[00:00] /o\ \o_ \o/ [00:00] * phillw is here [00:00] please see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings [00:00] for the meeting agenda [00:00] o/ [00:00] yes jledbetter [00:01] Sorry, was waving along. [00:01] ok [00:01] my car broke down so I am not at home. I'll try and follow along and participate [00:01] for the record can all Beginners Team meeting attendees say here [00:01] here [00:01] here [00:01] here [00:01] here [00:01] here [00:01] here [00:02] here [00:02] here [00:02] anyone else? [00:02] here [00:02] o/ [00:02] [LINK] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings [00:02] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Meetings [00:03] alright... thanks all [00:03] [TOPIC] UDS-N Blueprints and Notes [00:03] New Topic: UDS-N Blueprints and Notes [00:03] duaneipho and I were both at UDS along with Darkwingduck [00:04] there were several things that came up in regards to the beginners team [00:04] the following were specs [00:04] [link]https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Specs/NattyRoadmap/MembershipProposal [00:04] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Specs/NattyRoadmap/MembershipProposal [00:04] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Specs/NattyRoadmap/MentorsProposal [00:04] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Specs/NattyRoadmap/MentorsProposal [00:05] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Specs/NattyRoadmap/FocusGroupContainers [00:05] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Specs/NattyRoadmap/FocusGroupContainers [00:05] I know you will not all have time to read these, but these are the ideas that the council has been working on [00:05] and the reason for some of the changes that will be discussed tonight [00:06] there were also some other blueprints that the BT is part of, but are not the lead team on. [00:06] The 'core' summary is that there is a desire from the community leaders and some other teams to utilize the BT as an on-ramp for people to become involved in the community [00:07] Jono Bacon spent an entire session at UDS-N on Thursday discussing the BT and what the team has accomplished [00:07] he kept saying "great work" [00:07] so you all should feel very proud of what the team (you) have accopmplished [00:07] Yep. Great work everyone. [00:07] +1 [00:08] +1 [00:08] the overall goal is to align ourselves a little tighter with existing Ubuntu teams [00:08] this is expressed in how we are re-defining the Focus Groups [00:08] membership process and mentor approval process [00:09] You may have noticed significant changes to our Wiki as we prepared for this meeting [00:09] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Structure [00:09] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Structure [00:09] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FGCreation [00:09] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FGCreation [00:09] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Membership [00:09] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Membership [00:10] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors [00:10] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors [00:10] in addition the header was tweaked and the colors changed slightly [00:10] (and lots of emails if you subscribe to BeginnersTeam/.*) [00:11] the basic part of the change is that, in general, the BT FGs will be aligned with an associated Ubuntu team [00:11] bugs-FG = Bug Control, Testing, and QA [00:12] at some point if there is enough interest in one of those sub-topics and the necessary 'mentors' we would form another FG [00:12] but that team is an example of how we try to align with existing team(s) [00:12] does anyone have any questions about that part of FGs? [00:13] Nope [00:13] ok... [00:13] [TOPIC] Membership [00:13] New Topic: Membership [00:13] We also needed to really nail down membership [00:14] in what way? [00:14] at present members are those people who have demonstrated that they are knowledgable in an area of the Ubuntu project [00:14] that could be development or advocacy [00:15] they will also have proven that they are mature individuals who work well with others and are dedicated to giving something back to the community and beginners [00:15] they do not need to be experts [00:15] just knowledgeable [00:15] any questions there? [00:15] Nope [00:15] no [00:15] no [00:16] The process is also detailed on the Join Us Page [00:16] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Membership [00:16] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Membership [00:16] I hope that this is very clear to prospective members [00:16] There are two membership cases... [00:17] an Ubuntu user that is knowledgeable, but has not contrinbuted to the Ubuntu Project before [00:17] and an Ubuntu user who has contrinbuted before to other teams, but now wants to help mentor people [00:17] In the first case the person will have to prove they have made contributions and are knoweldgeable [00:18] this might take 1 month or 12 months (long long time) [00:18] we do not rush the process [00:18] the second case would be a special case [00:18] such as Carlos (hgghd) [00:18] who is a long standing member of bug-control, testing and QA [00:19] in those cases these people will have a body of work that can be judged [00:19] and a history of working with the community that can also be looked at [00:19] in either case we have two choices [00:19] 1) wait until an official team meeting to vote on the new members [00:19] or [00:20] 2) have the council vote on the members with input live, wiki and email based on each prospecitve member [00:20] +1 for 2) [00:20] +1 for 1 [00:20] I would like to have the team vote on that idea the next time after we discuss it on the mailing list [00:20] I see positives and negatives for both [00:21] and think we should all think on it [00:21] any questions on membership? [00:21] [topic] Mentors [00:21] New Topic: Mentors [00:22] I just wanted to note that even for experienced people, we still want to make sure they are integrated well with the team [00:22] +1 nhandler [00:22] good [00:22] I thing [00:22] +1 [00:22] yeah [00:22] One thing sorry? [00:22] +1 for 1 [00:23] At UDS we received a couple of comments about some of our mentors not being 'knwoledgeable' in certain areas [00:23] PabloRubianes: go ahead [00:23] people who don't know and never contribute to the Ubuntu project... are going to be integrated till are electable right? [00:23] PabloRubianes: yes -- they will be prospective members that we work with [00:24] good [00:24] we will work as long as they keep trying [00:24] work with them [00:24] I think that should be clear for thouse people to make them work hard [00:24] * cprofitt nods [00:24] ok... back to mentors [00:24] agrees [00:24] we had some comments that are mentors were not knowledgeable [00:25] the incidents were isolated, but we agreed that we should have a tighter control on 'mentors' [00:25] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors [00:25] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors [00:25] you will notice a few things in the mentors page [00:25] there are now rows with time zones [00:26] I would appreciate folks modifying their entry to fit their time zone [00:26] that's great [00:26] also there is a column for Focus Group / Qualifications [00:26] if you have no qualification area -- you are a general mentor [00:26] and you can help people join the BT [00:27] we all know how that works :-) [00:27] Looks like the time zone column is messed up [00:27] if, you want to be a bug-FG mentor, you would need to get some testimonials from the bug-control team or another associated team [00:27] I think the time zones are subheader rows nhandler [00:28] time zones are rows that cover the entire table [00:28] Well, we should probably make it a bit more clear that they are headers, but we can fix that later ;) [00:29] to become a bug-control FG mentor you would apply to the council [00:29] sorry for the flacky connection. what page we talking about? [00:29] you would get either the associated team lead to give you a testimonial or two other associated team members [00:29] duaneipho: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/Mentors [00:30] thank you [00:30] the council would then vote to approve you or work further with you to improve your level of knowledge [00:30] cprofitt: as PhilBull has made me a wiki administrator, can I add wiki to my area? [00:30] No. [00:30] you would apply to the doc-FG to be a mentor [00:30] okies [00:30] you would have PhilBull add a testimonial to your page [00:31] the council would then talk with you and make a decision [00:31] cprofitt: it's already there :) [00:31] it is not always enough to be made a member of a team [00:31] np [00:32] we need to ensure that the associated team feels you have enough knowledge to 'teach' and the BT council wants to ensure your temperment is suitable to teaching as well [00:32] being a mentor can be trying at times [00:32] so it is not knowledge alone that makes a mentor [00:32] +1 :) [00:32] any questions on mentors? [00:33] ok [00:33] [topic] changing the wiki to fit the new theme [00:33] New Topic: changing the wiki to fit the new theme [00:34] duaneipho: you have the floor [00:34] I have think we have done a pretty good job of that [00:35] has everyone tried the page out with the new theme? [00:35] My only concern is that the theme might look ok in the light theme, but right now, it looks rather "bad" in the kubuntu theme [00:35] yes [00:35] I wish there was a way to have two different wiki codes for each theme [00:35] nhandler we might consider looking at the all white menus [00:35] but for now that is an issue [00:36] duaneipho: I think that might be nice. [00:36] we can certainly keep trying to work on it [00:36] not as neat as what we have but more theme agnostic [00:36] right now our menus are grey [00:36] and the side is grey [00:37] [ACTION] cprofitt and duaneipho will create a test header page for different color combos to be tested [00:37] ACTION received: cprofitt and duaneipho will create a test header page for different color combos to be tested [00:37] cprofitt: They have definitely gotten better (than what they were the other day), but the purple and orange don't go well with the blue [00:37] I agree [00:38] any more on the theme -- or just a desire to try and make them better? [00:38] ok [00:38] [TOPIC] New Member Nominations [00:38] New Topic: New Member Nominations [00:38] We have two tonight [00:38] yeah that is it. it was actually left over topic from last month [00:39] the first is bioterror mentored by phillw [00:39] bioterror is out due to family illness [00:39] phillw: would you like to speak on your mentees behalve? [00:39] oh no [00:39] he does send his apologies. [00:39] can we post his wiki [00:39] cprofitt: So you want to process these in the old style? [00:39] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/bioterror [00:40] for now yes nhandler [00:40] team vote [00:40] until we have time to consider the proposal put forth tonight [00:40] He's been on today, but 2AM was too big an ask for him [00:40] would anyone else like to give a testimonial for bioterror? [00:41] he has a great knowledge in different things [00:41] cprofitt: I believe hobgoblin also sent a mail to mailing list. [00:41] always seem to know the answers [00:42] [VOTE] To accept bioterror as a Ubuntu Beginners Team Member [00:42] Please vote on: To accept bioterror as a Ubuntu Beginners Team Member. [00:42] Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot [00:42] E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting [00:42] hobgoblin testimonial was likely from his work in ubuntu-beginners [00:42] +1 [00:42] +1 received from phillw. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 [00:42] +0 [00:42] Abstention received from nhandler. 1 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 1 [00:42] +1 [00:42] +1 received from duaneipho. 2 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 2 [00:42] +1 [00:42] +1 received from friTTe|. 3 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 3 [00:42] +1 [00:42] +1 received from UndiFineD. 4 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 4 [00:42] +1 [00:42] +1 received from PabloRubianes. 5 for, 0 against. 1 have abstained. Count is now 5 [00:42] +0 [00:42] Abstention received from cprofitt. 5 for, 0 against. 2 have abstained. Count is now 5 [00:43] any more votes? [00:43] I think we forgot to mention voting was for members:) [00:43] * aveilleux isn't a member yet so she can't vote [00:43] any more votes? [00:43] [ENDVOTE] [00:43] Final result is 5 for, 0 against. 2 abstained. Total: 5 [00:44] [agreed] bioterror is now a UBT member [00:44] AGREED received: bioterror is now a UBT member [00:44] so is that 3 for [00:44] the next candidate is jledbetter with myself as a mentor [00:44] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/jledbetter [00:44] damn, missed it [00:44] jledbetter: would you like to address the members? [00:44] yaa [00:44] cprofitt, Thank you. Yes. [00:46] i think jledbetter would make a good member. always catch her giving help when possible. [00:46] I would like to add that jledbetter has been active in the community by participating remotely with UDS, attending linux shows, presenting in OpenWeek and with Ubuntu Women [00:46] Hello everyone. I'm jledbetter, and as you can see, I love to code :) I'm hoping to help answer the question "I do X language and want to contribute. How can I?" I've been a member of Ubuntu-Women and my LoCo and am holding my first Ubuntu Hour in a few weeks. I have been interviewed and share my love for Ubuntu and the community. I blog and hope to do screencasts. Whatever I can to help out :) [00:46] She is also involved with a project I think we should also consider called the 100 user project [00:46] duaneipho, Thank you :) [00:46] [link] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/100UsersProject [00:46] LINK received: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/100UsersProject [00:46] excellent :) [00:47] remote participated at uds and always violunteering for stuff. [00:47] Great! [00:47] jledbetter: Lanuage of choice ? [00:47] Yes, have my action items from UDS and very excited about them :) [00:47] In my opinion she has integrated very well with our team and would be a good asset as a UBT member [00:47] nhandler, Java at work but learning Python. [00:47] * nhandler won't hold that against her [00:48] * cprofitt smiles [00:48] lol [00:48] nhandler, Appreciated ;) Gotta pay the bills. [00:48] no language ware allowed [00:48] :-) [00:48] Hehe. [00:48] anyone else have any questions for jledbetter [00:48] java got a lot cooler now that apple has dropped it :) [00:48] nope let's vote :-) [00:49] [VOTE] To accept jledbetter as a Ubuntu Beginners Team Member [00:49] Please vote on: To accept jledbetter as a Ubuntu Beginners Team Member. [00:49] Public votes can be registered by saying +1/-1/+0 in the channel, private votes by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to MootBot [00:49] E.g. /msg MootBot +1 #ubuntu-meeting [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 received from phillw. 1 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 1 [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 received from cprofitt. 2 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 2 [00:49] +1 received from pleia2. 3 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 3 [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 received from pedro3005. 4 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 4 [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 received from PabloRubianes. 5 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 5 [00:49] +1 received from duaneipho. 6 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 6 [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 received from nhandler. 7 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 7 [00:49] anymore votes? [00:49] woot! [00:49] +1 [00:49] +1 received from friTTe|. 8 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 8 [00:50] +1 [00:50] +1 received from UndiFineD. 9 for, 0 against. 0 have abstained. Count is now 9 [00:50] anymore votes? [00:50] [ENDVOTE] [00:50] Final result is 9 for, 0 against. 0 abstained. Total: 9 [00:50] [agreed] jledbetter is accepted as an UBT member [00:50] AGREED received: jledbetter is accepted as an UBT member [00:50] congrats jledbetter [00:50] congrats jledbetter [00:50] Yay! Thank you everyone :) [00:50] Congratulations and welcome to the team jledbetter [00:50] as there are no other topics I will close with the following brief comments [00:51] congrats jledbetter and bioterror [00:51] please remember to contribute to our meeting planning by adding topics to the meeting page and discussing them on the mailing list [00:51] yes, congrats to bioterror as you and your family hopefully get better [00:51] #endmeeting [00:51] Meeting finished at 18:51. [00:51] thanks everyone!! [00:52] I would like to congrat the Council for the great work! [00:52] Excellent meeting [00:52] yes definetly we need to take advantage of ml [00:52] very informative :) [00:52] if anyone would like to discuss anything I will be available for open discussion in our team channel [00:52] Well run meeting, first BT I've sat in on. [00:52] #ubuntu-beginners-team [00:52] thanks head_victim [00:52] good to have you sit in with us [00:52] I was afk for the first 30 minutes but caught up for the voting. [00:53] cprofitt: our head of dev was on earlier I'll catch up with him later. [00:53] sorry bout the voting i wasnt supposed to, first meeting and the AM is to blame [00:54] friTTe|: your mentor will flog you later. [00:54] yeah === kees___ is now known as kees === Tm_K is now known as Tm_T === lamont` is now known as lamont === Adri2000_ is now known as Adri2000 === JamieBen1ett is now known as JamieBennett === ian_brasil__ is now known as ian_brasil === ian_brasil__ is now known as ian_brasil === yofel_ is now known as yofel === virtuald_ is now known as virtuald === bilalakhtar_ is now known as bilalakhtar [16:00] hello [16:00] yo [16:00] howdy [16:01] ¡hola! [16:02] yo! [16:02] #startmeeting [16:02] Meeting started at 10:02. The chair is robbiew. [16:02] Commands Available: [TOPIC], [IDEA], [ACTION], [AGREED], [LINK], [VOTE] [16:02] [TOPIC] Foundations Team Lightning round [16:02] New Topic: Foundations Team Lightning round [16:02] JamesHunt: so fyi, we usually do a 2-3 sentence update [16:03] which is usually already prepared by the team and cut and pasted :P [16:03] kk. [16:03] cjwatson: mind going 1st? :) [16:05] done: piles of merges (esp. isc-dhcp coordination with network-manager), enabled natty builds, consolidated ports on cdimage, made os-prober mark block devices read-only, caught up somewhat on 10.04.2 uploads [16:05] sorry - disconnected [16:05] todo: um. work items! I think I need to get back to figuring out what's involved with using GRUB for CD booting, but am open to other priorities [16:05] -- [16:05] text free booting :) [16:05] "enabled natty CD builds", that should've said [16:06] I think I'm mostly blocked on the kernel team for that, but it's true that I could merge ebroder's blacklist patch - I'll do that [16:06] cjwatson: thnx [16:06] mvo: mvo_: ?? [16:06] lol [16:06] did: 3 days on vacaion :), mail backlog, admin stuff (travel booking dallas, expenses), fix cron script on on people running crazy, [16:06] prepare natty update-manager, upload msttcorefonts with EULA display, work on my LP branch to land (in week 4 now ;) [16:06] this/next week: blueprints! make maverick->natty upgrades work [16:06] eh, vacation [16:06] (done) === unimix_ is now known as unimix_work [16:07] barry? [16:07] python27 ftbfs bugs (670188, 671222, 672843, 6633343); continue to work on python bug 9807 (build flags); flufl.* packaging updates for debian; maverick on apple powerpc; setuptools_bzr packaging and ppa upload from user request; help oubiwann w/C extension writing. this week: finish bug 9807 work for py3.2b1; more ftbfs for py27; pkgme/udd work. [16:07] Launchpad bug 9807 in base-config (Ubuntu) "Doesn't put {warty,hoary}-updates in sources.list" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/9807 [16:08] thank you ubottu, that's not a lp bug :) [16:08] (done) [16:08] doko: ? [16:09] back from vacation / llvm developers meeting last week, catching up, writing two specs [16:09] and grumbling about the changelog change ... [16:09] barry: good to know it's fixed though! [16:10] Keybuk: ? [16:10] cjwatson: not yet accepted upstream, but i'm hopeful ;) [16:10] I meant the LP bug :-) [16:10] done: mostly been getting notes in order, preparing to meet weekly with James Hunt, catching up post-UDS and upgrading machines to maverick [16:11] cjwatson: :) [16:12] Keybuk: cool, thnx [16:12] ev: you around? [16:12] must be fighting protesters at millbank [16:12] or joining them? [16:12] psurbhi is out sick [16:12] lol [16:12] he's on the DX team now, remember [16:13] JamesHunt: anything to add? [16:13] so, designing better protest signs? [16:13] Keybuk: oh yeah [16:13] firehose is still squirting: having fun reading through wiki.{canonical|ubuntu}.com, starting to get to grips with upstart (lots of reading + playing), wrote up plumbers report, expenses, investigating debootstrap/armel/natty issue for colin/ogra, (I feel like I've read half the web! :), started to look at how to compare bootchart[12] in upstream/ubuntu/debian. [16:13] barry: he's designing apis to make sign making more uniform :P [16:13] TODO: - meet up with Scott on Friday. Finish reading the web,debootstrap issue, bootchart. [16:13] robbiew: :-D [16:13] re dallas, do I need to contact Amity? [16:14] JamesHunt: great [16:14] JamesHunt: yes....sorry [16:14] forgot all about that [16:14] np - I'll call Matt today... [16:14] JamesHunt: https://wiki.canonical.com/UbuntuPlatform/Rally/Natty [16:14] fyi [16:14] thx [16:15] [TOPIC] Natty Blueprints [16:15] New Topic: Natty Blueprints [16:15] Feature Definition Freeze is Nov 25th [16:16] So we need to have specs done and work items mostly sorted before then [16:16] I'm out that week..so the 19th is what I want folks to shoot for [16:17] I don't think there's much for us to do, as most of our work is maverick carry-over [16:17] \o/ [16:17] gotcha, seems fair [16:17] which is nice for a change [16:17] indeed [16:17] yep [16:17] Omnipotent Ox will be interesting :P [16:17] okey dokey [16:18] Ornery Otter [16:18] [TOPIC] 10.04.2 Stuff [16:18] New Topic: 10.04.2 Stuff [16:18] the next LTS point release is coming...due out in Feb I believe [16:18] just want to keep it in folks' mind [16:18] as skaet will soon be on the attack! :) [16:18] :) [16:19] [TOPIC] Sponsorship Queue [16:19] New Topic: Sponsorship Queue [16:20] sorry..too many conversations [16:21] Everyone PM robbiew on the count of three .... [16:21]