| czajkowski | aloha | 01:52 |
|---|---|---|
| paultag | morning czajkowski | 01:55 |
| czajkowski | ello brat | 01:57 |
| Pendulum | paultag: are you in the loco council channel? | 02:05 |
| paultag | Pendulum, yup. | 02:05 |
| Pendulum | paultag: well done. | 02:05 |
| paultag | Pendulum, are you an eddie izzard fan? | 02:06 |
| paultag | I read that in his voice | 02:06 |
| paultag | "Aaaah well done! You must get up very early in the morning." | 02:06 |
| czajkowski | paultag: glad yer getting the hang of that | 02:14 |
| czajkowski | :p | 02:14 |
| paultag | czajkowski, I have to manually join every login, it's really lae | 02:14 |
| paultag | lame | 02:14 |
| pleia2 | paultag: use a server password when you connect to freenode | 02:16 |
| pleia2 | freenode sees it as a nickserv password | 02:16 |
| paultag | pleia2, wait, what? | 02:16 |
| paultag | No way!! | 02:16 |
| pleia2 | yes | 02:16 |
| paultag | That would make my life awesome | 02:16 |
| pleia2 | that's how the rest of us do it :) | 02:16 |
| paultag | well shit! | 02:16 |
| * paultag huggles pleia2 | 02:16 | |
| czajkowski | paultag: language | 02:16 |
| pleia2 | it also avoids this: | 02:16 |
| pleia2 | 09:58:56 -!- paultag [~tag@cpe-76-190-130-58.neo.res.rr.com] has joined #ubuntu-community-team | 02:16 |
| maco | !language | 02:16 |
| ubot2 | Please watch your language and topic to help keep this channel family friendly. | 02:16 |
| pleia2 | 09:58:56 -!- paultag [~tag@cpe-76-190-130-58.neo.res.rr.com] has quit [Changing host] | 02:16 |
| paultag | +1 pleia2 :) | 02:16 |
| pleia2 | 09:58:56 -!- paultag [~tag@ubuntu/member/paultag] has joined #ubuntu-community-tea | 02:16 |
| paultag | Well, I'm going to try this out | 02:17 |
| paultag | much better | 02:17 |
| paultag | thanks there pleia2 | 02:17 |
| duanedesign | cya all in the am | 02:41 |
| dholbach | good morning! | 08:32 |
| nigelb | morning dholbach :) | 08:32 |
| nigelb | dholbach: The new harvest is totally rocking. I just saw it :) | 08:32 |
| kim0 | morning fellas | 08:34 |
| dholbach | hi nigelb | 08:34 |
| dholbach | hey kim0 | 08:34 |
| kim0 | dholbach: long flight ? | 08:34 |
| kim0 | :) | 08:34 |
| nigelb | morning kim0 :) | 08:34 |
| kim0 | nigelb: morning man | 08:34 |
| dholbach | kim0, it was alright, but I'm properly jetlagged now :) | 08:34 |
| kim0 | hehe :) | 08:35 |
| nigelb | kim0: dholbach just says disaparates into Berlin :p | 08:35 |
| nigelb | s/says// | 08:38 |
| nigelb | Pendulum: Hiya :) | 09:34 |
| === Pendulum_ is now known as Pendulum | ||
| nigelb | dholbach: whoa, that's a lot of action items. | 10:22 |
| dholbach | nigelb, no slacking this cycle | 10:23 |
| nigelb | dholbach: heh | 10:23 |
| nigelb | Well, if you want to offload some action items, let me know :) | 10:23 |
| czajkowski | aloha | 10:32 |
| dholbach | hi czajkowski | 10:32 |
| czajkowski | dholbach: ello | 10:34 |
| nigelb | morning czajkowski :) | 10:36 |
| nigelb | czajkowski: did ya find taffes eventually? ;) | 10:37 |
| czajkowski | yup thanks to Pendulum and doctormo | 10:38 |
| nigelb | \o/ | 10:38 |
| duanedesign | 'lo all | 10:56 |
| nigelb | duanedesign: sleep cycle out of whack? ;) | 10:57 |
| duanedesign | nigelb: actually this is pretty close to normal :) | 10:58 |
| duanedesign | well, normal for me :P | 10:59 |
| nigelb | heh | 11:02 |
| nigelb | \o/ http://www.canonical.com/about-canonical/resources/case-studies/french-national-police-force-saves-%E2%82%AC2-million-year-ubuntu | 12:40 |
| Pici | woo! | 12:44 |
| nigelb | ok, off home, later all! | 12:51 |
| Pici | Cyas | 12:52 |
| daker | hello everybody | 13:00 |
| kim0 | o/ | 13:00 |
| daker | so i have a question | 13:01 |
| daker | i am asking the UDS organizers if there is a chance to organize the UDS somewhere in Africa ? | 13:03 |
| kim0 | It's just generally good to just ask your question and wait for an answer | 13:03 |
| daker | coze it's really important and it will push the FLOSS movement | 13:06 |
| AlanBell | daker: my understanding is that the next two UDS locations have been decided | 13:07 |
| AlanBell | and the next one is Budapest | 13:07 |
| daker | Two ? oh :s | 13:07 |
| AlanBell | It has been suggested that sabdfl takes us home to SA | 13:07 |
| Pici | I suspect that cost might be a limiting factor there. | 13:07 |
| Pici | Also, does anyone know if the UDS surveys were sent out, and if they only went to sponsored people? | 13:08 |
| duanedesign | i have not received one Pici | 13:08 |
| Pici | duanedesign: Okay. | 13:09 |
| daker | Pici, what do you mean by "limiting factor" can you elaborate ? | 13:09 |
| daker | Pici, i mean "cost might be a limiting factor" | 13:09 |
| Pici | daker: Canonical does not have unlimited funds. They sponsor (an increasing) number of people to attend each UDS. | 13:10 |
| jussi | daker: Suggestions for suitable places (good internet, ~450 people in double rooms, cheap enough, 450 perrson audotorium etc) can be sent to marianna | 13:11 |
| daker | jussi, thanks | 13:12 |
| jussi | daker: theres no guarantees of course, and youll have to go find her email somewhere... | 13:13 |
| Pici | I think it was on the wiki page for UDS-N | 13:14 |
| * kim0 waits for the accidental paste :) | 13:14 | |
| JanC | it's not only cost for those who get funded but also cost for those who don't | 13:26 |
| Pici | Right. | 13:26 |
| nigelb | JanC: +1 | 13:26 |
| daker | JanC, why ? | 13:26 |
| JanC | although, of course cost would be less for those in/near South Africa then | 13:27 |
| popey | daker: some people pay their own way to go | 13:27 |
| popey | i paid my own way to go to my first UDS in Sevilla | 13:27 |
| Pici | I've paid for all the UDSes I've attended. | 13:27 |
| nigelb | I might for O :) | 13:27 |
| nigelb | Really glad its announced early, we can actually get good deals on flights | 13:28 |
| popey | I dont see how having UDS somewhere in Africa helps African FLOSS adoption specificall | 13:28 |
| popey | _y | 13:28 |
| nigelb | s/-/+ | 13:28 |
| popey | but I do see that othr events around it could | 13:28 |
| popey | but we dont tend to do events around UDS like we used to | 13:28 |
| Pici | Too busy. | 13:28 |
| popey | FOSSCamp for example | 13:29 |
| JanC | I guess the most likely place in Africa might be Morocco, as it's close to Europe and relatively stable/safe ;) | 13:31 |
| popey | I understood that they might go back to florida again | 13:32 |
| daker | JanC, yeah :D thanks you | 13:32 |
| daker | s/thanks/thank | 13:32 |
| JanC | daker: you're from Morocco ? | 13:33 |
| daker | yep | 13:33 |
| popey | Morocco would certainly be a somewhat more... hmm... 'cultured' place than florida :) | 13:34 |
| popey | well, more than Disney anyway | 13:34 |
| jussi | heh | 13:35 |
| nigelb | well, I just did Mor<tab>, sigh. | 13:35 |
| nigelb | Well, Morocco would be fun indeed. | 13:35 |
| JanC | you can always propose it, if you know a good conference location, maybe for 1.5 years from now... ;) | 13:35 |
| daker | JanC, that's good | 13:36 |
| nigelb | I was hoping we'd have a UDS in some Asian city, anywhere Dubai, Singapore, Hong Kong, lots of places with good hotels (I don't know about price though) | 13:36 |
| daker | nigelb, maybe in 2years from now :D | 13:37 |
| JanC | nigelb: I know at least one person who certainly wants to organise it if it's in Singapore or Vietnam ;) | 13:37 |
| nigelb | Singapore would be lovely. | 13:38 |
| jussi | 2 years from now it should be in the US | 13:38 |
| nigelb | 2.5 years then :) | 13:38 |
| jussi | <cough> taiwan<cough> | 13:38 |
| jussi | :D | 13:38 |
| nigelb | +1 | 13:38 |
| nigelb | London? ;) | 13:39 |
| JanC | I think the problem is that Asia is quite expensive to travel to/from, and there are often visa problems | 13:39 |
| nigelb | I believe Singapore has visa on arrival. | 13:39 |
| * nigelb checks | 13:39 | |
| JanC | I know Vietnam has visa on arrival | 13:39 |
| JanC | but does visa on arrival mean you always get it? | 13:40 |
| nigelb | well, no visa for US citizens | 13:40 |
| nigelb | I think it does | 13:41 |
| JanC | so, in that respect it would be easier than the US actually? :p | 13:41 |
| popey | there should be a webapp which looks at the home locations of all attendees and calculates average flight costs to all cities then figures out a location for you :) | 13:41 |
| JanC | that would be rather complicated | 13:42 |
| popey | yup | 13:42 |
| popey | exactly the kind of task a computer should do :) | 13:42 |
| popey | and not a human | 13:42 |
| Pici | popey: I believe that Jorge was talking about that at one of the community sessions at UDS. Although he was comparing it to D&D. | 13:43 |
| JanC | the problem is that in some countries the price for visa depends on what official you meet at arrival etc. ;) | 13:44 |
| JanC | not to mention that airplane tickets to the same location might vary between 50 and 500 € sometimes | 13:45 |
| nigelb | http://www.worldtravelguide.net/singapore/passport-visa Interesting | 13:45 |
| nigelb | ok, it looks like the rains a bit less. Time to go home \o/ | 13:46 |
| dholbach | hey jono | 13:55 |
| jono | hey dholbach | 13:55 |
| dholbach | jono, I started feeding work items into the blueprints - is it enough to set the "series goal"? | 13:56 |
| dholbach | and how are you doing? had a good trip back? | 13:56 |
| jono | dholbach, cool beans - yeah, now is the time to start populating blueprints | 13:57 |
| daker | popey, JanC http://www.worldtravelguide.net/morocco/passport-visa | 13:57 |
| jono | don't worry about the series goal yet | 13:57 |
| jono | good flight thanks :) | 13:57 |
| dholbach | jono, I think I can't set it anyway, I can just 'propose' it | 13:57 |
| jono | dholbach, cool | 13:58 |
| dholbach | jono, I'm just waiting to see how many work items I end up with :) | 13:58 |
| jono | dholbach, wise | 13:58 |
| dholbach | jono, ok, it seems you need to accept them for them to get on the work item tracker - I'll leave the rest up to you :) | 14:01 |
| jono | dholbach, sounds good | 14:01 |
| dholbach | gracias | 14:01 |
| daker | popey, JanC there is ~50 countries that they need just a passport | 14:02 |
| daker | including USA, UK and other countries | 14:02 |
| sense | good afternoon | 14:11 |
| daker | good afternoon sense | 14:13 |
| sense | hi daker | 14:14 |
| jono | dholbach, hey, I know you are tired, we can cancel our call if you want to head off and grab some sleep or chill? | 14:17 |
| dholbach | jono, I doubt we have much to talk about yet, I'll just plough through some of the easy stuff that doesn't require all my brain during the time :) | 14:18 |
| jono | dholbach, sure - just focus on getting the BPs ready, and then lets review them later this week | 14:19 |
| jono | make sure the workload is doable | 14:19 |
| dholbach | jono, blueprints are ready, specs will take longer | 14:19 |
| * duanedesign waves at everyone | 14:20 | |
| jono | dholbach, thanks | 14:21 |
| Technoviking | morning all | 14:40 |
| duanedesign | morning Technoviking | 14:40 |
| duanedesign | Technoviking: latest work on the forums looks great | 14:41 |
| Technoviking | duanedesign: thanks for the UDS session pics, they were a big help | 14:41 |
| Technoviking | duanedesign: thanks, going to see how hard it will be to change the header now | 14:42 |
| duanedesign | Technoviking: ok great! I was not sure if they went through :P I was dealing with airport wiFi. | 14:42 |
| Technoviking | I love the MCO airport, compared to most it is great services. | 14:42 |
| Pici | It was empty compared to EWR. | 14:44 |
| Pici | Or maybe the Continental terminal is just like that. | 14:45 |
| * dholbach takes the dog for a walk | 14:55 | |
| scott-work | dholbach: when you get back would you stop in #ubuntustudio-devel? we wanted to ask you some questions about xwax please | 15:18 |
| doctormo | Morning everyone | 15:19 |
| scott-work | good morning doctormo | 15:20 |
| Pici | Howdy | 15:20 |
| doctormo | I feel great now, socially recharged. Now to hold onto UDS-buzz for as long as possible :-) | 15:20 |
| Pici | Heh, I've been thinking the same. | 15:21 |
| jono | kim0, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntutheproject-community-n-dev-training-events | 15:30 |
| jussi | MCO was horrible - or at least the delta terminal was... | 15:48 |
| sense | MCO feels a bit old and past its glory days, but I liked the free wifi. | 15:49 |
| sense | AMS is much less boring and more comfortable, but there is no free internet! | 15:49 |
| sense | You have to pay KPN for it. | 15:49 |
| * jussi is spoiled though, with helsinki vantaa... | 15:49 | |
| sense | jussi: Comfort and free wifi? | 15:49 |
| jussi | sense: yup | 15:49 |
| sense | ah! | 15:50 |
| jussi | and modern to boot | 15:50 |
| sense | That is nice as well. | 15:50 |
| sense | AMS is a mix of older buildings, new buildings and stuff to link that. | 15:51 |
| sense | jussi: But! Is HEL in a lake? AMS is! | 15:51 |
| sense | The water is gone, but it is a lake! | 15:52 |
| jussi | sense: no,but its next to one :P | 15:52 |
| sense | jussi: A lake? In Finland? Huh? | 15:52 |
| jussi | lol | 15:53 |
| jussi | yeah, we only have like 188000 of them... :P | 15:53 |
| sense | What is the lake-per-capita ratio? | 15:54 |
| jussi | hrm... | 15:54 |
| jussi | well if we have a little over 5 million people... | 15:54 |
| sense | You beat Norway there! | 15:54 |
| sense | Anyway, that is not even one lake per person? | 15:54 |
| sense | Finland's LPC is 0.0375776 | 15:55 |
| === dholbach_ is now known as dholbach | ||
| jussi | right. so population: 5,313,399 (2008) and lakes: 187,888 | 15:58 |
| sense | Number of Dutch: http://www.cbs.nl/nl-NL/menu/themas/bevolking/cijfers/extra/bevolkingsteller.htm | 16:01 |
| sense | ah! One more than when I last looked. | 16:01 |
| sense | Congratulations to the new parents. | 16:01 |
| sense | 16.644.700 | 16:01 |
| Technoviking | safety tip: never post a mac screenshot :) | 16:09 |
| sense | Technoviking: for personal safety reasons, or for technical safety reasons? | 16:11 |
| Technoviking | personal safety | 16:11 |
| sense | ah | 16:12 |
| jcastro | http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/natty/canonical-community.html | 16:16 |
| jcastro | we are doomed! | 16:16 |
| dholbach | jcastro, already? | 16:16 |
| doctormo | scott-work: Do we have a wacom daily ppa? | 16:17 |
| dholbach | jcastro, still waiting for Jono to accept a bunch of blueprints :) | 16:17 |
| jono | dholbach, expect to wait a little longer, I am un screwing my inbox | 16:17 |
| paultag | OK, well my internet is dead. I'm mooching off my neighbors, but I can't stick on it, it's so laggy. I'll be on email if anyone needs me, be sure to pass on the word | 16:17 |
| scott-work | doctormo: i am not aware of one | 16:17 |
| paultag | much love | 16:17 |
| dholbach | jono, enjoy | 16:17 |
| jono | dholbach, and I will approve them when we have reviewed them on a call and discussed the actions | 16:17 |
| jono | so you don't have too much to do ;-) | 16:17 |
| jcastro | ugh you gotta be kidding me | 16:18 |
| sense | jcastro: Two todo-items! O Noes! | 16:18 |
| jcastro | beginner team's already done 2 work items | 16:19 |
| scott-work | doctormo: to be honest, after your last comments about lack of developers/development i was concerned that this might be dead | 16:19 |
| doctormo | scott-work: Not dead, just undernourished. | 16:20 |
| doctormo | scott-work: I'm working on getting the wacom project people more involved with having ubuntu support instead of recommended compiling in upstream docs. | 16:20 |
| doctormo | I also had the chance to talk with Ping Cheng of Wacom at UDS. | 16:21 |
| scott-work | doctormo: oh, do tell :) | 16:21 |
| doctormo | scott-work: It's probably better if I try to join the dots than attempt to do programming ;-) But yeah I think a ppa for daily builds, some announcements upstream and some clearing on the ubuntu forums and wiki should put us in good form. I also found a wacom-utils python package which does the job of allowing the user to set preferences for their wacom. | 16:23 |
| scott-work | outstanding | 16:24 |
| jcastro | stepping out for caffeine | 16:27 |
| jcastro | bbiab | 16:27 |
| jcastro | I've finally reached inbox 1! | 17:24 |
| jcastro | where "1" means, one page! | 17:24 |
| dholbach | haha | 17:27 |
| dholbach | sweet | 17:27 |
| duanedesign | :) | 17:28 |
| jcastro | jono: is it worth having our call today? I would prefer a day to catch up. A deferrment to tomorrow would help me out | 17:36 |
| jcastro | my WI's are kind of a big pile right now | 17:36 |
| jono | jcastro, no worries, but can we have a really quick call now about something different? | 17:36 |
| jcastro | yeah | 17:36 |
| jcastro | skype or ... ? | 17:36 |
| jono | skype | 17:37 |
| jono | calling | 17:37 |
| jcastro | 20 secs to test mic | 17:37 |
| jcastro | wait! | 17:37 |
| jcastro | ok i'm good! | 17:38 |
| dholbach | ok, enough messing around with specs & blueprints today - it's dinner time - see you all tomorrow | 17:56 |
| * dholbach hugs you all | 17:56 | |
| jcastro | popey: hmm, looks like the friday sessions and lightning talks and summary videos didn't make it yet? | 18:02 |
| Technoviking | jcastro: how long will you be doing Unity Q7A and Ask Ubuntu> | 18:35 |
| jcastro | Technoviking: I guess it's ongoing, the DX guys are on it now and most of the major questions are answered so you can unsticky if you want | 18:36 |
| Technoviking | jcastro: thanks, We will have a new stick in the NAtty subforum | 18:37 |
| Technoviking | what is the design team channel? | 18:45 |
| Pici | #ayatana ? | 18:48 |
| Technoviking | Pici: thanks | 18:50 |
| Pici | Or maybe thats the dx team. /me shrugs | 18:51 |
| doctormo | jcastro: Unity, why will the user be required to install a package to enable normal gnome desktop when it's installed already for the fallback? | 18:52 |
| jcastro | yes | 18:56 |
| jcastro | unless your hw doesn't support unity | 18:56 |
| jcastro | and then you'll get "classic" gnome anyway | 18:56 |
| jcastro | Technoviking: the UDS session forum people still hate me? :) | 19:05 |
| Technoviking | jcastro: I never knew sigs were so important to people | 19:05 |
| jcastro | heh | 19:06 |
| jcastro | I gave up too and just added a sig | 19:06 |
| jcastro | when in Rome | 19:06 |
| Technoviking | I never have had a long sig, always hated people who did | 19:06 |
| Technoviking | the forum rank I created are been hit though, and make the flow of info on the screen well | 19:07 |
| Technoviking | hopefully I can convice people 2 lines, no color, no graphics sig will look alot more modern | 19:07 |
| jcastro | this must be some kind of joke | 19:10 |
| jcastro | it's already 3:10pm | 19:10 |
| Technoviking | hell, a stream pipe exploded outside my building and I missed it. | 19:12 |
| Technoviking | Too busy and losing my hearing to Severed Fifth:) | 19:13 |
| doctormo | jcastro: I had a bit of trouble with my net connection, so if you responded, I didn't see it. | 20:17 |
| jcastro | yes | 20:18 |
| jcastro | unless your hw doesn't support unity | 20:18 |
| jcastro | and then you'll get "classic" gnome anyway | 20:18 |
| jcastro | doctormo: ^ | 20:21 |
| jono | jcastro, erk, I don't think it was wise to announce the proceedings | 20:21 |
| jono | remember we are distilling them into an edited document of proceedings | 20:21 |
| jono | that is what I wanted us to announce | 20:21 |
| doctormo | jcastro: So say your hardware does support unity and you still want classic gnome. Why do you have to install an extra package for that? | 20:22 |
| jcastro | jono: oh ok, what should I do? | 20:22 |
| jono | jcastro, no biggie, just leave your blog as it is | 20:23 |
| jcastro | doctormo: we don't ask you if you want firefox/epiphany, evo/tbird, etc. either? | 20:23 |
| jcastro | jono: I'll update with a "these are in progress and raw" | 20:23 |
| jcastro | but that won't bump it on planet | 20:23 |
| jono | thanks | 20:23 |
| doctormo | jcastro: Er no, what I mean to ask is why is there a technical requirement to install something that is already installed. | 20:23 |
| jono | hmmm did I read somewhere that there is a libreoffice dailly build? | 20:24 |
| jcastro | there are some upstream | 20:24 |
| jcastro | let me find them | 20:24 |
| jono | cheers | 20:24 |
| jcastro | jono: UPDATE: As many of you have pointed out, these are raw and in some cases don’t even make sense since they’re pasted in from people furiously typing into gobby documents. They’ll be polished as the week progresses. | 20:25 |
| jono | thanks | 20:25 |
| jono | jcastro, I am asking the leads to summarize outcomes at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDSProceedings/N/Final | 20:25 |
| jono | and then I will put them into a properly laid out PDF and release it | 20:25 |
| jcastro | ah, rock and roll | 20:25 |
| jono | :) | 20:25 |
| jcastro | http://download.documentfoundation.org/libreoffice/testing/3.3.0-beta2/deb/ | 20:27 |
| jcastro | hmm, I have a WI to talk to meeks anyway, I'll add it to the agenda | 20:27 |
| jcastro | I saw some floating around | 20:27 |
| jcastro | but that's as official as I can find | 20:28 |
| doctormo | jcastro: Should I point my question at the desktop/foundations team? they might be able to answer the technical point. | 20:28 |
| jcastro | doctormo: I don't get your question | 20:28 |
| jcastro | but yeah, probably | 20:28 |
| doctormo | I want people to be sure that what we say they will have to do, is actually what they will have to do. Even when it seems illogical. | 20:28 |
| jcastro | I don't know how you would fit both desktops on the same CD | 20:28 |
| doctormo | jcastro: That's a requirement anyway, for fallback. | 20:29 |
| jcastro | yeah I don't know how they will do that, it's a good question | 20:29 |
| jcastro | doctormo: send it to -desktop, half the desktop team is on holiday today | 20:29 |
| doctormo | thanks! | 20:30 |
| jcastro | jono: did you see meek's libreoffice contributor graph? | 20:32 |
| jcastro | http://people.gnome.org/~michael/blog/2010-10-25.html | 20:32 |
| jcastro | hey doctormo | 20:33 |
| jcastro | https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/performance-desktop-n-install-footprint | 20:33 |
| jcastro | that should have some answers | 20:33 |
| jcastro | unity is only 2.5mb! | 20:33 |
| jcastro | man I had no ideas changelogs are like 28megs!! | 20:34 |
| doctormo | Looks like classic will stay, I'll send the email anyways for clarification. | 20:36 |
| jcastro | doctormo: ask them to clarify it in the spec too | 20:37 |
| jcastro | that will make it obvious | 20:37 |
| doctormo | sent | 20:39 |
| doctormo | That libre-office graph is cool, wonderful to see what dropping a contributors assignment can do ;-P | 20:41 |
| jono | anyone running natty yet? | 21:50 |
| AlanBell | I am planning to upgrade the chickens from Kubuntu 10.04 to Kubuntu 10.10 tomorrow | 21:56 |
| sense | czajkowski: Awesome picture at <http://photos.pixoulphotography.com/Events/UDS-Natty/14450330_Xqidv#1072457032_AvoXD>! :P | 22:03 |
| AlanBell | not often you can do lipreading from a static photograph | 23:12 |
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