who're using it, and a subtle discouragement for people who aren't.
[11:16] <and471> devildante, vertical spacing that should be
[11:17] <vish> mpt: agreed ,not mentioning GNUstep is not an option. mentioned the same thing in the bug too :)
[11:17] <seb128> chrisccoulson: hey
[11:17] <seb128> chrisccoulson: how are you?
[11:17] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128,  how are you?
[11:17] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm good thanks
[11:17] <chrisccoulson> did you have a good weekend?
[11:17] <devildante> and471: not occurring with me
[11:17] <and471> devildante, I also feel that the icon size should be 16 not 24
[11:18] <and471> devildante, go into appdetailsview_gtk.py and change
[11:18] <and471>         gtk.VBox.__init__(self, False, 8)
[11:18] <and471> nono
[11:18] <vish> mpt: but my concern was rather more about how we handle such cases [than the exact bug]
[11:18] <seb128> chrisccoulson: weekend was quite nice thanks
[11:18] <and471> change
[11:18] <and471>         gtk.VBox.__init__(self, False, 12)
[11:18] <and471> to
[11:18]  * vish still searching..
[11:18] <and471>         gtk.VBox.__init__(self, False, 8)
[11:18] <and471> and it freezes
[11:18] <and471> (that is in addonsview)
[11:19] <seb128> chrisccoulson: could you tell me what we need to ask to mozilla about translations permissions?
[11:19] <devildante> and471: it doesn't freeze with me
[11:19] <seb128> chrisccoulson: the workitem is not really clear to me
[11:19] <vish> oh , found it in the unresolved issues! \o/
[11:19] <and471> devildante, oh?
[11:19] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's not clear to me either, i need to speak to micahg about where that one came from
[11:19] <mpt> vish, I don't think you need to do anything in particular with them. In this case, you might want to reword the sentence so it looks more like "Zipper is a tool for {extracting and viewing archive files} in GNUstep" and less like "Zipper is a tool for extracting and viewing {archive files in GNUstep}". Other than that, it's fine.
[11:20] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i think we wanted to find out if the translations are covered by the same trademark restrictions as the branding
[11:20] <and471> devildante, anyway I'll leave that stuff to you, but I think it would look better with 16x16 icons, and less vertical spacing
[11:20] <chrisccoulson> so we could translate in launchpad
[11:20] <seb128> chrisccoulson: we don't translate firefox atm?
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - not really. apparently, we do during the development release, but revert back to shipping only upstream translations during the stable release
[11:21] <chrisccoulson> at least, that is my understanding of what we do
[11:21] <seb128> hum
[11:21] <vish> mpt: yeah , that sounds sensible , /me adds that to bug comment.. thanks.
[11:22] <seb128> chrisccoulson: seems buggy then, we don't test what we ship?
[11:22] <devildante> and471: okay :)
[11:23] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm not 100% sure whether thats really the case. perhaps we never put the launchpad translations in to the language packs
[11:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson: could you try to figure that as well while you figure if we can translate it?
[11:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson: thanks!
[11:23] <seb128> chrisccoulson: no hurry but would be nice to sort that this cycle
[11:25] <devildante> and471: 16x16 icons look like this: http://imgur.com/yMDUS.png (too small?)
[11:28] <and471> devildante, I think they looks better, the same height as the text that is next to them, mpt, kiwinote?
[11:29] <vish> devildante: do we need an image for the addon? how many addon have unique icons?
[11:30] <vish> seems to me that most of the add-ons are just using the generic icon
[11:31] <devildante> vish: some of the firefox add-ons are using icons
[11:31] <mpt> and471, I'm torn. The smaller ones make the add-ons section smaller overall, which is good. But the bigger ones reward those add-ons that do have custom icons. I'll leave that up to devildante. :-)
[11:32] <vish> devildante: thats 3 icons?  but would be better to know how many actually have icons..
[11:33] <devildante> kiwinote: any opinions on this?
[11:34] <devildante> vish: is it a real problem if we just let generic icons in there? (just asking)
[11:35] <mpt> vish, by showing icons for every add-on, we encourage more add-ons to have icons later, even if they don't have them now.
[11:36] <vish> devildante: an icon needs to help distinguish one object from another , if it is gonna be the same icon for all the objects , it just seems a visual overload..
[11:36] <devildante> vish, you heard mpt, now obey :p
[11:37]  * mpt tries out lp:~mmcg069/software-center/branches-for-installedview
[11:37] <vish> devildante: ;)  mpt has a lot of hopes , but i dont really expect we'd have icons for those any time soon
[11:39] <devildante> vish, mpt: why not show the app icon when not having an icon? (just a thought)
[11:41] <vish> devildante: still not an improvement, is it?  when every icon for add-on in a page is gonna be the same, icons need to be able to help differentiate.
[11:41] <baptistemm> hi there
[11:41] <mpt> devildante, because that would mean showing different icons for the same package in different contexts. E.g. sword-text-gerlut1545 would have a different icon when shown as an add-on for BibleTime as it would when shown as an add-on for Xiphos.
[11:42] <baptistemm> seb128: I didn't know you updated bluez to 4.69. did merge from the debian package?
[11:42] <devildante> vish, mpt, and471, kiwinote: what about 22x22: http://imgur.com/iX0UW.png
[11:42] <devildante> vish, mpt: you've got valid points :)
[11:42] <and471> devildante, I think a good compromise :)
[11:43] <devildante> 1-0
[11:44] <and471> mpt, sorry that actionbar thing is more complicated than I anticipated I'm stuck :(
[11:45] <and471> mpt, anything easier for a lazy guy? :)
[11:45] <devildante> and471: find a bug and fix it :p
[11:45] <mpt> and471, what part are you stuck on?
[11:45] <seb128> baptistemm, hey, why should I have done that?
[11:45] <mpt> Removing the code that hides it, changing the label, or changing the click action?
[11:45] <seb128> baptistemm, I just wanted to get the current version uploaded
[11:46] <and471> mpt, the variables that track the nonapps in the appview are not simple, they are hooked in multiple places
[11:46] <mpt> ah
[11:46] <and471> mpt, if you find me an easier one, I'll even write a test for it :)
[11:49] <mpt> and471, how about making the title in software item screens selectable and Copyable?
[11:49] <baptistemm> seb128: because that's nice to have the code near from the one in debian :)
[11:50] <devildante> mpt: is it okay to work on new features after FeatureFreeze (maintaining them in my branches of course)
[11:50] <mpt> devildante, sure, just keeping in mind that you'll be maintaining them until mvo either branches for 3.0 or starts his own "to-merge-later" branch
[11:51] <devildante> mpt: thanks :)
[11:56] <and471> mpt, done :)
[11:57] <seb128> baptistemm, you are welcome to work on that if you want
[11:57] <mpt> sweet
[11:57] <mpt> and471, and the same for the summary? :-)
[11:58] <and471> mpt, yup
[11:58] <baptistemm> seb128: actually I opened a bug for that with the merge request :)
[11:58] <mpt> and471, is "Edit" > "Copy" sensitive?
[11:59] <baptistemm> as I was offline I work on that during my break
[11:59] <seb128> baptistemm, you had a merge conflict and told dholbach you would not have time to fix it I think, that's why I did the update
[11:59] <and471> mpt, I shall work on it :)
[12:00] <mpt> thanks and471
[12:00] <devildante> does sabdfl spy us and then goes out? :p
[12:01] <and471> mpt, is there a bug for the selectable thing?
[12:01] <devildante> I lol'd at bugs.debian.org: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?archive=no&bug=591609
[12:01] <and471> devildante, shh dont tell anyone :P
[12:01] <devildante> happy birthday, Debian :)
[12:02] <devildante> and471: ;)
[12:02] <and471> devildante, hehe funny, but makes the page annoying to scroll :/
[12:02] <devildante> and471: True :p
[12:03] <mpt> and471, bug 447285 covers several parts of it, but not all parts (and even fixing one part is better than fixing none of it)
[12:03] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 447285 in linux (Ubuntu) "[Dell Inc. Inspiron 1721] suspend/resume failure (affects: 2) (heat: 16)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/447285
[12:03] <and471> mpt, maybe wrong bug no. :)
[12:03] <mpt> true, true
[12:04] <mpt> and471, I meant bug 477285
[12:04] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 477285 in software-center (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Can't copy text from software item descriptions (affects: 6) (heat: 34)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/477285
[12:06] <and471> mpt, should the version/license stuff be selectable?
[12:06] <mpt> and471, yes
[12:07] <kiwinote> and471: in my branch I have changed the version/license code, it should be selectable atm
[12:07] <and471> kiwinote, ah, but just that stuff?
[12:07] <kiwinote> and471: yep
[12:08] <and471> kiwinote, a simple label.set_selectable()?
[12:08] <kiwinote> and471: yep
[12:08] <and471> kiwinote, cool :)
[12:09] <kiwinote> and471: but the description stuff will be slightly harder I think, as it needs to be selectable as one field
[12:09] <and471> kiwinote, yeah I was looking at this
[12:09] <and471> kiwinote, I think we need to merge it as one label
[12:10] <and471> kiwinote, bullet points suffer as well
[12:10] <kiwinote> and471: yeah, that was my thought as well, so if it's simple / low-risk to change, then that would be great
[12:11] <and471> kiwinote, I will have an experiment :)
[12:11] <kiwinote> and471: great, thanks ;)
[12:26] <devildante> kiwinote, mpt, vish: feel free to tell me if there is any bug in my branch :)
[12:36] <kiwinote> devildante: those changes you have been making look quite sweet
[12:37] <devildante> kiwinote: thanks :)
[12:37] <kiwinote> devildante: now that the icon size for addons is smaller the padding can be slightly less
[12:37] <kiwinote> devildante: it also seems that the padding between the title and the pkgname has increased as well..
[12:40] <kiwinote> devildante: you may want to have a look at the accessibility stuff as well. There is an example of how to do this in the package_info code. You can use the program 'orca' to get the interface read out to you. At the moment it doesn't say anything usefull when you tab to the addons part.
[12:41] <devildante> kiwinote: okay, will take care of it :)
[12:42] <kiwinote> devildante: yeah, it's slightly confusing at first, but I sat down the other day and kind of understand it now, and the result was the code in the info table
[12:45] <kiwinote> devildante: and just to be fussy we have a PackageStatusBar(), so renaming the AddonsStateBar() to AddonsStatusBar() may be a nice idea ;)
[12:45] <devildante> kiwinote: okidoki
[12:48]  * devildante doesn't know how to make orca work :p does /me needs to log out?
[12:50]  * devildante logs out
[12:52] <kiwinote> mpt: just saw that you had updated the gdebi part of the spec, looks good!
[12:53] <mpt> kiwinote, sorry that I didn't get that done much much earlier
[12:53] <kiwinote> mpt: for the pkgs in the main archive would the text be eg "Universe" has a newer version or "Ubuntu has a newer verions?
[12:54] <kiwinote> mpt: np
[12:54] <mpt> kiwinote, just "Ubuntu". We shouldn't be exposing the terms "Main", "Universe" etc anywhere
[12:55] <kiwinote> mpt: ok, thanks (we do use those terms visibly in the use this source part)
[12:56] <mpt> kiwinote, ah, right, but there we don't have much of a choice. :-)
[12:56] <AnAnt> Hello, I am trying to fix LP: #613304, how can I test the fix (I am using lucid now)
[12:56] <kiwinote> mpt: yeah, indeed
[12:56] <mpt> bug 613304
[12:56] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 613304 in zekr (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Zekr SC logo is very low resolution (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/613304
[12:57] <mpt> AnAnt, thanks for working on that. I don't know the answer, but if no-one else here does you could try in #ubuntu-motu.
[12:57] <AnAnt> I was told that the Software Center hackers are here
[12:58] <kiwinote> AnAnt: hi, what precisely is it that you have changed, did you add a new icon to your pkg, or did you increase the size of an existing one?
[12:59] <kiwinote> AnAnt: if you just replaced an existing one, you should be able to replace the old one in /usr/share/app-install/icons to test if s-c picks it up
[12:59] <AnAnt> kiwinote: Hello, there are 32,48,128 & 256px icons already, I just created symlinks to them in /usr/share/pixmaps/<size>/apps
[13:00] <AnAnt> kiwinote: and chanchged the desktop file
[13:00] <AnAnt> kiwinote: erm, I'm not sure which one will be taken
[13:01] <kiwinote> AnAnt: If you have modified the desktop file then for testing you can replace the old desktop file in /usr/share/app-install/desktop with the new one
[13:02] <kiwinote> AnAnt: s-c should read those desktop files, let me just look to see if you need to update the database first though
[13:04] <AnAnt> kiwinote: In .desktop file, you can just name the icon
[13:04] <AnAnt> kiwinote: ie. I did this: Icon=zekr
[13:04] <AnAnt> ok
[13:04] <devildante> kiwinote: orca doesn't want to work and make my whole desktop freeze :p Can you take care of this for me?
[13:04] <kiwinote> devildante: yep, will do
[13:04] <devildante> kiwinote: thanks :)
[13:06] <AnAnt> kiwinote: hmmm, it is still bad
[13:07] <kiwinote> AnAnt: yep, if you rename the icon in the desktop file and run 'sudo update-software-center' then software-center will pick up the changes
[13:07] <AnAnt> ok
[13:07] <kiwinote> AnAnt: for the pkg that means just make sure that the desktop file refers to the correct icon and that the icons are available
[13:08] <AnAnt> WARNING:root:error processing: /usr/share/app-install/desktop/zekr.desktop No option 'X-AppInstall-Package' in section: 'Desktop Entry'
[13:08] <AnAnt> no icon now
[13:09] <kiwinote> AnAnt: the desktop files there are slightly modified versions of the original desktop files
[13:10] <kiwinote> AnAntL for testing you can just change the 'icon' line of the zekr desktop file that was already there
[13:11] <kiwinote> AnAnt: the desktop files in that folder are generated automatically and contain some extra magic
[13:12] <AnAnt> wonderful !
[13:12] <AnAnt> it worked
[13:12] <AnAnt> thanks
[13:13] <kiwinote> AnAnt: I hope this makes sense a bit: so for the pkg itself you just update the original desktop file and make sure that the icons are available.
[13:14] <kiwinote> AnAnt: just before the beta release the 'special' desktop files will get updated, and from that time on s-c will show the correct icon
[13:15] <kiwinote> AnAnt: thanks a lot for working on this!
[13:16] <and471> AnAnt, thanks :(
[13:16] <and471> AnAnt, eh :)
[13:16] <AnAnt> no problem, I am co-maintaining the package in Debian actually
[13:18] <kiwinote> and471: btw, how is the desctiption selection getting on, is it easily doable, or are you having to rewrite large chunks of code?
[13:19] <and471> kiwinote, I tried at it but I couldn't get it working
[13:19] <and471> kiwinote, I don't know whether large chunks need to be edited, just the right chunks and I couldn't find them :)
[13:19] <kiwinote> and471: ok, no probs, my guess was that it wouldn't be simple ;)
[13:32] <kiwinote> devildante, and471: if one of you is idling atm I have a simple-ish bug that can be fixed in a new branch
[13:32] <devildante> kiwinote: gimme I'm bored :p
[13:32] <and471> kiwinote, shoot
[13:33] <and471> kiwinote, depending on how simple-ish it is, I may elect to give it to devildante (read as if it is too hard, i will bug off) XD
[13:33] <kiwinote> devildante, and471: when universe is disabled and you browse to a universe app then you get a 'use this source button'. If you click this button and cancel the policykit alert then the button stays disabled
[13:33] <kiwinote> hehe, sorry guys, only have one bug at a time :(
[13:33] <and471> devildante, you can have it, I'm going to watch some TV :)
[13:34] <devildante> and471: okay :)
[13:34] <kiwinote> shouldn't be that hard.. (hopefully)
[13:34] <kiwinote> devildante: in a separate branch from your add-ons branch if you can please
[13:34] <devildante> kiwinote: np
[13:38] <devildante> kiwinote: is there a bug filed for this?
[13:38] <kiwinote> devildante: nope
[13:42] <kenvandine> pitti, did you lose the indicators or is the icon just missing?
[13:42] <pitti> kenvandine: I lost them; they aren't in ps ux
[13:42] <kenvandine> pitti, that was broken for unity on friday, but fixed on friday too
[13:42] <pitti> $ ps ux|grep indic
[13:42] <pitti> martin    1940  0.0  0.4 364736 15652 ?        S    08:12   0:00 /usr/lib/indicator-applet/indicator-applet-session --oaf-activate-iid=OAFIID:GNOME_FastUserSwitchApplet_Factory --oaf-ior-fd=33
[13:42] <pitti> martin    1946  0.0  0.1 144896  5512 ?        S    08:12   0:00 /usr/lib/indicator-me/indicator-me-service
[13:42] <pitti> martin    1948  0.0  0.1 143720  5500 ?        S    08:12   0:00 /usr/lib/indicator-session/indicator-session-service
[13:42] <pitti> martin   25303  0.0  0.0  14144   884 pts/2    S+   14:42   0:00 grep --color=auto indic
[13:42] <kenvandine> /usr/lib/indicator-messages/indicator-messages-service
[13:42] <kenvandine> run that
[13:42] <kenvandine> what does it say?
[13:43] <pitti> kenvandine: and if I run /usr/lib/indicator-messages/indicator-messages-service, it just finishes with
[13:43] <pitti> (process:25306): libindicator-WARNING **: No watchers, service timing out.
[13:43] <pitti> ** (process:25306): WARNING **: Shutting down service!
[13:43] <kenvandine> humm
[13:43] <pitti> well, there's more output of course
[13:43] <kenvandine> yeah, but not useful
[13:43] <kenvandine> ok
[13:43] <kenvandine> not a known issue... please file
[13:43] <pitti> kenvandine: http://paste.ubuntu.com/478830/
[13:43] <kenvandine> i'll get ted to look at it when he shows up :)
[13:43] <pitti> kenvandine: ok, will do
[13:43] <kenvandine> thx
[13:43] <pitti> I'll try it in a guest session, too
[13:44] <kenvandine> pitti, unity or desktop?
[13:44] <pitti> kenvandine: standard maverick alpha-3 gnome
[13:44] <pitti> plus daily updates
[13:44] <kenvandine> ok
[13:55] <seb128> pitti, what issue do you have?
[13:56] <pitti> seb128: message and sound indicator don't start
[13:56] <pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/478830/
[13:56] <pitti> they just claim there are "no listeners"
[13:56] <seb128> pitti, do you have an indicator applet?
[13:57] <pitti> me-menu and session indicators work
[13:57] <pitti> seb128: yes
[13:57] <pitti> oh, wait
[13:57] <seb128> pitti, session is another applet
[13:57] <pitti> indicator-applet-session != indicator-applet
[13:57] <seb128> yes
[13:57] <pitti> I thought it was all just one
[13:57] <seb128> no
[13:57] <pitti> hm, how did I lose it?
[13:57] <seb128> it might have crashed
[13:58] <seb128> and you didn't click on reload
[13:58] <seb128> there was a crasher friday
[13:58] <pitti> right, some days ago it kept crashing
[13:58] <pitti> ah
[13:58] <pitti> yippie, it's back
[13:58] <pitti> thanks, and sorry for the confusion!
[13:58]  * pitti hugs seb128
[13:58] <seb128> or you were typing when it crashed and dismissed the dialog
[13:58]  * seb128 hugs pitti
[13:59] <pitti> now rhythmbox has a broken icon in the soud indicator, but that I can live with :-P
[13:59] <seb128> right, that's due to the libindicator changes
[13:59] <seb128> but that was a crash or that :p
[14:00] <pitti> so session and me indicators are not "quite" indicators?
[14:00] <seb128> they are
[14:00] <seb128> they are not applications indicators
[14:01] <seb128> they are system indicators
[14:01] <seb128> the first ones are equivalent to gtkstatusicons the second ones are applets rather
[14:03] <seb128> pitti, the applets are tweaked to load specific indicators
[14:03] <rickspencer3> good morning all
[14:03] <seb128> hey rickspencer3
[14:03] <seb128> how are you?
[14:03] <kenvandine> good morning rickspencer3!
[14:03] <seb128> hey kenvandine
[14:03] <kenvandine> hey seb128
[14:04] <seb128> kenvandine, can you update your libgwibber spec to postpone the apis you will not get this cycle?
[14:04] <kenvandine> seb128, i think that is done
[14:04] <kenvandine> there aren't any with a milestone left
[14:04] <seb128> well they still show on http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/maverick/canonical-desktop-team.html
[14:05] <seb128> you have 31 workitems remaining
[14:05] <kenvandine> hummm
[14:05] <pitti> hey rickspencer3
[14:05] <seb128> which is almost as many as everybody else added in the team ;-)
[14:05] <kenvandine> i guess that shows all of them, even without a milestone
[14:05] <seb128> yes since the spec is milestoned for maverick
[14:05] <kenvandine> i'll specifically mark them all as postponed then :)
[14:05] <seb128> thanks
[14:05] <kenvandine> np
[14:06] <seb128> to be fair a quite amount of those items are the gwibber testsuite as well
[14:06] <seb128> but those a small items and you have time for that
[14:09] <rickspencer3> jeez
[14:10] <rickspencer3> this New App thingy jumped the rails
[14:26] <pitti> rickspencer3: indeed..
[14:26] <rickspencer3> pitti, I don't actually think many people are going to use it in Maverick, so I think all will be well eventually
[14:27] <pitti> rickspencer3: seems the main point of dispute is why not to use backports
[14:27] <rickspencer3> pitti, well, there are two parts
[14:27] <pitti> I don't think backports is the right answer here, since those packages aren't meant to be part of Ubuntu, but it keeps coming back
[14:27] <rickspencer3> the implementation (use backports)
[14:28] <rickspencer3> but the other part is related but separate
[14:28] <rickspencer3> do we really want to stretch to do more reviews of apps, and why change at all?
[14:49]  * kiwinote is delighted at the thought that multitouch may actually work. Time to test it out!
[14:58] <seb128> re
[14:58] <seb128> pitti, do we have retracers atm or are they still down on db corruption?
[14:58] <pitti> seb128: still down, I'm afraid
[14:59] <seb128> rickspencer3, the issue with backports is that it doesn't work, you can only backport the current unstable version
[14:59] <seb128> you don't want to ship unstable series to stable users
[14:59] <rickspencer3> seb128, well ...
[14:59] <pitti> rickspencer3: backports is not just implementation, it's an incompatible concept IMHO
[14:59] <seb128> like maverick version use new glib apis etc
[14:59] <rickspencer3> I think the root of the problem is inadequate communication on my part
[14:59] <rickspencer3> it's a moot point now, the implementation is done
[15:00] <rickspencer3> (for Maverick)
[15:00] <seb128> not really a miscommunication I think
[15:00] <seb128> Laney had the same concerns at UDS
[15:00] <rickspencer3> seb128, well, jono followed up with Laney quite a bit afterward
[15:01] <rickspencer3> but in hindsight, I should have triggered this discussion on ubuntu-devel after the implementation decisions were made
[15:01] <rickspencer3> some of the problems are not about the specific implementation, though
[15:01] <rickspencer3> some of the objections are about changing the very nature of universe
[15:02] <rickspencer3> I thank Laney for his reasoned and well written summary, along with his willingness to help in Maverick
[15:03] <seb128> right
[15:03] <seb128> not easy to define what ubuntu is or should be
[15:04] <seb128> ie a platform only or aiming at distributing any software you can get
[15:23] <seb128> pitti, did you see my retracer question before?
[15:24] <pitti> seb128: i answered 12 secs after that; they are still down, I'm afraid
[15:24] <seb128> sorry I missed that reply somewhat
[15:25] <seb128> pitti, still due to that db issue?
[15:25] <seb128> pitti, do you understand what's going on?
[15:25] <seb128> did the db got corrupted? do we have any backup or way to regenerate it?
[15:25] <pitti> seb128: argh, no, it's something else this time
[15:25] <pitti> ImportError: No module named launchpadlib.errors
[15:25] <seb128> urg
[15:26] <pitti> seb128: apparently some python modules were upgraded, and something interacted badly with p-central/support and symlinks
[15:26] <seb128> those are not using a local checkout?
[15:26] <pitti> seb128: last time that happened I purged and reinstalled the affected packages
[15:26] <pitti> seb128: no, they are using the maverick packages for launchpadlib etc.
[15:26] <pitti> seb128: local checkout is just for the "outside" crash-digger and python dupe detection
[15:26] <seb128> ok
[15:27] <seb128> pitti, if you tell me what to do I can have a go at it
[15:27] <pitti> seb128: log into the chroots, try python -c 'import apport', this shold trigger the ImportError
[15:27] <pitti> seb128: then keep reinstalling python-launchpadlib, python-lazr* and what not until it works again
[15:28] <seb128> ok
[15:28] <seb128> will have a try, thanks
[15:28] <pitti> and once it works, apt-get clean and save
[15:28] <pitti> seb128: merci
[15:28] <seb128> de rien ;-)
[15:28] <pitti> seb128: could still be the db issue underneath, of course
[15:28] <pitti> seb128: I already dumped and recreated it, so it must be something in the actual data; might be a sqlite bug, not sure
[15:28] <pitti> we might need to remove a malformed dup db entry or so
[15:28] <seb128> ok, I will let you know if I figure something
[15:29] <pitti> right, amd64 retracer crashed on db
[15:29] <pitti> oh, it's right in init_duplicate_db()
[15:29] <pitti> so it sohld be reproducible locally
[15:29] <pitti> damn bug
[15:36] <dobey> did the xorg driver abi change recently?
[15:38] <dobey> it would appear so :/
[15:42] <seb128> dobey, yes, a week ago or so
[15:42] <seb128> dobey, why?§
[15:43] <dobey> seb128: because i just upgraded and x wont start
[15:43] <dobey> nvidia driver is apparently incompatible :(
[15:49] <seb128> seems the xorg-edger has a newer version which work, that's from IRC discussions the other day
[15:49] <seb128> check maybe with #ubuntu-x
[15:56] <dobey> seb128: i'd be happy to just downgrade X for now, but i just get 'release not found' when i try to :(
[16:02] <devildante> kiwinote: got time?
[16:02] <kiwinote> devildante: yep
[16:03] <devildante> kiwinote: I wasn't able to reproduce your bug, but I did found another bug :p
[16:03] <kiwinote> devildante: aha, which one did you find?
[16:03] <devildante> kiwinote: when clicking on "use this source", it wasn't set to not sensitive, so you could still click on it!
[16:03] <devildante> kiwinote: I just fixed it now :)
[16:04] <kiwinote> devildante: hm, that seems to be the opposite of the bug I had
[16:04] <devildante> kiwinote: yeah :p
[16:06] <kiwinote> devildante: can you push the branch?
[16:06] <devildante> kiwinote: of course!
[16:06] <kiwinote> devildante: thanks, then I can attempt to work out how we can both experience the opposite bug ;)
[16:07] <dobey> seb128: ah, seems telling the server to ignore abi works
[16:10] <devildante> kiwinote: pushed! it's the fix-use-source one :)
[16:11] <kiwinote> devildante: great, was just looking at it
[16:14] <vish> devildante: did you see mpt's comment..  maybe we can rename update-manager as well this cycle? ;)
[16:15] <devildante> vish: yes, I've seen it
[16:15] <devildante> vish: I think we should
[16:15] <devildante> vish: yay, more work to do!
[16:16] <vish> devildante: when is mvo coming back? i guess we cant do it without him ;)
[16:16]  * vish forgot..
[16:17] <devildante> vish: meh, he said he'll be in vacation for a week
[16:18] <devildante> mpt: ping - do you think we should rename update-manager as well for this cycle? (looking for opinions)
[16:19] <and471> devildante, why is that?
[16:19] <mpt> devildante, I don't see a problem with it, but I'm not familiar with how package renames relate to the various freezes
[16:20] <devildante> and471: mpt suggested to rename update-notifier to software-updater-daemon because we want to rename update-manager to software-updater in the future
[16:21] <and471> devildante, mpt, I can see the reasoning but I wonder whether this should be for maverick+1
[16:21] <devildante> mpt: np, was just looking for opinions - but we'll have to ask mvo once he returns
[16:25] <and471> seb128, could you clarify? <mpt> [...]but I'm not familiar with how package renames relate to the various freezes
[16:25] <seb128> and471, why do you need to rename something?
[16:25] <devildante> seb128: <devildante> and471: mpt suggested to rename update-notifier to software-updater-daemon because we want to rename update-manager to software-updater in the future
[16:25] <and471> seb128, I'm just the messenger :)
[16:25] <seb128> and471, is that the source name or the ui one?
[16:26] <and471> seb128, sorry I don't understand
[16:26] <seb128> does it make any practical difference?
[16:26] <devildante> seb128: well, the UI one, but we could do both
[16:26] <seb128> and471, do you want to rename the tarball or is that changing UI strings?
[16:26] <and471> seb128, ah now I understand
[16:26] <and471> seb128, sorry :)
[16:26] <seb128> well ui and string freeze is next week
[16:26] <seb128> so you can still do that
[16:31] <vish> mpt: and471: devildante:  Bug #618723  ;)
[16:31] <ubot2> vish: Bug 618723 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/618723 is private
[16:32] <devildante> fail
[16:32] <vish> gah!
[16:32] <vish> devildante: its public , but the bot is stupid ;p
[16:32] <and471> oops
[16:32] <devildante> fail means fail, admit it vish :p
[16:32] <vish> devildante: lol!
[16:33] <and471> devildante, do you want to work on it? I am currently updating some shotwell stuff but if you want I can do it afterwards
[16:33] <and471> mpt, wow those mockups look good - is anybody making it happen?
[16:34] <devildante> and471: I'd want you to do it, I don't know enough u-m code to know if I won't break something
[16:34] <mpt> and471, which mockups?
[16:34] <and471> mpt, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdateHandling
[16:34]  * and471 realised his question to mpt was a bit general XD
[16:34] <mpt> and471, devildante has done a couple of parts. I'm not aware of anyone else working on it.
[16:34] <and471> devildante, you have a branch?
[16:35] <devildante> and471: some of it is already in trunk
[16:35] <and471> devildante, oh are you not starting from scratch?
[16:35] <devildante> and471: the software-properties part is in the updates-redesign branch, but FF has passed
[16:36] <devildante> and471: I mean that I worded on some of it, and it has been merged in trunk
[16:36] <devildante> worked*
[16:36] <and471> devildante, and the mockups under https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdateHandling#Launching
[16:36] <and471> ?
[16:36] <micahg> chrisccoulson: seb128: the work item for translation permission I think was for including translations that upstream doesn't have through LP
[16:37] <devildante> and471: I think we're pretty close to what's in there
[16:37] <and471> devildante, close to starting or finishing :)
[16:37] <devildante> and471: there remain a couple of bits, but that will have to wait for 11.04
[16:37] <devildante> and471: finishing
[16:38] <and471> devildante, and where is that stuff?
[16:38] <devildante> and471: oh, wait nvm
[16:38] <devildante> and471: the big part in there is that it's not in a separate dialog
[16:39] <seb128> gra, kenvandine just conflicted with pending rb changes uploaded to the ppa
[16:39] <devildante> and471: everything is occurring in the main window (in the mockups)
[16:39] <and471> devildante, yup
[16:39] <kenvandine> seb128, whoops
[16:40] <seb128> kenvandine, no worry I will merge when ronoc is ready with the mpris2 changes
[16:40] <devildante> and471: this is gonna take some work, because as of now, the install backends are the one to display GUI related to transactions
[16:40] <seb128> kenvandine, thanks for doing some sponsoring ;-)
[16:41] <kenvandine> :)
[16:43] <and471> devildante, so for those mockups I spoke about, has any work started on them?
[16:44] <devildante> and471: no, and likely won't be until we're approaching the 11.04 cycle
[16:44] <and471> devildante, see when I look at hem I really want to start on it :)
[16:44] <devildante> and471: go for it, just keep in mind you'll have to maintain your branches
[16:45] <and471> devildante, sure, I won't be able to do the apt/backend stuff but PyGTK and I are good friends :)
[16:45] <devildante> and471: oh, and leave me the "expanded updates" bit, I too wanna work on it :p
[16:45] <asac> Riddell: there? can you upload qws again (it was rejected by jdstrand saying that we should produce it from normal qt sources) and state that you want a separate source until we are confident we can ship all from one source?
[16:45] <kenvandine> seb128_, can you sponsor lp:~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/maverick/libgwibber/ubuntu ?
[16:45] <and471> devildante, are you able to do the apt/backend stuff?
[16:45] <seb128_> kenvandine, ok
[16:45] <kenvandine> that is needed for the indicator-me port
[16:45] <kenvandine> thx
[16:46] <kenvandine> it also drops gir-repository :)
[16:46] <asac> Riddell: if you say you dont want it in the archive at all its fine. we just need to know ;)
[16:46] <devildante> and471: yeah, I think for now, we just have to separate backend from gui
[16:46] <Riddell> asac: I can do yes
[16:46] <and471> devildante, definitely
[16:46] <asac> Riddell: so this reject wasn't coordinated with jdstrand?
[16:47] <and471> devildante, I might start on that when I have finished this shotwell stuff so vish stops bugging me XD
[16:47] <Riddell> asac: he rejected it, I want it in the archive, and this is my prefered way since it means the package doesn't cause me any hassle, although I can understand his view for sure
[16:47] <devildante> and471: okay :)
[16:47] <asac> Riddell: maybe add a line to changelog "acked and sponsored by: Riddell" ? ... just so that archive admins see its official?
[16:47] <asac> or approve on your own ;)
[16:47] <asac> or seb128 is a good click through approver too ;)
[16:47] <asac> Riddell: thanks!
[16:48] <Riddell> asac: I'll file a bug and point the changelog at it
[16:51] <asac_> ok thanks Riddell
[16:51] <Riddell> asac: I'll put your name down for an ack too :)
[16:52] <asac_> yeah
[16:52] <vish> and471: shotwell!!!! ;p
[16:52] <asac_> Riddell: i can also upload the package so you can approve ;) lol
[16:52] <asac_> what a mess
[16:53] <asac_> i am reading the irc log now
[16:53] <asac_> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/08/13/%23ubuntu-devel.html
[16:53] <and471> vish, yes sir....
[16:53] <and471> :)
[16:56] <and471> vish, I have done the stuff upstream, tomorrow I shall give you a list of icons that still need to be done (can be done for next cycle) so that I can bug you about it now :P
[16:56] <seb128> kenvandine, hum, you have upload rights for gwibber but not libgwibber?
[16:57] <seb128> kenvandine, can you ask cjwatson to give you those?
[16:58] <kenvandine> sure
[16:58] <kenvandine> libgwibber is still in universe
[16:58] <kenvandine> i figured it would change when that goes to main
[16:59] <seb128> gwibber is not using it?
[16:59] <and471> devildante, for these morphing windows, do we need to do some magic, or are we just hiding and showing?
[16:59] <kenvandine> seb128, no
[16:59] <seb128> oh ok
[16:59] <kenvandine> seb128, it depends on gwibber... a future version of the gwibber UI will require it
[17:00] <seb128> ok, kick session restart then call
[17:00] <seb128> ok, makes sense
[17:00] <seb128> brb
[17:06] <dobey> kenvandine: you convinced segphault to rewrite the UI in vala or something? :)
[17:08] <devildante> and471: that's the problem, I don't know, ask mpt
[17:09] <and471> devildante, as if by magic ^ :)
[17:10] <kenvandine> not yet :)
[17:10] <kenvandine> dobey, ^^
[17:10] <mpt> devildante, I'm looking at your add-ons branch again now
[17:10] <devildante> mpt: <and471> devildante, for these morphing windows, do we need to do some magic, or are we just hiding and showing?
[17:10] <devildante> mpt: thanks :)
[17:10] <mpt> and471, ask bratsche. I think the code for morphing windows lives in libido now.
[17:11] <mpt> ah, bratsche isn't online
[17:11] <and471> mpt, hehe I was looking for him and came to the same conclusion
[17:12] <devildante> mpt: libido?
[17:12] <seb128> dobey, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntuone-client/+bug/618285
[17:12] <ubot2> Ubuntu bug 618285 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Typo in one translatable string (affects: 3) (dups: 2) (heat: 24)" [Undecided,New]
[17:13] <mpt> devildante, https://code.launchpad.net/ido
[17:13] <and471> davidbarth, hi, did any code ever come of this? https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/dx-karmic-morphing-windows
[17:14] <devildante> mpt
[17:14] <devildante> mpt: it's in C, so I dismiss it :P
[17:15] <mpt> haha
[17:16] <devildante> mpt: what do you think of the add-ons branch? could you accelerate the ffe process? (just asking)
[17:16] <mpt> devildante, for something without add-ons, "Total size:" correctly shows up all the time. But for something with add-ons, it shows up only when I check/uncheck the checkboxes.
[17:17] <tedg> and471, lp:ido
[17:17] <devildante> mpt: isn't this the correct behavior?
[17:17] <and471> tedg, thanks, mpt, devildante, I think I found it in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~canonical-dx-team/ido/trunk/annotate/head%3A/src/idomessagedialog.c
[17:17] <tedg> and471, You kinda need to do the work with IDO as it has the timeline in it as well.  Which you'll need to do the animation.
[17:17] <devildante> and471: meh, I did nothing
[17:18] <and471> tedg, so we need libido? can we not just do an incremental size_request?
[17:18] <mpt> devildante, how would it be? :-) It's showing less information, by default, for something with add-ons than for something without.
[17:19] <tedg> and471, Yeah, that's what you want to do, but the timeline makes it both simple and runs in the idle loop nicely.
[17:19] <and471> tedg, ah okay :)
[17:19] <and471> tedg, can we access this from python?
[17:19] <tedg> and471, Uhm, there's no reason, but I don't think someone has setup introspection in IDO yet.  It's on the TODO list.
[17:20] <tedg> I mean, there's no reason you couldn't -- just work needs to be done.
[17:20] <dobey> seb128: i'll bug people to get the fix in for the release this week
[17:20] <seb128> dobey, thanks
[17:20] <and471> tedg, you reckon it will be done by 11.04?
[17:20] <bilalakhtar> kenvandine: Thanks a lot for the upload!
[17:20] <kenvandine> np
[17:20] <kenvandine> thx for the patch :)
[17:20] <devildante> mpt: "Total size" shows for me if there is addons - but only when the app is installed (does it make sense to include the removal size of the app?)
[17:21] <seb128> kenvandine, do you have libgwibber python bindings?
[17:21] <mpt> devildante, ah, sorry, my mistake
[17:21] <tedg> and471, Oh, definitely.  Too many Vala and Python programmers that'll kill us if we don't :)
[17:21] <and471> tedg, hehe :)
[17:21] <kenvandine> seb128, no... but i have tested with introspection
[17:21] <kenvandine> seb128, works well :)
[17:21] <seb128> kenvandine, I'm a bit nervous with introspection abi changing still though
[17:21] <kenvandine> there is even a python example in libgwibber which uses it
[17:21] <and471> devildante, mpt, I will try to do some preliminary work on the gui side of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdateHandling#Launching
[17:21] <devildante> you better do it, tedg, or it will be a personal affair :p
[17:22] <devildante> and471: go for it :)
[17:22] <kenvandine> i had generated python bindings but dropped them when pygi got merged into gobject
[17:22] <and471> devildante, mpt, and when we get libido python bindings for 11.04 I shall hook them in hopefully
[17:22] <devildante> and471: all right!
[17:22] <and471> devildante, mpt: tedg promised me personally (even if he didn't realise it) XD
[17:22] <mpt> devildante, ideally I'd like installed items to show "Total size: {Y} on disk ({Z} available)", but that's not critical for merging
[17:22] <kenvandine> seb128, i could pretty easily bring that back
[17:23] <kenvandine> but would prefer not
[17:23] <seb128> kenvandine, doesn't seem worth the effort
[17:23] <seb128> I guess introspection changes should not lead to client changes
[17:23] <kenvandine> i wish mono could use introspection
[17:23] <seb128> just rebuild of the typelibs
[17:23] <kenvandine> yeah
[17:23] <seb128> let's see how that goes
[17:23] <kenvandine> which is a pain... but not code changes
[17:23] <devildante> mpt: You haven't learned your lesson, have you? :p like mvo and I said, there is no way we could count the total size if it spans on different partitions (just saying)
[17:24] <mpt> devildante, that information is from the package. Synaptic already displays it
[17:24] <mpt> (Installed-Size:)
[17:25] <devildante> mpt: I meant if the user has /usr, /opt, /, /var ... partitions. We can't know if we'll have enough space on them
[17:25] <seb128> kenvandine, bug #611263 about the icon btw
[17:25] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 611263 in rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store "Ubuntu One in Rhythmbox - both the Music Store and the 'Link to a song' function have the same icon (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/611263
[17:25] <kenvandine> thx
[17:25] <mpt> devildante, ok, I'll remove the "{Z} available"
[17:29] <mpt> devildante, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter?action=diff&rev2=423&rev1=422
[17:30] <seb128> kenvandine, should I just sponsor libgwibber for now until that's sort with cjwatson?
[17:30] <devildante> mpt: thx :)
[17:31] <kenvandine> seb128, yeah
[17:31] <kenvandine> seb128, please do
[17:31] <mpt> devildante, in the screen for Accessories > ACE, the Qcomicbook add-on has an extremely long label
[17:32] <devildante> mpt: oh god!
[17:32] <mpt> devildante, can you ellipsize it just before the "("?
[17:32] <devildante> mpt: wait, I got some idea ;)
[17:33] <mpt> devildante, e.g. "Qcomicbook is a view for comic book archives (cbz, cbr ... (qcomicbook)"
[17:34] <devildante> mpt: so you want me to stop at a specified number of characters?
[17:34] <mpt> So that (a) the package name is always visible, and (b) the screen doesn't scrolls horizontally
[17:34] <mpt> scroll, rather
[17:34] <mpt> devildante, ideally, stop at the edge of the window, no sooner and no later :-)
[17:34] <devildante> mpt: is line wrap acceptable?
[17:35] <mpt> devildante, that would be better
[17:35] <mpt> (This is a bug in qcomicbook in that its description doesn't have a synopsis, but USC should cater for weird data anyway)
[17:36] <mpt> oh, hang on, it *does* have a synopsis
[17:36] <mpt> ok, one bug at a time
[17:39] <mpt> and471, great, thank you
[17:40] <kenvandine> seb128, libgwibber MIR bug 618757
[17:40] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 618757 in libgwibber (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libgwibber (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618757
[17:41] <seb128> kenvandine, you might want to ping asac rather ;-)
[17:41] <kenvandine> seb128, that was just FYI :)
[17:41] <seb128> k
[17:41] <seb128> thanks ;-)
[17:41] <seb128> libgwibber uploaded btw
[17:41] <kenvandine> thx!
[17:42] <kenvandine> asac, if you have the time... could you look at bug 618757 ?
[17:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 618757 in libgwibber (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libgwibber (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618757
[17:43]  * kenvandine -> lunch
[17:53] <mpt> devildante, got it figured out?
[18:04] <devildante> mpt: no, line wrap does strange things, and does not cater to the whole window
[18:07] <devildante> mpt: do you know if there are many packages that are like this? If not, we should rather leave the code as-is and fix those packages
[18:08] <mpt> devildante, well, we're on the third level of bugginess here
[18:08] <devildante> mpt: ?
[18:09] <mpt> devildante, the second level is that qcomicbook's synopsis is actually much shorter: it's only "qt viewer for comic book archives (cbr/cbz/cba/cbg/cbb)"
[18:09] <mpt> devildante, for some reason the code that calculates the add-on title is taking more than that first line from the description.
[18:10] <devildante> mpt: in fact, qcomicbook as a separate app has the same summary/synopsis as when it is an add-on
[18:10] <mpt> devildante, you can see the same bug on the screen for Qcomicbook itself.
[18:10] <mpt> right
[18:11] <mpt> So, maybe you could leave fixing that for a separate branch :-)
[18:11] <devildante> mpt: what is in fault: my code, the appdetails code, or a database typo?
[18:11] <mpt> I don't know
[18:11] <devildante> mpt: so I leave it as-is?
[18:11] <mpt> From "apt-cache show" it looks like a perfectly normal package description to me.
[18:12] <mpt> devildante, the first level is that as far as I can tell, qcomicbook shouldn't be showing up as an add-on for ACE in the first place. :-)
[18:12] <mpt> It's not a Recommends: or Suggests: of unace
[18:13] <devildante> mpt: but qcomicbook Recommends unace, and we search for reverse recommends (as per the spec)
[18:13] <mpt> and its not marked as Enhances: unace
[18:14] <mpt> devildante, I don't think it says anything about reverse recommends
[18:14] <davidbarth> and471: hi, no sorry, not in Maverick, cody had some prototype running but didn't get enough time land that this cycle
[18:16] <and471> davidbarth, ok thanks, are we looking at maverick+1?
[18:16] <devildante> mpt: "X is the only known package that Recommends A"
[18:17] <mpt> devildante, unace does not Recommend qcomicbook
[18:18] <devildante> mpt: whoopsie, got it wrong
[18:18] <devildante> mpt: so my implementation was wrong all along!
[18:21] <mpt> heh
[18:22] <devildante> mpt: it's fixed now, but I can't believe I'm stupid
[18:22]  * devildante hides and cries :(
[18:22]  * mpt hugs devildante 
[18:22]  * devildante smiles and hugs back mpt :)
[18:24] <mpt> devildante, pushed your branch?
[18:24] <devildante> pushing...
[18:25] <devildante> mpt: pushed :)
[18:29] <mpt> devildante, the size calculation seems to be causing the whole window to seize up for ~2 seconds whenever I go into a software item screen
[18:29] <mpt> Is there anyway to make it happen in the background or something?
[18:30] <devildante> mpt: the problem is it's already in the background :P
[18:30] <devildante> mpt: gobject.idle_add ftw
[18:32] <mpt> devildante, would it improve things to show "Total size: Calculating…" and then replace "Calculating…" with the size once it arrives?
[18:32] <devildante> mpt: will test that
[18:33] <devildante> mpt, what do you mean by "seize up"? (still have to perfect my english :p)
[18:33] <mpt> devildante, freeze, become immovable
[18:33] <devildante> mpt: oh
[18:34] <mpt> Try scrolling with the mousewheel as soon as you go into a software item screen, for example
[18:37] <devildante> mpt: fixed :)
[18:37] <mpt> devildante, the only other problem I see at the moment is that there's not enough padding above the add-ons section.
[18:38] <devildante> argh, you and your padding issues :p
[18:40] <devildante> mpt: not enough padding? I would say there is too much! (or is it between the "Choose add-ons" label and the checkboxes?)
[18:40] <mpt> devildante, no, above the "Choose add-ons" text
[18:42] <devildante> mpt: misunderstanding? I think there is enough padding
[18:43] <mpt> devildante, compare the red and green areas here: http://imgur.com/wr7cR
[18:43] <mpt> They should be roughly the same height
[18:46] <devildante> mpt: now I understand :p will work on it
[18:46] <mpt> thank you
[18:53] <devildante> mpt: now I reversed it :p http://imgur.com/4kkzU.png
[18:54] <mpt> ...
[18:55] <devildante> mpt: was doing some testing, sorry :p
[19:01] <mpt> devildante, it's still USC's fault that it was showing that really long checkbox label. It should have been showing the title <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter#software-title>, which in that case was "qcomicbook".
[19:02] <mpt> ("cat /usr/share/applications/qcomicbook.desktop | grep Name=")
[19:02] <seb128> mpt, grep Name= ...
[19:02] <seb128> mpt, it's shorter to type ;-)
[19:02] <mpt> yeah yeah :-)
[19:03] <mpt> Everything I know about the command line I learned in 1996
[19:04] <devildante> mpt: got it, I was using app_details.summary instead of app_details.display_name
[19:06] <mpt> great
[19:06] <kenvandine> yay... ubuntuone-preferences segfault
[19:07]  * kenvandine files bug
[19:07] <chrisccoulson> hmmm, i have one very miserable daughter this evening
[19:08] <kenvandine> chrisccoulson: sorry to hear that!
[19:08] <chrisccoulson> kenvandine, heh, that's ok ;)
[19:08] <chrisccoulson> she's teething atm
[19:08] <kenvandine> chrisccoulson: my 2 year old is wearing a big metal boot now... broken foot
[19:08] <chrisccoulson> ouch, that's not good
[19:08] <kenvandine> if that makes you feel better :)
[19:08] <chrisccoulson> how did that happen?
[19:08] <kenvandine> he keeps saying his brother did it... not sure exactly
[19:09] <kenvandine> he limped on it for 2 days but we couldn't find anything wrong
[19:09] <kenvandine> moving it and pressing on it didn't seem to hurt at all
[19:09] <kenvandine> so we took him in for xrays, and sure enough it was broken
[19:09] <kenvandine> no pain though... apparently
[19:10] <chrisccoulson> yeah, a similar thing happened to my younger brother when he was around the same age (although with his arm)
[19:10] <chrisccoulson> we noticed over several days he kept holding it, and crying when we laid him down, but he was still able to play ok
[19:10] <chrisccoulson> then we took him to the doctor's, where he had an x-ray that showed he'd broken his arm
[19:11] <chrisccoulson> strange ;)
[19:15] <kenvandine> eek
[19:16] <devildante> mpt: managed to do lot of padding in up and no padding in bottom, not good I presume? http://imgur.com/KxTfC.png
[19:17] <mpt> devildante, not really
[19:17] <devildante> mpt: not really good or not really not good? :p
[19:17] <mpt> not really good
[19:18] <devildante> argh :p
[19:19] <mpt> (hey, "really not good" would have been even worse)
[19:20]  * mpt finishes reporting bug 618803
[19:20] <devildante> haha
[19:20] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 618803 in qcomicbook (Ubuntu) "Comment= in QComicBook's .desktop file is too long (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/618803
[19:27] <devildante> mpt: is this better: http://imgur.com/zXYsj.png
[19:28] <mpt> devildante, a bit -- more space would be even better
[19:29] <devildante> mpt, up or bottom?
[19:29] <mpt> both
[19:42] <devildante> mpt: is this better: http://imgur.com/h3Zpc.png
[19:42] <devildante> (please say yes :p)
[19:42] <mpt> yes!
[19:44]  * devildante has now more chances to work in Canonical
[19:45] <devildante> (is it a true yes? I mean, I don't want to commit for nothing :p)
[19:46] <kiwinote> devildante: yes, the padding does look a lot better now
[19:47] <devildante> oh my! kiwinote was impersonating mpt since the beginning :p
[19:49] <kiwinote> devildante: we still have the case when we have a one line description, but I think that that blocks on the screenshot positioning
[19:50] <devildante> kiwinote: ?
[19:51] <kiwinote> devildante: if the main app has a description which is only one line long, then we get a massive gap between the description and the 'choose add-ons'
[19:51] <kiwinote> devildante: but to fix that you would have to modify the screenshot positioning code, which is something you probably don't want to do ;)
[19:52]  * devildante is relieved :)
[19:53] <kiwinote> devildante: but as I can tell that you love working on padding, there is something else
[19:53] <devildante> argh
[19:53] <kiwinote> devildante: the addonstatusbar looks clamped between the total size and the version label
[19:54] <kiwinote> devildante: some padding on each side of the statusbar would be nice ;)
[19:54] <devildante> kiwinote: imma gonna do it now :)
[19:56] <kiwinote> devildante: by doing so much of it, you must getting good at it ;)
[20:06]  * mpt -> home
[21:53] <devildante> kiwinote: I finally fixed it :p
[23:44] <rickspencer3> RAOF, heya
[23:49] <TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3.
[23:49] <rickspencer3> hey TheMuso
[23:59] <RAOF> rickspencer3: Good morinng