=== chaotic_ is now known as chaotic
dbarth_klattimer: hi, hey man, the ibus indicator, it's an appindicator one you've done right?11:14
klattimerdbarth_: yeah11:14
klattimerdbarth_: please don't tell me that the patches have been unapplied during the build11:15
klattimerthat was happening to me repeatedly when trying to build the package11:15
klattimerdbarth_: ?11:19
dbarth_klattimer: don't think so, no11:19
dbarth_klattimer: it was just to double check the nature of the indicator; mpt was not aware a new appindicator version of the ibus one was available11:19
klattimeryeah, that's what I fixed11:19
klattimerin theory11:19
klattimerI haven't been able to build the package though11:20
klattimerso many weird dpkg-buildpackage errors11:20
klattimerbut the python code was replaced in the system and tested11:20
klattimerand the patch built from that11:20
klattimerso everything *should* be working well11:20
dbarth_mpt: ^^ see, almost good news ;)11:21
klattimerdbarth_: I'm rebuilding the package now to test11:21
klattimerfrom upstream tarball and all seems to be working OK11:21
klattimeralthough GIR causes hell too11:21
dbarth_klattimer: did you get news from kenvandine yesterday on the build?11:27
dbarth_klattimer: seb128 was also asking11:27
klattimerdbarth_: he left me a message in the channel and via email11:32
=== oubiwann is now known as oubiwann-away
=== oubiwann-away is now known as oubiwann
sladenklattimer: greetings, dbarth_ has pointed me in your direction about language icons14:56
klattimersladen: hi14:56
klattimersladen: well, the first part isn't about language icons14:56
sladenklattimer: although I suspect/fear that it's more a case of you teaching me first :)14:56
klattimerit's about language bar/proposed input14:56
klattimercan you install ibus from maverick proposed and configure it with a couple of input methods?14:56
sladenklattimer: I can... could you give me some high-level context first14:57
klattimersladen: once you've got ibus up and running you should be able to select an input window and then start typing14:57
klattimeryou notice that a) the "language bar" appears with some icons on it in the bottom right14:58
klattimerand b) with many input methods a "proposed input" window appears with some suggestions14:58
sladenklattimer: right, after clicking 4 x pointless dialogues, I get a keyboard in the gnome-panel14:58
sladenklattimer: English ispell14:58
klattimersladen: english wont show up the proposed input14:59
klattimerpinyin is probably the best14:59
klattimerwe need these two floating windows to have a "unity" look about them14:59
sladenklattimer: anyone, keep talking, so that I have an idea of the end goal14:59
klattimerso it matches the overall desktop14:59
sladenklattimer: so this is an issue with the full-screen one-app-at-a-time setup in Unity, and needing to have siultaneous floating input method windows15:00
klattimersladen: well, it's not just about one app at a time15:01
klattimereffectively just a new visual style for those floating windows15:02
sladenklattimer: do I need to be running anything other than maverick-proposed/ibus-indicator ?15:02
klattimerme and njpatel will work out what we're going to do about positioning them15:02
klattimerI just want them to look prettier :)15:02
klattimersladen: nope, the maverick proposed ibus is the only thing you'll need15:02
klattimerthat should be released soon15:03
klattimerbut the current release in the repos is very broken15:03
klattimerproposed actually works so you can see the windows I'm talking about15:03
sladenklattimer: it appears I can't on _this_ machine, which is on 10.0415:07
klattimersladen: ah, you'll need 10.1015:07
klattimerupdate dude15:08
sladenklattimer: that's the other machine, which is not the one I'm using just now15:08
klattimersladen: ok, cool15:08
sladenklattimer: so moving on, there is $some proposed window layout idea15:08
klattimerwell I'm sure you know what to do when you're in front of it15:08
klattimersladen: exactly the same layout15:09
sladenklattimer: which is what is trying to be demonstrated15:09
klattimerjust more in tune with the general UI design15:09
sladen...rather than a small floating box with a star in it?15:09
klattimerat the moment it's just gtk background colour and doesn't sit very well on the unity desktop for someething which will be mostly a permanent floating window for many users15:09
klattimersladen: there'll be more icons than just the star once you're on maverick15:10
sladenklattimer: nod15:10
klattimerbut still, yeah basically the existing look is pretty lame15:10
sladenklattimer: so what are you thinking, more of a iPhone press-and-hold-a-key popup?15:11
sladenklattimer: or something a kin to the semi-transparent notify-osd popups?15:12
sladenklattimer: (sorry, I know looking in person would give me the answer)15:12
njpatelklattimer, sladen (excuse the fact that I haven't every used ibus), does this popup window require/allow user input through the mouse?15:13
klattimersladen: more like notify osd style15:14
klattimernjpatel: yeah, both of them I believe require mouse input15:14
klattimerbut maybe it's just the language bar15:14
njpatelcool, then it'll probably take the quicklist style15:14
klattimerthe proposed input window is keyboard driven for the most part15:14
klattimerbut I think it still supports mouse15:15
klattimerI should check15:15
njpatelnotify-osd style is meant to signal "you can't touch this" (with a picture of mc hammer in your head)15:15
klattimernjpatel: I meant visual style15:15
njpatelwhereas there is a specific overlay style15:15
klattimerthe interaction as it stands is perfectly fine atm15:15
njpatelklattimer, so do I15:15
njpatelklattimer, we have a specific style for overlay windows that can accept input, is what I mean to say, sorry for the confusion. Notify-OSD styling is a overlay window that can't accept input15:16
klattimernjpatel: well, either way, I don't want the interaction changed at all, just the visual appearance of it15:16
klattimerso it's got a dark back ground, rounded corners and looks nice15:16
njpatelyeah, no change to interaction15:16
njpatelwell, it'll have a dark background with dots and a bit of shine, rounded corner and will look lovely ;)15:16
klattimernjpatel: that's exactly what I was thinking :)15:18
klattimerjust like the tooltips on the dock/launcher15:18
njpatelklattimer, the cairo code that gives the correct still will be in the unity plugin, so hopefully just be able to use that15:19
njpatelbloody hell I can't type today15:19
klattimerah, excellent15:19
klattimerthe windows will probably still need to be drawn with gtk15:19
njpatelsure, but just override the gtkwindows paint right?15:19
klattimerI can port the cairo cuteness to gtk without worries though15:19
klattimernjpatel: yeah15:19
klattimersladen: the other thing is, we need all the existing m17n icons, and any other icons associated with the various ibus packages re-done to match the symbolic icons style15:20
sladenklattimer: njpatel: so is there a brand/style/guideline already defined for "floating windows that accept input"), or is this the first time it's come up and therefore it's the issue?15:22
klattimersladen: I think this is pretty much the first time it's come up15:23
njpatelsladen, the quicklist windows are the first that use the style, I'm 95% that other overlay windows that accept input should use the same style, but there's no harm in making sure with chaotic15:24
njpatelsladen, to that end, the tooltips on the latest unity are styled like notify osd, as it was confusing because you can't actually click them until you right-click to get a quicklist15:24
dbarth_tedg: ping? hi Ted15:27
dbarth_checking your email about the orphan indicators15:28
dbarth_it's a good point, so i'm switching datetime and session to klattimer, to reflect the uds planning15:28
klattimerdbarth_: nice to know15:29
dbarth_well, that's why i'm doing the switch here15:30
klattimerdbarth_: :)15:31
dbarth_klattimer: session is mostly bug fixes ataicr, while datetime is nicer piece with eds integration15:31
tedgGood morning dbarth_15:31
dbarth_tedg: good morning15:31
tedgUhm, so what is happening to keyboard then?15:31
dbarth_keyboard is on hold15:32
dbarth_i chatted about it a bit with mpt this morning15:32
klattimeryeah we need a better idea from the users15:32
tedgSo then what are we doing for Natty?  The AppIndicator ones still?15:32
klattimertedg: yeah atm15:32
tedgI thought they had a few bugs... do those need to be fixed?15:32
klattimeribus at least is working now15:32
klattimerwith gsd layout indicator I think we just need to work on the icon situation15:33
klattimernot sure how to get flags into a theme package at the moment though15:33
klattimerwe'll need to figure that out, but it should be easy15:33
dbarth_tedg: quickly, it's the result of the uds session; the designs (mpt's, klattimer's and even mccan) where not matching the expectations of the people we had in the room15:33
mptFixing the title icons can be done regardless of the rest of the design, though15:34
dbarth_we had people from different regions of the world, and the main use cases they helped us understand were, well different15:34
dbarth_mpt yes, there are a couple of elements that can be fixed, and can be targetted for natty15:34
tedgSo are we going to mail mpt to China for a few weeks?  :)15:34
dbarth_atm i see that more as a set of bug fixes, ie the workload is not at the same level as a merge/rewrite like was envisionned initially15:35
dbarth_tedg: you're kidding, but I feel we learned a lot during this session; at least i did15:36
dbarth_so ok, those 2 indicators are on the map now15:36
tedgYeah, I'm just concerned that we don't have a plan to solve it eventually.  If it needs to be redesign, sure, makes sense.  But we need a plan to get the expertise so that it can be redesigned.15:37
dbarth_tedg: the other thing i'm worried about is the appmenu-gtk / libappindicator code merge15:37
tedgFor the most part, assuming mpt is going home for Christmas, it's on his way ;)15:37
dbarth_since bratsche won't be available much to do it; something i had also in mind for karl15:37
klattimerdbarth_: its already on my list of things I've been asked to work on15:38
dbarth_but it's a major chunk and something i'd prefer you guys to talk about a bit more before we commit to doing it15:38
dbarth_klattimer: ah, that was already in the air15:38
dbarth_oh yes, mt was already around when we made that list15:38
tedgIt honestly should be "cut-and-paste" coding-wise.  But then it's just test, test, test, test :)15:38
dbarth_test is the keyword15:38
klattimertedg: that was what I was thinking too15:39
dbarth_and we know from maverick that tesdt is not easy here15:39
klattimerso I'll poke session bugs for the next few days, then move onto the merge after?15:39
dbarth_klattimer: session bugs i think can wait a bit15:39
tedgklattimer, It'd be good to start looking at datetime as well, that's a reasonably large development task.15:39
tedgklattimer, Make sure that you're comfortable with the design.15:40
klattimerso guys, which one first?15:40
dbarth_you also have that im-context thing at the moment on your plate15:40
klattimerdbarth_: true15:40
mpttedg! You're awake!15:40
dbarth_so i'd suggest not taking too much at the same time15:40
dbarth_well, maybe another small feature or list of bugs; and im-context (the bigger dev. task)15:40
tedgklattimer, The one thing that I haven't figured out is how to make the backends "plugable" in that it'd be nice if we provided an easy way for Akanadi support.  It may just have to be an #ifdef thing :-/15:40
klattimerdbarth_: getting the indicator code merged will let app developers fix their indicators15:40
dbarth_once the im thing is under control, you can take another big one; that'd be my recommendation15:40
klattimeras signalling click is a major issue for them15:40
tedgklattimer, Yeah, that's not as much merging the GTK parsing code.15:41
mpttedg, there are a few blueprints assigned to you that aren't approved or accepted, and I don't know who is supposed to do those things.15:41
dbarth_unless you get back on fire like the other day ;) in which case, i'll throw a couple more blueprints15:41
tedgmpt, Well, the only ones I'm assigned are the dbusmenu ones and indicator-messages.15:41
njpateldbarth_, can we drop mutter im context? and concentrate on natty?15:41
klattimerdbarth_: the other day was the end of a long drawn out fist fight with ibus, eventually he got tired and I managed to land a KO15:42
tedgklattimer, But, yes, we need that and another couple appindicator features as well.  I'm trying to prioritize those as early as possible, but I dont' think most appindicator developers are using dev releases...15:42
dbarth_njpatel: yeah, i think it's not a high prio; the only reason i was considering it was as a way to clear the ground and see what to do for natty15:42
klattimerunless I face an opponent as well trained at messing my day up as ibus15:42
klattimerit's mostly just getting it done15:42
dbarth_klattimer: ;)15:42
njpateldbarth_, i think they will differ enough that we could get away with just working on natty (i.e. writing the module loaders or just using gtk-im, if possible)15:43
njpatelklattimer, heh15:43
dbarth_right, let's try to conclude tomorrow on that15:43
dbarth_but i guess you're right15:43
mpttedg, you're also assigned to <https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-dx-n-indicator-application> and <https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-dx-n-indicator-datetime>.15:43
dbarth_mpt: datetime, not anymore15:43
dbarth_mpt: karl just got offered it15:44
tedgmpt, yes, datetime will be klattimer.  I imagine application will end up a group effort.15:44
tedgmpt, klattimer is doing the appmenu-gtk integration. for instance.15:44
tedgmpt, And I believe that kamstrup is doing the GDBus port, etc.15:44
seb128tedg, what application?15:46
klattimerseb128: indicator-application blue print15:46
dbarth_tedg: not sure for the gdbus port though15:47
mptstill shows tedg as Drafter and Assignee15:48
tedgmpt, We just decided like 20min ago -- give us some time :)15:49
dbarth_mpt: oh really15:57
dbarth_which one? datetime?15:57
dbarth_application menu however is not updated, right16:01
mptdbarth_, https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-dx-n-indicator-application16:02
tedgkenvandine, Seems that I can't create a new Facebook account with the new Gwibber.  Gets to a page saying "SUCCESS" but doesn't do anything after that.16:18
kklimondatedg: could you take a look at bug 673302 ?16:21
ubot5Launchpad bug 673302 in appmenu-gtk (Ubuntu) "appmenu-gtk breaks dynamically created Emacs Gtk+ menus (affected: 6, heat: 40)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/67330216:21
kenvandinetedg, that is the facebook allocation problem16:21
kenvandinetedg, i promise i will make that work better when that fails... soon16:22
kklimondatedg: can I for example disable appmenu integration for emacs?16:22
tedgkenvandine, Ah, okay, even with the latest?16:23
kenvandinetedg, until more people get the update in lucid and maverick16:23
tedgkklimonda, Yeah, you just can do UBUNTU_MENU_PROXY= emacs16:23
tedgkenvandine, Can I have your magic API key that works ;)16:24
kenvandinetheir are versions in -proposed for lucid and maverick now that fixes it... :)16:24
kenvandinetedg, i would rather you suffer until you rename indicator-*16:24
kenvandinemy personal vengeance16:24
tedgThis is the funny thing.  Half the people complain when you name things explanatory names -- the other half complain when you name things fun names.16:25
tedgHmm, Kaleo isn't in this channel.  You two should have a death match.16:25
kenvandinei am fine with the names now... but i do still get confused sometimes16:26
kenvandineit's just too many packages with similar names16:26
kenvandinelike i would prefer me-indicator, messages-indicator, etc16:26
kenvandinestill descriptive :)16:26
tedgShouldn't it be broadest category to more specific?  Eh?  Like com.ubuntu.indicator.messages ?16:27
=== bratsche is now known as bratsche-afk
=== oubiwann is now known as oubiwann-away
=== oubiwann-away is now known as oubiwann
=== bratsche-afk is now known as bratsche

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