[00:14] <persia> I'd probably ask once a day or so, trying for staggered random time (something like every 29 hours or similar)
[00:14] <persia> But no point asking on weekends.
[00:15] <TheMuso> Natty is open.
[00:18] <persia> Oh, indeed.  Nice.
[00:22] <ScottL> persia, TheMuso, i hope to make changes to the seeds tomorrow during the day, unless you have an objection
[00:23] <ScottL> i probably will not push them for a couple of days until i review my changes a few times
[00:23] <TheMuso> ScottL: You have a few months to make your changes, so go right ahead.
[00:24] <ScottL> TheMuso, well, my goal would be to have them completed (more or less) before the first alpha image
[00:24] <TheMuso> Right.
[00:26] <ScottL> just for my edification, even if i do not run ./update will the ISOs build if i push the changes to the seeds ?
[00:26] <TheMuso> Yes, but depending on what changes you make, the builds may not update until you have updated the metapackage.
[00:27] <ScottL> hmmm, i'm still working my mind around all of this so i'll have to think through that a little before i understand it
[00:30] <TheMuso> Ok.
[00:30] <TheMuso> What changes are you wanting to make?
[00:36]  * ScottL was making dinner for the kids
[00:36] <ScottL> TheMuso, i hope to add the new seeds, make the metapackages, make a transition package for ubuntustudio-audio
[00:38] <TheMuso> Oh right./
[00:39] <ScottL> i'm hoping to write down my methodology and have you and persia look over it, to make sure i'm not going to do something stupid
[00:39] <ScottL> the goal was to start writing it down tonight and complete it tomorrow during the day
[00:40] <TheMuso> Right.
[00:41] <ScottL> i'll spend the better time of tomorrow evening working locally to change and create the seeds files
[00:46] <TheMuso> If you are unsure about the bzr changes you are making, feel free to create another branch, and request a merge proposal.
[00:48] <ScottL> last time you and i worked on the seeds, that is what we did i believe
[00:50] <persia> And if it doesn't block you terribly long, I'd recommend sharing an update to the etherpad with the plan prior to fussing about the seed contents.
[00:50] <persia> Trying to discuss seed structure and seed contents at the same time can be confusing.
[00:51] <TheMuso> Yep.
[00:51] <ScottL> persia, i will work whatever plan is best and most comforting as required :)
[00:52]  * persia has no requirements, only suggestions :)
[00:57] <ScottL> persia, i mentioned earlier that tonight and during the day i was planning on writing down the steps i plan to take (with headings) and having you and luke look over them
[00:59] <persia> OK :)
[01:00] <ScottL> part of that is to make sure i'm not doing something stupid, but also to help me frame the process
[01:00] <ScottL> if i can write it down in an organized form it well help me place it all together cohesively in my mind
[01:01] <ScottL> plus any correction i get from either of you should help as well ;)
[07:49] <amanthethy> Hey, where can I grab an iso of 10.10? The Ubuntu Studio website only shows 10.04
[07:50] <persia> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/releases/maverick/release/
[07:51] <persia> We're having a transition in the website team, and the timing unfortunately hit us badly.
[07:52] <amanthethy> sweeet. Is there any susbstantial changes from 10.04?
[07:52] <amanthethy> are*
[09:57] <poine> hello world - what is the lowlatency or realtime kernel to use ? it seems that 2.6.35-20-lowlatency is in the repo but the headers are 2.6.35-22 which prevents me from being able to use the nvidia driver
[09:59] <persia> poine, I'm of the opinion that most folk don't need either.
[10:00] <poine> i just want to do some audio recording with low latency. What do you suggest ?  I was using -rt kernel on lucid
[10:02] <persia> I use the regular kernel.  Works for me.
[10:02] <persia> You only need the -lowlatency or -realtime ones if you're really pushing your hardware.
[10:02] <persia> You might need it, depends on what you're recording, how, and what hardware you have.
[10:03] <poine> i just want to use superlooper on my macbookpro with the internal soundcard
[10:04] <persia> You probably don't need it then.
[10:05] <persia> If you start getting odd clicks and pops, or interruptions, etc. then maybe you might, but not likely for 2-channel all-on-board.
[10:05] <poine> i get xruns with 6ms latency
[10:05] <persia> (but #ubuntustudio is probably a better channel for this sort of discussion: not very development related)
[10:05] <persia> Do you need 6ms?
[10:05] <poine> (sorry, switching to that channel, my first time here, I had no idea )
[10:06] <persia> No worries, or I'd have been firmer :)
[14:09] <diwic> ScottL, ping
[14:11] <persia> scott-work, ^^
[14:26] <scott-work> diwic: hello, yes?
[14:27] <diwic> scott-work, aha, I just sent an email to you instead :-)
[14:28] <diwic> scott-work, I was curious about your thoughts about my blueprint
[14:28] <scott-work> diwic: i am actually about to leave work to go home, in about 30 minutes i will be on IRC again as ScottL
[14:29] <diwic> scott-work, ok :-) No problem, I'll be around for another hour or so.
[14:29]  * scott-work is will be hosting an Open Week class pretty soon https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek
[14:29] <scott-work> but if nothing else i will respond to your email :)
[14:29] <scott-work> bye
[15:22] <ScottL> #ubuntu-classroom-chat
[15:22] <ScottL> #ubuntu-classroom-backstage
[15:32] <falktx> hi ScottL
[15:32] <ScottL> hi falktx 
[15:32] <falktx> has anything being decided about Natty PPAs?
[15:33] <ScottL> i guess you mean if we have one and what would be included in it?
[15:33] <ScottL> to be honest, not yet
[15:34] <ScottL> i'm hoping to update the seeds this weekend first, and it's taking up most of my focus currently
[15:34] <falktx> when is alpha1 coming out?
[15:34] <ScottL> !schedule
[15:34] <ScottL> eh, hold on
[15:34] <persia> diwic, Are you still about?  What did you want to ask ScottL about?
[15:35] <ScottL> falktx, alpha is dec 2nd  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyReleaseSchedule
[15:35] <falktx> ScottL: so we still have time
[15:35] <falktx> hehe
[15:35] <ScottL> persia, we spoke briefly before i left work, he emailed me and i told him i'd email him back
[15:35] <persia> Ah, OK.
[15:36] <persia> I thought it might have been something about JACK/FFADO, and didn't want it lost :)
[15:36] <ScottL> falktx, keep in mind, the ppa cannot be used in any way to build an official ubuntu studio ISO
[15:36] <ScottL> so we can always add the ppa at any point
[15:36] <falktx> ScottL: what about a welcome screen?
[15:36] <diwic> persia, it does, although I'll let ScottL prepare for his talk now :-)
[15:37] <falktx> ScottL: also I now have a non-free repo for apps like renoise, pianoteq, and vst plugins
[15:37] <ScottL> persia, i have looked at the blueprint previously, although briefly, and wanted to look again with more depth, i probably will need either your assistance or luke's later though
[15:38] <persia> ok
[15:38] <persia> I'm in favour, for what it's worth, although there's lots of detail to be added.
[15:39] <ScottL> i need to reread it again because i really cannot remember the thrust of it currently, i'm getting sick, updating the seeds in running rampant through my head, and now i've got an open week class in 22 minutes :?
[15:39] <ScottL> er.. :/
[15:40] <ScottL> i'm really not expecting too many people in the class (which is okay, because my preparations are terrible)
[15:41] <persia> Don't worry: if you don't have enough content, folks will ask questions.
[16:46] <falktx> AutoStatic agrees on an official UbuntuStudio PPA - http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=9977038&postcount=435
[16:47] <persia> Why?  Why not just upload to the regular repositories?
[16:47] <falktx> if it's official, more ppl will use it
[16:47] <persia> If it's the regular repository, even more people will use it.
[16:48] <falktx> some ppl dont like my PPA cause it's not official (maybe they dont trust me...)
[16:48] <falktx> but, perhaps if it's maintained by a team...
[16:48] <persia> Sure, but I don't see what that means there should be a studio PPA, when there's an entire archive.
[16:48] <falktx> yep
[16:49] <persia> So it makes sense to you not to have an official PPA, and instead just update the archive?
[16:50] <falktx> it makes sense to me using PPAs
[16:50] <persia> Why PPA vs. the archive?
[16:50] <falktx> i mean, 'official' is a strong worg
[16:51] <persia> Sure, but the archives are already official, and mirrored in almost every country.
[16:51] <paultag> persia, mind if I PM you for a quick second?
[16:51] <persia> paultag, No.
[16:51] <paultag> cheers
[16:51] <falktx> i know ubuntu wont change its policy for updating the archive after it has been frozen
[16:51] <persia> falktx, Sure, but we can update everything for the next release.
[16:52] <persia> How much of what you want to update in maverick now was ready a month ago?
[16:52] <persia> Also, we can do backports for anything we like, as long as we can get 2 testers.
[16:52] <persia> So we *can* update the archive (for users who enable backports)
[16:53] <falktx> i dont want to wait 6 months for an update...
[16:53] <falktx> oh, that is different
[16:53] <falktx> didnt knew that
[16:54] <persia> !backports
[16:54] <persia> The only requirement is that we get them into the future release before we backport them.
[16:54] <persia> But that's not usually that hard.
[16:55] <falktx> persia: basically if, for example, we wanted to port dssi-1.1.0 to maverick and 2 guys say it's working, then it will be backported?
[16:55] <falktx> (my internet is going slow...)
[16:55] <falktx> hm... i should get into the debian multimedia asap
[16:55] <persia> We'd have to get it uploaded in natty first, and then it would have to compile on maverick, but yeah.
[16:56] <persia> Oh yeah.  That's the best: push to debian-multimedia, sync to release+1, backport.
[16:57] <falktx> anyway, a ppa would help to get updates faster
[16:57] <falktx> so like this: ppa -> debian-multimedia -> natty -> (backports)
[16:57] <persia> Why?
[16:57] <persia> ppa -> debian-multimedia requires changing the source (debian/control)
[16:58] <persia> Easier just debian-multimedia -> natty -> backports
[16:59] <persia> But nothing wrong with ppa -> d-m -> natty -> backports if you find it easier.
[16:59] <persia> Err, changing debian/changelog (sorry)
[17:02] <falktx_> damn just went offline..
[17:03] <falktx_> who's here is a motu or debian packager?
[17:04] <falktx_> i know quadispro is from debian multimedia
[17:07] <persia> quadrispro is also able to upload to Ubuntu, as am I, and a couple other folks.
[17:07] <persia> For that matter, if you upload to Ubuntu regularly for all of natty, and demonstrate good practices and bugfixes, I'm sure you could get upload permission, at least to Studio packages.
[17:07] <falktx_> that's very cool
[17:08] <falktx_> i started packaging for Revu some time ago, but the process is very slow
[17:08] <persia> Yeah, you came at our worst time, I think.
[17:08] <falktx_> hehe
[17:08] <persia> We were between leaders and running out of developers.
[17:09] <persia> Things are much better now: it's still not really fast, but it's better.
[17:09] <falktx_> but I guess debian would be better than REVU, right?
[17:09] <persia> And if you are up for getting involved in debian-multimedia, it's that much faster, because you can get reviews there, and then get stuff sync'd.
[17:09] <falktx_> ok
[17:09] <falktx_> is there a debian-multimedia IRC?
[17:09]  * falktx_ searchs...
[17:09] <persia> For two reasons: the social reason is that more folk use Debian and distributions based on Debian than use Ubuntu and distributions based on Ubuntu.
[17:10] <persia> #debian-multimedia @ OFTC
[17:10] <falktx> nope
[17:10] <falktx> ah, different server
[17:11] <persia> And the technical reason being that more developers who know about multimedia stuff are involved in debian-multimedia, so you get better comments and reviews.
[17:11] <falktx> cool
[17:16] <falktx> persia: one thing I will do is a new unstable PPA for natty
[17:16] <falktx> ardour30, blender25, etc
[17:16] <persia> Sure, I'd expect that.
[17:17] <persia> We mostly only want stable stuff on the debian-multimedia -> natty -> backports route.
[17:17] <falktx> yep
[19:46] <astraljava> Good session, ScottL! :)
[20:03] <ScottL> thanks astraljava :)
[20:03] <astraljava> Looked to me that you were well prepared.
[20:06] <ScottL> heh, not really, just a few bullet points on paper five minutes before the class, and the rest in my head :P
[20:06] <astraljava> You've got a decent head on your shoulders. :D
[20:07] <ScottL> thanks :)
[20:07] <ScottL> some of the pauses were because i was thinking about how i wanted t approach a topic
[20:08] <astraljava> Didn't seem to break the flow, to me at least.
[20:23] <ScottL> that's good :)
[20:23] <ScottL> and i'm thankful to charlie-tca as well for asking questions
[20:24] <astraljava> That was nice.