[00:20] <Unit193> I take it rebuilding is a bit of work to do?
[00:21] <paultag> Unit193: nosir
[00:21] <paultag> Unit193: all my source is very public
[00:22] <paultag> Unit193: just change the changelog target and build on your local pbuilder
[00:22] <Unit193> If I do a mini install it would mostly be easy?
[00:22]  * canthus13 is considering setting up a freenet node...
[00:23]  * canthus13 wonders how bandwidth-intensive it is...
[00:23] <paultag> canthus13: on your network?
[00:23] <paultag> canthus13: like that you work for, not local
[00:23]  * Unit193 just does the sudo apt-get install k/f/ubuntu-desktop
[00:23] <paultag> Unit193: yeah it would be really easy
[00:29] <Unit193> Would it help you any?
[00:29] <paultag> Unit193: the PPC build?
[00:30] <paultag> Unit193: I'd love a test
[00:31] <Unit193> I have an very old G3 350MHz that I would love to put linux on (I'd even take debian)
[00:32] <Cheri703> http://notalwaysright.com/an-open-and-shut-case-2/8891
[00:33] <paultag> Unit193: give it a build
[00:45]  * Cheri703 is chilly
[00:50] <canthus13> paultag: at may home.
[00:50] <canthus13> err. my.
[00:51] <paultag> :)
[00:52]  * canthus13 is upping to 50/3 soon, may dedicate 1mbit upload to freenet.
[00:53] <paultag> aye
[00:57] <Cheri703> someone told me that roadrunner was going to be increasing speeds...don't know if I buy that
[00:59] <deejoe> "speeds"
[00:59] <deejoe> what horse hockey
[01:00] <Cheri703> well, that they were changing to fiber or something, I dunno
[01:00]  * Cheri703 wasn't paying attention
[01:00] <deejoe> which channel was it someone was saying their max rate was as advertised, so the fact that they were getting 50 percent packet loss wasn't considered a problem
[01:00] <Cheri703> o.O
[01:02] <deejoe> I know, right?
[01:02] <deejoe> (^^^ I don't know wtf that adds to any conversation, but it seems to be au courant, so I like to drop it in every now and again)
[01:02] <Cheri703> we have roadrunner, our connection drops out sometimes. but we have a really good price for what we get
[01:02] <Cheri703> heh
[01:02] <Cheri703> at least you didn't spell it "inorite"
[01:03] <paultag> inorite?
[01:04] <Cheri703> I know right = inorite for some people
[01:04] <Cheri703> I always read it as "inno-write" at first
[01:10]  * BiosElement has had 2 hours of sleep with maybe 3 30min sessions when he was woken between...and is writing test cases. >.>
[01:10] <BiosElement> Gonna be a long day heh
[01:11] <deejoe> inno-write--sounds like some database people tried their hand at a word processor or text editor
[01:35]  * canthus13 yawns.
[01:45] <firstc624> not much  going on this snowy monday huh....seems really quiet
[01:46] <canthus13> snowy?
[01:46] <canthus13> We have a few flurries, but nothing sticking.
[01:46] <firstc624> yell by the lake it is another thingi guess....hasn't stopped all day
[01:47]  * canthus13 is in toledo, out of range of Erie lake effect and Michigan lake effect.
[01:47] <firstc624> lake effect snow, gotta love it..lol
[01:48] <firstc624> it isn't to bad, but the lake is just getting warmed up for the big suff later in the year
[01:48]  * Cheri703 is in mansfield
[01:49] <Cheri703> we've had quite a bit of snow so far
[01:50] <firstc624> i think it is supposed to tapper off finally tomorrow sometime....but it is nice to see the snow....cold...but nice
[02:04] <Cheri703> blargh
[02:10] <canthus13> blargh?
[02:11] <Cheri703> yes
[02:12]  * Cheri703 had too much sugar and is blah, also not looking forward to leaving my house at 8am to drive 2 hours >.<
[02:12] <Cheri703> woo hypoglycemia
[02:15] <canthus13> :(
[02:15] <Cheri703> and procrastinating things that need to be done and I don't want to do...
[02:15] <Cheri703> working further on the contract for bosses and working on my resume'
[02:16] <canthus13> get that resume done! :P
[02:16] <Cheri703> yeah yeah
[02:16] <Cheri703> tonight my brain is mush though
[02:45] <thafreak> I want to smash these grad students
[02:45] <thafreak> seriously...
[02:45] <thafreak> he just said "What's a hash table"
[02:45] <deejoe> it's like brunch
[02:47] <BiosElement> Hah thafreak us new-breed programmers are ignorent of lower-level stuff. :P Heck, I had to google it. >.> I blame python. ;P
[02:47] <thafreak> are you a grad student?
[02:47] <thafreak> I expect grad students to know this crap
[02:47] <BiosElement> haha, no. :P
[02:47] <Cheri703> thafreak: you're in medina right?
[02:48] <BiosElement> Sounds a pain actually
[02:48] <thafreak> if you supposedly know about b-trees, in data structures, you better know what a hash table is, or you should never have been admitted to the grad program
[02:49] <thafreak> Cheri703: medina = yes
[02:49] <deejoe> I've got a vague idea of what a hash table is, and wouldn't know a b-tree if it fell on me in a windw storm
[02:49] <thafreak> hashtable == dict
[02:49] <BiosElement> Yep
[02:49] <deejoe> an index, for computers
[02:49] <BiosElement> I knew what a associative array was at least. :P
[02:49] <thafreak> but you guys aren't in a graduate CS program...where a pre-req is data structures...
[02:50] <thafreak> i'm just tired of these people...how they get in the program is beyond me...
[02:51] <Cheri703> know anyone in the region who needs a reasonably technical employee? (not a programmer though)
[02:51]  * Cheri703 is not too proud to solicit jobs in irc :)
[02:51] <thafreak> sorry for my whining...
[02:52] <thafreak> Cheri703: not off hand, but I will keep my eyes open...what kind of hourly rate/salary range are you looking for?
[02:53] <Cheri703> uhm, honestly? if I were making $10/hour it'd be vastly more than I make now...so...I'm pretty darn flexible (/me makes $300/week, which at 40 hours is about $7.50 an hour, thanks to idiot lying bosses, hooray!)
[02:53] <thafreak> yeah, you'll have those
[02:54] <Cheri703> so if I can't find a tech job, I'm pretty much open to any job I can get to that pays $9 or more and I don't have to be on my feet all day
[02:54] <thafreak> I atleast don't hate my boss...she's an academia type...so she talks like a politician alot...but that's about the worst
[02:54] <canthus13> a hash table... that's a counter in a coffee shop in amsterdam,r ight?
[02:54]  * Cheri703 would LOVE to make well over $10, but doesn't know how realistic that is
[02:55] <thafreak> I saw some internships doing tech stuff in the Kent area recently...not sure how far that is from you.
[02:55] <Cheri703> thafreak: mine decided that my corporate bonuses would count as my pay for a month at a time, want me to pay my own taxes and expect more than 40 hours per week whenever possible
[02:55] <canthus13> Cheri703: I'll let you know when something here opens up.
[02:55] <Cheri703> hmm...I'll google
[02:55] <Cheri703> thanks cant
[02:55] <Cheri703> canthus13:
[02:55] <Cheri703> bha
[02:55] <thafreak> I see alot of job openings come across my kent account
[02:55] <Cheri703> sd9-fryaw90er78
[02:55] <Cheri703> bah
[02:55] <Cheri703> ok
[02:55] <Cheri703> freaking computer
[02:56] <thafreak> Cheri703: maybe you should install windows xp a 5th time on it :)
[02:56]  * canthus13 baaws at his nfs share-less desktop.
[02:56] <Cheri703> nah, that's a different computer
[02:57] <BiosElement> True Story: http://xkcd.com/446/ >.<
[02:57] <Cheri703> got xp and the xerox programs working, now have to try to hunt down xp drivers for it
[02:57] <Cheri703> thafreak: 1.5 hours from mansfield to kent
[02:58] <thafreak> ouch...a bit far
[02:58] <Cheri703> while that's less than I drive to some clients now, not realistic long term :/
[02:58] <thafreak> is canton closer?
[02:58] <Cheri703> 15 min
[02:59] <canthus13> Cheri703: http://www.buckeyecablesystem.com/bci_html/career.html  $13.90 to start as tech support.
[02:59] <thafreak> is ashland near you?
[02:59] <Cheri703> ashland is about 25-30 min, definitely doable
[03:00] <canthus13> part time to start, though.
[03:00] <Cheri703> and toledo :/
[03:00] <Cheri703> we're in a lease until at least april
[03:00] <canthus13> True.
[03:01] <canthus13> Cheri703: But those are the reqs, and they never change. I'm sure something will pop up around then.
[03:01] <thafreak> I sometimes see canton stuff...so I'll keep an eye out
[03:01] <Cheri703> yeah, I appreciate it :)
[03:01] <Cheri703> (ashland would be very good :) )
[03:02] <thafreak> I know a guy who lives in ashland...and works for the local cable company there
[03:02] <Cheri703> ah, that's cool
[03:02] <thafreak> He might know of something...but he's also REALLY slow at responding to emails :)
[03:02] <Cheri703> there's a centurylink office here in mansfield, but I have roadrunner :)
[03:03] <Cheri703> I know a lot of people like that thafreak
[03:03] <thafreak> Why do you always say that "you're not a programmer"? :)
[03:03] <Cheri703> I've been contemplating what I should do if for some reason crazy bosses actually acquiesced to my proposed contract...
[03:03] <Cheri703> because I'm not, and a lot of people think of developer jobs when they're thinking tech jobs
[03:04] <Cheri703> not everyone, but I just put it out there as a disclaimer
[03:04] <thafreak> Only thing between avg non-programmers, and programmers is a few hours of playing with python :)
[03:05] <Cheri703> eh, I poked at python before, I didn't really get into it...I'm more of a "figure out things to do with what currently exists" than a "create something new" person. I am very interested in the networking side of things
[03:05]  * Cheri703 is also procrastinating reading up on the network+ exam materials
[03:06] <thafreak> do cisco
[03:06] <thafreak> the basic cisco cert is pretty decent
[03:06]  * thafreak not even sure what it's called these days
[03:06] <Cheri703> yeah, but I've heard from various people that having a non-manufacturer specific cert is *sometimes* preferable
[03:07] <thafreak> maybe, but I've heard mostly the + certs as being jokes...especially A+
[03:07] <canthus13> Cheri703: CCNA is an excellent all-around cert. it's very, very heavy on basic networking.
[03:07] <thafreak> they're more made fun of than MBA's
[03:07] <Cheri703> hmm...k
[03:08] <Cheri703> there are SO MANY conflicting views on certs, it's aggravating for someone trying to figure out where to focus their time
[03:08] <thafreak> CCNA is what I'd get first...
[03:08] <thafreak> you get past that, network+ should be cake
[03:09] <thafreak> I see mostly the Cisco stuff required/requested in most job postings...
[03:09] <Cheri703> some people say msce are useless, some companies ask for them, some people say ccna, some say comptia, some say don't get certs at all because they view them as wastes of time, others say don't get them because it just says you're willing to cram and toss some money out and probably don't have any experience to back it up >.<
[03:09] <thafreak> I only really see network+ on resumes :(
[03:09] <thafreak> you're right, all those views are valid :)
[03:09] <Cheri703> I've heard from at least 3 people who are at least vaguely related to my current work say that the network+ is what's wanted, so that's why I was headed that way
[03:09] <Cheri703> bah
[03:10] <Cheri703> I hate it
[03:10]  * Cheri703 is self taught thus far
[03:10] <thafreak> it all depends on the company doing the hiring
[03:10] <Cheri703> yeah
[03:10] <Cheri703> I'd like to put "I'll get whatever cert you want me to have"
[03:10] <Cheri703> but...don't know that that's helpful
[03:10] <thafreak> most managers haven't a clue, so they throw alphabet soup at the requirements
[03:11] <Cheri703> yeah :(
[03:11] <thafreak> well, if you started on net+, and, more importantly, if it's cheaper, do that first....but if you're serious about networking, ccna...
[03:12] <Cheri703> yeah, I wasn't planning to stop with network+
[03:12] <Cheri703> so quick poll time:
[03:12] <canthus13> If they'll take network+, they'll love CCNA. CCNA has all of network+ and then some.
[03:13] <Unit193> Trying to install Ubuntu on PPC is no cakewalk....
[03:13] <thafreak> haha...dude, doing anything on ppc is no cakewalk :)
[03:13] <canthus13> only idiots dismiss cisco certs because of a vendor affiliation.
[03:13] <thafreak> you think that's fun, try installing linux on an old Alpha
[03:14] <Cheri703> if you had craptastic bosses who did any of the various things I've pissed about in here, and they said "wow, you know what? we were wrong, we'll pay you more because we realize that we'll be utterly screwed without you" would you stay? even after they've lied to corporate about paying you, taken your bonuses, denied others, claimed you didn't talk about things you did, changed the working arrangement pretty much every few months.
[03:14] <Cheri703> ...? would you stay?
[03:14] <thafreak> canthus13: right, but those idiots are often called "managers" :)
[03:14] <Unit193> thafreak: did you ever get PPC to work?
[03:14] <canthus13> Cheri703: Not without a contract.
[03:14] <thafreak> Unit193: I had debian on an imac...barely got past the installer it kept crashing and freezing
[03:15] <Cheri703> they seem to be the type of people who might view a contract as a fluid document
[03:15] <Cheri703> and I would be putting forth a contract to see if they'll go for it
[03:15] <canthus13> Cheri703: a signed contract isn't 'fluid'.
[03:15] <canthus13> It's something to beat them over the head with. :)
[03:15] <Unit193> thafreak: should I even bother trying?
[03:15] <thafreak> I'm all about head beating
[03:16] <canthus13> Unit193: It's a fun exercise.
[03:16] <thafreak> Unit193: of course you should
[03:16] <canthus13> It builds character. :)
[03:16] <Cheri703> but considering that the last time I told them that changes needed to happen and that they were in violation of the requirements of me being a "contractor" I was told that we have a "non-traditional contractor agreement" (which isn't on paper and basically means I'm an indentured servant), and that she's "not concerned about the government coming in to look at [her] records" regarding following said laws
[03:16] <thafreak> it will put hair on your chest...unless your a female...then it will...do whatever is the femail equivalent
[03:16] <Cheri703> and that she freaks out if anyone questions her about pretty much anything
[03:16] <canthus13> Cheri703: ...you *could* tip the IRS off...
[03:16] <Cheri703> canthus13: that's on the agenda potentially
[03:17] <Unit193> thafreak: 350MHz l/x/f/ubuntu?
[03:17] <canthus13> Unit193: Lubuntu.
[03:18] <Cheri703> I just know that they'll be utterly screwed without me, and that I like the work and the clients, but I don't know that it's worth it even if they were suddenly to have a come to jesus moment
[03:18] <thafreak> Unit193: fluxbox if your doing a desktop....I wouldn't do xubuntu...lxde might work...but fluxbox would probably run best
[03:18] <canthus13> Lubuntu is remarkably well done.
[03:18] <canthus13> and It's mature enough and stable enough to use everyday.
[03:18] <Unit193> thafreak: that's what I was thinking... but I'll have to rebuild and I have never done that
[03:19] <thafreak> how much ram Unit193 ?
[03:19] <Unit193> canthus13: I use that on one old pc... it's not as fast as Ubuntu used to me
[03:19]  * canthus13 has run Lubuntu with 256MB with no issues at all.
[03:19] <Unit193> *be
[03:19] <thafreak> rebuild is pretty easy...
[03:19] <Unit193> thafreak: 512+
[03:19] <thafreak> wow
[03:19] <Unit193> canthus13: 500MHz
[03:20] <thafreak> well 512mb of ram, should be good enough for even xubuntu...
[03:20] <canthus13> Unit193: Same.  Then I upgraded/killed that machine.
[03:20] <canthus13> thafreak: 500mhz might be a bit tight.
[03:20] <canthus13> Xubuntu was a dog on a 1ghz P3 with 512mb.
[03:20] <Unit193> thafreak: 4 ram slots so I just kept on adding
[03:20] <Unit193> canthus13: 350 in the PPC
[03:21] <thafreak> all I know, is that my 120mhz p1 w/64mb of ram ran blackbox like a dream...
[03:21] <canthus13> PPC speeds don't really measure up to the same as x86...
[03:21] <thafreak> fluxbox isn't much more than the old blackbox
[03:21] <thafreak> not sure how you'd work the menus with only a single mouse button though
[03:22] <Unit193> mini install doesn't seem to have the HD driver....
[03:22] <Cheri703> ctrl click probably?
[03:22] <Cheri703> or whatever the mac key is called
[03:22] <canthus13> splat.
[03:24] <Unit193> http://www.everymac.com/systems/apple/powermac_g3/stats/powermac_g3_350_bl.html <--- that's it
[03:49] <BiosElement> And the amazing corporate censorship continues with mastercard. Awesome how all these companies think they're judges. >.<
[04:04] <Unit193> Is there a simple guide telling you how to rebuild a distro?
[04:05] <thafreak> rebuild a distro, or a package?
[04:06] <Unit193> distro
[04:06] <thafreak> why do you want to rebuild an entire distro?
[04:06] <Unit193> x/k/l/f/ubuntu
[04:08] <Unit193> that's not the only way to get f/lubuntu on PPC?
[04:08] <thafreak> i think most of ubuntu is already built for ppc
[04:09] <thafreak> so you only need to build say, fluxbox
[04:09] <Unit193> fubuntu-desktop I'm sure won't work, right?
[04:09] <Unit193> or lubuntu-desktop
[04:09] <thafreak> well, those are meta-packages
[04:10] <thafreak> not real ones
[04:10] <Unit193> I know that... it just makes it easy :)
[04:10] <thafreak> they just are basically empty, but have a bunch of "dependancies"
[04:10] <thafreak> so the meta package isn't the problem, it's the various dependancies you'll need to make sure are built for ppc
[04:11] <Unit193> That seems like it may take a while
[04:12] <thafreak> probably not...most of the big stuff should already be there as long as ppc is a supported arch
[04:12] <thafreak> like all the packages from main
[04:12] <thafreak> universe/multiverse is the only place where there might be things missing
[04:13] <Unit193> I take it you can't just apt-get install fubuntu-desktop and see what won't work?
[20:51] <thafreak> ?
[23:02] <Unit193> ubuntu-10.10-alternate-powerpc.iso - Still no HD detected :( trying debian