[00:29] <charlie-tca> ochosi: too much gray text on gray backgrounds, it is blurring for me
[03:03] <charlie-tca> um, broke natty now, bad. 
[03:03] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: orage works great after a restart.
[03:04] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: unfortunately, it restart without any panels, and no window title bars either. adding the panels puts them their, but nothing on the panels works.
[03:05] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: the launchers are dead, the workspace switcher is dead, the quit button is dead
[03:05] <charlie-tca> the windows don't respect the panels at all now. 
[03:06] <charlie-tca> Can not change themes, since Settings Manager -> Window Manager is blank
[03:06] <charlie-tca> I can use the single workspace that is active. I can only use whatever window starts on top. The rest can not be raised
[03:07] <charlie-tca> But, Thank you for orage.
[03:08] <charlie-tca> micahg: why does firefox never came back with any tabs?
[03:08] <micahg> charlie-tca: that would be a bug :)
[03:08] <micahg> session restore should be working
[03:08] <charlie-tca> It restarts with a single blank tab now
[03:09] <charlie-tca> I suppose you know it is going to be hard to report the bug for a bit. things are kind of jumbled up at the moment.
[03:09] <charlie-tca> :-)
[03:10] <micahg> charlie-tca: maybe it's a xubuntu quirk, I think chrisccoulson is on natty already
[03:10] <charlie-tca> I have to wonder if Ubuntu did not do something to us again. Since all the window title bars are gone
[03:11] <micahg> compiz?
[03:12] <charlie-tca> unity
[03:12] <charlie-tca> I think takes the title bar away and puts the menu in the top panel, isn't it?
[03:12] <charlie-tca> We did not lose the window menus, but the windows start on top the panel in the top right corner now
[03:13] <charlie-tca> s/top right/top left
[03:13] <micahg> charlie-tca: yeah, sounds like Ubuntu hijacked compiz for unity
[03:14] <charlie-tca> but we don't use compiz
[03:15] <micahg> charlie-tca: oh, right, xfwm?
[03:15] <charlie-tca> yup
[03:15] <charlie-tca> compiz and unity are not installed
[03:16] <micahg> charlie-tca: in that case I would think it's a bug in xfwm
[03:17] <charlie-tca> Well, then. I just need to wait for everything to catch up, I guess. 
[03:25] <charlie-tca> Well, I feel better now. Alpha is living up to what it should be... :-)
[03:32] <charlie-tca> found the problem. Xfce4-session failed to start
[03:35] <micahg> ah
[03:36] <charlie-tca> well, that is part of it anyway. I will investigate more tomorrow, I guess. 
[03:36] <charlie-tca> starting the session manager did give the window title bar and panels back, anyway
[12:44] <ochosi> charlie-tca: hm, could you please be a bit more specific? grey text where on what grey areas?
[13:15] <charlie-tca> I can try to be. 
[13:16] <charlie-tca> ochosi: window title and menus
[13:16] <charlie-tca> firefox, list of bookmarks
[13:16] <charlie-tca> claws-mail, all read mail is gray text
[13:16] <charlie-tca> the main window to read my mail is gray text
[13:17] <charlie-tca> liferea - all feeds are gray
[13:17] <ochosi> aha interesting
[13:17] <charlie-tca> all text in the feeds are gray
[13:17] <mr_pouit> I guess some screenshots would be nice :p
[13:17] <ochosi> yep :)
[13:17] <ochosi> i don't seem to have those issues with the theme in maverick
[13:17] <charlie-tca> It's almost all the text
[13:17] <ochosi> maybe something changed in natty
[13:17] <charlie-tca> heh
[13:18] <charlie-tca> like that is not possible :-)
[13:18] <ochosi> the window-title is understandable, but the current xfwm-theme is far from final
[13:18] <ochosi> sure, anyways, a screenshot would be nice
[13:18] <charlie-tca> alrighty, I will screenshot stuff in a bit
[13:18] <ochosi> just to be able to compare
[13:19] <mr_pouit> (and I rebuilt the current natty murrine engine to use it on debian unstable, and it works fine here, so probably not a natty-specific issue)
[13:19] <ochosi> mmh
[13:19] <charlie-tca> and, not yours at all, I can not change anything on the desktop yet. I lost the picture yesterday and it looks like brown only today
[13:19] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: I know, I am patiently waiting on that one
[13:20] <mr_pouit> charlie-tca: check that xfce4-settings-helper is running, and also xfdesktop
[13:21] <mr_pouit> (and xfwm4, etc.)
[13:21] <mr_pouit> from what you wrote earlier this morning, it seems like nothing is running (no session manager, no settings manager, no window manager, etc)
[13:22] <charlie-tca> heh
[13:22] <charlie-tca> neat, huh?
[13:25] <charlie-tca> don't see no xfdesktop running
[13:27] <charlie-tca> um, no such package, xfdesktop
[13:28] <mr_pouit> try with xfdesktop4
[13:29] <charlie-tca> not installed
[13:30] <charlie-tca> candidate: 4.7.4-0ubuntu1
[13:30] <mr_pouit> yeah, it probably got removed when you installed the new panel
[13:30] <charlie-tca> oops
[13:30] <mr_pouit> install it back then, and your desktop should be back
[13:31] <charlie-tca> restarting
[13:39] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: got it
[13:39] <charlie-tca> Thanks
[13:39] <charlie-tca> That is much better than the dark brown background
[13:39] <charlie-tca> got icons and wallpaper now
[13:48] <ochosi> charlie-tca: did anything change with the theme now?
[13:49] <charlie-tca> nope
[13:50] <charlie-tca> well, I mean yes, but it is things like different icons
[13:50] <charlie-tca> Since I have your icons loaded too
[13:50] <charlie-tca> Oh, ochosi, I wanted you to look at a wiki page, if you have time
[13:50] <ochosi> k, link?
[13:51] <charlie-tca> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Artwork/Natty
[13:51] <charlie-tca> Do we want to move that stuff to the Artwork page itself?
[13:52] <ochosi> with artwork-page you're referring to: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Artwork ?
[13:52] <charlie-tca> yup
[13:52] <ochosi> well, in fact it would make sense to me that the artwork page is the same as the one for the current cycle
[13:52] <charlie-tca> I am going to advertise the page, need to make sure it reads good
[13:53] <ochosi> meaning artwork = natty, but after natty Artwork/Natty is kept whilst Artwork then contains the stuff for 11.10
[13:53] <ochosi> currently it's too hard for people to find the artwork for the current cycle
[13:54] <charlie-tca> So, move it to xubuntu/Artwork, at the end of the release cycle, archive it and start again?
[13:54] <ochosi> yeah, that was the idea
[13:54] <charlie-tca> That actually makes sense to me. I will do it this week
[13:54] <ochosi> or even keep both the xb/Artwork page and xb/Artwork/natty in sync and just update xb/Artwork when the next cycle starts
[13:55] <ochosi> cool
[13:55] <charlie-tca> Thanks
[13:55] <ochosi> btw, i'll talk to knome about greybird versioning, i mean we'll do releases that can be linked to from the wiki page
[13:55] <ochosi> so that people can download it directly from there
[13:55] <charlie-tca> Neat!
[13:56] <ochosi> btw, if you don't mind i'd like to edit the installation instructions a bit
[13:57] <charlie-tca> Go ahead. That's why I wanted you to check it out
[14:02] <ochosi> charlie-tca: k, updated it a bit here and there, i'll maybe rework it a bit as soon as i have more time
[14:03] <charlie-tca> Great! Thanks for helping
[14:03]  * ochosi is wondering why all wallpaper submissions up to now are dark blue...
[14:07] <charlie-tca> Trying to get away from it. Thorwil keeps trying to tell them we other other colors included, but...
[14:08] <charlie-tca> We do need to know if the window borders, title bar, background, and panels will be the colors I see now
[14:09] <ochosi> yeah, well i would say "we need to decide"
[14:09] <ochosi> the point is that the current colors are my proposal, i've been working with/on them for a month or so
[14:09] <ochosi> and i still like them, which should be a good sign
[14:09] <charlie-tca> ooops
[14:09] <charlie-tca> yes, that is a good sign
[14:10] <charlie-tca> I will let him know, then
[14:13] <ochosi> k
[14:13] <ochosi> g2g now, bbl
[14:13] <charlie-tca> okay
[16:01] <robertf> Hello
[16:03] <charlie-tca> Hello, robertf 
[16:03] <robertf> i've a problem to try xubuntu 11.04. I downloaded the iso image. I can choose the language, the keyboard layout. After, there is a message "there was a problem reading data from cd-rom. Please make sure it is in the drive.
[16:03] <robertf> i use an usb stick
[16:03] <charlie-tca> Did you burn to usb using usb-creator in 10.10?
[16:05] <robertf> charlie-tca: no, i only copy these files initrd.gz, vmlinuz, from natty repository to usb drive and the natty-desktop-i386.iso
[16:06] <charlie-tca> Then it won't work, as far as I know
[16:06] <robertf> i alsa created the syslinux.cfg and added default vmlinuz and append initrd=initrd.gz
[16:06] <charlie-tca> !burn
[16:06] <charlie-tca> !iso
[16:06] <charlie-tca> well
[16:07] <robertf> the md5sum is correct
[16:07] <charlie-tca> yeah, those were wrong
[16:07] <charlie-tca> Might ask in #xubuntu, which is the support channel. they might have a better idea.
[16:07] <robertf> charlie-tca: thank you
[16:07] <charlie-tca> You are welcome
[16:08] <charlie-tca> Just ask your question and someone will answer if they can
[16:26] <charlie-tca> ochosi: by the way, the icons in "notification area" seem to shrink and grow randomly. Sometimes they are as big as the other icons, other times they are about 8px X 8px, which is really hard to see on 40opx panels
[16:26] <charlie-tca> well, 40px panels, even
[16:51] <charlie-tca> mr_pouit: by the way, I heard they are going to move apport to gtk3, too
[16:53] <mr_pouit> yeah, they're going to move all utils to gtk3
[16:53] <charlie-tca> okay
[21:44] <charlie-tca> ochosi, mr_pouit : http://imagebin.org/126996  shows the gray text best. Also all dropdowns are gray on gray similar to the title bar
[21:45] <charlie-tca> http://imagebin.org/126992 for shrinking notification area icons
[21:45]  * charlie-tca thinks they shrank completely now, they are gone
[22:47] <charlie-tca> ochosi: let me know it is my eyes, not the colors
[23:01] <micahg> charlie-tca: mr_pouit: FYI, it looks like there won't be any major gtk3 porting happening in natty
[23:06] <charlie-tca> thank you, micahg