[00:29] <sshaw> if anyone has a second to answer a packaging question...  I'm trying to package something that has a gconf schema file.  On openSUSE and Fedora, there are some macros in the spec file to add that schema.  I was wondering what the Ubuntu way of doing this was?  (Still fairly new to Ubuntu or deb packaging)
[00:32] <chrisccoulson> sshaw, we have dh_gconf to handle gconf schemas
[00:32] <chrisccoulson> how you call that depends on how you're packaging your application
[00:33] <sshaw> chrisccoulson: this particular package is at-spi2-atk
[00:33] <sshaw> I think its just one key to determine whether to use at-spi or at-spi2
[00:33] <chrisccoulson> eg, if you're using CDBS, including /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/gnome.mk will add the right hooks for you automatically
[00:33] <sshaw> its not cdbs
[00:34] <chrisccoulson> i have a case of deja-vu here, i'm sure somebody has asked me about at-spi2-atk before :/
[00:34] <chrisccoulson> perhaps i'm just going crazy though ;)
[00:34] <sshaw> chrisccoulson: I'm can't remember if I have asked before or not
[00:34] <chrisccoulson> i think you have ;)
[00:34] <chrisccoulson> you might want to take a look at other gnome apps
[00:34] <sshaw> wow, my memory just sucks :)
[00:36] <sshaw> I'd assume gedit would be a good example?
[00:37] <devildante> vish: ping
[00:39] <chrisccoulson> sshaw, possibly, although i don't know what packaging system at-spi2-atk is using
[00:40] <sshaw> chrisccoulson: how can I tell?
[00:40] <sshaw> I'm pretty sure its not cdbs
[00:40] <sshaw> I can tell you how I packaged it
[00:43] <sshaw> actually, as I'm looking at it it looks like it already handles the keys
[00:43] <sshaw> can't believe I missed that
[00:43] <sshaw> my brain is fried
[00:44] <chrisccoulson> ;)
[00:44] <sshaw> I think one of the other guys put that in without me knowing it
[00:45] <sshaw> luckily these packages will eventually be part of the distro and I won't have to worry about them anymore :)
[01:21] <devildante> vish: ping pang pong
[01:46] <devildante> dammit, vish :p
[02:45] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell hey dude
[02:47] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, hey
[02:49] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, so ... any change you could spend some more time looking at that cheese bug?
[02:50] <rickspencer3_> it's been driving me a bit crazy thinking about it having it in maverick ... and somehow you seem like the guy who can crack it
[02:50] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, I'm going to have a look at it today. (yesterday was frantically updating gnome)
[02:50] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, cool man, thanks
[02:51] <rickspencer3_> let me know if you need anyone to send you any hardware or anything like that
[02:52] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_ ok, will do.  Did you add any comments about the hw you have?
[02:53] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, no
[02:54] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, what info would help?
[02:54] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, yes please, so we can compare the behaviour on our hw and see if it's hw specific
[02:55] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, right, so I'm looking for the model # of my webcam
[02:55] <rickspencer3_> meh, robert_ancell I just realized I'm at a different computer, atm
[02:55] <rickspencer3_> I'll track it down when I get back to my desk
[03:12] <rickspencer3_> urk, these gstreamer pipelines remind me of writing old school sql queries
[03:15] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, heh :)
[04:05] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, so I'm trying to capture video output on Lucid at 30fps ...
[04:05] <rickspencer3_> gstreamer seems to not be keeping up
[04:06] <rickspencer3_> so ... I'm not surprised to see regressions in cheese, I wonder if it's it a bit hard to make this work
[04:08] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, yeah, there seems to be a lot of performance issues in gst
[04:10] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, hmm, when I use avimux it works just fine
[04:10] <rickspencer3_> so maybe something about theora?
[04:15] <TheMuso> rickspencer3_: How much CPU usage when you are capturing?
[04:16] <rickspencer3_> TheMuso, I'm on my lucid netbook atm
[04:16] <rickspencer3_> so, it's probably at best tangentially related to the maverick cheese bug
[04:16] <rickspencer3_> but you ask a good question
[04:16] <TheMuso> ok
[04:16]  * rickspencer3_ tests
[04:17] <rickspencer3_> recording and displaying with avimux = 16% of one core
[04:18] <rickspencer3_> with oggmux it's 97% of one core
[04:20] <rickspencer3_> oops, robert_ancell TheMuso cheese can't record on my Lucid netbook either!
[04:20] <rickspencer3_> I never thought to test it, but it's got 100% of one of my cores
[04:20] <TheMuso> rickspencer3_: Were you using the same codec for avimux and oggmux?
[04:21] <rickspencer3_> uh, I don't know
[04:21] <rickspencer3_> I'm just fidling with gstreamer pipelines
[04:21] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_: it's more that just theora because you can encode using videotestsrc
[04:22] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, I'm a bit weirded out that I'm seeing this on Lucid, I thought it was a maverick issue
[04:23] <rickspencer3_> TheMuso, here's what I know ... this works:
[04:23] <rickspencer3_> queue ! avimux ! filesink location=boo.avi
[04:23] <rickspencer3_> this pins the CPU:
[04:23] <rickspencer3_> theoraenc ! queue ! oggmux ! filesink location=boo.ogg
[04:26] <rickspencer3_> nice, meanwhile desktopcouch comes along and takes up 50% of each core
[04:27] <robert_ancell> If you run with GST_DEBUG=v4l*:5,theora*:5,GST_QOS:5, it shows there are about 2 frames per second being generated.  But playing back the video doesn't show this.  It's like the video is corrupted (it doesn't play smoothly in totem)
[04:29] <robert_ancell> Does anyone know of a tool to dump information about a video file? e.g. number of frames
[04:30] <RAOF> From what I remember, the ffmpeg commandline tool wasn't terrible.
[04:30] <RAOF> But might not give all the info you want.
[04:31] <RAOF> If videotestsrc works but v4l2src doesn't, maybe it's an interaction between timestamps and oggmux?
[04:31] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, I think mencoder has like every function you could want
[04:34] <robert_ancell> RAOF, does this sound interesting: 0:00:16.537149013  9190      0x22e7470 DEBUG              theoraenc gsttheoraenc.c:823:theora_enc_is_discontinuous:<theoraenc0> Incoming TS 0:00:16.244409842 exceeds expected value 0:00:16.024553226 by too much, marking discontinuity
[04:37] <RAOF> Possibly - that looks like the incoming frame is arriving ~.2 sec later than the encoder is expecting.
[04:37] <RAOF> That said, why is the encoder looking at the timestamps anyway?  I obviously don't know enough about theoraenc.
[04:37] <robert_ancell> hmm, I run "ffmpeg -i test.ogg -r 1 -s WxH -f image2 test-%03d.jpeg" and I get "incorrect frame size"
[04:38] <robert_ancell> oh, no I needed to replace WxH
[04:38] <RAOF> :)
[04:39] <rickspencer3_> heh
[04:39] <robert_ancell> Interesting - that shows 13 correct frames - so the video data is there, totem just isn't able to play it
[04:39] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_: can you confirm if you get the same?
[04:40] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, sorry, I wasn't paying attention, can you tell me exactly what you want me to repro?
[04:40]  * rickspencer3_ keeps playing with his new webcam app
[04:40] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, encode an ogg from you v4l2src, confirm it doesn't play back properly in totem, then run "ffmpeg -i test.ogg -f image2 test-%03d.jpeg" and see if it does have valid video frames inside it
[04:42] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, what does "doesn't play back properly" entail?
[04:42] <robert_ancell> oh, you don't even need the "-f image2"
[04:42] <robert_ancell> in my case, I see one or a few frames in the output ogg, but ffmpeg shows it does have all the frames
[04:42] <robert_ancell> I'll reproduce with cheese
[04:43] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, cheese is just flat unusable on this machine
[04:44] <rickspencer3_> (well for capturing video anyway)
[04:46] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, it didn't seem to report an error, but I the resulting jpegs are garbage in eog
[04:47] <robert_ancell> weird
[04:48] <rickspencer3_> robert_ancell, well, I am on lucid here
[04:48] <rickspencer3_> shall I run upstairs and try on my maverick desktop?
[04:49] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, worth a try
[04:50] <robert_ancell> I heard v4l had a reputation for being broken, it may have improved since lucid
[04:50] <TheMuso> What about using a different codec...
[04:56] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, what encoders do we have in Ubuntu that you can use?
[04:57] <robert_ancell> I was looking but theora sounded like the only available one
[04:59] <TheMuso> robert_ancell: ffmpeg via the gstreamer ffmpeg package. No idea about how to use it ina pipeline I'm affraid.
[05:00] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I'm at my desktop again
[05:00] <TheMuso> Encode to mpeg or something similar
[05:00] <RAOF> There's a hundred and one ffenc_* options available.
[05:00] <TheMuso> RAOF: heh
[05:00] <RAOF> xvidenc might be a winer
[05:00] <RAOF> Or even a winner.
[05:01] <TheMuso> RAOF: separate gstreamer plugin?
[05:02] <rickspencer3> I*sigh*
[05:02] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, cheese just worked perfectly for me
[05:03] <robert_ancell> rickspencer3, *sigh*
[05:03] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[05:04] <robert_ancell> If I run cheese on the lowest resolution the output video seems to stabilise after 10s.  Not sure if this is expected behaviour for a video codec
[05:04] <rickspencer3> hmm, I did just do a dist-upgrade
[05:06] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I give up!
[05:06]  * rickspencer3 thirsts for beer
[05:06] <rickspencer3>  actually, I wonder if my webcam app will work on this computer with theora?
[05:07] <robert_ancell> oh, someone updated cheese...
[05:07] <rickspencer3> lol
[05:08] <rickspencer3> don't tell me this was fixed upstream and we just spent all this time debugging it :/
[05:08] <rickspencer3> lol
[05:08] <rickspencer3> fml
[05:11] <rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I'm seeing the same issue with oggmux in my gstreamer pipeline on maverick as well (that I was seeing on my lucid netbook)
[05:12] <robert_ancell> the performance still seems bad, very hard to tell if it's as bad as it was on lucid.  It's a little unpredictable
[05:12] <robert_ancell> The NEWS file doesn't suggest anything major has changed
[05:12] <rickspencer3> hmmm
[05:13] <rickspencer3> well, I really need to roll
[05:13] <rickspencer3> sorry I can't "help" more :/
[05:13] <robert_ancell> go forth and drink beer!
[05:13] <rickspencer3> :)
[07:23] <and471> sabdfl, I think I can see why you chose natty. Look at the definition on this page http://www.thefreedictionary.com/natty - "Neat, trim, and smart; **dapper**."
[07:23] <and471> XD
[07:27] <nigelb> and471: you missed jaunty :p
[07:28] <and471> :)
[07:35] <and471> kenvandine, just read you post on libgwibber - looks interesting :)
[07:35] <and471> kenvandine, does this mean we should replace the call to 'gwibber-poster' in software-center
[07:36] <and471> kenvandine, and replace it with something like in your python example?
[08:30] <sabdfl> and471: just keepin' it real :-)
[08:30] <and471> sabdfl, :)
[08:31] <vish> and471: we need to take away sabdfl's thesaurus ;)
[08:31] <nigelb> vish: or remove certain entries from it.
[08:32] <and471> hehe
[08:33] <vish> and471: he is having too much fun with it, while we keep guessing what he is gonna name it next.. *or* now that we have found a pattern, we can guess it easier next time :p
[08:54] <robert_ancell> seb128, hey, can you check my update for evince?  I think I've got all the library stuff right this time.  Not sure if both shlibs variables should be updated though
[08:54] <seb128> hey robert_ancell
[08:54] <seb128> I was just reading your email
[08:54] <seb128> soname is age-revision usually
[08:56] <seb128> hum, not awake yet
[08:56] <seb128> current - age rather
[08:57] <seb128> ie the first and the third number in the 1:2:3
[08:57] <seb128> ie 5:0:1 -> 5-1 == 6:0:2 -> 6-2
[08:57] <robert_ancell> seb128, the rule is, only update if you see n:0:0 right?
[08:58] <seb128> the soname changes on abi breakage, ie when the age is set to 0
[08:58] <seb128> the rule is "match the installed filename on the disk"
[08:58] <seb128> it's easier than trying to read the configure.ac logic ;-)
[08:58] <seb128> but yeah usually when the third number (ie the age) is set to 0 that's an abi break
[08:59] <seb128> that's when the soname changes
[08:59] <robert_ancell> seb128, but a library can make a change 4:0:0 -> 5:0:1 and we don't update right?
[08:59] <seb128> no
[08:59] <seb128> there is compatibility breakage in such cases
[08:59] <seb128> I should clean and publish my script which diff installed packages and deb
[08:59] <robert_ancell> seb128, but we do change binary package name?
[09:00] <seb128> no
[09:00] <seb128> we change when the soname changes
[09:00] <seb128> is change "lib<name>.so.<n>" changes "n"
[09:00] <seb128> ie when "lib<name>.so.<n>" changes "n"
[09:00] <seb128> the binary is named libname<n>
[09:01] <robert_ancell> ok, so the safest thing to do is a dpkg -L on the currently installed version and a dpkg -c on the new version and see what changed?
[09:01] <seb128> usually what we want is to have abi incompatible versions to be stay around for a while to allow easy transitions
[09:01] <seb128> right
[09:01] <seb128> I should really publish my script
[09:01] <seb128> it basically does that for all the deb in the dir you are
[09:01] <seb128> and diff the lists
[09:01] <seb128> and shows the diff
[09:03] <seb128> robert_ancell, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/debnbfiles
[09:03] <seb128> very hackish but if you want to try on your recent build
[09:03] <seb128> just run it in the dir with the debs
[09:04] <seb128> robert_ancell, otherwise you didn't reply to my question about the polkit gettext change in the email
[09:04] <seb128> do you think you will have time or interest for this one?
[09:04] <seb128> what about shotwell and f-spot import on first run?
[09:05] <seb128> brb, grabbing coffee
[09:05] <robert_ancell> seb128, bug #619632
[09:05] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 619632 in policykit-1 (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Use gettext for translating user messages (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619632
[09:05] <seb128> robert_ancell, you rock as usual ;-)
[09:05] <seb128> thanks
[09:06] <seb128> did you merge the new gtk from debian today?
[09:06] <seb128> just checking if you didn't do it for a reason since I see no upload
[09:06] <seb128> brb
[09:11] <robert_ancell> seb128, no, I was going to ask you if you knew of any problems with the new gtk - since it has dropped so much api I didn't want us to require two versions on the cd.  I thought they were going to make those changes in 3.0!
[09:11] <robert_ancell> I notice that Debian has taken it though
[09:11] <seb128> robert_ancell, they didn't drop apis
[09:11] <seb128> they are marking those deprecated only I think
[09:12] <seb128> robert_ancell, I didn't build evince yet but I think your update missed the libevview soname change
[09:13] <robert_ancell> seb128, according to the GTK+ email it says "Remove all GDK drawing functions, ie gdk_draw_*. Use cairo instead" etc
[09:14] <seb128> robert_ancell, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?h=gtk-2-22&id=92055d8d328a7adaa05f3c6ac6d1c496819940ec
[09:14] <seb128> robert_ancell, that's those sort of changes
[09:14] <seb128> they are changing gtk to use cairo rather than gdk_draw_ calls
[09:15] <seb128> I doubt they dropped any public api that would break the abi which is what gtk3 is for
[09:18] <robert_ancell> oh, that sounds safer :)
[09:19] <seb128> I will do the update and see how it goes today
[09:19] <seb128> robert_ancell, did you read my libevview comment?
[09:20] <robert_ancell> seb128, yes, do you mean the gir1.0- package or something else?
[09:20] <seb128> robert_ancell, libevview2 -> libevview3
[09:20] <robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, did that (I pushed to the u-d branch as UNRELEASED)
[09:21] <seb128> robert_ancell, no, you renamed libevdocument
[09:21] <robert_ancell> damn
[09:21] <seb128> robert_ancell, both need renaming
[09:22] <seb128> robert_ancell, try  http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/debnbfiles
[09:22] <seb128> robert_ancell, if you didn't install the new version yet
[09:22] <robert_ancell> trying it now
[09:23] <robert_ancell> ok, pushed changes now
[09:24] <seb128> robert_ancell, seems correct now
[09:25] <seb128> robert_ancell, btw lintian should warn you about names not matchin sonames as well
[09:25] <seb128> robert_ancell, if you have it installed
[09:25] <robert_ancell> right
[09:25] <seb128> so it's usually a hint to think about when you see it ;-)
[09:26] <robert_ancell> does it remind you if you forget to update the shlibs variable though?
[09:26] <seb128> no
[09:27] <seb128> but we should stop using shlibs
[09:27] <seb128> we should use .symbols rather
[09:27] <robert_ancell> right
[09:34] <robert_ancell> hmm, I didn't have lintian installed since I replaced my hdd - no wonder I'm not seeing any warnings!
[09:34] <seb128> heh
[09:42] <robert_ancell> pitti, have you tried the latest simple-scan?  I made it do the 2 bit scan for text, see how it looks
[09:47] <seb128> robert_ancell, so shotwell
[09:47] <seb128> robert_ancell, https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-shotwell
[09:48] <seb128> doh
[09:48] <seb128> he left ;-)
[10:05] <ronoc> bl8: ping
[10:33] <devildante> kiwinote, mpt, vish: hi :)
[10:33] <kiwinote> devildante: hey
[10:33] <mpt> Good morning devildante
[10:34] <devildante> Good morning you two :)
[10:34]  * devildante wants mvo back :p
[10:34] <vish> devildante: hey!
[10:34] <devildante> hey vish :)
[10:35] <vish> devildante: you ping-a-linged at 5am for me ;p
[10:35] <devildante> vish: it was, like 1am for me, so you're forgiven :p
[10:36] <devildante> vish: I have finished the renaming of update-manager
[10:36] <vish> mpt: ^ :)
[10:37] <vish> devildante: now we wait for mvo to return..
[10:38] <and471> devildante, mpt, I have started on the treeview that shows the updates http://imgur.com/EvTCF
[10:38] <kiwinote> devildante: you do realise that there is a large number of packages depending on 'update-manager', 'update-notifier', etc..?
[10:39] <mpt> hi and471. Are you doing this interface from scratch, or is it changes to the existing update-manager code?
[10:39] <devildante> vish, mpt: I'll redo the update-notifier renaming tomorrow, as I want to finish a little project for tomorrow ;)
[10:39] <and471> mpt, well I decided it best to do it from scratch since software-updater is VERy different from UpdateManager
[10:39] <devildante> all right, and471, you're the best!
[10:39] <and471> mpt, I can definitely bring some stuff over from update-manager
[10:39] <and471> mpt, to minimise duplication of effort
[10:40] <and471> mpt, however I feel even the backend will be from scratch
[10:40] <devildante> kiwinote: Replaces and Conflicts would be enough, I think
[10:40] <vish> kiwinote: yeah devildante was wondeirng about that, probably we should only do renaming of the UI alone for now and think about the gconf changes for next cycle?
[10:40] <mpt> and471, maybe so, but there are probably many intricate details of update-manager that I don't know about yet, and it seems dangerous to me to try and rewrite them all.
[10:40] <and471> mpt, as I suspect mvo will want to use aptdaemon+plicykit instead of gksudo
[10:40] <mpt> and471, update-manager in Maverick already uses aptdaemon+policykit, right?
[10:41] <and471> mpt, I don't know
[10:41] <kiwinote> yep, parts of it do
[10:41] <and471> kiwinote, ah
[10:41] <and471> mpt, I shall have a look, but because the interface is very different, I feel as though form scratch is better
[10:41] <and471> *from
[10:42] <mpt> and471, I tried to write the spec so that it could be implemented a little bit at a time (as devildante did with the running-on-battery text, for example).
[10:42] <devildante> and471: I could work on the treeview alone for update-manager without starting from scratch
[10:42] <devildante> (if you want of course ;) )
[10:43] <and471> mpt, devildante it is just the way software-updater will work with morphing windows means the UI framework is vastly different
[10:43] <kiwinote> and471: there are a few things hidden in the update-manager code (afaik) like partial updates, dist-upgrades etc
[10:43] <and471> kiwinote, yup I was thinking about these :)
[10:43] <kiwinote> and471: as far as I am aware they have some quite complex code ;)
[10:43] <and471> becuase of these vast differences I felt it was better to start from scratch as otherwise I would end up with quite horrible code
[10:44] <and471> kiwinote, definitely, but I am just starting with the GUI stuff, I am not confident with aptdaemon etc.
[10:44] <and471> kiwinote, mpt, devildante, let me quickly have a look at the UM code
[10:44] <kiwinote> yeah, for the 'normal' updates I think it does make sense to rewrite
[10:45] <kiwinote> should also check it out myself ;)
[10:45] <and471> (btw if anyone wants to see the code, it is in lp:~and471/+junk/software-updater)
[10:46] <devildante> and471: does it really make sense to rewrite? as far as I know, only UpdateManager.py and the backends have GUI, so you could only rewrite these
[10:46] <mpt> I'm not an engineer, so I'll defer to mvo on this. Maybe I'm biased against rewrites because I lived through the Mozilla rewrite
[10:46] <and471> devildante, mpt, I will email mvo for his advice
[10:46] <and471> devildante, sorry I don't understand
[10:47] <and471> don't worry I haven't progressed so far that I can't go back and update existing code :)
[10:47] <and471> (into UM)
[10:47] <mpt> ok
[10:47] <and471> but I shall slow down to avoid any 'oops I've done this the wrong way and waisted all that time' :)
[10:47] <kiwinote> just for the record that was only the front end rewrite I was referring, the backend is quite complex as it is..
[10:48] <and471> kiwinote, yeah
[10:48] <devildante> and471: I meant that only 2 files uses Pygtk+: UpdateManager.py (the main file) and InstallBackendAptDaemon.py (the backend), so you could only modify these ;)
[10:48] <and471> kiwinote, I agree,
[10:48] <and471> devildante, yes but I think rewriting those files
[10:48] <and471> devildante, is better than
[10:49] <and471> devildante, going through code that follows an old workflow and trying to make it fit with our new one
[10:49] <and471> anyway let me have a look
[10:50] <and471> ok
[10:51] <and471> I think I shall wait to mvo's much hyped return :)
[10:51] <and471> hopefully he will know what to do
[10:51] <and471> to > until
[10:52] <and471> mpt, I have even wrote gui_tests for the software-updater (the stuff nessita taught me) :)
[10:52] <mpt> bravo
[10:52] <and471> hehe
[10:53] <and471> devildante, < I could work on the treeview alone for update-manager> could I ask that we both wait till mvo's return
[10:53] <and471> devildante, so we avoid duplication fo effort
[10:53] <and471> *of
[10:53] <and471> ?
[10:53] <devildante> and471: okay, no problem ;)
[10:53] <and471> devildante, thanks
[10:53] <devildante> and471: np :)
[10:53] <seb128> asac, hello
[10:54] <seb128> asac, you need your clutter changes in maverick right?
[10:54] <seb128> asac, just checking
[10:56] <asac> seb128: yes, we upstramed everything and i think pochu wanted to apply this in debian next
[10:56] <asac> stay tuned for another day or two ... hope we can just sync by then
[10:56] <seb128> ok
[10:56] <seb128> we should get that in this week
[10:56] <asac> ok. then we might need to prepush that
[10:56] <seb128> we are over the time for changes, we should aim at stabilization ;-)
[10:57] <asac> seb128: our changes shouldnt destabilize the normal GL stack ;) ... but yeah
[10:57] <seb128> shouldn't != will not ;-)
[10:57] <asac> thats news to me ;) ... j.k
[10:57] <seb128> is the email you sent the other day current state of the art for those?
[10:58] <seb128> I will check with pochu when if he reviewed it and try to get that in tomorrow
[10:58] <asac> seb128: alf is fixing one more bug now ... we will ping you when its ready
[10:58] <seb128> thanks
[10:58] <asac> alf__: ^^
[10:58] <seb128> if you could rebase on the current version that would be nice as well
[10:58] <seb128> ie do one changelog entry with summarize the changes
[10:59] <seb128> rather than having history of the version you maintained mixed in the changelog
[11:03] <alf__> seb128: This has been mostly fixed in 0ubuntu4unified2 in my ppa
[11:04] <alf__> seb128: I will soon upload 0ubuntu4unified3, I will ping you. Thanks!
[11:04] <seb128> alf__, thank you
[11:11] <and471> dpm, hi, is bug 560591 related to SC, to me it looks like the reporter's language is set to English
[11:11] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 560591 in software-center (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Wrong language shown in Ubuntu Software Center (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/560591
[11:12] <dpm> hi and471, let me have a look
[11:12] <and471> dpm, thanks
[11:15] <and471> mpt, are you working on bug 433841?
[11:15] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 433841 in software-center (Ubuntu) "Enable users to upload a screenshot (affects: 2) (heat: 10)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/433841
[11:21] <dpm> and471, ok, done some quick tests and commented on the bug
[11:22] <mpt> and471, no, it's assigned to me so I can design the interface. Do you have a suggestion?
[11:24] <asac> seb128: gnome-terminal doesnt do the right thing for me anymore for alt + backspace (e.g. doesnt delete full words)
[11:25] <asac> seems alt key isnt used at all (e.g. alt+d doesnt delete full word, alt+a doesnt go to front etc.)
[11:25] <asac> err alt+a never did that ;)
[11:25] <asac> still alt key is broken ... /me checks gnome-terminal settings
[11:26] <seb128> asac, I don't know about this issue but I'm not the one who did the recent update and I didn't upgrade yet
[11:26] <asac> ok
[11:27] <asac> but seems there was a gnome-terminal update
[11:28] <asac> filed bug
[11:29] <asac> bug 619754
[11:29] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 619754 in gnome-terminal (Ubuntu) "alt + backspace; alt+d etc. don't work anymore (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619754
[11:30] <and471> dpm, thanks
[11:31] <and471> mpt, I was going to have a go at designing it and implementing it
[11:31] <and471> mpt, I was thinking along the same lines as the review dialog, but obviously a bit different
[11:33] <mpt> and471, sure, maybe you could post sketches of the design on a wiki sub-page
[11:33] <and471> mpt, ok, i''l have a go :)
[11:58]  * and471 wonders why wiki.ubuntu.com is so slow...
[11:58] <and471> mpt, added it to the end of this page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter/Comments
[12:03] <mpt> and471, what do you think are the best and worst things about that design?
[12:25] <devildante> any python-webkit experienced guys here?
[12:33] <rodrigo_> seb128, please merge https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/tomboy/fix-sso-signals/+merge/32982
[12:33] <seb128> rodrigo_, heh you didn't do the version update! ;-)
[12:33] <seb128> rodrigo_, hey btw
[12:33] <seb128> rodrigo_, who is working on the ubuntuone-client nautilus integration btw?
[12:34] <seb128> rodrigo_, did you notice it's broken since the nautilus 2.31 update?
[12:34] <seb128> rodrigo_, there is no bar displayed, not that I complain but I think it's not wanted
[12:34] <rodrigo_> seb128, no, coming in the next branch
[12:34] <rodrigo_> seb128, I am working on it
[12:35] <rodrigo_> seb128, we only show it now for XDG folders
[12:35] <rodrigo_> seb128, does it show for you in ~/Documents?
[12:36] <seb128> rodrigo_, yes, excellent
[12:36] <seb128> rodrigo_, I was afraid I broke it with the update
[12:36] <seb128> rodrigo_, so the context menu show,hide option doesn't work on non-xdg dirs
[12:37] <rodrigo_> no, it doesn't, since it never shows it
[12:37] <rodrigo_> we need to discuss what's the best way, so will get some bug fixes
[12:39] <seb128> ok
[12:53] <kenvandine> good morning folks
[12:54] <kenvandine> seb128, i'll be a little late today, heading in for a parent-teacher conference in a few minutes
[12:54] <seb128> kenvandine, hey, ok
[12:54] <seb128> kenvandine, btw read the 15 lines backlog before you said hello
[12:55] <kenvandine> ah!
[12:55] <kenvandine> that is very good :)
[12:56]  * kenvandine heads out
[13:50]  * pitti headdesks on bug 612988; c'mon guys
[13:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 612988 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 2 other projects) "[nautilus] shows ubuntu-one ribbon in each folder (affects: 7) (dups: 2) (heat: 48)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/612988
[13:53] <seb128> hey pitti
[13:53]  * pitti hugs seb128
[13:54]  * seb128 hugs pitti
[13:55] <chrisccoulson> hi pitti!
[13:56] <pitti> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
[13:56] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm good thanks, and you?
[13:56] <pitti> I'm great
[13:56] <pitti> back in Dresden again
[13:56] <pitti> nice quiet train ride with lots of time for hacking
[13:57] <chrisccoulson> nice!
[13:59] <pitti> ah, maverick langpacks finished building
[14:00] <pitti> dpm: ^ I started it this morning
[14:00] <pitti> dpm: building locally in the DC, that is (not uploaded yet, want to give them a quick test first)
[14:01] <dpm> pitti, you've been reading my mind, I was just about to ping you about them :) Thanks for the update
[14:02] <pitti> dpm: not quite -- you pinged me over night :)
[14:02] <dpm> hahaha, forgot about the scrollback
[14:09] <pitti> yay, finally! translated evolution again
[14:09] <pitti> firefox and desktop look fine
[14:09] <dpm> \o/
[14:10] <pitti> dpm: ok, looks good; pushing them archivewards
[14:10] <dpm> brilliant, thanks pitti
[14:11] <pitti> no problem
[14:41] <dpm> pitti, after the full language pack is generated, i take it the deltas will keep being generated and automatically uploaded during development, won't they? (apart from freezes, where I know they need to be disabled IIRC)
[14:42] <pitti> dpm: I need to reenable the cronjob for that, but yes
[14:42] <pitti> dpm: btw, I flipped the base version on the LP page
[14:42] <pitti> Here I mean: https://translations.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+language-packs
[14:44] <dpm> pitti, ah, right, thanks. I think Arne was purposefully not updating that (I think he said to avoid manual overhead), does that have any funtion, apart from informative?
[14:44] <dpm> function, I meant
[14:46] <seb128> james_w, there to help me on a bzr merge-upstream issue?
[14:46] <james_w> yes
[14:46] <seb128> james_w, so I'm using lp:ubuntu/indicator-sound
[14:47] <seb128> bzr get lp:ubuntu/indicator-sound
[14:47] <pitti> oh, no didrocks today?
[14:47] <seb128> pitti, he's on holidays 2 weeks
[14:47] <seb128> james_w, http://edge.launchpad.net/indicator-sound/sound-menu-v2/0.4.0/+download/indicator-sound-0.4.0.tar.gz
[14:47] <seb128> $ bzr merge-upstream --version 0.4.0 ../indicator-sound-0.4.0.tar.gz lp:indicator-sound
[14:47] <seb128> Using distribution maverick
[14:47] <seb128> bzr: ERROR: An inconsistent delta was supplied involving u'/vapi', 'vapi-20100621103135-gycdn15933l3irmh-1'
[14:47] <seb128> reason: Attempt to add item at path already occupied by id 'vapi-20100624175500-xymgx3h309uhcz83-12'
[14:47] <seb128>  
[14:48] <seb128> james_w, ^ I get that error
[14:48] <pitti> seb128: ah, thanks
[14:48] <seb128> james_w, do you know any way to get around it?
[14:48] <seb128> pitti, do you need anything? I might be able to help
[14:50] <pitti> seb128: just filed bug 619858 about the problem
[14:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 619858 in openoffice.org-l10n (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 1 other project) "starts pulling OpenJDK into CDs (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619858
[14:51] <seb128> pitti, ok, he stepped up to do the version update but he's not going to be maintainer for it so I guess don't wait for him to be back
[14:51] <pitti> seb128: ok; just thought it might be quicker for him than for anyone else, but nevermind; filed as an RC bug for now
[14:51] <seb128> pitti, thanks
[14:52] <seb128> I guess doko knows about it, he pinged me to ask if didrocks as around as well some minutes ago
[14:53] <james_w> seb128: no idea, please file a bug
[14:53] <seb128> james_w, ok thanks
[14:53] <james_w> seb128: if you run with "-Derror" then you will get a full traceback, I might be able to guess a workaround from there.
[14:59] <seb128> james_w, which component should be bugged?
[15:00] <james_w> seb128: bzr-builddeb for now, I'l reassign if needed
[15:01] <seb128> james_w, ok, just finishing those uploads first I want those changes to land now then I will open a bug, thanks
[15:01] <james_w> thank you!
[15:04] <rickspencer3> pedro_, is evolution crashing for everyone in maverick, or just for me?
[15:05] <seb128> rickspencer3, it's just you
[15:05] <rickspencer3> dang it
[15:05] <pedro_> rickspencer3, probably just you, haven't seen any new crash coming today
[15:05] <seb128> well maybe pedro has noticed bugs
[15:05] <seb128> but we don't get crash bugs atm
[15:05] <pedro_> rickspencer3, it's working fine here btw
[15:05] <rickspencer3> I trust it's not because I'm the only one still using it :P
[15:05] <pedro_> lol
[15:05] <seb128> retracers are out of order for some time
[15:06] <seb128> which means filled bugs don't go through
[15:06] <chrisccoulson> "crashing", or "crashing more than usual"? ;)
[15:06] <pedro_> but still there's no pending crashes to be retraced
[15:06] <rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, crashing a whole lot more than usual
[15:06] <seb128> pedro_, how do you know?
[15:06] <rickspencer3> pedro_, yeah, I'm not getting apport for some reason
[15:06] <pedro_> seb128, well those are marked as need-X-retrace, no?
[15:06] <seb128> pedro_, you don't have access to crashes the retracers didn't work on it
[15:06] <seb128> pedro_, you wouldn't see those
[15:06] <pedro_> for evolution i mean
[15:06] <seb128> they are visible only for the retracers
[15:07] <pedro_> seb128, so those aren't filed in lp yet?
[15:07] <seb128> rickspencer3, is that while reading email or composing?
[15:07] <seb128> pedro_, they are but they are private and bug teams are not subscribed
[15:07] <rickspencer3> forwarding or replying causes crashes
[15:07] <rickspencer3> a lot
[15:07] <seb128> pedro_, virtually only the retracers have access
[15:08] <seb128> rickspencer3, right, I get that as well
[15:08] <rickspencer3> I'm running from the command line to see if it tells me what happened
[15:08] <pedro_> seb128, ok
[15:08] <seb128> pedro_, do you think somebody in the qa team could to maintain the retracers?
[15:09] <pedro_> seb128, perhaps bdmurray but he's doing a rotation atm
[15:09] <gzerphey> hello all... i have installed ubuntu desktop 10.04LTS and I am having a wireless disconnect problem under load.  Is there any thoughts on how I might fix this?
[15:09] <gzerphey> i have tried generic-pae backports.  the fix used to be jaunty backports but that doesnt seem to be an option anymore
[15:09] <pedro_> seb128, but we could talk to him to start doing that for next cycle
[15:10] <gzerphey> any help would be appreciated
[15:10] <seb128> pedro_, would be nice
[15:10] <pedro_> noted
[15:10] <seb128> gzerphey, hi, wrong channel, we talk about GNOME there basically
[15:10] <seb128> gzerphey, try #ubuntu
[15:10] <gzerphey> i did
[15:10] <seb128> pedro_, thanks
[15:10] <gzerphey> no response
[15:10] <gzerphey> any other thoughts
[15:11] <pedro_> gzerphey, you're probably not going to get a better response here, just be patient there's plenty of people at #ubuntu doing support
[15:11] <pedro_> gzerphey, you can ask in the forums as well, but as seb128 said this isn't a support channel, sorry
[15:12] <gzerphey> i can appreciate that
[15:13] <rickspencer3> seb128, pedro_, I just repro'd the evo crash
[15:13] <rickspencer3> it's a core dump
[15:13] <rickspencer3> what's the best way for me to use this to log a bug?
[15:13] <rickspencer3> if I do ubuntu-bug evolution will it pick it up?
[15:15] <pedro_> rickspencer3, could you run evolution under gdb to get that backtrace?
[15:15] <pedro_> rickspencer3, and do a 'set logging on evolution-crash.txt'
[15:15] <rickspencer3> k
[15:15] <pedro_> rickspencer3, reproduce the crash and 'thread apply all bt full'
[15:16] <pedro_> rickspencer3, then 'set logging off' or just quit gdb
[15:16] <rickspencer3> ok
[15:16] <rickspencer3> thanks pedro_, I'll get to that later today
[15:16] <pedro_> it will save the backtrace at that evolution-crash.txt which you can be attached to the report you file with ubuntu-bug evolution
[15:16] <pedro_> you're welcome
[15:17] <kenvandine> brb, installing maverick on my new intel SSD :)
[15:40] <rickspencer3> kenvandine, awesome post on libgwibber!
[15:40] <rickspencer3> what a great a contribution
[15:41] <rickspencer3> ara I also love your post on "Love an Upstream Project?" http://ubuntutesting.wordpress.com/2010/08/18/love-an-upstream-project-want-it-well-tested/
[15:42] <rickspencer3> nice work there
[15:42] <ara> rickspencer3, thanks
[16:08] <kenvandine> thx rickspencer3
[16:16] <kenvandine> and471, saw your comment about libgwibber, yes you could use that in software-center
[16:16] <kenvandine> ideally not spaw a new window but just embed it
[16:16] <and471> kenvandine, ah thanks :)
[16:16] <and471> kenvandine, you mean like just in the right pane?
[16:16] <kenvandine> then just expand it if someone clicks on it or something
[16:17] <kenvandine> instead of a popup
[16:17] <kenvandine> imho
[16:17] <and471> k
[16:17] <and471> I will let mpt think about it :)
[16:17] <kenvandine> also, you can connect to the is_available signal to decide to even show it
[16:17] <and471> kenvandine, cool :)
[16:17] <kenvandine> so if someone doesn't use gwibber, they don't even see it
[16:17] <kenvandine> :)
[16:18] <and471> mpt, did you get a chance to look at the screenshot submit mockup?
[16:21] <repete> seb128, do you know if UNE 10.04 will detect whether XGLX drivers are present so it can fall back to the 2D interface if needed?
[16:25] <seb128> repete, it will not autofallback
[16:25] <seb128> didrocks has a workitem on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/mobile-m-lightweight-panel-for-efl though
[16:25] <seb128> "[didrocks] Add a detection mechanism for HW support to unity and pop up an error message that allows to go back to gdm"
[16:47] <repete> seb128, thx
[17:05] <bl8> ronoc: pong
[17:06] <seb128> tedg, should the libindicator patch be dropped in favor of your recent commit?
[17:06] <seb128> tedg, it breaks the sound menu icon
[17:08] <tedg> seb128, Hmm, that's an odd result.
[17:10] <ronoc> bl8: hey
[17:10] <kenvandine> sigh... desktopcouch fails to replicate to my new install
[17:10] <ronoc> so how is the implementation doing bl8
[17:10] <tedg> seb128, The sound icon works for me...
[17:10]  * kenvandine files bug
[17:11] <seb128> tedg, the rhythmbox icon is a broken icon there
[17:11] <seb128> tedg, in the menu
[17:11] <bl8> ronoc: Haven't done much yet, been away this week-end, then sick... But I have printed out the spec ;)
[17:11] <ronoc> bl8: cool, well when you have something you want to test just let me know.
[17:12] <ronoc> bl8, the 0.4.X versions of the indicator-sound will mpris2 ready
[17:12] <bl8> ronoc: yep, will do. When are those 0.4.x expected ?
[17:12] <tedg> seb128, I'm not sure what you're referring to.  I dont' have any broken icons... the app indicator for rhythmbox?
[17:13] <seb128> tedg, no, the indicator-sound v2 menu, next to the "rhythmbox" label the icon is broken
[17:13] <seb128> tedg, I'm using the light theme if that makes a difference
[17:13] <seb128> tedg, could be due to something else
[17:14] <ronoc> 0.4.0 just went out today, which has everything in it except scrubbing, rb was segfaulting on scrub so I would imagine in the morning i will release 0.4.1 which will have this enabled again
[17:14] <seb128> tedg, in any case should we drop kamstrup change and get your commit? does that fix the unity issue they were having?
[17:14] <tedg> seb128, yes I think we should.  I'm not sure what the indicator-sound issue is -- I'm curious if I have an older version than you?
[17:15] <bl8> ronoc: Cool, thanks !
[17:15] <ronoc> bl8: also I only realized this morning that they dropped the useful playlist stuff from the spec
[17:15] <tedg> seb128, I proposed a merge for kenvandine
[17:15] <seb128> ok, so it's handled, less to do for me, nice
[17:15] <kenvandine> :)
[17:15] <ronoc> bl8, talking with mirsal and alex right now to get a new interface speced which covers the basic playlist stuff I need
[17:16] <ronoc> so the tracklist interface is redundant from my point of view
[17:18] <bl8> ronoc: Yeah, I'm not sure it's possible to come up with a tracklist thing that makes everybody happy, so you might as well start from your use case
[17:19] <ronoc> bl8: yeah looks like there will be new interface org.mpris.MediaPlayer2.playlist
[17:21] <kenvandine> tedg, you proposed the wrong branch again
[17:21] <tedg> kenvandine, Uhg, sorry.
[17:22] <kenvandine> no wrries
[17:22] <kenvandine> i know the right branch
[17:23] <ronoc> which will allow querying number of playlists, organizing by creation date, last played date or alphabetically, and fetching x number from a to b, and making a particular playlist active
[17:23] <ronoc> bl8 ^
[17:23] <ronoc> thats it really
[17:24] <tedg> kenvandine, Fixed
[17:25] <bl8> ronoc: Sounds reasonable, I'll try to have a look at it after I'm done with what's in the spec. No promises though
[17:25] <ronoc> grand
[17:36] <kenvandine> wow this ssd is fast!
[17:36] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine: are you still seeing problems with facebook account addition with gwibber?
[20:54] <vish> seb128: is this a bug in adduser or ..?  Bug #619532
[20:54] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 619532 in adduser (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Password discountinuity (affects: 2) (heat: 10)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619532
[20:54]  * vish cant find upstream for adduser..
[20:54] <seb128> dunno
[20:55] <vish> seb128: the prompt arises when we change the password from : user and groups
[20:55] <vish> oh! ok..nvm then :)
[20:56] <seb128> dunno I don't work on those softwares
[20:56] <seb128> I've no real knowledge about that stack
[20:56] <vish> seb128: np.. thanks :)
[20:59] <johanbr> vish, http://alioth.debian.org/projects/adduser/
[20:59] <vish> johanbr: ah , thanks :)
[22:06] <devildante> guys, does someone know some tips to focus on coding? :p
[22:15] <chrisccoulson> devildante, that's a bit of an open-ended question ;)
[22:16] <chrisccoulson> can you think of anything specific you'd like to do?
[22:16] <devildante> chrisccoulson: I'm going to code a gtk frontend for hugday-tools
[22:16] <devildante> chrisccoulson: but I can't concentrate :p
[22:17] <chrisccoulson> oh, perhaps i misunderstood your question
[22:17] <chrisccoulson> in that case, there is only 1 correct answer:
[22:17] <chrisccoulson> COFFEE!
[22:17] <chrisccoulson> :)
[22:17] <devildante> I hate coffee :p and it's definitely not a lack of sleep
[22:18] <chrisccoulson> trust me, it solves all of lifes problems
[22:18] <chrisccoulson> ;)
[22:19] <devildante> never, ever gonna drink coffee :p btw, the disconnect from network thingie won't work, hugday is interfacing with the wiki ;)
[22:42] <seb128> pitti, dunno if that's the recent update you did but g-p-m seems to be crashing a lot recently
[22:42] <seb128> pitti, do you think you could do the 2.31.90 update tomorrow and maybe see if you the crash is due to some recent change?
[22:43] <seb128> pitti, (no hurry I'm just letting that in the backlog while I think about it)