=== danilo_ is now known as danilos
=== salgado is now known as salgado-physio
=== mrevell is now known as mrevell-lunch
=== Ursinha-dinner is now known as Ursinha
bacLaunchpad Reviewers meeting now at 1500UTC -- one hour later13:51
=== salgado-physio is now known as salgado
=== mrevell-lunch is now known as mrevell
gary_posterapologies, bac, at sprint14:59
gary_posteror training, or whatever it is15:00
danilosbac, I am only going to lurk, sorry15:00
MootBotbac, There is already a meeting in progress.15:00
* gary_poster chuckles15:00
bacWho is here today at our new Bat Time?15:00
jelmerme, but I'm also browsing through my dictionary to find out what "Bat Time" means :-)15:01
abentleyjelmer: Reference to 60's batman show.15:01
benjijelmer: http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=same%20bat-time%2C%20same%20bat-channel15:01
jelmerabentley, abentley: ah, heh :-) Thanks15:02
* deryck sings nah nah nah nah Bat----man!15:02
benjideryck: ha!15:02
bactopic - Agenda15:02
sinzuiThe Green Hornet was cooler15:02
bac* Roll call15:02
bac * Agenda15:02
bac * Outstanding actions15:02
bac * Mentat update.15:02
bac   * Salgado (ui)15:02
bac   * StevenK (code)15:02
bac * New items15:02
bac   * Benji joins code review team mentored by EdwinGrubbs.15:02
bac   * jcsackett becomes a mentat (sinzui)15:02
bac * Peanut gallery15:02
bac*  Sinzui to investigate making lint check for the Storm 'in' gotcha15:03
bacsinzui: progress?15:03
sinzuiNo, fix, but I did make progress. I removed two of the false reports in our code15:03
sinzuioh, pocket-lint will be in natty15:04
bacthat's good sinzui15:04
bac* bac to work with mars regarding a slow introduction of new reviewer points regarding the ArchitectureGuide. (undone)15:04
bacas it says, i've not done this.  i'll try to get up with mars and get action on that one.15:05
bactopic - time change15:05
bacglad everyone got the email.  i hope this time works.  i heard no complaints.15:05
bac* Mentat update.15:06
bac   * Salgado (ui)15:06
bac   * StevenK (code)15:06
bachow's it going salgado?15:06
salgadoafter some time without any UI reviews, last week I did some15:06
salgadoit's going fine with me15:06
bacthe last time i checked with stevenk he was still having a hard time getting enough reviews to do.  i'll find out later if that is still the case.15:08
bac  New items15:08
bac   * Benji joins code review team mentored by EdwinGrubbs.15:08
bacthanks for starting the process benji.  and thanks EdwinGrubbs for mentoring15:09
bac* jcsackett becomes a mentat (sinzui)15:09
bacjcsackett: do you have a mentor?15:10
jcsackettsinzui, i believe.15:10
sinzuiI will mentor15:10
bacso when these guys finish up we'll have all canonical lp devs as mentors again15:11
bacer, reviewers15:11
sinzuiI think mister wgrant could start reviewer training when he starts15:12
bacperhaps we should give him a week to get settled15:12
sinzuiThen I will have some small satisfaction that my nomination was accepted, though it took almost a year15:12
jelmerhe's already been doing some very good post-merge reviews :-)15:12
sinzuibac: why? he already has rf setup15:13
bactopic - other stuff.  anyone have anything?15:13
sinzuiI have an apology to make to the bugs team15:13
* allenap is puzzled15:14
sinzuiI thought the death to all doctests mantra at Prague was crazy, but I just read the bug stories and doctests yesterday I now understand you need to kill kill kill15:14
bigjoolsand theirs are even better than soyuz... go figure15:15
deryckthanks for saying so sinzui!  I've felt I must be crazy that no one sees the insanity I see.15:15
allenapYeah, don't read those doctests.15:15
* jtv reviewed doctest changes today and is still trying to stem the bleeding15:16
sinzuibigjools, soyuz has lots of unittests I can extend. I just delete the contradicting doctest.15:16
deryckwe've made some good progress in the last few months converting to unit tests, but it's taking some time.15:16
deryckstill much to do15:16
bigjoolsbut the hideousness runs deep15:16
bigjoolsI did get rid of my most hated doctest recently.  It felt reeeeeal good.15:17
sinzuiIf I report 50 bugs about doctests, do we get to close them during the bugjam15:18
bacanything else but kvetching about doctests (which is a fine thing to do)?15:18
jtvWell one thing here15:18
bacthe chair recognizes the gentleman from BKK15:19
jtvI see lots and lots of code slip by reviewers that shouldn't.15:19
jtvAre we still instilling and reinforcing the habits that we expect everyone to stick to by themselves?15:19
jtvCoding standards mostly.  Today I saw an import in the wrong place for no reason, an empty docstring, etc.—and that's without looking at very much.15:20
abentleyjtv: I am close to being able to track a line of code back to the review where it was approved.15:21
jtvWell I'm not _really_ looking to hunt down & beat up the reviewers; I just say that.15:22
jtvAlthough that is a cool capability, I must say.15:22
bacjtv: you found these problems in the tree or in a review?15:22
jtvBoth, for today's cases.15:22
jtvOf course there were dozens of other little gotchas in the tree.15:23
sinzuiI think automated changes cause these issues. I have seen a lot bad style in our modules that I attribute to changes made after the review, such as requests to clean up a name in the whole tree.15:23
jtvWhat stings is that most of them are recent.15:23
jtvSome of that, too, yes.15:23
jtvAlso I think "make lint" no longer tracks down committed-but-unlanded changes?15:24
abentleyjtv: IME it does.15:25
bacif all changes are committed 'make lint' does the right thing, i think.15:25
* jtv will watch it more closely15:25
abentleyjtv: If there are any uncommitted changes, it just lints those.15:25
jtvThat's what it used to do; I just noticed an unexpected "no changes detected."15:25
jtvOn a branch that was unlanded and full of goodies, of course.15:25
abentleyjtv: But if all changes are committed make lint should lint all changes.15:26
jtvYes, that's what I thought.  I'll keep an eye out.15:26
sinzuijtv, make lint does commit changes that differ from parent15:26
jtvThe parent in this case was not one of the usual ones, I think.  Maybe that caused it.15:27
bacjtv: if you find code that has been landed that is clearly a problem i think we should discuss it with the reviewer, just so he'll be aware of what was missed or to determine if it happened post review.15:27
bacif you'd rather not have that conversation i'll be glad to do it.15:28
jtvFair enough.  I just got the impression that there's a gap between the speed/thoroughness tradeoffs I like and the ones the team as a whole has evolved to.15:28
bacnot finger pointing but for learning.15:28
jtvYes, that's important—the baseball bat was just a joke.15:28
bacis there anything else to discuss today?15:29
* jtv sits down15:30
bacthanks for coming15:30
MootBotMeeting finished at 09:30.15:30
abentleyjtv: FYI bzr log -r mainline:annotate:$FILENAME:$LINENO will find the revision where the line was merged into trunk.15:31
jtvthanks bac15:31
jtvabentley: cool!  Thanks.15:31
abentleyjtv: Now we just need to be able to find merge proposals according to revision id.15:31
jtvabentley: can't find "annotate" in "bzr help revisionspec"… where do I read more about it?15:32
abentleyjtv: it was added recently.  You'll need a newer bzr.15:33
jtvah, the ol' rat race15:33
* jtv used to watch version numbers avidly, once upon a time15:33
=== benji is now known as benji-lunch
=== benji-lunch is now known as benji
=== EdwinGrubbs is now known as Edwin-lunch
=== Edwin-lunch is now known as EdwinGrubbs
=== salgado is now known as salgado-afk
=== Ursinha is now known as Ursinha-bbk
=== Ursinha-bbk is now known as Ursinha-bbl

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