/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/09/08/#ubuntu-ops.txt

ubottuIn ubottu, rww said: !no, mint is <alias> mintsupport00:28
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (banlist filling up: 490 bans)03:06
goshi, i want to install a program to design of this page: http://www.sweethome3d.com/download.jsp    ,but lubuntu said that the program does not have a valid certificate. "can i install this program without any risk?03:58
IdleOnegos: This is not a support channel. You are in #ubuntu-ops right now04:00
IdleOnegos: you were sent here because you tried joining #ubuntu and are banned from there04:01
persia#lubuntu is probably the safer choice for lubuntu support.04:01
gosbut that site is valid?04:02
IdleOneask #lubuntu04:02
IdleOnegos: if you wish to discuss the ban in #ubuntu then you are in the right place, otherwise please part the channel04:04
IdleOnewhat's the freaking point in me asking a user to part if I can't enforce it when they don't04:05
persiaHelps train folk in social integration and attention to peer commentary, and highlights folks who have much to learn in these areas.04:10
IdleOneI'm not sure I know what any of what you just said means04:12
macoIdleOne: i think the last bit was about shaming04:13
IdleOneshaming?04:13
macopublic wrist-slapping04:14
IdleOnehmm04:14
IdleOneWell I still feel like we should all have access to remove users from here04:15
persiaIt's all about shaming really, and the rest was about making sure those who care for ensuring folks follow guidelines know who isn't reading the guidelines (or following them) even with reminders.04:15
persiaIdeally, we want everyone to be coorperative, and listen to their peers, because this means we don't have to do anything as ops.04:17
persiaBut this is made easier if we know who isn't following those guidelines, as we can track them for special observance.04:18
persiawhereas, if we kick folks often, that makes people think it's not serious until they get kicked, which makes our work harder.04:19
persiaAll that said, I'm tempted to see wider enforcement as well, but that doesn't change the rationale for not needing it.04:19
IdleOneSo a user like gos who has been here on several occasions asking for support and being told that this is not a support channel and being asked to leave, who is still here for no reason. How is this helpful to the ops team or even him/her04:19
IdleOneWho btw knows they are banned and that is why they keep getting sent here04:21
IdleOneit is frustrating when I have to go pinging people to remove a user who clearly does not care about the no idle rule.04:21
persiaAnnoyingly, the truly uncooperative fail to benefit from the rationale expressed above, and are simply frustrating.04:23
IdleOneespecially when I took the time to go to #lubuntu and asked them to part -ops04:24
persiaSo, I posit that we're optimising for the borderline, which would be good if there were fewer outliers.  With current volume, it may be a more delicate balance between operator frustration and user education.04:24
IdleOneI am being ignored by a troll because they know I can't do anything about it04:24
IdleOnefigures they part soon as I said that04:24
persiaIt demonstrates that learning has begun.  May it continue successfully.04:25
IdleOneWe can only hope04:25
persiaIndeed.04:25
IdleOnepersia: Thank you for your patience with my obvious semi-rant04:25
persiaNo problem.  Thanks for giving me the opportunity to document the point in a way that makes more sense to me.04:27
persiaI've come to share your opinion about +o, but going over the reason we don't have it helps dim my own frustration.04:27
elkyIt would be lovely to be able to afford to have people who can manage this channel independently of the daily ops, but sadly, we don't have the human resource for that.05:07
IdleOneelky: There are those who have expressed the willingness05:09
elkyIdleOne, except we need them on the front line as daily ops, and the staffing levels would dictate they'd not stay independent long for this reason.05:09
elkyIn Idealville we'd have 3 groups, wholly independent. Ops, ircc, and managers of this channel.05:10
elkyIn Realton, this isn't sustainable for the reason I state above.05:10
IdleOneI don't see this channel as separate from the core channels but an extension.05:11
persiaAh, so that if some op is exceedingly annoyed with some user, they lack the ability to also block them from here?05:11
elkyIdleOne, which is true, but this is for appeal process purposes05:11
elkypersia, so that who maintains the peace here is "independent"05:11
elkycurrently members of two of the parties in the appeals process maintain the peace here.05:12
persiaMakes sense.  I tend to look for social, rather than technical, solutions.  Something like expecting folks with ops here to recuse themselves from keeping the peace in cases where they are op on the channel of interest or on IRCC.05:13
elkyone, daily ops, the current party in a dispute, second, ircc, a potential arbitrator in the dispute.05:13
IdleOneI see, the daily ops can be trusted to enforce the rules in the core channels but not trusted enough to be impartial05:13
elkypersia, that's fine, and most do, until there's a staff shortage.05:13
persiaThat said, I can see how that degenerates badly if things fall out of balance.05:13
persiaRight.05:13
elkyThe current rate of burnout isn't sustainable for daily ops, let alone for maintaining a reservoir of peacekeepers who won't ever need to step over the line to make sure there's enough ops.05:14
elkyEvery time it gets brought up, it gets brought up in a broken fashion which neglects to understand the cycle of life. This is because once you understand the cycle of life, you give up on the idealism and deal with the hand reality has played you.05:15
persiaI disagree with the contention in the second sentence.05:15
persiaI think some folks both carry ideals and deal with the hand available, seeking to change the rules for the future.05:16
persiaNot that this disagreement matters in this context :)05:16
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (banlist filling up: 490 bans)05:16
elkySure, maybe I should have been clearer about "as reality currently stands"05:16
elkyfuture realities may or may not provide escape routes.05:17
persiaBut given the model of many-headed "core" of most-populous channels with shared ops, there's an automatic shortage with recusion.05:18
persiaPlus all the soft, idealiistic reasons I said earlier :)05:18
elkyYup. Damn those caveats.05:18
ubottuIn ubottu, rww said: !ics =~ s/ubuntu/Ubuntu/07:34
jussi!ics =~ s/ubuntu/Ubuntu/07:43
ubottuI'll remember that jussi07:43
jussi!ics > rww07:43
knomejussi, ping!08:46
ubottuIn #ubuntu-offtopic, rww said: !science is <reply> Space is fuelled with a network of wormholes | http://www.symphonyofscience.com/08:50
ubottuFloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (banlist filling up: 461 bans)10:03
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (banlist filling up: 475 bans)11:49
ubottuIn ubottu, JohnHeikkila said: !john is JOHN says MOO13:05
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join (1260 users, 22 overflows, 1282 limit))13:51
ubottuFloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join (1260 users, 21 overflows, 1281 limit))13:51
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join (1260 users, 24 overflows, 1284 limit))13:51
ubottuFloodBot4 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join (1261 users, 25 overflows, 1286 limit))13:51
LjL!staff | please check #ubuntu-unregged13:52
ubottuplease check #ubuntu-unregged: hey Christel, Dave2, Gary, KB1JWQ, Levia, Martinp23, Pricey, SportsChick, VorTechS, jayne, jenda, marienz, nalioth, niko, nhandler, rob, stew or tomaw, I could use a bit of your time :)13:52
=== rgreening_ is now known as ghost
=== ghost is now known as rgreening
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (fr0gger` appears to be abusive - 6)14:31
alabdGood day all , why my user is banned from #ubuntu ?14:55
ubottuIn #ubuntu-offtopic, LzrdKing said: !!! backup is corrupt too!15:44
ubottuFloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (mass join (1306 users, 7 overflows, 1313 limit))17:16
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (ohio appears to be abusive - 4)18:20
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (s13o1q- appears to be abusive - 6)19:35
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (dk12jq3p` appears to be abusive - 6)19:36
nikomind if i +r ?19:36
maconiko: i already did19:37
nikoyes i noticed19:37
PiciHm, I thought we were still +r too19:41
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (banlist filling up: 481 bans)19:52
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (banlist filling up: 481 bans)22:03
ubottuFloodBot4 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (flood (22))22:05
=== funkyHat_ is now known as funkyHat
=== Seeker`_ is now known as Seeker`
knomesent pog here since he's getting excess floods22:10
knomeif there is a more appropriate way, let me know22:10
IdleOneknome: forward to ##fix_your_connection22:11
knomeokay, thanks22:11
knomeshould i join there myself, or.. ?22:12
IdleOneno need22:13
knomeokay22:13
knomecan they remove the ban when the issue is solved, or will that guy come to me?22:13
Tm_Tknome: what ban?22:13
IdleOnethey will have to go to a channel op22:13
knomeIdleOne, okay, ta22:14
IdleOneso yeah you22:14
IdleOnenp22:14
knomeTm_T, banned pog from #xubuntu since he was having numerous excess floods22:14
Tm_Tso it's you who remove the ban (:22:14
knomejoin, excess flood, join, excess flood...22:14
knomeyeah, np :)22:14
ubottuFloodBot2 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)23:49
ubottuFloodBot3 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)23:49
ubottuFloodBot1 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)23:49
ubottuFloodBot4 called the ops in #ubuntu-ops-monitor (exploit)23:50

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!