[08:57] <MichealH> UndiFineD: here?
[09:45] <UndiFineD> good morning
[09:46] <UndiFineD> yes MichealH, I'm here
[11:33] <MichealH> Opp
[11:33] <MichealH> Yeah
[11:33] <MichealH> I was away :S
[11:33] <MichealH> UndiFineD: So youre here?
[11:37] <UndiFineD> yep
[11:37] <MichealH> I think I know why It aint working
[11:37] <MichealH> let me try to fix :)
[11:37] <UndiFineD> well, it works for LANG=nl_NL.utf8
[11:38] <UndiFineD> using nl_NL as the directory
[11:38] <MichealH> And where is the LANG place?
[11:38] <MichealH> In the source code dir?
[11:38] <MichealH> Like the .py files?
[11:39] <UndiFineD> no, that is how you can set the language from the commendline
[11:39] <UndiFineD> it is stored in 'env'
[11:39] <UndiFineD> which you can use to lookup all set environment variables
[11:40] <UndiFineD> you can make a variable permanent from that moment by ' export LANG=nl_NL.utf8 '
[11:41] <MichealH> This means I could do a quick patch
[11:41] <UndiFineD> which would make that shell dutch
[11:45] <MichealH> IT WORKS
[11:45] <MichealH> I just had to restart the app... Doh!
[11:46]  * MichealH hides the tomatos and other things trown at him
[11:46] <UndiFineD> hehehe
[11:46] <MichealH> Excuse my idiocy
[11:46] <MichealH> Okay, So, How do I push?
[11:47] <UndiFineD>  bzr pull && bzr add && bzr commit -m "message here" && bzr push lp:ubuntu-tour
[11:47] <MichealH> It comes up with a ">" on the next line
[11:48] <UndiFineD> read the line first :)
[11:48] <MichealH> Whut?
[11:48] <UndiFineD> ctrl-C breaks operation
[11:48] <UndiFineD> bzr pull
[11:48] <UndiFineD> bzr add
[11:49] <UndiFineD> bzr commit -m "your push message here"
[11:49] <UndiFineD> bzr push lp:ubuntu-tour
[11:49] <MichealH> Its doing it!
[11:49] <UndiFineD> pull before push, means your never overwrite other people's doings
[11:49] <MichealH> ITS DOING IT!
[11:50] <UndiFineD> :)
[11:50] <MichealH> YAH!
[11:50] <MichealH> W00T
[11:50] <MichealH> My first push evah!
[11:50] <MichealH> Is commited the revision!
[11:51] <MichealH> Now pushing
[11:51] <UndiFineD> :)
[11:51] <MichealH> Committed revision 244.
[11:51] <MichealH> Pushed up to revision 244.
[11:51] <MichealH> michealh@michealh-laptop:~/ubuntu-tour$
[11:51] <MichealH> YESH!
[11:51] <MichealH> branch it please :)
[11:51]  * MichealH has done quite a bit
[11:51] <UndiFineD> done
[11:52] <MichealH> Whatya think?
[11:52] <MichealH> I may need to do annother change but thats all really
[11:52] <MichealH> I need to fill in PPA's
[11:52] <UndiFineD> well, now you know how
[11:53] <UndiFineD> I had bzr issues too at this being my first project
[11:53] <UndiFineD> making use of bazaar
[11:54] <UndiFineD> I also filed patches for the kernel, but they we're ignored
[11:54] <UndiFineD> as being too much cosmetic
[11:54] <MichealH> Okay small update will be coming
[11:55] <UndiFineD> yes, it is eassier to file several small patches
[11:55] <UndiFineD> especially when oyu notice others are working in that area too
[11:56] <MichealH> Next push coming
[11:56] <MichealH> Commited
[11:56] <UndiFineD> I use bazaar explorer mainly to look at log changes
[11:56] <MichealH> Now pushing
[11:56] <MichealH> (This is easy)
[11:56] <UndiFineD> it is
[11:57] <MichealH> Pushed
[11:57] <MichealH> :D
[11:57] <MichealH> Im gonna enjoy doing this
[11:58] <UndiFineD> and I can wait for pulling, even when you file 200 patches, when I pull before push everything you did will be in my branch befor commiting
[11:59] <MichealH> Yup :)
[11:59] <MichealH> Why dont you pull now?
[11:59] <MichealH> :)
[11:59] <UndiFineD> oh doing other things at the same time
[11:59] <MichealH> Okies
[12:00] <MichealH> Can I do a todo item?
[12:00] <MichealH> Like in the /TODO/ folder?
[12:00] <MichealH> UndiFineD: ^^
[12:00] <UndiFineD> yes sure, it is all just basic copy paste from help and support
[12:01] <UndiFineD> which you can find in the sytem menu
[12:01] <MichealH> Also, If I did one how would a folder be deleted from bzr
[12:01] <UndiFineD> so the texts have been approved by canonical
[12:01] <UndiFineD> if you delete a folder and push
[12:02] <UndiFineD> it will remove it from the branch
[12:02] <UndiFineD> so for that too, pull before push
[12:02] <MichealH> But If I pulled?
[12:03] <MichealH> If i deleted and pulled wont it recreate?
[12:03] <UndiFineD> it should do
[12:03] <MichealH> So in that case I just delete the pull?
[12:04] <MichealH> I just add, commit and push?
[12:04] <UndiFineD> for safety, when you did something wrong, just create a new branch in a separate directory
[12:05] <MichealH> Like a backup?
[12:05] <UndiFineD> yes
[12:05] <MichealH> So I cp the files over then if I mess it up I cp back then commit again.
[12:06] <UndiFineD> yes, you could do that too
[12:08] <UndiFineD> but, when you messed up in your tree branch, you can create another branch in a separate directory
[12:08] <MichealH> WOW! Login screen has nothing in it t all
[12:09] <webrsk> Hello UndiFineD :) :) :)
[12:18] <UndiFineD> he webrsk
[12:18] <UndiFineD> sorry, I am hanging up some laundry
[12:18] <webrsk> :) :) :)
[12:20] <webrsk> I noted down your point regarding the screenshot tag from earlier irc log and i fixed it too :)
[12:22] <webrsk> just wanted to push , but the about_ubuntu section found missing during the tour in the latest revision 245 ...
[12:35] <webrsk> env
[12:36] <MichealH> UndiFineD: I am having isues creating a new section
[12:40] <UndiFineD> webrsk, lol
[12:41] <UndiFineD> MichealH wanted to do the en_US vs en_GB splice
[12:41] <UndiFineD> which is how that happened
[12:41] <webrsk> :) ya lang 'en' has changed :P
[12:41] <UndiFineD> but in the code that <screenshot /> is fixed ? great that makes it xml compatible again
[12:42] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Did you see what I said?
[12:42] <webrsk> yup i have tested :) let me pull & push :P
[12:42] <MichealH> 11:37 < MichealH> UndiFineD: I am having isues creating a new section
[12:42] <UndiFineD> what do you mean by section ?
[12:43] <MichealH> Like you have Getting Started > About Ubuntu
[12:43] <UndiFineD> which is done in the info files
[12:43] <UndiFineD> *.info
[12:44] <MichealH> But It isnt working :S
[12:44] <MichealH> Here is my tour.info file:
[12:44] <MichealH> name:Login Screen
[12:44] <MichealH> parent:Continue Playing
[12:44] <MichealH> position:11
[12:44] <MichealH> And nope, not working :/
[12:45] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Want me to push to let you fix?
[12:46] <UndiFineD> the tree root is in ./categories
[12:46] <UndiFineD> which still is 'en'
[12:46] <MichealH> Thats it!
[12:47] <UndiFineD> I am getting good at code logic without reading the code
[12:47] <MichealH> Uhh...
[12:47] <MichealH> It only has the gettingstarted.info file :L
[12:47] <UndiFineD> indeed
[12:47] <MichealH> Where do the other categories some in?>
[12:48] <UndiFineD> and it need to be en_GB and en_US
[12:48] <UndiFineD> want me to do it ?
[12:49] <MichealH> Its fixed
[12:49] <MichealH> I forgot to add a 'en' folder in the folder I wanted it to read
[12:49] <MichealH> Or a en_GB _S ect.
[12:50] <UndiFineD> commited
[12:51] <MichealH> Huh?
[12:51] <MichealH> I am goint tocommit now?
[12:51] <UndiFineD> :)
[12:53] <MichealH> Thanks alot
[12:53] <MichealH> :L
[12:53] <MichealH> CONFLICTS!!!
[12:55] <MichealH> Commited and pushed
[13:02] <MichealH> Commited
[13:02] <MichealH> Pushed No.248
[13:04] <MichealH> Just a minor fix
[13:09] <UndiFineD> :D
[13:14] <MichealH> Now to do thre gedit section
[13:14] <MichealH> *the
[13:27] <MichealH> Okay, Im gonna try gedit section now
[13:28] <UndiFineD> added a separate languages directory
[13:28] <UndiFineD> they still need to be converted to LANG setup
[13:29] <MichealH> I kniw
[13:29] <MichealH> Let me push now
[13:29] <UndiFineD> and i need to fish up my flags
[13:30] <MichealH> Oulling
[13:30] <MichealH> *Pulling
[13:32] <MichealH> Commited
[13:32] <MichealH> Pushed -250 is new revision
[13:37] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Can you pull to see If you agree with the new category/section please?
[13:42] <UndiFineD> nice
[13:43] <UndiFineD> dreaming of no more user support requests
[13:43] <UndiFineD> hehehe
[13:44] <MichealH> UndiFineD: hah lol
[13:44] <MichealH> UndiFineD: I have a Idea on how the tour can interact with the user
[13:44] <UndiFineD> :)
[13:45] <UndiFineD> brb, need to make a call
[13:46] <MichealH> OKay
[13:46]  * MichealH gets to work on user interactivity
[13:48] <UndiFineD> done
[13:49] <MichealH> I was thinking of introducing medals and trpheys
[13:49] <MichealH> *tropheys
[13:50] <UndiFineD> oh that would be great, if they viewed a tour, they get a bronze, if they interact silver, if completed gold, something like that
[13:50] <MichealH> A quiz at the end for Platinum?
[13:51] <UndiFineD> we also need to do something for difficulty level, I was thinking of some smileys
[13:51] <MichealH> Yup
[13:51] <UndiFineD> a quiz ?
[13:51] <MichealH> Or colour coes
[13:51] <UndiFineD> better mke that short then
[13:52] <UndiFineD> like 3 Q's per tour
[13:59] <UndiFineD> we do not want to annoy people, just teach them the basics of ubuntu, Q's could be useful in corperate env, verifying the user knows how to do things
[13:59] <UndiFineD> but they should be able to work without reading doing the tour entirely
[14:00] <UndiFineD> if they feel they are being pushed in doing the tour that is wrong, however, if they did not do the tour, support giving people could refer to it
[14:01]  * UndiFineD pokes aprilg1 
[14:01] <UndiFineD> you have a steady connection today
[14:02] <UndiFineD> tardis
[14:04] <UndiFineD> popey you do not have a highlight on tardis ?
[14:04] <UndiFineD> I am amazed
[14:05] <popey> heh
[14:09] <UndiFineD> MichealH, did you check out the Build Tests too ?
[14:09] <MichealH> Yeah
[14:10] <UndiFineD> pressed Go!!
[14:11] <MichealH> Yeah
[14:19] <MichealH> Is the meeting in 40 mins?
[14:20] <UndiFineD> it is
[14:20] <MichealH> UndiFineD: ^^
[14:20] <MichealH> Oop
[14:20] <MichealH> Okay
[14:20] <MichealH> We should bring upthe trophy thing @ the meeting
[14:21] <UndiFineD> add it to the pad
[14:31] <MichealH> Pulling, Adding, Commiting and Pushing new rev
[14:32] <MichealH> done
[14:32] <MichealH> Rev 251 is now pushed
[14:33] <MichealH> The TODO folder is become ever so empty :P
[14:33] <UndiFineD> which is great, saves me some trouble
[14:41] <MichealH> I just need some screenies done :)
[14:43] <UndiFineD> oh, that can wait
[14:43] <UndiFineD> I would not be suprised if canonical added new thingies to the final too
[14:45] <UndiFineD> and before we are even merged with the installation cd, a long road is ahead, then we will have to recreate them and again
[14:46] <MichealH> New Revision
[14:46] <MichealH> I am looking at your sudo thing.... ;)
[14:46] <MichealH> more for me to do?
[14:47] <UndiFineD> for anyone who wants it
[14:47] <UndiFineD> just spitting out idea's
[14:48] <UndiFineD> which is so much, I do not have the time to do it all
[14:49] <UndiFineD> but we have a large group, so just getting some of it done, is improvement
[14:51] <UndiFineD> heh, aboutme before about ubuntu
[14:51] <UndiFineD> I guess that folder needs an extra a
[14:53] <MichealH> Or it position changed
[14:55] <UndiFineD> ls ubuntu-tour: about-me; about-ubuntu
[14:55] <UndiFineD> when an extra a is added: aabout-ubuntu-about-me
[14:56] <UndiFineD> when an extra a is added: aabout-ubuntu; about-me
[14:56] <UndiFineD> me comes before ubuntu
[14:58] <MichealH> It isnt affecting the application, is it?
[14:58] <MichealH> Ahh well
[14:58] <MichealH> It can be reversed
[14:59] <MichealH> aaa didnt go well
[14:59] <MichealH> I went about-zme
[14:59] <MichealH> That woked
[14:59] <UndiFineD> lol
[15:00] <UndiFineD> silly alfabet
[15:00] <MichealH> Pushing
[15:00] <MichealH> in...
[15:01] <UndiFineD> mmmm, meeting time
[15:01] <UndiFineD> Muscovy,
[15:01] <MichealH> No need to ping me
[15:01] <MichealH> (although I did say in email)
[15:01] <MichealH> ;)
[15:02] <MichealH> Rev 254 pushed
[15:02] <UndiFineD> aprilg1, Dykam, Muscovy, Omega
[15:03]  * Dykam looks
[15:03] <MichealH> Does p<tab> need pinging? ;)
[15:03] <UndiFineD> great
[15:03] <UndiFineD> popey is just here to log
[15:03] <UndiFineD> busy busy man
[15:04] <MichealH> Isnt ubuntulog doing that?
[15:04] <UndiFineD> it is
[15:04] <MichealH> Oh... The pisg stuff?
[15:05] <popey> i am?
[15:05] <MichealH> :/
[15:05]  * MichealH avoids conflict
[15:05] <MichealH> ;)
[15:07] <MichealH> Anyone here for the meeting?
[15:07] <MichealH> Omega: ping?
[15:07] <UndiFineD> anyway, I expected a few more people at this time
[15:07] <MichealH> Hmm... Yeah
[15:08] <MichealH> Anyway...
[15:08] <MichealH> The have scrollback :P
[15:08] <MichealH> I can log?
[15:08] <UndiFineD> if you want to
[15:08] <UndiFineD> the ubuntulog does that too
[15:09] <MichealH> Well, Yeah
[15:09] <MichealH> Shall we start?
[15:09] <UndiFineD> with just four of us ?
[15:10] <MichealH> *ahem* Yeah
[15:10] <MichealH> :P
[15:10] <UndiFineD> 4 out of 9 signed up
[15:11] <MichealH> Hrmm...
[15:12] <MichealH> We shoild just start and they cn catch up
[15:12] <UndiFineD> [start meeting]
[15:13] <UndiFineD> http://openetherpad.org/r14iF5iOQs
[15:13] <UndiFineD> present are:
[15:13] <UndiFineD> o/
[15:13] <MichealH> I added somethino/
[15:13] <MichealH> o/
[15:14] <UndiFineD> [topic: Menu orientation, horizontal or vertical ?]
[15:14] <UndiFineD> skip this, no point to discuss this now
[15:15] <UndiFineD> [topic: uncovered items]
[15:15] <UndiFineD> Help to improve english language, there are uncovered topics too
[15:16] <UndiFineD> well, that is easy, I made a huge TODO directory which has topics uncovered and the texts from the Help and Support on the current installation cd
[15:16] <MichealH> I am kindly covering topics
[15:16] <UndiFineD> those texts are approved
[15:16] <MichealH> I am working from the TODO directory
[15:16] <UndiFineD> thanks for that MichealH
[15:16] <MichealH> May take a week or two
[15:17] <MichealH> I could focus on this  and get it done in maybe a week?
[15:17] <MichealH> Im always commiting when I can
[15:17] <UndiFineD> time cannot be determined now, as there is so much going on, with official release so close
[15:17] <UndiFineD> 7 more days
[15:18] <UndiFineD> till 10.10.10
[15:19] <UndiFineD> besides my TODO has not yet been expanded with anyone elses
[15:19] <UndiFineD> and there are unfinished items in the working tours too
[15:20] <UndiFineD> done ranting
[15:20] <UndiFineD> [topic: screenshots]
[15:20] <MichealH> Okay,
[15:20] <MichealH> I could be able to dig out my maverick CD?
[15:20] <MichealH> Update the things?
[15:20] <UndiFineD> PNG is recommended for screenshots, resolution 800x600
[15:21] <MichealH> It seems Muscovy is working on them
[15:21] <MichealH> I will leave it to Muscovy
[15:21] <UndiFineD> there is a fresh cd coming from Muscovy  soon
[15:22] <UndiFineD> but even then, I expect some alterations from canonical in the release
[15:22] <MichealH> We can try and update it
[15:22] <UndiFineD> so screenshots can wait a bit
[15:22] <MichealH> I can package it and get it released on the website
[15:23] <MichealH> Into a .deb
[15:23] <UndiFineD> it would be nice though to have a bit more done before UDS-N summit
[15:23] <MichealH> Yeah
[15:23] <UndiFineD> we have a screenshot tag instead of html img
[15:23] <popey> is the plan to get this in the repo for N?
[15:24] <MichealH> popey: I think so
[15:24] <UndiFineD> <screaanshot src="" /> works and is xml compliant
[15:24] <MichealH> I can get it sponsored
[15:24] <UndiFineD> <screenshot src="" /> works and is xml compliant
[15:24] <UndiFineD> popey, hopefully
[15:24] <popey> ok
[15:25] <popey> anyone from the team attending UDS-N?
[15:25] <UndiFineD> me
[15:25] <UndiFineD> online that is
[15:25] <MichealH> I will be online
[15:25] <MichealH> I cant fly over to wherever it is :(
[15:26] <popey> ok
[15:26] <UndiFineD> Nicola Moretto writes someting about translated screenshots
[15:26] <MichealH> Can we move on?
[15:26] <UndiFineD> not sure what he means
[15:27] <MichealH> Like screenshots in that pericular language
[15:27] <MichealH> So Instead of a toolbar saying open its whatever language it is.
[15:28] <UndiFineD> yes, each language can have it's own set of shots
[15:29] <MichealH> I can fix
[15:29] <UndiFineD> we have a lightbox that enlarges the image to real size
[15:30] <UndiFineD> silasle write about back and next buttons there
[15:31] <MichealH> Oh BTW I can do some screenshots of different languages and try to patch before end of meeting
[15:31] <UndiFineD> taking screenshots is a lot of work, can can only truly be done nice in a virtual machine
[15:32] <MichealH> Yeah
[15:32] <MichealH> Or make a new account
[15:33] <UndiFineD> no, that way it is very hard to do context menu's
[15:33] <MichealH> Yeah
[15:33] <popey> it is?
[15:33]  * MichealH gets out VirtualBox
[15:33] <UndiFineD> that is when you right click
[15:33] <popey> i just set a delay on the screenshot tool of 3 seconds and then do the right click
[15:33] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Set a delay~?
[15:34] <UndiFineD> even then it eassier to do this right from a vm
[15:34] <UndiFineD> and there are no unwanted packages
[15:34] <MichealH> Not really
[15:35] <MichealH> This is sorta a new install
[15:35] <UndiFineD> that me be, but it isn't nice if i would show nmap from my system menu
[15:36] <MichealH> Okay, I will try to patch in a good way
[15:36] <UndiFineD> welcome webrsk
[15:36] <MichealH> Uhh I will be away
[15:36] <webrsk> Hello UndiFineD :) :)
[15:37] <UndiFineD> ok, I think we're done with screenshots
[15:37] <UndiFineD> [topic: Help us get onto the Narwhal Installation CD]
[15:38] <UndiFineD> If we continue to make good progress as we are, we could replace the Help and Support / About Ubuntu
[15:39] <UndiFineD> we need promoters that help us get onto the cd and approved by canonical
[15:39] <webrsk> Thats great :)
[15:39] <UndiFineD> in the TODO directory are all texts of that application which are approved
[15:40] <webrsk> You are right !!!
[15:40] <UndiFineD> some of that can be replaced by shots
[15:41] <UndiFineD> which reduces translation effort, and transforms it into shots effort
[15:41] <webrsk> Ya we need a team who can work on screenshots , so it will speed up..
[15:41] <webrsk> 100% agree....Yup :)
[15:41] <webrsk> So we need to choose the topics which can be replaced with screenshots ...
[15:42] <UndiFineD> most of it is just lengthier wording of our own
[15:43] <UndiFineD> spliced into more pages
[15:44] <UndiFineD> I think this is clear
[15:45] <UndiFineD> [topic: merges]
[15:45] <UndiFineD> some people had to deal with merges
[15:45] <UndiFineD> right nicola88 ?
[15:46] <UndiFineD> this is easily prevented by pulling before pushing
[15:46] <UndiFineD> bzr pull
[15:46] <UndiFineD> bzr add
[15:46] <UndiFineD> bzr commit -m "your message"
[15:47] <UndiFineD> bzr push lp:ubuntu-tour
[15:47] <nicola88> here I am.
[15:48] <UndiFineD> this prevents merges, and prevents you to overwrite other peoples doings
[15:49] <webrsk> yes....pull command will make things better :)
[15:50] <UndiFineD> can someone add this sequence to the website ?
[15:50] <nicola88> i apologize i had some problems the first time i used bazaar. Are there some problems with the last "commits"?
[15:50] <UndiFineD> nicola88, it is ok, we just noticed this was not clear
[15:51] <UndiFineD> no harm done
[15:51] <nicola88> ok :)
[15:51] <UndiFineD> for many this is their first project
[15:52] <UndiFineD> including me
[15:54] <UndiFineD> can someone add this sequence to the website ?
[15:54] <webrsk> okay,undiFineD ill do that..
[15:54] <UndiFineD> thanks
[15:54] <webrsk> http://ubuntutour.org/contribute/branch/  ? This is not a wiki right.
[15:55] <UndiFineD> [topic: aprilg1, set deadline to finish all content (English)]
[15:56] <UndiFineD> UDS-N is here: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-n/
[15:56] <webrsk> Ya we all interested to know the roadmap...
[15:56] <UndiFineD> Starts: Mon, 25 Oct 2010 10:00:00 EDT
[15:56] <UndiFineD> Ends: Fri, 29 Oct 2010 19:00:00 EDT
[15:57] <UndiFineD> do we think it is possible to have a good version for this event ?
[15:58] <webrsk> Does All content includes the "TODO contents" also right ?
[15:58] <UndiFineD> no, I think that is for later operation
[15:59] <UndiFineD> we have 4 months to have a really nice version for inclusion
[15:59] <webrsk> Thats great span of time :)
[15:59] <UndiFineD> by that time, it has to be very complete
[15:59] <UndiFineD> with shots and all
[16:01] <nicola88> I think yes (if we exclude the TODO content). But we need to decide which contents are completed (and they will not be modified) so we can proceed with revision and translations (i think other translator agree)
[16:02] <UndiFineD> so for all current topics, can we have all English language complete by Saturday 23th of Oct ?
[16:02] <UndiFineD> this gives time to package it
[16:04] <nicola88> for example a lot of pages that were using the <img> tag now use <screenshot> instead; this changes require that i update all the translated pages.
[16:05] <UndiFineD> yes I know, but we do not need to have the translations done by that time
[16:05] <UndiFineD> just english
[16:05] <webrsk> nicola88:Ya that has to be done but the deadline we keep for now is for english content alone..
[16:05] <webrsk> yes :)
[16:06] <UndiFineD> okay let's set that as a goal then
[16:06] <UndiFineD> I would wait making shots after oct 10th
[16:06] <nicola88> i know, it's only an example to explain that before proceeding with translation we should complete the content
[16:07] <nicola88> and finalize it
[16:07] <UndiFineD> just to be sure we do not have another set of cosmetic changes
[16:07] <nicola88> @ UndiFineD: exactly :)
[16:10] <UndiFineD> [topic: aprilg1, set a week for edits/final review for all English content (translations can continue while this is ongoing)]
[16:10] <nicola88> when we make changes like these (tag, style, ...) we should pay attention to consistence, otherwise we could have - for example - the <img> tag in some pages and the <screenshot> tag in others
[16:10] <UndiFineD> I think a week is a bit short
[16:11] <UndiFineD> exactly for the reason nicola88 just mentioned
[16:12] <webrsk> Category wise review can happen.. so each category will get freezed ..
[16:12] <UndiFineD> so after UDS-N we will have had comments on the project, and get a few revisions
[16:13] <UndiFineD> and after that is done we can do that category review
[16:14] <UndiFineD> if you have time to do more translations this is ok ofcourse
[16:15] <UndiFineD> but mind that you may have to redo some
[16:17] <UndiFineD> are we done here ?
[16:17] <nicola88> yes
[16:17] <UndiFineD> [topic: aprilg1: contact Ubuntu System Docs team (for inclusion in 11.04 release)]
[16:18] <UndiFineD> hopefully we find some of them at uds
[16:19] <UndiFineD> or maybe someone is willing to do this in some other way ?
[16:20] <webrsk> Does anyone already contacted ubuntu system docs team regarding the inclusion?
[16:21] <UndiFineD> well, we can leave this for now
[16:21] <UndiFineD> move it to next meeting
[16:22] <UndiFineD> [topic: vanHoi: Take a look at Idea's list on the Todo list]
[16:22] <UndiFineD> short list of idea's
[16:22] <UndiFineD> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuTour/Todo#List
[16:23] <UndiFineD> but really this is after uds
[16:24] <webrsk> once the current sub-topics are completed then we can proceed with the ideas list.
[16:24] <nicola88> a lot of interesting topics, but most of them are advanced
[16:25] <UndiFineD> nicola88, is this :Programas / temas a incluir: yours ?
[16:25] <nicola88> what ?
[16:25] <UndiFineD> or is it from aprilg1
[16:26] <UndiFineD> does not really matter, but it is hard to read when not english
[16:26] <nicola88> it's not mine
[16:27] <UndiFineD> ok, think this is done too
[16:27] <UndiFineD> [topic: dtigue: Discuss Advanced users section]
[16:28] <UndiFineD> same thing, we know we want several levels of advanced
[16:28] <UndiFineD> but this can wait
[16:28] <nicola88> yes the idea is excellent but we can consider these topics in a second moment
[16:28] <UndiFineD> MichealH, proposed a medal awward system this afternoon
[16:29] <UndiFineD> reading could give a bronze, follow with the app open silver, fill out a short questionaire after the tour gold
[16:30] <UndiFineD> this is great for corporate use as personnel certification
[16:30] <nicola88> yes, it could attract more user and make the tour more enjoyable
[16:31] <webrsk> nice.... :) My 5cents for that idea :)
[16:31] <UndiFineD> great, cookie for MichealH
[16:31] <webrsk> :P
[16:32] <UndiFineD> [topic: nicola88; Navigation menu: how to translate the main sections (Getting Started, Office, ...)]
[16:32] <UndiFineD> translation of the menu's happens in the first line of the *.info files
[16:32] <UndiFineD> you can look at how I did it for dutch
[16:33] <nicola88> ok thanks
[16:33] <UndiFineD> that is nl_NL
[16:33] <UndiFineD> is this clear nicola88 ?
[16:33] <nicola88> yes
[16:34] <UndiFineD> ok, moving on
[16:34] <webrsk> :)
[16:34] <UndiFineD> [topic: nicola88: Translated screenshot]
[16:34] <Muscovy> Hi all.
[16:34] <UndiFineD> though we already covvered alot of screenshot stuff while you were not here
[16:34] <Muscovy> I'm awake. :D
[16:34] <UndiFineD> morning Muscovy
[16:34] <UndiFineD> :p
[16:34] <webrsk> Helloo Muscovy , Welcome :)
[16:35] <Muscovy> How much have I missed?
[16:35] <UndiFineD> a lot according to my ranting log
[16:36] <UndiFineD> nicola88, what did you mean by translated shots ?
[16:37] <nicola88> in the tour, i can't use the original screenshot with the translated text
[16:37] <nicola88> because the user won't find corrispondence between the screenshot and the text (particularly with menu)
[16:38] <UndiFineD> well we need to make separate shots then for each language
[16:38] <nicola88> exactly
[16:38] <UndiFineD> which some of us already did
[16:38] <UndiFineD> ~/ubuntu-tour/about-ubuntu/nl_NL/images/
[16:38] <nicola88> me too but since the default font has changed, we need to take the screenshots again, right ?
[16:39] <UndiFineD> indeed, but that can wait till after release on 10.10.10
[16:40] <nicola88> ok
[16:40] <UndiFineD> [topic: Silasle: Next/back buttons in lightbox (screenshot tag)]
[16:41] <UndiFineD> yes, those are still missing
[16:41] <UndiFineD> would be nice to have
[16:41] <UndiFineD> with pre-indexed images this is done eassier i think
[16:41] <UndiFineD> like 000-desktop.png
[16:42] <webrsk> So if a page has more screenshots only that page will have a prev & next button in lightbox.. rite ?
[16:42] <nicola88> with the images in an unique folder and named in that way, i think yes
[16:43] <UndiFineD> or, the code should walk the full tour, searching for shots and wlak the array that way
[16:43] <webrsk> Oh you mean the gallery of all the screenshots of the tour ?
[16:44] <webrsk> or only to specific page which has more images ?
[16:44] <UndiFineD> like, page 3 has such a shot, and pages 4 has 2 and page 5 1
[16:44] <UndiFineD> put them into an array
[16:45] <UndiFineD> and give that to lightbox
[16:45] <UndiFineD> by example
[16:45] <Muscovy> Wait, is the meeting going on now?
[16:45] <UndiFineD> yes Muscovy
[16:45] <UndiFineD> for 1,5 hours
[16:46] <Muscovy> Oh goodness.
[16:46] <Muscovy> Though I thought it didn't start for 10 minutes yet. :P
[16:47] <UndiFineD> i gave time in UTC
[16:48] <UndiFineD> so pre-indexed files is one option, or walk the tour for screenshot tags another
[16:48] <webrsk> wont user get distracted if they taken from page 3 to page 5 without reading contents ?
[16:48] <UndiFineD> whichever works
[16:48] <UndiFineD> it could
[16:48] <Muscovy> webrsk: Very, I should think.
[16:50] <UndiFineD> well, the coders can figure this out i guess
[16:50] <Muscovy> ...why are we missing the about-ubuntu chapter?
[16:50] <UndiFineD> [topic: Alex: Look at packaging options.]
[16:50] <UndiFineD> I think we have 5 people that can make debs
[16:51] <Muscovy> I can.
[16:51] <webrsk> Coding wise no problem in doing it.Just thinking about user point of view ..
[16:51] <Muscovy> I was thinking about install issues.
[16:51] <Muscovy> Viz a vi getting it included.
[16:51] <Muscovy> That's no way we can fit screenshots of 30ish languages into the CD.
[16:52] <Muscovy> We'd have enough of a challenge doing that for one.
[16:52] <UndiFineD> we can't
[16:52] <Muscovy> I think we should pakcage the screenshots separately
[16:52] <Muscovy> in ubuntu-tour-images-LANG.
[16:52] <UndiFineD> but, we could offer it for download during install
[16:52] <Muscovy> And make Ubiquity install them.
[16:52] <Muscovy> Exactly.
[16:52] <UndiFineD> which is another reason why i want us to be a replacement for Help and Support
[16:53] <webrsk> While installing we can have option like text only and graphical ... so if user selects graphical then we can download the images..
[16:53] <Omega> Sorry guys, lots of rainfall, I am present now.
[16:53] <UndiFineD> on the installation disc, it first ask you for country and language
[16:54] <UndiFineD> that alone is an indicator
[16:54] <webrsk> ya then its pretty good.... based on the language we can download the images ... not all screenshots ...
[16:54] <Muscovy> Hi Omega.
[16:54] <webrsk> Welcome Omega :) :)
[16:54] <Omega> :)
[16:54] <Omega> Hey guys.
[16:54] <UndiFineD> it was in my project evaluation doc, which now is in /docs
[16:54] <Omega> What are we talking about now?
[16:54] <UndiFineD> welcome Omega
[16:55] <Muscovy> I just pushed a revision, someone made an edit that broke the intro chapter for en CA and GB users.
[16:55] <UndiFineD> webrsk, is right, all the text can fit in one package
[16:55] <Muscovy> Easily.
[16:56] <UndiFineD> shots and potential video is something else
[16:56] <webrsk> Its possible , UndiFineD :)
[16:56] <Muscovy> We're looking at 6ish MB for screenshots per language, I would guess.
[16:56] <nicola88> So if we separate text and images, we can fit all text in the disc and download images separately during installation, right ?
[16:57] <Muscovy> Yep.
[16:57] <UndiFineD> ok, so this is clear
[16:57] <webrsk> Muscovy , if your environment sets to en_US then the tour will run . MichealH has working on transalation of en_GB so en got changed :)
[16:58] <Muscovy> webrsk: Ok, well I'm en_CA, so it couldn't find anything for me.
[16:58] <Muscovy> Maybe we should symlink the base language to the default one?
[16:58] <webrsk> ya intially mine is set to en_IN , so it didnt worked for me too then changed my env to En_US :P then it worked..
[16:58] <UndiFineD> how is en_CA diff from en_US ?
[16:58] <Muscovy> en_CA is basically en_GB.
[16:58] <Muscovy> Canadian English.
[16:58] <webrsk> yes , the default language should run if it didnt find the appropriate language..
[16:59] <webrsk> "en" can always be a default ...
[16:59] <Omega> If it can't find en_CA it shows you en
[16:59] <UndiFineD> so we need a 'en' directory too ?
[16:59] <Muscovy> I figure it should try to run the base language (en instead of en_CA), since the difference between base and derivatives is just some spelling.
[17:00] <MichealH> Muscovy: Just ask and I will try to help :)
[17:00] <MichealH> Uhh
[17:00] <MichealH> Yeah en_CA
[17:00] <MichealH> en_DE ect...
[17:00] <MichealH> Im currently trying fr
[17:00] <UndiFineD> english german ? never heard of that
[17:01] <MichealH> UndiFineD: English, but for Germans
[17:01] <Muscovy> So what's next?
[17:02] <UndiFineD> [topic: Alex: Create links between pages.]
[17:02] <Omega> MichealH: Is that on the cd?
[17:02] <Muscovy> Right.
[17:02] <Muscovy> I tried that about a week or so ago and the links always gave 404s.
[17:02] <Muscovy> I thought we need it since a lot of pages have prerequisets.
[17:03] <Omega> Mhm, it would be a good idea.
[17:03] <Muscovy> I'll see if it works currently.
[17:03] <webrsk> so interlinking between pages ?
[17:03] <Muscovy> Yeah.
[17:03] <UndiFineD> i think that is done by <a href="<relative path>/page"></a>
[17:03] <UndiFineD> keeping language the same
[17:04] <MichealH> Omega: What? The fr?
[17:05] <Muscovy> Ok, it works. :D
[17:05] <UndiFineD> so <a href="../../about-me/nl_NL/0_about-me">about me</a>
[17:05] <webrsk> Ya it will work as UndiFineD mentioned  :)
[17:06] <MichealH> I think the headers need to be stuck to the top of the window
[17:06] <UndiFineD> good, another issue solved
[17:06]  * MichealH fixes?
[17:06] <webrsk> :)
[17:06] <UndiFineD> [topic: MichealH: User interaction.]
[17:07] <UndiFineD> approaching 2 hour mark
[17:07] <UndiFineD> and diner is almost ready
[17:07] <webrsk> :P
[17:07] <MichealH> Okay,
[17:08] <UndiFineD> MichealH, this was about the medals ?
[17:08] <MichealH> As had been mentioned earlier
[17:08] <MichealH> I was thinking about  trophies and medals
[17:08] <MichealH> Bronze = Read
[17:08] <MichealH> Silver = Interacted with
[17:08] <MichealH> Gold= Quiz?
[17:09] <MichealH> UndiFineD was a bit jumpy about the quiz
[17:09] <nicola88> quiz could be made of multiple choices question...
[17:09] <UndiFineD> yes, you can collect your cookie in #ubuntu
[17:09] <MichealH> UndiFineD: huh?
[17:09] <UndiFineD> we liked it
[17:10] <webrsk> Yes MichealH its a good idea :) My 5cents are on the way :P
[17:10] <Omega> MichealH: The en_DE
[17:10] <MichealH> Omega: Dont think so
[17:10] <UndiFineD> ok
[17:10] <Omega> We should probably only include what the cd includes.
[17:10] <UndiFineD> [topic: webrsk: Each category page can have description about the sub topics.]
[17:10] <MichealH> Platinum medal = Completed
[17:11] <UndiFineD> i need to move on, and finish before diner
[17:12] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Okay
[17:12] <webrsk> Ya each category doesn't have description now , it shows the details of the sub topic only..
[17:13] <webrsk> so we should have a page for each category which will explain about the topic and sub topics, so that user will get an idea about what tour they going to travel.. :)
[17:13] <UndiFineD> like a new <description> tag ?
[17:13] <Muscovy> I think so.
[17:13] <UndiFineD> oh, separate page
[17:13] <Omega> A summery page?
[17:13] <MichealH> I can see what I can do
[17:14] <MichealH> I can try and push a release
[17:14] <webrsk> yup summary page :)
[17:14] <UndiFineD> ok, we'll have some trials
[17:14] <webrsk> Quick overview on the category and its sub topics :)
[17:14] <UndiFineD> [topic: webrsk: Alignment of text & image style differs from english content [Ex:In english content <div> ]
[17:14] <MichealH> Like a "In this section you will learn:"
[17:14] <nicola88> in the topic page, you could insert the topic name as title and a list of the subtopic with a description and a representative image for each one
[17:15] <UndiFineD> we will finish english language first, before the 23rd
[17:15] <webrsk> Yes nicola88 , but right now we dont have the seperate page for the topic ...
[17:16] <UndiFineD> then translations should be fixed to use that as example
[17:17] <nicola88> i saw... regarding the current topic, i agree with UndiFineD: we need to finish the english language before considering translations
[17:17] <UndiFineD> is this clear ? no, which english language would be base ?
[17:17] <webrsk> but undiFined also there is a reason of the query is why we didnt used any templating engine something splits the presentation and content seperately !!!
[17:18] <webrsk> because content editors have to do the alignment , applying appropriate styles while writing content...
[17:19] <UndiFineD> so what do you propose here ? have all text without headers and div ?
[17:19] <UndiFineD> the current layout is <h1/2></h1/2><div><screenshot /></div
[17:20] <webrsk> Ya , is there any specific reason having mixed with content and design layout ?
[17:20] <UndiFineD> we can leaveout the div
[17:20] <Muscovy> I was meaning to ask that.
[17:20] <UndiFineD> but the rest seems essential to me
[17:20] <Muscovy> WHy are there <div>s randomly in the text?
[17:21] <webrsk> ya when i checked the contents is mixed with the tags and styles like color , size , aligning to right/left.... i thought it would be difficult to editor who modifies the content mistakenly some tags can be deleted too..
[17:22] <UndiFineD> my diner is on the table, so I have to leave
[17:22] <Omega> Ok.
[17:22] <Muscovy> Alright.
[17:22] <UndiFineD> I am good with however it is done
[17:22] <webrsk> Its a initial start so its fine but as content grows i think it would be difficult i guess !!! :) just a suggestion :)
[17:22] <Omega> Bon appetite
[17:22] <webrsk> sure undiFineD :) enjoy dinner :)
[17:23] <Muscovy> Ok, someone who was here all meeting, could you strike out the topics on the pad that've been covered?
[17:23] <Muscovy> http://openetherpad.org/r14iF5iOQs
[17:23] <webrsk> Muscovy the current discussing one is the last topic :)
[17:25] <nicola88>  in last revisions, i saw a simple  <screenshot> tag instead of <img> with a lot of attributes; it's the same for the <h1/2> instead of <div> with relative attribute
[17:26] <nicola88> it's to say that using CSS we can afford big contents without a lot of problems (i think)
[17:28] <nicola88> but i'm am translator with a little knowledge about HTML/CSS so i don't know which problems may occurr
[17:29] <Muscovy> Do we have a deadline for Maverick writing?
[17:30] <webrsk> Sure nicola88, let me try with some example about how to make the content and design aside ..
[17:30] <Muscovy> Also, what are the plans for talking to the docs team?
[17:31] <Omega> I have more information about thsat.
[17:31] <webrsk> Muscovy , before 23rd october if we can finish the english content then we are ready for oct 25 UDS..
[17:31] <Omega> We need to leave a message on the ubuntu-desktop mailing list.
[17:31] <Muscovy> webrsk: Are any members heading to UDS?
[17:32] <webrsk> Only through remote i guess. UndiFined have registered :)
[17:32] <aprilg1> hi everyone. sorry for being really late.
[17:32] <Muscovy> Hi April. :D
[17:32] <webrsk> Hello April :) :) :)
[17:32] <aprilg1> full on mommy mode today. the kid is sick :(
[17:32] <aprilg1> anyway, will read thru logs!
[17:32] <Muscovy> Awe. Not to bad, I hope?
[17:33] <Omega> Hey april.
[17:33] <aprilg1> Muscovy fever's gone down. thanks for asking :)
[17:33] <aprilg1> hey Omega, webrsk :)
[17:34] <Muscovy> Perhaps we should start a pad for the email, Omega?
[17:34] <Omega> I hope your loved one feels better :)
[17:34] <Omega> That would be a good idea Muscovy
[17:34] <aprilg1> thanks Omega :)
[17:34] <aprilg1> UndiFineD, you've set the deadline for English content to Oct23, yes? :)
[17:34] <Muscovy> I think we can make that.
[17:35] <webrsk> April , yes :) :)
[17:35] <webrsk> Muscovy , can you share the idea about the pad of email ?
[17:35] <Muscovy> I take it there's a more distant date for screenshots?
[17:35] <Omega> http://openetherpad.org/qYsJH7tAyd
[17:35] <Muscovy> webrsk^
[17:36] <aprilg1> webrsk cool. we can definitely make that deadline
[17:36] <Muscovy> Is anyone actually going to UDS-N?
[17:37] <webrsk> Thanks Omega :)
[17:37] <aprilg1> last I checked, there were only a few topics that really needed some work in terms of content. Scanning, running windows programs, and ubuntu one. I've already started reviewing the others
[17:38] <webrsk> Yes and if we ready with appropriate screenshots for the existing contents , then we are through :)
[17:39] <aprilg1> should we wait for the official maverick release for the screenshots?
[17:39] <Muscovy> I'm not sure.
[17:39] <Muscovy> You heard about the new font April?
[17:39] <aprilg1> yep Muscovy I saw your email
[17:39] <Muscovy> I think we should wait a few days just in case Ambiance or the font get any last-minute edits.
[17:40] <aprilg1> I think that's a good idea
[17:40] <aprilg1> maverick will be released on the 10
[17:40] <nicola88> yes we should take the screenshot at the last
[17:40] <aprilg1> *10th
[17:41] <webrsk> Ya we can wait for 10th release , that font would be impressive :)
[17:43] <Omega> Sorry guys, for the same reason I was late, heavy rainfall, I have to leave.
[17:43] <Omega> It's kind of flooding.
[17:43] <webrsk> oh no , do take care Omega ...
[17:43] <Omega> Thank you :>
[17:43] <Omega> And I will.
[17:43] <MichealH> Oh no!
[17:43] <webrsk> :)
[17:43] <MichealH> Uhh
[17:43] <aprilg1> take care Omega
[17:43] <MichealH> Talk about unexpected situations
[17:43] <Omega> :)
[17:44] <MichealH> ;)
[17:44] <UndiFineD> back
[17:44] <MichealH> UndiFineD: and Omega has gone...
[17:45] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Okay what's next?
[17:45] <webrsk> Welcome back UndiFineD :)
[17:46] <webrsk> have we discussed this topic : [topic: MixCool: Create a team that's specialized on screenshots] ?
[17:46] <UndiFineD> oh yes, that one we skipped a bit
[17:46] <UndiFineD> hmm, well we can create such a team
[17:47] <UndiFineD> but we are really depended upon translators there
[17:48] <UndiFineD> I think it is really hard to do thai shots when you can't read thai
[17:49] <UndiFineD> unless you automate doing this somehow
[17:49] <aprilg1> do we have one translator working on a language, or are there several?
[17:49] <aprilg1> if there's only one translator for a language, we can just ask him/her to do the screenshots for that specific language
[17:49] <UndiFineD> Dykam, is dutch like me
[17:49] <Dykam> How do you know O_o
[17:50] <MichealH> I am english only :(
[17:50] <UndiFineD> it's in your whois Dykam
[17:50] <Dykam> hum hum
[17:50] <Dykam> ofcourse
[17:50] <aprilg1> I really think it would be nice to have a team working on the screenshots. at least we don't overlap
[17:50] <Dykam> I though: He couldn't have whois'd me, I've a special vhost
[17:50] <Dykam> *thought
[17:50] <Dykam> but yeah, that exact vhost is my site :]
[17:50] <UndiFineD> which ends in .nl
[17:50] <Dykam> :P
[17:51] <nicola88> i'm the italian translator and i can take all necessary screenshot for my language (and for others)
[17:52] <Dykam> note Omega can do dutch translations too failry well
[17:52] <Dykam> *fairly
[17:53] <UndiFineD> funny typo
[17:53] <webrsk> :)
[17:54] <Dykam> :]
[17:54] <UndiFineD> yes aprilg , I set the deadline for oct 23rd, that should give a day for packaging
[17:55] <UndiFineD> so UDS-N attenders can point to .deb ofr trial
[17:55] <UndiFineD> for
[17:55] <aprilg> UndiFineD excellent :) I'm slowly going over the content for editing/review
[17:56] <aprilg> by the way, I pushed an update to OpenOffice a few days ago.
[17:56] <aprilg> altho that may need to change again
[17:56] <aprilg> the name has changed to LibreOffice, I think
[17:56] <aprilg> altho I'm not sure if that's official
[17:56] <aprilg> :(
[17:56] <UndiFineD> leave the TODO and other improvements that do not matter for demo, if you have the time that is ok
[17:57] <aprilg> I'll also try add more content to these topics: Music
[17:57] <aprilg> Scanning
[17:57] <aprilg> Running Windows programs
[17:57] <aprilg> Ubuntu One
[17:58] <UndiFineD> well, I think that is my fault a bit too, I put it on my website thatsince oracle doings with java to google, OOo might be in danger too
[17:58] <UndiFineD> and suggested to replace java with python code
[18:00] <aprilg> also, can anyone tell me how deep we should go with the 'running windows programs' topic? should we just give an overview, or present an example on how to run a simple program?
[18:01] <UndiFineD> wine is secundairy for most linux users, but especially for converters this is a requirement
[18:01] <UndiFineD> I use wine for taxes
[18:01] <nicola88> i think running windows application in linux could be considered an advanced topic
[18:02] <nicola88> so you can give only an overview of the topic
[18:02] <UndiFineD> it is an advanced topic, but one critical one too for new users
[18:03] <UndiFineD> people who only converted because they learned of wine
[18:03] <UndiFineD> and the winehq page said their app works
[18:03] <nicola88> i didn't think in that way... you are right
[18:04] <nicola88> but the required skills depend on the application compatibility
[18:04] <UndiFineD> I try to think with this app in terms as how my children would see it
[18:04] <Muscovy> I'd probably do a simple Wine overview.
[18:05] <nicola88> we could give an example how to use wine with a real and diffuse application
[18:05] <aprilg> I've never used Wine
[18:05] <webrsk> Ya quick overview on Wine , would be great :)
[18:06] <webrsk> it would be helpful for specific category of users ..
[18:06] <aprilg> ok, we'll provide an overview and probably link to a more indepth source of information, maybe the manual or the official system docs?
[18:06] <Muscovy> I feel if we have to start explaining how to install Windows programs (as in WIndows installers) , that person hasn't used them and probably won't.
[18:06] <nicola88> in the tour we could insist on the possibiity of using free and opensource application as alternative of Windows ones
[18:07] <Muscovy> Yeah.
[18:07] <Muscovy> That's also a given for functionality, native _always_ works better than WIne'd.
[18:07] <nicola88> instead of explaining how to use Windows app in Ubuntu
[18:07] <UndiFineD> Help and Support does not even mention wine
[18:08] <UndiFineD> not even under advanced
[18:08] <Muscovy> Wine is a useful thing for transitionals though.
[18:08] <UndiFineD> but, new users may come to linux because of wine
[18:09] <UndiFineD> and especially for applications like tax filing it may be essential
[18:09] <Muscovy> Yeah, much as there's alternatives, some people won't want to relearn/migrate.
[18:09] <nicola88> in that case we should explain when use Wine (and how) and when use native Ubuntu app that are better/equivalent to windows app
[18:12] <Omega> We should tell them how to find native apps.
[18:12] <UndiFineD> oh and ... about-ubuntu chapter 9 contains chapter 12
[18:12] <UndiFineD> can we merge that
[18:12] <nicola88> The problem from the user point of view is the fear of leaving a known environment for learning a new app
[18:13] <webrsk> may be we can have a option to search an alternative application for the windows based which available in linux...[results from osalt.com] :)
[18:13] <UndiFineD> fear is of the dark side
[18:13] <Muscovy> As far as I know, most "normal" (browser, office, etc) applications that aren't the WIdnows defaults are FOSS and Linux.
[18:14] <Muscovy> I don't think I know anybody who doesn't use a Linux-compatible browser or IE.
[18:14] <nicola88> i have dinner so i'll come back as soon as possible, Bye ;-)
[18:14] <UndiFineD> enjoy nicola88
[18:14] <Muscovy> Am I making sense?
[18:14] <webrsk> Hello brandonj :) :)
[18:14] <aprilg> hey brandonj
[18:14] <UndiFineD> I think 98% uses iether IE or firefox
[18:15] <UndiFineD> calling all gecko firefox here
[18:15] <Omega> Oh and for Natty, we'll have to change OO.org to LibreOffice
[18:15] <aprilg> UndiFineD what did you mean by about-ubuntu chapter 9 and 12 ? :)
[18:15] <Muscovy> To summarize: most applications that don't get prestige from preinstallation are FOSS.
[18:15] <UndiFineD> chapter 12 is in chapeter 9
[18:17] <UndiFineD> I think we can leave out chapter 12, or rename it chapter 10
[18:17] <aprilg> UndiFineD changing it now :)
[18:17] <aprilg> thanks for pointing that out
[18:17] <UndiFineD> I noticed more than a week ago
[18:18] <Omega> I agree witj nicola88 though, we should stick to F/OSS apps as much as we can.
[18:19] <UndiFineD> well a secondary task of this app is to reduce newbie questions
[18:19] <Muscovy> It would be cool if we could have a "see alternatives" link that would launch a certain category of the software center, say, the browser section.
[18:19] <UndiFineD> explaining wine can reduce that a bit
[18:21] <webrsk> Yes , Muscovy that would give more idea to users about the alternative open source apps :)
[18:25] <aprilg> on the about-ubuntu section, im thinking we should merge 6-notification area and 7-top panel indicators. what do you guys think?
[18:26] <Muscovy> Perhaps.
[18:27] <Muscovy> They are fairly similar in nature.
[18:28] <aprilg> ok. updating
[18:28] <MichealH> I wish bzr would work
[18:28] <MichealH> :L
[18:29] <MichealH> I was gonna update something
[18:29] <Muscovy> MichealH: WHat seems to be the problem?
[18:29] <MichealH> Itis fixed
[18:30] <MichealH> I purged and installed
[18:30] <MichealH> Commited and pushed
[18:30] <MichealH> New Summary page
[18:31] <MichealH> Everyone pull :P
[18:32] <MichealH> What do you guys think?
[18:32] <UndiFineD> revision 257.
[18:32] <MichealH> Its my revision :)
[18:35] <MichealH> UndiFineD: What do you think?
[18:36] <UndiFineD> seems good to me
[18:37] <Muscovy> Same here. :D
[18:37] <webrsk> Cool :)
[18:37] <MichealH> :D
[18:37] <MichealH> I will be updating it as time goes on
[18:41] <MichealH> Small Update
[18:41] <MichealH> Commited
[18:41] <MichealH> Pushed
[18:43] <MichealH> Time to check?
[18:43] <UndiFineD> done
[18:43] <UndiFineD> it's going really well again
[18:43] <MichealH> Yeah
[18:43] <MichealH> We just needed a few Ideas
[18:44] <webrsk> Nice :)
[18:47] <UndiFineD> oh yeah ... mmm in the help and Support they have a 'About Ubuntu' and a 'New to Ubuntu' topic
[18:47] <UndiFineD> these differ in that the fist describes the desktop and the other about the ubuntu mindset
[18:48] <UndiFineD> or was it the other way around
[18:48] <UndiFineD> the text at in 0.0 and 0.10 in the TODO directories
[18:49] <MichealH> Pulling
[18:49] <MichealH> Adding
[18:49] <MichealH> Commiting
[18:50] <MichealH> Pushed
[18:50] <MichealH> Rev.260
[18:50] <UndiFineD> 180 rev in 2 weeks
[18:51] <MichealH> Thats a good thing
[18:57] <aprilg> hmm
[18:57] <aprilg> I don't seem to see the sections on email and empathy :(
[18:58] <aprilg> does anyone know what can be wrong with this ?
[18:58] <MichealH> aprilg: Whats your language?
[18:58] <aprilg> en
[18:58] <aprilg> en_PH but it normally goes to en
[18:58] <MichealH> Hmm..
[18:58] <MichealH> Oh
[18:58] <MichealH> I think I know whats wrong
[18:59] <aprilg> all the en_US things aren't displayed
[18:59] <MichealH> Try and get the latest revision (261)
[19:00] <aprilg> I'm using the latest revision
[19:00] <UndiFineD> ok, the meetinglog: it is in the bot ? or do I need to transfer it to someone
[19:00] <MichealH> aprilg: Does it work
[19:00] <MichealH> UndiFineD: I will get a link
[19:00] <aprilg> I tried changing the en_US folder under desktop config to just en. it's now included in the tour
[19:03] <MichealH> UndiFineD: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/10/03/%23ubuntu-tour.html
[19:03] <MichealH> aprilg: Thats in the new revision? :P
[19:03] <Muscovy> New revision?
[19:03] <Muscovy> That looks like a log to me. :P
[19:04] <aprilg> MichealH yes. the latest one -- 261
[19:04] <MichealH> Muscovy: No, I mean on Launchpad
[19:04] <UndiFineD> yup nice
[19:05] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Next time I suggest we use the bot in #ubuntu-meeting
[19:05] <aprilg> are we using en_US or just plain en?
[19:05] <MichealH> UndiFineD: I am experienced with that
[19:05] <aprilg> those that are in a en_US folder are not displayed on the tour I'm running right now :(
[19:05] <aprilg> I default to en by the way
[19:05] <aprilg> :(
[19:06] <MichealH> aprilg: Make a en_PH and make a en_US
[19:06] <MichealH> makes it easier
[19:06] <aprilg> err, wouldn't that be redundant? It's all the same content
[19:06] <MichealH> Uhh
[19:06] <MichealH> Sorry
[19:06] <MichealH> Making an addidtion
[19:07] <MichealH> Therwe
[19:08] <MichealH> Do we need to sunday 3-5pm UTC?
[19:08] <MichealH> *the
[19:08] <Muscovy> Perhaps not.
[19:08] <MichealH> Fixed
[19:08] <aprilg> Muscovy I have a problem with the en_US or just plain en folders
[19:09] <MichealH> aprilg: I can fix
[19:09] <Muscovy> aprilg: What's the problem?
[19:09] <aprilg> thanks MichealH
[19:09] <MichealH> I think I have fixed
[19:09] <MichealH> Oh
[19:09] <MichealH> How many Chapters do you have aprilg
[19:09] <aprilg> Muscovy I default to en, so all those sections that are stored in en_US aren't displayed
[19:10] <Muscovy> Maybe symlink en to en_US.
[19:10] <aprilg> MichealH I have 12
[19:12] <MichealH> aprilg: You should have 22
[19:12] <MichealH> Fixed
[19:12] <MichealH> Oop
[19:12] <MichealH> Its uploading
[19:12] <MichealH> I mean commiting
[19:12] <MichealH> Done
[19:12] <MichealH> Get the latest
[19:12] <UndiFineD> a commit is not pushed
[19:13] <MichealH> I know
[19:13] <MichealH> I mean push
[19:13] <UndiFineD> :)
[19:13] <MichealH> aprilg: It works?
[19:14] <aprilg> pulling na0
[19:14] <MichealH> Im pushing again
[19:15] <MichealH> I forgot a folder
[19:15] <MichealH> Pshed
[19:15] <MichealH> *Pushed
[19:16] <MichealH> aprilg: Does it work?
[19:17] <aprilg> MichealH yes. thanks a lot! :D
[19:18] <MichealH> :D
[19:18] <Muscovy> I've just pushed some more <h1/2> correntions on a number of pages.
[19:19]  * MichealH pulls
[19:20] <MichealH> Imma do a bit more improvements than bugfixes ;)
[19:22] <UndiFineD> ehm, isn't the first page a h1 and the second, third  a h2 ?
[19:22] <MichealH> UndiFineD: No
[19:23] <MichealH> If it is a new topic but related to the tour its a <h1>
[19:23] <Muscovy> Um.
[19:23] <MichealH> Isnt it?
[19:23] <Muscovy> I though h1s were first pages of a chapter.
[19:23] <Muscovy> And h2s other pages.
[19:23] <MichealH> Uhh...
[19:23] <UndiFineD> Muscovy, and ai have the same idea
[19:23] <MichealH> IT WASNT ME!
[19:23] <UndiFineD> :p
[19:24]  * MichealH hides
[19:24]  * MichealH runs
[19:24] <UndiFineD> cosmetics MichealH
[19:24] <UndiFineD> read it like a book
[19:24] <MichealH> Okay
[19:24] <MichealH> Can I fix?
[19:25] <Muscovy> Yeah.
[19:25] <Muscovy> Most of the "problem" pages either had manually inserted CSS or no header CSS at all.
[19:26] <UndiFineD> conflict :/
[19:28] <aprilg> hrrr the recent changes I made were lost :(
[19:28] <aprilg> waaaa
[19:28] <MichealH> Im pushing now
[19:28] <MichealH> I pushed without a problem
[19:28] <MichealH> haha
[19:28] <MichealH> I rule you ALL
[19:29] <MichealH> ;)
[19:29] <aprilg> did anyone overwrite the files on the en_US version of about-ubuntu? there were a few sections that I merged
[19:29] <aprilg> now they're gone
[19:30] <MichealH> Hrmm
[19:30] <MichealH> Let me look
[19:30] <MichealH> Theyre en
[19:31] <MichealH> aprilg: Tried restarting?
[19:32] <aprilg> I don't think I can solve this with restarting :) hehe
[19:32] <UndiFineD> commited
[19:32] <aprilg> the files I pushed were overwritten
[19:32] <aprilg> so.. meh
[19:32] <aprilg> redoing them
[19:33] <Muscovy> What a development process should and should not look like: http://i.imgur.com/bqZzj.png
[19:33] <Muscovy> XD
[19:34] <MichealH> lol
[19:35] <MichealH> We all are on track and you dont understand us XD
[19:35] <MichealH> Thats what it looks like
[19:36] <MichealH> RIGHT!
[19:36] <MichealH> WHO DID THAT?
[19:36] <UndiFineD> lol
[19:36] <MichealH> I had a lovley peice of work on the "Rubbish Bin"
[19:37] <MichealH> AND SOMEONE RENAMED IT TO "TRASH"
[19:37] <MichealH> GRR
[19:38] <MichealH> Muscovy: You know the pic on the bottom right?
[19:38] <MichealH> s/right/left
[19:38] <Muscovy> Yes.
[19:38] <MichealH> What does it represent?
[19:38] <UndiFineD> funny how someone has a better overview on the devel than me
[19:38] <MichealH> Number of pushes?
[19:38] <Muscovy> The trash, you mean?
[19:38] <Muscovy> Wait.
[19:38] <Muscovy> Um.
[19:39] <UndiFineD> rev 268
[19:39] <MichealH> Muscovy: Why... Wait untill I see you!
[19:39]  * MichealH chases Muscovy 
[19:39] <Muscovy> Hey, I'm going in a loop there!
[19:40] <Muscovy> Boy, it really felt like that diagram the morning the OMG post came out. :P
[19:41] <MichealH> Muscovy: Did you Do the vicious thing of remaming "Rubbish Bin" to trash?
[19:42] <Muscovy> MichealH: Nope.
[19:42] <MichealH> Good
[19:42] <MichealH> Who did it
[19:42]  * MichealH looks at everyone viciously
[19:42] <Muscovy> I feel "rubbish bin" is too long, and "recycling bin" is misleading.
[19:44] <Muscovy> Which file is it in, MichealH? I can't see that edit in the branch browser.
[19:45] <MichealH> ubuntu-tour/about-ubuntu/en_GB/14_trash
[19:46] <UndiFineD> I read the ubuntu-uk mailing list
[19:55] <MichealH> Hu jenkins
[19:55] <MichealH> *Hi
[19:55] <jenkins> hello
[19:56] <MichealH> :L
[19:56] <UndiFineD> hi
[19:57] <UndiFineD> rev 269
[19:58] <UndiFineD> administartors ...
[19:59] <UndiFineD> lets correct that
[20:03] <UndiFineD> aprilg, how is your little one ?
[20:05] <Muscovy> Well, this project has been around for a month and a half. :D
[20:06] <aprilg> UndiFineD she's getting better. Thanks for asking
[20:06] <aprilg> :)
[20:06] <UndiFineD> my family has been sick too last week
[20:06] <UndiFineD> just my gf atm
[20:07] <aprilg> I hope she's getting better
[20:07] <UndiFineD> she is, slowly
[20:07] <Muscovy> A lot of my friends have been sick after school started. :|
[20:07] <UndiFineD> that what you get for going to school
[20:08] <Muscovy> Yeah well grade 12 is hard to avoid. :P
[20:09] <UndiFineD> some try
[20:09] <UndiFineD> and all have failed
[20:12] <MichealH> UndiFineD: What will the Disclaimer be for Tour?
[20:12] <Muscovy> Disclaimer?
[20:12] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Is the license under GPL? 2? 3?
[20:12] <Muscovy> 3 I think.
[20:13] <UndiFineD> licence, undecided
[20:14] <UndiFineD> disclamier, make it something like what is already there
[20:14] <UndiFineD> I like GPL
[20:14] <MichealH> GPL 3?
[20:14] <Muscovy> We had his discussion a long time ago and I _think_ we settled on GPL 3.
[20:15] <Muscovy> this*
[20:15] <UndiFineD> some may approve MIT, others OSOR EU
[20:15] <UndiFineD> if it is GPL v3 I am ok with that
[20:19] <MichealH> I put the GPL 3 in
[20:22] <UndiFineD> 273
[20:27] <aprilg> I did a merge. lemme know if I killed anything :D
[20:28] <Muscovy> Thanks April.
[20:28]  * UndiFineD drops dead on the spot
[20:29] <UndiFineD> nah it is alright i think
[20:31] <UndiFineD> 277
[20:35] <MichealH> Pusing
[20:35] <MichealH> *Pushing
[20:35] <MichealH> Commited 279
[20:35] <MichealH> Pushed
[20:37] <UndiFineD> great we have a lic
[20:37] <MichealH> :)
[20:37] <MichealH> I sat there and added those h1/2 tags
[20:37] <MichealH> 10 MINS!
[20:37] <MichealH> We should have a contributor page
[20:38] <aprilg> are we up to 280 now?
[20:38] <aprilg> is anyoen else pushing?
[20:39] <aprilg> doing a push
[20:40] <UndiFineD> bzr: ERROR: Could not acquire lock "(remote lock)":
[20:40] <UndiFineD> and that's why we need kernel 2.6.36
[20:44] <UndiFineD> :)
[20:44] <UndiFineD> 282
[20:45] <MichealH> :O
[20:45] <UndiFineD> we had 80, 3 weeks ago
[20:45] <aprilg> wine isn't available in a default install, right?
[20:45] <UndiFineD> it is
[20:46] <UndiFineD> so celebrate aprilg
[20:46] <aprilg> lol
[20:46] <MichealH> UndiFineD: We need a list of contributors
[20:47] <UndiFineD> when ?
[20:47] <MichealH> Uhh for the next push :P
[20:47] <MichealH> I want to list the big contributors on the contrubutors page
[20:47] <UndiFineD> well, you could get them out of the commit log
[20:48] <MichealH> How do I find that?
[20:48] <UndiFineD> do you have bazaar explorer installed ?
[20:48] <MichealH> Nope
[20:48] <aprilg> MichealH try this page: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-tour/+topcontributors
[20:48] <aprilg> it lists the top contributors to the project
[20:49] <MichealH> Hrmm... Im not on it
[20:50] <aprilg> it takes a while to update MichealH
[20:50]  * MichealH installs the explorer
[20:50] <UndiFineD> mmm karma is good
[20:50] <MichealH> Oh ya!
[20:51] <aprilg> UndiFineD I can't seem to find wine anywhere; reading up on it now, I don't think it comes with a fresh ubuntu install
[20:52] <UndiFineD> starting my vm
[20:53] <UndiFineD> grmbl
[20:53] <UndiFineD> wont start
[20:53] <MichealH> hah
[20:57] <UndiFineD> but, that does not really matter
[20:58] <UndiFineD> wine is a important app for new ubuntu users
[20:59] <MichealH> UndiFineD: I just had an Idea!
[21:00] <MichealH> :)
[21:00] <UndiFineD> i will get a cookie
[21:00] <aprilg> ya. I just thought it would've been easier if we could just point to where wine is instead of telling them they had to install it
[21:00] <MichealH> LETS DO APTURL!
[21:00] <MichealH> It installs everything automaticly
[21:00] <MichealH> Well...
[21:01] <MichealH> The program you want
[21:02] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Whats your name?
[21:02] <UndiFineD> oh then if you really want to do advanced you could make a mailserver tour
[21:02] <MichealH> So i can put you on contrib list
[21:02] <UndiFineD> Keimpe de Jong
[21:03] <UndiFineD> k.dejong on lp
[21:06] <aprilg> guys, gotta go
[21:06] <aprilg> I'll try check back again in a few hours
[21:06] <aprilg> take care all!
[21:08] <MichealH> Whats MadnessRed's name?
[21:09] <MichealH> UndiFineD: ^^
[21:09] <UndiFineD> don't know, maybe it is on lp
[21:10] <MichealH> Nope
[21:10] <MichealH> Oh well
[21:10] <MichealH> When we find out add it to the contributors page
[21:10] <UndiFineD> his name is anthony
[21:12] <MichealH> Last name?
[21:12] <UndiFineD> could not find it
[21:13] <UndiFineD> but he will be around soonisch
[21:13] <MichealH> New push coming
[21:13] <MichealH> Commited
[21:13] <MichealH> Pushed
[21:13] <MichealH> Enjoy you name up in lights!
[21:14] <MichealH> Any errors? Correct them
[21:14] <Muscovy> Anthony Steward.
[21:14] <Muscovy> I'll be back in a bit.
[21:15] <MichealH> Pushing again
[21:17] <MichealH> Nother Push
[21:17] <UndiFineD> oh dear
[21:18] <MichealH> What?
[21:18] <UndiFineD> merges
[21:18] <MichealH> D:
[21:20] <MichealH> D:
[21:21] <MichealH> Mscovy left :(
[21:21] <MichealH> *Muscovy
[21:26] <UndiFineD> aprilg, you changed accessibility ?
[21:27] <aprilg> UndiFineD just a few minor things
[21:27] <UndiFineD> I have text through the 2nd screenshot
[21:27] <UndiFineD> very weird
[21:28] <aprilg> I just pulled, I don't see any screen shots
[21:29] <UndiFineD> hmmm diffs between en en en_gb
[21:30] <MichealH> Hrmm
[21:30] <MichealH> Could have been me
[21:30] <MichealH> GRR cp!
[21:31] <UndiFineD> oh yesterday i had a wonderful mv command MichealH
[21:31] <UndiFineD> mv *.jaybob *
[21:31] <UndiFineD> removed all movies
[21:31] <MichealH> hah
[21:32] <UndiFineD> 600 gb lost
[21:33] <UndiFineD> so now i have room for all dr who eps
[21:35] <MichealH> :O
[21:35] <MichealH> 600GB?
[21:36] <UndiFineD> irony is, yesterday i bought myself another 1TB disk
[21:36] <UndiFineD> and this happened after that
[21:36] <MichealH> heh
[21:37] <MichealH> UndiFineD: Wait a sec... You mv'd?
[21:37] <MichealH> You lost them?
[21:37] <UndiFineD> yes
[21:37] <UndiFineD> I just wanted to remove the directory name extention
[21:41] <UndiFineD> oh i am sorry aprilg
[21:41] <UndiFineD> I am getting tired
[21:41] <UndiFineD> nearly 11 pm here
[21:42] <MichealH> Its near 10pm here
[21:42] <UndiFineD> I am seeing text in changing the background
[21:42] <UndiFineD> through that image
[21:43] <MichealH> huh?
[21:43] <MichealH> Made no sence
[21:43]  * MichealH suggests UndiFineD gets some shut-eye
[21:43] <UndiFineD> I will
[21:43] <UndiFineD> but it is there
[21:44] <UndiFineD> second page of the desktop config
[21:44] <MichealH> I will look
[21:44] <MichealH> Hmm...
[21:44] <MichealH> Let me see
[21:50] <MichealH> Fixed
[21:53] <MichealH> pushed
[21:55] <UndiFineD> :)
[21:55] <UndiFineD> well I call it a night
[21:55] <UndiFineD> thanks MichealH
[21:56] <UndiFineD> and everyone else for being here
[21:56] <MichealH> :)
[21:56] <MichealH> No probs
[23:00] <Muscovy> Hello all.