[00:05] <major> hi, i want to launch a program (icecc daemon) locally. Im changing in the chroot /etc/init.d/icecc to launch "ltsp-localapps iceccd" I dont know if this is the right approach. can anybody help me?
[04:40] <Pavlz> http://www.gopetition.com/petition/40352.html for untrusted hardware
[05:29] <alkisg> Good morning
[09:24] <kca_teacher> Hi everyone. Just wanted to share my excitement with some fellow ubuntu users :) I have always been a fan of Ubuntu, but have never been able to incorporate it into my everyday life. Now, being a teacher, it has given me just that opportunity! Hello Edubuntu!! It's exactly what I have been looking for. This suite is going to help me in educating +- 105 young minds!
[09:24] <kca_teacher> Can't wait to get started
[15:22] <highvoltage> mhall119: hey, around?
[15:24] <mhall119> yup
[15:25] <highvoltage> mhall119: what's that social plugin/block thingy you suggested at UDS called again?
[15:25] <mhall119> I'm not sure what you mean
[15:25] <highvoltage> to replace the identi.ca block we currently have on edubuntu.org
[15:25] <mhall119> oh, twidenash
[15:25] <highvoltage> yes that's the one
[15:26] <mhall119> https://launchpad.net/twidenash
[15:26] <mhall119> look at the loco.ubuntu.com homepage source code to see how to use it, but it's pretty simple
[15:27] <highvoltage> ah, that maintainer name sounds familiar :)
[15:27] <mhall119> yeah, I haven't done much to it since taking over though
[15:28] <mhall119> it was originally authored by stuart langridge
[15:28] <mhall119> when I sent him several bugs and code patches, he just asked me to maintain it
[19:00] <highvoltage> running a bit late but edubuntu meeting starting soon!
[19:10] <stgraber> alkisg: ping (meeting)
[19:14] <alkisg> Ugh I'm doing something, I'll read the logs later on, sorry... :)
[19:46] <highvoltage> mhall119: I'd like to toy around with the new gnome stuff, so if you get stuck and need some fresh eyes to look at something, please give me a poke :)
[19:47] <mhall119> will do
[19:48] <mhall119> http://live.gnome.org/GnomeGoals/GSettingsMigration
[19:48] <mhall119> gnome-panel is still marked "to-do"
[19:48] <mhall119> :(
[19:48] <alkisg> Ah, about the EC update... I won't be able to contribute much for the next 2 years due to my phd, but I'll be around more or less, and I'll try to have a classroom administration tool ready for 12.04 :)
[19:48] <highvoltage> I'm quite confident that that's quite high on the list to fix up :)
[19:48] <mhall119> gnome-settings-daemon: to-do
[19:49] <mhall119> gnome-shell is "done", so gnome-panel may not be all that high
[19:49] <mhall119> nautilus is done at least
[19:50] <highvoltage> pessulus and sabayon is marked to do too (no big surprise there, but ":(" nontheless
[19:50] <mhall119> ok, I've gotta run, I'll continue looking at gsettings/dconf and try upgrading my vm to natty
[19:51] <highvoltage> cool, would be interesting to see how that goes!
[19:51] <sbalneav> highvoltage: yeah, I need to start digging into that for sabayon.
[19:51] <sbalneav> It's going to basically end up being a re-write, since sabayon's pretty much a gconf proxy.
[19:52] <sbalneav> I'm almost wondering if it might be easier to simply start from scratch.
[19:53] <alkisg> sbalneav: I still think it'll be better if it is "task based"... i.e. if it offers a GUI for tweaking some certain parts of gconf/gsettings, not arbitrary ones...
[19:55] <sbalneav> alkisg: Well, that's what pessulus was supposed to be, an interface for handling the lockdowns.
[19:56] <alkisg> Right, and it was very handy, but also very limited
[19:56] <sbalneav> I'm not sure how you'd control things like panel icons, desktop icons, etc, without a "desktop" like interface.
[19:56] <highvoltage> sbalneav: sounds like an opportunity to make it somewhat nicer :)
[19:57] <sbalneav> As a systems adminitrator, what *I* personally would prefer would be some kind of text-based file that specifies things.
[19:57] <sbalneav> something like:
[19:57] <sbalneav> Top Panel::Far Left::Menu Applet
[19:58] <sbalneav> Top Panel::Next::firefox.desktop
[19:58] <sbalneav> Top Panel::Next::thunderbird.desktop
[19:58] <sbalneav> Top Panel::Right::FUSA applet
[19:58] <sbalneav> etc.
[19:59] <alkisg> I agree, but having also a GUI for that text file would mean that inexperienced users like e.g. teachers could also use it
[19:59] <sbalneav> the "language" would translate into the appropriate gconf settings.
[19:59] <sbalneav> Maybe the way to go would be to write the backend, and text file parser.
[20:00] <sbalneav> Then the gui just creates text files.
[20:00] <alkisg> That sounds much better to me than the sabayon approach
[20:00] <sbalneav> I like the idea of the text file because, as a systems administrator, you say things like:
[20:00] <alkisg> I've only looked at sabayon a little - I think it shows the user a bunch of keys that changed, and he then has to select which ones he wants to keep or not. I don't think that the task of key "approving" could be handled by inexperienced users... while a dialog to "add that applet to the right side of the panel" would be much easier.
[20:01] <sbalneav> "Secretaries should have the same desktop as lawyers, but they need the openoffice icon on the top panel."
[20:01] <sbalneav> so then you could just copy "lawyer.foo" to "secretary.foo", and add in the appropriate icon.
[20:02] <sbalneav> Prolly an XML file would be the way to go.
[20:02] <sbalneav> alkisg: agreed.
[20:02] <dinda> well shoot, thought the meeting was now instead of an hour ago - bloody timezone changes
[20:02] <sbalneav> sabayon's very overwhelming.
[20:02]  * alkisg hopes gsettings offers a nicer interface for managing panels and the rest of the list-based gconf stuff
[20:03] <sbalneav> So you could say in xml:
[20:03] <sbalneav> <panel id="panel0" name="Top Panel">
[20:04] <sbalneav>   <applet id="applet0" name="Main Menu">menu.applet</applet>
[20:05] <sbalneav>   <launcher id="launcher0" name="Firefox">firefox.desktop</launcher>
[20:05] <sbalneav>   <launcher id="launcher1" name="Thunderbird">thunderbird.desktop</launcher>
[20:05] <sbalneav> ...
[20:05] <sbalneav> etc.
[20:05] <sbalneav> hmm
[20:05] <sbalneav> I like that.
[20:06] <alkisg> Sounds good.
[20:06] <alkisg> gconf-editor also has some good potential, if somehow group-based-settings support was added to it, that would also help in many cases (just brainstorming here). E.g. "open mandatory gconf-editor for group=secretaries".
[20:06] <sbalneav> yeah, I don't know yet if gsetting will have group permissions.
[20:07] <sbalneav> currently that's handled through the sabayon-apply process.
[20:07] <highvoltage> sbalneav: nice
[20:09] <alkisg> The sabayon-apply process (as I imagine it) is very powerful, and it could also be applied for other front-ends too, right?
[20:09] <sbalneav> sabayon-apply's no powerful at all.
[20:09] <alkisg> So someone could make a wrapper to run gconf-editor, gather the modified settings, and pass those to sabayon-apply for a specific group... no?
[20:10] <sbalneav> All it's doing is unzipping a set of gconf settings into the user's home directory :)
[20:10] <sbalneav> alkisg: yeah, that would work.
[20:10] <alkisg> Ah, so the user can delete his "mandatory" settings?
[20:11] <sbalneav> the problem with sabayon is, when you make a change to the desktop, a HUGE number of gconf settings are modified.
[20:11] <alkisg> That's exactly why I would prefer a different front end, either gconf-editor or a new UI...
[20:11] <sbalneav> alkisg: no, since they'd need to re-start gconf, which would mean restarting their session.  When they log in again, the settings are re-unzipped.
[20:12] <alkisg> Hmmm... aren't gconf settings read on the fly? E.g. if he runs gconftool-2 to change the settings, aren't they applied immediately?
[20:12] <sbalneav> right, so having some kind of back-end that reads a well formed XML file, and produces ONLY the setting changed you want is the first step
[20:13] <sbalneav> then it's just a case of coming up with a nice gui to generate the xml file.
[20:13] <sbalneav> an experienced admin can just stick to editing the XML directly
[20:13] <sbalneav> a teacher can use a gui to generate the XML file.
[20:13] <sbalneav> Hm.  I like it.
[20:14] <sbalneav> alkisg: not if they're set as mandatory settings
[20:14] <alkisg> Is a new .xml format needed? Or can the same xml format as gsettings be used?
[20:14] <sbalneav> the user can't modify those.
[20:14] <alkisg> Nice
[20:14] <sbalneav> alkisg: Well, possibly.  I need to sit down and read the gsettings docs.
[20:15] <alkisg> sbalneav: btw, nice to have you back on track :)
[20:18] <sbalneav> well, having a two week break from the grind has been a much needed respite.
[22:23] <mhall119> sbalneav: did sabayon change the system defaults, user settings, or what?