=== BenC__ is now known as BenC
=== BenC__ is now known as BenC
AceLanis there anyone runs lucid kernel can paste the below command result here to me thanks07:51
AceLanls /sys/firmware/acpi/tables/07:51
ikepanhcikepanhc@Natasha:~$ ls /sys/firmware/acpi/tables/07:52
ikepanhcAPIC  DSDT     FACP  HPET  SLIC   SSDT2  TCPA07:52
ikepanhcBOOT  dynamic  FACS  MCFG  SSDT1  SSDT307:52
aboganiAPIC  ASF!  DSDT  dynamic  FACP  FACS  WDDT07:52
AceLanikepanhc: cool07:52
AceLanabogani: thx07:53
lagsmb: let "var = 0xc041c0b4 + 0x14"; printf "%02X\n", $var08:59
smblag, Yeah, guess that should do the trick08:59
smbmourning cking 09:03
aboganimorning all!09:04
smbabogani, Good moning09:05
ckinghrm, laptop overheated :-(09:08
ikepanhcthe lenovo N3000?09:08
ikepanhcgood morning .eu09:09
smbI wished we knew why this happens all of a sudden09:09
smbikepanhc, hey09:09
ckingikepanhc, yep09:10
ikepanhcis there any document saying how linux-meta package doing?09:10
* smb rolls the drum09:10
ckingsmb, I maxed the CPUs on spam filtering, and pop it went09:10
ikepanhcseems using 'depends on' to pull linux-image package09:11
* apw looks blery09:11
ckingblurry or bleary?09:11
jk-hey apw, welcome back09:11
apwa bit of both ....09:11
smbcking, Blurry would mean he is fast. Hard to believe at this time09:11
apwjk-, thanks .... not sure i wouldn't rather be supping some nice wine09:12
lagapw: Do you remember us talking about addr2line?10:10
lagapw: http://paste.ubuntu.com/486657/10:10
lagI've written a shim10:11
lagTake -> hack -> keep10:11
apwlooks interesting, it would need some commentry on whats in $ARM/$ARCH for instance10:12
apwas i assume we have to put something there10:12
lagThat's the part you need to hack10:13
lagThat's just where _my_ Arm code lives10:13
lagI could make it more general for distribution, this is just the one I'm going to use10:14
lagapw: For you: http://paste.ubuntu.com/486661/10:22
smbapw, Ok, eomp :)10:45
=== amitk is now known as amitk-afk
=== amitk-afk is now known as amitk
* apw pops to lunch12:36
* smb returns from there12:56
pgranerJFo, can you make sure that https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/399978 and all its dupes get dealt with? Somehow these have slipped thru the cracks and its a regression going all the way back to Karmic or so it would appear.13:05
ubot2Launchpad bug 399978 in linux (Ubuntu) "Excessive heat versus excessive parkings (affects: 18) (dups: 4) (heat: 84)" [Undecided,Confirmed]13:05
smbpgraner, I had been looking on that I believe13:06
pgranersmb, no comments from you on that bug, not sure about the dupes13:06
smbThe problem I see is that setting APM from 254 to 253 already starts the head load cycles13:06
smbpgraner, Wanted to discuss this first on irc and forgot13:07
pgranersmb, talk to manjo he has contacts at WD they might be able to shed some light on it13:07
pgranersmb, JFo will still need to do all process magic on the bugs, get apport-collects and all that fun stuff13:08
smbI did not see increased heat on my netbook with a wd drive, so I cannot tell whether changing AAM would help temprature13:08
smbcking, Have you ever experimented with those? Though I think you rather "burn" ssd's :)13:09
smbJFo, I guess bug 417570 is one of those13:10
ubot2Launchpad bug 417570 in linux (Ubuntu) "hard disk is really hot (affects: 3) (heat: 20)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/41757013:10
ckingsmb, wd drive?13:12
smbcking, Yeah, maybe not only but I  only remember wd drives. I got two laptops with them and no heat problems13:12
ckingsmb, I've only seen overheating when I drove a micro SSD full tilt in a Dell Inspiron 6400 laptop 13:13
smbneither me. but from the reports its claimed that those run at over 50°C and changing APM reduces that, but cause the drive to load-cycle the heads every 15 or so seconds13:14
smbI can confirm the problem with load-cycling13:14
smbcking, Cannot even say whether this is more than a annoyance. One of my drives has nearly done 20,000 of them and still runs. But you hear the clicking everytime it does it13:17
apwmany are only rated in the millions of loads, which if it does it every 15s can mount up pretty fast13:17
* cking wonders how many times one can cycle a HDD before it fails13:17
apwcking, smartutils can tell you i think13:17
smbapw, right smartctl from smartmon-tools13:18
smbor the disk util from system->admin13:18
pgranerapw, so does hdparm -I /dev/sda13:18
pgranerapw, could this be causing some of the heat issues akgraner is seeing?13:19
apwpgraner, this is the same old machine, same as tim's yes?13:20
smbpgraner, She could check the temp of the drive13:20
apwpgraner, if so, unlikely, as it was ok on lucid and i think those settings were karmic and later13:20
apwpgraner, she is seeing a return to the old climes to 90c and switches off thing isn't she ?13:21
pgranerapw, yep, sometimes the box just locks up and won't shut off13:21
* cking pops away for a late lunch13:26
apwbah none of these values really means anything to me, a normalised vale of 103, worst of 94 and actuall of 44 for temperature on my HDD, what the heck does that mean13:28
smbapw, It feels sometimes only the actual makes sense13:29
smbapw, I hope your driver never saw a 94 in temperature13:31
smberr, drive13:31
apwindeed lets hope not13:32
tgardnerogra, is there going to be any rush to re-upload the maverick ti-omap4 package after Beta? I'm out Friday-Mon for the US holiday weekend.13:39
tgardnerI think apw will be around, so he could likely do it.13:39
pgranerapw, I notice that on my Thinkpad ibm-acpi is borked, it reports all temps as 32F or 0C except the CPU 13:40
smbpgraner, Was that ever different? What model?13:41
pgranersmb, T410, I've only ever had maverick on it and had been using acpi temp reporting, I thought I'd check out the ibm-acpi and found that strangeness13:42
smbpgraner, It usually does this for those sensors not present. It might also be that you just have only one. Or it is a bug13:43
smbHm, actually mine does -128 for those not present13:43
pgranersmb, ok13:43
lagapw: include/sound/soc.h:73113:48
pgranerlag, looks like i didn't send you an email, one is in your box now.13:51
lagapw: http://paste.ubuntu.com/486626/13:53
lagpgraner: Thanks13:53
JFopgraner, working on those HDD heat related bugs14:06
ogratgardner, if apw can do it thats fine 14:30
apwJFo, be good to make sure we have some kind of long term monitor of the drive temp, like we do for CPU overheat bugs14:32
apwthat page we did for them has the basic 'watch' stanza to collect it over time14:32
* JFo looks for it14:33
JFoapw, this one? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Debugging/HighTemperatures14:34
apwwe should make up a scripty similar to monitor disks too14:35
diwicsmb, or whoever was wondering about RT kernel for ham radio, have you tried the normal kernel, and how well does it work?14:40
smbsconklin, ^14:40
JFousing hdparm doesn't seem so show me temp on my machine14:40
apwsudo hddtemp -n /dev/sda14:40
apwJFo, ^^ 14:40
sconklindiwic: I haven't gotten all the bits installed to test yet, but I intend to14:40
JFocommand not found apw14:41
diwicsconklin, I'm curious of how well things would work and also how well the preempt kernel would work14:41
sconklindiwic: This is a horrible set of things to install, mostly from source, all glued together with shell scripts and config files that have to have the paths to various source dirs14:41
JFoclearly I am missing something14:41
sconklinBut it's definitely on my list to try various kernels14:41
sconklinIt may be that they spec the rt kernel because it uses jack14:42
sconklindiwic: this will give you a feel for all the things you have to install: http://code.google.com/p/sdr-shell/wiki/HowToCompileandInstallDttSPfromCGRAN14:43
diwicsconklin, my general impression is that normal kernels will do fine, but it might be that some drivers blocks the kernel for a very long time 14:43
diwicsconklin, dpkg-configure jackd will do the section under "Kernel parameters" there14:44
sconklinwell, if I have a setup that reliably reproduces blockage like that, that's useful. I did some rt and low-latency work many years ago, and half the problem was being able to excercise the paths that held the kernel locks14:44
sconklindiwic: oh, thanks for that14:44
diwicsconklin, for Natty I'd like to change the group name14:45
diwicsconklin, but that's a different story14:45
sconklindiwic: the amateur radio community fights a lot of sound problems, but they're not well plugged into the rest of the development community, so there are a lot of various pages with voodoo recommendations for dealing with problems14:46
diwicsconklin, and unfortunately, the ubuntu community pages are not really correct either14:47
diwicas in there is "voodoo" there as well14:47
sconklinyes. I hope that the stackexchange goodness can overtake that eventually14:48
apwsconklin, sounds like you are generally using hideously out of date kernels as well, cause of the RT requirement, one I cannot begin to understand14:57
apwi don't see ham radio occuring at a speed to engender such a requirement14:57
sconklinapw: these are primarily requirements for SDR orr software defined radio, which places very high computational demands on the system while still having to move multiple audio streams around at 48000 samples per second or higher, with zero dropouts14:58
diwicsconklin, that's unimportant compared to the latency demands you have14:59
sconklindiwic: kernel latency or audio stream latency? Because delays in the audio stream aren't that big a deal (in a pipelining sense)15:00
* apw tries to see how you have any latency requierme15:01
apwrequirement, if you have no pipelining latency requirements15:01
apwbut then thats why i am a kernel engineer not an audio engineer15:01
diwicsconklin, what's the lowest latency you need for *anything*? 15:02
diwicsconklin, as in "when my ham radio station receives a packet, I want it to start playing within x msecs"15:03
sconklinapw: Processing (FFTs and other signal processing occurs over a time range of samples, which is continuously processed. If you lose samples or have to wait for them, it blows the processing, and it doesn't resolve until the entire set of linear samples gets filled again with good data15:03
sconklindiwic: disclaimer: I am only just delving into this (SDR) but in general for standard TX and RX, hundreds of mS are probably ok. It's very like mumble in that sense.15:04
sconklinfor packet based things where theres a protocol on top, this might be slightly more restricted, but I've done some of this with packet radio, and standard kernels work fine15:06
diwicsconklin, how can waiting for samples blow the processing? You'll just continue the processing once the new samples has arrived, which leads to a higher latency.15:06
sconklinbecause it created a delay in the output, and the output is fed into further processing to decode various frequency-shift and multitone encodings, and accurate timing matters. Not so much with voice, our brains are pretty good at fixing voice15:08
sconklinit blows it because there are multiple stages of processing, and later ones depend on the timing15:09
sconklinHmm, I sense a conference talk here.15:09
diwicsconklin, not over ham radio, I hope ;-)15:09
sconklinwell, more like "Amateur radio audio processing, which metrics matter in audio and the kernel"15:10
diwicsconklin, "over" as in "transferred over"15:11
diwicsconklin, sample processing should not have the wall clock as input, only count samples. IMHO. 15:11
sconklinoh :)15:11
sconklindiwic: that's not how the world works ;-)15:12
diwicsconklin, fix the world, then ;-)15:12
sconklinwhen all this stuff was done in special SP hardware, these were design constraints, but now that it's moving to generalized computing platforms, it's not so simple.15:13
sconklindiwic: by the way, these are the some of the same issues that the financial quant guys care about in the kernel. Not for Audio, but for analyzing market data. That's why RH pays a lot of attention to things like the statistical distribution of latency of packets from the wire to userspace15:15
diwicsconklin, yeah, I heard that talk by John Kauer (?) /RedHat at Linux Audio Conference. 15:17
diwicsconklin, he also tried to explain the difference between rt and preempt kernels15:17
sconklinoh, I didn't would like to have.15:17
sconklinit's interesting, there are different classes of users. Some want a guarantee that latency will never, ever exceed a certain amount, and others don't care about a few outliers as long as the mean is very low. Two different problem sets.15:18
diwicsconklin, but that was more from a design rather than user perspective, but I got the feeling that the preempt kernel would work for all practical purposes, so you won't have to try the rt one15:19
sconklindiwic: iirc that's correct. I used to work with Clark Williams at RH, and he did a lot of that work. I built the hardware test set that they probably still use to measure interrupt processing latency15:20
pgranersmb, it this what you have been working on?15:22
diwicsconklin, ah, that was nice to know, now I know who to bug the next time I try to understand latencytop15:23
smbpgraner, No looks like something different15:23
sconklinafter my time lalalala can't hear you15:23
pgranersmb, ok, might want to keep it in mind15:23
diwicI need to call it a day for now.15:24
sconklinbut seriously, Clark is a really nice guy and very approachable and knows this inside out15:24
smbpgraner, Yeah, thanks. I keep an eye on it for Lucid and probably need to consider for Hardy15:24
* pgraner nods15:24
=== diwic is now known as diwic_afk
tgardnerpgraner, have you checked on emerald recently? seems dead15:26
pgranertgardner, no, I was out yesterday, lemme go down there now15:27
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
* smb sees a pint in his near future17:28
* amitk is seeing the same future17:30
smbAlways good to get the nice fortune cookies. :)17:31
=== smb is now known as smb-afk
JFosconklin, got the first of the boxes today17:48
sconklinstrange, they were together when they left. Maybe that's a feature of the cheap shipping rate17:49
sconklinJFo: I'm not sure how useful most of that will be.17:50
JFoeh, it will or it won't17:54
JFoeither way...17:54
JFoI got the Litl with the curiously strong magnets?17:54
* achiang perks up at mention of litl18:00
apwsmb-afk, what a good idea18:22
ckingJFo, don't put those magnets near a HDD18:26
=== cking_ is now known as cking
* tgardner lunches19:02
=== fddfoo is now known as fdd
manjocking, you coming back :) 19:31
manjocking, did I scare you ? 19:31
ckingmanjo, http://paste.ubuntu.com/486907/19:37
=== ivoks_away is now known as ivoks
=== cking is now known as cking-afk
tgardnerapw, http://marc.info/?l=linux-kernel&m=128335681711984&w=219:53
* jjohansen -> lunch20:11
=== kentb is now known as kentb_dell
=== tgardner is now known as tgardner-afk
* ogasawara lunch20:44
=== tgardner-afk is now known as tgardner
=== ivoks is now known as ivoks_away
broti am trying to bisect a bug in the kernel, and need to compile my own kernel packages to do so. running "make-kpkg --initrd --append-to-version=bisect1 kernel-image kernel-headers" for the vanilla kernel sources fails with:http://paste.ubuntuusers.de/398863/  . can someone tell me what i am doing wrong?23:53

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