| hajour | o and thanks for the answer dutchie | 00:07 |
|---|---|---|
| hajour | hai all | 12:03 |
| charlie-tca | Pendulum, if you don't mind, you appear to be stuck with me for a while | 20:22 |
| Pendulum | charlie-tca: I want you around. | 20:22 |
| charlie-tca | Great! got to much to try and get done to go away | 20:23 |
| Pendulum | charlie-tca: you're important for this project and that e-mail was not about you in particular. It was that the way things were happening weren't working and finding a better way | 20:23 |
| Pendulum | and obviously something happened since alejandra has now e-mailed with a mock up for trying to fix the website design | 20:24 |
| charlie-tca | Yeah, I read it again. I am really frustrated with the websites. It really gets to me when my eyes start fading again. | 20:24 |
| charlie-tca | Maybe did a teeny bit of good, too. | 20:25 |
| AlanBell | totally understandable | 20:25 |
| Pendulum | I understand. I'm hoping that there's now a compromise that will work | 20:25 |
| AlanBell | and I think we are moving to a better working relationship with the design team and web team | 20:25 |
| AlanBell | partly as a result of kicking up a bit of a fuss | 20:25 |
| Pendulum | yeah | 20:25 |
| charlie-tca | Just seems a little(or a lot) wrong that the website team keeps saying the design team is responsible, but they won't be told anything is wrong... | 20:26 |
| AlanBell | it is, which is what happened on saturday | 20:26 |
| charlie-tca | heh, then it is okay | 20:27 |
| Pendulum | charlie-tca: one of the reasons I copied as many people as I did on that e-mail was because I wanted jono and the design team to be aware that the LD and website people were not being helpful | 20:27 |
| Pendulum | or were being helpful in limited ways | 20:28 |
| AlanBell | but now we have demanded their attention we have to concentrate on building that better working relationship | 20:28 |
| Pendulum | yeah | 20:28 |
| charlie-tca | Agreed. That's why I got to keep quiet on it | 20:28 |
| charlie-tca | I'm all for AlanBell or phillw to take the thing | 20:28 |
| Pendulum | *nods* | 20:29 |
| UndiFineD | well aint that an easy excuse, someone else is responsible, i thought people should think for themselves ... | 20:29 |
| charlie-tca | What? me letting go? | 20:30 |
| UndiFineD | "the website team keeps saying the design team is responsible" | 20:30 |
| charlie-tca | Oh, that. Yeah | 20:30 |
| AlanBell | UndiFineD: yes, and now we understand what they actually meant by that | 20:30 |
| AlanBell | I asked phillw to join the channel | 20:31 |
| UndiFineD | hajour will be back online later, I had to re-install the eepc, this time fullblown ubuntu, which is eassier for config | 20:31 |
| UndiFineD | me and phill get along well :) | 20:32 |
| charlie-tca | Well, I kicked the ball as hard as I dared. | 20:32 |
| UndiFineD | hey phillw :) | 20:32 |
| charlie-tca | Hello, phillw | 20:32 |
| phillw | appears as summonsed, I'm good like that :P | 20:32 |
| Pendulum | hi phillw :) | 20:34 |
| AlanBell | o/ | 20:34 |
| charlie-tca | We were discussing the website and design team stuff | 20:34 |
| phillw | In response to the email, I was thinking of grabbing AlanBell tonight and asking if he wished to be 1st point of contact. We are both UK based | 20:34 |
| UndiFineD | oh, me and hajour did a lot of work on personas together ... might want to check it out | 20:34 |
| AlanBell | I am happy either way | 20:35 |
| AlanBell | UndiFineD: awesome! | 20:35 |
| phillw | hiyas UndiFineD, we'll have to stop meeting like this, people will talk :D | 20:35 |
| charlie-tca | phillw, as long as it is not me | 20:35 |
| phillw | hiyas charlie-tca and Pendulum | 20:35 |
| UndiFineD | shht phillw | 20:35 |
| * AlanBell wonders off for food | 20:35 | |
| phillw | UndiFineD: that'd be really good, as the accessify forum is really interested in how ubuntu is driving forwards. | 20:36 |
| phillw | I know I'm not that active on the mailing list, but I do follow avidly what is going on and have another convert to coding sites to AAA standards which is always good :) | 20:37 |
| UndiFineD | we did some work in hajour her pages, based on personal experiances: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/hajour and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/hajour/accessibility | 20:38 |
| Pendulum | I really should use the forums :-/ | 20:39 |
| UndiFineD | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/hajour/accesibility | 20:39 |
| Pendulum | I just have only so many methods of communication that I can handle at once | 20:39 |
| UndiFineD | missing an S i see | 20:39 |
| Pendulum | phillw: I'm happy with either of you so the two of you can duke it out ;-) Just please copy me on related e-mails to the design team, etc. if you can? | 20:40 |
| phillw | Pendulum: we will, myself and AlanBell already know eachother so it's hardly going to be a fight to the death :) | 20:42 |
| * charlie-tca thinks that would be good. We need both people | 20:44 | |
| Pendulum | yeah | 20:46 |
| UndiFineD | heh | 20:46 |
| phillw | charlie-tca: we already liase across another project, or two. So you'd get two for the price of one :P | 20:47 |
| Pendulum | phillw: btw, if you didn't know, I'm Penelope :) | 20:47 |
| phillw | Pendulum: I guessed :P | 20:47 |
| Pendulum | (I get confused between people often and have spent my day fighting on medical stuff so my brain isn't working anyway) | 20:47 |
| charlie-tca | sorry, Pendulum. I know that one well, too | 20:49 |
| phillw | I am always here to help in any way I can, I quietly (and some times loudly) champion accessibilty, it is something I very strongly believe in. | 20:49 |
| phillw | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/phillw#Accessibilty | 20:49 |
| charlie-tca | I might get a little loud, too, now and then. | 20:50 |
| Pendulum | charlie-tca: you'll love this, my insurance is currently approving a week of PT at a time | 20:50 |
| charlie-tca | you | 20:50 |
| charlie-tca | you're kidding! :-( | 20:50 |
| Pendulum | nope | 20:51 |
| Pendulum | they approved 3 visits initially | 20:51 |
| Pendulum | so last tuesday I had to fill out another survey for them | 20:51 |
| Pendulum | they've approved another 2 visits | 20:51 |
| charlie-tca | Hard to believe. but then, mine approved two visits initially, then I had to reapply monthly | 20:51 |
| Pendulum | so this thursday I'll fill out another one | 20:51 |
| Pendulum | to make it worse, if I don't show improvement, they'll deny | 20:52 |
| Pendulum | even after 3 visits | 20:52 |
| Pendulum | (went through that with different PT over the summer) | 20:52 |
| charlie-tca | yup, improvement is all that matters, isn't it? | 20:52 |
| charlie-tca | doesn | 20:52 |
| Pendulum | heh | 20:52 |
| charlie-tca | doesn't occur to them the progress might be slow and take time to show | 20:52 |
| Pendulum | I love that for my genetic condition I'm supposed to magically improve in 3 visits, one of which was an eval with no treatment | 20:53 |
| Pendulum | so I tell them I'm improving whether I am or not | 20:53 |
| charlie-tca | You have to. It's the only way to keep things going, sometimes. | 20:54 |
| Pendulum | and working with the therapist to get stuff I can do at home or in any pool so that when insurance stops improving it's not a disaster | 20:54 |
| Pendulum | *approving | 20:54 |
| Pendulum | but I have an insurance where doctor's offices see it and cringe | 20:54 |
| charlie-tca | I had a total of 6 months last time my legs went. It took about 4 years to get them fully working. | 20:55 |
| Pendulum | from what I can tell it covers about the same as medicaid (possibly a little less) with much higher copays | 20:55 |
| charlie-tca | That hurts, too | 20:55 |
| Pendulum | yeah | 20:55 |
| charlie-tca | I did try doing some of the stuff without filing the insurance claims. They charge me about twice what they charge the insurance | 20:56 |
| Pendulum | I pay $50/visit for PT. which is admittedly a lot better than the $300/visit I'd probably be paying out of pocket | 20:58 |
| UndiFineD | what is PT ? | 20:58 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: physiotherapy | 20:59 |
| UndiFineD | oh | 20:59 |
| UndiFineD | :) | 20:59 |
| Pendulum | charlie-tca: what really gets me is that the insurance companies make deals with providers. So I'd get charge out of pocket about $300, I pay a copay of $50, and then it turns out the deal my insurance company has made means they only pay $30 | 21:00 |
| UndiFineD | do you have your a chance your health will improve Pendulum / charlie-tca | 21:00 |
| UndiFineD | ? | 21:00 |
| charlie-tca | I know, Pendulum. It is really frustrating. | 21:01 |
| charlie-tca | And then the insurance wants to know why you used it... | 21:01 |
| charlie-tca | UndiFineD, not here. Mine improved as much as it will. It is slowly going downhill now | 21:01 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: not hugely. I have a rare genetic condition called Ehlers Danlos Syndrome and it's a matter of trying to manage symptoms, but it probably will get worse ;) | 21:01 |
| UndiFineD | that aint good, sorry to hear | 21:02 |
| charlie-tca | you do the best you can while you can | 21:03 |
| Pendulum | tbh, the only things I really care about improving are pain and fatigue levels | 21:03 |
| charlie-tca | Pendulum, Have you been able to try modafinal for fatigue? | 21:03 |
| UndiFineD | pain and fatique are the worst indeed | 21:04 |
| Pendulum | charlie-tca: no. because no one is doing a good job of managing my meds right now | 21:04 |
| charlie-tca | It is probably the best drug out there for it. It does take monthly authorizations from the insurance company, though. | 21:04 |
| Pendulum | I'm not sure my insurance covers it at all, tbh | 21:04 |
| charlie-tca | I can make it through a normal day with 100mg a day, but it is still about $3 a pill, too | 21:05 |
| charlie-tca | as for the rest, the VA says, "what do you think will help?" and prescribes whatever I tell them :-( | 21:06 |
| Pendulum | heh | 21:06 |
| charlie-tca | I just don't know the right drugs and doses to even try | 21:06 |
| Pendulum | I've just had to fight to get any medication | 21:07 |
| Pendulum | since I spent so long undiagnosed | 21:07 |
| Pendulum | that the only doctor willing to treat my pain was my psychiatrist | 21:07 |
| UndiFineD | insurance deciding whether your allowed to get medicine ? that is crazy, it means one day they can say "just die already" | 21:07 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: the US healthcare system shouldn't have "care" in the name. and it's very messed up | 21:07 |
| charlie-tca | yup | 21:08 |
| Pendulum | so I'm now trying the pain clinic route, but we'll see | 21:08 |
| charlie-tca | My sister is doing that, too. Trigeminal Neuralgia for 10 years | 21:10 |
| Pendulum | unfortunately I maxed out on non-narcotics when I was about 18 | 21:10 |
| Pendulum | and no one likes putting someone my age on narcotics | 21:10 |
| charlie-tca | heh, they don't like putting someone my age on them. We have to push for it | 21:11 |
| charlie-tca | addictive, they said. | 21:11 |
| charlie-tca | my answer: takes the pain lower? addictive is better than not at all | 21:12 |
| charlie-tca | but, then you have to keep increasing the dose to maintain the effectiveness | 21:12 |
| maco | Pendulum: one of my cousins has the narcotics fight in hospital ERs regularly | 21:12 |
| Pendulum | charlie-tca: medical marijuana is my answer to how they should solve that problem. doesn't generally end up with the same levels of tolerance as narcotics do | 21:14 |
| charlie-tca | This is true too. Doesn't calif. have that now? | 21:15 |
| Pendulum | a bunch of states do | 21:15 |
| Pendulum | CA has for a while | 21:15 |
| Pendulum | sadly my state doesn't :( | 21:15 |
| charlie-tca | Oregon has it, Idaho does not | 21:15 |
| Pendulum | I'm actually on marinol, which works better for me than a narcotic but not as well as actual marijuana, but we never managed to actually get dosage that was perfect with it because we were worried about messing too much | 21:16 |
| UndiFineD | tried medicinal weed ? | 21:16 |
| charlie-tca | UndiFineD, not legal in many of the states here | 21:16 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: in the Netherlands yes, but not availible everywhere here (it's what we were just discussing) | 21:16 |
| UndiFineD | sometimes pot works better than morfine | 21:17 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: not the only reason I love Amsterdam, but I have to say I'm in better shape there than I am anywhere else these days ;-) | 21:17 |
| UndiFineD | move to another state / country perhaps ? | 21:22 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: if I could, I would | 21:25 |
| UndiFineD | hajour:my eepc crashed so can t come on my own chat. | 21:25 |
| UndiFineD | hajour:not my falt this time | 21:25 |
| Pendulum | UndiFineD: say hi to hajour for me :) | 21:25 |
| charlie-tca | Well, I better go try to natty again | 21:29 |
| UndiFineD | hajour: pendulum in 2008 i had a acute hernia.they have operate 3 days later.they have give me morfine a lot.but i needed more and more.my neighbour hath ms.she adviced me weet for the pain.i needed not mutch to ease my muscles | 21:29 |
| UndiFineD | hajour:they hat say i not was able to walk again. | 21:31 |
| UndiFineD | hajour:just proved my body is weird i think. because in about 10 months i walked again with no help | 21:32 |
| UndiFineD | hajour:but i think that the boss from your haeltcare must exsperiance the pain you have.lookwhat he have to say after that day | 21:34 |
| UndiFineD | hajour: Pendulum about the accessibility program | 21:35 |
| UndiFineD | hajour: What you think of the sugestions i have made? | 21:36 |
| UndiFineD | hajour: UndiFineD have help with the technical words and spelling | 21:37 |
| UndiFineD | good night charlie-tca | 21:39 |
| charlie-tca | good night, UndiFineD | 21:40 |
| UndiFineD | hajour: goodnight charlie-tca | 21:40 |
| charlie-tca | good night, hajour | 21:40 |
| UndiFineD | LOL hajour was mistaken by the word "natty" | 21:41 |
| UndiFineD | I explain | 21:41 |
| UndiFineD | hajour: thought you was going to sleep charlie-tca | 21:42 |
| charlie-tca | oh | 21:42 |
| charlie-tca | Sorry. I just have to try and fix Natty Narwhal | 21:43 |
| UndiFineD | hajour: sorry | 21:43 |
| charlie-tca | I broke it in three systems at the same time | 21:43 |
| UndiFineD | clusterssh ? | 21:43 |
| charlie-tca | no, three different installs, one on a p4 2.8GHz. One on VirtualBox and one on a amd64 | 21:44 |
| charlie-tca | and three different problems, too. I am good! | 21:44 |
| UndiFineD | bug triaging :) | 21:46 |
| UndiFineD | I should do some testing on natty myself soon too | 21:46 |
| charlie-tca | It isn't really working yet | 21:46 |
| UndiFineD | i use vm | 21:46 |
| UndiFineD | virtualbox | 21:47 |
| charlie-tca | yeah, me too. but with unity and compiz, VBox won't work for Ubuntu images | 21:48 |
| Pendulum | also, VM's don't generally do 3-D accelleration which means you can't test Unity on them | 22:06 |
| UndiFineD | my system does not do 3d at all | 22:07 |
| Pendulum | *nods* | 22:07 |
| charlie-tca | I bought an ATI video card so I can test natty | 22:07 |
| UndiFineD | compiz does work, for a bit, but the dual gpu setup is giving poor performance | 22:08 |
| UndiFineD | onboard bad ati does the rendering for an offboard good ati gpu | 22:08 |
| UndiFineD | onboard does not get turned off due to a hardware bug | 22:09 |
| UndiFineD | great to see duanedesign 's cli companion nearing release: helps for memory issues | 23:53 |
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