[00:00] <penguin42> HNY
[00:00] <vxjonny> Happy New Year everyone
[00:00] <Azelphur> indeed, happy new year :P
[00:00] <moreati> Nappy Flew Near!
[00:01] <MichealH-iPod> Happy new year!
[00:01] <MichealH-iPod> Clock is just ticking over...
[00:02] <em> happy new year UK!
[00:02] <em> happy new year UK!!
[00:03] <AlanBell> happy new year
[00:03] <Azelphur> yay for new years on IRC :P
[00:05] <MichealH-iPod> Happy new year indeed
[00:05] <chalcedony> HAPPY NEW YEAR!!
[00:11] <txwikinger> Happy new year
[00:14] <MichealNewYear> You to! :D
[00:14] <MartijnVdS> *\o/*
[00:14] <MichealNewYear> o/
[00:15] <jacobw> happy new year
[00:15] <MichealNewYear> :O)
[00:16] <jacobw> finally, i can go to bed. i am so tired :o
[00:16]  * jacobw is a party animal. obviously
[00:19] <em> some people in the UK are getting tired in the new year.
[00:19] <em> Id like to say, UK, lets make 2011 the year when Western Culture gets back on top okay?
[00:20] <em> You are expected to be leaders at that.
[00:29] <penguin42> culture? Where?
[00:31] <stuphi> Rats. I have just gotten used to writting dates that end in 10, now I have to start again!
[00:31] <AlanBell> penguin42: on the cheese
[00:40] <domjohnson> I need to make a symlink to the directory /media/Elements and put it in my Music folder - how can I do that?
[00:40] <MattJ> Happy New Year!
[00:40] <MattJ> Am I late? :)
[00:40] <MattJ> domjohnson: terminal or graphical?
[00:41] <domjohnson> Either
[00:41] <domjohnson> So long as the terminal isn't too difficult
[00:41] <domjohnson> *terminal option
[00:41] <MattJ> ln -s /media/Elements ~/Music/Elements
[00:41] <domjohnson> LOL - sounds like a sci-fi film - "Coming to a cinema near you - The Terminal Option"
[00:42] <domjohnson> Ok - cheers :)
[00:42] <MattJ> :)
[00:46] <domjohnson>  /j #squeezebox
[01:17] <domjohnson> How do I set a symlink to be able to be accessed and executed by all users (i.e, in the 'other' section)?
[01:17] <domjohnson> by CLI is fine
[01:22] <MartijnVdS> domjohnson: symlinks are 777 by default. The permission of the thing they point to is the important bit
[01:23] <domjohnson> ok
[01:23] <domjohnson> How do I change that to the above options?
[01:23] <domjohnson> 777?
[01:23] <MartijnVdS> you don't need/want to do that
[01:24] <MartijnVdS> you need to change the thing the symlink points to
[01:24] <MartijnVdS> changing permissions on the symlink is useless
[01:24] <MartijnVdS> see the manpages of ln and chmod
[01:25] <domjohnson> Thats what I mean :)
[01:32] <domjohnson> Is it possible to set chmod for all files and directories within the directory you're cd'd into?
[01:33] <AlanBell> domjohnson: chmod -R dom: *
[01:33] <AlanBell> oh hang on that would be chown
[01:34] <AlanBell> night all o/
[01:34] <domjohnson> Night, AlanBell :)
[01:34] <domjohnson> Happy New Year
[10:06] <czajkowski> Happy 1.1.11
[10:07] <MartijnVdS> czajkowski: happy 2011 :)
[10:17] <buzz_> morning
[10:17] <buzz_> hangovers ?
[10:17] <MartijnVdS> nah
[10:18] <buzz_> i was sober last night, which is quite the exception :)
[10:18]  * MartijnVdS listens to http://is.gd/jT6Wc
[10:19] <buzz_> nice choice!
[10:19] <buzz_> one of my faves. saw the live show couple of years ago also
[10:19] <MartijnVdS> cool
[10:20] <MartijnVdS> too bad there are a few skips (minor ones) on my copy :(
[10:20] <buzz_> might stick it on myself actually
[10:20] <MartijnVdS> well my dad's copy really
[10:20] <buzz_> aah. on vinyl ?
[10:20] <MartijnVdS> yes
[10:21] <buzz_> can always download it as flac or something
[10:21] <MartijnVdS> sure
[10:21] <MartijnVdS> but I'm in a vinyl mood today :)
[10:21] <buzz_> oldschool!
[10:22] <MartijnVdS> buzz_: I told my dad how to use discogs.com yesterday.. we entered 90% of his LPs :) Great way to spend time with family on new year's eve ;)
[10:22] <buzz_> ive not used it myself
[10:23] <buzz_> is it just imdb for music type thing ?
[10:23] <MartijnVdS> imdb + ebay + a "collection manager"
[10:23] <buzz_> aah nice
[10:24] <MartijnVdS> yeah it helps me when I'm out buying records (or CDs) :)
[10:24] <MartijnVdS> So I don't buy things I already have
[10:25] <buzz_> you must have a lot :) i have bought some duplicate dvds in the past mind.
[10:25] <MartijnVdS> buzz_: "All (348)"
[10:25] <buzz_> blimey :)
[10:26] <MartijnVdS> http://twitpic.com/3lkuyu
[10:26] <MartijnVdS> (that's a 42" TV, for scale)
[10:26] <buzz_> nice cllection. and tidy too
[10:27] <buzz_> i have a large collection of cassettes.. (puter games not music!)
[10:27] <MartijnVdS> ooh, Press play on tape :)
[10:27] <buzz_> heh
[10:27] <buzz_> C= <3
[10:29] <MartijnVdS> I knew more MSX people ;)
[10:29]  * buzz_ guesses you from the netherlands then
[10:29] <buzz_> ?
[10:29] <buzz_> wasnt that big here
[10:30] <MartijnVdS> yeah
[10:30] <MartijnVdS> MSX was huge here
[10:30] <buzz_> yeh..
[10:30] <buzz_> some of the msx machines are quite interesting. some good capabilities
[10:31] <MartijnVdS> I've never really used them myself.. we got an early XT in the mid-80s
[10:34] <buzz_> quite a boring machine (imho) :)
[10:34] <MartijnVdS> It was.. no TV-out ;)
[10:35] <MartijnVdS> MSX could do TV overlay easily
[10:35] <buzz_> i asked for a c64 and got a spectrum in about 1984/85
[10:35] <buzz_> cheapskates.
[10:35] <MartijnVdS> haha :)
[10:35] <MartijnVdS> 'But it has all the nice colours!'
[10:35] <buzz_> :)
[10:36] <buzz_> got an amiga in about 1990 but continues to use the spectrum still.. it grew on me over the years :)
[10:36] <buzz_> plus i could code on the spectrum and the amiga was a complete mystery at the time.
[10:36] <MartijnVdS> I used that XT until the DMA controller broke (random disk writes failed, random glitches on the 8-bit Sound Blaster, etc.)
[10:36] <MartijnVdS> then got a 386SX
[10:36] <buzz_> soundblasters were cool
[10:37] <buzz_> there was a nice soundcard. awe32 or something? my memory
[10:37] <MartijnVdS> SUre, but that was later on, in the 16-bit ISA age
[10:37] <MartijnVdS> XTs had 8-bit ISA, so all I had was a "SoundBlaster 2"
[10:38] <buzz_> ah
[10:40] <buzz_> horsell common and the heat ray..
[10:40] <buzz_> fab
[10:40] <MartijnVdS> "Forever Autumn" here
[10:41] <buzz_> http://www.amazon.co.uk/War-Worlds-Live-DVD/dp/B000I6AMW2 is quite good :)
[10:41] <buzz_> http://www.amazon.co.uk/War-Worlds-Live-Special-disc/dp/B000J10LC2/ref=pd_cp_d_h__0 even cheaper.
[10:41] <MartijnVdS> wow.. 95 5* reviews
[10:42] <buzz_> the 2 disk one is cheaper than the 1 disk. odd
[10:42] <MartijnVdS> marketing 8-)
[10:42] <buzz_> 3 star review "Was a bit disappointed to find it was no different to the original. Still an amazing DVD " erm.. thats the point. its the original music done live
[10:42] <buzz_> :)
[10:42] <MartijnVdS> :)
[10:44] <buzz_> 'p[\
[10:44] <buzz_> oops.
[10:44] <MartijnVdS> *add to wishlist* :)
[10:45] <buzz_> hmm. not in stock i just saw
[10:46] <MartijnVdS> It'll be back
[10:57] <daubers> Morning
[10:57] <MartijnVdS> \o
[10:57] <buzz_> morning
[10:59] <daubers> So now we're in the future, where do I collect my jetpack and my robot butler?
[10:59] <MartijnVdS> daubers: First, put on your reflective one-part suit
[10:59] <daubers> MartijnVdS: Hmmm... might need a trip to JJB Sports for one of those...
[10:59] <MartijnVdS> daubers: then get in your flying car to get to the jetpack salesman
[11:00] <buzz_> http://www.jetpackinternational.com/equip.html
[11:00] <MartijnVdS> Estimated Flight Time: 9 minutes
[11:00] <MartijnVdS> Estimated Distance: Approx. 11 miles
[11:00] <MartijnVdS> nice
[11:01] <daubers> That would get me to work!
[11:01] <daubers> Would have to refuel to get home though
[11:01] <buzz_> daubers, http://www.robotshop.com/superdroid-hd2-swat-eod-tracked-robot.html
[11:02] <buzz_> :)
[11:02] <buzz_> not quite a butler, but
[11:03] <buzz_> or http://www.robotshop.com/b9-creations-lost-in-space-robot-replica.html :)
[11:10] <buzz_> reboot. brb
[11:11] <MartijnVdS> robot, brb 8-)
[11:17] <AlanBell> hope everyone just enjoyed 11:11 on 1/1/11
[11:50] <danfish> AlanBell: I was ecstatic, but have now returned to hungoveredness ;)
[11:50] <domjohnson> Or, as you could shorten it to, Alan, 255.
[12:14] <MartijnVdS> domjohnson: it's 01/01/11 11:11
[12:14] <MartijnVdS> domjohnson: so it's not 255 ;)
[12:14]  * MartijnVdS waits for 11-11-2011 11:11:11
[12:16] <domjohnson> Ah :)
[12:16] <domjohnson> Didn't think of that :)
[12:17] <domjohnson> 1,534, then :)
[12:20] <domjohnson> Is chmod -R g+rwx Elements a valid command?
[12:21] <MartijnVdS> yes
[12:21] <MartijnVdS> if Elements is an existing directory
[12:21] <MartijnVdS> it'll recursively (-R) add r, w and x bits to Elements and everything in it
[12:21] <MartijnVdS> you probably want X instead of x
[12:21] <domjohnson> ok
[12:21] <MartijnVdS> so it only adds "executable" status to things that already have an execute bit
[12:22] <MartijnVdS> (so if it's already u+x, g+X will add an x, but if it's not u+x, g+X won't add a group-x)
[12:23] <domjohnson> Someone told me that "The files and directories need to be readable by user 'squeezeboxserver', and that user must also have 'execute' permissions on the directories in your music library."
[12:23] <MartijnVdS> sure
[12:23] <MartijnVdS> that's what +X does :)
[12:23] <MartijnVdS> the directories are most likely already user+x, so g+X will add group+x
[12:24] <MartijnVdS> but the files don't need to be +x (especially if they're not executable, like movies, etc.)
[12:24] <penguin42> Hmm, didn't know +X - well, that's my useful learning for 2011 done
[12:24] <MartijnVdS> and g+X also does that: if there's no u+x, it won't add g+x
[12:24] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: TIL.reddit.com
[12:24] <domjohnson> Right...
[12:24] <domjohnson> Thanks :)
[12:25] <MartijnVdS> domjohnson: it's all in the chmod man page if you want more detail ;)
[12:25] <domjohnson> I know - I looked at it the other day but couldn't understand it all...then again, I looked at it late at night
[12:25] <domjohnson> Got to go
[12:25] <domjohnson> Be back soon
[12:25] <MartijnVdS> bye :)
[12:26] <exobuzz> since you probably dont want u+x on files you can jsut do the dirs - find somepath -type d -exec chmod 755 {} \; for all dirs in somepath to drwxr-xr-x
[12:27] <exobuzz> find somepath -type f -exec chmod 644{} \; - for files to -rw-r--r-- similarly
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> exobuzz: you forgot a space between 644 and {}
[12:28] <exobuzz> bah :)
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> also, I tend to use \{} so bash doesn't think I'm defining a function ;)
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> (same with ! in gstreamer pipelines)
[12:28] <exobuzz> never had a problem with it like that on bash
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> maybe I have weird settings then :)
[12:28] <MartijnVdS> or I'm paranoid
[12:29] <exobuzz> :)
[12:55]  * AlanBell waves http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/2011plan about again
[12:56] <czajkowski> AlanBell: :)
[12:57] <czajkowski> AlanBell: thought about mailing the ML with it as not everyone is on IRC at this time of year? plus more opinions ?
[13:08] <UndiFineD> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_LaakhfpX99w/STmqjYuyCuI/AAAAAAAAAyI/ZPVIaCRuTFQ/s400/Baby+ocelot.jpg
[13:13] <jacobw> aw :( its frightened
[13:35] <danfish> Happy new year to all and yours
[13:37] <dwatkins> likewise, danfish
[13:39] <danfish> I need an online, encrypted backup solution for approx 100gb of data - carbonite is a nice option, bit win/mac only. Any recommendations on alternatives?
[13:40] <penguin42> danfish: I think I've used duplicity a few years ago
[13:41] <brobostigon> afternoonings all.
[13:43] <popey> danfish: crashplan
[13:45] <danfish> popey: tx - as always spot on :)
[13:45] <danfish> do you cache the whole internet in you brain?
[13:46] <danfish> s/you/sour
[13:46] <danfish> s/you/your
[13:46] <popey> :)
[13:49] <danfish> I have been mulling over remote backup at a relatives with a dedicated box (and the associated power costs and bandwidth usage) vs a dedicated offline storage
[13:49] <popey> i installed crashplan and stopped worrying about it :)
[13:54] <danfish> looking at that pricing structure, I agree
[14:03] <marsilainen> what does it backup? the whole machine?
[14:03] <marsilainen> or do I tell it what bits to backup?
[14:04] <marsilainen> what about for databases, does it lock them and handle that sort of thing - or would I need to do that manually?
[14:04] <marsilainen> well, automatedly
[14:09] <danfish> marsilainen: I'm not sure yet - exploring as we chat :)
[14:09] <kvarley> Great start to 2011, no phoneline no internet...
[14:11] <marsilainen> and yet you can communicate with us telepathically or something :)
[14:11] <kvarley> Hehe, at a friends borrowing wifi for a bit
[14:11] <kvarley> Bt picks it's moments to mess my line up, over the bank holiday weekend lol
[14:14] <jacobw> :(
[14:15] <kvarley> On the positive side its been up solid for years
[14:19] <popey> marsilainen: it backs up what you want it to backup
[14:33] <czajkowski> popey: love the way fab blames Apple for everything, followed by you :) He has an interesting logic
[14:41] <kvarley> Whoever was helping me to fix the quake wars audio delay, I found a fix. Run "sudo killall pulseaudio" before launching the game & that fixes it.
[14:41] <popey> :)
[14:42] <czajkowski> longest episode ever
[14:42] <czajkowski> have stopped about 1/3 the way through going to join local gym
[14:44] <popey> did i get a mention then?
[14:45] <penguin42> kvarley: You can probably do pasuspender nameofgame
[14:45] <penguin42> kvarley: That will suspend PA while the game runs
[14:45] <czajkowski> popey: aye he was blaming mac for taking all the IP4 addresses, then said by default he balmes you as you use a MAC :)
[14:45] <czajkowski> popey: fab logic :)
[14:45] <kvarley> penguin42: pasuspender wasn't working for some reason
[14:45] <penguin42> oh weird
[14:47] <kvarley> 2011 holds great things for Ubuntu. I'm most looking forward to the commercial games using the unigine engine! What are you looking forward to?
[14:49] <jacobw> I want them to stop deleted items on removable media going in to .Trash on the removable media
[14:50] <jacobw> Why?!
[14:51] <directhex> kvarley: there are unigine games?
[14:55] <kvarley> directhex: There will be this year, oil rig is the first one to be released I think
[15:00] <popey> czajkowski: blames apple for ipv4 going!?
[15:05] <daubers> o/
[15:06] <daubers> What're we blaming apple for now?
[15:07] <popey> 14:45:33 < czajkowski> popey: aye he was blaming mac for taking all the IP4 addresses, then said by default he balmes you as you use a MAC :)
[15:07] <daubers> I see
[15:07] <popey> i dont think i have the stomach for 3 hours of that
[15:07] <daubers> 3 hours?????????
[15:07] <daubers> So Dan finally lost control of Fab then...
[15:08] <popey> :)
[15:13]  * dwatkins wonders if there will be a Unigine port for the Mac
[15:13] <dwatkins> The demos are impressive, especially the light flare and water effects
[15:16] <jacobw> popey: has anything happened with the 'clubuntu' idea yet?
[15:51] <daubers> urgh, working with tcp stresms is weird
[16:05] <|Dreams|> ok i am going to try a new distro because i want to advance my knowledge of linux any suggestions? I was thinking maybe arch linux or fedora?
[16:05] <AlanBell> linux from scratch
[16:05] <AlanBell> !lfs
[16:06] <brobostigon> maybe a rolling distro, like archor debian unstable/sid.
[16:06] <brobostigon> arch*
[16:06] <|Dreams|> ok thanks will look into these
[16:08] <AlanBell> debian has a more useful packaging system to learn about
[16:09] <|Dreams|> oh and hapy new year everyone
[16:13] <directhex> centos. it's Enterprise(tm)
[16:14] <domjohnson> To use the line "/dev/sdb1        /media/musiclib  auto    rw,nouser,noauto,exec,utf8 0       0" (without quotes) in fstab, do I have to create the directory /media/musiclib?
[16:14] <daubers> domjohnson: Yes
[16:14] <domjohnson> (I know it sounds a daft question, and I think you probably do, but I'm a little weary of messing around with things - this isn't my computer)
[16:14] <domjohnson> Cheers, daubers :)
[16:24] <AlanBell> does anyone run their own nameserver? as in ns1.example.com and ns2.example.com pointing to your own server?
[16:26] <mattt> not right now, but have in the past
[16:27] <mattt> got a specific problem?
[16:27] <AlanBell> not really, got a customer using cpanel which really really wants to be a nameserver
[16:28] <mattt> yeah, the plesk cp does the same thing out of the box
[16:28] <mattt> every time you set up a domain, it'll create local zones, etc.
[16:30] <AlanBell> just seems like madness to me
[16:30] <mattt> what we used to do -- just let plesk do it's thing, and then point the domain at some proper name servers
[16:30] <mattt> and then just ensured the box hosting the cp wasn't configured to query itself
[16:40] <mhad> happy new year ubuntu-user
[16:43] <jacobw> happy new year mhad
[16:43] <mhad> thanks jacobw
[16:50] <balor> Anyone here run mythtv?  I'm having an issue getting channels from my satellite
[16:52] <marsilainen> how do people cope with download limits like 30GB/month?
[16:52] <marsilainen> I easily seem to get through more than 1GB/day just by myself
[16:55] <DJones> balor: Might be worth asking in #mythtv (I think thats the channel)
[17:01] <DJones> Why isn't the channel +t?
[17:01] <AlanBell> good question
[17:01] <AlanBell> why did we forget the meeting on thursday is anothe good question
[17:02] <DJones> Heh, Meeting between Christmas & new was probably never likely to happen
[17:02] <brobostigon> AlanBell: too much prtying?
[17:03] <AlanBell> yeah true enough, just bumped it forward a bit from when we didn't do the previous one
[17:49] <czajkowski> AlanBell: or too many meetings :p
[18:38] <danfish> we had some friends round last night, one of whom worked for the civil service
[18:39] <czajkowski> danfish: don't hold it against them
[18:39] <danfish> she'd been working this week and noted that only half the floors in her building had been heated because, understandably only half the staff were working
[18:39] <danfish> czajkowski: :D
[18:41] <danfish> she commented on this to her boss and was told "there's an energy competition on - look at govspark.org.uk" !!!!!
[18:42] <danfish> yet more credit to issyl0 :)
[18:43] <czajkowski> :)
[18:43] <brobostigon> :)
[18:52] <em> hey do any of you guys enjoy English football league?
[18:54] <popey> it rarely gets discussed in here, so chances are not many do
[18:54] <Namolem> #centos
[18:55] <czajkowski> danfish: that reminds me can you give me the name of that pub again I seem to have lost it in the history please.
[18:57] <danfish> czajkowski: the northcote
[18:57] <czajkowski> danfish: cheers! you still at a conference ?
[18:58] <danfish> at the moment yes, but not confirmed
[18:58] <danfish> there are other matches .........
[18:59] <czajkowski> danfish: this is true! gonna book it this week and then create the event on the LD and mail the list, feck it if 5 people turn up it'll be a bit of a laugh!
[19:00] <czajkowski> em: you can ask me stuff in here rather than pm
[19:01] <em> aren't you freenode staff?
[19:01] <czajkowski> yes
[19:01] <em> you want me to only ask you stuff in this channel even if it has nothing to do with this channel?
[19:01] <czajkowski> em: or ask can you pm me, or give me a clue about what you want to pm me.
[19:02] <czajkowski> otherwise I don't tend to respond to random pm
[19:02] <em> That's a shame.
[19:04] <czajkowski> em: was there something you wanted help with ?
[19:04] <em> I wondered if you were Polish.
[19:05] <czajkowski> nope I'm Irish .
[19:05] <em> Oh well that's a good one too :)
[19:23] <bigcalm> HNY peeps
[19:24] <brobostigon> evening bigcalm
[19:31] <suprengr> o/ peeps
[19:31] <mattt> sup all
[19:31] <brobostigon> evening suprengr
[19:32]  * brobostigon has chocolate buttons, yummy, 
[19:36] <MartijnVdS> hmm chocolate
[19:37] <brobostigon> :) hehe
[19:39] <brobostigon> MartijnVdS: because i am allergic to dairy, the soya chocolate i have to get, is significantly more expensive than the normal chocolate.
[19:39]  * suprengr holds out plate and hopes brobostigon throws chocolate buttons at it
[19:39]  * brobostigon gives suprengr some.
[19:40] <suprengr> yummm
[19:42] <penguin42> brobostigon: It's very difficult to find dairy free chocolate; Green & Blacks have started putting it in their dark chocolate; you might try Tesco's Finest Organic finest 70% dominican - I don't think it lists Dairy in the ingredients (although I seem to remember an odd disclaimer)
[19:43] <penguin42> brobostigon: Kosher after dinner chocolate as well tends to be dairy free
[19:43] <brobostigon> penguin42: i get mne from holland and barrett.
[19:44] <brobostigon> penguin42: not have a look at that.
[19:45] <suprengr> just a long shot: I have two CD's which I am thinking of trying under Wine: Monty Python's Complete Waste of Time (1994) & Worms 2... any thoughts?
[19:46] <suprengr> [no reference found on Wine HQ]
[19:47] <DJones> suprengr: This Worms 2? http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=585
[19:48] <suprengr> DJones: cool! thanks
[19:50] <DJones> The other one doesn't look hopefull, although its an old test http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=1601 Maybe worth tryin it just because you can :)
[19:51] <suprengr> DJones: ;)
[19:51] <issyl0> danfish: that's awesome :D
[19:53] <suprengr> from beeb news: Thousands of Dutch swimmers have taken part in the traditional annual dip in the freezing North Sea. [translation for the brain gifted: "1000's of idiots freeze to death"]
[19:53] <MartijnVdS> suprengr: nobody froze to death
[19:53] <MartijnVdS> We've been doing this since '58 ;)
[19:53] <MartijnVdS> it's a great tradition
[19:53] <suprengr> WHAT!
[19:54] <suprengr> ...that's a long time to be in the Noth Sea.
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nieuwjaarsduik
[19:54] <suprengr> *North
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> oh '65
[19:54] <MartijnVdS> suprengr: the guy who started it was a channel swimmer :)
[19:55]  * brobostigon can read that, partly.
[19:55] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: Isn't it easier to sit in front of a nice warm radiator, feet up, reading the web etc etc
[19:55] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: sure, that's what I do.
[19:56] <MartijnVdS> penguin42: but uhm.. try finding photos ;)
[19:56] <MartijnVdS> it's not that bad ;)
[19:57] <suprengr> MartijnVdS:  Ashamed / proud to say I too trained for that particular challenge... but, no, I did not do it in the end...
[19:57]  * MartijnVdS gives everyone an oliebol
[19:57] <MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oliebol
[20:05] <suprengr> lard balls! wot!... no wonder the Dutch are so fun to talk to!
[20:05] <suprengr> [I had always assumed it was the scchhmmoke drifting from Amsterdam until now ;D
[20:05] <MartijnVdS> suprengr: they're a bit like donuts really
[20:05] <MartijnVdS> but less sugary
[20:06] <suprengr> MartijnVdS: that's just torture... now I wanna doughnut!
[20:11]  * suprengr looks in mirror & sees Homer Simpson
[20:15] <penguin42> MartijnVdS: Someone has stolen your doughnuts hole!
[20:33] <brobostigon> good name for an email client, K9, :)
[20:44] <ocean> hi guys. i was trying to install ubuntu on my new hp laptop.used g parted to resize the and get some free space. freed the spaces alright and is showing up as an ullocated space. i wanted to configure this unallocated space and whn i choose this unallocated space all the tools go greay and i am not able to format this space at all.g parted keep saying that it is not possible to create more than 4 primary partitions.how can i get around this issue
[20:44] <ocean> tx in advance
[20:45] <moreati> Do you have 4 partitions now?
[20:46] <ocean> yes.it is numbered as sda1 sda2 sda3 and sda4
[20:46] <AlanBell> you have indeed run out of primary partitions
[20:46] <ocean> i freed some space from sda2 where i want to configure and i am not able to do it :-(
[20:47] <ocean> how can i create a logical partition here then
[20:47] <moreati> ocean: Then what gpartedis telling you is right. You need to save the sata from the last partition, then delete it and recreate as a logical partition
[20:47] <AlanBell> you need to delete a partition and create logical partitions in it
[20:47] <ocean> ok, so how can i do it without loosing my data, i am pretty new
[20:48] <moreati>  ocean you can't. You need to backup your data (which I'm hoping you already did)
[20:48] <ocean> sda1 is the boot, sda2 has got windows, sda 3 says it is recovery and sda4 is HP-tools
[20:48] <jacobw> ocean: move the data from the partition you intend to delete on to a partition you intend to keep or on to a removeable volume
[20:48] <jacobw> sda1 is a Linux boot partition?
[20:48] <AlanBell> bye bye windows :)
[20:48] <ali1234> on windows 7 they have rejigged everything to use up all the primary partitions
[20:48] <ali1234> presumably to make dual booting harder
[20:49] <ocean> yeah thats what i understand now
[20:49] <ali1234> windows 7 has a separate "boot" partition now, plus usually at least 1 recovery partition
[20:49] <AlanBell> that is a pretty grim setup
[20:49] <moreati> ali1234: oh joy  :(
[20:49] <ocean> can i remove the the sda4 here?
[20:49] <ali1234> yeah well, what can you do?
[20:50] <jacobw> ocean: yes, you can if want to.
[20:50] <ali1234> you can do whatever you want, and if you break it, you get to keep the pieces
[20:50]  * suprengr creeps off to install Worms2
[20:50] <moreati> ocean: you can if you don't mind loosing the HP recover tools that are on that partition
[20:50] <ocean> if i remove that can i configure this unallocated space
[20:50] <ocean> ?
[20:51] <jacobw> ocean: yes
[20:51] <ocean> its an HP laptap. and the sda 4 is named after HP-Tools, do u have any idea what that partition is
[20:52] <ocean> I just dont care about windows much.
[20:52] <ocean> or can i move that sda 4 to sda2?
[20:52] <ali1234> what you should probably do is obtain a windows 7 install disk from MSDN (you have an MSDN account right?) then use it to do a vanilla install without all the "free" bundled crud, then you'll only be using two partitions...
[20:53] <penguin42> ali1234: No, that will lose any drivers needed on the HP
[20:53] <jacobw> ocean: if you want to keep the HP tools you should move them elsewhere
[20:53] <ali1234> penguin42: not if you download them first and slipstream them into the image...
[20:53] <ali1234> you do know how to slipstream windows right?
[20:53] <ali1234> windows is so easy to use...
[20:53] <ocean> sorry to ask u, what does HP tools contain? is that drivers?
[20:54] <ali1234> no, probably not, the drivers will be already installed in the recovery image
[20:54] <jacobw> ocean: no idea, could be anything, you should see if you can access it from Windows and copy on to the Windows parition
[20:54] <ocean> ok
[20:55] <ocean> and if i can copy the content into windows partition, deleting that partition would that be okay?
[20:55] <jacobw> or a removeable drive, however, if you don't care much about Windows you can instruct the Ubuntu installer to use the entire disk which will overwrite Windows installation
[20:55] <jacobw> ocean: unless the HP tools is a bootable OS in itself, which I doubt
[20:56] <ali1234> it could be
[20:56] <ali1234> could be a smarttop based environment
[20:56] <ocean> what would u do urslef if u r in such a situation and needs windows to work as well?
[20:56] <ali1234> i would wipe windows, install ubuntu, then install windows in a virtual machine
[20:57] <penguin42> ocean: I'd try and back up the HP partition if possible, delete it and create a logical partition
[20:57]  * jacobw agrees with ali1234 on the condition that you have Windows install media
[20:57] <ocean> i don have that much expertise to install windows on a virtual machine.:-(  ,
[20:58] <jacobw> ocean: installing Windows in a virtual machine is easy
[20:58] <jacobw> ocean: provided you have the installation media
[20:58] <ocean> penguin can u guess what HP-tools might be, what consequences will it have if i delete it
[20:59] <ali1234> http://h30434.www3.hp.com/t5/Notebook-Operating-systems-and/Drive-Letters-on-HP-laptop/m-p/254389
[20:59] <moreati> ocean: HP have probably put some special HP boot diagnostics/windows recovery tools on there. Maybe a frontend to the Windows recovery partition
[21:00] <ocean> sda3 is named after Recovery, so sda4 (hp tools) can it be related to recovery again?
[21:00] <ali1234> you could always do a wubi install
[21:00] <ali1234> yes, they can both be used for recovery
[21:01] <ali1234> trying to remember the name of that mini linux distro they use for this stuff
[21:01] <ali1234> splashtop
[21:02] <ocean> HP says once you haave made ur recovery disk it wouldnt let u make another one. I have already made a recovery disk in that case deleting sda4, would it be problem.
[21:04] <ali1234> splashtop actually really sucks... you see loads of motherboards advertised with it... sure they come with splashtop... on a CD-ROM... and you have to install it in a magic partition on your first hard drive
[21:04] <ali1234> and it boots no faster than any other linux distro
[21:04] <ali1234> complete waste of time
[21:04] <jacobw> unfortunately HP don't ship installation media
[21:05] <jacobw> because they are evil :(
[21:05] <ali1234> nobody does any more
[21:05] <Nafallo> O_o
[21:05] <ali1234> this is why you need an MSDN account
[21:05] <jacobw> i think Dell do
[21:05] <ali1234> nope
[21:05] <ocean> jacobw, if i have made recovery dvds, am i going to loose anything if i delete sda 4
[21:05] <ocean> pls help
[21:06] <jacobw> ocean: we can't determine that
[21:06] <ali1234> not on the cheaper end systems anyway
[21:06] <jacobw> ocean: it may help you could tell us more about the machine
[21:06] <ocean> what would u like to know jacobw. i am happy to provide that
[21:07] <jacobw> ocean: and why you need Windows for work, we may be able to suggest alternatives that run under Linux
[21:07] <jacobw> ocean: what model/number is it? e.g. pavillion dv6231ea
[21:08] <ali1234> is there a linux alternative to after effects yet?
[21:08] <ocean> pavilion dv6 dv6-3150sa
[21:09] <popey> ali1234: splashtop on my acer revo is much quicker than any linux distro
[21:09] <popey> and it came preinstalled, not something that needed installing
[21:09] <ali1234> by "any linux distro" do you mean ubuntu?
[21:09] <ali1234> yes, a very small number of systems have it in a flash chip
[21:10] <popey> yeah, its on the hdd
[21:10] <ali1234> netbooks often come with it preinstalled on the HD
[21:11] <ali1234> but if you pay attention during bootup you'll notice that it spends almost exactly as long in the bios, after which it's just a normal linux bootup
[21:11] <ali1234> for example, i bet it doesn't boot faster than meego
[21:12] <ali1234> meego boots in about 8 seconds from power on on by AAO
[21:12] <ali1234> about 5 of those seconds are the bios
[21:12] <popey> not tried meego
[21:13] <popey> your assertion was that it is no faster than _any_ other linux distro :p
[21:13] <ali1234> that's not the same as "slower than all other linux distros" and you know it :)
[21:14] <popey> meh
[21:14] <ali1234> the point is, it's not magically faster than everything else, like they claim in their marketing
[21:14] <popey> sure, but it's pretty quick
[21:14] <popey> I guess it only has to be faster than windows
[21:15] <popey> which isnt hard
[21:15] <ali1234> there are plenty of better alternatives which are equally fast, and you don't need to pay a premium on your hardware to get them
[21:15] <ali1234> but yeah, it's only really fast compared to a screwed up windows install or ubuntu
[21:15] <jacobw> ocean: https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/switching/C/preparing.html
[21:16] <ali1234> (i still think you should just do a wubi install)
[21:16] <ali1234> wubi is still supported, right?
[21:16] <popey> ya
[21:16] <popey> just a pain to migrate away from
[21:16] <ali1234> compared to what?
[21:17] <ali1234> if you're migrating away from wubi, going back to windows, it's trivial, just delete the file...
[21:17] <ali1234> much easier than migrating from dual boot back to windows
[21:18] <AlanBell> I think wubi is probably the way forward in this instance
[21:18] <AlanBell> less damage potential than anything else
[21:19] <AlanBell> personally I would nuke all 4 partitions, but then I don't want dual boot or the recovery stuff
[21:19] <jacobw> yeah, this is probably a prime use case for wubi
[21:20] <AlanBell> but that is a bit screwed up, shipping a box with 4 used primary partitions
[21:20]  * czajkowski hugs DJones :D 
[21:20] <popey> I meant a pain to migrate from wubi install to full install
[21:21] <DJones> czajkowski: I guess that worked then, did they win?
[21:21] <AlanBell> I think wubi is the best of a bad bunch of options
[21:21] <czajkowski> DJones: we did indeed 35 10 :D 4 trys = Bonus point!
[21:21] <DJones> Good score there
[21:21] <ocean> thanks jacobw. but i needs windows for my work.
[21:22] <ocean> is there any link with which u can help me with this issue. to get around the one which has 4 used up primary partitions
[21:22] <ocean> ?
[21:22] <ali1234> !wubi
[21:24] <ali1234> oh yeah, you'll need to put back your windows partition to how it was before
[21:24] <jacobw> there is no way to install another [stand alone] operating system on a hard drive with 4 primary partitions without deleting one or more of those primary partitions
[21:25] <ali1234> sure there is, wubi does it
[21:25] <jacobw> you can use wubi to the same effect
[21:25] <jacobw> [stand alone[
[21:25] <ali1234> wubi is standalone once it is installed
[21:25] <ali1234> it doesn't boot up through windows every time
[21:25] <jacobw> i suppose so..
[21:26] <ali1234> it just happens that the root partition is a file in another partition. this can be thought of merely as a very complex partitioning system however
[21:26] <jacobw> oh. i thought it did boot through windows
[21:26] <jacobw> i stand corrected
[21:26] <ali1234> it might use the windows bootloader, i'm not sure
[21:26] <ali1234> but cvertainly doesn't boot up all the way into windows
[21:30] <ali1234> ocean: all you have to do is use gparted to make your windows partition fill up the disk again, then boot up windows and put in the ubutu install cd, and it will offer you the wubi install
[21:33] <dwatkins> What would you like to achieve, jacobw? Multiple bootable operating systems on your machine, i.e. separate windows and linux partitions?
[21:34] <jacobw> dwatkins: jacobw > ocean
[21:34] <dwatkins> oh sorry
[21:34] <dwatkins> I was reading this discussion earlier on then went to cook some food.
[21:34] <dwatkins> ocean: what is your goal?
[21:34] <ali1234> dwatkins: yeah, dual boot is desired, but current windows install is using all 4 primary partitions
[21:35] <dwatkins> oh wow
[21:35] <dwatkins> I guess having Linux kjust bootable from a USB stick or SD card is either too slow or otherwise not practical on this machine.
[21:35] <ali1234> windows 7 uses two primary partitions, the other two are "recovery" and "hp tools" and we're not about to recommend deleting either of those :)
[21:36] <dwatkins> agreed, ali1234
[21:36] <dwatkins> So I guess wubi is the way forward, as it uses a file inside an NTFS partition as the linux root disk, iirc.
[21:39] <dwatkins> popey: can you not just tar-up and un-tar the entire filesystem in a piped commandline to move from wubi to a separate partition, or do you mean it's difficult to replace the partition itself?
[21:39] <popey> dwatkins: what you describe is not "simple"
[21:40] <dwatkins> popey: oh ok, I've done it before to clone disks with tar and dump etc.
[21:40] <popey> sure, me too
[21:41] <dwatkins> I forget how complex some things actually are.
[21:55] <czajkowski> hmm
[22:12] <Gizmo_the_Great> Hey all. Just wondering if you guys know how I can get involved with the role of making kids more aware of Linux when I'm not actually part of any volunteer groups or schools? I've posted a thread (http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=10305049#post10305049) but thought I'd better ask here as we're a UK team.
[22:18] <ocean> hi dwatkins
[22:18] <ocean> u there
[22:18] <czajkowski> Gizmo_the_Great: have you looked locally at schools
[22:19] <czajkowski> Gizmo_the_Great: talk to them and see if you can talk to the kids who may do an computer module in class?
[22:20] <Gizmo_the_Great> czajkowski: I thought about that, but (maybe I'm being pessimistic) if I ring up several schools in my area and say "Hi, I'm Mr X and I'd like to help make your kids aware about alternative operating systems" aren't they just gonna hang up on me?
[22:21] <czajkowski> Gizmo_the_Great: some of them may look at dfferent alternaives. Have you looked at CLCs I dont know what age bracket you're looking at
[22:21] <Gizmo_the_Great> And in addition, I work full time so would not likely be able to get to them at the time they are in school, which is why I was thinking more on the lines of volunteer groups who run in the evenings
[22:22] <Gizmo_the_Great> CLCs?
[22:22] <czajkowski> Gizmo_the_Great: city learning centers
[22:22] <Gizmo_the_Great> Oh right - no, I will Google them
[22:23] <czajkowski> Gizmo_the_Great: post to the UK mailing lists, they may have more of an idea than myself, sorry.
[22:25] <Gizmo_the_Great> OK, might do. Incidentally, have just found this (http://www.adult-learning-derby.org.uk/images/pdf/courses2011.pdf) but it relates more to adult education than children.
[22:25] <DJones> Gizmo_the_Great: YOu could also get in touch with your local LUG (Linux User Group) they might already have some things in place
[22:26] <Gizmo_the_Great> DJones: good idea. I am a memeber though I must confess to never having met up.
[22:26] <czajkowski> Gizmo_the_Great: where are you based?
[22:26] <Gizmo_the_Great> Derby
[22:26] <Gizmo_the_Great> Midlands
[22:28] <DJones> Maybe another suggestion could be to contact your local education department at the council
[22:33] <PhilT> http://opensourceschools.org.uk/technicians-view.html a S Derby guy
[22:39] <Gizmo_the_Great> PhilT An excellent link. I will contact him :-) That should be a good lead and maybe I can join him
[22:45] <brobostigon> nos da, sleep well.
[22:48] <jacobw2> if i register a domain with uk2.net can i use it with bytemark hosting?
[22:49] <popey> i personally wouldn't register a domain with uk2.net if you paid me
[22:49] <jacobw2> why is that?
[22:49] <jacobw2> (still, can it be done?)
[22:49] <popey> i dont trust them
[22:50] <popey> haven't for a long time
[22:50]  * Nafallo has almost all his domains transferred to gandi at this point.
[22:50] <dwatkins> domainexpress are pretty good
[22:51] <dwatkins> Clearly this is just my opinion, your mileage may vary etc. remember to always read the label, batteries not included.
[22:52] <Nafallo> hmm. they have a xmassy girl on their frontpage. not sure I believe she's the one taking care of the domains...
[23:01] <jacobw2> as far as i understand, you register a domain then you can point it at any ip address you like
[23:02] <popey> basically yes
[23:02] <popey> you register a domain, point it at some name servers, maintain the zone and point one or more records at a host/ip
[23:09] <jacobw2> what does 'maintain the zone' mean?
[23:12] <popey> your provider will usually have some kind of control panel which lets you maintain the zone file
[23:12] <Nafallo> vim
[23:12] <Nafallo> :-)
[23:18] <dwatkins> or let them host the dns
[23:19] <jacobw2> i've had a look at a few, i've decided to use Gandi
[23:22] <Nafallo> good choice
[23:22] <dwatkins> Best to make an informed decision after research.
[23:30] <jacobw2> yeah, i'll do some more research on gandi/bytemark in next few days
[23:30] <Nafallo> gandi has interesting stuff I want to test, but I lack ideas of what could be a good testcase :-P
[23:37] <dwatkins> Nafallo: reverse proxy based on subdirectories, perhaps?
[23:37] <jacobw2> test case == victim customers ?
[23:41] <Nafallo> dwatkins: automagic upscaling of vpses based on load, payable by the hour
[23:41] <Nafallo> well, up- and downscaling