[17:33] <vish> troy_s: hey , havent touched blender yet.. :(  but when i tried your .blend files , they seemed empty , need to check on them again.. :)
[17:33] <vish> i*
[17:43]  * darkmatter still has to finish setting up gimp(ed), blended, and sloshscaped 
[17:44] <darkmatter> vish: appmenus are almost useable now! *rubs hands eagerly in anticipation*
[17:44] <vish> meh!  i rarely use the menu ;p
[17:45] <darkmatter> vish: I actually hate menus, but 20ish+ extra pixels is a good thing :P
[17:46] <darkmatter> none of my designs have menus *shrug*
[17:46] <vish> darkmatter: well , you can just remove the menu and /not/ have the top panel  .. and you'd get another 20px ;p
[17:46] <darkmatter> ;P
[17:47] <darkmatter> oooo... my fonts look good in blender :O
[17:48] <vish> gah!  stop it!  now, i need to make time for blender!
[17:48] <vish> ;)
[17:49] <darkmatter> vish: still gotta customize the theme and layout. but nommy! http://img814.imageshack.us/img814/2718/screenshottw.png
[17:51] <vish> darkmatter: i just checked out fanzea theme , pretty impressive for a single guy to get so much work done :)
[17:52] <vish> but i guess the plus side is , there is consistency there ;p
[17:53] <darkmatter> vish: aye. it has its shortcomings though. I have menus n stuff at 16 pixels. and I have fuzzy little iOS blobs! ;P
[17:54] <vish> darkmatter: yeah , i think he might have just scaled the icons down from one size..
[17:55] <darkmatter> yea. some of them are crispy. others not so much. but wip's being what they are
[17:59] <darkmatter> vish: I'm actually adapting some o' my designs to be moar 'buntu-ish. I think I could get it to fit in nicely with a few tweaks (I already like the general schtuff they're doing)
[18:04] <vish> darkmatter: hmm , the radience seems to be a bit overboard with the inner-outline for menus , seems a bit too bright..
[18:08] <darkmatter> vish: aye. the main drawback of radiance is if you drop compositing the menus and panels are flat. need a bit o contrast there. not black, just 5 or 6 shades darker sand ;)
[18:09] <darkmatter> otherwise its not bad
[18:09] <vish> yeah , only the menu was a bother on my eyes by being too bright
[18:10] <darkmatter> btw. I'm currently tweaking radiance and ambiance for mo bettah padding in regards to the overall aesthetic + fixing a few buggs (uber dark insensitive text in menus)
[18:13] <darkmatter> but gotta pause work on various things for a week. headin out on a medical trip again
[18:14] <darkmatter> reminds me. I should get off my ass and shave in a bit
[18:18] <thorwil> vish: if you want to get into blender, you should start with a tutorial. myself, i tend to learn by exploring and only look for documentation when i'm stuck, but with blender, that approach didn't work
[18:19] <vish> thorwil: yup , i'v seen one of those..
[18:20] <vish> still need to see the second part of the intro :D
[18:20] <darkmatter> rooibos+lime= ♥
[18:21] <thorwil> written ones with screenshots have their place, too
[18:21] <thorwil> perhaps especially for getting round the gui itself
[18:21] <vish> hehe! yeah , just wish i had more time :)
[18:21] <thorwil> don't we all?
[18:21] <vish> damn who ever stuck us all with only 24 hrs a day!
[18:28] <darkmatter> vish: I haz an idea for an optional indicator-main-menu! including having an uby logo that changes state on available updates. and an entry proper for the update manager that goes bold text (<number of updates>) with maybe a little coloured arrow signifying security/enhancement/whatever based on teh level of importance! and it's non traditional to boot!
[18:31] <darkmatter> vish. instead of popping up/minimizing the update manager, since the menu is the most commonly accessed feature for most users it makes sense to put that there. just one small feature of the idea. secondly, you could have an auto "update you moron" feature in the session menu (like teh win minus the mandatory reboot unless it's a driver :P)
[18:32] <darkmatter> in case they forget ;o
[18:37] <darkmatter> gonna have to mak semi live mockups though, for testing purposes
[18:38] <vish> darkmatter: updates is not a new idea! :p
[18:38] <vish> there have been mockups for that for more than a yr ;)
[18:38] <vish> but mpt does not want to do that..
[18:39] <darkmatter> vish: which is why I said "optional" :P
[18:40] <darkmatter> because most so-called designers are clueless :P *ducks for cover*
[18:40] <vish> darkmatter: no! no options allowed! ayatana will not give you options! ;p
[18:41] <darkmatter> ;P
[18:41] <darkmatter> vish: then I branch/fork! ;P
[18:41] <vish> darkmatter: seriously , if you say , "add an option"! mark cries a little ;)
[18:42] <darkmatter> vish: that's not what I meant by 'option' :P
[18:42] <vish> darkmatter: no gconf either ;)
[18:44] <darkmatter> vish. by 'option' I meant 'install this hear specialized but dirt simple indicator based applet if you so wish and get rid of the crud bloat gnome menubar"
[18:45] <darkmatter> that discriptive enough? :P
[18:45] <darkmatter> e in there somewhere :P
[18:45] <darkmatter> here*
[18:48] <vish> darkmatter: well , aernt you just reimplementing the notification area icon? :)
[18:48] <darkmatter> vish: we can call it indicator-markandmpthatemelongtime-menu
[18:49]  * vish maybe i just need to sleep :s
[18:50] <darkmatter> vish: no! I hate notification areas as much as I hate windows popping up in my face or staring at a bazillion <whatevers> on a dock, etc to see whats changed!
[18:50] <darkmatter> vish: first time the update notifier did that I almost shit my pants ;P
[18:50] <vish> darkmatter: well , mpt's rationale for the window poping up was , instead of user having to click on an icon somewhere and then bring up the window , just bring up the window..
[18:52] <darkmatter> yes. ala windows "fuck you! I'm in charge! users suck!" rational. seriously. do not force an issue in the midst of the "workflow" (pr0n streaming). make it auto on session quit or have a notification in the menu (session or main. whatever)
[18:53] <darkmatter> in-your-face has long been shown to _not_ work
[18:53] <vish> darkmatter: yeah , we all tried to yell that at mpt , but he is stubborn ya know ;)
[18:53] <darkmatter> unless the goal is pissing people off, then it works quite well
[18:53] <knome> darkmatter, can you please try to calm down?
[18:54] <darkmatter> knome: I'm perfectly calm. now shush. you're interupting my rant :P
[19:02] <knome> darkmatter, the ubuntu irc channel guidelines also apply to #ubuntu-artwork
[19:02] <darkmatter> vish: even a "You have <number> updates pending. Please log in to review and install the available updates." banner message at gdm is feasible and far less intrusive
[19:04] <darkmatter> knome: goodie. tell mark to sue me for breach of protocol. :P
[19:05] <knome> darkmatter, i don't really think that most of the people want that kind of attitude or language in the channels
[19:09] <darkmatter> attitude and language. let me tell you something. I've done more good in my life for the benefit of others than most would possibly dream of and done not but suffer in return. if the precious rules can't let slide the occasional "slip" than whatever. I'm too old to care about someone elses rules, and I've seen far worse things "veiled" as polite in official channels than one little profanity
[19:10] <knome> that's not really the point. there is no exceptions to the rules.
[19:11] <knome> it doesn't matter even if you donated all your money to ubuntu. the guidelines apply.
[19:11] <darkmatter> I quit worrying about any level of even semi-official involvement after seeing firsthand the dirty little games members play. I' here to associate with people I respect, and above that I dun give a crap
[19:12] <darkmatter> so in other words "go lecture someone who cares about hypocrisy"
[19:12] <vish> alrighty! kids go to bed NOW!
[19:12] <troy_s> Sorry
[19:13]  * vish sleeps too :)
[19:13] <knome> night vish
[19:16] <troy_s> darkmatter: Family channel. No swearing. You already know that...
[19:18] <troy_s> darkmatter: Fair?
[19:20] <darkmatter> lol. one slip of the tongue (not even directed at a person)  and it's BOFH mode. rofl. maybe you should op in other official channels and ban all the fools that twist the rules _regularly_ and treat each other like general crap under the veil of the CoC. is that equally fair? anyway. I'm out. got better thing to do than discuss this
[19:22] <knome> darkmatter, sorry to see you go
[19:23] <troy_s> vish: The files will have broken links. There is a menu item to find the missing assets.
[19:25] <troy_s> darkmatter: I don't care to really have a huge debate about it. It's pretty obvious that language is an issue around these parts so try and keep the tone family friendly. Passion is great. Random gutter speak not so much.
[19:26] <darkmatter> knome: sorry, but I dun stay where the children try to muscle people for a simple mistake (not referring to you, obviously, you didn't try to pull the op card). I've better thing to do quite frankly than soothing inflated egos :) take care dude. I've gotta go and endure my monthly week of tortures anyhow
[19:28] <thorwil> with more children like troy_s on the intertubes, lolspeak would be something entirely different, me thinks
[19:28] <troy_s> thorwil: Probably. Although I have a helicopter landing pad the size of a grapefruit on my head, which is hard to reconcile with being a child.
[19:30] <knome> troy_s, a small or big grapefruit?
[19:30] <troy_s> knome: Big. Very big.
[19:30] <knome> :o
[19:31]  * thorwil 's imagination has special forces land on the helicopter pad of troy's head, which somewhat resembles a grapefruit. the pirates demand that the special forces define their target audience before shooting
[19:31] <troy_s> Wow. I got accused of inflated ego with an op mode shift. Now that's something I haven't seen.
[19:31] <troy_s> (Especially considering that I was randomly typing commands into the IRC session to see if I could remember even how to _get_ ops and remove them. LOL.)
[19:32] <troy_s> thorwil: Shoot first if you know what's good for you.
[19:33] <troy_s> thorwil: Anything new?
[19:33] <thorwil> troy_s: i guess you know about the generative wallpaper plans, drifting apart and converging towards specific dates?
[19:34] <thorwil> troy_s: i have happy clients at the queen mary university. will likely blog about it once this is wrapped up
[19:34] <troy_s> thorwil: I saw the animated wallpaper plans. Not really sure what it brings to the table when the default wallpaper is as it is.
[19:35] <thorwil> troy_s: to me it seems to be throwing composition and any sense of precision/engineering out of the window to realize an artsy concept that rather belongs in some exhibition
[19:36] <troy_s> thorwil: Erm. Animated wallpapers are at least one full year past mainstream. Arguably Android pushed it to the next level.
[19:36] <troy_s> thorwil: But that said, a purple mush of Cream of Wheat isn't exactly communicating anything, and moving it around won't change that fact.
[19:37] <troy_s> thorwil: If you cut up a sheet of white paper and move the squares around, it's... underwhelming?
[19:37] <thorwil> not with the proper substances taken in beforehand, i guess
[19:38] <troy_s> thorwil: I strongly suspect the godawful abortion of mediocrity is coming down from high up the mountain. It probably drives the poor people that were forced to barf it out nuts.
[19:40] <thorwil> http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/canonical_PS-UEA/ and http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/canonical_PS-DE/ indicate ... some changes
[19:40] <thorwil> as i have the feeling i know who had those positions
[19:41] <troy_s> thorwil: Oh good... 'it is beautiful and usable as well'
[19:41] <troy_s> thorwil: I am shocked that someone manages to type that. Or even conceive of it. It is like there are a million companies out there that didn't have the epiphany moment of "Ohhhh gee... we only needed to realize we needed to make our products beautiful and usable. Silly us."
[19:42] <troy_s> Although it _is_ good to see UxD suddenly on there.
[19:42] <troy_s> That's exciting.