=== MonsterKiller is now known as monsterkiller [00:39] * popey wonders what you have to do to incurr virgin throttling [00:39] I've been downloading at ~1.5-2MB/s constantly for about 12 hours. [00:40] :( [00:41] 8 Meg Bt here. [00:41] I want Infinity so badly. [00:51] i wonder about infinity [00:52] i get 16 down, 1.6 up, unmetered. infinity would mean 40 down, 8 up, with a "fair use" cap of 300 gig, and some unstated traffic shaping [01:31] directhex, note the cap is 300gb of up and down combined also. [02:08] dafs === cypher is now known as Guest76209 [06:58] Morning folks [06:58] How did the Christmas party go? [07:00] hii [09:03] Morning [09:03] nigelb: Was very good [09:11] Hi All [09:12] I was wondering, apart from performance, why should a server not have a GUI? [09:12] daubers: \o/ [09:13] GreenDance: Complexity is one reason I see relativley frequently [09:13] GreenDance: personally I don't believe performance is a valid reason not to have a GUI on a server [09:13] X has crashed my machine more than anything else [09:14] if I want a server that keeps working, I don't want a gui [09:14] having stuff to update that isn't being used much is a reasonable reason [09:15] AlanBell: so a GUI on a server is ok? [09:15] * popey looks at a list of hundreds of servers here where they all have x [09:15] OK by me [09:15] and performance is not even remotely a reason [09:15] other opinions are available [09:15] popey: I'm not saying nobody should, I'm saying I wouldn't :) [09:15] sure :) [09:15] personal preference [09:16] I wouldn't stick 3d drivers on it or anything like that [09:16] i suspect that x crashing isnt a good enough reason either MartijnVdS [09:16] when logged out GDM takes hardly any resources [09:16] AlanBell: "It's a UNIX system, I know this!" [09:16] heh [09:16] cue girl holding mouse like an idiot [09:16] popey: unless it takes the whole system with it [09:17] no, you miss the point [09:17] the reason x crashes on the desktop, you wouldn't do the same things on the server [09:17] e.g. running evolution, gnome panel etc [09:17] popey: i'm supprised x crashes? [09:17] popey: I thought X was stable? [09:17] GreenDance: it's software. It has bugs. [09:17] GreenDance: i never said it wasnt stable [09:18] popey: You say that... one reason I had someone tout ast me for not having a GUI was so people couldn't do that [09:18] X is pretty stable, 3d drives when stressed can sometimes be an issue [09:18] popey: i know, i just thought from browsing site, reading docs, i thought x was stable [09:18] define stable [09:19] "doesn't crash ever" - not true [09:19] "crashes less often than is annoying" - more true [09:19] popey: something that doesn't crash [09:19] nothing doesn't crash ever [09:19] if you want a gui so you can run a few terminal windows and gedit and a browser to look up documents and stuff when you need to fix things then go for it [09:19] Have a gui also adds more security risks, as there is more to exploit, not that it's really an issue but it's another layer of complexity [09:19] I'm currently running x on a 12 way opteron box (vnc) [09:19] we use vnc here heavily [09:20] because many server linux apps require a gui [09:20] and whilst we could use remote x, we tend to use vnc so people can easily share sessions [09:21] I wish there we're more apps like rapache for linux, a remote gui to connect tolinuxboxes [09:23] diplo: mentioned a gui can be exploited? [09:23] I've often wondered why bits of software don't have an admin tcp channel, so you could run the gui admin app from your desktop sending all the config over tcp (preferably through some secure channel like ssh) [09:24] No, I'm saying that it's another layer of security risks, you get more levels of exploits as you have more applications running. [09:24] Morning peeps [09:24] without a GUI is the core-os rock solid? [09:24] Less programs running you don't need the less stuff to be checked for security ( updates etc ) as popey said it's not the be all, we don't run them to save ourselves another layer of issues. [09:25] As rock as your are going to get, with it's still stable.. it's preference as others have put it already [09:25] We do run some servers with GUI, but if i'm installing it I rarely do install GUI [09:25] also depends a bit on what other machines are about [09:25] I'm quite happy with ssh and vi [09:26] yeah, entirely depends on who the admin is [09:26] who the admin is? [09:26] as to whether you have a gui or not [09:26] <- me [09:26] oh [09:26] i.e. the people here have a gui, i dont [09:26] i understand :) [09:34] http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-12059969 [09:34] what a great tradition to bring to the UK for next year I feel [09:35] that was on QI once [09:36] Oh dear [09:36] http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJxHHP-aTOc [09:48] wifey says we can't get a Caganer :( [09:48] AlanBell: heh, you've been told! [09:48] * daubers makes a new branch of some code [09:49] This is one of the disadvantages of being in any co-habitation relationship ;) [09:55] morning all [09:55] Evening [09:56] bigcalm, I'm so hungover that I just looked out the window to check.. [09:56] Heh [09:56] my first thought was "is it?" [09:57] After last night's meal, I wont need to eat until Saturday [09:57] Speaking of which, I need to send my boss the bill [10:06] morning [10:06] bigcalm now has a bigtummy ;) [10:07] danfish: pregnancy? [10:07] I think I'm close to the due date [10:07] MartijnVdS: hah [10:08] danfish: I now have a bigger tummy [10:09] I had 2 pints of EPA last night. I've never had such bad gas, and it's still going on [10:09] lovely [10:09] my wife won't let me drink certain ales due to the same reason [10:09] popey: even I'm worried [10:10] I think I'll stick to Spitfire [10:10] there's a list on the kitchen noticeboard [10:10] Hah [10:10] a [10:28] what... the... [10:28] listening to the podcast.. [10:28] it just turned into Jackanory [10:28] :) [10:29] It's panto season! [10:29] morning all o/ [10:29] popey, I see.. [10:29] :p [10:29] It's amusing if a little cheesy in places :) [10:29] Oh no it isn't... [10:29] #blametony [10:29] it's actually pretty good.. [10:29] :) [10:29] except my dodgy accent [10:29] loving the voice of the cow ;) [10:29] we're getting a lot of comments about the cow [10:32] thats no goose [10:35] help - authentication failure at login screen, recovery mode needs a root password - is there a way in? [10:36] I think this is going to be quite tricky if not impossible . . . . [10:36] the default behaviour doesn't ask for a password [10:36] have you set a root password? [10:36] no, I am worried that something is broken [10:37] no optical disk, system won't boot from USB [10:37] just boot to grub, press escape or hold shift to get the menu, highlight the first line and press 'e' to edit, go down to the 'kernel' line, e to edit, and at the end of the line add "rw init=/bin/bash" (without quotes) [10:37] which will boot you to a shell [10:38] where you can diagnose the issue [10:38] aha, I remember now, thanks! [10:38] Or just change the password [10:38] forgot the init= option [10:38] Using popeys method [10:38] OK off to try it now . . . . . [10:39] ... [10:41] OK, now in as root thanks! Need to investigate hat happened . . . [10:41] really thx a lot !!! [10:41] np [10:47] hmm, the /etc/shadow file is empty! there is a shadow- file but the filesystem is read only so I can't copy it across. Shame I can't boot a live USB, don't have a spare machine to put the disk into, I think it's time to get a new machine [10:49] morning :) [10:51] So how are we all? [10:55] m4r35n357: did you do rw in the boot line as I suggested? [10:55] took out the "ro" in the kernel line in Grub, still can't copy shadow- to shadow (not even sure if it's the right thing to do!) as the filesystem is apparently still read-only despite /proc/mounts reporting rw [10:56] remount rw? [10:56] i'll try putting an expicit rw in (missed it the first time) [10:56] can you remind me of the remount command please - I forgot most of this stuff years ago ;) [10:57] morning all [10:57] morning davmor2 [10:58] * davmor2 prods czajkowski till her wakes up and gets on irc, pretending she has a life in the really world [10:58] mount -no remount,rw / [10:59] popey, cheers, actually putting the explicit rw in the kernel line has restored write access (still grateful for the remount command though) - now to see if I can fix mu user login [11:00] hello alangridge :) [11:02] popey: aq's brother? [11:05] doh, just found redstone ore for the first time in Minecraft - only to destroy it with a stone pickaxe :/ [11:05] hah [11:05] I thought it was taking a while to break :( [11:05] popey, just listening to latest episode. I guess other have suggested this before, but you should look at LastPass.com [11:05] Odd, starting steam from terminal fails but opening it from menu doesn't [11:05] i finally managed to build a portal to the netherworld [11:06] popey, I can never find anything but gravel and cobblestone [11:06] imexil: I'm using that now :) [11:06] exactly the same line :s [11:06] :) [11:06] kazade: dig down :) [11:06] I did for fecking miles.. [11:06] hehe [11:06] then I found a cave with some lava and a piece of redstone ore [11:06] wish I could make my world available on a server [11:06] which I mutilated [11:06] I've just realized that I can sync my .minecraft folder on Ubuntu one :D [11:07] i sync mine on dropbox :) [11:07] also, I've patched my minecraft.jar with 64x64 textures [11:07] looks awesome [11:07] i come in on a monday morning and my laptop says "30327 files synced" :) [11:07] uh-oh [11:08] popey, this is what mine looks like: http://www.minecraftforum.net/viewtopic.php?f=25&t=97561 [11:08] well, the textures at least [11:09] * kazade just realizes you can build ladders... no wonder it took me ages to dig down! [11:09] I should really read the wiki [11:09] nice [11:09] heh [11:14] Anyone able to log into skype? [11:15] Can't seem to for some reason [11:15] Ah good is my friend :) [11:18] wfm :) [11:25] Yesterday afternoon was quiet with skype being down :) === dogmatic69_ is now known as dogmatic69 [11:38] oh well, looks like a lost cause - I can restore shadow from its backup, but on next reboot it is empty again, I suspect a disk fault, although fsck -f -n reports no problems and ./lost+found is empty === gordo is now known as loopzilla === loopzilla is now known as gordo [11:42] :S [11:48] Is it worth trying unity on 10.10? [11:48] no [11:48] next question? === issyl0 is now known as Guest65922 [11:48] ;) [11:49] popey, :) === gordo is now known as loopzilla [11:49] popey, Is that just against unity or is it a bag of bolts on 10.10? [11:50] I have yet to have a good experience with unity === loopzilla is now known as gonzogeographer === Guest65922 is now known as issy0 === issy0 is now known as issyl0 [12:01] SVN repo view in trac, looking at the ages just now. branches: 6 weeks, tags: 6 months, trunk: 6 minutes [12:01] I'm easily amused === gonzogeographer is now known as gonzogeo === gonzogeo is now known as gonzogeographer [12:10] popey, does gravel have any useful purpose in Minecraft? [12:12] kazade: Yes I'm just not telling you what muhahahahahahahahahaha! [12:12] davmor2, :( [12:13] kazade: have a look on the wikipedia minecraft page there is a big listing there of what is what [12:13] yeah, I did... but gravel looked useless on there, I just wanted to clarify ;) [12:14] grr, hit close instead of minimize [12:21] Oh virtualbox 4 [12:30] popey, is that because of the paradigm shift or it just doesn't function as intended? [12:44] popey, fixed my login (well I still think there is a hw fault but I've bought a bit of time) [12:45] moved /etc/shadow to another area of disk, then restoring itfrom /etc/shadow- worked after a reboot [12:45] so the original location must be faulty (not nice I know) [12:45] so thanks again for the recovery pointers === monsterkiller is now known as MonsterKiller [12:50] * gonzogeographer wakes [12:52] * screen-x offers gonzogeographer some coffee [12:55] * gonzogeographer offers thanks for the hot black stuff [13:35] its like everyone is on holiday or something.. [13:36] * bigcalm is still at work [13:37] Tomorrow off though :) [13:37] Then bugger all until the 4th [13:37] Poor GF has to work for a couple of days next week though :( [13:37] * screen-x is working tomorrow morning, and inbetween bank holidays [13:38] mostly because I used up all my annual leave sailing earlier on in the year :D [13:39] Boss is closing the company for the holidays. I have no choice... [13:39] Though, I do work from home. So could carry on working [13:39] Don't think my GF would like that though [13:40] Coor, look at the time. LUNCH! [13:41] lunch!? you've missed the boat on that, its almost time for afternoon tea [13:50] I should wrap GF's presents really... [13:50] WRAPPING TIME! [13:54] * screen-x beatboxes [13:55] https://iamclu.deviantart.com/#/d35f9dc # Tron tube map :) [13:55] tron room at ice hotel: http://www.curatedmag.com/news/2010/12/10/tron-inspired-room-at-ice-hotel/ [13:56] I was there yesterday :) [13:56] ooooooh [13:56] shineh :) [13:56] wow [13:56] * AlanBell would like to go there one day [13:56] AlanBell: it is awesome... [13:57] so what was the occasion? [13:58] Just visiting Sweden really. [13:58] did you stay there? [13:58] one night in the ice hotel, in a "snow room" rather than an "art suite" such as the tron room, but during the day you can wonder round and have a look at all the rooms. [13:59] awesome [14:00] they recommend you only wear one layer of clothing in their sleeping bags, it works well. I was warm despite ambient temp of -5. [14:06] * AlanBell downloads Natty daily [14:07] what, every day! [14:08] *chortle* [14:08] haha [14:08] oh popey you are so sharp you will cut yourself [14:08] bazinga! [14:08] AlanBell: Gdm doesn't seem to be working after the latest updates [14:09] * AlanBell isn't scared [14:09] Yay, my wife has a interview for transferring to TVU in london, may be able to escape wales and make next years Christmas Party :) [14:09] quick! move the party to wales! [14:09] :p [14:10] There are other advantages to moving east.. [14:18] Cardiff? [14:19] screen-x: "Escape from Wales", sounds like a nice movie title :) [14:19] gonzogeographer: yeah [14:24] can anyone remember the vnstat switch to initialise an interface, I'm reading the man page but it isn't jumping out at me. [14:25] heh [14:25] http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/330 [14:25] first hit for "vnstat initialise database" [14:25] vnstat -u -i [14:26] I must be tired, I read that as vmstat [14:26] heh, I suppose I should have googled... thanks popey [14:27] np [14:27] * popey hugs vnstat [14:34] spot the welsh atlas probe :) http://atlas.ripe.net/ [14:52] hi [14:55] this channel is quiet today [14:57] hi Phineas [14:57] ho ho hollo [14:57] xmas eve tomorrow [14:58] cant wait till xmas [14:58] Wow, world of goo is awesome [14:59] nperry: it's not awesome but it is as addictive as hell :D [15:00] is it for android? [15:00] it's for Mac, Windows, Linux [15:00] they have debs [15:00] is it online? [15:00] no, you install it [15:00] davmor2: I would say awesome :P [15:00] you can buy it online [15:01] does it work on mac odd 10.3? does it need an internet connection to work? [15:01] Ferb: http://2dboy.com/games.php [15:02] mmm panther [15:04] http request was interrupted by host [15:04] games work on 10.3? [15:05] yeah , badaboom [15:06] to name but a few [15:06] Badaboom is one if them [15:06] osx didn't even get graphics drivers capable of throwing more than a couple of dozen polygons around a screen until 10.6.4 [15:06] directhex: like Linux! [15:07] MartijnVdS, i'd rather use linux from a few years ago than macos from a few years ago for 3d [15:07] * Ferb boots his mac running 10.3 [15:08] it works, it boots [15:09] and its ready [15:10] I'll prove you wrong about graphic dirivers [15:12] I just got Badaboom to run [15:12] thats in 10.3 [15:13] a bit laggy tho [15:15] badaboom the nvidia GPU-based media encoder for windows? [15:15] that proves you guys wrong [15:16] nope the game [15:17] badaboom is a game as well, thats what I managed to run [15:17] the flash-based puzzle game? [15:18] the full version of it [15:18] yeah the flash one. the dull version [15:18] :> [15:18] the full version of a 2d, flash-based puzzle game from 2004 [15:19] that's your demonstration of the awesome gaming powers of mac os x 10.3, from... 2003 [15:19] * AlanBell thinks directhex isn't fully impressed just yet [15:20] AlanBell, i'd love to hear how well left 4 dead runs [15:20] not quite one more game to try [15:20] is it minesweeper? [15:20] AlanBell: :)) [15:20] AlanBell, which is a facetious request, because the game will outright not run on less than 10.6.4, which is the first release where apple completely rewrote their graphics drivers, because valve demonstrated they were completely unusable for gaming [15:20] Minecraft! [15:21] no, Tico [15:21] My HTC Desire Z arrived :D [15:21] * popey googles [15:21] wow, too many buttons [15:21] popey: on the HTC desire z? [15:21] ya [15:22] popey: just the way I like it :D [15:22] Tick runs smoothly on the same mac [15:23] tico the tetris clone? [15:23] yep [15:23] throw away your xbox! [15:23] you know these are things that should be smooth on a 486-dx2 66mhz, right? [15:24] scratch that. a cyrix clone of a 486-dx2 66mhz [15:25] badaboom is not very smoo [15:25] my first pc was an 8086 Epson with mono only graphics [15:25] in fact mono text only [15:26] I _upgraded_ to hercules 720x576 graphics card ! [15:26] the max even runs garageband [15:26] but the hdd is noisy [15:27] popey, we didn't get a pc until late '94 [15:27] I didn't get a pc until windows 95 [15:28] windows 95 is on the cusp of old enough to have had to jump through *proper* hoops to play games. [15:31] 1988 I think I got my pc [15:34] popey: I was 4 years old in 1988 :) [15:34] i was -4 :) [15:34] Hehe [15:35] are hard drives ment to be loud [15:38] ? [15:38] yes, get an SSD if you don't like it [15:39] Ferb: yeah, I wear ear defenders when using my laptop [15:39] * AlanBell isn't having fun installing natty [15:39] AlanBell: but you sounded so excited about it earlier! [15:40] wtf, according to the speedtest.net app on android I'm getting 26kbps down and 2596kbps up [15:40] what is this madness :S [15:40] tick tick tick squeek tick tick tick [15:41] Azelphur: I think there is a version of iperf for android [15:41] Azelphur: that should give you a more sensible measurement [15:41] thats what I hear [15:41] screen-x: fun [15:42] I think it's accurate though, I keep having network problems and can't load things :s [15:42] Waffle Phineas Ferb, I'm loosing track of your reincarnations [15:42] Azelphur: :( [15:42] Azelphur: mtr? [15:43] screen-x: on android? lol [15:43] hard disk noise is related to the speed, and the model, and the age. [15:43] * Ferb starts reading Garfields twetith anniversary collection [15:43] right now for me the natty alternate works in virtualbox but is a total fail on real hardware [15:43] Azelphur: ahh is it the 3g connection your having issues with? [15:43] and the insulation in your case [15:44] screen-x: yea [15:44] doesn't get to the installer menu, just an unthemed grub menu [15:44] i rarely hear my hard disks in motion [15:44] woa, that's some innovative design [15:44] Azelphur: ? [15:44] "FM Radio: You need a headset to work as an antenna. Please plug in your headset and try again" [15:44] heh [15:44] when you run out of room on the inside ;) [15:45] Azelphur: I have a few devices that use headphones as an antenna [15:45] every single battery operated portable radio of the size of a mobile phone (including mobile phones) have done that for years [15:45] hehe, new to me [15:45] it's not room [15:46] you don't want one of those silver telescopic antennas sticking out of your phone [15:46] retro [15:46] I suppose not :) [15:46] ha ha thats funny [15:46] might be funny :) [15:46] actually that'd be kinda cool. [15:46] popey: I heard you had yours wrapped round the edge? [15:46] screen-x: nope, no fm in an iphone :p [15:46] FM is deprecated, didn't you hear? :) [15:46] well the aerial anyway... [15:46] hehe indeed [15:47] Yeah free up FM spectrum for something more useful :) [15:47] I need to root this so I can remove all the HTC bloat ware [15:47] * hamitron hasn't moved off MW yet :/ [15:47] there's quite a bit of crud in here [15:47] sense? [15:47] ho ho ho [15:47] no the book I am reading is funny [15:47] welcome to android [15:47] screen-x: yea [15:47] popey: android isn't bloated, htc sense is ;) [15:47] its an android phone [15:48] it's sold as an andoird phone [15:48] :p [15:48] hence my comment "welcome to android" was appropriate [15:48] still probably gonna put cyanogen on it [15:48] is there a phone you can realistically roll out your own install? [15:48] yes [15:49] the freerunner doesn't count [15:49] hamitron: you can with android, everyone does it [15:49] hamitron: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_FreeRunner [15:49] :) [15:49] why screen-x ? [15:49] lol [15:49] popey: mostly because I've never seen one. [15:50] i have [15:50] used one for a while [15:50] i think I made maybe two successful phone calls on it [15:50] once again thats funny [15:50] popey: \o/ ? [15:50]