[06:21] <pitti> Good morning
[06:22] <pitti> vish: we'll ship LibO if possible; we should be getting an OO.o maintainer soon
[06:29] <TheMuso> 8Morning pitti.
[06:58] <pitti> robert_ancell: I'm about to merge libgweather, unless you already started with that?
[07:33] <didrocks> good morning
[07:33] <pitti> bonjour didrocks
[07:33] <pitti> didrocks: so, unity by default with last night's dist-upgrade :)
[07:34] <didrocks> hey pitti, how are you?
[07:34] <didrocks> nice! all went well? :)
[07:35] <pitti> yep, apparently
[07:35] <pitti> except that I now miss gtimelog and system-monitor :)
[07:35] <pitti> didrocks: how are you?
[07:39] <pitti> didrocks: gnome-panel and applets are still running, though; is that intended?
[07:39] <didrocks> pitti: I'm fine, thanks :)
[07:39] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, nm-applet has to run :)
[07:40] <didrocks> and we will postpone for A2 for the "smart session launch" as upstream is changing gnome-session (long long discussions… :))
[07:40] <pitti> didrocks: oh, what's the thing that I see on the unity panel?
[07:40] <pitti> looks like a network indicator
[07:40] <didrocks> the thing? :)
[07:40] <didrocks> I don't have it
[07:41] <didrocks> did I miss something? do you have a ppa?
[07:41] <didrocks> AFAIK, the nm indicator isn't NEWed
[07:41] <TheMuso> As someone who will still need GNOME for a little while, do I have to select a different session once I upgrade?
[07:42] <pitti> didrocks: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/unity-panel.png
[07:43] <didrocks> TheMuso: yeah, with latest gnome-session, you should get a ubuntu classic session in gdm
[07:43] <pitti> the thing that drives me mad is the global menu bar
[07:43] <pitti> it conceptually doesn't work with focus-follows-mouse
[07:43] <didrocks> pitti: talk to mpt about it, we argued for ages :)
[07:43] <didrocks> pitti: I'm surprized, maybe I should check my nm version
[07:43] <pitti> is it possible to disable global menu bar for this?
[07:44] <didrocks> apart from UBUNTU_MENUPROXY=0 at session starts, no
[07:44] <pitti> didrocks: I don't see an indicator process which sounds network-related
[07:44] <TheMuso> didrocks: Thanks, thought as much.
[07:44] <didrocks> design tells that you are a corner case pitti with follow on mouse :)
[07:45] <pitti> didrocks: !?!
[07:45] <didrocks> (focus following mouse)
[07:45] <pitti> 40 years of unix history is a corner case?
[07:45] <didrocks> I agree, that was even raised on ayatana mailing list
[07:45] <didrocks> (and yes, I used that on my unix in my previous job)
[07:45] <pitti> well, not your fault, sorry for venting
[07:46] <didrocks> no worry :)
[07:46] <didrocks> pitti: grrr, no new network-manager, don't know from where this indicators come
[07:46] <pitti> didrocks: info in the indicator thing says "nm-applet"
[07:47] <pitti> network-manager-applet (0.8.2+git.20101123t161608.f143e76-0ubuntu1) natty; urgen
[07:47] <pitti> cy=low
[07:47] <pitti>   * Now draw the applet and applet's menus using libappindicator.
[07:47] <didrocks> pitti: and network-manager-gnome ?
[07:47] <pitti>     - add debian/patches/nm-applet-use-indicator.patch
[07:47] <didrocks> ah
[07:47] <pitti> didrocks: (-applet is the source for -gnome)
[07:47] <didrocks> ok, maybe I'm not up-to-date for that one
[07:48] <didrocks> grub is breaking my nvidia card, so I don't dist-upgrade but cherry-pick
[07:48] <pitti> didrocks: but I figure having a running panel is important for something else: Alt+F2 :)
[07:48] <pitti> which currently seems to be the only way to actually launch programs, aside from terminals
[07:49] <pitti> since there's no overlay yet
[07:49] <pitti> (at least I don't have it, I just have the launcher bar)
[07:49] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, njpatel wants to make it for A2, but the panel is crashing a lot of applets… so not sure what we should do
[07:49] <didrocks> in any, we either:
[07:49] <didrocks>  - remove it, forget it and "sorry" for nvidia user for A1
[07:50] <pitti> I don't think it actively hurts for a1
[07:50] <didrocks> - let it there : alt+F2 ok but crash for everyone at start with the applets
[07:50] <pitti> it's just resource waste, but at least keeps alt+F2
[07:50] <didrocks> ok, let's keep that way then
[07:50] <pitti> didrocks: right, I noticed the applets crashes, too
[07:50] <didrocks> yeah, I think that's because their X window is hidden at start
[07:50] <didrocks> particularly for the systray
[07:51] <didrocks> ok, so gnome-session will soon have the bits we need to have a nice detection system for A2 :)
[07:51] <didrocks> also, for boot speed, we thought about launching the detection module during gdm and touch some file for result
[07:52] <pitti> didrocks: oh, so we'll split out the detection after all?
[07:53] <didrocks> pitti: right, I discussed that with dbarth yesterday in some extends and we still discuss a little this morning, but I think we found a way that is interesting for the distro and for upstream
[07:53] <didrocks> so, we will discare the --replace case
[07:53] <didrocks> (as GNOME will discare it as well)
[07:54] <didrocks> and also the case where someone add/remove the unity plugin
[07:59] <pitti> bryceh, dbarth, didrocks, kenvandine, Laney, RAOF, robert_ancell, TheMuso: you still have a couple of alpha-1 WIs; can you please check if some of them were done, and move the rest to alpha-2?
[08:00] <TheMuso> pitti: Sure.
[08:00] <didrocks> pitti: already on them, I think banshee will be postponed as there is no MIR reviewed yet
[08:00] <pitti> didrocks: sounds fine
[08:01] <didrocks> and the other one, we just discussed it :)
[08:04] <didrocks> pitti: I can simply remove gnome-panel only in the ubuntu desktop session btw, (and don't impact gnome-classic with the gconf path trick), maybe it's better than having the crashes?
[08:04] <didrocks> and yeah, you will loose alt + F2 :)
[08:05] <didrocks> (got the indicator here as well, working fine for the general case)
[08:05] <pitti> didrocks: hm, tricky; I wouldn't mind to not start panel for a
[08:05] <pitti> a1
[08:06] <pitti> didrocks: it's still pretty "crippled" anyway
[08:06] <pitti> but it would better test how the system is standing on its own without the panel
[08:06] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, for instance, we can have pager conflicts and the application minimizing effect to the wrong pager
[08:06] <didrocks> so, maybe better to remove it
[08:07] <didrocks> that will just tell "sorry for nvidia driver and for those not having acceleration or dist-upgrading with wm != {gnomewm,compiz}"
[08:07] <didrocks> but I think it just needs documentation on the release note
[08:08] <TheMuso> pitti: Done thanks for the heads up.
[08:08] <pitti> TheMuso: cheers!
[08:10] <dbarth> pitti: sure
[08:14] <vish> pitti: thanks.  when would we decide(which milestone) finally whether we ship LibO or not?
[08:15] <pitti> vish: before FF in any case
[08:15] <vish> ah, ak.. :)
[08:15] <vish> ok*
[08:15] <pitti> vish: right now the delta between OO.o and LibO isn't so huge yet, so from an end user's POV it shouldn't look too different
[08:16]  * vish nods..
[09:02] <rodrigo_> morning
[09:28] <seb128> hey
[09:28] <rodrigo_> hi seb128
[09:29] <seb128> hey rodrigo_
[09:29] <seb128> how are you?
[09:29] <rodrigo_> fine, and you?
[09:31] <seb128> rodrigo_, I'm fine thanks
[09:31] <seb128> didrocks, lut
[09:31] <didrocks> seb128: salut
[09:32] <seb128> didrocks, so the classic desktop session is not so great
[09:32] <didrocks> seb128: why?
[09:32] <seb128> I got applet crashing at start like under unity yesterday
[09:32] <seb128> it doesn't respect my keybindings
[09:32] <didrocks> seb128: do you have the latest compiz?
[09:32] <seb128> the workspace layout got reset to the default one
[09:32] <seb128> dunno what you did since I went to bed
[09:32] <seb128> let me check what is the latest
[09:32] <seb128> I've the same versions than yesterday when we discussed
[09:33] <didrocks> seb128: well, you removed the gconf settings, so your default worskpace layout is set
[09:33] <didrocks> seb128: so, it's normal you don't have the keybinding, same version, same bug :)
[09:33] <didrocks> for the ws layout, you resetted gconf yesterday
[09:34] <seb128> right
[09:34] <didrocks> so the "default profile" has no data
[09:34] <seb128> well issues is that the wnck applet has 0 by 0 in its combo
[09:34] <seb128> but it could be a compiz 0.9 issue
[09:34] <didrocks> oh?
[09:34] <didrocks> that's weird
[09:34] <seb128> I didn't try to change my layout since I upgraded I think
[09:34] <seb128> didrocks, well the applet has the correct layout
[09:34] <seb128> it's just the properties dialog which is buggy
[09:35] <seb128> changing values there doesn't work either
[09:35] <didrocks> yes, I've already warned you about that :)
[09:35] <didrocks> it's a compiz bug
[09:35] <seb128> ok
[09:35] <didrocks> so upgrade to latest version
[09:35] <seb128> the fix from yesterday you did fix the keybindings imports as well?
[09:35] <didrocks> you should have your keybindings back
[09:35] <seb128> or just the capplet?
[09:36] <seb128> the xml matching so the capplet display those entries
[09:36] <seb128> ok
[09:36] <didrocks> it should work with the import as it will be recognized
[09:36] <didrocks> not sure if you have to reset your profile
[09:38] <seb128> ok, let me upgrade and try
[09:39] <pitti> hey seb128, how are you?
[09:40] <seb128> hey pitti
[09:40] <seb128> I'm fine thanks
[09:40] <seb128> how are you?
[09:40] <pitti> I'm great, thanks!
[09:40] <pitti> mvo: guten Morgen
[09:41] <pitti> mvo: sorry about the defer reject, I only looked at the debian/ dir in the branch yesterday
[09:41] <mvo> hey pitti
[09:41] <mvo> no worries
[10:18] <pitti> didrocks: hm, I think we shold disable the gnome-panel under unity; I just booted today's daily and it looks pretty horrible
[10:18] <pitti> about 5 crashes at start, and the rather defect gnome-panel sits on top of the unity panel
[10:20] <didrocks> pitti: yeah, will do that once the meeting is finished
[10:22] <didrocks> ok, back :)
[10:23]  * pitti hugs didrocks
[10:24]  * didrocks hugs pitti back
[10:25] <rodrigo_> :)
[10:25]  * pitti hugs rodrigo_ as well, how are you?
[10:26] <rodrigo_> cool, I was feeling alone without being huged :)
[10:26] <rodrigo_> pitti, fine thanks, and you?
[10:26] <pitti> swearing at kvm, but otherwise fine, thanks!
[10:26] <rodrigo_> heh
[10:27] <didrocks> hey rodrigo_ :)
[10:27] <rodrigo_> hi didrocks
[10:50] <seb128> re
[10:51] <didrocks> hey seb128!
[10:51] <chrisccoulson> flying visit!
[10:51] <didrocks> :)
[10:51] <chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
[10:51] <didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
[10:52] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - good thanks. i'll be better once i can get thunderbird to build ;)
[10:52] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: and you want to as a default? :p
[10:52] <didrocks> (kidding)
[10:53] <seb128> didrocks, re
[10:54] <didrocks> seb128: re
[10:54] <bilalakhtar> didrocks: Just installed natty, and saw your great work with Unity
[10:54] <didrocks> bilalakhtar: well, unity is more dx work TBH :)
[10:55] <chrisccoulson> hi seb128!
[10:57] <seb128> hey chrisccoulson
[10:57] <seb128> I just wasted an hour trying to figure why the applets crash half of the time on session start with unity ang gnome-panel
[10:58] <bilalakhtar> seb128: same thing here
[10:58] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, you figured it out? i get that too
[10:58] <pitti> seb128: can they even appear on two panels at the same time?
[10:58] <pitti> it's the indicators, not the applets, right?
[10:58] <seb128> pitti, unity has no applets
[10:58] <chrisccoulson> and compiz crashes on start too
[10:58] <didrocks> well, as said, this was forced as we didn't have any indicator for network
[10:58] <didrocks> but now, I remove gnome-panel
[10:59] <seb128> didrocks, well I've gnome-panel issues in the classic session as well
[10:59] <didrocks> well…
[10:59] <didrocks> seb128: not sure for that one
[10:59] <didrocks> ok, restarting session…
[10:59] <seb128> chrisccoulson, compiz crashes when I click on of the applet crash dialogs
[10:59] <seb128> same for you I guess?
[11:00] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i think so
[11:00] <seb128> njpatel, is unity supposed to indicate running applications or focussed applications with the small triangle at the right of launchers?
[11:00] <seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, same here
[11:00] <njpatel> seb128, focused applications
[11:01] <seb128> njpatel, ok thanks
[11:01] <njpatel> running applications have color behind their icons
[11:01] <seb128> gotcha
[11:02] <didrocks> seb128: tried again and reloading them doesn't crash compiz there
[11:02] <seb128> njpatel, btw do you guys need pings on IRC for merge request reviews?
[11:02] <seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson has the same issue than me
[11:02] <didrocks> maybe driver related…
[11:02] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i think it's the same issue. i got lots of applet crash dialogs, and when i closed them all, i realised i had no window borders any more
[11:02] <seb128> njpatel, I've sent a trivial dee one last week to fix the build on natty
[11:02] <chrisccoulson> so, i guess it's the same issue
[11:03] <seb128> njpatel, but no review so far, I'm wondering if I did something wrong
[11:03] <seb128> njpatel, the unity team is subscribed for review
[11:03] <chrisccoulson> and Xorg keeps using 100% CPU after a few hours too. my laptop was roasting hot this morning when i woke up ;)
[11:03] <didrocks> restarting in gnome-classic session with a clean profile
[11:03] <seb128> chrisccoulson, what driver do you use?
[11:03] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - i915
[11:03] <seb128> ok, so intel as well
[11:04] <njpatel> seb128, maybe ask kamstrup to take a look?
[11:04] <seb128> njpatel, ok, so IRC pings are required, thanks ;-)
[11:04] <chrisccoulson> oh no, i've ran out of coffee
[11:04] <seb128> njpatel,  I'm fine with that but we should be careful to not ignore contributors who don't know who to ping on IRC
[11:05] <chrisccoulson> and my gf is at her parents house, with the car!
[11:05] <seb128> chrisccoulson, lol
[11:05] <chrisccoulson> and it's too cold to walk to the supermarket ;)
[11:05] <njpatel> seb128, it's not about ignoring seb128, it's obviously just slipped through
[11:05] <njpatel> seb128, that happens to all projects :)
[11:05] <seb128> njpatel, well as a contributor I feel like my first contribution got ignored which makes we not want to come back :p
[11:06] <didrocks> ok, the applets are crashing in gnome-classic… not sure if it's compiz related or not, trying with metacity
[11:06] <seb128> njpatel, joke aside I just wanted to check what works better for you guys to document it on the wiki
[11:06] <njpatel> yeah, kamstrup is on a call with me right now, will ping him afterwards
[11:12] <bilalakhtar> didrocks: FYI if I re-add the applets, it works
[11:12] <didrocks> bilalakhtar: not sure what's the issue is, I'll make some tries
[11:12] <seb128> in the unity session clicking on reload makes compiz crash there
[11:13] <bilalakhtar> didrocks: BTW, 'menu bar becoming blank' is a known issue in unity or not?
[11:13] <bilalakhtar> I can't find a bug
[11:13] <seb128> how blank?
[11:13] <didrocks> bilalakhtar: someone mentionned it on an unrelated bug, so please, open one
[11:13] <seb128> you mean if ie firefox is focussed?
[11:13] <didrocks> bilalakhtar: with lspci and such
[11:13] <bilalakhtar> okay
[11:13] <bilalakhtar> seb128: no, occurs with every app, even gnome-terminal and nautilus
[11:13] <seb128> dunno then
[11:13] <bilalakhtar> seb128: http://people.ubuntu.com/~bilalakhtar/Screenshot_natty.png
[11:15] <seb128> rodrigo_, ok, I'm done with unity playing for a bit, I will do sponsoring now
[11:16] <seb128> rodrigo_, do you have something else than gnome-panel and gnome-applets?
[11:26] <didrocks> so, the crash is compiz related
[11:26] <didrocks> very clear when you set your windowmanager to metacity, I tried 5 boots without any crash
[11:26] <didrocks> I tried to deactivate the latest plugins I added: fade and animation, I still get some crashes
[11:30] <chrisccoulson> is everybody else using unity now then?
[11:31] <seb128> sort of, I switch between them
[11:31] <pitti> I did for a while ,but switched back now
[11:31] <pitti> focus-follows-mouse and appmenu just don't go together
[11:32] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that's my main reason for going back too
[11:32] <seb128> it creates flickering?
[11:32] <chrisccoulson> focus-follows-mouse and dual screen make it completely unusable ;)
[11:32] <didrocks> seb128: for appmenu
[11:32] <pitti> no, it's impossible to catch the menu for the app you actually want
[11:32] <seb128> oh, right
[11:32] <chrisccoulson> yeah, that's my problem too
[11:32] <seb128> uninstall appmenu-gtk?
[11:33] <pitti> because while you move the mose, the menu switches to nautilus' or gnome-terminal's
[11:33] <chrisccoulson> yeah, i might do. i'm not losing focus-follows-mouse ;)
[11:33] <seb128> without appmenu-gtk you should just go back to normal menus
[11:34] <pitti> that seems a nice package to file a bug against
[11:34] <chrisccoulson> can unity not turn off the menu in configurations where it's not appropriate? i think the menu really shouldn't be displayed on my setup at all
[11:35] <chrisccoulson> having to move to the other screen to open the menu is not good
[11:35] <chrisccoulson> i have to move my hand half way across my desk ;)
[11:35] <seb128> pitti, I think there is one about focus follows mouse open
[11:36] <seb128> chrisccoulson, open a bug on unity about that
[11:36] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, will do
[11:36] <seb128> that's the sort of feedback which is useful since it targets the desktop this cycle
[11:40] <rodrigo_> seb128, yes -> the 5 first branches at https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya
[11:40] <rodrigo_> :)
[11:43] <chrisccoulson> pitti - i found bug 674138 and subscribed you to it
[11:43] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 674138 in unity ""Global" appmenu breaks sloppy focus (affects: 7) (heat: 38)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/674138
[11:43] <seb128> rodrigo_, ok ;-)
[11:43] <didrocks> ok, I think I got it
[11:43] <seb128> rodrigo_, could you just put a commit id or bug reference in the gnome-panel patch?
[11:43] <seb128> rodrigo_, we try to enforce the tagging policy nowadays ;-)
[11:44] <rodrigo_> seb128, which tagging policy?
[11:44] <didrocks> so, there are multiple bugs
[11:44] <rodrigo_> seb128, ah, ok
[11:44] <didrocks> seb128: can you file the bug you get (and that I don't reproduce) when clicking on "reloading", it crashes compiz?
[11:44] <seb128> rodrigo_, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/PatchTaggingGuidelines
[11:44] <didrocks> then, the crashing applets seems to be a compiz bug when gnome-panel has its starting animation
[11:45] <seb128> didrocks, well done
[11:45] <didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
[11:45] <didrocks> seb128: I would apprecitate that you confirm it if possible
[11:45] <didrocks> appreciate*
[11:45] <seb128> didrocks, I will open a bug about the crash
[11:45] <didrocks> I tried 5 restarts
[11:45] <seb128> didrocks, how do I turn the animation off?
[11:45] <didrocks> and don't get anymore crash
[11:45] <didrocks> ok, that's where it will be tricky packaging side
[11:45] <didrocks> it's part of the generated gnome-panel gconf keys
[11:45] <didrocks> one sec
[11:47] <didrocks> seb128: /apps/panel/toplevels/top_panel_screen0/enable_animations
[11:47] <didrocks> and same for bottom_panel…
[11:47] <didrocks> (/apps/panel/global/enable_animations doesn't work as a master key)
[11:49] <seb128> didrocks, ok
[11:49] <seb128> didrocks, i've a phone interview in 10 minutes and I need to get ready for it
[11:49] <seb128> but I will test that after it
[11:49] <seb128> well I set the key but I don't want to start restarting my session now
[11:50] <didrocks> seb128: sure, thanks a lot :)
[11:50] <didrocks> seb128: just one question, on the keybindings: all is ok after the upgrade?
[11:50] <seb128> thank to you!
[11:51] <rodrigo_> seb128, pushed the tagging in the patch
[11:51] <seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
[11:51] <seb128> I will do the sponsoring after this phone call
[11:52] <rodrigo_> ok thanks
[11:55] <seb128> hum, just crashed compiz by scrolling in evince
[11:57] <seb128> this new compiz is crash land
[11:57] <seb128> didrocks, using the mouse whell in evince make compiz crashes
[11:57] <seb128> didrocks, using the mouse whell in evince makes compiz crash
[11:57] <didrocks> seb128: reliably? there was one on OOo, but it was fixed
[11:57] <seb128> yes
[11:57] <didrocks> I get one crash a day ~
[11:57] <seb128> I just got it twice in a minute
[11:58] <seb128> I use the scrollbar now
[11:58] <didrocks> seb128: there are some crash fixes in trunk, but it depends on other part of code and cherry picking isn't easy
[11:58] <seb128> it's probably the scrolling animation
[11:58] <seb128> ok
[11:58] <didrocks> so do you think I should make dist today?
[11:58] <didrocks> and hope for not additional issues?
[11:58] <pitti> chrisccoulson: cheers
[11:59] <didrocks> (scrolling here in evince very fast isn't an issue)
[11:59] <didrocks> but I have a nvidia card and the OOo issue we saw was on intel
[12:00] <seb128> didrocks, don't bother with getting a new version in, it's still alpha1
[12:00] <didrocks> yeah, I'm scrolling very fast and no issue
[12:00] <seb128> ok, I'm away for this call
[12:00] <didrocks> see you!
[12:01] <seb128> compiz crashed when I clicked on the firefox launcher now!
[12:01] <seb128> weird
[12:01] <didrocks> seb128: did you say that the intel driver was great? :)
[12:01] <didrocks> or that you get no issue with it? :)
[12:01] <didrocks> time changes :-)
[12:01] <didrocks> epoch*
[12:02] <didrocks> seb128: I'm running it full time for the last two weeks and I have one to two crashes a day…
[12:02] <didrocks> I need to make more test on my netbook it seems with the intel card…
[12:05] <hyperair> my intel card works fine \o/
[12:06] <hyperair> probably because i reported almost every crasher bug i hit already
[12:06] <didrocks> :)
[12:06] <didrocks> I'm just guessing that being hw related
[12:07] <didrocks> because I have a totally different experience and there is almost no bug report on crashers
[12:07] <didrocks> maybe it's not and just cpu/execution timing issue
[12:07] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - ok, my first unity bug (bug 683084) :)
[12:07] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 683084 in unity "Global menu doesn't work well with more than one screen (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/683084
[12:08] <chrisccoulson> i'll probably be opening a few more caused by my setup this morning ;)
[12:08] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: hum, there are a lot of multi-monitors bugs
[12:08] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: let me look at this one
[12:08] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, oh, i did search before, but i didn't find any
[12:08] <chrisccoulson> that's how i found the sloppy focus bug too ;)
[12:09] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, those are more design issues that bug report
[12:09] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: so for those, what we normally do is:
[12:09] <didrocks> - upstream bug report -> incomplete
[12:09] <didrocks> - package bug report -> incomplete
[12:10] <didrocks> + adding an "ayatana design" task -> New
[12:10] <didrocks> then, design can answer and change the unity status :)
[12:10] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - ah, ok. i didn't know that
[12:11] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: more a FYI and making my life easier :)
[12:11] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: do you want me to do it or can you do it?
[12:12] <chrisccoulson> didrocks, ok, done :)
[12:12] <didrocks> thanks chrisccoulson :)
[12:12] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: also, for each bug report, I tend to open an ubuntu and upstream task and get the same status
[12:13] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: I think we don't plan to fork upstream and it can avoid dups :)
[12:21] <seb128> re
[12:21] <didrocks> re
[12:21] <didrocks> already finished? :)
[12:21] <Tm_T> fd
[12:21] <seb128> didrocks, yes
[12:21] <seb128> chrisccoulson, why did firefox open a "Thanks!"
[12:22] <seb128> "Thank you for uploading your data"
[12:22] <seb128> which is over my IRC
[12:22] <seb128> when I didn't send any data!
[12:22] <seb128> seems to be the feedback thing
[12:23] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, that's from the test-pilot extension, but it's set to ask your permission by default
[12:23] <chrisccoulson> it shouldn't have just uploaded stuff without asking :/
[12:24] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - what is extensions.testpilot.alwaysSubmitData set to in about:config?
[12:24] <seb128> it want me to promise to be careful
[12:24] <seb128> not sure I can do that :p
[12:24] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it's false
[12:25] <seb128> chrisccoulson, it might be that it stealed my focus with the question and I hit enter
[12:25] <didrocks> oh yeah, the "you can mess up your system, take care" :)
[12:25] <chrisccoulson> yeah, possibly
[12:25] <didrocks> we should do that in gconf-editor and say "not your fault \o/"
[12:26] <bilalakhtar> haha
[12:31] <seb128> re
[12:31] <didrocks> re
[12:31] <seb128> didrocks, ok, I suck, the CV was an odt so it was not evince ;-)
[12:31] <seb128> I managed to crash my xserver this time though
[12:31] <didrocks> seb128: ok, so it's the OOo crash… yeah, I didn't take that one, sorry :)
[12:31] <seb128> well compiz did take xorg down with it
[12:31] <didrocks> the x server?
[12:31] <didrocks> oh bad…
[12:36] <seb128> didrocks, well at least I restarted my session and it worked fine
[12:36] <seb128> so it made me test the gconf change for the animation
[12:36] <seb128> I just realized
[12:36] <seb128> no crash ;-)
[12:36] <didrocks> nice \o/
[12:36] <didrocks> I'm still afraid it's a timing issue
[12:36] <didrocks> so, maybe depending on CPU…
[12:36] <seb128> btw does anybody know what jasoncwarner work hours are?
[12:37] <didrocks> he generally finishes at 9:30 (french time), not sure when he starts though
[12:37] <didrocks> seems he doesn't sleep a lot :)
[12:47] <didrocks> session restarts and final tests, brb
[12:56] <seb128> chrisccoulson, there is a bug between firefox and compiz
[12:56] <seb128> the test pilot dialogs are present on all workspaces
[12:56] <seb128> not only over firefox
[13:02] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, interesting :)
[13:03] <chrisccoulson> i'll have a look at that
[13:03] <seb128> compiz crashed again as well
[13:03] <seb128> ok, let's get something to eat and I will report that crasher
[13:03]  * seb128 pets apport for catching it
[13:03] <didrocks> :)
[13:14] <bilalakhtar> didrocks: just saw your gnome-session upload, but not starting gnome-panel has a few consequences
[13:14] <bilalakhtar> like Alt+F2 won't work
[13:14] <didrocks> bilalakhtar: we discussed that this morning
[13:15] <bilalakhtar> okay then
[13:15] <didrocks> bilalakhtar: it's better than having both, and you can set it in the command plugin
[13:24] <pitti> didrocks: hm, will that disable gnome-panel in a GNOME session, too?
[13:25] <didrocks> pitti: the GNOME session is the "unity" session (the default one)
[13:25] <didrocks> pitti: the gnome-classic session will still have the panel
[13:25] <pitti> right, I mean the "GNOME" gnome session
[13:25] <pitti> ah, good
[13:26] <didrocks> yeah, it's using my gconf path on sessions
[13:38] <seb128> pitti, you might want to send a meeting reminder today?
[13:38] <pitti> oh, thanks for the reminder reminder, doing now
[13:38] <seb128> ;-)
[13:38] <didrocks> a reminder reminder is a must :)
[13:40] <pitti> sent
[13:44] <kenvandine> pitti, will do
[13:46] <pitti> kenvandine: good morning, how are you?
[13:46] <kenvandine> great, and you?
[13:46] <pitti> splendid, thanks
[13:47] <pitti> gtk-gi stuff is making progress :)
[13:47] <pitti> I need to pay mvo another beer to do another python-defer upload, then a beer for glatzor, then two more projects will move away from pygtk
[13:47] <kenvandine> :)
[13:47] <kenvandine> yay
[13:48] <pitti> oh, and of course a beer for you for appindicator :)
[13:48] <kenvandine> not done yet :)
[13:48] <pitti> since that's much harder, this will also include a big hug
[13:48] <pitti> kenvandine: (I know, not that urgent)
[13:48] <seb128> hey kenvandine
[13:48] <kenvandine> hey seb128
[13:48] <seb128> kenvandine, have you seen the bug I assigned you last week about libgwibber not building in natty?
[13:48] <kenvandine> i wish we could drop the python bindings, but not yet
[13:48]  * kenvandine looks
[13:49] <kenvandine> vaguely familiar
[13:49] <seb128> the reply is "no" then ;-)
[13:49] <seb128> kenvandine, could you add that to your todo?
[13:49] <pitti> kenvandine: oh, is it the python bindings for appindicator which cause trouble?
[13:49] <kenvandine> will do
[13:49] <seb128> thanks
[13:49] <kenvandine> pitti, no, just a pain to maintain
[13:49] <kenvandine> we need to keep them around for gtk2
[13:49] <pitti> sbackup-gtk, lernid, virt-manager, ibus (jockey-gtk is prepared)
[13:50] <pitti> so, a bit of work, but could be doable
[13:50] <kenvandine> seb128, i suspect i know why it fails to build and it is fixed in trunk... just need to get it released
[13:50] <seb128> kenvandine, ok
[13:50] <kenvandine> i know trunk builds in pbuilder
[13:50] <kenvandine> seb128, how urgent is it?
[13:50] <pitti> kenvandine: if we (I) port these four, we could drop the bindings, right?
[13:50] <kenvandine> no
[13:51] <kenvandine> other upstreams that have used it... we had a big push to get people to use appindicator
[13:51] <kenvandine> but for n+1
[13:51] <pitti> we want to encourage upstreams to use py-ai instead of the gir?
[13:51] <kenvandine> no, we want to encourage gir
[13:51] <kenvandine> but the API will be a little different
[13:52] <pitti> right, necessarily
[13:52] <kenvandine> so we don't want to just break anything they have done
[13:52] <seb128> kenvandine, not urgent
[13:52] <seb128> kenvandine, next week will do
[13:52] <kenvandine> seb128, ok, i want to break a few more bits of the api before doing another release :)
[13:52] <pitti> kenvandine: if for nothing else, they need to port to GTK3
[13:52] <kenvandine> indeed
[13:52] <seb128> kenvandine, ok
[13:52] <kenvandine> so we decided to give them a little more time
[13:52] <pitti> kenvandine: so even having a compatibility shim of py-ai which translates to using the gir wouldn't mean zero porting
[13:52] <kenvandine> so we will build python-appindicator for gtk2 only
[13:52] <pitti> kenvandine: ok, understood
[13:53] <seb128> it's not different from pygtk staying around for a while ;-)
[13:53] <pitti> kenvandine: so for natty we'll have py-ai for gtk2 and a separate gtk3 version with gir?
[13:53] <kenvandine> yes
[13:53] <pitti> seb128: well, we need two appindicator APIs in parallel then
[13:53] <pitti> since we can't mix gtk2 and 3
[13:54] <pitti> (tried that, falling over horribly)
[13:54] <kenvandine> if we can get libdee GIR working in python we can get rid of pygtk in gwibber too :)
[13:54] <kenvandine> we are probably 50% done with the new vala client :)
[13:54] <pitti> kenvandine: wow, you are rewriting gwibber in vala?
[13:55] <kenvandine> the client
[13:55] <kenvandine> njpatel did the cool part already :)
[13:55] <kenvandine> pure gtk... no webkit
[13:55] <kenvandine> it has been a "when we have time for it" thing, so no promises it will make it in for alpha2 :)
[13:56] <kenvandine> but i am willing to lose lots of sleep over getting it done :)
[13:56] <njpatel> hells yes
[13:56] <kenvandine> blocked on dee now
[13:56] <kenvandine> :)
[13:56] <kenvandine> njpatel, you rock!
[13:56] <pitti> kenvandine: heh, this *is* a pet project of your's as it seems :)
[13:56] <kenvandine> i owe you beer!
[13:56] <njpatel> kenvandine, I added support for filling up remaining space with extra tiles plus a few more fixes for rgba
[13:56]  * pitti hugs njpatel
[13:56] <kenvandine> njpatel, awesome, did you push it?
[13:56] <njpatel> kenvandine, yep
[13:57] <kenvandine> njpatel, i am really at the point where i need to get the service exposing the dee model
[13:57]  * njpatel hugs pitti
[13:57] <njpatel> pitti, I'm guessing non webkit is important to you too? :)
[13:57] <kenvandine> hoping the dee problems get fixed soon :)
[13:57] <seb128> pitti, right, I know about not mixing gtk version, that's why we keep most of GNOME3 in a ppa
[13:57] <seb128> we will probably not touch system indicators as well
[13:57] <njpatel> kenvandine, what were you blocking on with dee, again?
[13:57] <pitti> njpatel: not particularly, why? I guess TheMuso will appreciate the better a11y, though
[13:57] <seb128> but we need libappindicator bidding for each gtk
[13:57] <kenvandine> njpatel, using dee with gir
[13:57] <pitti> seb128: right
[13:57] <kenvandine> in gwibber-service
[13:58] <seb128> bindings even
[13:58] <njpatel> kenvandine, aah, is that still not working?
[13:58] <kenvandine> i think it is close
[13:58] <kenvandine> but he had other priorities in front of me :)
[13:58] <njpatel> pitti, nothing, seemed like you were excited, thought maybe you'd like the faster startup etc :)
[13:58] <kenvandine> and much lower memory footprint :)
[13:58] <pitti> njpatel: I'm always generally excited about better performance, yes :)
[13:59] <kenvandine> nessita: i haven't forgotten about your upload, i got distracted last night
[13:59] <nessita> kenvandine: no problem, dholbach was looking to it (I thought you asked him to do it)
[13:59] <kenvandine> oh... i guess he just saw it in the queue
[13:59] <kenvandine> i'll let him do it then :)
[14:00] <kenvandine> i had a kid that didn't want to sleep last night, so didn't get back online until like midnight
[14:00] <kenvandine> and by then was too tired to do any reviewing :/
[14:00] <njpatel> pitti, Heh :) How is it coming back to platform this cycle? Missing OEM? :)
[14:01] <njpatel> kenvandine, are you blocked on me/kamstrup or just upstream?
[14:01] <pitti> njpatel: OEM was fun, but I actually like working on a product again which I use myself
[14:01] <kenvandine> njpatel, kamstrup
[14:01] <njpatel> pitti, ah, that's an interesting view point
[14:01] <pitti> njpatel: I might do another rotation in the future, though; I had lots of time for hacking, which was nice
[14:01] <kenvandine> njpatel, we think it is just a constructor
[14:01] <njpatel> pitti, DX!!
[14:01] <njpatel> :)
[14:01] <kenvandine> at least that is the most obvious problem
[14:02] <pitti> njpatel: and seeing the other side of "the fence" was an interesting view on its own right, to see what these guys are doing, etc.
[14:02] <njpatel> pitti, then we can have easter eggs that come up with your head and a speech bubble that says "I Pitti the fool!"
[14:02] <kenvandine> hehe
[14:03] <pitti> I just loved that thin at UDS
[14:11] <nessita> kenvandine: I hope things get better for you!
[14:11] <kenvandine> things are great
[14:11] <kenvandine> just my evening got a little interrupted last night :-D
[14:12] <seb128> re
[14:12] <kenvandine> njpatel, AttributeError: type object 'SharedModel' has no attribute 'new_with_name'
[14:12] <kenvandine> that is what we get now in python using gir
[14:13] <njpatel> kenvandine, hmm, why?
[14:13] <kenvandine> not sure, kamstrup is going to look at the constructor once he clears some higher priority stuff from his stack
[14:14] <njpatel> kenvandine, can you use other parts of the stack like sequence model etc?
[14:14] <kenvandine> oh wait, that is the wrong error
[14:14] <kenvandine> that is from me trying to work around it
[14:14] <didrocks> seb128: I was rethinking about the defaults in the unity panel, we didn't set evolution there (because it was in the messaging menu). I don't remember why we didn't have the same conclusion for empathy
[14:15] <kenvandine> (test.py:22884): dee-CRITICAL **: You must set the 'back-end' property of the DeeProxyModel upon creation.
[14:15] <seb128> didrocks, dunno, it would make sense to do the same
[14:15] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - "* default music playerban" - is that a typo? ;)
[14:15] <kenvandine> njpatel, that is what we get from model = Dee.SharedModel()
[14:15] <didrocks> seb128: ok, can still change that for alpha1, unity isn't released yet, let me do the change :)
[14:16] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: should be :)
[14:16] <kenvandine> and none of the signals seem to be there to connect too
[14:16] <njpatel> kenvandine, weird :/
[14:16] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: where is it?
[14:16] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-application-selection (near the top of the whiteboard)
[14:17] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks
[14:21] <bcurtiswx> is there any way I can see more details about why a patch fails.  upon comparing the patch to the code, the patch looks OK to me but won't push
[14:32] <vish> sladen: hi, any reason Bug #350329 gnome-session task was switched from fix-committed » confirmed?  afaik, the desktop team preferred the task to be set to committed once it is fixed upstream (since they check and roll releases regularly) ... are we now not doing it anymore?
[14:32] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 350329 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "gnome-session-properties dialog is far too small (affects: 4) (dups: 1) (heat: 26)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/350329
[14:35] <sladen> vish: oh dear, in that case, I've probably caused some huge diplomatic incident again... yes, I guess in the case of GNOME where there is active importing going on it makes sense
[14:35] <sladen> vish: it perhaps highlights a sub-optimal use-case in Launchpad
[14:36] <vish> sladen: oh! cool.. :)   i thought we had changed the way we do it for this cycle, with unity and stuff having higher priority …
[14:38] <seb128> the reason we do that in the desktop components is that it makes easy to see what bug have fixes available
[14:38] <seb128> especially to see from the buglist what bugs to close in the next upload
[14:38] <chrisccoulson> pitti - mozilla have just started the respin for ffox 3.6.13 now. am i going to cause you a problem for alpha 1 if i start ours now?
[14:38] <chrisccoulson> (considering, i'm going to take up a lot of buildd time)
[14:39] <pitti> chrisccoulson: does firefox build any arch:all packages?
[14:40] <chrisccoulson> pitti - yes, there is an empty meta-package which is arch:all
[14:40] <pitti> chrisccoulson: does it have strict dependencies to binary versions?
[14:40] <pitti> if not, it should be okay
[14:41] <chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, this isn't being uploaded to natty btw
[14:41] <chrisccoulson> only every other release
[14:41] <pitti> I just don't want to make the old armel package uninstallable if i386 already builds ffox, but armel doesn't
[14:41] <pitti> chrisccoulson: oh; don't worry, go ahead
[14:41] <chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, thanks
[14:49] <bcurtiswx> is there a place to pastebin a screenshot so i can ask a question on it ?
[14:51] <vish> bcurtiswx: imagebin.ca
[14:52] <bcurtiswx> vish thx
[14:53] <bcurtiswx> http://imagebin.ca/view/2ogKiw.html is a pic of a patch thats failing.. the line of the start of the patch matches the code and i can't see where the patch would go wrong.  any suggestions ?
[15:00] <njpatel> I'm missing one didrocks again
[15:00] <bcurtiswx> there's more than one didrocks ? that explains a lot :P
[15:01] <njpatel> heh
[15:01] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, got a sec to look at my image link above and see if you see anything that I'm not?
[15:06]  * bcurtiswx thinks didrocks needs one of those pull-tab waiting line numbering systems (like deli's have)
[15:12] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, ping
[15:12] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, pong
[15:12] <kenvandine> hey bcurtiswx
[15:12] <rodrigo_> hey kenvandine :-)
[15:13] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, last week, my libu1 submission failed building -> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/59571483/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.libubuntuone_0.3.8-0ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
[15:13] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, any idea what's wrong there?
[15:13] <bcurtiswx> hi kenvandine
[15:16] <kenvandine> bcurtiswx, nothing that i can see
[15:16] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, looking
[15:16] <bcurtiswx> kenvandine, that makes me sad, because it fails on the push
[15:16] <kenvandine> on the push?
[15:17] <bcurtiswx> yes quilt push -f on that patch fails in the area on the pic
[15:17] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, cool, thanks
[15:17] <didrocks> bcurtiswx: hehe :)
[15:17] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, oh... that is fun :)
[15:18] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, oh, is it? :)
[15:18] <kenvandine> it is the ordering of builds
[15:18] <kenvandine> since it does multiple passes
[15:18] <rodrigo_> oh
[15:18] <kenvandine> what did you change ?
[15:18] <kenvandine> like the order of packages in the control file?
[15:18] <kenvandine> or dependencies between targets in the rules file?
[15:20] <kenvandine> i think you want to make it build in build-python2.6 before it builds in the default build dir
[15:20] <kenvandine> configure and build
[15:20] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, nothing related to that, afaik -> http://pastebin.com/uR0P5MWZ
[15:20] <seb128> it probably won a python2.7 build since
[15:20] <kenvandine> ah!
[15:21] <kenvandine> yeah, that would do it it bet
[15:21] <kenvandine> s/it it/it i/
[15:22] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, yes, I (and mterry) found some problems with dh_python in natty, so might this be related?
[15:22] <jcastro> didrocks: what's the "tricky gnome panel issue"?
[15:22] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, perhaps
[15:22] <kenvandine> but it could just be the build targets for pyversion
[15:22] <didrocks> jcastro: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2010-November/002689.html
[15:23] <didrocks> enjoy :)
[15:23] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, unfortunately, at least for me, it is something that takes a bit of trial and error
[15:23] <rodrigo_> ok, I'll try several things
[15:23] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, look at the depends between the targets in the rules file
[15:23] <rodrigo_> ok
[15:24] <kenvandine> i think it should configure, make, and make install for each python version before it starts the next
[15:25] <jcastro> didrocks: that'll teach me to not catch up on the list
[15:25] <didrocks> jcastro: :-)
[15:25] <didrocks> jcastro: well, the traffic is low
[15:25] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, actually, look at the order of packages in the control file first
[15:25] <kenvandine> it isn't building for the python versions yet
[15:25] <rodrigo_> kenvandine, hmm, python-ubuntuone is the 1st one
[15:26] <kenvandine> humm
[15:26] <kenvandine> i never fully understood how it chooses that order
[15:26] <kenvandine> one sec
[15:26] <rodrigo_> let me try moving it to the bottom
[15:26] <rodrigo_> oh, ok
[15:29] <jcastro> Laney: did the MIRs get an ack?
[15:30] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, ok... so the problem is when it runs make -C build-python2.6
[15:30] <kenvandine> it thinks it needs to configure
[15:31] <kenvandine> rodrigo_, so yeah, look at the rules
[15:32] <kenvandine> i think it needs to configure, make, make install for each
[15:32] <kenvandine> instead of configure each, make each, etc
[15:34] <rodrigo_> yes
[15:35] <Laney> jcastro: no not yet
[15:35] <Laney> :(
[15:35] <jcastro> :(
[15:38] <jcastro> Laney: is it just a matter of poking asac?
[15:38] <Laney> not sure, you'll have to ask him
[15:38] <jcastro> ok on it
[15:38] <Laney> I targetted it to the A1 milestone
[15:39] <cyphermox> chrisccoulson, remember why we don't remove doc/*.txt from connman anymore? were the files re-licensed or something?
[15:50] <momelod> greetings channel
[15:50] <momelod> I've an issue w/ the latest dist-upgrade to ubuntu 10.10
[15:51] <momelod> since the upgrade my gnome-power-management is broken
[15:51] <momelod> would anyone know if this is a known issue? or did i do something wrong during my upgrade.
[15:52] <chrisccoulson> cyphermox, yeah, i think they were relicensed
[15:53] <momelod> funny thing is i can `sudo /etc/acpi/sleep.sh` fine.  but i dont have the options to sleep, or hibernate.  Also, my monitor doesn't auto dim. and when my battery is depleted the machine does not automatically shutdown.
[15:53] <cyphermox> chrisccoulson, thx. I asked on #connman but haven't received an answer yet...
[15:54] <chrisccoulson> cyphermox, the main issue i think was the copy of an RFC that was shipped in the tarball
[15:54] <chrisccoulson> but that has gone now
[15:55] <bcurtiswx> seb128, do you know yet that nautilus crashes from the gnome3 ppa ?
[15:55] <cyphermox> chrisccoulson, ah, cool
[15:56] <seb128> bcurtiswx, it doesn't?
[15:56] <seb128> bcurtiswx, you probably didn't get the new libnautilus-* with it
[15:56] <bcurtiswx> apt-get install libnautilus-* ?
[15:56] <seb128> no
[15:57] <seb128> libnautilus-extension1
[15:57] <didrocks> cyphermox: can you close bug #680298, please?
[15:57] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 680298 in unity (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "no network manager icon when running unity (affects: 6) (dups: 1) (heat: 530)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/680298
[15:58] <bcurtiswx> seb128, OK, also libgcr0 idk if thats from gnome3 PPA ro not, but it fails on install
[15:58] <seb128> what error?
[15:58] <cyphermox> didrocks, ah, right, thanks!
[15:59] <bcurtiswx> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/538318/
[15:59] <seb128> bcurtiswx, seems a buggy version from the ppa, ask rodrigo_ about it?
[16:00]  * bcurtiswx pokes rodrigo_
[16:00] <rodrigo_> hmm
[16:00] <momelod> does ubuntu have a repair option? like an install that overwrites the system files, but maintains the users home directories and 3rd party apps?
[16:00] <rodrigo_> yes, seems an old version, seb128, did you upload the fixes you did yo gnome-keyring?
[16:00] <seb128> rodrigo_, I did fixes?
[16:01] <seb128> let me check
[16:01] <rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, I thought you did
[16:01] <seb128> I'm a bit behind on uploads
[16:03] <seb128> rodrigo_, I don't think I did anything yet on gnome-keyring but you fixed it IIRC
[16:03] <seb128> bcurtiswx, try to sudo apt-get install libgcr0/natty
[16:03] <rodrigo_> hmm
[16:04] <rodrigo_> oh, right, the correct packages are on the ppa (libgcr-3-0)
[16:04] <bcurtiswx> haha, i keep killing seb128
[16:04] <rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, seems to be an old version laying around on the ppa
[16:04] <bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, sebs idea gave me same error as before
[16:04] <rodrigo_> what error?
[16:04] <bcurtiswx> http://paste.ubuntu.com/538318/
[16:07] <pitti> bcurtiswx: stop scaring him away, dude! :-)
[16:07] <rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, and what does apt-cache policy libgcr0 shows?
[16:08] <mterry> Has anyone had problems with "3.0 (quilt)" packages trying to apply patches twice and thus failing?
[16:08] <pitti> mterry: not me; what are you trying to do?
[16:08] <rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, ok, I think it's the old broken package being still in the ppa
[16:08] <bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, http://paste.ubuntu.com/538321/
[16:08] <rodrigo_> can that ^^ be possible?
[16:08] <bcurtiswx> pitti, sorry ;)
[16:08] <mterry> momelod, this probably isn't the best channel -- try #ubuntu.  But as far as I remember, the installer itself will do that -- preserve /home.  Won't maintain 3rd party apps outside of /home though
[16:09] <rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, right, the version in the ppa is 2.92.92.is.2.91.2-0ubuntu2
[16:09] <rodrigo_> 2.92.92.is.2.91.2-0ubuntu1 is the old, broken, libgcr0
[16:09] <seb128> re
[16:09] <rodrigo_> so, how can it be the PPA still has a libgcr0 that was part of a previous upload?
[16:09] <seb128> ok, back under GNOME, let's deal with pending sponsoring and updates
[16:09] <mterry> pitti, trying to update anjuta, and I'm hitting this.  Let me get as simple a sequence as I can
[16:10] <rodrigo_> seb128, were you running kde before? :D
[16:10] <seb128> rodrigo_, no, unity
[16:10]  * seb128 slaps rodrigo_
[16:10] <rodrigo_> ah
[16:10] <rodrigo_> :)
[16:11] <pitti> seb128: wb; DSL reconnect or broken irc?
[16:11] <rodrigo_> seb128, the lñibgcr0 problem is because the old broken package is still in the ppa repo, even though a new version was submitted, with the fixes renaming it to libgcr-3-0, so how can we remove that old package?
[16:12] <rodrigo_> libgcr0, not  lñibgcr0 :)
[16:12] <seb128> pitti, unity testing and crappy intel
[16:12] <seb128> pitti, often the xserver goes down on user switching
[16:12] <seb128> or when compiz crashes the xsession crashes
[16:13] <bcurtiswx> seb128, that makes me feel alot better.. mine does the same thing
[16:14] <rodrigo_> :)
[16:14] <rodrigo_> pitti, so, no individual status reports any more on the meeting page?
[16:15] <pitti> rodrigo_: that's how I understood it
[16:15] <bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, bcurtis@wx:~/Desktop$ aptitude why libgcr0 --> i   seahorse Depends libgcr0 (>= 2.26.0)
[16:16] <rodrigo_> oh
[16:16] <rodrigo_> right, we need a new seahorse on the ppa it seems then
[16:16] <bcurtiswx> yes
[16:19] <seb128> rodrigo_, I doubt there is an old gnome-keyring is the ppa
[16:19] <seb128> it's likely that bcurtiswx got that buggy version installed some time ago
[16:19] <rodrigo_> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/538321/
[16:20] <rodrigo_> the version in the ppa is 0ubuntu2
[16:20] <didrocks> ok, goodbye firefox again, the issue with launchpad waste me too many times…
[16:20] <didrocks> time*
[16:21] <micahg> didrocks: what issue?
[16:22] <chrisccoulson> didrocks - which video driver are you using btw, i still can't reproduce it?
[16:22] <didrocks> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0/+bug/223238
[16:22] <bcurtiswx> seb128, also my aptitude why libgcr0 says that seahorse depends on it and it can't be removed ATM.
[16:22] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 223238 in clicompanion "lp:clicompanion is stacked on itself, giving maximum recursion depth error (affects: 2) (dups: 1) (heat: 14)" [High,Confirmed]
[16:22] <didrocks> chrisccoulson: nvidia with the nvidia driver
[16:22] <didrocks> there are a lot of dups
[16:23] <seb128> bcurtiswx, rodrigo_: ok, you were right, I deleted the buggy gnome-keyring from the ppa
[16:24] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok, but how that can be?
[16:24] <seb128> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/gnome3-builds/+delete-packages has some "superseded" sources
[16:24] <rodrigo_> if you submit a new version of the package, the old subpackages don't get removed?
[16:24] <seb128> not sure why it keeps those though
[16:24] <rodrigo_> ah
[16:24] <mvo> didrocks: LP and stacking seems to be rather anoying, I ran into bug #681431
[16:24] <seb128> well "had"
[16:24] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 681431 in launchpad-code (and 1 other project) "confusing error when original stacked branch becomes invalid later (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/681431
[16:24] <seb128> I deleted them now
[16:25] <rodrigo_> seb128, ok, thanks
[16:27] <didrocks> mvo: hum, I don't see the link with the rendering issue between firefox and launchpad TBH :)
[16:28] <bcurtiswx> so soon with a dist-upgrade i won't have the gcr issue anymore?
[16:28]  * kenvandine reboots right before the meeting
[16:28] <kenvandine> :)
[16:28] <rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, right
[16:28] <seb128> bcurtiswx, right
[16:28] <bcurtiswx> seb128, rodrigo_, awesome.  thx and i'll get out of the way for your meeting :)
[16:29] <rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, sorry I didn't see it, I'm just updating selectively, no upgrade/dist-upgrade
[16:29] <bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, i'll let you all know fo any errors i get in the future that IDK how to fix.. :)
[16:29] <rodrigo_> bcurtiswx, ok, please :)
[16:29] <mvo> didrocks: oh, """"lp:clicompanion is stacked on itself, giving maximum recursion depth error (affects: 2) (dups: 1) (heat: 14)""" is what the bot told me
[16:30]  * pitti rings the meeting time bell
[16:30] <mvo> didrocks: and that sounded similar to my bug. nevermind
[16:30] <seb128> hey pitti
[16:30] <pitti> -ENOJASON
[16:31] <didrocks> mvo: hum, I'm wondering if I pasted the right bug report, my bad, nevermind :)
[16:31] <pitti> chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter: meeting time
[16:31] <didrocks> doing that and other stuff in // isn't good :)
[16:31] <cyphermox> yep :)
[16:31] <didrocks> hey
[16:32]  * tremolux waves
[16:32] <mterry> heyo
[16:32] <pitti> [TOPIC] action review
[16:32] <tkamppeter> hi
[16:32] <pitti> seems we didn't have any
[16:32] <pitti> [TOPIC] partner update
[16:32] <pitti> kenvandine: are you ready?
[16:32] <rodrigo_> \o/
[16:34]  * kenvandine is semi here
[16:34] <pitti> [TOPIC] Kubuntu update
[16:34] <kenvandine> no window manager :)
[16:34] <pitti> Riddell: do you have something?
[16:35] <pitti> kenvandine: alt+f2 compiz --replace?
[16:35] <chrisccoulson> hi (sorry, was at my other computer there)
[16:35] <kenvandine> gnome-session doesn't seem to be finishing starting
[16:35] <kenvandine> i'll look at it in a bit :)
[16:35] <kenvandine> classic gnome session didn't work either
[16:35] <pitti> kenvandine: is that already your partner update? :-)
[16:35] <kenvandine> yup
[16:36] <kenvandine> hehe :)
[16:36] <kenvandine> want me to do that while we wait for Riddell?
[16:36] <pitti> please do
[16:36] <kenvandine> U1 has a bunch of desktopcouch fixes queued up being reviewed now
[16:36] <kenvandine> so lots of their A1 work items are "Fix committed"
[16:37] <kenvandine> will be done tomorrow
[16:37] <pitti> it's getting a bit tight for a1, so they should be moved to a2 now
[16:37] <kenvandine> but i guess the uploads should wait until after thursday
[16:37] <kenvandine> yeah
[16:37] <kenvandine> i'll have them do that, but there is good progress there
[16:38] <kenvandine> for DX
[16:38] <kenvandine> dbusmenu and libindicator packages are ready for gtk2/gtk3 builds... but we are waiting until after A1
[16:38] <mterry> kenvandine, can you get some attention for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/couchdb/+bug/682866  ?  it's blocking a quickly update
[16:38] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 682866 in couchdb (Ubuntu) "CouchDatabase() call hangs (affects: 2) (heat: 10)" [High,Confirmed]
[16:38] <pitti> \o/
[16:38] <kenvandine> and tedg has more API breakage he wants to do
[16:38] <kenvandine> mterry, i will
[16:38] <mterry> thx
[16:38] <kenvandine> also
[16:39] <seb128> kenvandine, will those be done by next week?
[16:39] <kenvandine> seb128, yes
[16:39] <kenvandine> this week in fact
[16:39] <seb128> the API breakages
[16:39] <seb128> I mean
[16:39] <kenvandine> i just won't upload them until after A2
[16:39] <seb128> 1 you mean? ;-)
[16:39] <kenvandine> whoops
[16:39] <kenvandine> yeah :)
[16:39] <seb128> ok, makes sense
[16:39] <kenvandine> same for gdbus
[16:40] <kenvandine> that is all i have
[16:40] <pitti> thanks kenvandine
[16:40] <pitti> X update -> eastern edition
[16:40] <pitti> [TOPIC] Unity update
[16:40] <pitti> didrocks: anything which is currently blocking you or that we should be aware of for A1?
[16:41] <pitti> FYI, I just respun a desktop image with your latest gnome-session fix
[16:41] <didrocks> nothing blocked, just uploaded latest bits
[16:41] <pitti>  http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20101130.1/
[16:41] <didrocks> pitti: oh, there is a new unity just uploaded
[16:41] <pitti> test away
[16:41] <didrocks> just making the short summary first:
[16:41] <didrocks> Unity is the default in ubuntu now!
[16:41] <didrocks> Now we have two sessions: one "Ubuntu Desktop" which launch unity by default and one "Ubuntu Classic" which launches compiz (if supported) and gnome-panel. The compiz profiles are separated as well.
[16:41] <didrocks> We got a new Unity and Nux release, still improving the desktop experience, handle the migration with previous launcher settings
[16:41] <didrocks> There is a new compiz with a lot of improvment and fixes like 2D/3D detection, fallback, fixes gconf backend and old transition settings migration
[16:41] <didrocks> Unity and all compiz plugins now builds -dbgsym packages
[16:41] <didrocks> (so, use apport to report unity backtrace)
[16:42] <pitti> didrocks: congrats for landing all this by A1! great job, I know it was far from easy
[16:42] <didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
[16:42] <didrocks> pitti: so, there is a new bamf + nux + unity just uploaded
[16:42] <didrocks> pitti: if that can make A1, will be nice
[16:42] <pitti> ack
[16:42] <pitti> tomorrow's dailies then
[16:42] <didrocks> yes
[16:43] <pitti> I'll make sure that we do that
[16:43] <didrocks> thanks a lot pitti :)
[16:43] <pitti> no worries
[16:44] <pitti> thanks didrocks
[16:44] <pitti> [TOPIC] Software-center
[16:44] <tremolux> heyo
[16:44] <tremolux>  * Released Software Center version 3.1.3, includes further performance improvements and bugfixes
[16:44] <tremolux>  * Now tracking Software Center startup performance on reference hardware (Dell Mini 10) at:
[16:44] <tremolux>   * http://people.canonical.com/~mvo/software-center/mini10-startup/startup-times.png
[16:44] <tremolux>  * Additional Software Center startup improvements in-progress, further 20%+ speedup in a branch soon to be merged
[16:44] <pitti> tremolux: anything which we sohuld be aware of or you want to announce?
[16:44] <pitti> whoo
[16:44] <pitti> tremolux: you have a "paste-on-hilight" trigger, don't you?
[16:44] <rodrigo_> :)
[16:44] <tremolux> yep, I am actually off having an espresso at Starbucks right now
[16:45] <pitti> tremolux: did the startup performance get a lot better again with swithcing back to uncompressed indexes?
[16:45] <pitti> tremolux: /me wants to see the source for tremolux.py
[16:45] <tremolux> pitti: it did improve it, not sure how much
[16:45] <mvo> its not much influenced by this as it was mostly using the binray cache, but for invalid-caches it does help (not measured how much though)
[16:45] <pitti> 6 s on a Dell Mini 10, aka "abacus" is pretty nice
[16:46] <mvo> more to come (we hope :)
[16:46] <pitti> admittedly it's still 5 s here on a fast machine
[16:46] <pitti> so it seems not to be much CPU bound
[16:46] <mvo> 5s for you on a ssd with --measure-startup-time?
[16:47] <pitti> mvo: with "count in my brain"
[16:47] <pitti> yes, 250 MB/s SSD and 2.4 GHz quad-core
[16:47] <pitti> but anyway, nice work on this!
[16:47] <pitti> [TOPIC] release status
[16:47] <pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team-natty-alpha-1.html
[16:48] <pitti> this doesn't look too bad, it by and large seems that everyone (on average) was just missing one WI
[16:48] <pitti> we can easily transition them to A2 if they are blocked by the A1 freeze
[16:48] <pitti> but please make sure that your WIs are up to date
[16:49] <pitti> as for RC bugs, it's well within normal parameters right now
[16:49] <pitti> would be nice if bryceh and RAOF could bring up bug 292214 in the eastern edition
[16:49] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 292214 in xserver-xorg-video-mga (Ubuntu Natty) (and 2 other projects) "Xinerama broken since intrepid on MGA (affects: 14) (dups: 1) (heat: 124)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/292214
[16:50] <pitti> likewise bug 636311
[16:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 636311 in xserver-xorg-input-evdev (Ubuntu Natty) (and 6 other projects) "Keyboard special keys interfere with mouse (affects: 198) (dups: 15) (heat: 780)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/636311
[16:50] <pitti> bug 676949 is marked for a1; does anyone feel particularly attached to shotwell?
[16:50] <Sarvatt> pitti: MGA bug is fixed already
[16:50] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 676949 in shotwell (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "shotwell crashes on importing images (affects: 10) (dups: 6) (heat: 373)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/676949
[16:51] <pitti> we can easily move this to later, but it does sound relevant
[16:51] <seb128> pitti, robert_ancell
[16:51] <seb128> assign the bug to him
[16:51] <pitti> seb128: I'll assign him, thanks
[16:51] <seb128> thanks
[16:51] <pitti> Sarvatt: awesome, thnaks
[16:52] <pitti> that's all from my side for release status, questions?
[16:52] <pitti> jasoncwarner: hello
[16:52] <seb128> hey jasoncwarner
[16:52] <jasoncwarner> morning guys
[16:52] <seb128> jasoncwarner, perfect timing to miss the missing again :p
[16:53] <pitti> jasoncwarner: meeting started 22 mins ago
[16:53] <pitti> [TOPIC] new meeting report format
[16:53] <chrisccoulson> hi jasoncwarner!
[16:53] <pitti> so, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-11-30 used the new format
[16:53] <pitti> I think we ought to go back to the previous template, though, to include actions and the various status reports
[16:53] <pitti> but the "changes since last week" think looks pretty nice as a summary
[16:54] <pitti> what do you guys think?
[16:54] <didrocks> don't you think it looks like a draft? :)
[16:54] <pitti> well, it is
[16:54] <kenvandine> it did actually make me want to read over the list
[16:54] <pitti> I mean the size and contents looks fairly appropriate to me for a team report of a week
[16:55] <kenvandine> however, i think we should probably always append to the bottom, which would make it easier to go back and look at a second time
[16:55] <didrocks> I agree with that
[16:55] <pitti> I'm just curious how everyone likes it more or less now
[16:55] <rodrigo_> it would be easier to read if it had sections, like 'Natty updates', 'software center', etc?
[16:55] <pitti> rodrigo_: I think that'd be part of actually cleaning and writing them up
[16:56] <pitti> this is supposed to be the raw input for the weekly report, AFAIUI?
[16:56] <seb128> well it was a comment made last week
[16:56] <seb128> we said we would try without category
[16:56] <seb128> it would work as well to dump into categories
[16:56] <pitti> seb128: you mean including folding partner, unity, etc. into that?
[16:56] <pitti> well, worth a try
[16:56] <seb128> yes
[16:56] <pitti> might be the discretion of whoever will write this up
 however, i think we should probably always append to the bottom, which would make it easier to go back and look at a second time
[16:56] <pitti> to make something nice and readable
[16:57] <pitti> seb128: ok, WFM
[16:57] <seb128> kenvandine, robert_ancell suggested to sort it in real time by interest
[16:57] <kenvandine> seb128, yeah
[16:57] <kenvandine> but if i look at it this morning and then again later today
[16:57] <pitti> seb128: so we should update our meeting template accordingly; I would like to see actions separately
[16:57] <seb128> so it you are bored before the end of the list you get the key points
[16:57] <kenvandine> i would have to read the whole thing again
[16:58] <didrocks> kenvandine: just wait… there is no hurry to read it little by little, isn't it? :)
[16:58] <mterry> didrocks, well, if it's being updated over the course of the week...
[16:59] <seb128> didrocks, well one thing we said is that it could be used during the week to pick up blockers etc
[16:59] <didrocks> seb128: in that case, we can have an "update" in bold? when it's filed after the meeting?
[16:59] <kenvandine> perhaps if it gets compiled into another final weekly report, the person that does it could put it in order
[17:00] <kenvandine> but while it is a WIP we just append to the end...
[17:00] <didrocks> kenvandine: seems you volonteer :)
[17:00]  * kenvandine hides
[17:00] <pitti> ok, so let's try the full thing all the way up to the final mail
[17:00] <kenvandine> ok
[17:00] <pitti> jasoncwarner: we still need to incorporate the Eastern edition meeting there
[17:00] <kenvandine> in general i like the concept behind it better than what we did before
[17:01] <jasoncwarner> pitti: yeah, eastern edition is later today...
[17:01] <pitti> jasoncwarner: is it ok for you if I just paste in the log from this meeting to the wiki page, and you merge the X.org updates etc. from Eastern edition?
[17:01] <jasoncwarner> pitti: yup!
[17:01] <pitti> ok
[17:01] <pitti> [TOPIC] AOB
[17:02] <pitti> anything else?
[17:02] <jasoncwarner> pitti: I do
[17:02] <pitti> please go ahead
[17:02] <jasoncwarner> first, sorry for being late. two words: sick kid. ugh
[17:02] <jasoncwarner> second, I have two things I wanted to discuss quickly
[17:02] <pitti> oh, good luck with her/him!
[17:03] <jasoncwarner> 1. Discuss dropping desktopcouch from the CD. Lets explore the possibility of removing this as a default package.
[17:03] <didrocks> (onneeeeconfffff :/)
[17:03] <pitti> we'd have to unseed evolution-couchdb
[17:04] <pitti> which will probably require making this discoverable in evolution somehow?
[17:04] <pitti> (installing the package from the net sounds fine, since all U1 only makes sense with an internet connection anyway)
[17:04] <kenvandine> or in ubuntuone-preferences
[17:04] <pitti> kenvandine: ah, good point
[17:04] <kenvandine> they do that already for bindwood
[17:04] <rodrigo_> yes
[17:04] <seb128> didrocks wanted to get oneconf integration in ubiquity as well
[17:05] <kenvandine> didrocks, that woud be cool!
[17:05] <pitti> kenvandine: when you enable contacts syncing, you'd get an aptdaemon dialog for installing desktopcouch?
[17:05] <didrocks> yeah, which means more work as installing desktopcouch on the same time
[17:05] <kenvandine> yeah
[17:06] <didrocks> but well, in any case, you need the network, so installing it in ubiquity while getting u1 credentials is doable
[17:06] <didrocks> just more work
[17:07] <pitti> didrocks: in terms of download resources, or also in terms of changing ubiquity?
[17:07] <didrocks> pitti: changing ubiquity (just a guess) as it has to download it, starts it to then use it for oneconf
[17:08] <didrocks> but again, just a guess and not a blocker "theorically"
[17:08] <jasoncwarner> so what I hear is that right now the only thing on the CD that needs it is evolution and that needs a network to be useful anyway...it would require some patching on our part right now. Other things using it in the near future would be ubiquity and oneconf (both of which require network as well, right?)?
[17:09] <didrocks> jasoncwarner: exactly, as you need network in any case, it makes sense
[17:09] <pitti> jasoncwarner: ubiquity is the installer; it would be the conduit to get oneconf
[17:09] <jasoncwarner> pitti: yeah, but do we require network in ubiquity when using ubuntu one/one conf?
[17:09] <pitti> jasoncwarner: ubiquity/installer itself doesn't
[17:10] <pitti> but it offers you to install extra driver pacakges and install updates if you have network
[17:10] <pitti> enabling oneconf would use the same check
[17:10] <jasoncwarner> pitti: ok...that makes sense
[17:10] <pitti> i. e. it already has all the building blocks: checking connectivity, actions conditionalized on that, and installing pacakges
[17:11] <didrocks> pitti: just need the launching services, but shouldn't be complicated to sneak in
[17:11] <pitti> kenvandine: We alrady have a checkbox for syncing contacts in U1-prefs; can we use this, instead of patching evo?
[17:11] <kenvandine> yeah
[17:11] <pitti> sounds great
[17:11] <didrocks> pitti: u1-pref is deprecated AFAIK
[17:11] <kenvandine> they have the logic in there already for bookmarks
[17:11] <rodrigo_> yes, u1-control-panel replaces it
[17:12] <rodrigo_> so, we need to let nessita know about this
[17:12] <kenvandine> so if you check bookmarks it installs bindwood
[17:12] <didrocks> (still waiting NEWing btw :))
[17:12] <pitti> kenvandine: that sounds perfect; can you add a work item for this for the U1 team?
[17:12] <seb128> didrocks, will do it, the NEWing
[17:12]  * nessita is here
[17:12] <kenvandine> sure
[17:12] <didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
[17:12] <pitti> kenvandine: thanks
[17:12] <nessita> kenvandine: u1prefs is being replaced
[17:13] <pitti> jasoncwarner: ok, this seems like a good solution and consensus
[17:13] <jasoncwarner> cool. does anyone think we shouldn't remove desktopcouch? I haven't heard anyone jump up and say we absolutely have to keep it. :)
[17:13] <kenvandine> nessita, yeah
[17:13] <seb128> jasoncwarner, pitti: the u1 team will be unhappy
[17:13] <seb128> but out of this...
[17:13] <rodrigo_> nessita, we're discussing about removing desktopcouch from the CD, and so have evo-couchdb and its dependencies installed when the user selects syncing of contacts in u1-control-panel
[17:13] <seb128> I would say do it early and see what users think
[17:13] <pitti> seb128: just because it's "theirs", or because it will make the user ecperience much worse?
[17:14] <seb128> pitti, because they think it'll slow u1 adoption I think
[17:14] <nessita> rodrigo_: I'm not sure about that, our roadmap does not plan for that
[17:14] <jasoncwarner> seb128: ack on that. I'll go talk to them about it
[17:14] <pitti> of course we won't drop it until that automagic install will be working
[17:14] <nessita> rodrigo_: that meaning, is not a trivial adding to the control panel to install some packages to enable contact synch
[17:15] <pitti> [ACTION] jasoncwarner to negotiate evo-couchdb dropping with U1 team, and automagic installation via u1-control-panel
[17:15] <pitti> I think we can help with the control-panel integartion
[17:15] <pitti> just to agree to the approach
[17:15] <jasoncwarner> pitti: got the item :)
[17:15] <pitti> jasoncwarner: what was the other thing you want to discuss?
[17:15] <jasoncwarner> if that is settled...only other thing I have is
[17:16] <jasoncwarner> 2. OOo is crashing in Natty right now :) Something to watch for (in other words could people test it).
[17:16] <pitti> WFM (writer)
[17:17] <didrocks> jasoncwarner: when scrolling?
[17:17] <pitti> it does look a bit funny, though (the buttons have some shadow)
[17:17] <pitti> but I guess that needs to wait for an OO.o maintainer
[17:17] <seb128> jasoncwarner, works there
[17:18] <jasoncwarner> pitti: didrocks: I had reports of a crash and I had a crash (might be unrelated...was asking people to watch for it).
[17:18] <seb128> didrocks, this crasher crashes compiz not the application though
[17:18] <pitti> jasoncwarner: right, current compiz crashes all the time
[17:18] <didrocks> seb128: sometimes, compiz brings the application with him
[17:18] <didrocks> it*
[17:18] <kenvandine> not really unlike mutter :)
[17:19] <Sarvatt> compiz doesn't crash often here, just gtk-window-decorator crashing and respawning constantly taking out window decorations
[17:19] <jasoncwarner> pitti: I'm done :)
[17:19] <jasoncwarner> thanks guys!
[17:19] <pitti> cool, thanks everyone!
[17:19] <tremolux> thx folks, good day all
[17:19] <seb128> thanks
[17:20] <didrocks> thanks :)
[17:20] <rodrigo_> thanks :-D
[17:20]  * kenvandine waves, time for lunch!
[17:20] <mterry> yay
[17:20] <seb128> hum, calendar reminder about the meeting
[17:20] <pitti> jasoncwarner: ok, I'll paste the log; are you doing the final writeup, or should we rotate that in the team?
[17:21] <jasoncwarner> pitti: I'll do it ...no worries
[17:22] <tremolux> lunch me too
[17:23] <pitti> dinner and off for the evening for me, cu tomorrow!
[17:23] <didrocks> see you pitti
[17:23] <tremolux> 'night pitti
[17:25] <pitti> jasoncwarner: log pasted
[17:25] <jasoncwarner> pitti: thanks! have a great night
[17:28] <seb128> pitti, 'night
[17:29] <seb128> rodrigo_, ok, I had some issues with gnome-panel and local changes so I didn't properly merges your patch so don't worry about the merge request
[17:29] <seb128> rodrigo_, I deleted it but it's merged in and uploaded
[17:32] <bryceh> pitti, last few comments on bug 636311 make it sound like it's been resolved but people don't know what updated to fix it... maybe kernel.
[17:32] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 636311 in xserver-xorg-input-evdev (Ubuntu Natty) (and 6 other projects) "Keyboard special keys interfere with mouse (affects: 198) (dups: 15) (heat: 780)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/636311
[18:47] <seb128> kenvandine, https://code.launchpad.net/~fluteflute/ubuntu/natty/indicator-messages/indicator-messages-fix-658096/+merge/40473 btw
[18:48] <dobey> seb128: hey. i can't make uploads to packages i don't have rights for, so i guess i have to file bugs with diff.gz attached to get them updated?
[18:49] <seb128> dobey, or point to a vcs which has the upload to build
[18:49] <seb128> or do a merge request against the packaging vcs
[18:49] <kenvandine> seb128, yeah, waiting on the next update
[18:49] <seb128> kenvandine, ok, I'm just pointing it because it's showing on the sponsoring queue
[18:49] <seb128> kenvandine, thanks ;-)
[18:49] <kenvandine> ah, i'll merge now just leave UNRELEASED :)
[18:52] <dobey> ok
[18:52] <seb128> kenvandine, thanks
[18:52] <seb128> dobey, what package is that?
[18:53] <dobey> seb128: right now, ubuntuone-dev-tools
[18:53] <seb128> if they have a vcs do a merge request
[18:54] <dobey> just the branch from the import from the original uploads
[18:54] <dobey> should i merge against that, or just do the diff.gz?
[18:57] <seb128> dobey, the standard way would be for you to get a checkout of the packaging vcs, do your changes, push somewhere on your launchpad account and request a merge back
[18:58] <dobey> right
[19:01] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - oh, you had an accident with gnome-bluetooth ;)
[19:02] <cyphermox> kenvandine, I'm done preparing connman, if you want to review it
[19:23] <fagan> getting an interesting bug with unity+flash+chromium
[19:23] <fagan> Bug #683303
[19:23] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 683303 in unity (Ubuntu) "Unity [compiz] adobe flash+chromium crash (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/683303
[19:24] <fagan> the terminal didnt output anything very informative though
[19:25] <seb128> chrisccoulson, I knew it would happen with that GNOME3 ppa
[19:25] <seb128> would be nice if the ppa has a different upload target
[19:25] <seb128> natty-ppa
[19:26] <seb128> has -> had
[19:26] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i've nearly done that so many times as well ;)
[19:26] <micahg> seb128: you can do that if you force the series in .dput.cf
[19:26] <micahg> or on the cli
[19:26] <micahg> err, maybe not on the cli
[19:27] <seb128> you mean?
[19:27] <seb128> like using natty-ppa in the changelog and having dput changing the files you upload?
[19:27] <micahg> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/538387/
[19:28] <micahg> seb128: that's for dput and you can use what you want as the series in the changelog
[19:28] <micahg> the brackets is just what you pass to dput when uploading
[19:29] <seb128> well I know how to upload to the ppa
[19:29] <seb128> but will the ppa accept an upload to "natty-ppa"
[19:29] <seb128> like having the changelog having "natty-ppa"
[19:29] <seb128> so uploads to natty would fail
[19:29] <micahg> seb128: only if you set the series in .dput.cf like I did (see the incoming line)
[19:30] <seb128> well I would assume soyuz checks for known series
[19:30] <seb128> jaunty is one
[19:30] <seb128> but natty-ppa not
[19:30] <micahg> seb128: right, setting in .dput.cf makes it not check the changelog for the series
[19:30] <seb128> right
[19:30] <seb128> but is the server side checking?
[19:31] <seb128> I would assume soyuz will not accept an upload to "random"
[19:31] <micahg> seb128: no, it should override the server side check
[19:31] <seb128> hum ok, I need to try that, that seems weird
[19:31] <micahg> seb128: https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/PPA/Uploading#Using%20packages%20from%20other%20distributions
[19:39] <seb128> micahg, thanks
[19:39] <micahg> seb128: np
[19:39] <dobey> seb128: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/natty/ubuntuone-dev-tools/devtools-012/+merge/42295
[19:41] <seb128> dobey, ok, I've to run for a bit but I will sponsor that later if nobody else do it before
[19:43] <dobey> seb128: ok, thanks
[19:50] <mterry> didrocks, latest unity is not responsive to clicks, but does update itself visually....
[19:50] <didrocks> mterry: it's working there and for other people
[19:51] <mterry> hmm
[19:51] <didrocks> I really have to go, more than 13 hours without any break and I will be killed soon there :)
[19:51] <mterry> didrocks, kbye
[19:51] <didrocks> mterry: try to ping smspillaz later (when he's awake) if you can catch him :)
[19:52] <didrocks> mterry: also, try the gnome classic session to ensure it's not compiz related
[19:52] <didrocks> bye guys :)
[20:08] <bilalakhtar> gksu is in the desktop package set?
[20:11] <cyphermox> bilalakhtar, apparently not.
[20:11] <bilalakhtar> cyphermox: okay
[20:12] <micahg> bilalakhtar: not any more, it's in desktop-core
[20:12] <bilalakhtar> micahg: yup, got it
[20:25] <devildante> how do you build empathy? apt-get build-dep empathy doesn't seem to be enough
[20:26] <devildante> and the GNOME3 Stack PPA isn't either
[20:26] <didrocks> ok, back for a few minutes
[20:27] <didrocks> mterry: did you figure out your issue?
[20:27] <mterry> didrocks, no, but I filed a bug... let me get the number
[20:27] <didrocks> mterry: that's weird… all unity is not reactive?
[20:28] <mterry> didrocks, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/683328
[20:28] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 683328 in unity (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Unity does not accept mouse clicks (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
[20:28] <mterry> didrocks, it is if I'm in the middle of an alt-tab...  ;)
[20:29] <didrocks> mterry: waow, which version of nux do you have?
[20:31] <jcastro> didrocks: from the list of A1 bugs from skaet_  I guess we'll have to MIR/Banshee after A1.
[20:32] <didrocks> jcastro: yeah I've already postponed the task, the MIR isn't reviewed
[20:32] <didrocks> and it's too late to switch the seed now
[20:32] <didrocks> jcastro: but from A1, we will have working daily iso build, so not a huge issue
[20:32] <didrocks> can be switched quite easily by default
[20:32] <jcastro> nod
[20:33] <didrocks> mterry: we lost you! do an alt-tab to answer :p
[20:34] <didrocks> mterry: btw, you have a big compiz plugin list, maybe trying for to revert to default one?
[20:42] <mterry> didrocks, woah, you did lose me
[20:42] <mterry> didrocks, i'm back!
[20:43] <didrocks> mterry: \o/
[20:43] <mterry> didrocks, big compiz plugin list?  ok... how do I go back to default?
[20:43] <didrocks> mterry: you have latest compiz right?
[20:43] <mterry> didrocks, bleeding edge
[20:43] <didrocks> nice, so
[20:43] <didrocks> metacity --replace
[20:44] <didrocks> because compiz won't help :)
[20:44] <didrocks> then
[20:44] <mterry> k
[20:44] <didrocks> gconftools-2 --recursive-unset /apps/compiz-1
[20:44] <didrocks> and gconftools-2 --recursive-unset /apps/compizconfig-1
[20:44] <mterry> done
[20:45] <mterry> now I do compiz --replace ccp?
[20:46] <mterry> didrocks, ^
[20:47] <didrocks> mterry: compiz --replace should be enough
[20:47] <didrocks> (we have a distro-patch to add ccp when you have no plugin listed)
[20:47] <mterry> nice, makes sense
[20:47] <didrocks> not sure why upstream doesn't want it )
[20:47] <didrocks> :)
[20:47] <mterry> didrocks, ok, unity is up and responsive.  hopefully it will be next time I log in too.  I'll comment on bug
[20:47] <mterry> didrocks, thanks!
[20:48] <devildante> didrocks: that actually fixed my compiz crash, thanks :)
[20:48] <mterry> didrocks, not sure why my compiz list was non-default
[20:48] <didrocks> mterry: for bonus point, you can add plugins until it's not working :)
[20:48] <didrocks> devildante: hehe, double fix in one command then? \o/
[20:48] <devildante> :)
[20:48] <didrocks> ok, so that was useful 20 minutes at least!
[20:48] <mterry> didrocks, :)
[20:48] <didrocks> now, it's really time to enjoy the evening
[20:49] <didrocks> (with light heart and not last time "OMGUnityIsBroken" :))
[20:49] <didrocks> ok, have a good evening everyone, see you tomorrow
[20:50] <didrocks> s/time/minute
[21:16] <chrisccoulson> pitti - am i ok to upload tbird to fix bug 682748?
[21:16] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 682748 in thunderbird (Ubuntu Natty) (and 1 other project) "thunderbird doesn't build in natty due to linker changes (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/682748
[21:19] <seb128> chrisccoulson, you should ask on #ubuntu-release
[21:20] <chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i should do really :)
[21:20] <ShacakaL> Hi friends
[21:22] <micahg> chrisccoulson: assuming 3.1.6 works, I don't see the need to have 3.1.7 in alpha 1
[21:22] <chrisccoulson> micahg - well, the 3.1.7 upload doesn't build. we should just fix it ;)
[21:23] <micahg> chrisccoulson: right, but what if the build is broken even if it's successful
[21:23] <chrisccoulson> i'll know if that's the case in a few seconds
[21:23] <chrisccoulson> once it has installed
[21:23] <chrisccoulson> if my laptop hurries up!
[22:01] <jasoncwarner> Morning! Everyone. Meeting time! :)
[22:01] <jasoncwarner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-11-30
[22:02] <jasoncwarner> bryceh: RAOF: robert_ancell: TheMuso: you guys here?
[22:02] <TheMuso> Yep.
[22:02] <robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, yup
[22:02] <jasoncwarner> morning TheMuso: robert_ancell
[22:03] <jasoncwarner> (giving RAOF and bryceh another minute)
[22:05] <jasoncwarner> Ok...guess we should get started...
[22:05] <jasoncwarner> was everyone able to update meeting notes? this is the week we are trying out something new.
[22:06]  * jasoncwarner gives everyone a minute to load and review page *very* quickly
[22:07] <TheMuso> Totally slipped my mind. I must admit I am a bit absorbed with the unity a11y stuff atm, absorbed to the point where I tend to forget administrative matters occasionally.
[22:07] <jasoncwarner> western edition has some comments (see chat log on format).
[22:08] <chrisccoulson> oh, i just added my bits to the summary, i probably should have done that earlier though ;)
[22:08] <jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: thanks ;)
[22:09] <jasoncwarner> Ok...moving on to topics
[22:09] <robert_ancell> how do the eastern edition people find the notes for reading?
[22:10] <TheMuso> I find them ok.
[22:10] <robert_ancell> ok, better? ok, same?
[22:11]  * jasoncwarner notes the lively bunch this morning. 
[22:11] <jasoncwarner> ;)
[22:11] <TheMuso> For me, its no different to how things were, since I tend to be aware of what is going on already./
[22:11] <TheMuso> The format is easier to digets though.
[22:11] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, so did you previously read them, and do you read them now?
[22:12] <TheMuso> I read them now because feedback is wanted. I tended to read reports of those people's work that affects me, or interests me.
[22:13] <TheMuso> I do prefer the older meeting summary format./
[22:13] <TheMuso> though
[22:13] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, ok.  What aspects of the older format do you think the new format is missing?
[22:13] <RAOF_> Sorry; compiz thought that was a good time to wedge my desktop.
[22:14] <TheMuso> A list of action items, partner update, kubuntu update, etc.
[22:14] <robert_ancell> RAOF_: heh, know that
[22:14] <robert_ancell> TheMuso, ok, so we still have action item.  The headings are not there for this trial, but I'm going to make an alternative write up with headings so we can compare
[22:14] <jasoncwarner> RAOF_ :)
[22:14] <chrisccoulson> i like the general summary idea in the new format, but it seems to have ended up with there being a lot of text, and presented in a slightly disorganized way
[22:15] <TheMuso> ok.
[22:15] <TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Yeah I agree with that.
[22:15] <robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, do you think a few headings (X, Unity etc) will improve that?
[22:15] <RAOF_> I noticed that I was the ony person who did any updates to it during the week.  Unless I was looking at the wrong place :)
[22:15] <robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, do we have any actions to put in that section
[22:15] <robert_ancell> RAOF_, you were :)
[22:15] <chrisccoulson> robert_ancell, yeah, a few headings would definately help there
[22:16] <TheMuso> As I said, I tend to gravitate to those things that affect/interest me only, so sorting with some kind of heading structure would make that easier.
[22:16] <TheMuso> Granted, a lot of the desktop goings on do interest me.
[22:16] <Amaranth> I wish launchpad had some way of making package groups so I could see all of the bugs from several packages at once
[22:17] <jasoncwarner> robert_ancell: I have an action, but haven't gotten to it yet. though, my action is to mail out summary ;)
[22:17] <seb128> hey guys ;-)
[22:18] <RAOF_> Amaranth: That would be pretty useful; moreso if you could do tag groups (like: kernel bugs marked “radeon” + xserver-xorg-video-radeon + Xorg bugs)
[22:18] <jasoncwarner> hey seb128
[22:18] <seb128> robert_ancell, jasoncwarner: I find the sections easier to read as well
[22:18] <RAOF_> Good evening seb128
[22:18] <seb128> hey RAOF
[22:18] <robert_ancell> seb128, hey
[22:18] <Amaranth> RAOF_: I want it for compiz packages :)
[22:18] <seb128> well I find the summary easier to read with section
[22:18] <seb128> like having a clear summary of the s-c, unity, xorg worlds
[22:19] <Amaranth> At one point I moved all of the bugs to the compiz package for just this reason but the bugsquad outsmarted me and moved a lot of them back and new bugs of course don't go to the right place
[22:19] <jasoncwarner> seb128: I think that is the general comment... robert_ancell was going to try an adapted format with headings...
[22:19] <seb128> Amaranth, the best way is to get a team subscribed to all the components you want to watch and watch the team bug
[22:19] <RAOF_> Amaranth: Talk to bryceh about getting one or more arsenal scripts to do what you want?
[22:19] <seb128> or that
[22:20] <jasoncwarner> ok...on to quick topics for eastern edition
[22:20] <Amaranth> Yeah, I should see if we can get the compiz packagers team subscribed to all of them
[22:20] <jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] X update
[22:20] <seb128> jasoncwarner, right, I was just giving my personal opinion on the summary from this week
[22:20] <robert_ancell> so, I wanted to try the minimum complexity report, and now we have a baseline we can try headings
[22:20] <Amaranth> I think it's only subscribed to compiz
[22:20] <jasoncwarner> RAOF_ or bryceh?
[22:20] <Amaranth> Oh, am I interrupting a meeting?
[22:20] <RAOF_> X update:
[22:21] <jasoncwarner> Amaranth: it's all good! no worries...we are going to be quick anyway...
[22:21] <RAOF_> Mesa 7.9 merged from Debian; this includes a switch to the gallium r300 driver and we're also building the r600 gallium driver (but it's not enabled by default)
[22:22] <RAOF_> There's also a new xorg.conf option to switch between the two drivers - ForceGallium true will enable the gallium driver, ForceGallium false will enable the classic driver, and omitting the option will choose the default.
[22:23] <bryceh> heya
[22:23] <RAOF_> Mesa also shaved many megabytes of it's install size by dynamically linking the DRI drivers.
[22:23] <bryceh> we also brought up idea of moving to xserver 1.10
[22:24] <RAOF_> There doesn't seem to be anything radioactive in 1.10, so we'll probably choose to ship it in Natty, but the discussion has just started.
[22:25] <jasoncwarner> oh, bryceh and I were talking about wayland and 3d v 2d drivers for chipsets like nvidia. ....he mentioned I should ask about 3d state in -nouveau drivers... I think that is for RAOF?
[22:26] <RAOF_> Ok.  3D state in nouveau is: Upstream still doesn't want bug reports.
[22:26] <RAOF_> However, the 3D is pretty solid.
[22:26] <RAOF_> It's no less solid than some other DRI drivers we're shipping - savage, mga, etc.
[22:26] <bryceh> of the userbase numbers I've seen, NVIDIA graphics hardware is by far the most widely owned
[22:27] <bryceh> which means if we had a solid nouveau+unity story, then the unity play will go a lot further
[22:28] <jasoncwarner> bryceh: that was going to be my question...I guess I can update to unity and try nouveau and see :)
[22:28] <RAOF_> There are a couple of remaining problems - nouveau 3D is more likely to hit paths that end in a GPU lockup, and nouveau doesn't yet have powermanagement (although that looks moderately likely to land in 2.6.38)
[22:29] <RAOF_> And then there are some newer chips which nouveau won't drive at all, but that's somewhat par for the course. :/
[22:30] <bryceh> an uneviable choice we have
[22:31] <bryceh> we can opt to stick with non-3D nouveau, and thus limit how many people will be able to run unity by at least 50%
[22:31] <jasoncwarner> thanks, RAOF_ ...I'll probably ping you later to discuss a bit more
[22:31] <jasoncwarner> bryceh: is that glass half full or half empty talking? ;)
[22:32] <robert_ancell> or damned if you do, and damned if you don't
[22:32] <bryceh> or we can enable 3D on nouveau to support unity, but likely cause widespread breakages, and lots of bug reports that we won't be able to do anything about (since upstream won't take the bug reports, and since gpu hang bugs are insanely hard to troubleshoot)
[22:32] <bryceh> I think robert_ancell has it.  ;-)
[22:32] <jasoncwarner> :)
[22:33] <RAOF_> I don't know how likely widespread breakages are, although they're certianly a risk.
[22:33] <jasoncwarner> ok... bryceh and RAOF_, I'd like to talk more outside the meeting just so I have a feel for it.
[22:33] <jasoncwarner> cool?
[22:33] <RAOF_> Yup.
[22:33] <bryceh> well one last question... does unity run on -nvidia ?
[22:33] <RAOF_> Yes.
[22:33] <chrisccoulson> didrocks runs it on nvidia i think
[22:33] <bryceh> ok, then no problem
[22:34] <RAOF_> Like kwin, many of the DX team develop on nvidia systems :)
[22:34] <chrisccoulson> i steer clear of nvidia systems having owned a nvidia based desktop for years
[22:34] <chrisccoulson> :)
[22:34]  * TheMuso recently swapped out the NVIDIA card in his desktop for a 2nd hand amd card.
[22:35] <RAOF_> The AMD cards do have the advantage of working out of the box, yeah. :)
[22:35] <TheMuso> Although my notebook has NVIDIA, so I don't get to avoid it entirely
[22:35] <bryceh> the wayland + unity + nouveau combo we probably don't need to worry about getting sorted for natty
[22:35]  * RAOF_ shudders
[22:35] <bryceh> ;-)
[22:36] <RAOF_> Are we going to have a wayland + unity + *anything* combo for Natty?
[22:36] <jasoncwarner> next topic [TOPIC] A11y
[22:36] <jasoncwarner> RAOF_ wayland? no
[22:36] <RAOF_> Yeah, didn't think so.
[22:36] <TheMuso> Not really much to report. Started working on a an a11y design for the launcher, but was then asked to look at the unity panel, as the qa team want to start automated testing on it.
[22:37] <TheMuso> The issue with the unity panel is whilst one can navigate menus once clicked on, i.e navigate up/down menus, one cannot move from one menu to another using arrow keys.
[22:37] <TheMuso> Whilst not an a11y issue as such, it does prevent testing, and general keyboard usage.
[22:37] <TheMuso> A solution also needs to be found for labeling indicator icons in the accessibility framework, which I am currently looking into now.
[22:38] <seb128> the left,right not working issue is a bug
[22:38] <TheMuso> seb128: Yes exactly.
[22:39] <seb128> did you let the unity team know it's blocking testing?
[22:39] <TheMuso> njpatel asked me to look at the panel because QA wanted to test it, I just had a play with the panel as much as I could and reported my findings.
[22:41] <TheMuso> So I think they are aware that its blocking testing.
[22:42] <jasoncwarner> TheMuso: I would confirm...just to be sure..
[22:42] <TheMuso> Ok.
[22:42]  * TheMuso feels stretched in multiple directions atm...
[22:42] <TheMuso> :)
[22:42] <jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] Anything Else?
[22:43] <jasoncwarner> robert_ancell: wasn't sure what you wanted to report
[22:43] <robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, report?
[22:44] <robert_ancell> just the usual gnome2.32/gnome3 updates from me
[22:44] <robert_ancell> One last thing, I tidied up the formatting of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-11-30 and added sections
[22:46] <bryceh> robert_ancell, I like the new format a lot.  much easier to grok
[22:46] <robert_ancell> bryceh, needs some graphs though :)
[22:46] <bryceh> I have one!
[22:46] <bryceh> http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-natty-workqueue.svg
[22:48] <bryceh> kind of a boring graph, but in this case that's a very good thing ;-)
[22:48] <robert_ancell> bryceh, nice :), we need an easy way to drop that sort of thing in
[22:48]  * jasoncwarner notes his love of graphs
[22:49] <bryceh> this is enabling us to keep tight track of *all* xorg bugs filed against natty
[22:49] <seb128> bryceh, what do you consider the "workqueue"?
[22:50] <seb128> the bugs which have a natty task?
[22:50] <bryceh> seb128, bugs that need our attention; i.e. that are not Incomplete without response, or forwarded upstream, or fix committed
[22:50] <bryceh> seb128, no it looks for bugs that have  a tag 'natty'
[22:50] <seb128> the count seems really low...
[22:50] <bryceh> apport and arsenal add 'natty' tags automatically where we can determine the user's version based on logs
[22:51] <bryceh> seb128, yes but we're still pre-alpha-1
[22:51]  * TheMuso notes his dislike of graphs.
[22:51] <bryceh> my experience has been that it'll go up exponentially as we get towards beta
[22:52] <seb128> well, you consider that all issues open before natty don't concern natty unless someone checks and confirms it's still an issue then?
[22:52] <seb128> (just curious of other teams workflows)
[22:52] <bryceh> seb128, that's correct
[22:53] <bryceh> seb128, I might bug-spam people to ask them to re-test maverick bugs against natty after alpha-1 or alpha-2, as I've done in the past
[22:53] <bryceh> and then if they run apport-collect it should re-tag them natty
[22:53] <bryceh> and then they'll appear on this chart :-)
[22:54] <bryceh> TheMuso, that's a fair point.  It would be pretty straightforward for me to represent the data in a table format as well
[22:54] <TheMuso> bryceh: ok cool.
[22:55] <bryceh> TheMuso, which would be displayed in a format similar to http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/patches.html
[22:55] <TheMuso> ok
[22:55] <bryceh> TheMuso, just let me know if it is something you would use, I'd be more than happy to set it up
[22:55] <TheMuso> bryceh: Thanks for the heads up, will let you know if I am interested.
[22:55] <seb128> bryceh, interesting
[22:56] <seb128> I'm still trying to figure how to deal with desktop bugs
[22:56] <bryceh> TheMuso, already collecting the data and generating a few graphs for audio bugs - http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-audio/
[22:56] <seb128> we pretty much stopped dealing with them and rely on qa or triager to raise issues nowadays...
[22:56]  * TheMuso looks.
[22:56] <seb128> but it's not really optimal
[22:57] <bryceh> seb128, so far I'm liking this approach, it helps us focus on ones confirmed as natty bugs, and we can get to them very quickly (same day service) if the user filed them using apport
[22:57] <bryceh> and it feels good to be able to drive a graph to zero :-)
[22:57] <TheMuso> Audio is a firehose as well, so we tend to just deal with them as they come in, as best we can. Because we often have to wait a long while before we can actually get fixes into the dev release at the time, its just easier to work upstream and let users know when the fix has arrived.
[22:57] <seb128> well you can get to triaging quickly
[22:58] <seb128> but it means you might get old bugs slipping out easily
[22:58] <bryceh> TheMuso, *nod*.  I sometimes do similar, that's why I count "forwarded upstream" as a (temporary) resolution to exclude the bug from this chart
[22:59] <TheMuso> Right.
[22:59] <bryceh> I think I have it set so when the upstream bug gets marked fix released, it'll show up again in the work queue (so I can decide about backporting the fix)
[23:00] <bryceh> there's also a separate report just for those types of bugs - e.g. http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-audio/upstream-fixed.html
[23:02] <bryceh> robert_ancell, are we going to continue to use the new meeting report format for next week?
[23:02] <seb128> bryceh, could you get a timestamp on the pages?
[23:03] <bryceh> seb128, yep, sure can
[23:03] <robert_ancell> bryceh, I want to, I guess it's up to jasoncwarner?
[23:03] <seb128> bryceh, http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/desktop-bugs/
[23:03] <robert_ancell> I think most people are convinced it's the same or better
[23:03] <seb128> bryceh, does the timestamps there means only the milestone one is updated?
[23:03] <seb128> robert_ancell, I think most people will be convinced it's better with your formatting update you did ;-)
[23:04] <bryceh> seb128, yes, but I'll get those flipped back on.  Sometimes launchpad chokes with some of the larger bug collections
[23:04] <seb128> robert_ancell, I think most people will be convinced it's better with your formatting update you did ;-)
[23:04] <seb128> ups
[23:05] <seb128> bryceh, ok, thanks
[23:05] <seb128> bryceh, did you think about getting those scripts run on a people page rather than your own server?
[23:05] <seb128> would that be possible?
[23:06] <seb128> (like depends available etc)?
[23:06]  * jasoncwarner can't tell if we are still having meeting anymore (not saying much about my moderation skills ;) )
[23:06] <robert_ancell> jasoncwarner, break out the gavel
[23:06] <jasoncwarner> [END MEETING] :)
[23:06] <jasoncwarner> robert_ancell: btw..like the newly formatted wiki as well.
[23:07] <jasoncwarner> groups help me and I like the summary also
[23:07] <seb128> I like having the words highlighted
[23:09] <RAOF_> Yeah, that's really good.
[23:09] <bryceh> seb128, I used to rsync the results onto the people page but elmo asked not to do that since he didn't want automated things with ssh keys
[23:10] <seb128> bryceh, well that would not be really useful (out of sparing some load from your server)
[23:10] <bryceh> seb128, I have on my todo list to investigate running the scripts there but it's a bit tricky due to dependencies and stuff
[23:10] <seb128> I was rather asking because things running on people can be edited by any platform team member
[23:11] <micahg> jasoncwarner: got a minute for a PM?
[23:11] <seb128> like having the work items tracker there is a nice win for pitti and for others as well
[23:11] <seb128> it means any team can tweak their queries
[23:11] <seb128> bryceh, ok
[23:11] <seb128> not sure how much you need
[23:11] <bryceh> seb128, ah, true, I've just assumed no one else would be interested in helping maintain the jobs, but it's worth considering
[23:12] <seb128> I would be interested maintaining the desktop ones
[23:12] <seb128> or at least helping maintaining those :-)
[23:12] <jasoncwarner> micahg: certainly
[23:14] <bryceh> ok cool, I'll poke around on people and see what's available.  There's one dependency for doing html templates which I know won't be there but I can probably replace with a different one (the one the security team uses).
[23:14] <bryceh> with the wayland stuff winding down, I can turn focus to working on the reporting stuff more
[23:17] <RAOF_> bryceh: Oh, thinking of which, is there anything more in the mesa department you'd like me to review?
[23:17] <bryceh> RAOF_, next step with that is to make sure wayland works on radeon and nouveau, so making sure mesa is packaging the right bits there is the big thing
[23:18] <bryceh> after that, the focus would turn to getting the packaging bits and pieces (like cairo-gl) accepted into the archive
[23:18] <bryceh> which doesn't have to be done for natty, but the more we can get done, the easier waylandy things will be in the future
[23:19] <RAOF_> Right.
[23:19] <bryceh> RAOF_, so I'd be interested in hearing of any of the packaging that can't be taken into natty for whatever reason, so we can explore/resolve those issues in coming weeks/months
[23:19] <RAOF_> We should be able to get all the mesa ducks in a row at the very least.
[23:20] <RAOF_> Hm.  Is there no natty build of wayland in the PPA?
[23:21] <bryceh> RAOF_, not yet, just been focusing on maverick
[23:21] <RAOF_> Ok.  When there is I'll test on my nouveau & radeon systems.
[23:21] <bryceh> but I think that's close enough to done that we can do natty builds
[23:27] <bryceh> alright desktop-bugs is re-enabled - http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/desktop-bugs/
[23:28] <bryceh> hmm, I bet a lot of the bugs on http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/upstream-fixed.html could be closed
[23:29] <bryceh> RAOF_, as you package new releases ^^ might be a useful report for finding bugs #'s to include in changelogs to auto-close ;-)
[23:36] <RAOF_> :)