[07:36] <czajkowski> Evil snow
[07:42] <cjohnston> It's finally in the 40's at night here for a couple days!
[07:55] <dholbach> good morning!
[07:55] <kim0> Morning o/
[07:55] <dholbach> hey kim0
[07:55] <kim0> hey there
[07:55] <dholbach> greetings from snowy winterland
[07:55] <kim0> people are begging winter to come here
[07:56] <kim0> someone was just tweeting "If winter doesn't come in a week .. I'll make him pay for my expensive winter clothes" :)
[07:56] <dholbach> 10cm of snow, -8°C
[07:57] <kim0> lovely
[08:19] <popey> \o/ snow http://popey.com/webcam/
[08:21] <kim0> OMG lovely
[08:21] <dholbach> same here :)
[08:22]  * kim0 looks at the bright shining Sun .. sigh :)
[08:59] <dpm> morning all
[09:02] <kim0> dpm: morning man :)
[09:03] <dpm> hey kim0 :)
[09:15] <dholbach> hola dpm
[09:16] <dpm> morgen dholbach
[09:58] <duanedesign> morning all
[10:07] <dholbach> hi duanedesign, daker, randa
[10:10] <randa> hi all
[10:16] <daker> hello dholbach randa duanedesign ツ
[10:17] <randa> hey :) good morning daker
[10:38] <czajkowski> A;pja
[10:39] <czajkowski> aloha
[10:45]  * jussi sighs tiredly. cant wait for the week to be over
[11:01] <kim0> jussi: it can't be that bad :)
[11:02] <jussi> kim0: nah, but I am tired.
[11:06] <dpm> restarting, brb
[11:21] <dholbach> nigelb, how's the loco/dev script coming along?
[11:25] <dholbach> dpm, so the text for "Introduction to Ubuntu Development" is going to be part of the new packaging guide anyway, so I guess it makes sense to just translate it as part of that project - I don't know if there's plans to make ubuntu.com translatable at all, so I guess ubuntu.com/developer (which will have that text) will just be plain English
[11:25] <dholbach> dpm, for the presentations (.odp I guess) there's probably no clever way to translate them, right?
[11:26] <dholbach> we could make them .pdf, somehow I guess
[11:26] <dholbach> hmhmhm
[11:29] <dpm> dholbach, I don't know of any easy way to translate them, other than just modifying the docs. But perhaps some people would like to do that. I think we'll have to figure out where to host the translated version if people want to do that
[11:30] <dpm> (.odp, I meant)
[11:31] <dholbach> dpm, we could set up a branch for that or just use a wiki page and people would subscribe to changes there
[11:32] <dholbach> dpm, but the rest sounded sane to you?
[11:32] <dholbach> I mean … relatively speaking :-P
[11:33] <dpm> dholbach, I'm not expecting anything sane from you :-P Anyway could you repeat which things are you considering for translation. I just wnt to make sure I get it right: a) "Introduction to Ubuntu Development" b) presentations
[11:34] <dpm> ok, re-reading I can ignore a), as it's going to be part of the packaging guide
[11:34] <dpm> and written in sphinx
[11:34] <dholbach> "Introduction to Ubuntu Development" is content that will live on ubuntu.com/developer, in the packaging guide and in a different form in presentations
[11:35] <dpm> ok, gotcha
[11:35] <dholbach> I hope it's going to be sphinx - the discussion has not started yet :)
[11:38] <dholbach> thanks dpm
[11:38] <dholbach> another work item done
[11:41] <dpm> dholbach, ok, so yeah, just to confirm what you just said a) in ubuntu.com/developer the text will be English-only (u.c is Drupal, can be multilingual, but there are no immediate plans for a multilingual u.c) b) Yeah, I also think it makes sense to translate "Introduction to..." as part of the packaging guide and take advantage of the translated output from the doc format the guide ends up using c) I don't know any way of producing translated o
[11:41] <dpm> dp output, so PDF would be an option, although then you cannot use Impress for the presentations. You could try beamer, but you'd need to use Latex as a doc format (and I'm sure you'd not be looking forward to that) - http://www.uncg.edu/cmp/reu/presentations/Charles%20Batts%20-%20Beamer%20Tutorial.pdf (the output looks good, though)
[11:43] <dholbach> dpm, as sphinx does something with ReSt→Latex→PDF there might be a way to do that - I'll have a look at it closer to the time
[11:43] <dholbach> if it's .odp in the end, I assume there's not going to be that much text, so it won't be wasted days of work
[11:43] <dpm> ah, nice
[11:43] <dpm> sounds good
[14:24] <jcastro> man this is weird
[14:24] <jcastro> someone called me a celebrity on #omg!ubuntu!
[14:24] <nigelb> that isn't really weird :p
[14:25] <jcastro> I've never been as popular as popey before
[14:25] <nigelb> haha
[14:26] <dholbach> there's nobody more popular than Elvis
[14:26] <Pici> The Beatles
[14:27] <nigelb> dholbach: heh, +1
[14:31] <nigelb> paultag: I like your myth busting series
[14:32] <popey> haha jcastro
[14:54] <nhandler> dholbach: re:packaging training, sorry for not replying. I've just been a bit busy lately. I'll try to reply today. In the future, feel free to give me a poke on IRC if I don't reply to something like that ;)
[14:54] <nigelb> nhandler: Odd, we were just talking about that ;)
[14:54] <dholbach> it'd be great to get this back on track again
[14:55] <nigelb> I like what duane's doing on the forums
[14:55] <dholbach> I feel we've had a bunch of great ideas
[14:55] <nigelb> I wonder if we can get askubuntu onto this...
[14:55] <dholbach> now we just need to agree on stuff, assign months and get going
[14:57] <nhandler> nigelb: The forums are ok, but the audience they attract for the most part, tends not to do much with the info (they haven't learned that it is a myth that packaging applications is all that devs do and they aren't interested in the other work)
[14:57] <nhandler> dholbach: I still think the hard part is finding people to lead the sessions. It feels like we always go back to the same small group of people
[14:58] <dholbach> nhandler, but I think it's a great source of questions if we just get a bunch of developers to hang out in the channel and take questions
[14:59] <dholbach> that's a relatively easy way to get a session going, helpful content out there and people happy :)
[15:00] <nhandler> dholbach: Q&A sessions are nice (maybe once a month). One issue with those is that they are only useful if you get a nice crowd of people to show up and ask questions (which means certain convenient times for people in Asia/US aren't that great). Maybe Q&A once a month or so?
[15:01] <dholbach> nhandler, if we don't get many questions we could fall back to answering questions from the forums for example
[15:01] <duanedesign> nigelb: while collecting suggestions from daniels blog and adding them to the wiki I came across 'A system of online workshops you could follow in your own time'
[15:01] <dholbach> nhandler, it'd be great to have sessions weekly, so if we don't get anybody to do a session at all, I'd personally prefer to have 4 Q&A sessions in that month :)
[15:02] <dholbach> we should go through the list of all ~ubuntu-dev people and reach out to debian folks too
[15:02] <nigelb> duanedesign: I'll do that
[15:02] <nigelb> I seriously loved the ustream session
[15:03] <nhandler> dholbach: How many useful questions are on the forum? Last I checked, I saw a lot of posts asking why my package doesn't work (when they didn't edit any dh-make files). And like I said, Q&A is nice if you can get it at the right time. i.e. me doing a Q&A would end up as me talking to myself for an hour ;)
[15:03] <nhandler> As for ~ubuntu-dev, that is what I've tried doing before. Maybe we should keep better data about who we contact and stuff like that. I had started a doc on google docs a while ago for that, but I never got it up-to-date
[15:04] <dholbach> I totally agree that we should reach out more and try to have as many people there as possible
[15:04] <dholbach> but the questions you mentioned above should at least be easy to asnwer ;-)
[15:04] <dholbach> nhandler, sounds like a good idea
[15:05] <nhandler> dholbach: Here was what I started. https://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AiFFoXLMT-gudEE2WDUwRmZLeE9rQy1TM0J2UlN5THc&hl=en&authkey=CLTriBg
[15:05] <duanedesign> nhandler: maybe if more people knew the forums were a place you could get good reliable information on packaging it would attract more 'useful' questions
[15:05] <nhandler> At the time, I was simply trying to go through Packaging/Training/Logs to get old sessions
[15:06] <nhandler> duanedesign: The issue is, not enough developers go there, so I'm not sure how much "reliable information" you actually will get
[15:06] <dholbach> duanedesign, totally agreed - I could imagine that loads of people from the Ubuntu development facebook group would also rather use forums than anything else
[15:44] <doctormo> dholbach: I wanted to confirm the images are good.
[15:46] <jcastro> did someone say askubuntu for Q+A?
[15:46] <jcastro> I say hell yeah!
[15:46] <doctormo> jcastro: Other people say: "Well since it's the way we've been told to do it" ;-)
[15:46] <dholbach> doctormo, I like them - I'm just wondering if the branching story would be better if we changed it vertically somehow? I realise that what I did in ASCII art wasn't very clear :-D
[15:47] <dholbach> doctormo, I can send you something small tomorrow my morning that might make it a bit clearer - illustrating (just as an example) which code goes from where to where
[15:48] <doctormo> What would you like to change vertically?
[15:48] <dholbach> doctormo, but generally: good work - it would have taken me days to get there :)
[15:48] <dholbach> doctormo, the upstream/ubuntu branch etc. story
[15:48] <doctormo> Since the diagram depends heavily on what you want to illustrate, you decide what details are to be pronounced.
[15:48] <dholbach> like rotate it 90°
[15:49] <dholbach> my idea was to show upstream mainline, indicate that we branched off when 1.0 was released, put that into Ubuntu, added a bugfix which went back upstream, then we got 1.1 into Ubuntu
[15:49] <dholbach> but I didn't make that very clear in the 70x3 ASCII diagram :-P
[15:50] <doctormo> hmm, why does the bugfix wait for 1.1? I thought bug fixes flowed downstream.
[15:50] <nigelb> jcastro: I wanted to ask a question to see what topics people watnt to be taken by packaging training
[15:50] <dholbach> doctormo, we added it in Ubuntu before 1.1 was released, then it flowed back upstream
[15:50] <dholbach> that was the idea
[15:51] <dholbach> just to show a bit of "back and forth of ideas"
[15:51] <jcastro> hi dpm
[15:51] <jcastro> http://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/
[15:51] <jcastro> at the bottom here I have "translations"
[15:51] <jcastro> which was a template jono put there
[15:51] <jcastro> but I fear I am pointing to the wrong pages
[15:51] <jono> hey all
[15:51] <jcastro> what should I link to?
[15:51] <dholbach> hi jono
[15:51] <jcastro> hi jono
[15:52] <nigelb> hai jono
[15:52] <dpm> jcastro, they look fine from a quick glance, but do you mind if I look at it in more detail and I come back to you in ~1h? I'm preparing the translations videocast starting in ~8 min now
[15:53] <jcastro> dpm: yep, no rush
[15:53] <dholbach> DPM!
[15:53] <dpm> cool
[15:53] <dholbach> wooohoooooooooooo!
[15:53] <jcastro> dpm: I just ran into this yesterday so it's no biggie
[15:53] <dpm> ok
[15:53] <dpm> Anyway, folks, do join me and bring the popcorn:
[15:53] <dpm> http://www.ustream.tv/channel/ubuntu-translations-with-david-planella
[15:54] <dholbach> yoooooohooooooooo
[15:54] <dpm> :-)
[15:54] <jcastro> I am in!
[15:54] <vish> yay! nhandler is back …
[15:54]  * vish reminds nhandler about the mail server.. ;)
[15:55] <jono> hey dholbach, jcastro, nigelb
[16:03] <paultag> nigelb, thanks, mang
[16:03] <paultag> hey jono, can I get a re-tweet?
[16:03]  * nigelb hugs paultag 
[16:03] <paultag> jono, http://twitter.com/#!/paultag/status/10319908143370240
[16:04] <paultag> nigelb, How are you today?
[16:04] <nigelb> paultag: Resting.  Eating.  Its hot here and humidity is matching.
[16:04] <paultag> nigelb, mmmhum
[16:05] <jcastro> paultag: high 5 tumblr team
[16:05] <jcastro> I like how yours looks
[16:05] <paultag> jcastro, ^5 dude
[16:06] <paultag> jcastro, thanks, man
[16:06] <nigelb> jcastro: he hacked it like crazy
[16:06] <nigelb> jcastro: I think he now writes blog post in latex
[16:06] <paultag> nigelb, I love tumblr
[16:10] <jcastro> man, ustream is SO much better with this new flash
[16:10] <jcastro> it's actually not so bad anymore
[16:10] <dholbach> ok my friends, I call it a day - I'll have to see if I find some defrosting spray, so I can de-ice my bicycle lock so I won't have to walk through the snow tomorrow and get my lights fixed
[16:10] <dholbach> have a great rest of your day
[16:10] <dholbach> see you tomorrow!
[16:10]  * dholbach hugs you all
[16:10] <cjohnston> o/
[16:10] <jcastro> bye!
[16:11] <dholbach> thanks doctormo again - I'll send something to you tomorrow
[16:11] <doctormo> dholbach: please wait
[16:12] <paultag> jcastro, I've just spammed your PM
[16:12] <dholbach> doctormo, how long? I need to head out because the shop will close soon
[16:12] <dholbach> doctormo, can you mail something over and I'll respond later this evening?
[16:12] <doctormo> 5 seconds
[16:12] <doctormo> More like this: http://imagebin.ca/view/knylDSj.html
[16:13]  * doctormo hits imagebin's slow upload with a wet fish
[16:13] <dholbach> doctormo, great
[16:13] <dholbach> doctormo, maybe we could add something saying that 1.1 goes into Ubuntu again? like another arrow from once 1.1 is released?
[16:13] <dholbach> a small one? :)
[16:14] <doctormo> yes ok, I'll mail you it
[16:14] <doctormo> talk tomorrow, :-)
[16:14] <dholbach> doctormo, excellent work!
[16:14]  * dholbach hugs doctormo
[16:14] <dholbach> rock on everybody - see you tomorrow :)
[16:19] <doctormo> All done, these kinds of images are fairly easy
[16:21] <doctormo> Considering that I watched my artist friend vectorize this http://doctormo.deviantart.com/#/d33wox9 and it took 4 hours.
[16:21] <doctormo> I'm going to have to pay him extra.
[16:35] <nigelb> doctormo: Wow, that's beautiful!
[16:36] <doctormo> nigelb: It is good work :-) it'll be great when it's finally all together into the poster.
[16:37] <nigelb> oh, wow http://scayris.deviantart.com/#/d2b5xvm
[16:37] <nigelb> Dr. House <3
[16:42] <doctormo> nigelb: Er no, that's Hugh "hit by a" Lorrie, the actor who plays the prince regent in Black Adder the Third, the comic genious who teamed up with Stephen Fry in their show "a bit of fry a Lorrie". I have never seen something called house ;-)
[16:44] <nigelb> doctormo: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregory_House
[16:44] <nigelb> doctormo: That's a TV series, of couse played by High Lorrie ;)
[16:45]  * doctormo mutters something about American culture as poisons.
[16:45] <nigelb> lol
[16:45] <nigelb> I remember him best from Stuart Little
[16:46] <doctormo> Remember Jeeves and Wooster?
[16:46] <nigelb> Nope, I watch more "American TV" than "British TV"
[16:46] <popey> s/lorrie/laurie
[16:47] <popey> nigelb: :(
[16:47] <popey> which is why American English is so pervasive
[16:48] <doctormo> popey: It's why not-english-at-all is so pervasive, even Ubuntu made by a UK company is set to not-English USA by default. :-/
[16:48] <nigelb> popey: heh
[16:49] <popey> yeah, i see pages on the wiki getting "corrected" from en_GB to en_US spelling :(
[16:49] <doctormo> This is why I was so sad to see many of my thai friends so confused when they watched Wallace and Grommet. They just couldn't get the fact that there was an English culture that wasn't American.
[16:49] <popey> hah
[16:49] <popey> and :(
[16:49] <nigelb> Also, British English means I have to strain to make out words
[16:49] <popey> pfft
[16:50] <popey> thats just lack of familiarity
[16:50] <nigelb> heh, I *knew* he'd do that
[16:50] <nigelb> Yeah, I should listen to UUPC more often
[16:50] <doctormo> nigelb: Unlike American English which is practically a fully clarified interpretation *roll eyes*
[16:52] <popey> aaanyway :)
[16:52] <doctormo> popey: How are you, not heard from you in a while.
[16:52] <popey> not bad, head down at work
[16:52] <popey> should come up for air soon :)
[16:53] <doctormo> Hope that grinding stone isn't taking off too much flesh.
[16:53] <popey> heh
[16:53] <doctormo> Are you going to the protests?
[16:54] <nigelb> Protest for snow?
[16:54] <popey> the student protests?
[16:55] <doctormo> popey: Sure, student protests now, half the country sometimes next week. Or so the news would have you believe.
[16:55]  * kim0 calls it a day
[16:55] <kim0> ciao fellows
[16:55] <popey> o/ kim0
[16:55] <doctormo> ta-ra
[16:55] <kim0> ta-ra :)
[16:56] <nigelb> later kim0
[16:57] <doctormo> popey: From what I could tell, this seemed to be the news back there: "Oh no snow!!, Oh no students! Oh no wikileaks"
[16:57] <nigelb> lol
[17:05] <dpm> just finished the first ever Ubuntu translations videocast, lots of questions and participation, it was fun!
[17:05] <nigelb> gosh, missed it
[17:05] <nigelb> I shall watch video tomorrow
[17:05] <nigelb> dpm: Did you have a dog barking? :p
[17:06] <dpm> nigelb, no, my comedy moment wasn't that exciting, but I had to turn on the light at some point, as it was getting dark and people couldn't see me on the video :)
[17:07] <nigelb> heh
[17:17] <jono> jcastro, call?
[17:17] <jono> dpm, nice work!
[17:17] <jono> dpm, I missed it, was on a UDS call
[17:17] <jono> did you get a recording?
[17:20] <paultag> jono, can I get a retweet on the myths busted #2? -- http://twitter.com/#!/paultag/status/10319908143370240
[17:21] <paultag> jono, it's RE being a coder to contribute to Ubuntu
[17:21] <popey> paultag: nice idea
[17:22] <paultag> popey, :)
[17:22] <popey> paultag: how about linking QA to the testing team page on the wiki, and same for UBT?
[17:22] <paultag> done popey :)
[17:22] <jcastro> http://www.hudson-labs.org/content/whos-driving-thing
[17:22] <jcastro> ^^^ everything about that article is awesome
[17:22] <popey> same for the others actually :)
[17:22] <paultag> popey, they all have links inline, there are like 30 - 40 :)
[17:22] <paultag> popey, my hrefs don't come up different colors. I'm working on fixing that soon
[17:22] <popey> ah
[17:22] <popey> thats broken :)
[17:23] <paultag> popey, sure is! :)
[17:23] <popey> ^5
[17:23] <paultag> ^5
 jcastro, call?
[17:24] <jono> :-)
[17:24]  * JFo bluffs jono
[17:24] <jcastro> jono: yep, one sec.
[17:25] <JFo> I raise
[17:25] <jono> JFo, lol
[17:25] <JFo> :)
[17:25]  * popey takes his shirt off
[17:25] <popey> oh, wrong game.
[17:25] <JFo> oooh
[17:25]  * JFo folds a dolla lengthwise
[17:26] <popey> lol
[17:26] <JFo> :-P
[17:26] <jcastro> jono: all set
[17:26] <jcastro> on the skypes
[17:26] <jono> :)
[17:28] <duanedesign> wow jono that Drupal real time contributions map is pretty awesome
[17:29] <dpm> jono, yeah, here's the recording: http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/11209840
[17:29] <paultag> popey, fixed the css :)
[17:29]  * popey hugs paultag 
[17:29] <paultag> popey, you got me off my lazy back-half
[17:29]  * paultag hugs popey 
[17:30] <popey> That's good, I don't like tweeting links to broken pages ;)
[17:30] <paultag> popey, I saw the re-tweet, thanks! :)
[17:30] <popey> np
[17:31] <duanedesign> I had never seen http://www.ubuntustats.com/
[19:09] <jcastro> duanedesign: wow that's still up?
[19:09] <jcastro> I remember that from years ago
[19:33] <duanedesign> jcastro: how are you liking IRC Cloud?
[19:38] <jcastro> duanedesign:  love it, I will likely subscribe
[20:03] <duanedesign> jcastro: good to hear. Seems like a great idea. I signed up for an invite.
[20:04] <sense> good evening
[20:05] <duanedesign> o/
[20:06] <duanedesign> sense: did you get any snow where you are?
[20:36] <jcastro> <-- caffeine refill
[20:44] <sense> duanedesign: yes
[20:45] <sense> duanedesign: The damn snow is ruining our ice!
[20:45] <sense> It has been freezing for a few days, which was good, but then this snow comes along and ruins it!
[20:47] <duanedesign> sense: we have not gotten our snow yet here. We usually get one to two good snows each winter
[20:48] <sense> we usually just once, but not always a lot
[21:26]  * JanC thinks sense wants an "Elfstedentocht"  ;)
[21:26] <JanC> the famous "eleven cities skating race"
[21:35] <Technoviking> jcastro: I posted something on the staff forum seeing if anyone could help the compiz forums
[21:35] <jcastro> ta
[21:50] <Pendulum> JanC: was that the race all over the canals in the Netherlands?
[21:51] <JanC> Pendulum: yes, the canals between 11 cities in Friesland (northern province, where sense lives)
[21:52] <Pendulum> :)
[21:52] <JanC> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elfstedentocht  ☺
[21:52] <JanC> seems like the last one was in 1997
[21:57] <JanC> so you can imagine they are eager for good ice by now  ;)
[21:57] <JanC> I think it didn't freeze for long enough yet anyway, but of course the snow makes the ice unusable
[22:12] <doctormo> jono: Got a second?
[22:12] <jono> doctormo, can't chat now, will be back soon
[22:12] <jono> doctormo, or drop me a mail
[22:12] <jono> back soon
[22:12] <doctormo> Wow that was quick, will email.
[22:19] <doctormo> pleia2: Are you here?
[22:21] <pleia2> doctormo: yep
[22:21] <doctormo> You've been to uds before, your thoughts: http://imagebin.ca/view/0pJwdCZh.html
[22:24] <pleia2> I think it's fairly accurate
[22:25] <doctormo> thanks pleia2, time to get myself to the bunny meetup.
[22:25] <AlanBell> doctormo: "Corperate"
[22:26] <doctormo> I was on TV yesterday, Chronical on channel 5 and 9 at least here in Boston. To do with SteamPunk.
[22:26] <AlanBell> Corporate
[22:26] <pleia2> doctormo: cool :)
[22:27] <doctormo> AlanBell: It's too late, my email is sent and my dyslexia apparent.
[22:27] <AlanBell> Phaises
[22:27] <AlanBell> Planaries
[22:27] <AlanBell> alternativly
[22:28] <AlanBell> s/supported/supposed/
[22:29] <AlanBell> I have no idea what dialectic consensus is
[22:29] <AlanBell> however, other than that, it totally rocks \o/
[22:29] <AlanBell> s/Customerisation/customisation/
[22:56] <czajkowski> aloha
[23:06] <doctormo> AlanBell: No, it's Cutomerisation
[23:06] <doctormo> The rest are spelling mistakes. ;-)
[23:07] <doctormo> dialectic consensus is when you get 5 people in a room who all want to achieve slightly different aims and have different considerations and users in mind. They use the power of discussion to effect the ideas in the other people's heads until everyone's ideas are almost exactly the same.
[23:08] <doctormo> Cutomerisation = Turning users into customers :-P
[23:10] <AlanBell> ok, that makes sense
[23:10]  * czajkowski hugs jono before going off to sleep 
[23:10] <jono> hey czajkowski :-)
[23:10] <jono> czajkowski, see my blog post?
[23:10] <jono> doctormo, back now
[23:10] <czajkowski> had a great afternnon in canonical.
[23:11] <czajkowski> jono: I did.. interesting comments on it, will reply tomorrow ehn I'm a lot more awake
[23:11] <jono> thanks czajkowski
[23:11] <jono> :)
[23:16] <jono> jcastro, still around?