[01:23] <MTecknology> newz2000: Anything on the legal stuff? I could really use that info..
[03:25] <newz2000> MTecknology: no, I haven't heard a bit, let me do some follow up
[16:00] <MTecknology> mhall119: You around?
[16:17] <mhall119> yup
[16:18] <mhall119> MTecknology: ack
[16:19] <MTecknology> mhall119: I was wondering if you have the latest django theme running live somewhere I could see
[16:20] <mhall119> not at the moment
[16:20] <MTecknology> I was wondering if you figured out that width bug
[16:20] <mhall119> which width bug?
[16:21] <MTecknology> bug 632179
[16:21] <ubot4> Launchpad bug 632179 in ubuntu-website "light-base-theme has bad background width (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/632179
[16:22] <MTecknology> I'm not so sure light-wiki is an appropriate tag but.. idk
[16:22] <mhall119> that's on light-base-theme, not light-django-theme.....I'll have to look more into it
[16:22] <MTecknology> Can I see the light-django-theme online anywhere?
[16:22] <mhall119> yeah, give me a minute
[16:24] <MTecknology> frick!
[16:24] <MTecknology> I just removed a site I need
[16:25] <mhall119> MTecknology: http://family.ubuntu-fl.org:8001/
[16:26] <MTecknology> mhall119: yay, at least the django theme doesn't have it - it wound up making its way to the drupal theme
[16:27] <mhall119> these branches are diverging quite a bit more than I want
[16:27] <MTecknology> oh... I see why too - it's quite a bit different from the base theme
[16:27] <mhall119> it shouldn't be all that different from the base theme, and all my css changes have gone into new files
[16:27] <MTecknology> you and I just said the same thing, huh?
[16:27] <MTecknology> I mean the widths of things
[16:28] <mhall119> the header/footer being static width is only done in loco-directory, not light-base-theme
[16:28] <MTecknology> like in newstyle.css line 191
[16:28] <mhall119> or light-django-theme for that matter
[16:28] <mhall119> newstyle.css is loco-directory only
[16:28] <MTecknology> right
[16:29] <MTecknology> so the issue is still in the django theme too probably
[16:29] <mhall119> default.css and django_extras.css are the only ones from light-django-theme
[16:29] <mhall119> and default.css should be identical to the one in light-base-theme
[16:31] <MTecknology> mhall119: If you have it up and running anywhere, try to just make the browser smaller than the width of the staqtic width content and then scroll right
[16:32] <mhall119> MTecknology: http://family.ubuntu-fl.org:8001/ is the latest code for both loco-directory and light-django-theme
[16:33] <MTecknology> mhall119: but that has a static width for the backgrounds
[16:33] <mhall119> okay, you want to try a non-static width?
[16:34] <MTecknology> use firebug, grab header#page-header and change width to 100% - that's what's in light-base-theme
[16:36] <MTecknology> frick......
[16:36] <MTecknology> This sucks..... I deleted the website that means the most to me...
[16:36] <MTecknology> I have the database - but not the website files
[16:36] <mhall119> yup, I see it
[16:36] <mhall119> http://family.ubuntu-fl.org:8002/
[16:43] <MTecknology> I wish I updated backup paths back when I was thinking about it... I really boned myself hard
[17:07] <mhall119> MTecknology: I hate css
[17:09] <mhall119> I've tried every combinations of styles I could think of, and I can't make it 100% with a horizontal scroll without breaking the layout under other circumstances
[17:10] <mhall119> maybe newz2000 or someone better at css than I am can help
[17:10] <newz2000> what are you trying to do?
[17:11] <mhall119> oh, wait, maybe...
[17:11] <mhall119> how supported is the min-width attribute?
[17:12] <newz2000> not IE
[17:12] <newz2000> wow, that looks very pretty
[17:12] <mhall119> what does?
[17:12] <newz2000> the family.ubuntu-fl theme
[17:13] <mhall119> alright, well IE can look like crap for all I care
[17:13] <newz2000> what are you trying to achieve?
[17:13] <mhall119> newz2000: newz2000 family.ubuntu-fl.org:8001 is loco-directory trunk
[17:13] <mhall119> :8002 is summit.ubuntu.com trunk
[17:14] <mhall119> newz2000: when the browser's width is less than 980px, it produces a horizontal scroll
[17:14] <newz2000> ah, yes, that's the challenge with fixed width
[17:14] <mhall119> but the body and #page-header element widths match the browser's width
[17:14] <mhall119> so when you scroll right, the header doesn't extend the full 980px
[17:15] <newz2000> yeah, I've seen that a "few" times
[17:15] <mhall119> but setting min-width: 980px on BODY fixes it for browsers than recognize min-width
[17:15] <MTecknology> mhall119: I'm reading the backlog - min-width doesn't work :(
[17:16] <MTecknology> it kinda does - but not completely
[17:16] <mhall119> MTecknology: set it on BODY on default.css line 138
[17:16] <newz2000> mhall119: what do you want to happen?
[17:16] <mhall119> newz2000: for the <body> width to always be at least as wide as the page content
[17:16] <MTecknology> mhall119: min-width 100% on body?
[17:16] <mhall119> MTecknology: no, min-width: 980px
[17:17] <MTecknology> mhall119: that'll only work if you're using 980px for everything else though
[17:18] <MTecknology> I made the drupal one so you can decide the size of the page..
[17:18] <mhall119> MTecknology: oh...
[17:18] <mhall119> then make the min-width the same as the page width
[17:19] <newz2000> that does work
[17:19] <MTecknology> that can work for width in px but what about setting the width of the page to say 90%
[17:20] <newz2000> Another option is to not use a combination of fixed/% widths
[17:20] <mhall119> MTecknology: in that case, I'm not sure
[17:20] <mhall119> % widths will be relative to the browser's width
[17:20] <newz2000> no
[17:20] <newz2000> % widths are relative to container's width
[17:20] <mhall119> which for <body> is the window, correct?
[17:20] <newz2000> So you'd want one 90% width container and 100% widths inside
[17:20] <MTecknology> lemme change the drupal theme to a %
[17:21] <MTecknology> http://staging.profarius.com/
[17:21] <MTecknology> 80%
[17:22] <newz2000> MTecknology: your search box is causing a prob in Chrome
[17:22] <mhall119> yeah, it's wrapping on small widths
[17:22] <MTecknology> newz2000: the whole think kinda breaks :(
[17:23] <newz2000> yeah, this is why I have tended towards fixed width lately
[17:23] <newz2000> Another option is to do a media query and choose a layout based on the width of the browser window
[17:24] <MTecknology> I tend to lean that way too.. I just want to make it work nice and pretty for everyone and % was a common request
[17:24] <newz2000> With a media query you can create a narrow layout and a 980px layout. That way it works in mobiles and desktops.
[17:25] <MTecknology> what about resizing browser windows?
[17:25] <newz2000> I think it applies there too, but I'm not confident
[17:25] <newz2000> I've actually only done this once. :-)
[17:26] <MTecknology> heh... cool
[17:26] <MTecknology> if it's less than 800px; then enforce 800px min width
[17:27] <MTecknology> still going to be a bitch with the % width.. part of the issue is whining if there's horizontal scroll
[17:28] <MTecknology> I'm half considering saying % width isn't an option.....
[17:28] <MTecknology> I hate to be a dick to anyone that wants that but at this point I'm pretty frustrated :(
[17:29] <MTecknology> Did I make him upset? :(
[17:29]  * newz2000 just did something and accidentally closed irc
[17:30] <MTecknology> newz2000: oh, I thought you were mad at me and left in anger :(
[17:30] <newz2000> I'm not even sure what keys I pushed
[17:30]  * newz2000 meant to alt+tab
[17:30] <MTecknology> sometimes I alt+tab - and openbox dies
[17:31] <newz2000> so, ftr, I say forget the % width unless you're really passionate about it
[17:32] <MTecknology> I have been in the past.. and it worked perfect..
[17:32] <MTecknology> this new theme is.... not nice to me :P
[17:32] <newz2000> if you were going to accommodate a different width window I'd say look into mobile friendly width
[17:33] <MTecknology> ?
[17:33] <newz2000> I mean that 320px is more important than 840px
[17:34] <MTecknology> oh
[17:34] <MTecknology> is that the de facto for itty bitty windows?
[17:34]  * newz2000 double checks his numbers
[17:35] <newz2000> yes, 320x480
[17:37] <MTecknology> alrighty - I'll sit on it in my head for a while and see if I build up the motivation to attack it
[17:37] <MTecknology> otherwise we can sit with static widths..
[17:37] <newz2000> yes, I think you're safe with static widths
[17:37]  * newz2000 won't criticize you at least
[17:40] <MTecknology> I'm sure there has to be a way to deal with it in a way that's not an ugly horrible hack
[17:41] <newz2000> yes, there is: don't use a mix of % and px
[17:41] <MTecknology> there's that too
[17:43] <mhall119> use tables for layout
[17:43]  * mhall119 ducks
[17:43] <MTecknology> lol... that's been an option that's been looking prettier and prettier
[17:43] <MTecknology> honestly..... I think... at this point.... it might be a good option
[17:43]  * MTecknology hides
[17:43] <mhall119> MTecknology: http://giveupandusetables.com/
[17:44] <MTecknology> mhall119: exactly that
[17:45] <pleia2> mhall119: haha, nice
[17:45] <mhall119> okay, I'm off to lunch and the book store
[17:45] <mhall119> pleia2: are you coming to UDS?  I thought no, but Michelle said you were
[17:46] <pleia2> mhall119: nope, I have too much going on this fall
[17:46] <mhall119> darn, had my hopes up and everything
[17:47] <pleia2> sorry :)
[17:47] <MTecknology> I want to go someday :(
[17:47] <mhall119> deadline to apply for sponsorship was 2 days ago...
[17:47] <mhall119> if you wanted to go, should have filled it out by ten
[17:47] <mhall119> then
[17:47] <MTecknology> I wouldn't have time
[17:48] <mhall119> okay, my stomach is yelling at me, be back later
[17:48] <MTecknology> hopefully I can find the time at some point in my life :P
[17:48] <MTecknology> so.. I finally restored this website except for every single image in it
[17:51] <MTecknology> My finacee is going to be maaaaaaaaaad
[17:51] <MTecknology> and sad :(
[18:57] <mhall119> MTecknology: got anything in browser cache?
[18:57] <mhall119> or maybe http://www.archive.org/web/web.php ?
[20:38] <MTecknology> mhall119: hm?
[20:38] <MTecknology> oh!
[20:38] <MTecknology> nah, there's nothing. :(
[20:39] <mhall119> oh well
[20:39] <MTecknology> thanks though
[20:39] <MTecknology> it's close enough to be accepotable
[20:39] <MTecknology> mhall119: btw - http://wedding.profarius.com
[20:40] <mhall119> wow, I'm glad blogs weren't popular when I was getting married
[20:41] <MTecknology> :P
[20:41] <MTecknology> I do websites - so it was fun to do :_
[20:42] <daker> \o/
[20:43] <mhall119> I did websites when I was getting married, still wouldn't have wanted to blog it
[20:44] <MTecknology> I enjoyed making it :P   Kim's enjoyed tossing things on there
[20:45] <MTecknology> mhall119: If I don't figure this out by tonight.. things are moving to a table layout for the background..
[20:45] <mhall119> +1
[20:45] <MTecknology> It'll be a 3x4 grid and it's going to take magic for me to change my mind :P
[20:45] <mhall119> I'm amazed that we're on CSS3, and still they can't make it do what tables do
[20:46] <MTecknology> part of it is probably some ugly code on my part
[20:46] <mhall119> yeah, but ugly table code still worked
[20:46] <MTecknology> I'm not using tables now
[20:46] <MTecknology> Nowhere actually
[20:47] <MTecknology> I mean I think I have some ugly css
[20:49] <mhall119> I meant that even back in the day when I was writing ugly table code, it still worked
[20:49] <MTecknology> oh, ya
[20:49] <MTecknology> it's less fragile
[20:49] <mhall119> it's easier to understand why it's doing what it's doing
[20:51] <MTecknology> I think for the light-{base,django}-theme the fixed width could work best. I just know how many people have prodded me in the past. Back then it was easy though..
[20:54] <newz2000> since looking at your stuff earlier I have been browsing with my window narrower than usual. Wow, the web is screwed up like that. :-)
[20:55] <MTecknology> newz2000: :P indeed
[20:55] <MTecknology> newz2000: sucksabit?
[20:56] <newz2000> a bit
[20:56] <MTecknology> oooh! with tables I only need to asign widths for the top row too... :)
[20:56] <newz2000> no
[20:56] <newz2000> don't do that
[20:57] <MTecknology> no?
[20:57] <newz2000> a good simple fixed width layout is not hard with css
[20:57] <MTecknology> right... but dynamic not so much
[20:58] <newz2000> if in doubt, use a css framework then
[20:58] <MTecknology> ?
[20:58] <newz2000> yui is fine
[20:58] <newz2000> there's a fluid version of 960
[20:58] <MTecknology> oh..
[20:58] <newz2000> The one I used on old old Ubuntu (with gold header) was skidoo2
[20:59] <MTecknology> so instead of converting this theme yet again, drop it and switch to something like 960?
[21:00] <MTecknology> btw - I already wrote the table :P
[21:01] <MTecknology> took me almost two minutes
[21:03] <newz2000> do you want fixed width or fluid?
[21:04] <MTecknology> both
[21:05] <MTecknology> 960 isn't bad but it's definitely overkill
[21:07] <newz2000> in two min you can also write a fluid page template
[21:07] <newz2000> assuming you want fluid main column with a fixed width nav column on the side
[21:08] <newz2000> you just nest one div inside the other, set the outer one to something like width:90%;min-width:550px;max-width:960px;margin: 0 auto;
[21:08] <newz2000> the inner div: float: left; width: 220px;
[21:08] <MTecknology> I mean the whole inner content being based on either fixed or fluid - then the inside of that is the content with two collapsible sidebars
[21:08] <newz2000> MTecknology: how much of your theme did you write from scratch?
[21:08] <MTecknology> ~80% of it
[21:09] <newz2000> is it some of that 80% that is not working right, or is it the other 20%?
[21:09] <MTecknology> it's only putting a fluid width on the page that's not working
[21:09] <MTecknology> if that starts working then I'll be satisfied
[21:10] <newz2000> MTecknology: are we still looking at http://staging.profarius.com/ as an example?
[21:11] <MTecknology> ya
[21:11] <MTecknology> You can check out the source for it bzr branch lp:ubuntu-drupal-theme
[21:11] <newz2000> I'll just view in the browser, I work better that way
[21:11] <newz2000> What is the problem?
[21:11] <newz2000> (we're trying to fix?)
[21:12] <MTecknology> h on - lemme drop that damned search block
[21:13] <MTecknology> alrighty, right now the menu doesn't line up with the rest of the page with the % width
[21:14] <MTecknology> with the static width I run into needing to put a static width on body but that won't work for %
[21:14] <newz2000> MTecknology: check this: http://awesomescreenshot.com/0e117tg9a
[21:14] <newz2000> There's a couple probs there
[21:14] <newz2000> 3 actually
[21:15] <newz2000> one is the top (orange) nav is piled up on the logo
[21:15] <newz2000> the other is the gray nav is too narrow to fit the search
[21:15] <newz2000> and lastly, the page content is cramped but I still have these pretty dotted background borders running down the side
[21:16] <newz2000> is there more that's wrong?
[21:16] <MTecknology> the menu and content divs don't line up
[21:17] <newz2000> MTecknology: what do you mean?
[21:18] <MTecknology> the left most line in the menu is the left most of that div - it should line up with the white background right below it
[21:18] <newz2000> MTecknology: are you referring to the orange menu?
[21:19] <MTecknology> ya
[21:19] <newz2000> "page 1"
[21:19] <newz2000> I see from #sidebar-left that there is 10px of white space
[21:20] <newz2000> if I add 10px left margin to ul.nice-menu then it lines up
[21:21] <newz2000> not worrying about the search box, it looks like the min-width is 740px
[21:21] <newz2000> for div.container
[21:22] <newz2000> so width:80%;min-width:740px
[21:22] <MTecknology> unless you add more stuff to the menu
[21:22] <newz2000> right
[21:24] <newz2000> it's a tricky prob
[21:24] <MTecknology> ya
[21:24] <MTecknology> and you know why....
[21:24] <MTecknology> Back before the community theme everything could be contained inside of one container div
[21:25] <MTecknology> now that doesn't work because there's three different backgrounds that span the whole width
[21:25] <newz2000> so make one container and make those other 3 100%
[21:25] <newz2000> oops, I'm looking at the wrong theme
[21:26] <newz2000> nah, you'd still need at least 2 containers
[21:27] <MTecknology> <div style="margin: 0 auto;">Junk</div>
[21:28] <MTecknology> I think maybe I need to take a break and rewrire my brain a bit - I've been working on the same theme for so long the change in design is just breaking my mind
[21:28] <newz2000> yeah
[21:28] <newz2000> that happens
[21:28] <MTecknology> I want to mimic how I've been doing it.. but that's not really possible anymore.
[21:29] <MTecknology> I have a meeting pretty quick  here.
[21:29]  * newz2000 has to write a shell script to do date math
[21:29] <MTecknology> newz2000: thanks for taking the time to help me. I think I need to get home, get a drink, watch the black screen on my tv (no cable or movies), and mellow, then come back and do something amazing
[21:30] <MTecknology> ouchy
[21:30]  * newz2000 will cheat and use python
[21:30] <MTecknology> lol
[21:30] <newz2000> have a nice end to your day MTecknology. I will be in Europe next week, so screwy hours
[21:30] <MTecknology> ok
[21:30] <MTecknology> you too