[03:02] <Drakeson> I want to create a bootable {cd,dvd,usb stick,etc.}.  I can create a chroot by debootstrap.  I can also install grub2 on that partition.  Is there any *major* step that I might be missing?
[03:03] <ebroder> Drakeson: Checkout the livecd-rootfs package to see how the live CD's...rootfs's get built. There are a bunch of tweaks you probably want to do. Like, say, install a kernel for starters
[03:12] <Drakeson> ebroder: thanks. livecd-rootfs looks very useful.
[05:57] <pitti> Good morning
[05:58] <pitti> ScottK: no, it's not a problem to have installed; in lucid I changed it from starting at boot to dbus activation, so as long as nothing tries to talk to it, it remains inert
[05:59] <pitti> ScottK: XFCE upstream also made the switch, and the packages are currently flowing into natty, so at some point hal shold just drop to universe; then the upgrade should take care of auto-cleanup
[07:33] <didrocks> good morning
[08:18] <dholbach> good morning!
[08:19] <didrocks> hey dholbach
[08:20] <dholbach> hey didrocks
[08:21] <bilalakhtar> Good morning dholbach !
[08:21] <bilalakhtar> dholbach: What is the procedure of adding datasources to hall-of-fame.u.c?
[08:21] <dholbach> bilalakhtar, it's currently unmaintained and being rewritten
[08:22] <dholbach> bilalakhtar, but if you set up some kind of script that sets up a .csv file somewhere that is easy to parse I can add it
[08:22] <dholbach> just send me an email
[08:22] <bilalakhtar> I have a script that writes it to an HTML
[08:22] <dholbach> hum
[08:22] <dholbach> I think it'd be better to just have the values
[08:22] <bilalakhtar> dholbach: http://people.ubuntu.com/~bilalakhtar/papercutters-hall-of-fame.html
[08:22] <bilalakhtar> dholbach: CSV would be easier
[08:23] <bilalakhtar> I would do the thing and mail you
[08:23] <dholbach> excellent
[08:24] <dholbach> bilalakhtar, just "launchpad-id, number" is enough
[08:25] <bilalakhtar> good, will do surely
[08:25] <bilalakhtar> dholbach: BTW, is it proprietary?
[08:27] <dholbach> bilalakhtar, yes, and the code sucks - it's really really bad stuff that contains passwords and all the rest of it
[08:27] <dholbach> that's why it's being rewritten in django
[08:27] <bilalakhtar> oh
[08:27] <dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Spec/HallOfFameRewrite
[08:27] <dholbach> I had to finish it quickly back then and it's really horrible
[08:28] <dholbach> so I hope we can do it properly soon
[08:31] <bilalakhtar> will do soon
[09:00] <bilalakhtar> dholbach: Should the list limit the people to 10 or something? or will the hall of fame do that?
[09:00] <dholbach> bilalakhtar, I can limit it easily, no problem
[09:20] <quadrispro> hi all
[09:20] <quadrispro> is there any release manager around?
[09:20] <micahg> quadrispro: try #ubuntu-release :)
[09:20] <quadrispro> s/release manager/sru member/
[09:20] <quadrispro> micahg, trying, thanks
[09:21] <micahg> quadrispro: oh, pitti's around somewhere for SRUs  :)
[09:21]  * pitti hides :)
[09:21] <quadrispro> pitti, bug #665243, would you take a look?
[09:21] <quadrispro> pitti, the patch seems to work fine
[09:37] <pitti> quadrispro: (in a bit, having another discussion right now)
[09:39] <quadrispro> ok
[10:20] <jibel> pitti, Is the removal of wubi.exe from the ISO part of the 'reducing cd footprint' policy ?
[10:20] <pitti> jibel: I'm not aware of this; sounds like a bug rather?
[10:20] <jibel> pitti, sounds like a bug to me too, bug filed. Thanks.
[10:25] <pitti> quadrispro: seems fine to me
[10:28] <quadrispro> good!
[10:32] <quadrispro> pitti, please leave a msg on the report, I'll upload it right now
[10:32] <pitti> quadrispro: you don't need a prior ack, just upload :)
[10:32] <quadrispro> \o/
[10:32] <quadrispro> I didn't know
[10:33] <quadrispro> thanks!
[10:33] <micahg> quadrispro: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure <-- see step #4 at the end :)
[10:34] <quadrispro> ahhh yes, I see
[10:34] <quadrispro> I forgot it
[11:08] <chrisccoulson> @pilot in
[11:08] <chrisccoulson> yay \o/
[11:09] <dholbach> yeeeeehaw :)
[11:09]  * dholbach hugs chrisccoulson
[11:09]  * chrisccoulson hugs dholbach
[11:09] <dholbach> :)
[11:13] <cjwatson> ev: could you make http://people.canonical.com/~evand/wubi/natty/stable exist, please?
[11:13] <cjwatson> jibel,pitti: ^- that's the cause of wubi.exe going missing
[11:13] <ev> bah, I should've done that when I sorted usb-creator
[11:14] <pitti> cjwatson: ah, thanks for the heads-up
[11:15] <ev> cjwatson: done, I've put the signed version from maverick up for now.  Should I build a copy against the latest grub, or have there not been many changes there yet?
[11:16] <cjwatson> ev: would probably be a good idea after alpha-1.  let's leave it with what we have for now?
[11:16] <ev> sure
[11:29] <jhunt_> tseliot: hi - talking to apw about nvidia drivers: he mentioned that X may soon allow a graceful fallback from nvidia to nouveau. Meantime, could we consider maybe having a facility that only boots kernels compatible with the nvidia drivers?
[11:30] <tseliot> jhunt_: err.. what do you mean by "only boot kernels compatible with the nvidia drivers"?
[11:33] <jibel> cjwatson, thank you for the info.
[11:35]  * cjwatson fixes MoM, I think
[11:35] <cjwatson> and wags a finger at quadrispro for breaking it. :)
[11:37] <quadrispro> cjwatson, huh? did i break something? :/
[11:37] <cjwatson> quadrispro: your mixxx upload that didn't unpack properly
[11:37] <cjwatson> (to Debian)
[11:38] <cjwatson> MoM gets really upset by that kind of thing :)
[11:39] <quadrispro> cjwatson, maybe is it due to the fact that I use different quilt series?
[11:39] <cjwatson> you fixed it in -4
[11:40] <cjwatson> but it was stuck trying to unpack -3
[11:40] <quadrispro> ahhh! yes
[11:40] <cjwatson> wonder why that didn't get rejected on upload to Debian, though
[11:40] <quadrispro> yep, and this was actually 'cause of that I said above
[11:41] <quadrispro> I wrongly appended the patch to the quilt's ubuntu.series, so it got a little mess
[11:42] <cjwatson> you mean it failed to unpack in Ubuntu but not in Debian?
[11:42] <quadrispro> no, only in Debian, I didn't upload it to Ubuntu
[11:42] <cjwatson> ok
[11:43] <cjwatson> still; I think maybe MoM needs to be careful to ensure that the proper series file is used when unpacking
[11:43] <quadrispro> ACK
[11:44] <quadrispro> cjwatson, and I'd like to take a closer look at MoM, hope to do it soon
[11:45] <quadrispro> cjwatson, PS: I tried to catch you during the natty's release party in London, but I failed to find you guys :(
[11:47] <cjwatson> the maverick party?  it was buried deep in the weird uncharted depths of London
[11:47] <cjwatson> or you mean you found the party but not me?
[11:48] <quadrispro> no, I get to the "shooting star" but seemed there was no party at all
[11:57] <quadrispro> leaving, bye!
[12:11] <chrisccoulson> cjwatson - for bug 616682 - do you still just want the patches backported from maverick, or am i ok to upload 2.10.0 to lucid-proposed? i just attached a minimal diff, showing what the upstream changes look like without all of the autotools bits in it
[12:19] <cjwatson> chrisccoulson: the whitespace changes and the like are tedious, but I suppose that isn't too bad
[12:21] <chrisccoulson> cjwatson, yeah, it looks like quite a small diff, but i can take whichever approach you prefer for it anyway
[12:40] <jhunt_> tseliot: kernel linux-image-2.6.35-23-generic-pae breaks my nvidia (NVS 3100M). If I switch to linux-image-2.6.35-22-generic-pae I'm good.
[13:48] <jdstrand> didrocks: hi! do you have a moment to talk about unity vs the old gnome desktop? today's update really broke me
[13:49] <seb128> jdstrand, just ask your question
[13:49] <jdstrand> heh
[13:49] <seb128> jdstrand, if your machine is not capable of 3d a fix has been uploaded
[13:49] <jdstrand> yes, I guess that is irc 101 isn't it
[13:49] <seb128> it will start gnome-panel for you
[13:49] <didrocks> jdstrand: sure, that's a tricky issue, I'll let you read that first: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2010-November/002689.html
[13:50] <jdstrand> well, my machine is capable of running unity, but let me read that first
[13:50] <didrocks> then, gnome-session has landed the change we needed last Monday and we will build a fallback solution for alpha2
[13:50] <seb128> jdstrand, I guess that post will not reply to your question then
[13:50] <seb128> that's about fallbacks
[13:51] <jdstrand> ok, so let me just say what happened
[13:51] <jdstrand> I'm running natty
[13:51] <jdstrand> every once in a while, I try unity be enabling the plugin
[13:52] <jdstrand> in the past there were bugs that affected my productivity, so I disabled the unity compiz plugin and used the classic plugin
[13:52] <jdstrand> so today, I did a natty upgrade from within the classic session and rebooted
[13:52] <jdstrand> I login, expecting a classic session, and no gnome-panel is launched
[13:52] <didrocks> jdstrand: what do you call "classic session", the "Ubuntu classic desktop" or "Ubuntu Desktop session"
[13:53] <seb128> I guess the second one
[13:53] <didrocks> you have two sessions in gdm
[13:53] <jdstrand> my background is drawn, with icons, so it is partially started
[13:53] <jdstrand> didrocks: I was going by the language in that email thread you mentioned
[13:53] <jdstrand> the traditional gnome desktop
[13:53] <seb128> jdstrand, so what you did is that your turned unity off from the unity session
[13:53] <didrocks> jdstrand: env | grep GDMSESSION
[13:53] <didrocks> you are in the unity session, not the classic one
[13:53] <seb128> didrocks,  you should probably not let users do that :p
[13:54] <didrocks> seb128: already planned for alpha2, need to add "mandatory plugins" in compiz
[13:54]  * jdstrand is confused
[13:54] <didrocks> just I can't do everything in a round :)
[13:54] <seb128> jdstrand, you basically shoted yourself on this one
[13:54] <jdstrand> when I disabled the plugin, I would logout and back in and have the traditional gnome desktop
[13:54] <seb128> jdstrand, the "default" session is unity now
[13:54] <jdstrand> yes
[13:54] <didrocks> jdstrand: you shouldn't do that, unity plugin will be mandatory
[13:54] <seb128> jdstrand, well it used to do that because were still running gnome-panel
[13:54] <seb128> jdstrand, which we stopped now since we don't need it
[13:55] <didrocks> jdstrand: then, in gdm, you have a "Ubuntu Classic Session" which runs compiz + gnome-panel
[13:55] <jdstrand> maybe that changed in today's update, but prior to today, I only saw one choice in gdm
[13:55] <didrocks> jdstrand: did you update to latest gnome-session?
[13:55] <jdstrand> and so I didn't know how to change to the traditional desktop
[13:56] <didrocks> 2.32.1-0ubuntu2 should get it
[13:56] <jdstrand> 2.32.1-0ubuntu3
[13:56] <didrocks> so, you should get it in gdm
[13:56] <jdstrand> btw, right this second I have:
[13:56] <jdstrand> $ env | grep GDMSESSION
[13:56] <jdstrand> GDMSESSION=gnome
[13:56] <jdstrand> but with unity
[13:56] <didrocks> yeah, this is the default session
[13:57] <didrocks> you have a gnome-classic one
[13:57] <didrocks> named Name=Ubuntu Classic Desktop
[13:57] <jdstrand> the only way I could get antyhing to work was to right click on the desktop, create a launcher to ccsm and then check the unity plugin
[13:57] <didrocks> jdstrand: yeah, in the future, yo uwon't be able to remove the unity plugin in the default session
[13:57] <didrocks> just not implemented yet
[13:57] <jdstrand> didrocks: so what I am hearing is that I should have a choice in gdm as to traditional vs unity. correct?
[13:58] <didrocks> jdstrand: right
[13:58] <jdstrand> ok, let me try that
[13:58] <didrocks> sure, keep me posted :)
[13:58]  * jdstrand -> logs out
[14:04] <jdstrand> didrocks: ok, I have the choice and gdm is picking one or the other, and unity launches ok, but logging into the classic desktop results in no window manager and my bottom panel not launching
[14:04] <didrocks> jdstrand: of course, if you don't enable the unity plugin
[14:04] <didrocks> jdstrand: and the dynamic detection is something not easy, as pointed in my post
[14:05] <jdstrand> didrocks: I need to have the unity plugin enabled in the classic desktop??
[14:05] <didrocks> it would answer the question why we don't launch gnome-panel dynamically
[14:05] <didrocks> jdstrand: well, let's use the name of the session
[14:05] <didrocks> jdstrand: are you telling about gnome-classic.desktop or gnome.desktop?
[14:05]  * jdstrand is just trying to use the terminology given in gdm now
[14:05] <didrocks> ok
[14:05] <didrocks> so gnome-classic.desktop?
[14:05] <jdstrand> gdm said Ubuntu Desktop or Ubuntu Desktop Classic or something
[14:05] <seb128> didrocks, gdm doesn't display the .desktop name
[14:06] <jdstrand> I chose Classic
[14:06] <jdstrand> my top panel started
[14:06] <didrocks> jdstrand: ok, and no panel, nor window mananger?
[14:06] <jdstrand> I have no window manager
[14:06] <jdstrand> I don't have a bottom panel
[14:06] <didrocks> hum, weird
[14:06] <didrocks> jdstrand: there is a drawing bug with the bottom panel, if you click on it, it doesn't appear?
[14:07] <jdstrand> since I had a top panel, I tried to go to Appearance and verified my desktop effects
[14:07] <didrocks> (I'm more surprized by the now window manager)
[14:07] <didrocks> jdstrand: well, it doesn't work yet with the new compiz
[14:07] <jdstrand> they were set to 'None' (odd, since I had them enabled prior to today)
[14:07] <didrocks> so, don't trust that
[14:08] <didrocks> ok, so, let's see what can happens
[14:08] <didrocks> happen*
[14:08] <didrocks> if you don't have a windowmananger, that means that ctrl + alt + t isn't working, right,
[14:08] <jdstrand> I also tried launcing ccsm to verify that the unity plugin wasn't started-- it was not checked, but I didn't change anything
[14:09] <jdstrand> well, hold on
[14:09] <didrocks> no, it's another compiz profile, so it should work without unity
[14:09] <jdstrand> let me start irssi on my console and then I can go back and forth
[14:09] <didrocks> ok :)
[14:09]  * jdstrand logs out again
[14:11] <jdstrand> ok, I am back
[14:12] <didrocks> ok, so, you have no window manager at all? ctrl + alt + t doesn't bring you a terminal, for instance?
[14:13] <jdstrand> didrocks: no window manager. ctrl+alt+t does not bring up a terminal. if I launch it from Applications, it starts but has no borders, etc
[14:13] <jdstrand> didrocks: interestingly, this time both the top and the bottom panel started
[14:14] <didrocks> jdstrand: the bottom panel always started, it's just not drawn sometimes and you have to click on it to get the X window to be redrawn
[14:14] <jdstrand> didrocks: I can also say that the cursor is 'spinning' so it is working on starting something (this is on login, not ctrl+alt+t)
[14:14] <didrocks> I'm more concerned about the "no window manager part"
[14:14] <jdstrand> ok
[14:14] <didrocks> one sec
[14:15] <jdstrand> ps auxww| grep compiz gives nothing
[14:15] <jdstrand> same with metacity
[14:15] <jdstrand> let me try with a new user
[14:15] <didrocks> jdstrand: gconftool-2 -g /desktop/gnome/session/required_components/windowmanager
[14:15] <jdstrand> ok, let me try that
[14:16] <jdstrand> didrocks: compiz
[14:16] <didrocks> jdstrand: can you try launching compiz in a terminal and pastebin the output?
[14:16] <jdstrand> k
[14:20] <jdstrand> didrocks: http://paste.ubuntu.com/538661/
[14:20] <jdstrand> didrocks: the segfault happened after two flashes
[14:21] <jdstrand> at least I think it was two...
[14:21] <didrocks> and you get unity on the ubuntu desktop session? (no compiz segfault)?
[14:21] <jdstrand> didrocks: yes
[14:21] <didrocks> oh, you have the ini backend
[14:21] <seb128> seems you standard profile is broken
[14:22]  * jdstrand doesn't know what you are talking about
[14:22] <didrocks> seems that your profile is broken, right
[14:22] <seb128> jdstrand, the compiz config on your GNOME session
[14:22] <didrocks> well, you can easily reset it
[14:22] <didrocks> but having it can be interesting
[14:22] <jdstrand> I try to not enable anything special in compiz
[14:22] <didrocks> jdstrand: so, can you please pack somewhere ~/.config/compiz-1 and then rename that?
[14:23] <jdstrand> I always just use 'Normal desktop effects'
[14:23] <didrocks> (also, do you have a ~/.config/compiz)
[14:23] <dholbach> james_w, Daviey: if you have a tiny little bit of time could you review my harvest merge proposal?
[14:23] <james_w> dholbach, sure, link?
[14:23] <jdstrand> earlier this week I saw something with 'Extra effects for increased bling' or some such
[14:23] <jdstrand> so I did enable that
[14:23] <jdstrand> but not the 'everything plus the kitchen sink' option
[14:23] <dholbach> james_w, https://code.launchpad.net/~dholbach/harvest/581732/+merge/40950
[14:23] <didrocks> jdstrand: well, forget about the capplet for now, it's broken
[14:24]  * Daviey dodged that bullet! :)
[14:24] <didrocks> jdstrand: so, can you please pack what I requested? :)
[14:24] <jdstrand> ie, there were 4 options in Appearances/Desktop Effects, whereas in the past there were 2
[14:24] <seb128> jdstrand, the desktop effects tab has not been updated for the new compiz
[14:24] <jdstrand> didrocks: I understand, I am just trying to give you history as to how I got here
[14:24] <seb128> jdstrand, so it might create issues
[14:25] <seb128> it might well screwed compiz 0.9 compiz
[14:25] <jdstrand> I do not have ~/.config/compiz
[14:25] <didrocks> jdstrand: ok, then just tar ~/.config/compiz-1 and remove it then
[14:25] <didrocks> jdstrand: you should remove it once under another windowmanager, like metacity --replace
[14:25] <didrocks> to avoid it dumping the config again
[14:26] <mdz> pitti, thanks for merging the apport python traceback stuff. if you get bug reports about cases I might have missed, let me know and I will try to fix them.
[14:26] <pitti> mdz: thanks for improving that
[14:26] <jdstrand> didrocks: so I am in unity (so I could start firefox for the paste)
[14:27] <jdstrand> didrocks: I will logout of unity, then into classic, then try to start compiz manually, then tar up compiz-1
[14:27] <jdstrand> didrocks: does that sound reasonable?
[14:28] <jdstrand> didrocks: ie, does that repeat my steps sufficiently?
[14:28] <didrocks> jdstrand: just add an additional step
[14:28] <didrocks> jdstrand: oh no sorry, that should work
[14:28] <jdstrand> ok
[14:28] <didrocks> (if you confirm compiz is crashing :))
[14:29] <jdstrand> yes
[14:29] <didrocks> just tar and rename compiz-1 without compiz running
[14:29] <hallyn_> oh, compiz was segfaulting?  i did not some weird behavior on my natty laptop, but wasn't at tis console enough to be able to play with it
[14:34] <jdstrand> didrocks: http://people.canonical.com/~jamie/compiz-1.tar.gz
[14:34] <smoser> mvo, ping
[14:34] <didrocks> jdstrand: ok nice, now tell me with removing that + restarting compiz :)
[14:35] <jdstrand> didrocks: ok, I might also point you to http://paste.ubuntu.com/538670/
[14:35] <jdstrand> didrocks: those are the segfaults from this morning as seen in kern.log
[14:35] <mvo> hey smoser
[14:36] <didrocks> jdstrand: ok, you frigthened me :)
[14:36] <jdstrand> didrocks: the 08:29:39 was for my last login from a second ago
[14:36] <jdstrand> didrocks: oh sorry, I apparently had some from yesterday too that I hadn't noticed
[14:36] <didrocks> ok
[14:37] <didrocks> so, compiz still segfaults for you?
[14:37] <jdstrand> didrocks: starting at 07:37:05 is after I upgraded this morning
[14:37] <smoser> mvo, soren suggested i ping you about some bzr /launchpad branch stacking issues.
[14:37] <didrocks> jdstrand: well, with broken config and without a stacktrace doesn't really help :)
[14:37] <smoser> i think i'm getting the correct help in #launchpad though. (bzr-set-stacked-url)
[14:38] <jdstrand> didrocks: sure, but it is interesting that it is all happening in libstaticswitcher.so (for the most part)
[14:38] <jdstrand> anyway, let me move compiz-1 aside and see what happens
[14:38] <didrocks> jdstrand: right, but there are pending issue with the new mainloop
[14:38] <didrocks> jdstrand: so, it can be related
[14:41] <jdstrand> didrocks: ok, moving compiz-1 aside, I now have a window manager, but all kinds of applets have 'quit unexpectedly'. Trash, Show Desktop, System Monitor, Notification Area, Clock, Window List, and Workspace Switcher
[14:42] <mvo> smoser: if you could repush your old branches that would help, here is the background
[14:42] <mvo> smoser:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/bzr/+bug/681431
[14:42] <mvo> smoser: but btw, I think this should be fixed in LP for all branches
[14:42] <didrocks> jdstrand: yeah, this is a know bug related to compiz vs gnome-panel race
[14:42] <jdstrand> didrocks: so I tried clicking 'Reload' on them, and it was working until I reloaded the system monitor, and compiz crashed and my panel went away
[14:42] <mvo> smoser: its not really going to scale if I/soren ping each and every branch owner
[14:42] <mvo> smoser: let me file a RT ticket
[14:42] <smoser> mvo, yes, i would say it should be fixed on launchpad side, quite possibly results in loss of data.
[14:42] <jdstrand> maybe my panel was there and I had to click on it, I don't know
[14:43] <smoser> well, if user starts trying to "fix" things.
[14:43] <didrocks> jdstrand: this is due to compiz 0.9 and reparenting, sam is working on this but there can be a lot of side effects
[14:43] <smoser> mvo, where would you want me to push them ?
[14:43] <didrocks> jdstrand: I have a workaround to minimize that, just try to delay gnome-panel load
[14:43] <didrocks> jdstrand: and remove the startup animation
[14:43] <jdstrand> didrocks: ok. I have noticed this in the past few weeks, so that seems no worse
[14:43] <didrocks> jdstrand: you will still get some, but less
[14:43] <mvo> smoser: its dosn't really matter, it seems like a push under a new name is enough to work around the problem
[14:43] <seb128> didrocks, I don't think delay works
[14:44] <seb128> didrocks, I've tried to wait 15 seconds, compiz crashes after clicking on a few "reload" buttons
[14:44] <seb128> and gnome-panel is still in a weird state
[14:44] <seb128> like applets not drawed
[14:44] <didrocks> seb128: I tried a sleep 5 && and didn't get any crash, but as it's a timing issue, I was just maybe lucky
[14:44] <smoser> mvo, yeah. i got it fixed. maxb in #launchpad suggested http://j.maxb.eu/~maxb/bzr-set-stacked-url , then bzr reconfigure --unstacked (which is appropriate in this case)
[14:44] <mvo> smoser: aha, cool!  thanks
[14:44] <jdstrand> I have found that stopping gdm and logging in again usually works
[14:44] <didrocks> like the animation disabled, you got the issue less present
[14:44] <maxb> I really ought to get that thing built into bzr core
[14:45] <mvo> smoser: I want to keep vmbuilder in a vaguely working state would be nice to unitfy 0.11 and 0.12 again
[14:45] <didrocks> jdstrand: yeah, because it's loading faster as it's in the cache (that's my guess) and so compiz doesn't have to cope with it…
[14:45] <smoser> mvo, yeah... i have gone rogue on 0.11, i agree.
[14:45] <smoser> :)
[14:45] <jdstrand> didrocks: right, that was my guess too
[14:45] <mvo> smoser: ;)
[14:46] <didrocks> jdstrand: hopefully, we'll have a fix end of week/next week but they can have drawbacks (right now, with the new reparenting event, all menus are disabled :))
[14:46] <jdstrand> didrocks: anyway, it seems I am back to the state I was in yesterday-- a racy classic desktop, but at least I can work
[14:46] <smoser> and, i agree, it would be good to have vmbuilder in a working state, but for me, i have a functional uec image build process, and getting that onto 0.12 doesn't benefit me at all, just costs me.
[14:46] <didrocks> jdstrand: yeah, sorry for that, and thanks for the configuration, I sent it to upstream
[14:46] <smoser> also, before moving to 0.12, i'd consider live-helper
[14:47] <jdstrand> didrocks: thanks for your time. you might want to get the word out on not disabling the unity plugin in ccsm, cause people are blogging about how that is the right way to disable unity
[14:47] <didrocks> jdstrand: yeah, but my server is in a box as I'm moving so my blog is down, I'll try to get that soon :)
[14:48] <jdstrand> heh
[14:48] <jdstrand> didrocks: thanks again
[14:48] <didrocks> jdstrand: you're welcome :)
[14:49] <mvo> smoser: ok, good to know.
[14:49] <mvo> smoser: what is the advantage of live-build?
[14:49] <jdstrand> didrocks: I'll toss something out on my blog in the mean time
[14:49] <seb128> didrocks, get jcastro to blog
[14:49] <didrocks> jdstrand: thanks :)
[14:49] <didrocks> seb128: yeah, can do that
[14:50] <jdstrand> didrocks: do you need a bug filed for the compiz-1 business are are we good?
[14:50] <smoser> mvo, well, while i'm extremely *not* interested in starting a flame war, the interest in live-build would be centered around perceived livelyhood/maintainance of vmbuilder.
[14:50] <jdstrand> s/are are/or are/
[14:50] <didrocks> jdstrand: please, file one and attach the tarball
[14:51] <didrocks> jdstrand: with the debug output in the description
[14:51] <mvo> smoser: fair enough, I don't have strong feelings either way, I just need something to build image for my upgrade tester :)
[14:51] <smoser> exactly.  no politics involved, i want something that works, and is likely to be maintained in the future.
[14:53] <smoser> mvo, fwiw, my opinion, is of course, that you should use our images on ec2 for your upgrade tester :)
[14:53] <mvo> smoser: will they work with kvm?
[14:53] <smoser> the uec images "sort of" work with kvm.
[14:53] <smoser> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UEC/Images
[14:54] <mvo> interessting, I have a look
[14:54] <mvo> I need them as kvm as often its useful/iimportant to run it on the local machine for better control etc
[14:54] <smoser> yeah, i understand that they might not fit the bill.
[14:55] <smoser> but on ec2, you can fairly easily start an instance of a fully updated M and 'do-release-upgrade -d'
[14:55] <smoser> with local mirrors, and instance start up is < 2 minutes ,and all automatiable.
[14:55] <mvo> yeah, the release upgrader tester has a ec2 backend (that is not used much though)
[14:56] <mvo> one of the disadvantages of the ec2 test is that it does not test the kernel upgrade and the xserver (both will be done with kvm). however that is only a tiny disadvantage as most problems are from the packages (maintainer script issues etc)
[14:57] <smoser> kernel upgrade works in maverick and going forward
[14:58] <smoser> and i'm working on getting that into 10.04
[14:58] <mvo> oh? sweet, good to know
[14:58] <smoser> https://launchpad.net/~smoser/+archive/lucid-kernel-upgrades has more info
[15:01] <ogra> doko, bug 683683 ... given that klibc didnt change between maverick and natty would you agree that this is likely toolchain related ?
[15:02] <ScottK> pitti: Thanks for the feedback (re hal and stuff)
[15:02] <pitti> ScottK: nice to see it going!
[15:03] <ScottK> I've got what I believe are the needed changes for Kubuntu to drop in right after Alpha 1.
[15:04] <dholbach> thanks a lot james_w
[15:04] <doko> ogra: ENOCLUE. but I don't follow your logic from "klibc unchanged" -> "toolchain issue"
[15:05] <james_w> dholbach, pas de problem
[15:05] <ogra> doko, hmm, seems linaro sees it too
[15:06] <ogra> doko, bug 683582
[15:06] <ogra> doko, well, what else could it be? klibc doesnt have much build deps so it must be something in the toolchain
[15:07] <dholbach> james_w, tu as appris à parler Français? :)
[15:07] <doko> ogra: but klibs isn't rebuilt
[15:07] <ogra> hmm
[15:08] <ogra> so we probably *should* rebuild it :)
[15:08] <jdstrand> didrocks: fyi bug #683686
[15:08]  * ogra is clueless as you can see
[15:09] <didrocks> jdstrand: thanks :)
[15:14] <mdz> pitti, I noticed the "update TeamReports" item on TechnicalBoardAgenda got removed---are we not doing that anymore?
[15:15] <pitti> mdz: I didn't remove that; I thought we should bump that to "[next due: May 2011]" or so
[15:16] <mdz> pitti, wasn't it done every month?
[15:16] <pitti> mdz: I thought we'd do it once per cycle?
[15:16] <pitti> it was on the agenda as a reminder when we should handle it
[15:16] <mdz> pitti, hmm, ok. I must be confused
[15:17] <pitti> mdz: argh, sorry
[15:17] <pitti> mdz: I am confused
[15:17] <pitti> mdz: somehow I thought you were speaking about the brainstorm review
[15:17]  * pitti engages brain this time
[15:18] <pitti> mdz: updating the teamreports page is of course something that we should do after each meeting
[15:18] <highvoltage> hmmm brains
[15:18] <pitti> mdz: it's not a topic in the meeting per se, but an action that the chair has to do as part of the post-processing
[15:20] <cjwatson> should be done every meeting, yes
[15:23] <smoser> cjwatson, do you have a minute ? (you're back from holiday?)
[15:25] <cjwatson> yeah
[15:25] <ogra> doko, hmm, looking at runinitlib.c is see the following at the top, http://paste.ubuntu.com/538687/ could it be that eglibc defines these constants differently on arm now ?
[15:25] <smoser> I'd like your insight on bug 683379.
[15:26] <smoser> the two prompts are not avoidable by DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive
[15:26] <doko> ogra: we still have the same eglibc in natty as in maverick-updates/-proposed
[15:26] <ogra> damned
[15:27] <cjwatson> smoser: the best way to get such bugs handled quickly is to provide DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer output
[15:27] <smoser> ah.
[15:27] <smoser> this is new to me. i can do that.
[15:27] <cjwatson> smoser: and, if possible, to attach /var/cache/debconf/config.dat from before the upgrade
[15:28] <smoser> coming your way
[15:28] <cjwatson> any installation logs you have would be good too
[15:28] <smoser> i can attach install logs also
[15:32] <dholbach> Daviey, I fixed the merge proposal with regard to james_w's comments - maybe you can review now? :-P
[15:35] <james_w> dholbach, I don't think it needs another review
[15:35] <dholbach> alrightie
[15:35] <dholbach> I'll go and merge it then
[15:35] <smoser> cjwatson, i'm guessing DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer sends info to stderr ?
[15:35] <cjwatson> yeah
[15:42] <smoser> cjwatson, hm... DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer sudo apt-get install grub-pc 2>debconf-developer.out
[15:42] <smoser> gave me empty debconf-developer.out
[15:42] <hggdh> can someone please give me Status edit rights to coreutils bugs?
[15:43] <dholbach> james_w, Daviey: I'll release a new Harvest soon, so people can take advantage of giving us .json feeds as opposed to .csv
[15:43] <james_w> \o/
[15:44] <cjwatson> smoser: sudo DEBCONF_DEBUG=developer ...
[15:46] <smoser> oh yeah.
[15:46] <smoser> shoot
[15:46] <smoser> i didn't realize that sudo took 'env' type arguments.
[15:47] <smoser> i had actually done sudo env KEY=VALUE before to get around sudo's cleaning of environment
[15:52] <ogra> Keybuk, if i break=bottom, "exec run-init /root /sbin/init" should theoretically work, right ?
[15:54] <Keybuk> not sure
[15:54] <Keybuk> can't remember whether panic() turns the initramfs into a shell
[15:54] <ogra> hmm, k
[15:54] <Keybuk> or spawns a sub-shell
[15:54] <Keybuk> check your PID
[15:54]  * ogra is seeing weird run-init errors on armel recently
[15:55] <ogra> and given that nothing changed the only thing i can imagine is that the args are not handed over right
[15:55] <Keybuk> if panic() turns initramfs into a shell
[15:55] <Keybuk> (exec bash)
[15:55] <ogra> (i.e. i would expect run-init to work fine instead of spilling an "Unknown error")
[15:55] <Keybuk> then yes, that will work
[15:56]  * ogra talks about bug 683683 and is a bit clueless
[15:57] <ogra> Keybuk, so you mean the kernel panicing there would be normal ? (and shoudl drop me into bash)
[15:57] <ogra> if thats supposed to happen, it never worked on armel :)
[15:58] <cjwatson> panic starts a subprocess
[15:58] <cjwatson> right now
[15:58] <ogra> hmm, it doesnt on armel
[15:58] <smoser> cjwatson, ok. i've attached everything you asked for to bug 683379. if you want access to a pristine instance, let me know.
[15:59] <Keybuk> ogra: initramfs panic() not kernel PANIC
[15:59] <ogra> oh !
[15:59] <ogra> k, thanks
[15:59] <Keybuk> cjwatson says it spawns a sub-shell
[15:59] <Keybuk> so you cannot run-init from that
[16:03] <ogra> hmm, k i see it now in initramfs-tools/scripts/functions
[16:04] <ogra> intresting though that i get the same error when trying
[16:08]  * ogra tries init=/bin/bash
[16:09] <ogra> hrm. same error
[16:28] <mrenouf|work> sorry guys
[16:28] <mrenouf|work> all fixed
[17:25] <cjwatson> mvo: RT#42717: if it were me, I'd file a question on https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad-code
[17:25] <cjwatson> IME that gets good response on tickets requiring LOSAs
[17:26] <cjwatson> (that said I see Andrew has already added a losa tag to that RT ticket so maybe just leave it there for now ...
[17:26] <cjwatson> )
[17:31] <dobey> anyone know why adding -Vfoo:Bar=1.9.0 to DEB_DH_GENCONTROL_ARGS_ALL in rules wouldn't work as expected? it's getting passed to dh_gencontrol it looks like, but dpkg-deb is failing with a parse error as the value isn't actually getting substituted it seems
[17:33] <cjwatson> did you put it after --?
[17:33] <cjwatson> (what exactly does the DEB_DH_GENCONTROL_ARGS_ALL line say?)
[17:37] <cjwatson> Riddell: should bug 683400 be reassigned to kdebindings?
[17:38] <Riddell> cjwatson: yes, I can do that
[17:40] <ScottK> pitti: I approved the pg 9.0 backport request today.  In the future if those lag for approval, please feel free to ping me to have a look.
[17:45] <dobey> cjwatson: DEB_DH_GENCONTROL_ARGS_ALL = -Vbanshee:Version=$(BANSHEE_VERSION)
[17:45] <dobey> cjwatson: do i have to put a -- at the beginning of that?
[17:45] <cjwatson> -- -Vbanshee:Version=...
[17:45] <cjwatson> the dh_gencontrol(1) manual page should explain
[17:52] <linuxfreaker> After how many hours Alpha 1 is releasing?
[17:53] <dobey> thanks cjwatson
[17:54] <statik> hi ScottK! low priority ping about this backport, anything else I should do before it's ready to be approved? https://bugs.launchpad.net/lucid-backports/+bug/683193
[17:55] <cjwatson> linuxfreaker: some
[17:55] <cjwatson> linuxfreaker: we don't give exact times
[17:57] <ScottK> statik: Commented.
[17:57] <statik> ta
[17:59] <linuxfreaker> Does Ubuntu 11.04 Alpha 1 has kernel 2.6.37-rc4
[17:59] <linuxfreaker> I just saw it under http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-natty.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/master-next
[17:59] <cjwatson> no, it'll be -rc3
[18:00] <cjwatson> if we pulled in -rc4 at this point we'd have to move back the alpha release
[18:00] <linuxfreaker> ahh
[18:00] <linuxfreaker> So -rc3 will be final kernel being put
[18:00] <linuxfreaker> Why it says rebase to v2.6.37-r c4
[18:03] <cjwatson> linuxfreaker: because the kernel team is preparing that for their next set of packages, *after* alpha 1
[18:03] <cjwatson> alpha 1 is just a snapshot of development
[18:38] <mvo> thanks cjwatson, answers is a good idea, I will do that next time
[18:44] <pitti> ScottK: ah, thanks; TBH I forgot about it myself
[18:56] <pitti> c/quit
[18:56] <ogra_ac> pitti, nearly :)
[19:09] <bryceh> chrisccoulson, mind if I take over?
[19:11] <chrisccoulson> bryceh - yeah, sure
[19:12] <chrisccoulson> @pilot out
[19:12] <bryceh> @pilot in
[19:12] <ebroder> The bot handles multiple pilots, btw
[19:22] <cody-somerville> mvo, Is python-apt uploaded to pypi?
[19:23] <SpamapS> bryceh: ping? can you get this one into lucid-proposed by any chance? https://code.launchpad.net/~clint-fewbar/ubuntu/lucid/mysql-dfsg-5.1/increase-killtimeout/+merge/41403
[19:26] <bryceh> SpamapS, sure thing
[19:26] <bryceh> SpamapS, is there a .dsc generated for it I can grab?
[19:29] <SpamapS> bryceh: err.. no but I could generate one I 'spose. :-P
[19:36] <SpamapS> bryceh: though you can very easily just apt-get source mysql-dfsg-5.1 and then apply the patch linked to..
[19:36] <SpamapS> bryceh: probably easier than I can serve the dsc+orig+diff to you..
[19:39] <SpamapS> bryceh: but.. for your viewing pleasure .. http://spamaps.org/files/mysql-dfsg-5.1_5.1.41-3ubuntu12.8.dsc
[19:39] <SpamapS> err.. 403.. doh
[19:41] <SpamapS> bryceh: ok, you should be able to dget that .dsc now
[19:44] <bryceh> SpamapS, thanks
[19:46] <bryceh> SpamapS, upload sponsored
[19:49] <mvo> cody-somerville: I don't think its at pypi, I never uploaded it
[19:49] <mvo> cody-somerville: but maybe someone else did
[19:49] <PROGRAM_IX> 'evening all.
[19:52] <SpamapS> bryceh: sweet thanks! :)
[19:54] <highvoltage> Is there any reason why ubuntu-desktop depends on unity (as apposed to recommending it)?
[19:55] <highvoltage> we need to have unity available as an option in Edubuntu, and it's kind of hard to make it just optional when edubuntu-desktop depends on ubuntu-desktop
[19:57] <cjwatson> Recommends would seem more in keeping with standard seed practices, certainly
[20:00] <highvoltage> cjwatson: what would you recommend? Should I open a bug or poke someone in the desktop team?
[20:03] <highvoltage> (filing bug anyway)
[20:15] <achiang> hm, booting the Lucid alternate ISO, what do I do to make it only install a console-based system? a command line option? something during d-i?
[20:17] <achiang> i don't get any menus, since i booted a USB key
[20:18] <achiang> ah, 'cli' on the boot command line will do it
[20:19] <achiang> maybe it's "install cli"
[20:33] <achiang> hm, i don't think that was it. i still see d-i installing xservers. :-/
[20:49] <ebroder> pitti: ping, do you know off the top of your head if there's an easy fix I could apply locally for bug #592239?
[20:50] <ebroder> Oh, it's marked as a dup. Missed that
[20:55] <achiang> the help text on the installer says that 'cli' is available, but trying that, there's an error saying 'cli kernel not found'. pressing <tab> to see what grub knows about, i don't see cli in there either...
[21:59] <smoser> pitti, are you around ?
[22:00] <smoser> I was doing some verification of bug 671103 and found that it did not fix one issue that I had expected it to fix (bug 671103)
[22:01] <smoser> whoops. second bug was bug 683890
[22:01] <smoser> i am not clear on the process here, but I have a fix for the second and would would like to get it in as soon as possible.
[22:45] <Patrickdk> how do I go about publishing a package to a ppa for both lucid and hardy?
[22:45] <Patrickdk> I can get it to work for one or the other, but not both
[22:46] <ScottK> Patrickdk: PPA support is in #launchpad
[22:47] <Patrickdk> ah heh, been attempting to find the right place :)