* flan kinda liked having all the apt commands grouped under one utilitiy.00:00
humphreybcHi everyone00:36
humphreybctime to see if I can pull a fresh branch and test our installation instructions00:36
humphreybcbecause I have totally forgotten how to use bzr :P00:36
MuscovyIt took me a while to discover a few vital features.00:37
MuscovyLike bzr add. :P00:37
humphreybcgodbyk: are you there? how can I check if I have the correct version of latex installed?00:37
MuscovyI think the pkgs/install-pkgs.sh does that.00:39
humphreybcin the branch?00:39
humphreybcand we're still working in lp:ubuntu-manual?00:39
humphreybcnot lp:ubuntu-manual/maverick or something?00:39
MuscovyMaverick branch is lp:ubuntu-manual.00:40
humphreybc great00:40
humphreybcso it is :D00:40
humphreybcI've got my coffee and last night's pizza ready to be re-heated for lunch00:40
humphreybcsome nice music playing, all ready to start working through these 172 pages of text :D00:41
humphreybchey banshee gapless playback is working all of a sudden00:43
humphreybctook like 10 seconds to branch00:49
humphreybceverything installed except one thing which the script installed :D00:49
humphreybcthis is better than I remember :D00:49
MuscovyJust in case you didn't know, manual doesn't compile currently.00:49
MuscovySo if you try, it's probably not your edit.00:49
humphreybcthanks :)00:50
godbykhumphreybc: yeah, I'm here.00:51
humphreybci've got the latest branch00:52
humphreybcgoing to burn through these open bugs firstr00:52
godbykrun "xelatex --version".  It should say "XeTeX 3.1415926-2.2-0.9995.2 (TeX Live 2009)".00:52
humphreybcthen I'll start making edits for maverick00:52
humphreybcyup, all good00:52
MuscovyDoes Maverick have the right version of Tex, anyone know?00:53
godbykMuscovy: I'm not sure if it does or not.00:54
flanI'm installing it now.00:54
humphreybcTHANK GOD Launchpad has fixed a heap of things so overlays come up when changing bug details instead of loading new pages!!00:55
godbyklooks like the PPA glossary entry hasn't been defined.00:57
godbykSomeone misspelled \marginnote.00:57
flanxelatex --version looks correct, numerically.00:58
flanThe string devates a little, though, saying TeX Live 2009/Debian.00:58
humphreybcgodbyk: could you do us a favour and fix the compile errors so it will compile for me to test?00:59
godbykI'm working on it.00:59
humphreybci'm going to push my changes01:00
humphreybclet me try and remember how :P01:00
godbykflan: I think that the Lucid packages were missing some required TeX Live packages. I don't know if they're in the Maverick packages now or not.01:00
humphreybcwalk me through so I don't cock it up01:00
godbykhumphreybc: don't push your changes yet.01:00
godbykgimme just a sec.01:00
flangodbyk, is there a simple command sequence I could use to test?01:00
Muscovyflan: compiling lucid-e2 might be a good trial-by-fire.01:01
flanMuscovy, I've never compiled the manual before, so I'm not sure where to start.01:01
humphreybcguys, have a look at this bug report and the comment I added and tell me what you think01:02
manualbotLaunchpad bug 584537 in ubuntu-manual "notification area is/will be obsolete" [Low,Confirmed]01:02
MuscovyI think that looks good.01:05
MuscovyBesides, other than intended phasing out, not much is really happening yet.01:05
Muscovyflan: Have you run pkgs/install-pkgs.sh?01:06
MuscovyOnce you do that, and you're theoretically all set up, compiling is just make ubuntu-manual-en_US.pdf (in the main directory).01:06
godbykhumphreybc: Okay, the PDF should build okay now.01:06
godbykhumphreybc: you'll have to run bzr pull to grab the changes.01:06
humphreybclet me pull01:06
godbykthen you can commit and push your changes.01:07
flanMuscovy, which branch do I need?01:07
humphreybcwhat the bzr shortcut to mark bugs as fix committed?01:08
humphreybc--fixes-bugs or something?01:08
godbykhumphreybc: I never remember.01:09
Muscovyflan: lp:ubuntu-manual/lucid-e2 for a compile test.01:11
nigelbhumphreybc: --fixes=123401:11
MuscovySince the main branch doesn't compile right now.01:11
humphreybcnigelb: how do I do multiple bugs?01:11
humphreybcgodbyk: main branch still not compiling01:11
humphreybcunless I broke it01:11
nigelbno clue :D01:12
nigelbideally, one commit should be fixing one bug (commit often?) :D01:12
humphreybcgodbyk: what does the \gls command do?01:12
flanBazaar's spewing host key validation errors at my Maverick box.01:12
godbykhumphreybc: Creates a cross-link to the glossary entry.01:12
humphreybcah, that's why it wasn't working01:13
Muscovyflan: Have you got your/an SSH key?01:13
humphreybctakes a while to compile nowadays huh :P01:13
humphreybchttps://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/+bugs :D01:14
flanMuscovy, of course. The only thing I can think of is that I'd need to be a member of the manual project itself to be able to pull this branch.01:14
humphreybccan we get the remaining four bugs sorted today?01:14
flan(I'm associated through Quickshot)01:14
MuscovyTo be honest, I didn't know people needed to login at all to get branches.01:15
humphreybcwho's got the link to that etherpad?01:16
flanNeither did I.01:16
MuscovyGah, my inbox is filling with the manual's bug reports. XD01:22
humphreybcanyone recently installed maverick?01:30
godbykI haven't installed it at all yet.01:30
humphreybcyou should :)01:31
MuscovyI've got a partition.01:33
MuscovyI use it on and off.01:33
MuscovyIt's temping to just use it, but beta wackiness drives me nutty.01:33
humphreybcI've been using maverick since alpha (a dodgy upgrade from Lucid no less!) and it's been stable as a rock01:35
flanI installed the beta in VirtualBox today.01:36
flan(So I can test Quickshot functionality tomorrow)01:37
humphreybcflan: is the clock indicator default?01:37
flanThe what now?01:37
humphreybcgo to the clock in the panel01:37
flanAnd do what?01:37
humphreybcis it an indicator (ie, left click opens it up, consistent with the memenu, shutdown and shit)01:37
humphreybcright click should display a menu saying "remove from panel" and other crap01:38
flanLeft-click brings up the calendar view, same as it's always done.01:38
flanSame as I hope it always does.01:38
humphreybcright click?01:38
humphreybccan you "scroll" through all of the indicators (like volume, messaging, clock, memenu, session menu) ?01:38
humphreybcif you open one and move across01:38
flanNo. The clock is different from the rest.01:39
flanIt still uses Karmic-style colours.01:39
flanIt's the same docklet as it's been for years.01:39
humphreybcI guess they're not putting it on the desktop till Natty then01:40
godbykShouldn't manualbot tell us when things have been committed to the repository?01:41
humphreybcit should01:47
humphreybcback in about an hour, getting lunch01:47
dakergodbyk, have you installed django on the server ?01:48
godbykdaker: I think I have an old version on there.01:49
dakerwhich one ?01:49
godbykLet me look01:50
dakergodbyk, food time01:54
flanMuscovy, the Maverick TeX Live packages seem to be unable to find things like xifthen.sty and xkeyval.sty.02:37
MuscovySomeone really ought to update it. :|02:41
MuscovyActually, I'm surprised the manual doesn't have a Tex PPA or something.02:42
godbykMuscovy: We do have a TeX PPA.  But I think it's offline at the moment.02:59
MuscovyOffline as in outdated or as in Launchpad is moody?03:02
godbykI think the latter two.03:03
godbykjenkins is the one to ask about it. He's the one who set up the PPA.03:04
humphreybcgodbyk: I assigned a few bugs to you btw :)03:05
godbykhumphreybc: Gee, thanks!  :-)03:05
humphreybcwhen you install Maverick (which will be very soon hopefully) can you take notes on the new installer?03:05
humphreybcit hasn't landed just yet though03:05
godbykYeah, I can do that when the installer lands.03:05
humphreybclp:ubuntu-manual-website is working, right?03:06
godbykhumphreybc: should be.03:07
humphreybcy'know, it's not actually the end of the world if we release the manual AFTER Maverick comes out03:07
humphreybcof course it's ideal to coincide with the release03:07
humphreybcbut manuals for OSes usually come out long after the OS is released03:08
humphreybc(probably because other OSes are proprietary)03:08
godbykwe may have to depending on when all the UI updates finally land.03:08
godbyk(They won't stop changing things on us.)03:08
humphreybcso much for the UI freeze03:08
MuscovyI think we should aim for as-close-as-possible.03:08
humphreybcI'm struggling to actually figure out what needs to be changed text wise03:09
humphreybcfor bugs like this03:09
manualbotLaunchpad bug 630548 in ubuntu-manual "MeMenu, sound menu and messaging menu changes" [High,Confirmed]03:09
godbykyou'll have to read through that section of the manual and see if anything no longer holds true with the new menus.03:12
humphreybcfixing the f-spot / shotwell thing atm03:17
humphreybcgodbyk: how do I do bullet points again?03:35
godbyk \begin{itemize} \item blah \item blah \end{itemize}03:36
humphreybchow would you explain "tint" for an image?03:38
humphreybcSaturation is "how colorful the image is"03:38
humphreybctint is...?03:38
humphreybcwhat's the command for bold?03:39
godbykhumphreybc: bold for what, specifically?03:39
humphreybcand for an emdash?03:39
godbykdash is \dash03:39
humphreybci'm listing the options under "Adjust" - levls, exposure, saturation, tint, temp etc etc. I want to bold the names of each thing and then have a very short description beside them03:40
godbykUse \begin{description} \item[Levels} blah blah \item[Exposure] blah blah \end{description}03:40
humphreybcoh ok03:41
humphreybcdescription for tint?03:41
godbykyou're on your own there.03:42
MuscovyGeneral colour scheme maybe?03:42
MuscovyI'd image that means basically adding a really page colour overlay.03:43
MuscovyLike saturation but not just greyscaled?03:43
humphreybcif someone wants to go through the shotwell stuff and have a look at the changes, i'd be grateful03:50
MuscovyJust make a list or something?03:51
humphreybccomment on the bug report03:51
humphreybcor alternatively, just make changes03:51
MuscovyI could help, but I don't feel like using Shotwell for an hour.03:52
humphreybcneither do I, but has to be done :D03:53
=== zkriesse__ is now known as zkriesse_
godbykThis project is hard work. Who's dumb idea was this anyway?!  ;-)03:53
MuscovyIt must be cool to look back at when it was just an idea.03:54
humphreybcthose are the most important03:54
humphreybcMuscovy: you should see the original manual from open office :P03:54
MuscovyI've assigned myself to Software Centre stuff, since I've already been working on that.03:55
MuscovyI'll stick to the Software Centre for now, but I'll probably play with Shotwell tomorrow.03:57
MuscovyIt's evening here and nearing reading time.03:57
=== Zeike is now known as brandonj
humphreybccan we get manualbot telling us when people have pushed to the branch and their commit message?04:04
humphreybcit would be immensely helpful04:04
godbykhumphreybc: there's apparently a supybot bzr plugin.04:09
godbykhumphreybc: dude, you gotta stop adding revision.tex and screenshots.log files. :)04:26
humphreybcmy bad :P04:27
MuscovyIs someone working on the cover?04:28
godbykMuscovy: thorwil handles the covers.04:29
dutchierev 1012:11
manualbothttp://bazaar.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual/revision/10 | http://bazaar.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual -r 1012:11
jenkinsflan: in glade id you go help > about > credits they have the e-mail's click able any idea how to do that with a normal text box/lable ?17:01
flanIt might be a Pango markup property. I'm really not sure.17:04
flanI wouldn't worry too much about that detail.17:04
flanFigure it out if you have time.17:04
jenkinsk I will look into it17:05
jenkinsapart from adding the people into the credits windows is there anything elese you would liek me to do?17:07
flanOnce credits and licence are done?17:07
jenkinsI am trying to find one or two settings for to get those pages pefect17:08
flanWell, we're going to need much better logging coverage... And documentation...17:09
jenkinsdocumentaion on how to use it?17:09
flanThink you can write good-sounding text that may be exposed to other developers?17:09
flanNo, documentation of the code itself.17:09
flanWe've got a lot of it.17:09
flanI was planning to do that after we have 0.9.x ready.17:09
flanBEcause of the crunch.17:10
jenkinsI don't know what alot of the code does but I can have a read and see what makes sense17:10
flanIf not, then environment_details contains a number of bugs.17:10
flanLike commands being expressed as strings, rather than sequences.17:10
flanWould you be comfortable wrapping, testing, and revising those functions?17:11
flanI should have screen-captures working again very soon.17:11
flanSo we'll also need to test stuff.17:11
jenkinshave you implimented the resolution changing stuff?17:12
flanNo, not yet.17:12
flanI'm going to work backwards.17:12
jenkinsk just wondering if it was failing for me :)17:12
flanIf you want to write some basic functions thatll change and roll back the resolution and put them inot a new package inside of lib/, that would work.17:13
flanmkdir lib/resolution/17:13
flantouch lib/resolution/__init__.py17:13
flanPut stuff in there.17:13
jenkinsok I will do some work into how to get the origianl resolution. i must be stored some where17:13
flanNo, it's not failing. I just wanted to make sure I had callbacks working from that window.17:13
flanSo it'd behave the way the user would expect.17:14
jenkinsyea cool17:14
flanThe resolution library will need to provide the current resolution and change resolutions. It shouldn't need any other externally accessible functions.17:14
flanIt should internally handle everything currently done by environment_details.17:15
flanSo move all the grapgics-card-checking stuff into that module and make it completely isolated from the rest of the code.17:15
flanget_resolution() -> tuple(x, y); set_resolution(x, y) -> any number of possible exceptions, grouped under a common Error class. See the server modules for examples on how to do this.17:16
jenkinsok I will have a read i need to work out how to get the current resolution first17:22
flanOf course.17:22
flanI've got lots to do, so there's no rush.17:22
flanGetting it right is more important than just getting something.17:23
jenkinsok makes sense17:23
thorwiljenkins: hi! http://www.foopics.com/showfull/1827bc02f1d99e1d27108dd08590e84b17:40
jenkinshey thorwil i like the lower one, what would it look like with different colour text to the  large  Q17:42
jenkinsalso what contact details/e-mail would you like to have next to your name in the credits window?17:42
thorwiljenkins: i'd like a link to http://thorwil.wordpress.com/17:44
jenkinscool will do :)17:44
thorwiljenkins: if others appear with email address, t_w_@freenet.de is ok (known to every spammer one earth since long)17:45
jenkinsI am happy with the website, I will bear that in mind thanks17:46
thorwiljenkins: so it's all about color tweaks for the logo now?17:47
* thorwil -> dinner17:47
jenkinsfor me yes17:47
jenkinsi like the bottom one over the top17:47
jenkinshave a nice dinner thorwil17:49
jenkinsbe back later18:16
=== Zeike is now known as brandonj
thorwiljenkins, flan: http://www.foopics.com/showfull/98ddcd8128b519d7bf110ea9c5f80c5320:36
jenkinsI am not sure about the use of the background color and how it would look in the program. I prefer the colours on the left20:38
flanI'm okay with whatever.20:39
flanI don't think we can really go too wrong.20:39
jenkinsI am just putting it in the app to see what it looks like20:42
thorwiljenkins: not sure about what to do with the logo for in-app use, would have to see ...20:42
MuscovyThat's a _nice_ set of logos.20:43
jenkinshttp://imagebin.org/112804 apart form the over streched window i am unsure. what about swapping the bacground colour and the white?20:44
thorwilbtw, did ben say anything about the earthquake in christchurch?20:44
jenkinserm he is ok thats all i konw20:45
jenkinsok now I like the bottom right. what about making the background white and changing the text to the background color on that one?20:45
jenkinswhite/see through20:46
thorwilguess there will have to be 2, one for use on bright ground20:46
thorwilthe other as intended for the website20:46
thorwilthe idea behind the color and contrast is a camera flash20:47
jenkinsI see they are great! btw20:48
thorwilglad you like them :)20:48
jenkinsI was looking at colour choices earlier using agave and could not come up with anything. its very hard, you have made a good choice on that.20:50
jenkinsI think the bottom left one and do it with white/transparent on the outside with current background where white is for one version .then as it is for the other one. would that look right ?20:52
flanjenkins, are you good with visualizing 2D geometry in discrete co-ordinates?20:54
flanI'm trying to redo the sub-rect logic and I'm starting to lose concentration.20:54
jenkinsdo you mean take a screenshot of the panel only stuff?20:55
jenkinsI should be good with 2d cordinates20:55
flanUh... Sure.20:55
* jenkins is sure flan thinks he is mad :)20:55
flanI mean more like "Given this cropped section of the screen, take this other rectangle and reduce the area to only the overlapping parts"20:55
thorwiljenkins: i found tools like agave to be more of a distraction than a help, as colors depend on their surrounding so much20:56
flanYou're an engineer. I'd expect you to be better with numbers.20:56
jenkinsI am good with numbers, i just have to make sure i right them down correctly. what do you mean by overlapping parts?20:58
jenkinsthorwil: makes sense why i could not get any where with it20:58
MuscovyQuickshot uses PyGTK, right?20:58
flanYes, Muscovy, it does.20:59
MuscovyAre there any tutorials you'd recommend? I mean to learn it, but it looks frighteningly complicated.21:00
flanIt's actually quite easy.21:00
flanThe reference documentation is excellent.21:00
flanAre you comfortable with Python in gneeral?21:01
MuscovyI just know "general Python".21:01
jenkinsnissh recomended http://learnpygtk.org/pygtktutorial/index.html to me it does not cover everything but is usefull21:02
flanAre you intimidated by the Python module index?21:02
jenkinsflan: which bits overlap that what i don't get21:02
MuscovyThanks jenkins, I'll bookmark that.21:05
thorwilenough for today, good night! :)21:07
flanjenkins, I just wrote a summary. I'll commit it in a moment.21:11
jenkinsok ty21:11
flanI basically just need you to write a function that takes some base geometry and a pair of flags and returns potentially altered geometry.21:12
jenkinsI am trying to work out how gnome-display-properties works out the current screenset up21:12
flan(A tuple of four numbers)21:12
jenkinsok cool I will take a look21:13
flanThere's a much easier way than that.21:13
jenkinsI have gained memories of wnckd or something21:14
flanwnck can do it easily, yes.21:15
flan>>> import gtk21:15
flan>>> gtk.gdk.screen_get_default().get_width()21:15
flan>>> gtk.gdk.screen_get_default().get_height()21:15
jenkinshow would you tell if there are two screens?21:15
flanDo you need to?21:15
jenkinswell people can have some strange setups21:16
flanFair enough.21:17
jenkinswe can use your way for now but it would be good to do it properly21:18
jenkinsI will have a play with dgkscreen21:19
flanI've just got my monitors merged into a single massive screen managed by X viewports.21:19
flanI think that's pretty common.21:20
flanResizing it would look terrible, of course.21:20
jenkinsits how nvidia twin view is handled. last release i cloned the display on the outputs for dual screens21:20
* jenkins starts using gnome shell to see how he gets on21:27
flanMath issue worked out.21:38
jenkinsnight all22:05
flanHi, brettalton.22:11
flanIt's so rare that people will apply and actually drop by.22:12
MuscovyApply for what?22:12
flanThe Quickshot team.22:12
brettaltonwell I wanted to get workin :)22:13
flanAre you familiar with PyGTK or should I try to force some library tasks on you?22:14
flanThough I've actually finished all the major PyGTK reworking...22:14
flanAnd I'm going to be connecting pieces pretty quickly, so trying to work in the GUI right now might be an exercise in futility.22:14
brettaltonflan: you talking to me? I'm just the (new) website guy :(22:15
brettaltonin time I would like to learn PyGTK though22:15
flanWell, then, in that case, you'll probably want to speak to daker.22:16
* flan approves application.22:16
brettaltonYa, I've got what I need, I just want to download the website branch so I can submit some changes here22:17
brettaltonflan: excellent, thank you22:17
flanI dunno if we're still using that branch...22:17
flanI'm not sure what's going on witht he website.22:17
flanI've been too busy trying to get the application itself ready for the 10th.22:18
brettaltonflan: don't worry, I've been talking with humphreybc and he got me on path22:18
flanI'll leave it to you, then. Not that I had any intention of building the site myself or anything.22:23
* flan is not a designer.22:23
brettaltonhey, we all have our skills. If it wasn't for you, what would the quickshot 1.0 release be?22:25
flan0.0.8 with, like, more numbers.22:25
flanWhich would be *awesome*.22:25
brettaltondaker: you there?23:05
dakerhey brettalton23:39
brettaltonhey daker23:39
dakerbrettalton, need help ?23:51

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