/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/12/23/#ubuntu-motu.txt

ScottKtumbleweed: Please try to avoid too many recommends (see how devscripts handles this)01:35
paissad_hello guys, i maintain a package for about 1 year now, .. but recently there's someone who contributed about some useful changes in the packaging .. i would like to add his name somewhere but i hesitate where to mention his name02:09
paissad_in the debian/changelog ? ... int the README.Debian ? ....02:09
paissad_i think about creating THANKS.Debian :P02:10
paissad_how would you proceed ?02:10
udienzari-tczew, already removed02:10
micahgpaissad_: packaging changes would go in debian/changelog02:10
ari-tczewudienz: so now you have to wait for core-dev response02:11
paissad_micahg, yes the changes will be mentionned in debian/changelog indeed, but i'm talking about mentionning the name of a contributor02:11
micahgpaissad_: something like this is fine: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xulrunner-2.0/2.0~b8+build1+nobinonly-0ubuntu102:12
paissad_micahg, ok thanks02:13
dholbachgood morning!06:56
evaluatemorning06:57
iulianMorning dholbach.09:31
dholbachhey iulian09:31
akoskmhi09:43
akoskmhow can I change file contents on installation? there would be a line what I have to add to /etc/environment09:47
=== akoskm is now known as akoskm`away
bdrungtumbleweed: massfile branch fixed and pushed11:19
=== yofel_ is now known as yofel
=== Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan
paissadhello guys, i absolutely have to add some change in a default config file /etc/file.conf .... but the matter is i wonder wether i should do the changes automatically whenever someone upgrade to newer version of the package12:21
paissador wether i prompt the user if he want to do the changes or not (but i should ^^)12:22
paissadbut he should*12:22
geserpaissad: dpkg has some conffile (files in /etc) handling and asks about changed files on upgrade (or is it ucf who does it?)12:29
paissadoO12:29
paissaducf ?12:30
Laneyit's dpkg12:30
Laneydpkg and ucf are two alternative implementations of conffile handling AIUI12:30
geser!info ucf12:31
ubottuucf (source: ucf): Update Configuration File: preserve user changes to config files.. In component main, is important. Version 3.0025 (maverick), package size 66 kB, installed size 260 kB12:31
geserpaissad: ^^12:31
paissadok, so i don't have to worry about that12:31
paissadbut i would like to warn users to at least change the value of an OPTION in their conffile12:32
geserpaissad: if you ship a changed file in /etc dpkg will ask what to do during the package upgrade (install the new version, keep the old one, show diff)12:33
Laneyif you just change it they will be prompted accordingly12:33
Laneyif they have modified it, otherwise it will be set for them12:33
bdrungtumbleweed: are you there?12:33
paissadok, another question:12:35
paissadlintian shows this warning !12:35
paissadpackage-contains-empty-directory usr/share/pms-linux/database/12:35
paissadbut i do have a file debian/pms-linux.lintian-overrides12:35
paissadwith the content:12:35
paissadpms-linux binary: package-contains-empty-directory usr/share/pms-linux/database/12:35
paissadis my lintian-overrides file wrong ?12:36
rdw200169just tell lintian to shut the heck up... thats what i do...12:36
paissadi prefer considering as much as possible all warning that lintian show12:36
paissadif have an empty dir in my package usr/share/foo/emp-dir/12:39
paissadhow must i add "it's lintian-override"12:39
paissadits*12:39
geserpaissad: why to you have an empty directory in the package in the first place?12:40
Laneywhy does the package need an empty directory?12:40
Laneyif it's to write to, that's an FHS violation12:40
paissad!info fhs12:40
ubottuPackage fhs does not exist in maverick12:40
paissadok ^^12:40
Laneyhttps://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Filesystem_Hierarchy_Standard12:40
paissadLaney, the program will create some file there12:41
paissadLaney, i do know that empty dirs should not be created ^^12:42
geserpaissad: in theory /usr/share can be mounted read-only12:42
paissadoO12:42
Laneyit should be somewhere under /var12:42
Laneyand furthermore the program should handle creating the directory itself12:43
paissadLaney, yes indeed, the program does create it automatically12:44
paissadLaney, but i would like to remove that dir when i use --purge12:44
paissadLaney, i could create /var/lib/pms-linux/database/ and make a symlink to /usr/share/pms-linux/database12:45
paissadgood idea or not ?12:46
paissadin any case, i will need the lintian-overrides (i just want to know what is wrong with the lintian-ovverides i wrote)12:47
geserwould it be too much work to let it use /var/lib/... directly?12:47
Laneydpkg will not remvoe a non-empty directory on purge anyway12:47
Laneyyou need a maintainer script12:48
paissadgeser, i would have to change the source if i want to creates the files in /var/lib instead of default dir !12:49
paissadgeser, i already modified some stuffs in the source12:49
paissadLaney, rm -rf /var/lib/pms-linux/database/* (postrm)12:50
Laneyso remove those last two characters and you have no need to create it in your packaging :)12:51
paissadhmm, i don't get what you mean12:52
paissadlast two chars ?12:52
Laneyrm -rf /var/lib/pms-linux/database12:53
paissadplease, why don't you only tell me about the lintian-overrides ^^12:53
paissad:(12:53
Laneybecause it's wrong and unnecessary12:54
paissadmy God12:54
paissadLaney, you're driving me crazy :D12:54
geserpaissad: and file a bug upstream that it wants to write to /usr (see the FHS: /usr Secondary hierarchy for read-only user data)12:54
geserlintian.override should only be used for "false-positives" and not to hide (packaging) bugs12:55
paissadok12:56
paissadit's not a packaging bug (according to me)12:56
geserthen an upstream bug (writing to /usr) which should be fixed12:57
bdrungRainCT: you wrote the man page of update-maintainer. do you allow relicensing it under the ISC license?12:59
=== freeflyi1g is now known as freeflying
paissadLaney, geser, i all files and/or dirs that the program need to create are elsewhere (/var/lib/ for example) is accepted that anyway accepted i symlink them to /usr/share/pms-linux/ ?13:19
paissadif all*13:19
paissadi think yes13:21
geserpaissad: yes13:33
paissadok thanks13:33
paissadi changed the source to write database contents to /var/lib/pms-linux/database13:34
RainCTbdrung: sure13:43
=== akoskm`away is now known as akoskm
bdrungRainCT: thanks14:18
paissadquilt is complicated :(14:55
paissadcomplicate*14:55
highvoltagecompared to.... ?14:57
paissadi used to use patch programm directly ( i had no problem) .. but i wan to try quilt now since patches may grow up and if i understand correctly, quilt applies a series of patches14:58
paissadhighvoltage, compared to patch command14:58
paissada have a debian/patches dir which contains the .diff files and a file named series (which contains the name of each .diff file to apply)14:59
highvoltageI found it quite usable, I guess it depends on exactly what you want to patch and how14:59
highvoltagewhere did those .diff files came from? did you create them with quilt?15:00
paissadhighvoltage, no, i created them using diff command15:00
paissaddiff -U 3  file.orig file15:01
paissaddiff -U 3  file.orig file | file.diff15:01
highvoltageI speak under correction, but I guess the right way to do it if you have existing patches would be to do a quilt add on the file and then apply your old patches, and then let quilt handle the creation of the patch files15:01
paissaddiff -U 3  file.orig file | tee file.diff15:01
highvoltagesee https://www.wzdftpd.net/blog/index.php?post/2008/02/05/3-quilt-a-patch-management-system-how-to-survive-with-many-patches for example15:01
tumbleweedbdrung: I am now, thanks. (Been offline, making mountains of ravioli today)15:09
tumbleweedScottK: what's the issue with many recommends? surely they are preferable to depends?15:10
evaluatehello15:10
evaluatewould a request to NOT sync a package to ubuntu be taken into consideration if it would come from the upstream maintainer?15:11
tumbleweedevaluate: packages can be added to the sync blacklist, yes http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/sync-blacklist.txt15:12
bdrungtumbleweed: i am working on update-maintainer but i don't know how to add test cases15:12
evaluatetumbleweed, ok, thank you15:12
tumbleweedbdrung: I'd imagine you'd have to patch open like I did for the config tests15:13
bdrungevaluate: which package?15:13
evaluatebdrung, It's not in debian yet, but I hope it soon will be...15:13
tumbleweedevaluate: and it's something that can't be maintained in debian for both debian and ubuntu?15:13
cdbsevaluate: If it has a version number like -0ubuntuX, then it won't be synced automatically15:13
tumbleweedcdbs: people will spend time trying to merge it, though15:14
bdrungevaluate: what are the reasons for not wanting it to be synced?15:14
evaluatetumbleweed, no, I actually started hating ubuntu as of today. I hate where it is going. I really wanted to get involved with both ubuntu and debian, but I may have to rething this15:15
evaluatewell, for one the recent changes, read indicator, notify, etc. They are not mature, yet still you enforce them on people, this is not the way to do it IMHO15:15
tumbleweedevaluate: it's perfectly ok for you to maintain your package in debian and not care about ubuntu, you don't have to. At the same time, it's nice if you do.15:16
evaluateI worked my ass off to get indicator support for my app, but it lacks some serious features (e.g. I can't display any items in the indicator menu that contain underscores, the underscores get trimmed off). WTF is that?15:16
tumbleweedpersonally, I'm not a unity fan either (and in fact, I primarily use debian)15:16
evaluatetumbleweed, I seriously would love to do that, but the sh*t that's going on is making it impossible for me to do so...15:17
tumbleweedevaluate: without something more concrete, we can't really give you much guidance15:18
evaluateI mean, why would you enforce the indicator on people of it can't even display underscores in it's menu items. Also, why would you enforce a notify daemon that's not configurable AT ALL15:18
evaluatetumbleweed, well, I gave you an example. underscores in the indicator menu. They get trimmed off.15:18
evaluatetumbleweed, just a sec15:19
evaluatehttps://lists.launchpad.net/ayatana-dev/msg00052.html15:19
bdrungevaluate: underscore are trimmed off on menus too, because they have a special meaning.15:19
tumbleweeddunno if my system is just broken, but I don't seem to have notify-osd when I use "Ubuntu Classic" desktop15:19
evaluatebdrung, no, not the way I use them...15:20
bdrungevaluate: for what do you use the underscores?15:22
evaluatebdrung, I'm working on a clipboard manager. I need to put the clipboard history in the menu, and people sometimes also copy stuff that contains underscores15:22
evaluateand it looks like hell if you copy 'g_signal_connect' and see 'gsignalconnect' in the menu15:23
bdrungok, that makes sense15:23
evaluateI also don't understand Mike's attitude on configuration: http://www.webupd8.org/2010/05/mark-shuttleworth-its-ok-to-customize.html15:24
evaluateHe used to be cool and stuff...15:24
cdbsevaluate: Its just that underscores in the menu items aren't a concern for the devs15:25
evaluatecdbs, that wasn't my point. It seems that many things aren't a concern for the devs lately, examples being configurability and the ease to change things...15:26
* cdbs would not like to take up that matter15:26
evaluatethey seem to want to enforce a certain look to all people. If I wanted that I could've stayed with win$hit or OSX...15:26
bdrungevaluate: isn't a lack of configurability common for new projects? they will gather configurability over time (after they are requested)15:26
evaluatebdrung, well, yeah, but apparently Mike stated that he wouldn't like to receive patches to change the behaviour of notify-osd (see the link I pasted above)15:27
cdbsevaluate: yes, remember that nothing is perfect in its early years15:27
cdbss/years/releases/15:27
cdbsEven Mac OS was a failure until 10.1 came along15:28
evaluateI mean, I would understand it if he would say that he won't spend his time coding it, because he sees something else as being more important, but NOT ACCEPTING PATCHES?15:28
evaluateWTF?15:28
bdrungevaluate: Mike? did you mean Mark?15:28
evaluateyeah, Mark15:28
evaluatemy bad15:28
cdbsYou can't blame SABDFL for that, he sets goals. He has more serious matters of concern than to think of underscores15:29
ScottKtumbleweed: They are still installed by default and so lots of recommends means a huge install for stuff most people won't use.15:29
bdrungevaluate: the only solution is to fork notify-osd (or implement something else) if you want a different behaviour.15:29
tumbleweedScottK: so you'd rather have suggests were possible, and less dependancies where possible. I'm with you on that15:29
ScottKtumbleweed: Yes.15:29
evaluatethere also is a notify-osd patch that has been created over a year ago by someone, but it's been discontinued. If they really wanted they could've merged the changes, because it seems to be working fine...15:29
tumbleweedScottK: otoh, we haven't added any dependancies in this work, (than I know of) only BDs15:30
ScottKtumbleweed: As an example, as installed dget won't work, but if you run it, it fails telling you to install wget or curl (IIRC).15:30
ScottKtumbleweed: Great.15:30
tumbleweedScottK: yeah, sounds familiar15:30
evaluatebdrung, like I said, that wasn't the idea. Why would I want to fork something if that feature can easily be integrated into the main program without loosing any of it's current usefulness or functionality?15:30
cdbsevaluate: I just got 3 patches accepted, one for indicator-session, one for dbusmenu and another for notify-osd. (all of these are ayatana projects)15:31
evaluatecdbs, did any of them bring additional features to them?15:31
ScottKevaluate and cdbs: This is probably more on topic in #ayatana.15:31
azeem_it is fine to reject patches if they compromise the design15:31
azeem_the patch author is free to fork thn15:32
azeem_then*15:32
cdbsevaluate: the devs are busy coping with the changes (GTK3, Python 2.7, etc). If you want to write a patch and get it accepted, then feel free to ping the devs. They are friendly with prospective devs who follow their coding style and designs15:32
evaluateScottK, sorry, I was initially asking about the inclusion (or exclusion therefore) of a package from ubuntu15:32
cdbsAnd if you want a modification in the design, then file a bug with the ayatana-design project (let us stop this discussion here)15:32
evaluateok, back on topic then. Who should I talk to, to get my program on that blacklist?15:34
ScottKWhy do you want it blacklisted?15:35
tumbleweedbdrung: hmm, we did add a D on python-gnupginterface, and it's only used by one script (which I never use)15:35
evaluateScottK, because I don't want it to be synched over from debian, when it will be uploaded there...15:35
ScottKevaluate: As long as it's got an XubuntuY revision number it won't be sync'ed over.15:35
bdrungevaluate: to get back to your initial question: you can request to blacklist a package from syncs, but you need a good reason. your request will be rejected if the reason is "i don't like ubuntu". that's the freedom open source gives us.15:35
cdbsevaluate: I would recommend you to get the package uploaded to Debian, sync then, and then make local changes in Ubuntu15:35
bdrungtumbleweed: you can move that to recommends15:36
cdbsIs the package intended to be repackaged in Debian?15:36
cdbss/package/upstream tarball/15:36
evaluatecdbs, that's my point, I don't want to spend another bazillion hours to get it to play nicely with ubuntu, just because the ubuntu people feel it's ok to enforce unusable stuff on their users15:36
tumbleweedbdrung: done, and I'll file a bug about scripts failing nicely without recommends / suggests15:37
cdbsevaluate: please mention why you *don't* want a sync15:37
bdrungevaluate: you have to make your package DFSG incompatible to prevent it from getting into ubuntu. ;)15:37
Laneyplenty of packages don't care about the ayatana stuff15:38
Laneythere's no requirement for you to15:38
evaluatebdrung, well, if you sync it over, YOU will have to take care of the awkward stuff that will happen with it with the ayatana stuff...15:39
ScottKevaluate: I misunderstood what you were after.15:39
ScottKevaluate: Yes.  It's Ubuntu's problem then.15:39
evaluateok then, that works with me :-)15:39
=== cdbs changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Archive: Open | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ | Ubuntu support in #ubuntu
paissadhighvoltage, now i understand quilt, yes indeed, it's quite usable ;)15:43
evaluateScottK, to clear it up. I got angry at the fact that because the ubuntu devs implemented stuff in ubuntu that shouldn't have made it there, because it's not stable and usable enough yet, users file bugs at programs like mine, like 'implement support for indicator' or 'indicator menu doesn't work properly'...15:44
ScottKevaluate: I can understand feeling that way.15:45
ScottKI think it's reasonable to adapt to it, accept patches for it, or say it's a distro problem as you please.15:45
ScottKSo just mark the bug whatever your equivalent of wontfix is and move on.15:45
=== dholbach_ is now known as dholbach
paissadi'm done ... ^^18:01
paissadi have to make ask some user options for 1st installation or during configure about the user who run the program's daemon etc ...18:01
paissadi don't want really want to use debconf (really complicated)18:01
paissadreally18:01
paissadmy Godness18:02
paissadi just want to do something like this ... ask the user, the domain name, port, sharing dirs ...18:03
Riddelldebconf can be complicated but it does sound like the right tool for the job18:08
geserand debconf is the only policy-compliant tool for questions during package installation18:18
ari-tczewcongrats to AnAnt for syncing package from experimental without build test - git-buildpackage18:35
micahgari-tczew: do you know he didn't test?18:37
ari-tczewmicahg: I guess18:37
ari-tczewanybody know how can I fix this ftbfs: /usr/bin/ld: unrecognized option '-Bsymbolic-functions;-Wl'18:55
tumbleweedari-tczew: -Wl,foo means gcc please pass foo to ld. So if ld is getting a -Wl, someone has made a typo or something18:59
ari-tczewtumbleweed: heh, still don't know how fix ftbfs19:01
tumbleweedari-tczew: work out how that got there (start by replicating it locally)19:01
ari-tczewtumbleweed: ok, leaving this one, thought that it's easy to fix19:01
Leon_Wallch_DeveI have a problem connecting two ui files... If anywone have time please answer here (http://www.qtforum.org/article/35341/create-a-thread-to-the-one-ui-to-be-connected-with-the-qcloseevent-of-the-main-ui.html). Thank you :)19:04
carstenhhi, deborphan/1.7.28.3 has been unblocked in debian and will presumably enter squeeze before its release. it includes fixes for the two bugs that are fixed in the ubuntu's version. could someone please sync deborphan from debian to ubuntu n*?19:16
carstenhit also includes other fixes and translation updates.19:17
micahgcarstenh: ok, I'm looking into it19:19
carstenhmicahg: thanks :)19:19
carstenhmicahg: the dbgsym changelog entry is incomplete, but the according code is correct and complete.19:20
micahgcarstenh: what about the french man page?19:21
carstenhmicahg: fixed in .119:21
carstenh| * Recode note regarding bug reporting from the French l10n team to UTF-8. LP: #352744, Closes: #60390719:21
micahgcarstenh: ah, ok, great, I just need to test build before I request the sync19:22
carstenh:)19:22
micahgcarstenh: looks good, I'm requesting the sync19:28
carstenhmicahg: fine, thanks a lot19:29
micahgcarstenh: bug 693905 if you wish to subscribe19:30
ubottuLaunchpad bug 693905 in deborphan (Ubuntu) "Sync deborphan 1.7.28.3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/69390519:30
ari-tczewmicahg: thanks19:33
micahgari-tczew: what did I do?19:34
ari-tczewmicahg: taking a look on deborphan. did you see comment on MoM?19:34
micahgari-tczew: oops, sorry no19:34
* micahg needs to remember to check19:34
ari-tczewmicahg: you're golden19:35
micahgari-tczew: did you file a bug already?19:35
ari-tczewmicahg: not yet19:35
ari-tczewmicahg: however, I wasted only 5 minutes today morning, so don't afraid19:35
carstenhmicahg: I'm already on the "to be notified" list :)19:35
ari-tczewmicahg: I planned to do it today evening, if you have done this, no problem, but please remember check in future comments19:36
micahgari-tczew: ok, thanks19:36
micahgcarstenh: cool19:36
=== akoskm is now known as akoskm`away
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blueyedI want to upload a fix for apt-build, which is a Debian native package. should I use 0.12.37-0ubuntu1 for the version?22:43
ari-tczewblueyed: is it new upstream release?22:44
crimsunif it's an Ubuntu-specific change, 0.12.37ubuntu122:44
ari-tczew+1 ^^22:45
carstenhari-tczew: native packages are always new upstream releases ;)22:45
ari-tczewblueyed: or send changes to Debian git and we can get full source from git22:45
blueyedIt is not Ubuntu specific. The same bug applies to Debian.22:47
blueyedI just wanted to get it fixed, and would have forwarded it.22:47
blueyedI might just forward the debdiff without upload.22:48
blueyedari-tczew: are you involved in apt-build?22:49
ari-tczewblueyed: nope22:49
blueyedoh nice, my two patches are in git already (from looking at the changelog)22:50
blueyedwell, part of it.22:53
blueyedIs there a recommended version to get the Git commit upstream? Send them to the bug, if there is one?22:56
crimsunwould you clarify, please?22:57
ari-tczewblueyed: report a bug on BTS22:58
blueyedI have cloned the apt-build repo and am about to commit my fix. Is there a best way to get it to the Debian developer? e.g. via git-send-email to a bug.22:59
Laneya git-formatted patch on the BTS is the best way usually22:59
blueyedari-tczew: there's a bug already. I will try sending the commit there.22:59
blueyedk, thanks, Laney.22:59
akoskmhi! where to place the bash script in debian/rules if I want to run it after the installation?23:15
carstenhakoskm: debian/postinst is run after the installation, but i'm sure you don't want to place your script there without prior adaption23:44
carstenhakoskm: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-maintainerscripts.html23:45
carstenhakoskm: http://wiki.debian.org/MaintainerScripts23:46
akoskmcarstenh, thank you. I have to run this script to update the classpath variable in /etc/environment. I can't find any already implemented scripts for doing such things. If you have better idea I really appreciate it.23:51
carstenhakoskm: is this your private package or something you intend to upload?23:52
akoskmno, for now it's just my test package (qt jambi, java binding for Qt). I want to upload later and make it available for download23:54
carstenhakoskm: changing files in maintainerscript is bad and mostly a policy violation23:56
carstenhakoskm: you should read http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/java-policy/x85.html23:56
carstenhakoskm: ubuntu is based on debian, so the debian policy applies on ubuntu too23:57
carstenhakoskm: looking how exactly other packages have solved such problems is often a good idea23:59

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