[00:00] <saintly> how do i go about finding out what friver i need, and how do i get it?
[00:00] <charlie-tca> What version of Xubuntu?
[00:00] <saintly> 10.10
[00:00] <charlie-tca> Applications -> System -> Additional Drivers
[00:01] <saintly> it said: no proprietary drivers found.
[00:01] <charlie-tca> much harder
[00:01] <charlie-tca> what video card do you have? You can use    lspci    in a terminal to find out
[00:02] <saintly> okay, let me try that
[00:03] <saintly> alrght gave me a whole list, what do i need to look at?
[00:03] <charlie-tca> find video in it
[00:03] <charlie-tca> or graphics
[00:03] <saintly> 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation 82852/855GM Integrated Graphics Device (rev 01)
[00:05] <saintly> will this work for me? http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=5294706
[00:07] <charlie-tca> Isn't that to set up a second instance of compiz. You can't get the first instance to start
[00:08] <saintly> i have Compiz up entirely, what it would seem is that "vesa" is the fallback driver for intel, and i need the right driver, but i dont know how to do that
[00:08] <charlie-tca> Looks to me like I should say to try in #ubuntu-x , since I don't know why the hardware driver is not working for you
[00:09] <saintly> until i have the right driver, only basic rendering is possible, which means no pretty compiz
[00:09] <charlie-tca> Your hardware driver is built in to the kernel
[00:10] <saintly> hmm
[00:10] <charlie-tca> !855gm
[00:10] <charlie-tca> !intel
[00:11] <charlie-tca> but it doesn't tell us about 10.10
[00:11] <gr8m8> a read of the X log should give a clue especially whether dri is enabled
[00:12] <charlie-tca> You have to tell saintly how to do that, gr8m8
[00:13] <gr8m8> ok
[00:13] <saintly> lol noobish :P
[00:13] <gr8m8> saintly: in a terminal run this command   grep -i dri /var/log/Xorg.0.log | grep -iv driver
[00:14] <saintly> and you wnat the outcome?
[00:14] <charlie-tca> if it is more than a line or two use pastebin
[00:14] <gr8m8> it should tell if dri is enabled on a line that starts with AIGLX
[00:14] <charlie-tca> !paste
[00:16] <saintly> alright says: AIGLX: Screen 0 is not DRI2 capable... and also: AIGLX: Screen 0 is not DRI capable
[00:16] <gr8m8> that means you can't do compositing then afaik
[00:16] <saintly> which means im just not able to do compiz?
[00:17] <gr8m8> yep
[00:17] <gr8m8> I'll have a quick google about your card
[00:17] <saintly> what ifi find a driver for my graphics card, will that fix anything?
[00:18] <MorphixNW> I have the same graphics chip, but I dont have drivers installed for it
[00:18] <MorphixNW> default works for me, but it broke after the latest kernel update
[00:18] <gr8m8> I think the only one available is the driver in the kernel for intel cards
[00:19] <saintly> and thats the vesa one yeah?
[00:19] <MorphixNW> yeah
[00:20] <saintly> hmm well im gonna look around online, i already found one for the 82852 family
[00:21] <gr8m8> saintly: have you run the terminal app   Compiz-check   ?
[00:21] <charlie-tca> saintly: it has to be for the 855gm though. The family has many cards included
[00:21] <saintly> yes i have, gr8m8, thats what told me vesa driver wouldnt support compiz
[00:21] <saintly> hmm
[00:22] <gr8m8> saintly: using the vesa driver will never get you compositing - can you paste your X log?
[00:23] <saintly> hold on found a soved fix i beleive...
[00:23] <saintly> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1464239
[00:24] <saintly> will that work?
[00:25] <charlie-tca> might be. Read all of that information. Sometimes, it makes things worse, but if you are willing to take a chance than it is worth tryign
[00:25] <charlie-tca> You might have to reinstall xubuntu when it breaks, though
[00:26] <saintly> lol i have 2 usbs and a cd of xubunt now :D
[00:29]  * charlie-tca shrugs... he is always willing to do another installation if needed
[00:29] <gr8m8> that forum post is about a different issue with an earlier kernel
[00:29] <saintly> alright well i found a set of instructions, but i cant wrpp my mind around it
[00:30] <gr8m8> I'd check the X log for why it uses the vesa driver first myself
[00:30] <gr8m8> !ppa
[00:31] <gr8m8> should tell how to set up a ppa
[00:32] <saintly> what about this set of instructions? its the first answer there, i cant understand about hlaf of it
[00:32] <saintly> http://superuser.com/questions/192121/how-to-install-intel-82852-855gm-driver-on-ubuntu-10-10-maverick-meerkat
[00:35] <gr8m8> the comment marked 1 seems to be the easiest - but it depends on what the X log says about why it is using the vesa driver
[00:36] <gr8m8> there has to be a reason for that
[00:36] <saintly> lol i have no idea
[00:36] <saintly> is there any way to find out?
[00:36] <gr8m8> I asked earlier if you could paste your X log
[00:37] <saintly> where do i get that from? the system check for compiz?
[00:37] <gr8m8> the X log is the file   /var/log/Xorg.0.log
[00:38] <saintly> how do i pull that out and get it here? lol
[00:39] <gr8m8> open it and copy it to pastebin
[00:39] <gr8m8> !paste
[00:40] <gr8m8> in mousepads menu is an option for selecting all text in an open file - then right click the selected text and select copy
[00:40] <saintly> lol im still trying to find the file
[00:42] <gr8m8>  /var is a toplevel directory like /boot and /media
[00:43] <charlie-tca> Open places; click system
[00:43] <charlie-tca> find var
[00:44] <saintly> i have xorg log and xorg log old
[00:44] <saintly> i have xorg log and xorg log old
[00:47] <gr8m8> bbiab
[00:47] <guero> Hello?
[00:47] <charlie-tca> !hi | guero
[00:48] <guero> Hey! :)
[00:48] <guero> I'm trying to set up Xubuntu on my laptop.
[00:48] <guero> I just updated all of the drivers and installed all of the necessary updates.
[00:48] <guero> Apparently, Xubuntu says that "wireless is disabled."
[00:48] <guero> I'm using a cable to connect to the Internet.
[00:49] <guero> Any ideas...?
[00:49] <saintly> dang
[00:49] <guero> That doesn't sound too good! lol!
[00:50] <guero> Am I out of luck on this one?
[00:50] <MorphixNW> could try installing Windows Drivers, not exactly sure how, but I managed to make a Netgear USB WiFi work on my 10.04 system that way :)
[00:51] <LK> hiya eberybody!
[00:51] <charlie-tca> see if the driver is waiting to be installed in additional drivers
[00:52] <MorphixNW> hi lk
[00:52] <guero> @MorphixNW  Where could I find the Windows drivers?  Would I have to try Wine and see what happens?
[00:52] <LK> how's it going?
[00:52] <charlie-tca> !wireless
[00:52] <MorphixNW> guero: try Applications > Additional Drivers first :)
[00:52] <MorphixNW> LK: not so bad :)
[00:52] <LK> I'm thinking of finally Taking The Plunge
[00:53] <MorphixNW> go for it
[00:53] <LK> well, my big issue is, i don't want to get rid of all of my settings
[00:53] <MorphixNW> remove the hard drive and install a different one :)
[00:54] <LK> I'd have to buy a new hard drive :p
[00:54] <MorphixNW> VM it for a while and the switch fully
[00:55] <LK> that's what I've been doing, actually
[00:55] <MorphixNW> go for it, format and install Xubuntu :)
[00:56] <LK> which brings me back to losing my settings :p
[00:56] <MorphixNW> what is it that is important about the settings?
[00:56] <MorphixNW> or do you mean files?
[00:56] <LK> logs, histories, favorites, that sort of stuff
[00:56] <LK> which I suppose are, technically, files
[00:56] <MorphixNW> USB stick?
[00:56] <guero> MorphixNW: I looked up the additional drivers, and it said "no propriety drivers are in use on this system."
[00:57] <LK> hm
[00:57] <guero> MorphixNW: It also said that I had the Broadcom B43 wireless driver installed and activated.
[00:57] <LK> that might work
[00:57] <MorphixNW> hmmmm
[00:57] <MorphixNW> try installing wicd then :)
[00:57] <guero> I've tried rebooting the machine, but it doesn't seem to help.
[00:57] <MorphixNW> guero "sudo apt-get install wicd"
[00:57] <MorphixNW> guero: "sudo apt-get install wicd"
[00:58] <MorphixNW> its a different network manager
[01:00] <guero> MorphixNW: Okay, I just ran the sudo you just gave me.
[01:00] <MorphixNW> !cluster
[01:00] <guero> MorphixNW: And it said, * Starting Network connection manager wicd   [fail]
[01:01] <MorphixNW> try to start it from Applications > Network
[01:01] <guero> MorphixNW: Okay, I got it to start from Applications > Network
[01:02] <guero> It says that I'm currently connected via wired-default
[01:02] <MorphixNW> any wireless options?
[01:02] <guero> No wireless networks found
[01:02] <guero> Do I need to unplug the internet cable from the laptop and try the router?
[01:03] <guero> Trying to connect to the Internet wirelessly, I mean
[01:03] <MorphixNW> should be able to see it even with wired plugged in
[01:04] <guero> The box is checked that says, "Use as default profile (overwrites any previous default.)"
[01:04] <guero> Do I just need to try to add my network manually?
[01:04] <MorphixNW> give it a shot :)
[01:05] <guero> I mean, I don't know my IP Address/Netmask
[01:05] <guero> Can't you tell I'm a Linux newbie?
[01:05] <guero> Haha!
[01:07] <guero> MorphixNW: Or am I just out of luck on this one?
[01:08] <MorphixNW> assign that to DCHP or automatic
[01:08] <MorphixNW> but wifi isnt always easy on linux :(
[01:09] <guero> DCHP is already set to "automatic"
[01:10] <guero> Yeah, WiFi on Linux is becoming pretty painful! lol!
[01:10] <MorphixNW> so you should just need to setup the SSID
[01:10] <MorphixNW> network name (wireless)
[01:10] <LK> is Xcfe based on Qt?
[01:11] <gr8m8> nope gtk
[01:11] <LK> ok
[01:11] <saintly> alright, im back and ready to try this one more time...
[01:12] <gr8m8> did you find the log?
[01:12] <saintly> Im using http://www.downloadatoz.com/driver/articles/guide-install-intel-855gm-driver-to-ubuntu-10-10.html to try and install a 855gm, but its asking for /etc/x11/xorg.conf which i do not have.
[01:12] <guero> MorphixNW: Umm...how to I setup the SSID?
[01:12] <guero> XD
[01:13] <saintly> and yes i fould the file, but it wouldnt let me past somethingthat bifg gr8m8
[01:13] <MorphixNW> the SSID is the name of your wireless network, setup on the router
[01:13] <MorphixNW> you shoudl just be able to enter the details in the correct boxes, but I dont have wicd installed so hard to say precisely
[01:13] <saintly> i dont know why i dont have a xorg.conf file but i should.
[01:14] <gr8m8> saintly: you cam make a xorg.conf with the command   Xorg -configure   or easier find one on the net for your card
[01:14] <gr8m8> saintly: not for a while has xorg.conf been used - the dir xorg.conf.d is used now
[01:14] <saintly> gr8m8: find one what? LOL and yes i just ran the config file in term
[01:15] <gr8m8> but a xorg.conf will still work
[01:15] <MorphixNW> I am sleepy now, tomorrow I will hopefully have my cluster-farm setup :)
[01:15] <guero> MorphixNW: I'm sorry, but I'm still really lost on this one!
[01:15] <saintly> gr8m8: where can i find the new config file, is it still under X11?
[01:15] <gr8m8> saintly: it will be in your home dir
[01:16] <saintly> gr8m8: just home? wow thats nuch easier :D
[01:16] <gr8m8> saintly: it won't work from there you need to copy it to /etc/X11
[01:16] <gr8m8> edit it first
[01:16] <saintly> so create a xorg.conf.d, and copy it to X11?
[01:17] <gr8m8> saintly: you will already have that dir in /etc/X11
[01:17] <saintly> hmm
[01:17] <gr8m8> saintly: if you are going to use a xorg.conf file it goes in /etc/X11
[01:18] <saintly> gr8m8 i have nothing that even says xorg on it under X11
[01:19] <gr8m8> saintly: I dunno what has happened to your system then
[01:19] <gr8m8> it is always there
[01:19] <saintly> yeah, i have a genetic mutation..
[01:19] <saintly> :D
[01:19] <saintly> this sux
[01:20] <saintly> maybew thats why im using vesa drivers then, because the file that would specify otherwise simply does not exist.
[01:20] <gr8m8> saintly: what does   cat /etc/issue   return?
[01:21] <saintly> gr8m8: in term?
[01:21] <gr8m8> yep
[01:21] <saintly> Ubuntu 10.10 \n \l
[01:22] <gr8m8> k
[01:22] <saintly> what does that tell you? lol
[01:22] <gr8m8> saintly: do your editing to the xorg.conf file you made and copy it to /etc/X11 then
[01:23] <gr8m8> just what os you run
[01:23] <saintly> alright
[01:23] <saintly> now what shold i be putting IN the file lol
[01:23] <saintly> and is it just a wordpad?
[01:24] <gr8m8> it is called mousepad in xubuntu
[01:24] <saintly> lol oopsy
[01:24] <saintly> what goes inside there?
[01:26] <gr8m8> you said you were following a website what does that ask you to do?
[01:26] <saintly> to edit my file, but the file its asking me to edit, doesnt exist.
[01:26] <saintly> :D
[01:27] <gr8m8> you just made it you said and it was in your home dir...
[01:27] <saintly> i said where do i put it once i make it
[01:28] <gr8m8> saintly: do your editing to the xorg.conf file you made and copy it to /etc/X11 then
[01:28] <gr8m8> like I said earlier
[01:28] <gr8m8> ffs
[01:28] <LK> back XD
[01:29] <LK> I had a thought
[01:29] <saintly> or not, cuz i found Xorg conf.d under usr/share/X11 YESSSSSS
[01:29] <saintly> wooooo
[01:30] <saintly> they appriently moved it from etc
[01:30] <saintly> is that where yours is?
[01:30] <LK> if I were to delete as much as I could from Windows, I could use the spare space for a new partition, right?
[01:31] <saintly> i dont see why not, as long as you have the space for files in your linux
[01:31] <LK> can Xubuntu read/write/execute from Windows?
[01:32] <saintly> like, while running windows?
[01:32] <LK> no, while running Xubuntu
[01:32] <LK> execute I'm not so worried about, really
[01:32] <LK> though, if I installed WINE...
[01:33] <saintly> wine or virtualbox, both are killer programs for that kind of thing.
[01:33] <LK> virtualbox can read/execute from other partitions?
[01:35] <saintly> i beleive so.
[01:35] <LK> weird
[01:35] <saintly> gr8m8: where under xorg.conf.d do i edit for my driver intel
[01:36] <LK> I'd think a guest machine wouldn't even see any extra partitions from the host machine...
[01:36] <saintly> its only doing configs for my mouse and track pad so it would seem.
[01:37] <saintly> i might not have a clue what im talkin about LK lol.
[01:37] <LK> lol
[01:37] <saintly> ive used VB though, and have run several distros from windows in linux, and linux in windows.
[01:38] <saintly> i perfer VB to WINE
[01:38] <LK> what I'm thinking is, if my program settings are saved in various files, then I can install Xubuntu in a new partition, then copy all the settings files from Windows to Xubuntu
[01:39] <LK> adjusting the partition sizes as Windows slowly gets assimilated
[01:40] <LK> would that work?
[01:41] <saintly> i dont know about that, theres always that barrier between linux and windows, i dont know if theyll convert without a program specifically for finding and converting them.
[01:41] <charlie-tca> saintly: if xorg.conf is not under /etc/X11/xorg.conf, create it there. Otherewise it won't actually work
[01:41] <LK> does any *buntu have such a program?
[01:42] <LK> for that matter, does any distro?
[01:42] <saintly> so i dont need it under xorg.conf.d?
[01:42] <charlie-tca> saintly: xorg.conf.d is wrong
[01:43] <saintly> aha okay, so all i have to do now is write my own Xorg.conf file :D yay fun...
[01:43] <saintly> ill do that tomorrow.
[01:43] <saintly> im out for now guys, see you later
[01:43] <charlie-tca> yes.
[01:43] <charlie-tca> If it exists it will be used,
[01:43] <charlie-tca> It just is not created by default anymore
[01:44] <saintly> other wise, they revert to vesa default which are lacking in reall graphics power.
[01:44] <saintly> understood. :D
[01:44] <saintly> well im outta here
[01:49] <guero> Hey, I've got another question for you all.
[01:49] <guero> I'm trying to find the drivers for a particular router.
[01:49] <guero> And I'm not having a whole lot of luck.
[01:51] <guero> Do you all know where I could find the drivers for a Linksys E2000 Wireless-N router?
[01:52] <LK> you sure you don't need the drivers for the wireless card?
[01:53] <LK> I don't know if routers need drivers...
[01:55] <charlie-tca> !linksys
[01:57] <guero> Yeah, I need the drivers for the wireless card
[01:57] <guero> My bad!
[01:57] <guero> XD
[01:57] <LK> what card do you have?
[01:58] <guero> Hold on, I'm trying to find the right code to enter into terminal to find out
[02:00] <guero>  I have a Broadcom Corporation BCM4318 802.11g Wireless Lan card
[02:00] <guero> I've already installed the Broadcom Drivers Xubuntu recommended for me.
[02:00] <guero> And I've already activated them
[02:01] <guero> I've also tried ndiswrapper
[02:01] <guero> And just sticking the CD that came with my router into the drive
[02:01] <guero> Nothing seems to work
[02:01] <guero> :(
[02:01] <charlie-tca> did you restart after activating them?
[02:03] <guero> Yes, I restarted my computer
[02:03] <guero> The only way I can stay online is through my ethernet cable
[02:07] <guero> Do you guys have any ideas???
[02:11] <LK> definitely an issue with the wireless card
[02:11] <guero> Yeah, that's what I'm thinking.
[02:12] <guero> I installed Xubuntu 10.04 on a Dell Latitude D610 laptop
[02:12] <guero> It's really old...XD
[02:12] <guero> Okay, I've got another question for you guys...
[02:13]  * LK put FreeDOS on his oldest laptop
[02:13] <guero> The last time I used Ubuntu, I was dual-booting with Windows via WUBI
[02:13] <guero> Ubuntu never had any problems connecting to Wi-Fi via Wubi
[02:13] <guero> If I were to use Ubuntu instead of Xubuntu, would I still have problems with my wireless card?
[02:14] <LK> try it
[02:14] <guero> Or is this a Xubuntu-only issue?
[02:14] <LK> I'd try that
[02:14] <guero> Does the fact that I used Wubi have anything to do with Ubuntu and my Wi-Fi signal?
[02:15] <guero> I mean, I just need a machine that can quickly access the Internet
[02:15] <guero> I'm not tied down to one particular distro.
[02:16] <LK> I'd test it out live before the install, but what do you have to lose by trying?
[02:19] <guero> Hmm...very true LK
[02:19] <guero> I'll have to look into it.
[02:19] <guero> I made a bootable Xubuntu USB...I can always reformat it with Ubuntu
[02:20] <guero> I'm going to try it out...
[02:20] <guero> Thanks for the tips you guys! :)
[02:46] <_Techie_> is it at all feasable to run xubuntu in text mode inside a headless VM, and use cygwin to have an X server on widows with xfce4-panel running via ssh with X forwarding?
[02:46] <LK> wait, what?
[02:47] <_Techie_> okay
[02:47] <_Techie_> ill reword it in sections
[02:47] <_Techie_> have xubuntu or any other ubuntu derivative running in a headless VM
[02:47] <_Techie_> using the text parameter on boot to make sure no GUI loads
[02:47] <_Techie_> ...
[02:48] <_Techie_> and use a X server with cygwin to ssh into that headless VM and start xfce4-panel ?
[02:48] <LK> I don't see why it wouldn't be, but I don't know how you'd do it
[02:50] <_Techie_> i know how to do it, i was wondering whether it sounded like a feasible idea, or if i was going guano crazy
[02:51] <LK> not mutually exclusive, mind you
[04:01] <davis_> hello.  I've installed the latest stable build of Xubunut on my desktop.  I have an MAudio 2496 PCI audio card installed.  Xubuntu can see the card -- it lists it as a device in the mixer panel -- but I am not able to get any sound out of it.  I've searched for some how to's on trouble shooting this, but don't see anything that seems to relate.  Can someone suggest a trouble shooting method, or point me to some doc'
[04:01] <davis_> s that might help?  Thanks
[04:03] <well_laid_lawn> !sound
[04:17] <davis_> thanks, I'll check those references
[05:37] <topgun21> ow does one install openoffice?
[05:38] <UBuxuBU> gi into synaptic pkg mgr
[05:38] <UBuxuBU> go*
[05:38] <UBuxuBU> or just the software installer
[05:38] <topgun21> at the cli please
[05:40] <pleia2> sudo apt-get install openoffice.org
[07:09] <UBuxuBU> good evening Lords of the Code.
[08:20] <MrNaz> with 10.10 i don't seem to be able to move panel widgets like before... i right click the widget, click "Move" but i cant place them where i used to
[08:20] <MrNaz> e.g., i cant move the "Applications" button to the bottom panel, or the task list etc
[08:21] <MrNaz> basically, i only have a bottom panel, kinda like the windows taskbar
[08:21] <MrNaz> also, i want to set up a few more launchers and place them next to where the firefox launcher is... but they dont seem to be movable to that side
[08:28] <TheSheep> looks like a bug
[10:44] <Obituary36> hi
[10:49] <leoquant> morning
[11:14] <Obituary36> where are you all from
[11:14] <vinnl> The Netherlands here
[11:15] <Obituary36> ok, me spain, canary islands
[11:15] <MorphixNW> morning everyone
[11:16] <vinnl> Good afternoon :)
[11:16] <Obituary36> whats the weather like in holland?xd
[11:16] <vinnl> Snowy :)
[11:16] <MorphixNW> kinda off topic guys ;)
[11:16] <vinnl> Sorry :)
[11:16] <vinnl> /join #xubuntu-offtopic
[11:16] <MorphixNW> should join #xubuntu-offtopic :)
[11:17] <Obituary36> here today is sunny
[11:17] <MorphixNW> anyone ever tried clustering ubuntu machines?
[11:17] <Obituary36> me
[11:17] <MorphixNW> I would like to harness the power of network connected machines to use as one powerpc :)
[11:17] <Obituary36> in virtual box?
[11:17] <MorphixNW> no
[11:17] <MorphixNW> physical machines
[11:17] <Obituary36> no
[11:18] <Obituary36> i am using xubuntu right now becouse if i try ubuntu my laptops get hot and switch off, dont know why
[11:18] <MorphixNW> strange
[11:18] <MorphixNW> could be an ACPI issue on that machine
[11:18] <MorphixNW> I am on xubuntu 10.10 on this machine, my media-centre is 10.04
[11:19] <Sysi> take desktop effects off
[11:19] <MorphixNW> but I have a stack of other older machines which alone arent fast enough for much, but a cluster would harness the smaller power and combined it as one :)
[11:19] <Obituary36> the thing is, sometimes the machine goes off when i am installing too
[11:20] <MorphixNW> sounds like a hardware issue tbh
[11:22] <Obituary36> my laptop is an aspire one 5315,icp 530, 1,73 gh
[11:22] <Obituary36> cannot install all linux systems
[11:22] <Obituary36> linux mint 7 works perfect, but if i install an update it gets hot again, even with puppy linux, its strange
[11:24] <MorphixNW> can anyone point me to a guide for setting up a cluster (farm)
[11:24] <Sysi> it won't be simple and propably won't work like that well
[11:24] <MorphixNW> googling doesnt seem to be working, probably bad terms
[11:24] <MorphixNW> hmmmmm
[11:25] <MorphixNW> any other suggestions for use for these old machines?
[11:25] <MorphixNW> file server, printer server, firewalls, etc are the obvious ones
[11:25] <MorphixNW> anything more funky geeky :)
[11:26] <Sysi> you propably end up throving them away
[11:26] <MorphixNW> never! lol
[11:26] <MorphixNW> they been in my storage (Attic) workshop for years already
[11:26] <MorphixNW> these relics are awesome if only for show
[11:27] <MorphixNW> clustering them seems like the best use, but also could be the hardest
[11:28] <MorphixNW> surely I cant be the only one who doesnt throw away anything that is working :)
[11:28] <MorphixNW> but uses seem to be harder to find
[11:34] <MorphixNW> bandwidth monitoring?
[11:35] <well_laid_lawn> file server/media server/torrenting/pvr etc
[11:35] <well_laid_lawn> lots of little things you can do with an old comp
[11:36] <MorphixNW> I would like a machine to monitor network traffic, bandwidths, etc, could be text based terminal :)
[11:36] <MorphixNW> I have a media-centre and download mule :)
[11:41] <MorphixNW> I am defo going to dedicate one of these machine to distribution work
[11:41] <MorphixNW> let them use it for better use
[11:44] <MorphixNW> I would just like to use these machines, I have lots and spare monitors, and I have bucket loads of time :)
[11:46] <well_laid_lawn> have a look into distibuted computing then
[11:47] <well_laid_lawn> and blender the graphics app
[11:47] <MorphixNW>  :)
[11:47] <MorphixNW> !requirements
[11:49] <MorphixNW> that link doesnt show me the minimium requirements
[11:49] <MorphixNW> doesnt show requirements at all in fact
[11:51] <well_laid_lawn> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/SystemRequirements does
[11:51] <Sysi> 512MB/P3 to run smoothly, 256MB/X to try
[11:52] <MorphixNW> hmmmm
[11:53] <MorphixNW> can I still get hold of eeeXubuntu?
[11:55] <Sysi> if you have real low-end, debian with openbox or no graphics at all
[11:56] <MorphixNW> !openbox
[11:57] <MorphixNW> I have a machine with an AMD K6 500 chip, maybe could give it 256mb or maybe even 512mb at most
[11:59] <well_laid_lawn> I ran ubuntu dapper server with fluxbox on one of those
[12:01] <MorphixNW> how was it?
[12:01] <well_laid_lawn> slow but worked ok enough
[12:02] <well_laid_lawn> dapper was a much lighter os then the newer ones are tho
[12:02] <MorphixNW> hmm
[12:12] <MorphixNW> seems that programmers no longer work hard with the resources they have, older stuff was designed to make far better use of what was available..... this is because we didnt have buckets of resources like we have today
[12:18] <well_laid_lawn> yep if they have more resources it seems they want to use 'em all
[12:54] <dvanstone> just installed xubuntu in 2 old gx110's
[13:01] <dvanstone> all I can say is "now they work" but what a pain (if you aren't used to the wait)
[13:07] <MorphixNW> dvanstone: specs?
[13:08] <ShootEmUp> hi
[13:08] <MorphixNW> ShootEmUp: hey
[13:10] <ShootEmUp> Has anyone else noticed that XFCE panel applets are easier to find than GNOME applets?
[13:11] <MorphixNW> I am not so good with gnome, as I only recently fully converted so I am used to usng fce4
[13:11] <MorphixNW> which I find very good and easy to use/customise
[13:12] <ShootEmUp> Well I have Older and newer computers, and if you can run GNOME comfortably, than use GNOME. If not use XFCE
[13:13] <Sysi> i've always liked xfce more in about everything
[13:13] <Sysi> some "gnome-apps" maybe nice bust still
[13:14] <Sysi> 3.2GHz*2 + 4GB, not about specs really
[13:14] <dvanstone> MorphixNW 13g hard drive 256mb ram no propietary video
[13:14] <ShootEmUp> I really like XFCE panel customizing over GNOME's
[13:14] <dvanstone> slow in simple terms
[13:14] <Sysi> 256 isn't too much ram
[13:14] <ShootEmUp> 2.6GHz, 1GB RAM
[13:15] <ShootEmUp> Single Core
[13:15] <MorphixNW> dvanstone: and the CPU?
[13:15] <dvanstone> the processor is 766 pentium 3
[13:15] <MorphixNW> :)
[13:15] <MorphixNW> how does it run?
[13:15] <dvanstone> faster than Windows 2000 was
[13:16] <ShootEmUp> I've but Xubuntu on 600MHz and 256MB RAM. everything ran good except Firefox
[13:16] <MorphixNW> on this particular machine I am running 1Ghz CPU (Embedded), 1GB RAM and 80gb PATA HDD
[13:16] <dvanstone> but super slow on install
[13:16] <MorphixNW> awesome stuff so it will run ok(ish) below min spec's
[13:16] <dvanstone> had to mount usb drives to assist
[13:16] <ShootEmUp> You use Live CD?
[13:16] <MorphixNW> make my ADM K6 500 seem more usable
[13:17] <ShootEmUp> or alternate install CD?
[13:17] <MorphixNW> I have an alternate install cd of 10.10
[13:17] <ShootEmUp> cool, Live CD lags like hell on older hardware
[13:17] <dvanstone> had to use the Live Desktop when I tried (several times from disc not enough ram to complete)
[13:18] <ShootEmUp> not its fault, the computers are to slow
[13:18] <dvanstone> yes real slow
[13:18] <MorphixNW> I have a couple of AMD Athlon and Intel 700/900/1000  Boards with CPUs
[13:18] <MorphixNW> would be awesome to be able to combined them ;)
[13:18] <dvanstone> but at least now they work
[13:19] <MorphixNW> dvanstone: very true :)
[13:19] <ShootEmUp> Hey do you think I can run Xubuntu on 366MHz 160MB RAM?
[13:19] <MorphixNW> headless yes :)
[13:20] <ShootEmUp> headless?
[13:20] <MorphixNW> I have seen a version of ubuntu (maybe eeeubuntu) that is designed purely for surfing the web, was wondering if anyone knows how well it runs?
[13:20] <MorphixNW> text based
[13:20] <MorphixNW> no GUI
[13:20] <ShootEmUp> ohh ok
[13:20] <ShootEmUp> right now I have ubuntu command line install plus X and LXDE
[13:20] <dvanstone> all streaming gfx are choppy- is there any way to fix?
[13:21] <MorphixNW> I have so many machines I want running, I also have a Dell Axim X51 that I am going to install ubuntu on :)
[13:21] <dvanstone> no the ram on those boxes was pc133 256
[13:21] <dvanstone> what is the spec
[13:22] <MorphixNW> dvanstone: who are you refering too?
[13:22] <dvanstone> your Axim X51
[13:22] <MorphixNW> ohhh I am not sure
[13:22] <ShootEmUp> damn, didn't know the quit command would quit EVERY channel
[13:22] <MorphixNW> lol
[13:23] <ablomen> ShootEmUp, /part ;)
[13:23] <MorphixNW> dvanstone: lemme see if I can find out
[13:23] <MorphixNW> WM runs crap and isnt very useful IMO
[13:24] <MorphixNW> dvanstone: Intel PXA270 416mhz 64mb RAM, SD/CF slot :)
[13:25] <ShootEmUp> hi blupp
[13:25] <MorphixNW> hi | !blupp
[13:25] <dvanstone> use a stick and cd prividing it has usb slots
[13:25] <MorphixNW> it doesnt
[13:25] <blupp> hi
[13:25] <MorphixNW> I plan to install the required parts onto the SD card and install from there
[13:25] <dvanstone> can you put an i/o to the board
[13:26] <MorphixNW> i/o? usb cable to connect it to my pc you mean?
[13:27] <MorphixNW> I have the cable for that yes
[13:28] <dvanstone> well if you have usb pci support it can be used as ram
[13:28] <dvanstone> or a network install
[13:29] <dvanstone> that is a big SD card IMO
[13:29] <MorphixNW> hmmmm
[13:29] <ShootEmUp> You need atleaset a 700MB card
[13:29] <MorphixNW> thats easy
[13:29] <MorphixNW> I got as 1gb
[13:30] <MorphixNW> check this out
[13:30] <MorphixNW> Android
[13:30] <ShootEmUp> The smallest SD cards I'[ve seen are 256MB
[13:30] <MorphixNW> http://forum.htcgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=1660
[13:30] <dvanstone> mico sd
[13:31] <dvanstone> Sd cards I have one thats 4mb and 32mb that came w/ cameras
[13:31] <MorphixNW> wow
[13:31] <MorphixNW> not seen one that small EVER lol
[13:31] <ShootEmUp> My micro SD is 2GB
[13:31] <dvanstone> buy a canon
[13:31] <MorphixNW> I have an 16gb SDHC
[13:31] <blupp> hope someone can help me :/ the last software-center update went into an error... i killed this process and changed to the terminal. apt-get update runs till "update-initramfs: Generating /boot/initrd.img-2.6.35-23-generic" and there the system hangs.... since approximately 30min
[13:31] <MorphixNW> bbs guys, lunch time
[13:32] <dvanstone> I think you are talking Micro SD
[13:32] <ShootEmUp> bye
[13:32] <dvanstone> ttfn
[13:32] <MorphixNW> :)
[13:32] <MorphixNW> bbs
[13:33] <dvanstone> shootem what was the spec you were going to try an install on?
[13:33] <ShootEmUp> 366MHz 160MB RAM
[13:33] <ShootEmUp> 4.3GB hard disk
[13:33] <dvanstone> what periferals
[13:34] <ShootEmUp> CD drive, 1 USB, PCMICA wifi card
[13:34] <MorphixNW> laptop?
[13:34] <dvanstone> oh a lappy
[13:34] <ShootEmUp> old laptop
[13:35] <ShootEmUp> toshiba satellite 2065CDS
[13:35] <ShootEmUp> Maxed out ram
[13:35] <MorphixNW> will it boot the live cd?
[13:35] <MorphixNW> run that too test and see what works out the box
[13:35] <dvanstone> use a usb drive to call ram or swap and it can happen
[13:35] <ShootEmUp> never in your lifetime
[13:36] <MorphixNW> see if you can get hold of eeexubuntu
[13:36] <MorphixNW> designed for lower specs
[13:36] <ShootEmUp> Swap I will use
[13:36] <dvanstone> does it load usb in bios
[13:36] <ShootEmUp> Live CD will never boot, I don't ever have to try it
[13:36] <MorphixNW> ok
[13:36] <ShootEmUp> No USB
[13:36] <dvanstone> what or is it running
[13:37] <ShootEmUp> It is currently running Ubuntu Commadn line install + X + LXDE
[13:37] <dvanstone> well you already have it
[13:38] <ShootEmUp> Was running Win98, pice of shit
[13:38] <MorphixNW> best Bindows OS ever made IMO :) but yeah shite lol
[13:39] <dvanstone> oh now some of the factories I support still use it
[13:39] <MorphixNW> there are many WinNT servers still out there
[13:39] <charlie-tca> !language | ShootEmUp
[13:39] <ShootEmUp> If microsoft would opensource win98, I'd jump on that quickly
[13:40] <dvanstone> only internal network allowed / oooh you got in trubble
[13:40] <MorphixNW> they should/could as its no longer officially supported
[13:40] <ShootEmUp> sorry for my language
[13:40] <MorphixNW> :)
[13:40] <dvanstone> I thought you left
[13:40] <MorphixNW> I am going :) bye bye for now
[13:41] <ShootEmUp> bye
[13:41] <dvanstone> ttfn
[13:42] <ShootEmUp> I like 98 is fast, lightweight, could be stable if they let us work on it
[13:42] <dvanstone> well if it works fine but with everyone wanting the BBD it cant
[13:43] <Sysi> unix-like FTW
[13:43] <dvanstone> Bigger Better Deal
[13:43] <ShootEmUp> true
[13:43] <ShootEmUp> also true
[13:44] <ShootEmUp> I guess I'll have to go back to trying to make GNOME look like 98
[13:44] <dvanstone> everyone wants to play myspace or facebook apps or POGO while they call it work
[13:44] <ShootEmUp> lol
[13:45] <ShootEmUp> I hate those games
[13:45] <dvanstone> brb
[13:45] <ShootEmUp> syt
[13:45] <ShootEmUp> syt = see you then
[13:48] <dvanstone> back
[13:49] <dvanstone> twas justa break -early here coffees on
[13:50] <ShootEmUp> you have coffee? I want some
[13:51]  * dvanstone pours a cup o' coffee for ShootEmUp
[13:51] <ShootEmUp> thanks man
[13:51] <ShootEmUp> can you hand me the sugar?
[13:52] <charlie-tca> !cookie | ShootEmUp
[13:52] <dvanstone> so is there a way to watch youtube without the choppyness on that low of ram
[13:52] <ShootEmUp> I GOT A COOKIE!
[13:52] <charlie-tca> dvanstone: I don't think so.
[13:52]  * dvanstone hands the sugar bowl
[13:52] <ShootEmUp> thanks
[13:52] <charlie-tca> !sugar
[13:53] <charlie-tca> dvanstone: I don't know if there is a way to download the full video, then feed it yourself, but that might do it.
[13:53] <ShootEmUp> yeah you could probably be better off just downloading the vid\
[13:54] <dvanstone> can totem or one of the common stream handlers do better than ff or chromium
[13:54] <ShootEmUp> idk, but I can't hurt to try
[13:55] <dvanstone> well the systems won't be on my network
[13:55] <ShootEmUp> I would try for you, but I'm in vista right now
[13:56]  * dvanstone goes to utube to look
[13:56] <ShootEmUp> I'll be back, I'm booting up in ubuntu
[13:56] <charlie-tca> you would have to try the different apps to find out. It is possible that gstreamer w/totem or parole might work
[13:56] <well_laid_lawn> try youtube-dl.py to download the vid instead of watching it over the net
[13:57] <dvanstone> I think parole is the default
[13:59] <dvanstone> well_laid_lawn is that in default repos
[14:00] <ShootEmUp> back
[14:00] <dvanstone> quick
[14:00] <ShootEmUp> ubuntu loads fast
[14:01] <dvanstone> depending on the machine
[14:01] <well_laid_lawn> !find youtube-dl
[14:01] <well_laid_lawn> dvanstone: yep it is in the repos
[14:01] <charlie-tca> !info youtube-dl
[14:01] <dvanstone> oh I didnt know that bottu command
[14:02] <ShootEmUp> oooooh, cool
[14:02] <dvanstone> learn something everyday... well I hit my days limit so now I am on coast mode
[14:03] <MorphixNW> hmmm I like that :)
[14:03] <charlie-tca> !ubottu
[14:04] <ShootEmUp> Totem plays youtube video pretty well
[14:05] <dvanstone> be back
[14:08] <ShootEmUp> youtube is not working right now :-(
[14:08] <xTitan> working fine for me
[14:09] <xTitan> isp problem?
[14:09] <MorphixNW> ubuntu system starts to get slow and bogged down, how can this be fixed?
[14:10] <charlie> hello
[14:10] <ShootEmUp> hi
[14:10] <MorphixNW> hey
[14:11] <theotherstone> had to change the nick so I remember what this comp is
[14:11] <well_laid_lawn> MorphixNW: in a terminal you can use   top   to see what is using resources
[14:11] <MorphixNW> could it not be just clutter?
[14:12] <xTitan> i've never used ubuntu before
[14:12] <xTitan> planning to try it out
[14:12] <theotherstone> well of course but top will let you see what the clutter is
[14:12] <MorphixNW> xTitan: its awesome once you get used to the feel of it
[14:13] <MorphixNW> theotherstone: thanks ill try that
[14:13] <xTitan> does it support multi monitors?
[14:13] <well_laid_lawn> if you don't have much memory you could be using the swap file alot and that slows things up
[14:13] <MorphixNW> I got 1gb
[14:13] <theotherstone> if your machine does
[14:13] <MorphixNW> I dont think I have SWAP
[14:13] <xTitan> to be honest i've never really used or seem ubuntu but i am excited to try out a new OS apart from windows..
[14:13] <MorphixNW> maybe if I gave it 2 - 3 GB of my hard drive, would that help a lot?
[14:14] <theotherstone> just search for it on youtube
[14:14] <theotherstone> Morphix yes
[14:14] <well_laid_lawn> swap is slower than memory
[14:15] <ShootEmUp> alot slower
[14:15] <theotherstone> but better than not enough memory
[14:15] <MorphixNW> yes, but combining 1GB of physical ram with 2 or 3GB of HDD?
[14:15] <ShootEmUp> but Its just like a page file on windows, except on its own partition
[14:15] <MorphixNW> how can I do that easily?
[14:15] <theotherstone> makes your drive work more
[14:16] <theotherstone> use gparted or livecd
[14:16] <MorphixNW> I have gparted
[14:16] <xTitan> can someone tell me what's a good irc script to download? i'm using the one all the way backl in like 2003
[14:16] <MorphixNW> making the drive seems easy, making the OS use it tho?
[14:16] <theotherstone> !mp3
[14:17] <charlie-tca> xTitan: script for what?
[14:17] <theotherstone> this comp is soooo slow
[14:17] <xTitan> irc client
[14:17] <theotherstone> xchat
[14:17] <charlie-tca> xchat is excellent
[14:17] <ShootEmUp> whats the specs of your computer theotherstone?
[14:17] <charlie-tca> and is the default in Xubuntu
[14:18] <xTitan> xchat? orite.. ima go check that out on big g now
[14:18] <well_laid_lawn> MorphixNW: you'd use the /etc/fstab file to mount the swap at boot time
[14:18] <well_laid_lawn> !fstab
[14:18] <theotherstone> this is the one I was describing earlier 256ram w/ 766 processor
[14:18] <charlie-tca> xTitan: when you install Xubuntu is is found in Applications -> Networking
[14:18] <theotherstone> GX110
[14:18] <MorphixNW> thanks
[14:18] <ShootEmUp> 766MHz?
[14:19] <theotherstone> yep
[14:19] <charlie-tca> theotherstone: that will be slow. Can you increase the ram to 512?
[14:19] <ShootEmUp> You using Xubuntu?
[14:19] <theotherstone> not mine and as long as it works I did my deed
[14:19] <charlie-tca> true. Best to keep it to a single app at a time though
[14:20] <theotherstone> xubuntu 1010
[14:20] <ShootEmUp> I've run Xubuntu on 256MB RAM, It's not that slow
[14:20] <ShootEmUp> and 600MHz
[14:20] <theotherstone> not in the xfce
[14:20] <ShootEmUp> So I don't see what the problem is
[14:21] <MorphixNW> hmmm I may of just made a mess of my media-centre machine
[14:21] <ShootEmUp> not in XFCE? then what?
[14:21] <MorphixNW> 10.04
[14:21] <theotherstone> but in comp to my others this one is sloooow
[14:21] <ShootEmUp> probably will be
[14:21] <ShootEmUp> Its older
[14:21] <theotherstone> oops yes in xfce
[14:21] <ShootEmUp> okay
[14:21] <theotherstone> the tags say
[14:22] <theotherstone> 1997
[14:22] <ShootEmUp> If it is to slow, I might recommend LXDE or Fluxbox
[14:22] <MorphixNW> oh no, my media-centre is broke :(
[14:22] <theotherstone> dut bunnies like no one business b4 I cleaned it
[14:22] <ShootEmUp> you can install them without removing XFCE
[14:23] <theotherstone> fluxbox works on almost everything
[14:23] <ShootEmUp> I know
[14:23] <ShootEmUp> small little WM
[14:24] <ShootEmUp> you can install fluxbox by : sudo aptitude install fluxbox fluxconf
[14:24] <theotherstone> at least it now has a GUI that works the Windows 2000pro just was not doing its job
[14:24] <ShootEmUp> then chose fluxbox at GDM login
[14:24] <MorphixNW> ok I have fixed the problem "dpkg --configure -a" and then "sudo apt-get install xbmc" I think it will be ok now
[14:25] <ShootEmUp> I prefer LXDE, but fluxbox is faster
[14:25] <theotherstone> reading be back
[14:25] <ShootEmUp> k
[14:26] <xTitan> what's a good OS for me to start out to try linux?
[14:26] <xTitan> ubuntu? is it easy for beginners?
[14:26] <ShootEmUp> yes, the best
[14:26] <xTitan> noob friendly?
[14:26] <ShootEmUp> yup
[14:26] <xTitan> coz im a big one
[14:26] <xTitan> i downloaded it
[14:26] <xTitan> and its just like 20mb?
[14:27] <xTitan> the entire Os is just 20mb?
[14:27] <ShootEmUp> no, you have the wrong download
[14:27] <ShootEmUp> the download is 650MB i think
[14:27] <xTitan> ubuntu-10.10-desktop-amd64 i got this download
[14:27] <ShootEmUp> thats it, but it should be more
[14:28] <theotherstone> xTitan go to ubuntu.com
[14:28] <ShootEmUp> did you get the bit torrent file?
[14:28] <xTitan> ><Økie>< i'm doing a download now
[14:28] <charlie-tca> xTitan: generally Ubuntu is the easiest for new users
[14:29] <xTitan> i've no idea why it was just 20mb previously
[14:29] <xTitan> now its 695mb
[14:29] <MorphixNW> hmmmm, i fixed my media-centre, however, I have messed up the DB, so now it has to go and get movie information for 300 films lol
[14:29] <ShootEmUp> ok
[14:29] <MorphixNW> but in good news, it has installed a newer version now so :)
[14:29] <ShootEmUp> now your ready to go
[14:30] <xTitan> whats xubuntu anyway? another version of ubuntu?
[14:30] <xTitan> sorry about my noob questions..
[14:30] <charlie-tca> !xubuntu
[14:30] <ShootEmUp> yes
[14:30] <xTitan> which is where i ask.. whats Xfce and GNOME
[14:30] <xTitan> !xfce
[14:31] <xTitan> !GNOME
[14:31] <charlie-tca> They are different methods of working your computer
[14:31] <theotherstone> with the teminal running this machine is grunting
[14:31] <charlie-tca> Xfce is not as simple as gnome for making things work.
[14:31] <ShootEmUp> exactly
[14:32] <xTitan> ok, so i can say that GNOME is like a "desktop" interface
[14:32] <charlie-tca> When the software is free, you get choices
[14:32] <MorphixNW> :)
[14:32] <charlie-tca> Gnome and xfce are both desktop interfaces
[14:32] <ShootEmUp> XFCE is faster than GNOME, so it is used for slower hardware
[14:32] <theotherstone> ;)
[14:32] <xTitan> but the catch is that XFCE is less user friendly? less pretty and cool?
[14:32] <ShootEmUp> !mousepad
[14:33] <ShootEmUp> ?
[14:33] <charlie-tca> just as pretty and cool inj Xubuntu, but yes, less user friendly at times
[14:33] <ShootEmUp> xTitan, what are the specs of your computer?
[14:34] <theotherstone> xTitan xfce is used in and geared toward lower spec machines
[14:34] <xTitan> 4GB, i7-860 processor, 2 24inch monitor, 1 17 inch, 3TB HDD, mmm.. 5770 ATI RADEON.. ummm...
[14:35] <xTitan> it's a gaming system
[14:35] <charlie-tca> um, xfce is not aimed at slower computers/hardware
[14:35] <xTitan> but i am thinking of purchasing a netbook to play around with linux systems
[14:35] <ShootEmUp> Okay, you can run GNOME, don't bother with XFCE
[14:35] <charlie-tca> It is a choice for any hardware
[14:35] <ShootEmUp> okay, but I still recommend GNOME
[14:35] <charlie-tca> why?
[14:36] <charlie-tca> because the hardware is newer?
[14:36] <charlie-tca> wrong reasons
[14:36] <charlie-tca> Ubuntu is excellent for any new user. It gets them started outside of windows easier than anything else.
[14:36] <charlie-tca> from the xfce website: "Xfce is a lightweight desktop environment for various *NIX systems. Designed for productivity, it loads and executes applications fast, while conserving system resources." - Olivier Fourdan, creator of Xfce
[14:36] <xTitan> anyways, as i'm intending to purchase a netbook for a linux OS, should i download a Ubuntu NETBOOK EDITION, or a DESKTOP Edition?  I'm buying Samsung N210.. Specs on the link below..
[14:36] <xTitan> http://cgi.ebay.com.sg/Brand-New-Samsung-N210-Netbook-N450-250GB-Win7-6-Cell-/140492538599?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_216&hash=item20b60202e7
[14:36] <ShootEmUp> It is easier to install than windows
[14:37] <MorphixNW> xfce4 on 10.10 works great, previously I had tried to install 10.04 on the same hardware, but it would fail to get most lots of stuff like network etc, but on 10.10 they just work :)
[14:37] <ShootEmUp> Netbook
[14:37] <charlie-tca> 10.10 does know of more hardware, due to changes in the kernel
[14:37] <theotherstone> easier than ms really?
[14:37] <xTitan> i will be upgrading my netbook to 2GB RAM though
[14:37] <ShootEmUp> you could do desktop if you want, but I think netbook
[14:38] <xTitan> are there any compromise in functionality?
[14:38] <LK> KDE-- at least, KDE 3-- does have one huge advantage for the recent Windows convert
[14:38] <xTitan> or is it just kinda like looks? anyone who tried both? =\
[14:38] <ShootEmUp> back
[14:38] <charlie-tca> xTitan: netbook edition is made for the screens on them, which are not standard screen sizes
[14:38] <ShootEmUp> on Xchat now
[14:38] <theotherstone> xTitan advantage on what?
[14:39] <theotherstone> welcome back
[14:39] <MorphixNW> 10.10 was a walk in the park compared to anything Bindows based, all my hardware was installed out of the box :)
[14:39] <xTitan> ><?¿?>< i don't get ur advantage thing
[14:39] <ShootEmUp> Its better for smaller screens
[14:39] <charlie-tca> xTitan: if your netbook has the wide but short screen, desktop edition means you have to move things around more to see the screen
[14:39] <ShootEmUp> exactly
[14:40] <LK> the majority of Windows users are not used to changing their DE settings, and they aren't used to the "start" menu being anywhere but the bottom left corner
[14:40] <charlie-tca> Netbook edition is customized to fit the short screen
[14:40] <theotherstone> the newer linux kernels are geared to smaller devices i.e. netbooks
[14:40] <LK> KDE gives a more familiar environment out-of-box
[14:40] <ShootEmUp> never tried Kubuntu
[14:41] <LK> I'm referring specifically to KDE 3, though I suppose KDE 4 is trying to be more like Vista/7
[14:41] <theotherstone> LK so true most users cant get that apps are atart I normally have to rewrite it to start
[14:42] <theotherstone> LK I use 4.6 and and seems fine to me
[14:42] <ShootEmUp> I'll have to try KDE
[14:42] <LK> it still has the menu in the bottom left, I believe
[14:43] <LK> just handled differently
[14:43] <theotherstone> reboot required
[14:43] <charlie-tca> LK: we don't actually discuss kde here
[14:43] <MorphixNW> well i agree with the start menu comment
[14:43] <MorphixNW> but thats easy to giggle around and place at the bottom
[14:44] <MorphixNW> I switched panel 1 and 2
[14:44] <charlie-tca> You would have to ask in #kubuntu what kde is doing :-)
[14:44] <MorphixNW> making 2 autohide :)
[14:44] <dvanstone> o my that system is slow
[14:44] <LK> I was only bringing it up for comparison :)
[14:45] <ShootEmUp> thats fine to me
[14:45] <ShootEmUp> might not be to the mods
[14:46] <dvanstone> with xchat a terminal and one browser window it was crawling
[14:46] <ShootEmUp> gotta go now, ttyl everyone!
[14:46] <LK> my point was, yeah, it's pretty easy to put the Xcfe start menu down in bottom left, but the average Windows convert doesn't mess around with DE settings
[14:46] <dvanstone> ttfn
[14:46] <LK> see ya Shoot
[14:48] <dvanstone> LK maybe you should suggest or make a tute - but personally I find whichever desktop fairly easy
[14:49] <dvanstone> it is getting them to terminal that scares most
[14:49] <charlie-tca> It is intentional to not have Xubuntu a windows look-a-like. We do not want the user thinking nothing changed
[14:50] <LK> why not? I mean, ok, "windoze suxxorz", but it's what the average PC user knows how to use
[14:51] <dvanstone> I think the fact that people may need to read more about the comp instead of just use it
[14:52] <LK> maybe, but they don't
[14:52] <dvanstone> the trick is to get the familiar with it when they are young
[14:52] <LK> which is Windows' main advantage, I think
[14:52] <charlie-tca> The "why not" is because as a distribution, a decision was made to not look like windows
[14:53] <LK> that's... circular logic
[14:53] <charlie-tca> That's straight decision making. We do NOT want to be a look-a-like. Nothing is circular there
[14:54] <LK> like saying "that's not a cow, because a decision was made that that's not a cow"
[14:54] <charlie-tca> and how is Xubuntu like windows?
[14:54] <dvanstone> why make it look like something else they are all diff PC OS's
[14:54] <charlie-tca> Why make it look the same as something it is not?
[14:55] <dvanstone> got to chase the cat brb
[14:55] <LK> same reason all American steering wheels are on the left side, and why cars don't have 5 foot pedals
[14:56] <well_laid_lawn> if there was no choice in linux os's I wouldn't use them
[14:57] <well_laid_lawn> I use them because there is choice
[14:57] <well_laid_lawn> and steering wheels are on the right here
[14:58] <LK> well, yes, but they're consistantly on the right, regardless of make or model, aren't they?
[14:58] <MorphixNW> sociaty no longer encourages people to think for themselves
[14:59] <MorphixNW> we teach people the answers from a text book and thats the answer
[14:59] <MorphixNW> we dont encourage young people to come up with their own answer
[14:59] <MorphixNW> we teach them the answer that we believe is true
[14:59] <MorphixNW> people was once executed for believing that the world is not flat
[14:59] <MorphixNW> or that they could fly :)
[14:59]  * mark76 enters MorphixNW's name into database of possible subversive elements
[15:00]  * xTitan is ><AwaY>< ><Reason: >< SincE 11:00:02 pm>< AwayPager is on >< AwayLog is on >
[15:00] <LK> I'm just saying, familiarity is an important design element
[15:00] <MorphixNW> yes but if people are persecuted for thinking outside of the box, people will refrain from doing so
[15:00] <charlie-tca> You are welcome to customize any installation
[15:01] <charlie-tca> That's the great thing about it! You do not have to keep the defaults
[15:01] <MorphixNW> very much so :)
[15:01] <MorphixNW> each installation could be in itself different the dude's next door
[15:01] <LK> I, personally, don't keep the defaults
[15:02] <MorphixNW> nor me :)
[15:02] <LK> I like to tweak
[15:02] <MorphixNW> never did with Bindows either
[15:02] <MorphixNW> I was one for modifying the reg to tweak thinks :)
[15:02] <LK> does your family still use Windows? your friends?
[15:02] <MorphixNW> ubuntu makes it easy, like shrinking the taskbar items, easy on ubuntu, not so easy on Bindows
[15:03] <MorphixNW> my folks do
[15:03] <LK> do they tweak, or leave the defaults?
[15:03] <MorphixNW> cause they like games
[15:03] <MorphixNW> default
[15:03] <LK> like most Windows users, in my experience
[15:04] <MorphixNW> my mother likes her "BigFish" games and Father loves EA Command and Conquer
[15:04] <MorphixNW> not likely to convince them to switch
[15:05] <MorphixNW> i have managed to run "Call of Duty" on SuSe previously, using cedega, but it wasnt quite the same
[15:05] <MorphixNW> it needs to be said,  that until developers start making mainstream stuff for Linux I doubt it will ever prevail
[15:06] <well_laid_lawn> !games
[15:07] <well_laid_lawn> plenty of big name titles in the list
[15:07] <LK> Linux, though a technically superior system, does have a lot of flaws
[15:07] <MorphixNW> not as many as Bindows
[15:07] <well_laid_lawn> it doesn't have to run virus scanners all the time
[15:08] <LK> I'm not talking about technical problems
[15:08] <MorphixNW> cost is silly
[15:09] <MorphixNW> OS, plus office, plus dreamweaver, that is more then the machine itself
[15:09] <LK> I'm talking about all the things that stop more users from giving up virus scanners and defraggers
[15:09] <MorphixNW> holes
[15:09] <MorphixNW> Microsuck seem to like to release it and let the end user find the holes/bugs
[15:10] <well_laid_lawn> we aren't into bashing microsoft in here
[15:10] <charlie-tca> You are right. this should probably go offtopic
[15:12] <LK> I don't think the fact that Windows Sells is all that inexplicable, personally
[15:13] <MorphixNW> agreed
[15:14] <MorphixNW> xubuntu media-centre? anyone got one or rate or recommend?
[15:15] <charlie-tca> Microsoft has a terrific Marketing Department. That doesn't make it good software, necessarily
[15:16] <LK> it's not just marketing
[15:16] <MorphixNW> monopoly
[15:17] <LK> ever consider why Microsoft refuses to work with OEMs that give OS-less machines?
[15:17] <LK> as one example
[15:18] <MorphixNW> think this convo need to go #xubuntu-offtopic where it can go all night :)
[15:18] <charlie-tca> thank you, MorphixNW
[15:21] <MorphixNW> charlie-tca: no probs, could just see it taking over lol
[15:49]  * dvanstone wonders how much ram that board will support
[15:53] <charlie-tca> Older motherboards stopped at 384MB for the consumer, but some of the business machines would handle 512MB
[15:56] <dvanstone> charlie-tca I will try 512 then
[15:56] <MorphixNW> dvanstone: what board?
[15:57] <dvanstone> let me look it is in the dell gx110
[15:59] <charlie-tca> At the worst, it will only count the first 384MB, if it refuses to use more than that
[15:59] <MorphixNW> agreed
[16:00] <MorphixNW> it should just ignore anymore then the max
[16:00] <charlie-tca> All the systems designed for win98 stop at 384MB, as far as I know
[16:01]  * charlie-tca knows that was the limit that 98 could use
[16:01] <MorphixNW> wow thats deep knowledge ;)
[16:02] <dvanstone> this was 2000pro
[16:02] <charlie-tca> That should be capable of up to 2GB, but it depends on the hardware
[16:02] <MorphixNW> hmmmm 2GB on an optiplex gx110?
[16:02] <MorphixNW> nah
[16:02] <MorphixNW> more like 1gb
[16:02] <MorphixNW> I would think
[16:03] <dvanstone> Ill try a gig 2x512 and see what it gets
[16:03] <charlie-tca> no, win2000pro
[16:03] <MorphixNW> just dump it in the slots and see what it detects
[16:03] <dvanstone> tru
[16:03] <MorphixNW> Charlie-TCA: 2K pro yes
[16:03] <dvanstone> be back
[16:03] <charlie-tca> hardware varies.
[16:04] <LK> checking out the Wikipedia page for X... DEs like Xcfe are X clients?
[16:04] <MorphixNW> DE = Desktop Enviroment doesnt it?
[16:04] <LK> yeah
[16:04] <charlie-tca> they all use the Xserver to display the GUI
[16:05] <MorphixNW> i can make my machine boot something strange if I drop to terminal and "startx"
[16:05] <charlie-tca> gnome/kde/lxde/xfce/etc are all X clients
[16:05] <MorphixNW> looks all wierd lol
[16:05] <LK> so then it's possible to run X without a DE, I'd imagine
[16:05] <charlie-tca> MorphixNW: it boots an xfce session, bypassing all the xubuntu addins
[16:05] <MorphixNW> it is i believe
[16:05] <MorphixNW> charlie-tca: thanks wondered what it was doing :)
[16:06] <LK> is it possible to get any GUI functions without a client?
[16:06] <MorphixNW> you can run X without XFCE4 or gnome I believe
[16:06] <charlie-tca> I don't think it is possible with out the X server
[16:06] <MorphixNW> can also make an app boot instead of a true DE
[16:07] <LK> I mean if all you have is the X server, and no GNOME/KDE/Xcfe/etc
[16:07] <charlie-tca> yes, apps can run with out the DE, just kill xfwm4 and xfdesktop4 to see it in a tty
[16:08] <charlie-tca> But, remember, only gtk apps will run then; vim, nano, nothing that uses a gui
[16:08] <charlie-tca> You could boot to recovery mode, and try it too
[16:10] <charlie-tca> Take a look at wayland, it is an Xserver replacement
[16:10] <charlie-tca> it is not ready for use yet, but is coming along quickly and will probably see use in 11.10 or later
[16:13] <MorphixNW> hope the next version better supports touchscreens
[16:16] <MorphixNW> and maybe someone will make skype-mate work too, as it worked in earlier version
[16:30] <LK> I wonder, how hard would it be to install MicroXwin on Xubuntu?
[16:30] <dvanstone> 384 thats max put in a 512 it read as 80 and a 1g and it just beeped so 384 it is
[16:32] <dvanstone> LK do you use xubuntu?
[16:36] <LK> on a VM, yes
[16:38] <charlie> hello
[16:40] <theothestone> memory is running really high 76%
[16:40] <theothestone> any suggestions
[16:40] <MorphixNW> pulseaudio?
[16:42] <theothestone> shows 0% cpu
[16:43] <MorphixNW> hmm not sure then
[16:43] <MorphixNW> try "top" in the terminal
[16:43] <MorphixNW> should show you what is using it up
[16:43] <theothestone> well I am looking at the task manager but I will do that
[16:44] <MorphixNW> task man might not sure ALL processes
[16:45] <MorphixNW> I am going to build a machine into an old original xbox case, using a Mini-ATX board :) my project for this evening
[16:46] <theothestone> it is not reporting the correct memory
[16:46] <MorphixNW> hopefully the xbox PSU will be enough to run it, seeing as it once ran the board, dvdrom and hdd
[16:46] <MorphixNW> theothestone: strange
[16:46] <MorphixNW> does the bios see it all?
[16:47] <theothestone> shows 120620k total 117828k used but 384 mb in bios
[16:48] <MorphixNW> 120mb?
[16:48] <MorphixNW> very wierd
[16:48] <MorphixNW> in "task man" do you have a "system" tab?
[16:48] <theothestone> no system
[16:49] <MorphixNW> I really dont know whats going on with your ram
[16:49] <MorphixNW> maybe someone with more understanding can help
[16:50] <theothestone> task manager 1.0.0 from goodies.xfce.org
[16:50] <theothestone> so there is no system menu on xfce
[16:51] <theothestone> like regular buntu
[16:51] <theothestone> well i need to restart this to debug
[16:52] <charlie-tca> theothestone: go into preferences and turn on "all processes"
[18:01] <LK> if I installed Xubuntu on, say, sda2, but then deleted sda1 later on, would Xubuntu still boot?
[18:10] <dvanstone> is there a common command to stop/start/killall the systray to load it in another panel
[18:11] <dvanstone> LK in a VM or ?
[18:11] <LK> actual machine
[18:12] <dvanstone> well you were stating you ran it in a VM
[18:12] <LK> yeah, but I'm planning on installing it on an actual machine
[18:13] <LK> specifically, another partition of this machine
[18:13] <dvanstone> is LVM or not
[18:14] <LK> huh?
[18:17] <dvanstone> you could install a partition and format the partition yes but deleting would get a corrupt disk unless LVM or parting tools used
[18:17] <dvanstone> !systray
[18:17] <charlie-tca> LK: no
[18:17] <charlie-tca> not without modify the grub
[18:18] <dvanstone> well actually the partition table
[18:18] <charlie-tca> no, not the partition table, the grub menu will require changing to tell it you moved sda1
[18:19] <dvanstone> the grub is after the mbr
[18:19] <charlie-tca> true, but removing sda1 modified the partition table. You still have to tell grub you did it
[18:21] <dvanstone> grub mbr whichever that is what I was stating the disc management tool would do that not a simple file delete
[18:21] <LK> how hard would that be?
[18:22] <dvanstone> do an install manage the disc
[18:22] <LK> a what?
[18:24] <dvanstone> charlie-tca do you know how to kill or restart the systray
[18:24] <charlie-tca> not sure
[18:24] <dvanstone> LK you can simulate that in a vm
[18:24] <charlie-tca> it is called notification area
[18:25] <dvanstone> yes
[18:25] <charlie-tca> but I don't know how to kill it
[18:25] <charlie-tca> and, my main system is down until I reinstall natty on it
[18:26] <dvanstone> I moved the panel and now it says its running but no view
[18:26] <dvanstone> oh well
[18:34] <dvanstone> oh it seems I have a much bigger issue ... does not shutdown
[18:35] <dvanstone> restarts fine though
[18:36] <dvanstone> the machine that is
[18:38] <jeward> Hi, I've installed xubuntu 10.10 but it's not offering the proprietary drivers that generic ubuntu 10.10 did?
[18:38] <jeward> Anything I need to do to tickle it into doing that?
[18:40] <dvanstone> lol these old machines
[18:41] <jeward> Oh, it's offering on reboot.
[18:41] <jeward> dvanstone: Mine is an Alienware M11x if you're refering to my issue. :)
[18:42] <charlie-tca> jeward: sometimes it does need a restart to make things work
[18:42] <jeward> Looking good now!
[18:43] <Sysi> jeward: what generation of m11x?
[18:43] <jeward> I purposely got an r1.
[18:43] <jeward> SSD and 4G RAM.
[18:45] <Sysi> that's what i thought, g2 won't work on linux
[18:45] <Sysi> it's such a delicious machine, but i still may get mac air instead
[18:46] <Sysi> AV is hard to order to finland
[18:46] <jeward> It's a fine piece of hardware so far. :-)
[18:47] <Sysi> works well with linux?
[18:47] <charlie-tca> Whew! got natty to boot again
[18:48] <knome> charlie-tca, ...to be able to give it boot again ;)
[18:48] <charlie-tca> Thought I would have to do a complete reinstall
[18:49] <charlie-tca> which is bad, when the burner is in the broke systems
[18:49] <Sysi> jeward: c2d?
[18:49] <knome> yeah i know, i've cleanly installed xubuntu only two times to my desktop pc ;)
[18:49] <knome> first with 6.06, second with 10.04...
[18:50] <charlie-tca> wish I could say that... but with testing, you know how it goes
[18:50] <knome> sure
[18:50] <charlie-tca> They break VBox with the new kernels, and we have to test on hardware. It makes for a mess sometimes
[18:50] <knome> sure
[18:51] <MorphixNW> new kernels break full installs too lol
[18:51] <MorphixNW> it made a mess of my system, forcing a reinstall
[18:51] <charlie-tca> knome: went to using Dropbox now, trying to keep a decent backup available
[18:51] <knome> no, it's just a mess you either fix or surrender and reinstall ;)
[18:52] <knome> charlie-tca, i use several mercurial repositories for backups
[18:52] <charlie-tca> yup
[18:52] <charlie-tca> You know how to do that, though
[18:52] <MorphixNW> it knocked out my graphics, network and usb
[18:52] <knome> MorphixNW, been there, done that ;)
[18:52] <MorphixNW> wasnt best impressed after spending so much time making things work
[18:53] <LK> grub saves the partition names in a text file, doesn't it?
[18:53] <MorphixNW> now I have lost confidence
[18:53] <knome> it's not really an enjoyment, but every time you fix something, you come out with more and more experience
[18:53] <charlie-tca> First thing we tell before we say install...  backup please
[18:53] <MorphixNW> shouldnt have too tho, not when its an official update
[18:53] <charlie-tca> !grub2
[18:54] <charlie-tca> That's the best I got on it, LK
[18:54] <knome> charlie-tca, "what? backup?! are you crazy? don't you know it takes several ...minutes!?!"
[18:54] <charlie-tca> I know, I know.
[18:54] <charlie-tca> Sometimes I really wish I did it, too
[18:55] <charlie-tca> We are on the kernel a day thing in natty now.
[18:55] <knome> yeah. i hoped i had better backups when i had to call my client in japan to send me a copy of a backup cd...
[18:55] <charlie-tca> heh, :-)
[18:55] <knome> well, in japan that time, usually in finland :P
[18:56] <knome> or was that hong kong? ;)
[18:56] <knome> well anyway...
[18:56] <charlie-tca> AAh , can't keep track anymore. Not like the old days, when all you had to remember is the town
[18:57] <charlie-tca> If the screen is blank, ... again ;-)
[18:57] <LK> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Grub2#Creating%20the%20Custom%20Menu this is what I was looking for, I think
[18:57] <LK> I can edit that with the live disc, right?
[18:57] <knome> LK, yup, why not
[18:58] <LK> so if I had Xubuntu installed on sda2 and then deleted sda1, I'd just go there and change the menu entry for Xubuntu?
[18:59] <charlie-tca> no
[18:59] <knome> then you'd need to reinstall grub
[19:00] <LK> how would I do that?
[19:01] <charlie-tca> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RecoveringUbuntuAfterInstallingWindows
[19:01] <jeward> Can you guys help me get sound working on the M11x?
[19:01] <charlie-tca> just ignore the parts refering to what to do to get windows into the menu
[19:01] <jeward> It worked out of the box with generic Ubuntu.
[19:01] <LK> ok, thanks
[19:01] <Sysi> jeward: install pavucontrol
[19:02] <LK> technically, it'd be after removing Windows...
[19:02] <jeward> Sysi: Installed.
[19:03] <Sysi> see pulseaudio-something in menu
[19:04] <jeward> Sysi: I don't see anything about pulse in it.
[19:05] <Sysi> hmm
[19:05] <jeward> I think I don't have the device driver loaded for the sound card.
[19:05] <Sysi> if you had in ubuntu, you have in xubuntu
[19:06] <jeward> Hmm, I wonder why it's not loading under xubuntu?
[19:06] <charlie-tca> !sound
[19:06] <jeward> What's an easy way to test? Parole is hanging and the other one says it's missing a plugin.
[19:06] <Hc96> Hi! since today there is a new update for the linux-image. If I want to update my machine via the update-manager in the panel, it tells me, I would have to install unauthorized packages. (xubuntu 10.10). Is this common?
[19:07] <charlie-tca> sounds like you have ppa's or other repositories you added yourself?
[19:07] <Sysi> jeward: xubuntu-restricted-extras contains codecs and flash
[19:07] <jeward> When I click the volume applet, a mixer comes up with bno visible controls.
[19:07] <charlie-tca> click select controls and turn them on
[19:08] <jeward> Okay, that's better.
[19:09] <jeward> I started to say I'd try Netflix... then I remembered... :-)
[19:09] <Hc96> ibgudev-1.0-0 libudev0 linux-generic linux-headers-2.6.35-24 linux-headers-2.6.35-24-generic linux-headers-generic linux-image-2.6.35-24-generic linux-image-generic linux-libc-dev udev are the packages I would update
[19:10] <jeward> All my packages seem to be showing unauthorized.
[19:10] <jeward> I thought it was just because my network connection was iffy during the install.
[19:11] <Hc96> I have this since 2 days or sth. Nothing was wrong before
[19:13] <jeward> Sound is working, thanks! :-)
[19:13] <jeward> Thought the applet looks kinda dead?
[19:14] <jeward> I think Hc96 and I need to install or reinstall the xubunut public key maybe?
[19:16] <charlie-tca> xubuntu and ubuntu use the same repositories and keys
[19:16] <jeward> For some reason, all my packages are showing unauthorized?
[19:17] <jeward> My internet connection during the install was not well.
[19:17] <charlie-tca> in a terminal, run   "sudo apt-get update" without the quotes.
[19:17] <charlie-tca> Are there any error messages?
[19:18] <jeward> No. ;?
[19:18] <charlie-tca> then the keys are fine
[19:18] <Hc96> no errors
[19:18] <jeward> Where's the spot you click to have it determine the fastest mirror?
[19:19] <jeward> I thought it was in Software Sources somewhere?
[19:20] <Hc96> guess there is sth wrong with the releases
[19:23] <jeward> Oh, I found it: Ubuntu Software Center->Software Sources->Other->Select Best Server
[19:25]  * jeward installs wine beta.
[19:29] <jeward> I sure hopw wine works as well on 64bit as it did 32.
[19:29] <jeward> hope
[19:30] <jeward> Is the moonlight project kinda dead?
[19:31] <jeward> If I could stream Netflix on Xubuntu, I could just get rid of Windows altogether.
[19:33] <charlie-tca> as far as I recall, moonlight is going nowhere fast
[19:34] <charlie-tca> What about netflix won't work without windows?
[19:46] <ShootEmUp> hello
[19:47] <MorphixNW> hey
[19:48] <jeward> charlie-tca: Netflix uses Silverlight.
[19:48] <ShootEmUp> hey saw you this morning
[19:48] <charlie-tca> Is it required?
[19:48] <jeward> charlie-tca To stream, yes.
[19:48] <MorphixNW> yes :)
[19:49] <Sysi> M$ is taking down silverlight
[19:50] <jeward> http://how-to.wikia.com/wiki/How_to_watch_Netflix_(Watch_Instantly)_in_Linux
[19:50] <ShootEmUp> Sysi, they are?
[19:51] <jeward> Sysi: I doubt that?
[19:52] <Sysi> http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2010/nov10/11-01Statement.mspx
[19:53] <ShootEmUp> that doesn't say they are taking it down
[19:54] <jeward> "Silverlight provides the richest media streaming capabilities on the web, and we will continue to deliver that on both Windows and Mac. "
[19:54] <Sysi> well, but les focus on that
[19:54] <ShootEmUp> exactly
[19:55] <knome> Sysi, i can't see that exactly meaning even less resources/focus on it.
[19:55] <Sysi> finnish press showed that on very different light
[19:55] <Sysi> i'm kinda disappointed now
[19:55] <knome> ;)
[19:56] <ShootEmUp> I'm not
[19:56] <knome> anyway, #xubuntu-offtopic ...
[19:56] <jeward> I think they're trying to supplant flash with it maybe.
[19:56] <jeward> True. :)
[19:57] <ShootEmUp> flash is here for a little wile longer, but I don't see silverlight taking over
[19:57] <ShootEmUp> hopefully something open source
[19:59] <jeward> Just did the first three of these: http://tombuntu.com/index.php/2008/09/04/four-tweaks-for-using-linux-with-solid-state-drives/
[19:59] <jeward> The last one seems a bit involved. :)
[20:00] <jeward> It seems ubunutu automagically does some if not all of the 4th tweak when installed on SSD.
[20:05] <ShootEmUp> I don't have to worry about any of these
[20:11] <ShootEmUp> no ones talking
[20:11] <Sysi> no problems
[20:12] <ShootEmUp> you saying there are absolutely no more problems to solve?
[20:12] <Sysi> no questions
[20:13] <ShootEmUp> If there are no more problems, then why is Microsoft still living?
[20:13] <charlie-tca> We don't fix microsoft issues
[20:14] <ShootEmUp> I know, but if there are no more problems with Ubuntu, then microsoft should be dead
[20:14] <dvanstone> i have a question(s)
[20:14] <ShootEmUp> yes?
[20:14] <charlie-tca> Why? Ubuntu doesn't have any plan for world domination over microsoft. They are welcome to have users too
[20:15] <knome> charlie-tca, #xubuntu-offtopic ;]
[20:15] <dvanstone> how do I place the systray or kill
[20:15] <ShootEmUp> good question, cause ubuntu is about peace and harmony
[20:15] <charlie-tca> sorry, knome
[20:15] <knome> no problem :)
[20:16] <knome> just probably something for ot, the windows/microsoft discussion
[20:16] <charlie-tca> I can see that.
[20:16] <charlie-tca> thanks for keeping me straight
[20:16] <Sysi> i wish my steam-problems were about wine
[20:17] <Sysi> but they are because of ms, hotmail
[20:17] <knome> dvanstone, what do you mean by "place systray" ?
[20:18] <dvanstone> knome I do not see the systray but I can not put it on the panel because it is running
[20:19] <charlie-tca> The authentication issues are not just xubuntu; they are Ubuntu wide
[20:19] <dvanstone> I would like to see the items normally in the area
[20:19] <knome> charlie-tca, what's the systray command/process name?
[20:19] <dvanstone> what auth issues?
[20:19] <dvanstone> notification-area
[20:19] <knome> dvanstone, auth issues were probablt re: ms/hotmail for Sysi
[20:20] <charlie-tca> I still don't know. It is the notification area , officially, though
[20:20] <knome> i don't have that running
[20:20] <charlie-tca> In Natty, I just right-click the area and click remove. Poof, it's gone
[20:20] <dvanstone> officially that is what it is called
[20:20] <knome> but if it's not showing up, but running?
[20:20] <knome> !Panel
[20:21] <Sysi> log out and back in
[20:21] <charlie-tca> kill things having to do with notification-   I would guess
[20:21] <Sysi> or start app that uses it
[20:21] <knome> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/XubuntuPanels#Quick%20Fix probably would help at least
[20:21] <dvanstone> so just killall xfce-panel
[20:22] <knome> dvanstone, that could pretty well work :)
[20:22] <dvanstone> on gnome-panels when notif area has issue that is the solution
[20:32] <ShootEmUp> well not my area of expertise, so I guess I'll go now. Play some assault cube
[20:32] <ShootEmUp> ttyl
[20:37] <dvanstone> nope doesn't work
[20:37] <charlie-tca> dvanstone: what is it you are trying to do exactly?
[20:38] <dvanstone> show the notification area
[20:38] <charlie-tca> right-click the panel, left-click notification area, click add
[20:39] <dvanstone> says it is already running
[20:39] <dvanstone> I do overlook the obvious though
[20:40] <dvanstone> also on the clock applet why does it show a zero b4 the hour on pm
[20:41] <charlie-tca> Maybe you don't have anything in the notification area to be shown
[20:41] <dvanstone> network?
[20:41] <charlie-tca> try right-clicking the clock and see if there are properties you can change
[20:41] <charlie-tca> I don't use it
[20:42] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu doesn't always show the network icon
[20:42] <dvanstone> hmmm say what?
[20:42] <charlie-tca> My 10.04 never shows network
[20:42] <charlie-tca> You may be able to change the clock properties to show time how you want to see it.
[20:43] <dvanstone> a custom entry
[20:43] <dvanstone> what are other ways to get to the network settings
[20:44] <dvanstone> aside from ifconfig
[20:45] <Sysi> alt+F2 "nm-applet"
[20:45] <dvanstone> so xubuntu is xfce or is that a different desktop
[20:46] <charlie-tca> Xubuntu replaces Gnome with Xfce, yes
[20:46] <charlie-tca> but no, Xubuntu is not Xfce. Xfce is a separate project completely
[20:46] <charlie-tca> just as gnome is not Ubuntu
[20:46] <charlie-tca> and KDE is not Kubuntu
[20:46] <dvanstone> just curious because at login the option exists to select xfce or xubuntu
[20:47] <Sysi> they are different sessions
[20:48] <charlie-tca> Xfce is the group that does the hard part. We take what they do and put it together so you can use it easily
[20:49] <dvanstone> let me go to that comp
[21:03] <dvan_stone> you was saying how to start the network tool
 alt+F2 "nm-applet"
[21:04] <dvan_stone> applet lala
[21:04] <dvan_stone> do I need the quotes
[21:05] <charlie-tca> no
[21:05] <dvan_stone> no dice
[21:06] <dvan_stone> any other way
[21:06] <dvan_stone> well I will try from terminal
[21:08] <dvan_stone> An instance of nm-applet is already running. (nm-applet:1836): WARNING **: <WARN>  constructor(): Couldn't initialize the D-Bus manager.
[21:09] <dvan_stone> any help would be great
[21:11] <dvan_stone> is there a way to reset the session or panels to default
[21:13] <charlie-tca> remove /home/USER/.cache and /home/USER/.config/xfce4/xfce-perchannel-xml
[21:13] <charlie-tca> then reboot without saving session
[21:13] <dvan_stone> that sounds easy
[21:43] <dvanstone> that didnt workee
[21:43] <dvanstone> sounded easy though
[21:45] <charlie-tca> did you try this - https://help.ubuntu.com/community/XubuntuPanels#One%20Panel%20Disappeared ?
[21:45] <charlie-tca> It does erase the configuration completely too.
[21:57] <ShootEmUp> hello
[21:59] <ShootEmUp> no one here?
[22:01] <mark76> Hello
[22:01] <ShootEmUp> whats going on?
[22:04] <mark76> Where?
[22:04] <mark76> Here... Not a lot
[22:04] <ShootEmUp> I can tell
[22:04] <Sysi> IRC != AOL
[22:05] <ShootEmUp> Sysi, have you been on all day?
[22:05] <Sysi> nope
[22:05] <ShootEmUp> Every time I get on, your on
[22:05] <Sysi> i don't have nolife, steam is hardly working
[22:05] <ShootEmUp> :-(
[22:08] <ShootEmUp> don't worry, be happy!
[22:09] <Sysi> buying my first game
[22:09] <charlie-tca> general talk happens in #xubuntu-offtopic. Support happens here, so sometimes it is quiet
[22:09] <ShootEmUp> okay
[22:16] <theothestone> yippie
[22:16] <ShootEmUp> hi
[22:17] <charlie-tca> theothestone: so you fixed it?
[22:17] <theothestone> hey ShootEm finally got it
[22:17] <theothestone> yes
[22:18] <theothestone> both panels were on the bottom so until I did auto hide i didnt see the one w/ nm and deleted and put in the other
[22:19] <theothestone> workin fine
[22:19] <ShootEmUp> great!
[22:19] <theothestone> is there a disk management tool
[22:19] <charlie-tca> Not that I know of in Xubuntu
[22:19] <charlie-tca> I use gparted
[22:20] <theothestone> i will look in the software center
[22:20] <ShootEmUp> gparted
[22:20] <charlie-tca> as I recall, it had too many gnome specific dependencies on the disk tool
[22:20] <ShootEmUp> I don't know if there is another partition editor for ubuntu
[22:21] <ShootEmUp> No take that back, there is one for KDE
[22:21] <ShootEmUp> don't remember what it is called
[22:21] <charlie-tca> Ubuntu has a specific tool for disk management/looking.
[22:21] <theothestone> I normally use f14 so I feel like a newb
[22:22] <charlie-tca> But it wanted to install too much for me to use it
[22:22] <theothestone> charlie what specs do u have
[22:22] <charlie-tca> theothestone: we don't defrag, and seldom change partitions around.
[22:22] <charlie-tca> which computer?
[22:23] <ShootEmUp> All of them
[22:23] <theothestone> oh like me two to many
[22:23] <charlie-tca> I use an amd64 3200 daily, with VBox on it. I have 80 virtual machines to test things
[22:23] <ShootEmUp> damn
[22:23] <theothestone> 80 shoot bang
[22:23] <ShootEmUp> sorry, let that one slip
[22:23] <charlie-tca> It has 3 GB ram, and is about 5 years old
[22:24] <ShootEmUp> very nice
[22:24] <charlie-tca> I also have a P4, 1.5GHz, with 1GB ram
[22:24] <ShootEmUp> more like what I got
[22:24] <charlie-tca> p3, 866MHz, 768MB ram
[22:24] <charlie-tca> P2, 400MHz, 256MB ram
[22:24] <theothestone> yeah my normal rig is dual quads w/ 8g mem and 2g vid mem
[22:25] <charlie-tca> an 80386, 25MHz, tandy
[22:25] <charlie-tca> an 80486, 33MHz
[22:25] <charlie-tca> An older commodore 128 with cassette drive
[22:25] <ShootEmUp> Mine is 2.6MHz AMD 64, 1GB RAM
[22:25] <charlie-tca> not in use
[22:25] <theothestone> ooh charlie that just wastes electric
[22:26] <ShootEmUp> I feel sad
[22:26] <charlie-tca> and I burned up the other p4 and p3 last release
[22:26] <theothestone> I work on alot of em so I get to toy w/ new and old
[22:27] <charlie-tca> I think I have to buy another 64bit system for testing
[22:28] <theothestone> be back food calling
[22:28] <ShootEmUp> I've got a question, can you install 32bit packages on a 64bit Ubuntu?
[22:28] <charlie-tca> yes
[22:28] <theothestone> charlie 64 is the only wise choice
[22:28] <ShootEmUp> how?
[22:28] <theothestone> install
[22:28] <charlie-tca> apt-get install  or   synaptic package manager
[22:28] <theothestone> easy
[22:28] <charlie-tca> it doesn't really care
[22:29] <ShootEmUp> cause I need 32bit ndiswrapper for my wireless
[22:29] <charlie-tca> unless it is flash, then you have to use a wrapper
[22:29] <ShootEmUp> 64bit ndiswrapper doesn't work with my windows drivers
[22:30] <charlie-tca> I do a bit of testing on my systems
[22:31] <charlie-tca> I need to pick up a notebook soon, too
[22:31] <ShootEmUp> well does 32bit ndiswrapper work on 64bit Ubuntu?
[22:31] <charlie-tca> I don't know. I don't use wireless
[22:31] <ShootEmUp> thanks for your help
[22:32] <charlie-tca> You are welcome
[22:32] <charlie-tca> I had 10 systems running a little over a year ago.
[22:32] <ShootEmUp> I wrote about it here http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1645273
[22:32] <charlie-tca> good. Maybe they can help
[22:33] <ShootEmUp> I wrote it
[23:03] <saintly> evening folks
[23:05] <saintly> working on creating my own Xorg.config file, and ive run in terminal $ sudo xorg -configure to which i got these results: Fatal server error:
[23:05] <saintly> Server is already active for display 0
[23:05] <saintly> 	If this server is no longer running, remove /tmp/.X0-lock
[23:05] <saintly> 	and start again.
[23:05] <saintly> Please consult the The X.Org Foundation support
[23:05] <saintly> 	 at http://wiki.x.org
[23:05] <saintly>  for help.
[23:05] <saintly>  ddxSigGiveUp: Closing log
[23:06] <saintly> i have no idea what this error implies, but its stopping me from making a xorg.conf file
[23:06] <Sysi> sudo service gdm stop
[23:07] <Sysi> you can't create that file when xorg is running
[23:08] <saintly> so stop xrog from running first
[23:08] <dvanstone> testing
[23:12] <saintly> got booted...
[23:12] <saintly> alright so i have to have Xorg off in order to create a xorg conf file
[23:14] <saintly> and sudo service gdm stop made my computer shut down lol
[23:14] <Sysi> only graphics
[23:15] <Sysi> in other words xserver
[23:15] <saintly> then why did my computer turn off? lol
[23:15] <Sysi> it shouldn't
[23:15] <charlie-tca> use recovery mode and create it as root then
[23:15] <saintly> ill try again
[23:19] <saintly_> annnd here we go again
[23:20] <saintly_> sysi: it put me onto a black screen said few things disabled, pulseaudio untouched... stuff along those lines, and then stopped, didnt do anything.
[23:20] <saintly_> until i finally touched the power button, which immedialty sent it into shut down
[23:21] <Sysi> ctrl alt F1 brings you to text console
[23:22] <saintly_> so i need to shut down X server, do my instructions int othe text console, then what, turn it off and back on again?
[23:23] <saintly_> or sudo service gdm start
[23:26] <saintly_> well wish me luck, im going to try it..
[23:26] <saintly_> just for posterior, how do i go about deleting a file in terminal?
[23:26] <LK> if I were to take a *Buntu, and had Xfce, GNOME, and KDE all on it at once... what would I call it?
[23:26] <dvanstone> does anyone know what the java is needed to play on pogo
[23:26] <saintly_> Linux mutant Lk LOL
[23:27] <dvanstone> LK ubuntu
[23:27] <saintly_> no idea dvanstone
[23:27] <saintly_> brb
[23:27] <LK> but... it's just as much Kubuntu and Xubuntu!
[23:27] <LK> :p
[23:27] <saintly_> KUXBuntu
[23:27] <saintly_> :D
[23:28] <dvanstone> btu it is the gnome that makes it
[23:28] <LK> ... I like that
[23:28] <Sysi> *buntu
[23:28] <LK> that works, too
[23:29] <Sysi> basically they're all just ubuntu
[23:29] <Sysi> but the gnome one is the actual ubuntu
[23:30] <LK> thought: KUXbuntu for having all three, *Buntu for having no DE at all!
[23:30] <dvanstone> LK I would guess it would be linux supported by debian
[23:31] <Sysi> * means everything
[23:31] <Sysi> *buntu or **buntu for server or any DE/WM
[23:32] <dvanstone> debian is the base for all of them
[23:32] <dvanstone> .deb
[23:32] <dvanstone> unless we can say who owns the dot
[23:32] <charlie-tca> dvanstone: you would call it whichever desktop you were using at the time
[23:33] <dvanstone> tru charlie
[23:39] <dvanstone> so which desktop am I in?
[23:42] <saintly> OMG sysi thank you SO MUCH
[23:42] <saintly> I cant believe it worked!!!
[23:42] <saintly> Compiz fusion, running seemlessly on a computer with 250 MB ram!!
[23:43] <saintly> this is truly stunning