[03:19] <Zorael> What is the current state of the Qt4 packages in maverick? plasma keeps instacrashing on me, and I'm getting some very weird display errors in Qt apps in general. It has been blaming the proprietary nvidia driver, but I get it even after falling back to vesa.
[03:47] <ScottK> Working very well for me.
[03:48] <ScottK> Zorael: The only real problems I've had have been traced back to X or video driver issues (on  Intel)
[06:46] <maco> lucidfox has just made an exploratory switch to kubuntu!
[08:55] <Sput> hmmm... due to Evolution on Ubuntu now spamming unwanted signatures?
[08:55] <Sput> (which I find quite disturbing, tbh)
[09:09] <persia> Except Evolution only did that for 3 weeks, and doesn't now.  Just messiness.  Not that more Kubuntu users aren't welcome of course :)
[09:15] <apachelogger> bulldog98: pong
[09:42] <apparle> Hi guys, i want to access touchpad data. How to do it?
[10:22] <apparle> hi guys I want to access the touchpad. how to do it?
[10:23] <Riddell> dunno, apt-get source kde-config-touchpad will show how the kcm does it
[10:24] <apparle> Riddell: I mean I want to access events of touchpad.
[10:29] <Riddell> I don't know, I'd expect the API would be related
[10:37] <Mamarok> could somebody look at this bug and tell me what in Ubuntu causes that crash, please: https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=251869
[10:37] <Mamarok> I guess the network manager, not sure though
[10:38] <Mamarok> backtrace shows no evidence of Amarok or a KDE application being responsible, maybe Qt?
[10:38] <Mamarok> and I can't reproduce this here, switched from lan to wireless and back several times, no crash
[10:41] <persia> Mamarok, Look closely at QNetworkConfigurationManager : "ptr=" looks like it ought contain some value, but doesn't.
[10:41] <persia> (thread 1 in the stacktrace)
[10:43] <Mamarok> so it's his network configuration causing the crash?
[10:48] <persia> No idea.  I'd have to read source for 5-6 frames in both directions to get any idea what is actually wrong.
[10:48] <persia> But from a quick glance at the stacktrace, I suspect the crash to be in Thread 1 and the issue to be related to the fact that ptr isn't set.
[10:48] <persia> But I have absolutely no idea what "ptr" means, or any context to explain it in real terms.
[10:49] <Mamarok> OK, thanks anyway :)
[10:49] <Mamarok> the crash is in Thread 1, as it says KCrashHandler on top, btw :)
[11:22] <Mamarok> is there an ETA for the Amarok 2.3.2 package in the backports for Lucid?
[11:30] <Riddell> neversfelde was going to do them this evening
[12:08] <apachelogger> http://aplg.kollide.net/images/avatar/snapshot53.png
[12:09] <Riddell> is it SFW?  I know what you're like apachelogger and I wouldn't want my colleagues to think I'm into the same things as you are!
[12:10] <apachelogger> lol
[12:10] <apachelogger> Riddell: yes :P
[12:10] <apachelogger> well
[12:10] <apachelogger> depends on the POV
[12:10] <Riddell> ooh another new kcontrol module
[12:10] <apachelogger> Riddell: not a KCM at all right now
[12:11] <apachelogger> though with me it will of coursse end up as one ;)
[12:12] <apachelogger> Riddell: actually I was more thinking about having it feature a plasmoid
[12:13] <apachelogger> to counter them old init based plasmoid thingies 
[12:13] <Riddell> a plasmoid to stop system services? whyever would you need that?
[12:13] <apachelogger> I have no idea
[12:14] <apachelogger> Riddell: to quickly kill apache when you need RAMz maybe
[12:14] <Riddell> I'd think it would be more useful as part of ksysguard then
[12:15]  * apachelogger has a feeling a ksysguard plugin is not far from KCM ^^
[12:16] <apachelogger> them KCMs are everywhere ^^
[12:16] <apachelogger> Riddell: I'll try myself on model/view stuff so ultimately one could use it for whatever is desired
[12:52] <shadeslayer> jefferai: around?
[13:16] <shadeslayer_> jefferai: is your core ok now? 
[14:11]  * Riddell spots ftp://ftp.trolltech.com/qt/source/qt-everywhere-opensource-src-4.7.0.tar.gz
[14:11] <Riddell> who wants to package?
[14:13] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: sure
[14:14] <shadeslayer_> does we have a package for that?
[14:14] <shadeslayer_> or a brand new package?
[14:14] <Riddell> shadeslayer_: qt4-x11
[14:14] <shadeslayer_> thats.. omg.. thats qt4-X11? :O
[14:15] <shadeslayer_> oh well
[14:15] <shadeslayer_> first time for everything i guess :>
[14:15] <shadeslayer_> itll take an hour to download :P
[14:16] <shadeslayer_> apachelogger: http://gitorious.org/qzsync/qzsync/commit/81e75a5291370c415fcbbef15b4d66b02eb88a63 :: fixed the Icon issue ... its sort of a hack, but it works
[14:16] <Riddell> shadeslayer_: it'll take longer to compile!
[14:16] <Riddell> shadeslayer_: you can use my server if you want
[14:16] <shadeslayer_> Riddell: im afraid of that as well :P
[14:17] <shadeslayer_> to compile?
[14:17] <Riddell> yes
[14:17] <Riddell> although it's not great spec
[14:17] <shadeslayer_> dunno how to use it ... and its alright.. ill manage :P
[14:17] <shadeslayer_> and qt servers are slooooowwww
[14:17] <shadeslayer_> im getting 40 KBps ...
[14:23] <lucidfox> Okay, I have to say this: KDE4 rocks now
[14:23] <lucidfox> I last saw it around 4.0-4.1, when it didn't do much
[14:23] <ScottK> ;-)
[14:23] <ScottK> No.  It didn't.
[14:23] <lucidfox> So I'm staying here.
[14:24] <persia> Just don't try to run it with 256MB RAM and no X acceleration :)
[14:24] <lucidfox> haha
[14:24] <shadeslayer> lucidfox: im just happy that my Network manager plasmoid works now :P
[14:24] <shadeslayer> persia++
[14:24] <lucidfox> I have a fast enough computer that I notice no graphical delays, although Compiz seems subjectively faster than KWin, so I stuck with it.
[14:24] <shadeslayer> persia: btw.. need to talk about the zsync thing
[14:25] <lucidfox> And with some GNOME software I grew accustomed to, namely Nautilus, Empathy, Epiphany and Liferea.
[14:25] <persia> I'm up for a bit more: talk quick.  Extra points for transcribing yourself so I know what you're saying.
[14:25] <shadeslayer> persia: you said that i need to file a bug about getting all the zsync links on the iso site
[14:26] <shadeslayer> so that i can parse them to my app
[14:26] <persia> Oh, I said it might be a good idea to file a bug so that the cdimage site had a file that was a list of all the current images.
[14:26] <persia> Yeah.
[14:26] <shadeslayer> persia: the list should be in the top level dir right?
[14:27] <shadeslayer> like : http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/list.txt
[14:27] <persia> Unless you're intending to try to prepare the patch, I'd suggest leaving the implementation details up to the cdimage team.
[14:27] <shadeslayer> ok..
[14:27] <persia> But yeah, that would work fine :)
[14:27] <shadeslayer> persia: i file a bug against... which package?
[14:28] <shadeslayer> i dont remember
[14:29] <persia> No package.  launchpad.net/ubuntu-cdimage
[14:29] <shadeslayer> ohk
[14:31] <shadeslayer> thanks
[14:32] <shadeslayer> persia: bug 644353
[14:32] <lucidfox> So I wonder... How closely do you people stay in touch with upstream KDE?
[14:32] <shadeslayer> lucidfox: some of the people here ARE kde upstream
[14:33] <lucidfox> Nice!
[14:36] <persia> lucidfox, As an example, I fixed a bug, and uploaded something yesterday, and the first followup was a complaint that the patch didn't apply against svn HEAD.
[14:37] <Riddell> which is reported as https://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=251866 incidently
[14:38] <shadeslayer> Riddell: do you know who is coming to UDS from the kubuntu team? :)
[14:38] <Riddell> not exactly
[14:38] <shadeslayer> apart from me, Quintasan and apachelogger ...
[14:38] <Riddell> and ScottK and rbelem
[14:38] <shadeslayer> hmm... i thought you would know
[14:38] <Riddell> mgrasslin from upstream
[14:38] <shadeslayer> ScottK: your coming? why did you say..
[14:38] <Riddell> maybe maco
[14:38] <shadeslayer> s/did/didnt
[14:39] <shadeslayer> oh great 
[14:39] <persia> Riddell, Thanks for the pointer.  Reason the patch didn't apply is because upstream has already done ~40% of it (with slightly different syntax for one class of change).
[14:39] <Riddell> persia: some of the files have gone or been moved too I think?
[14:40] <shadeslayer> Riddell: also.. when are you planning to reach and depart from orlando?
[14:40] <persia> Not of the ones I've seen so far, but I've been focusing first on the literals.  I figure it's best to split out the upstream bits into multiple patches, more logically organised.
[14:41] <Riddell> shadeslayer: I get there on Sunday evening and leave the following Monday morning I think
[14:42] <Riddell> lucidfox: welcome along to Kubuntu :)
[14:42] <shadeslayer> Riddell: erm.. only for 2 days? or is the monday after 29th?
[14:42]  * lucidfox waves
[14:43] <lucidfox> So yes... the resident from the parable of two houses got tired of the first house being perpetually under reconstruction, and returned to the second.
[14:43] <Riddell> shadeslayer: 29th
[14:43] <shadeslayer> oh.. ok ...
[14:44] <ScottK> lucidfox: Welcome.
[14:55] <sikon> Hmm... Any idea why I have no menubar in Quassel?
[14:55] <sikon> oh, never mind
[14:55] <sikon> found it
[15:05] <maco> Riddell: maybe me what?
[15:05] <maco> sikon: hi :)
[15:06] <maco> Riddell: definitely me
[15:07] <maco> shadeslayer: Riddell's not making sense. he's staying til 1 Nov
[15:07] <shadeslayer> maco: yeah got that part :P
[15:07] <shadeslayer> maco: are you coming?
[15:07]  * shadeslayer just got flight details from BTS
[15:07] <maco> yes
[15:07] <shadeslayer> awesome
[15:09] <lucidfox> maco> So now I've migrated to Kubuntu!
[15:10] <maco> lucidfox: welcome to the darkside, have some cookies 
[15:10] <maco> bah no kubotu!
[15:10] <maco> kubottu normally gives out cookies
[15:12] <shadeslayer> Riddell: what do i do if i can find a cheaper flight via some other agency instead of BTS :>
[15:13] <shadeslayer> theres a 20 K INR ( 300 euro )difference :P
[15:13] <Riddell> shadeslayer: you can either book that yourself and claim the cost from canonical later, or just go with the one from the travel agent
[15:14] <shadeslayer> hmm
[15:15] <maco> or tell the travel agent about it...
[15:15] <maco> that sounds easiest
[15:15] <Riddell> who will add their commission and you'll get back to the number you first thought of :)
[15:21] <shadeslayer> kdevelop beta 3 is up... who wants to take it? :D
[15:22] <Riddell> surely you can do it while qt is compiling :)
[15:22] <shadeslayer> Riddell: not enuf bandwidth :P
[15:22] <shadeslayer> well..lemme try
[15:22] <Riddell> shadeslayer: I was joking!
[15:23] <shadeslayer> no seriously :P
[15:23] <jefferai> shadeslayer: I hope it is
[15:23] <shadeslayer> jefferai: ok dunno what happens, but i cant connect to freenode :(
[15:23] <jefferai> you're on freenode
[15:24] <shadeslayer> it says sync'ing to core... and it kept sync'ing for 40 mins
[15:24] <jefferai> when?
[15:24] <shadeslayer> jefferai: from quassel... not quassel client
[15:24] <shadeslayer> jefferai: about a hour ago
[15:24] <jefferai> which means what?
[15:24] <shadeslayer> jefferai: which means im not connected to your core
[15:24] <jefferai> right
[15:24]  * jefferai doesn't follow
[15:25] <shadeslayer> jefferai: i can connect to your core but not to freenode via your core
[15:25] <jefferai> that's odd
[15:25] <jefferai> I'm on freenode via my core
[15:26] <shadeslayer> http://i.imgur.com/6GL4o.png 
[15:27] <jefferai> why are you showing me that?
[15:27] <shadeslayer> because its hung on that
[15:28] <jefferai> and what am I supposed to do with that screenshot?
[15:29] <shadeslayer> uhh... so everything is fine at your end? ... 
[15:30] <jefferai> well
[15:30] <jefferai> I just got on my quassel core here 10 mins ago
[15:30] <jefferai> no problems whatsoever
[15:30] <jefferai> so currently I believe things are fine on my end
[15:33] <lucidfox> hmm, I wonder... What port does the core need open?
[15:33] <lucidfox> Quassel, that is
[15:33] <fejjerai> by default, 4242
[15:36] <maco> lucidfox: by default quassel is monolithic in kubuntu though.... not client/core
[15:36] <lucidfox> I know
[15:38] <shadeslayer> *shrug* ... ill leave it for the next few hours like that
[15:38] <shadeslayer> ShadowBelmolve: sorry :(
[15:47] <Zorael> How to recover from all Qt apps mysteriously freaking out on you completely regardless of if you run proprietary nvidia, nouveau or vesa:
[15:47] <Zorael> cease being your normal adventurous you, and go undo setting the default graphicssystem to opengl.
[15:53] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: uhhhh, merge requests....
[15:53] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: whut? :D
[15:55] <apachelogger> ohohoh
[15:55] <apachelogger> qt 4.7
[15:57] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: already on it
[15:58] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: mergery
[15:59] <shadeslayer> lol
[15:59] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: why do you have a qtoolbox that you do not use?
[16:00] <apachelogger> ui
[16:00] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: because ive deleted it in in my local files
[16:00] <apachelogger> oh dear lord
[16:03] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: what happened?
[16:08] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: rather than leave it like that, why not close quassel and re-open?
[16:08] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: already tried that
[16:08] <shadeslayer> i cant even connect with /connect 
[16:09] <sheytan> Hey guys
[16:09] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: more mergery
[16:09] <Riddell> hi sheytan 
[16:09] <apachelogger> also mind the comment
[16:09] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: so i see :)
[16:09] <sheytan> Is project neon available for lucid/maveric and do they have kde 4.6 builds? :)
[16:09] <shadeslayer> already merged 1
[16:10] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: hm, ok
[16:10] <fejjerai> I see the problem
[16:10] <fejjerai> Sput: more borkage :-(
[16:10] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: oh great :D
[16:10] <shadeslayer> oh.. that isnt good
[16:10] <ScottK> Riddell: Can 1:2.2.2-0ubuntu3 wait until after RC or do you want that in?
[16:11] <ScottK> err koffice
[16:11] <sheytan> Quintasan ^^
[16:12] <Riddell> ScottK: either is fine but why would we wait?  RC is 10 days away
[16:13] <shadeslayer> kdevplatform building... and Qt is next
[16:13]  * shadeslayer puts ark to the test
[16:13] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: the header includes lessen compile time i guess?
[16:13] <ScottK> Riddell: Oh.  Yeah.  So it is.  nevermind
[16:15] <ScottK> Riddell: In that case, would you please review mesa for me.  It should be a revert back to -0ubuntu1.
[16:15] <Riddell> groovy, component mismatches should shortly be clear of any kubuntu bits
[16:15] <Riddell> ScottK: ok
[16:15] <ScottK> Thanks.
[16:17] <ScottK> I'll look at mobile too once it gets a diff.
[16:18] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: depending on the compiler all that crap would also end up in your binary
[16:18] <apachelogger> e.g. inline functions
[16:19] <apachelogger> but yes, primary concern is compile time
[16:19] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: also .. can you update your merge request? i removed the toolbox and pushed to git repo :P
[16:19] <apachelogger> merging 90k SLOC is no easy business, finding something in there even less
[16:20] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: you are the merger not me :P
[16:20] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: how do i merge a conflicting merge then :P
[16:20] <apachelogger> you resolve the conflict
[16:20]  * apachelogger is wondering why his wifi is off
[16:20] <shadeslayer> how?? :D
[16:20] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: manually
[16:21] <shadeslayer> ok... but then your name doesnt come in the commit.. :P
[16:21] <apachelogger> dude
[16:21] <apachelogger> google for resolving conflicts in git
[16:21] <shadeslayer> okies
[16:34] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: http://paste.ubuntu.com/497796 : ever seen one of these?
[16:34] <apachelogger> dpkg-shlibdeps: error: couldn't find library libkdevplatformdocumentation.so.2 needed by debian/kdevplatform1-libs/usr/lib/libkdevplatformshell.so.2.0.0 (ELF format: 'elf64-x86-64'; RPATH: '').
[16:47] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: yo
[16:47] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: \o
[16:47] <shadeslayer> :D
[16:53] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: any hints on whats wrong?
[16:53] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: did you even package that file?
[16:55] <shadeslayer> nope.. ok..
[16:59] <maco> Riddell, ScottK:  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+source/arora/+bug/641359  ?
[17:08] <ScottK> Riddell: IIRC we wanted to remove that.
[17:09] <ScottK> maco: BTW, any core-dev and (I think) kubuntu-dev could deal with that.
[17:09] <ScottK> maco: Als minus point for the edge url.
[17:09] <maco> well you two are core devs with a special interest in kubuntu, and nixternal is almost always MIA so...
[17:11] <maco> i copied and pasted from my browser
[17:11] <ScottK> maco: Theres also JontheEchidna.
[17:11] <maco> has he been online yet today?
[17:12] <apachelogger> EVERYONE: why do you like kubuntu/kde?
[17:12] <ScottK> Oh, right.  Him too.
[17:13] <maco> apachelogger: doesnt treat users like zombies (in need of brains) like osx and gnome do?
[17:13] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: :)
[17:13] <fejjerai> maco: aren't most users zombies?
[17:14] <Riddell> maco: I already removed arora from the seed today
[17:14] <maco> Riddell: oh ok :)
[17:14]  * maco marks Fix Released
[17:14]  * Sput thinks most users are able to navigate a settings dialog if they're not happy with the defaults
[17:15] <ScottK> apachelogger: It's not over-engineered for a targe audience that doesn't include me.
[17:17] <neversfelde> Mamarok: just started, I hope I can come up with a package later this evening
[17:17] <maco> apachelogger: everything lucidfox said here:  http://lucidfox.org/posts/view/623 is why i use kubuntu :)
[17:18]  * apachelogger is posting exactly WRT that
[17:18]  * maco points to ScottK
[17:18] <maco> he made me do it
[17:19] <ScottK> "Suggested"
[17:19] <maco> heh yes "you know, you sound like a kde user" is what you said
[17:19] <Riddell> apachelogger: best developer platform, best community, it's what the suse CD I got given a decade ago had by default
[17:20] <maco> oh is that what your old distro was?
[17:20] <ScottK> apachelogger: Fundamentally KDE recognizes that everyone is different and there is no one best way to arrange a computer system for everyone and so it supports the idea of being adaptable to what works for me.
[17:20] <Riddell> maco: via Debian
[17:21] <ScottK> That and 6 years ago someone suggested I try Xandros and it came with KDE.
[17:22] <apachelogger> ^^
[17:22] <shadeslayer> heh.. my first encounter was with kubuntu itself.. i had a 8.04 CD lying beside my shiny new laptop and i decided to break my laptop with KDE 4.0 :P
[17:22] <apachelogger> oi! kde 4.0 was not broken
[17:22] <apachelogger> KDE 3.56 was :P
[17:22] <Riddell> and Kubuntu because it's got the right mix of KDE, apt, single live CD, and the best looking bunch of developers ever
[17:22] <shadeslayer> lol ^
[17:23] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: i was just a humble Windows user till then :P
[17:23] <maco> shadeslayer: you havent been around here very long yet, have you?
[17:23] <shadeslayer> maco: ~2 years :)
[17:23] <Sput> KDe 3.85 was quite usable
[17:23] <shadeslayer> ( counting in on #kubuntu time as well )
[17:23] <maco> and you havent realised that Riddell makes lots of comments about the channel's appearance yet?
[17:24] <shadeslayer> no :P
[17:24] <maco> ah but in -devel not long?
[17:24] <ScottK> mgraesslin: I'm having an intermittent problem on my Intel 945GME network.  I only have effects enabled 20% of the time after login.  They have been temporarily suspended.    Once I resume them they run fine.  It seems to me there might be a threshold somewhere that is set just a little too tight.  Is there something it might be worth me playing with adjusting and could you point me at where to find it.
[17:24] <maco> the /topic used to say "the distro with good-looking developers"
[17:24] <shadeslayer> yeah.. ive been here like.. 8 months i guess
[17:24] <shadeslayer> lol
[17:24] <apachelogger> Sput: yeah, I think that was about the time I tried to migrate kdepim
[17:24] <apachelogger> not very successful
[17:24] <maco> ScottK: i get the same on my netbook
[17:25] <apachelogger> maco: well, it is a known secret that kubuntu has the best lookign developers
[17:26] <maco> :P
[17:26] <apachelogger> well... nixternal is a bit out of the ordinary, but other than him...
[17:28] <shadeslayer> hmm.. so kdevelop now has git support
[17:39] <ScottK> As long as now means after the next release, yes.
[17:40] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: 2nd merge request merged as well
[17:42] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: whats the difference between http://gitorious.org/qzsync/qzsync and http://gitorious.org/qzsync ?
[17:47] <fejjerai> Riddell: were the bugfixes stripped out of dbusmenu related to build fixes?
[17:47] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: one is the project and one is the repository?
[17:47] <shadeslayer> so why doesnt the activity of the project get updated when the main repo is updated?
[17:48] <shadeslayer> oh.. takes some time i guess
[17:48] <Riddell> fejjerai: a little bit, you can see the changes at http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/libdbusmenu-qt/ubuntu/annotate/head:/debian/patches/kubuntu_00_external_contributions.diff
[17:49] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: how do i make the <***> Buffer Playback... stuff stop? 
[17:50]  * shadeslayer finds it a bit annoying
[17:50] <fejjerai> Riddell: great, fantastic :-(   Although libdbusmenu itself isn't building for us either
[17:51] <shadeslayer> Riddell: btw where do i put kdevplatform?
[17:51] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: what <***> Buffer Playback?
[17:51] <Riddell> shadeslayer: beta PPA?
[17:51] <shadeslayer> Riddell: ok
[17:51] <Riddell> fejjerai: but if you get it from gitorous you don't need to care about the silly external patch thing
[17:51] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: http://paste.ubuntu.com/497845
[17:52] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: dunno, never seen it
[17:52] <shadeslayer> line 8, 10, and 4
[17:52] <shadeslayer> hmm...
[17:52] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: which client?
[17:53] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: konversation
[17:53] <fejjerai> might be irssi doing special things with znc
[17:53] <fejjerai> see http://en.znc.in/wiki/Timestamps
[17:53] <fejjerai> search for Buffer Playback
[17:54] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: i guess i can leave out -./usr/lib/libkdevplatformdocumentation.so if i have usr/lib/libkdevplatformdocumentation.so.* in my install file
[17:54] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: not sure though
[17:54] <fejjerai> could try asking in #znc
[17:54] <shadeslayer> ok
[17:54] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: how do you reason that?
[17:55] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: um.. because earlier we had left out so files in favour of so.* files... like so.1.0 ....
[17:55] <apachelogger> now that is wrong
[17:56] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: so files are static libs right?
[17:56] <apachelogger> no
[17:56] <apachelogger> so = shared object 
[17:57] <shadeslayer> oh .. hmm
[17:57] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: static is generally .a
[17:57] <apachelogger> or .lib
[17:57] <apachelogger> latter on windows
[17:57] <shadeslayer> i got it the other way around :P
[17:57] <shadeslayer> so files are dynamic ..
[17:58] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: whats the difference between a so file and a so.1 file then?
[17:58] <apachelogger> the soversion
[17:59] <apachelogger> generally speaking
[17:59] <shadeslayer> that much i know, apart from that
[17:59] <apachelogger> the .so will be the one you tell the linker about
[17:59] <shadeslayer> ah
[17:59] <apachelogger> however
[17:59] <apachelogger> in the linked binary you will then end up with a soverioned dependency
[18:00] <apachelogger> so again generally speaking a .so will only be necessary at development time whereas the so.1 will be necessary at runtime
[18:00] <shadeslayer> ohk
[18:01] <howlymowly> hi poeple.... short question: I use the kde global menu widget in kubuntu 10.04 with kde 4.5 from the ppa ...  works like a charm, except:  it does not work together with gtk appliations. is this "normal" :)?
[18:03] <ScottK> howlymowly: There is a package you need to add.  Let me find it.
[18:04] <Riddell> iz gtk bug :)
[18:04] <howlymowly> ScottK: cool  thx! :)
[18:04] <ScottK> howlymowly: It's appmenu-gtk
[18:04] <shadeslayer> fejjerai: i get it on konversation as well :>
[18:05] <ScottK> Riddell: ^^^ probably good point for release notes.
[18:06] <Riddell> yees
[18:06]  * ScottK looks for claydoh_
[18:09] <howlymowly> alright ScottK..  I found the package...  but not in my ppa's :)  i guess that's because I am running kubuntu 10.04? already the gloabl menu was only available by manual download hehe
[18:09] <howlymowly> is there any workaround besids upgrading to maverick?
[18:09] <howlymowly> *besides  
[18:09] <ScottK> Not really.  gtk apps need to be patched to work with appmenu and none of the ones in 10.04 are.
[18:09] <howlymowly> (the appmenu-gtk seems to have some dependencies)
[18:09] <howlymowly> hmm..   thats bad :)
[18:09] <ScottK> So you'd also need to backport the patched packages.
[18:10] <ScottK> that's Gtk.
[18:10] <howlymowly> yeah, thats why I am using KKKubuntu :)
[18:10] <howlymowly> good that I do not use too many gtk-applications
[18:13] <fejjerai> shadeslayer: try asking in #znc
[18:13] <fejjerai> let me know what you find out
[18:13] <shadeslayer> sure
[18:20] <shadeslayer> Riddell: kdevplatform going into ppa:kubuntu-ppa/beta ... no time to testbuild Qt, i can only do that tmmrw
[18:22] <apachelogger> shadeslayer: is it beta?
[18:22] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: yes beta 3
[18:23] <apachelogger> kewl
[18:23] <shadeslayer> wrt kdevelop
[18:23] <apachelogger> hm
[18:23]  * apachelogger goes snapshotting
[18:27] <apachelogger> where does the educated user get latest amarok for lucid?
[18:28] <ScottK> I think the educated user sticks with what's stable and tested.
[18:28] <shadeslayer> apachelogger: project-neon :>
[18:28] <apachelogger> ScottK: are you saying amarok does not do QA? :P
[18:29] <ScottK> apachelogger: No.  I'm saying that there is merit to sticking with what's working.
[18:29] <blueyed> Is anybody using a LUKS usb device (or something similar)? I am about to forward https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase-workspace/+bug/629840 to BKO.
[18:29] <apachelogger> ScottK: maybe the other thing is better working
[18:29] <ScottK> Maybe.
[18:29] <apachelogger> blueyed: actually a package is missing
[18:30] <blueyed> apachelogger: cool, which?
[18:30] <apachelogger> blueyed: still the error message is the crap
[18:30] <apachelogger> truecrypt 
[18:30] <apachelogger> dunno
[18:30] <apachelogger> some silly *crypt* name for sure
[18:30] <blueyed> no truecrypt.. cryptsetup.
[18:30] <apachelogger> ah
[18:30] <apachelogger> latter
[18:30] <blueyed> but.. I have that installed, it works outside of kde.
[18:31]  * apachelogger doesnt have his key stick with him
[18:31] <apachelogger> it defenitely worked with lucid
[18:31] <apachelogger> ah
[18:31] <apachelogger> oh
[18:31]  * apachelogger should read the report ^^
[18:31] <blueyed> ok, but it might be another reason than "package missing" then, no?
[18:31] <apachelogger> blueyed: what file system?
[18:31] <blueyed> Yes, I can unlock, but not mount the unlocked one.
[18:31] <blueyed> apachelogger: ntfs.
[18:32] <apachelogger> I think we can only mount ntfs with sudo
[18:32] <apachelogger> it certainly works with ext4 and cryptsetup
[18:32] <blueyed> I would be happy if kdesudo would ask me to mount it.. ^^
[18:32] <apachelogger> blueyed: tell tsimpson that his patch is insufficient :P
[18:33]  * apachelogger doesnt really know why we need kdesudo anyway
[18:33] <apachelogger> isnt hal able to handle that sort of stuff?
[18:33] <blueyed> hal is deprecated.
[18:33] <apachelogger> says who?
[18:33] <ScottK> blueyed: Not in KDE
[18:33] <blueyed> I do not know what happens behind the scene.
[18:33] <blueyed> ok.
[18:33] <blueyed> #udev says that :D
[18:33] <apachelogger> well
[18:34] <apachelogger> #kubuntu-devel says gnome is deprecated :P
[18:34] <blueyed> it will be in kde later, too.. :)
[18:34] <blueyed> :)
[18:34] <apachelogger> still I wouldnt trust either
[18:34] <blueyed> it should work in gnome.. I should try that..
[18:34] <apachelogger> gnome does not use hal no more
[18:34] <blueyed> I'll subscribe tsimpson to the bug, right?
[18:35] <apachelogger> if he still cares... IIRC he was the one who wrote the original patch that was supposed to make ntfs mountable
[18:35] <apachelogger> also
[18:35] <apachelogger> that is not medium importance
[18:35] <blueyed> but high?
[18:35] <apachelogger> low
[18:35] <blueyed> :D - not for me.
[18:35] <apachelogger> but for me P
[18:36] <blueyed> ntfs is common sense, if you want to interact with win* systems.
[18:36] <apachelogger> me having had more uploads of the affected package being more important :P
[18:36] <apachelogger> blueyed: it works with ntfs
[18:36] <apachelogger> it does not work with luksed ntfs
[18:36] <apachelogger> of which I personally fail to see the point anyway
[18:36] <blueyed> oh well.
[18:36] <mgraesslin> ScottK: to your question from above: there are two possibilities: 1st composting self-test is just failing, 2nd something is producing heavy load during startup, so that FPS drops heavily
[18:37] <mgraesslin> given that it works sometimes number 1 is unlikely
[18:37] <ScottK> mgraesslin: I'm guessing the latter, but it's a guess.
[18:37] <blueyed> you can unlock cryptsetup on win* - but you're right, I should just drop ntfs.
[18:37] <blueyed> however, I discovered a bug at least.. ;)
[18:37] <apachelogger> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-members/kdelibs/ubuntu/changes?filter_file_id=kubuntu_06_user_disk-20081202074717-jqtakomqf3ewask8-47
[18:37] <apachelogger> that patch is super old
[18:37] <apachelogger> pre-bzr times even
[18:37] <apachelogger> scary
[18:37] <mgraesslin> ScottK: you could test that with enabling the FPS effect - it's not good but it should show if kwin stalls
[18:37] <apachelogger> we should get rid of it :P
[18:38] <ScottK> mgraesslin: I'll try it.
[18:38] <blueyed> apachelogger: do you think dropping that patch might improve its behaviour? should I forward the bug to BKO?
[18:39] <apachelogger> blueyed: you should forward the fact that the error message is next to useless
[18:40] <apachelogger> and the patch should be replaced by something more suitable because I really think hal is able to permit any user to mount stuff
[18:40] <apachelogger> that kdesudo thing is crap too
[18:40] <apachelogger> cause
[18:40] <apachelogger> say you are in a restircted environment (think school) and you still want users to be able to mount usb sticks
[18:41] <apachelogger> now I recon ntfs is not an uncommon format for stickies
[18:41] <ScottK> mgraesslin: With blur active and the plasma-widget-networkmanagement wifi connection window (that takes literally half the screen on my netbook) I get 15 - 17 FPS.  ~30 when nothing is going on.
[18:41] <apachelogger> hence fail since every user would need to be sudoer to mount a stick
[18:41]  * blueyed has not looked at the patch (and is not into kde packages anyway) - it uses kdesuo? - ah, it does not.. fixing the patch should not use hal though I think.
[18:42] <blueyed> apachelogger: being sudoer would work in most cases though - in contrast to "none".
[18:47] <blueyed> thanks for the memory leak fix!! - it was driving me kind of mad.
[18:48] <blueyed> btw: I need to resize the amarok GUI once, to make the "Context" widget in the middle behave (=> get the whole width in the middle)
[18:50] <apachelogger> blueyed: do your system logs have any additional information on the ntfs stuff?
[18:50] <blueyed> dmesg?
[18:50] <blueyed> "ntfs" not in dmesg..
[18:50] <apachelogger> and hal
[18:51] <apachelogger> in fact you'd best just grep /var/log for hal ;)
[18:51]  * apachelogger has no idea where that junk is logged
[18:52] <blueyed> lots of matches in backup files
[18:53] <apachelogger> :/
[18:54] <blueyed> does not like that.. only dpkg.log, pm-powersave and apt/dist-upgrade dirs for sudo find /var/log -name "*.log" | grep -v duply | xargs sudo grep -P "\bhal\b" -l.
[18:56]  * apachelogger i wondering why mounting ext works but not ntfs
[18:57] <mgraesslin> ScottK: seems ok, given that nothing changes (FPS effect is destroying its own benchmark as it triggers constant repaints)
[18:57] <ScottK> mgraesslin: OK.  So it's probably just something with the startup load (heaven knows KDE could use some work there).
[18:58] <mgraesslin> so true
[18:58] <ScottK> mgraesslin: Is there some change we could make to soften that up then?
[18:58] <mgraesslin> disable functionality checks by default :-P
[18:58] <Riddell> apachelogger: neversfelde said he'd do amarok
[18:58] <apachelogger> oh, not done yet? :(
[18:58] <apachelogger> that reminds me
[18:58] <neversfelde> working on it
[18:58] <ScottK> mgraesslin: OK. Perhaps a little less drastic ....
[18:59] <apachelogger> blueyed: I actually wanted to do other things than chasing after hal :P
[18:59] <ScottK> Riddell: Any luck figuring out that xbel thing on start?
[18:59] <Riddell> ScottK: not had a chance to look at it
[18:59] <Riddell> weird though
[18:59] <ScottK> Yeah.  I'm stumped.
[19:00] <Riddell> have we added any silly patches recently?
[19:00] <neversfelde> apachelogger: Don't be in such a rush! I can come over to Austria now and bring my laptop, so you can finish, if I have to go to bed :)
[19:00] <ScottK> I don't think so.  My theory is it's a timing issue where that file gets generated before ~/.local/config exists.
[19:01] <apachelogger> neversfelde: you would not dare anyway
[19:02] <neversfelde> apachelogger: sure
[19:02] <apachelogger> Riddell: startkde with mkdir -p ~/.local/share && mkdir -p ~/.config && mkdir -p ~/.cache
[19:02] <apachelogger> oh well, one can probably drop the -p for the latter 2 ^^
[19:02] <apachelogger> Riddell: I did not get dfaure to comment on that yet
[19:03] <apachelogger> also last I tried to get feedback on that proposal upstream I did not really get anyway
[19:03] <apachelogger> s/anyway/any
[19:03] <apachelogger> neversfelde: yeah sure :P
[19:05] <neversfelde> apachelogger: 30 km to the border and Asutria is not big, I will find you :)
[19:06] <blueyed> apachelogger: I could imagine that a better error message might help.. ^^ I am going to get that one in BKO at least, with a reference to the lp.net bug - however it sounded like a kubuntu patch could be involved..?!
[19:07] <apachelogger> neversfelde: lol, good luck :P
[19:08] <neversfelde> probably I should look at your latitude status message 
[19:09] <apachelogger> latidude ftw!
[19:09] <bulldog98> apachelogger: ping
[19:10] <apachelogger> bulldog98: pogo
[19:11] <bulldog98> apachelogger: you wanted to speek with me about membership
[19:11] <apachelogger> ah rightly
[19:11] <apachelogger> lets take that to a query
[19:26] <Mamarok> neversfelde: thanks :)
[19:41] <apachelogger> ScottK: pingy
[19:41] <ScottK> apachelogger: pongish.
[19:41] <apachelogger> ScottK: do you happen to have a plasma-netbook around to make a super awesome hot screenshot?
[19:42] <ScottK> apachelogger: Yes.
[19:42] <ScottK> What are you looking for?
[19:42] <apachelogger> ScottK: plasma-netbook with plasmoids I suppose
[19:42] <apachelogger> something show off at least
[19:42]  * apachelogger is preparing a blog stating reasons why Kubuntu (or KDE) is super awesom and people should use it ;)
[19:43] <ScottK> I see.
[19:43] <ScottK> http://skitterman.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/appmenu1.jpeg was pretty popular.
[19:45] <apachelogger> ScottK: not very netbooky though
[19:45] <apachelogger> erm
[19:45] <apachelogger> well
[19:45] <apachelogger> plasma-netbook
[19:45] <ScottK> Tru.
[19:45] <ScottK> e
[19:45] <blueyed> ScottK: png would be much better - sorry
[19:45] <ScottK> Let me come up with something.
[19:45] <apachelogger> oh, that too ^^
[19:46] <ScottK> blueyed: Patents are expired.
[19:46] <apachelogger> ScottK: still png is lossless and jpeg is not
[19:46] <blueyed> ScottK: from gif?
[19:46]  * apachelogger imports a billion billion photos into digikam
[19:46] <ScottK> Oh, yeah.  That was gif.
[19:47] <blueyed> would be better than jpeg maybe.. ;)
[19:47] <blueyed> png is it for screenshots.
[19:47] <apachelogger> what I probably hate most about both digikam and amarok is that they do not populate their views on the fly
[19:47] <blueyed> what game is this? (http://skitterman.files.wordpress.com/2010/07/appmenu1.jpeg)
[19:47] <apachelogger> it is is sort of horrible to essentially wait for digikam to scan a billion pictures before I can do anything
[19:48] <blueyed> I can see the title nowhere!! (semantic bug)
[19:49] <blueyed> I am really glad about some of the latest kde patches.. nasty bugs you would not expect in a .1 release (still).
[19:49] <blueyed> Thanks.
[19:52] <blueyed> can you convert ntfs inplace to ext4? ;/
[19:52] <blueyed> I should get the nfts-on-luks bug pushed.. ;)
[19:53] <blueyed> later though.. waiting for a ppa build to finish is like programming with lags: so much wait and so much to drink.
[20:03] <eMyller> hey plasma dudes, take a look at it: http://design-milk.com/dell-inspiron-duo/
[20:05] <apachelogger> hm
[20:05] <apachelogger> uhhhh
[20:05] <apachelogger> exciting
[20:05] <apachelogger> that is two paradigms in one
[20:05] <apachelogger> that is like
[20:05] <apachelogger> hm
[20:05] <apachelogger> plasma-tablet and plasma-netbook
[20:06] <apachelogger> and on the fly switching
[20:06] <apachelogger> uh uh uh
[20:06] <apachelogger> activities come to mind
[20:06] <apachelogger> someone get me such a device
[20:06]  * apachelogger feels inspired like not within the last year
[20:07] <nigelb> lucidfox: oh, you too!
[20:08]  * nigelb wanted to swtich, Intel 855 isn't playing nice with lucid :/
[20:12] <eMyller> apachelogger: we have to wait till end of this year :\
[20:12]  * apachelogger thinks his post is in need of spunk
[20:13] <apachelogger> eMyller: cant mario send us some prototype? ;)
[20:13] <ScottK> Riddell: poxml was accepted with the binary going into Universe.  One of it's reverse-build-depends is in Main.
[20:13] <eMyller> apachelogger: mario?
[20:13] <ScottK> apachelogger: Maybe he can bring it to UDS.
[20:13] <apachelogger> eMyller: superm1
[20:14] <apachelogger> ScottK: worth asking I suppose 
[20:14] <apachelogger> one week should be more than enough to make us compatible with that thing ^^
[20:14] <ScottK> He might even let you touch it.
[20:14] <eMyller> didn't know about him :P
[20:14] <eMyller> hehe
[20:14] <apachelogger> I only needs ssh
[20:14]  * apachelogger can remote controlz the plasma via javascript
[20:14] <apachelogger> <= supreme javascript0r
[20:15] <eMyller> and some telekinesis to touch the thing :P
[20:15] <apachelogger> someone else can do that
[20:15] <apachelogger> in fact 
[20:15] <apachelogger> I expect it to move by my movement
[20:15] <apachelogger> talking about that
[20:16] <apachelogger> if the design team pursues that movement detection stuff not only will your battery go bye bye but also will you not be able to relax intermediately while working
[20:16] <nigelb> apachelogger: +1
[20:16] <apachelogger> the dragonball you watch in the bottom right corner will go fullscreen
[20:16] <apachelogger> or some other sort of movie
[20:16] <apachelogger> how embarassing that would be... ^^
[20:16] <nigelb> and you will get kicked out of the library or office
[20:17] <apachelogger> aight
[20:17] <apachelogger> maybe there is ergonomical concern behind it though ^^
[20:20]  * apachelogger bounces
[20:40] <ScottK> apachelogger: Here's a couple (working on a widgety one) http://kitterman.com/kubuntu/present1.png http://kitterman.com/kubuntu/sal1.png
[20:40] <ScottK> Currently stymied by an unfortunate unwillingness of the comics widget to actually display a comic
[20:41] <apachelogger> hm
[20:41] <apachelogger> ScottK: thanks :)
[20:45] <ScottK> apachelogger: Widgets ahoy: http://kitterman.com/kubuntu/newspaper.png
[20:45] <ScottK> I may have found a critical but though.
[20:46] <ScottK> Can anyone else select a comic in the comic widget on Maverick (yes, I did install some)?
[20:46] <ScottK> but/bug
[20:50] <ScottK> apachelogger: You said you wanted hot, so I hope you appreciate the extra trouble I went to get that that YouTube content in the present windows screenshot.
[20:53] <apachelogger> I do
[20:53] <JontheEchidna> lol @ lady gaga
[20:53] <apachelogger> though my definition of hot is different :P
[20:54] <JontheEchidna> now... was somebody saying something about seed changes?
[20:54] <ScottK> JontheEchidna: It's taken care of.
[20:54] <ScottK> apachelogger: Certainly, but since I made the screen shot, I get to pick.
[20:55] <apachelogger> yeah ^^
[20:57] <maco> JontheEchidna: Riddell got it
[21:56] <ulysses> dantti_work: I've just upgraded to Maverick, and the KPackageKit tray icon is missing, a question marked page appears instead of, is this known already?
[22:16] <ulysses> Anyone noticed that Maverick drops a lot of ERROR in tty? http://pastebin.com/VBVFD0Cy
[22:38] <ulysses> bug 644740
[22:44] <ScottK> ulysses: You should talke to someone in #ubuntu-x.
[22:44] <ScottK> (make sure you have today's mesa update first)