[11:07] <rsalveti> morning
[11:07] <rsalveti> ogra: getting back to work I believe the main issue for getting images is the u-boot mkimage transition
[11:08] <rsalveti> for some reason people decided to remove it first before fixing the archive
[11:08] <rsalveti> to be faster than debian, but this is still being discussed there
[11:09] <rsalveti> ogra: and something would be good to have a final conclusion is the kernel for omap 3, and trying to use the linaro one
[11:09] <rsalveti> if not this week, at least let's have a discussion next one
[11:10] <janimo> do pandaboard wlan work on natty? I installed the mavertick packages from TI PPA but they don;t seem to work (no chip found by modprobe)
[11:10] <ogra> rsalveti, i'd like to solve it this week
[11:10] <ogra> depending on workload
[11:11] <rsalveti> yeah
[11:11] <ogra> for mkimage we're waiting for the MIR
[11:11] <ogra> i agree, it was bad to remove uboot-mkimage first, complain to lool
[11:11] <rsalveti> janimo: hm, I believe you need to get a new wlan package
[11:11] <ogra> not that the images did build though
[11:12] <rsalveti> well, we got a broken image for days just because of the mkimage mess
[11:12] <rsalveti> the package was removed at 12-14
[11:12] <ogra> yep
[11:12] <rsalveti> but yeah, still waiting for the MIR
[11:13] <rsalveti> janimo: try using https://launchpad.net/~tiomap-dev/+archive/omap-trunk
[11:14] <rsalveti> ogra: another thing is that I got a new x-loader package for omap 3 and omap 4, and will try to update it this week
[11:14] <rsalveti> the good thing is that I'm building both from the same sources
[11:14] <rsalveti> so one less package at the archive
[11:15] <lool> ogra: Why complain to me?
[11:16] <rsalveti> janimo: http://omappedia.org/wiki/Ubuntu_OMAP_trunk
[11:16] <janimo> rsalveti: thanks. upgrading to that PPA now
[11:16] <rsalveti> janimo: ti updated most packages for 10.10
[11:16] <rsalveti> but natty is using the same kernel
[11:16] <rsalveti> janimo: you may need a new x-loader
[11:16] <janimo> rsalveti: hmm, does that affect the wlan chip?
[11:16] <rsalveti> if you're using the latest natty's kernel
[11:16] <lool> ogra: I didn't trigger the mkimage issues; the packages were automatically imported from Debian
[11:17] <janimo> am using 35- 1001 I think
[11:17] <rsalveti> janimo: not directly I believe, but it's good to use the new x-loader with latest kernel
[11:17] <lool> ogra: I just noticed because I have mkimage on my laptop and I saw the uboot-mkimage package as obsolete after an upgrade
[11:18] <ogra> hmm, so removals happen automatically ?
[11:18] <janimo> rsalveti: but uBoot actually uses the kernel image on the first partition, and regardless of what I upgrade to on / that kernel is used still right?
[11:18] <ogra> i thought that needs manual action
[11:18] <ogra> then i dont blame you :)
[11:18] <rsalveti> I believe it was manually removed
[11:18] <rsalveti> but it wasn't lool
[11:18] <lool> ogra: I have no idea whether they happen automatically; I didn't request removal, and I'm not an archive admin
[11:19] <rsalveti> janimo: yes, but after a kernel update the flash-kernel tool is called
[11:19] <rsalveti> and then it upgrades the kernel from the first partition
[11:19] <janimo> ah, ok
[11:19] <janimo> did not know that
[11:23] <rsalveti> lool: ogra: bug 674904
[11:23] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 674904 in uboot-mkimage (Ubuntu) "Please remove uboot-mkimage from the archive (affects: 1) (heat: 77)" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/674904
[11:26]  * ogra rants a bit on that bug
[11:27] <ogra> asac, are you still active in the MIR team (i.e. could you approve u-boot) ?
[11:30] <asac> ogra: is that upstream u-boot?
[11:31]  * asac thought we already had some u-boot in main
[11:31] <hrw> I even made a patch for u-boot to ship uboot-mkimage transitional
[11:32] <hrw> http://pastebin.com/g49n8Jde
[11:32] <lool> asac: it's upstream u-boot
[11:32] <asac> ogra: bug id please
[11:33] <hrw> lool: can you finally review it?
[11:33] <lool> asac: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/u-boot/+bug/692613
[11:33] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 692613 in u-boot (Ubuntu) "[MIR] u-boot (affects: 1) (heat: 509)" [Undecided,New]
[11:33] <ogra> bug 692613
[11:33] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 692613 in u-boot (Ubuntu) "[MIR] u-boot (affects: 1) (heat: 509)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/692613
[11:33] <lool> hrw: Ah right; I have it in my TODO for a while, I wanted to fix some small things and fix the i386 build issue as well, but didn't get to it before the break; sorry about that
[11:34] <hrw> lool: happens. next time I will request bugs/reviews probably so others could look too
[11:34] <lool> asac: uboot-mkimage was in main, and uboot-envtools is in main; uboot-mkimage is gone and was a fork of the upstream u-boot code
[11:35] <asac> lool: ftbfs on i386
[11:35] <asac> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/u-boot/2010.12~rc2-1ubuntu1
[11:35] <lool> hrw: Note that the package name will change too, so I expect we will have to do another round
[11:35] <lool> asac: I've noted that in the MIR
[11:35] <asac> lool: does this ship anything besides uboot-mkimage?
[11:35] <asac> e.g. any u-boot bootloader?
[11:35] <lool> asac: Yes; it ships u-boot
[11:35] <lool> asac: but we don't use these images
[11:36] <lool> the Debian maintainer is semi-convinced that we need to split mkimage in a separate package
[11:36] <asac> lool: so no: http://paste.ubuntu.com/549796/
[11:36] <lool> This is discussed in http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=594937
[11:36] <ubot2> Debian bug 594937 in u-boot "u-boot: Create binary package for each supported machine instead of for each architecture" [Wishlist,Open]
[11:36] <asac> not a single relevant bootloader for ubuntu ;)
[11:37] <ogra> nah
[11:37] <lool> asac: It's the Debian package
[11:37] <asac> couldnt we at least produce omap3 from that source?
[11:37] <ogra> theoretically we could
[11:37] <lool> asac: I don't see any harm in keeping whatever Debian maintains; we don't care about the bootloader bits
[11:37] <rsalveti> but we're using the linaro one for that
[11:37] <ogra> right
[11:38] <rsalveti> for both omap 3 and omap 4
[11:38] <lool> I don't see why we should move away of Linaro's u-boot
[11:39] <ogra> we would have two omap source packages again (linaro omap4 and debian omap3) it would somehow defeat the purpose of unifying but techincally we could indeed build the omap3 binary
[11:39] <ogra> and i belive there is work going on in debian to actually do that
[11:39] <asac> i would prefer to wait for u-boot-tools to arrive from debian ... until then couldnt we just use one of our existing u-boot packages to provide mkimage
[11:40]  * ogra remembers a discussion about building official debian omap3 kernels, they will for sure also build bootloaders if they do that
[11:40] <lool> asac: Well, we could split u-boot in two in the way that we anticipate Debian to do it and provide the patch
[11:40] <asac> right
[11:40] <asac> thats fine with me
[11:41] <lool> and by we, I obviously don't specifically mean me  :-)
[11:42] <guerby> rsalveti, hi and happy new year :)
[11:42] <rsalveti> guerby: hey!
[11:42] <rsalveti> happy new year!
[11:42] <guerby> rsalveti, my pandaboard still freeze every few days, did you get any feedback from TI on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux-ti-omap4/+bug/690370 ?
[11:42] <ubot2> Launchpad bug 690370 in linux-ti-omap4 (Ubuntu) "Strange out of memory on pandaboard (affects: 1) (heat: 202)" [Undecided,New]
[11:43] <rsalveti> guerby: ti is getting back to work today too, so I expect something this week
[11:43] <guerby> rsalveti, ok great! thanks for your work on this. I'm still  hoping to put the pandaboard online :)
[11:43] <rsalveti> guerby: sure, will try to do some work on this bug this week
[11:44] <ian_brasil> my membership of ubuntu-mobile is due to expire - is this team deprecated now?
[11:46] <ogra> yep
[11:46] <ogra> if you are intrested in arm work, there is ubuntu-armel
[11:50]  * hrw will look at uboot/i386 ftfbs
[11:51] <ogra> hrw, i doubt thats easily solveable without a package split
[11:52] <lool> hrw: see u-boot mailing-list
[11:52] <lool> hrw: I propose two fixes; the maintainer of the board says he is working on sending the patc h
[11:52] <lool> hrw: I think we should just send two patches
[11:52] <hrw> lool: official uboot ml one?
[11:53] <lool> hrw: Yes
[11:53] <lool> hrw: MID 20101220111358.GA28532@bee.dooz.org
[11:55] <hrw> lool: author name would be better...
[11:55] <hrw> gmane lacks mid search
[12:46] <lool> hrw: It does have it
[12:46] <lool> hrw: http://mid.gmane.org/20101220111358.GA28532%40bee.dooz.org
[12:52] <hrw> ok, thx
[17:35] <aksh1> hi all , i have downloaded  http://rcn-ee.net/deb/rootfs/maverick/ubuntu-10.10-r3-minimal-armel.tar.7z
[17:36] <aksh1> how to install unity in that
[17:36] <aksh1> to create a netbook image
[17:39] <rsalveti> aksh1: if you're using this rootfs already then you just need to install unity, but it doesn't work that well with GL ES
[17:41] <aksh1> rsalveti, then do i need to do any changes ?
[17:41] <rsalveti> aksh1: you need to install the unity package
[17:42] <aksh1> rsalveti, but you told that it doesn't work well
[17:42] <aksh1> with GL ES
[17:43] <rsalveti> aksh1: sure, I wouldn't recommend to use it with gl es
[17:43] <rsalveti> you can, but it's very slow and crashes a lot
[17:43] <rsalveti> that will be fixed for natty
[17:43] <aksh1> rsalveti, what will be the best
[17:44] <rsalveti> for now on arm the efl netbook interface is the best option
[17:44] <rsalveti> or other wm like xfce
[17:44] <aksh1> rsalveti, how about lxde
[17:44] <aksh1> which is good better performance  in xfce4 and lxde
[17:45] <rsalveti> aksh1: could be, just never tried
[17:45] <ogra> ion surely has the better performance ;)
[17:46] <rsalveti> I'd use evilwm
[17:46] <rsalveti> :P
[17:46] <ogra> heh
[17:47] <aksh1> evilwm ?
[17:47]  * ogra always loved wm2 
[17:47] <rsalveti> evilwm is a very minimal wm
[17:47] <rsalveti> you can only open a terminal with it hehe
[17:48] <rsalveti> and move it
[17:48] <ogra> wm2 already has a tasklist
[17:48] <ogra> and shiny window decorations
[17:49] <ogra> ogra@ac100:~$ apt-cache show wm2|grep -i size
[17:49] <ogra> Installed-Size: 116
[17:49] <ogra> Size: 33096
[17:49] <ogra> ogra@ac100:~$ apt-cache show evilwm|grep -i size
[17:49] <ogra> Installed-Size: 96
[17:49] <ogra> Size: 30236
[17:49] <ogra> hmm, but evilwm wins the size battle
[17:49] <aksh1> rsalveti, i am looking a wm with full fledged gui to test utouch
[17:49] <rsalveti> ogra: ;-)
[17:50] <ogra> i guess you cant have bling without paying for it ;)
[17:51] <ogra> aksh1, then take the efl launcher
[18:00] <janimo> GrueMaster: I get banshee UI coming up over ssh -X and I can use the menus. no crash so far
[18:00]  * janimo has just started banshee for the first time ever
[18:00] <GrueMaster> Interesting.
[18:00] <janimo> last liune in the log is [Info  19:58:16.396] nereid Client Started
[18:01] <janimo> so right before you see the exception
[18:01] <janimo> this is an up-todate natty on pandaboard
[18:03] <GrueMaster> same here/
[18:03] <GrueMaster> Will try normal desktop to see if it is a netbook-ui issue.
[18:10] <GrueMaster> Nope, still fails.  Different error though, but I suspect the root is the same.
[18:12] <ogra> did you wash your fingers before firing it up ? its very fragile ;)
[18:12] <janimo> GrueMaster: so you can reproduce on panda/natty too?
[18:12] <GrueMaster> This is panda/natty.
[18:12] <janimo> ok
[18:12] <janimo> within seconds from startup?
[18:12] <GrueMaster> yes.
[18:13] <janimo> can you check if it crashes with ssh -X too?
[18:13] <janimo> not that it should be much of a difference
[18:13] <GrueMaster> It doesn't stay up long enough to use the menus.  Will try ssh -x.
[18:13] <janimo> just to make sure I can try reproduce without pulling out the HDMI cable
[18:13] <janimo> which means no dual monitor on my workstation :D
[18:13] <GrueMaster> Also, I am not getting any window frames in classic desktop mode.
[18:14] <GrueMaster> (different issue).
[18:15] <ogra> GrueMaster, remove maximus or disable it in the session settings
[18:15] <ogra> i thought i had solved that one in maverick
[18:15] <ogra> is that a maverick->natty upgrade ?
[18:15] <ogra> or a plain natty install
[18:16] <janimo> FYI mine is a natty image made with rootstock
[18:17] <ogra> ah
[18:17] <ogra> dont trust rootstock
[18:17] <ogra> its as close as possible to a real install, but after all not identical
[18:19] <rsalveti> ogra: alsa-utils is still broken :-)
[18:19] <rsalveti> another package to fix soon
[18:19] <ogra> yeah
[18:19] <ogra> first images ... then packages
[18:19] <rsalveti> sure
[18:19] <ogra> i also have a broken shadow to fix and doko slowly gets nasty
[18:20] <GrueMaster> ogra: This is the last natty image prior to mkimage snafu, updated to latest packages.
[18:20] <ogra> k
[18:20] <ogra> thx
[18:20] <ogra> that should have the fixed maximus
[18:20] <ogra> keep the pieces until next week and i'll take a look
[18:21] <janimo> ogra: rootstock is recommened in the wiki, it is no longer to be used?
[18:21] <rsalveti> janimo: it's ok to use it
[18:21] <janimo> are there better ways to do the same?
[18:21] <rsalveti> but while reproducing issues, the best option is to use the preinstalled image
[18:21] <janimo> ok
[18:21] <ogra> janimo, rootstock is o for building for unsupported HW, for test and development images, but you will only get 100% identical results on the real images
[18:21] <ogra> s/o/ok/
[18:22] <rsalveti> just because the supported images are the preinstalled ones
[18:22] <janimo> I used rsalveti's instructions to have / on an external USB drive so could not really use the preinstalled image
[18:22] <ogra> there is no guarantee that rootstock builds 100% the same as we do with the preinstalled image
[18:22] <ogra> s
[18:22] <janimo> it is much much faster this way that on SD card
[18:23] <janimo> well probabaly not the same, but for individual user space app testing I think there should be no differences
[18:23] <rsalveti> janimo: sure, while debugging and building stuff the usb disk usage is the best option
[18:23] <rsalveti> but while reproducing and testing bugs, try using the preinstalled one
[18:23] <ogra> the setup might differ
[18:23] <aksh1> i have installed plymouth and updated initrd using update-initramfs -u
[18:23] <aksh1> do i need to change boot commandline
[18:23] <ogra> rootstock doesnt track what changes are in oem-config for example
[18:23] <aksh1> mem=512M console=ttyS2,115200n8 console=tty0 omapfb.mode=dvi:hd720-24@60 root=/dev/mmcblk0p2 rw rootwait  is my commandline
[18:24] <ogra> so if you use rootstock and set up a user from cmdline, your user setup might be different
[18:24] <ogra> the way we build the image with rootstock isnt 100% identicaql to livecd-rootfs so fixes that go in there might not be in rootstock
[18:24] <ogra> etc etc
[18:25] <ogra> aksh1, add quiet and splash as keywords
[18:26] <ogra> and make sure your boot setup uses the uInitrd indeed
[18:28] <aksh1> ogra, i am not sure uInitrd updated one is used while booting
[18:29] <aksh1> bcoz default initrd will get updated in /boot/ folder and beagleboard has other /boot partition
[18:30] <ogra> any reason why you didnt use one of the official netbook images for the beagle ?
[18:30] <ogra> you wouldnt have to fiddle with that now
[18:31] <aksh1> ogra, want to know how to create similar image
[18:33] <ogra> well, the same things i wrote for janimo above apply to these images since they are built with rootstock ... they are "similar" but not identical
[18:33] <GrueMaster> ogra: I looked at the image and maximus is not running while in classic desktop.  I have plenty of SD cards, so I will preserve this one for you to eval.
[18:33] <ogra> things like the bootloader setup definitely differ heavily
[18:34] <ogra> GrueMaster, weird, maximus isnt running but you dont get window borders either ?
[18:35] <GrueMaster> nope.
[18:35] <ogra> sounds more like metacity being broken
[18:35] <ogra> unless
[18:35] <ogra> hmm
[18:35] <ogra> i heard roumors that metacity would be dropped in favor of a 2D compiz
[18:35] <ogra> not sure what the status on that is
[18:37] <GrueMaster> ogra: http://members.dsl-only.net/~tdavis/Screenshot.png
[18:43] <GrueMaster> Apparently, compiz is the registered WM currently running.
[18:44] <ogra> aha
[18:44] <ogra> so thats likely a 2D compiz bug then
[18:44] <ogra> i think the code is very very young
[18:45] <davidm> ogra, http://www.viewsonic.com/gtablet/spec.htm
[18:45] <GrueMaster> must be.  There is no compiz-config utility installed.  grrr,
[18:46] <ogra> davidm, hmm, sounds like the folio you can buy here
[18:47] <rsalveti> interesting
[18:47] <aksh1> ogra, after adding quiet splash it is giving kernel panic
[18:47] <aksh1> http://pastebin.com/6xyZksqq
[18:47] <ogra> if its the same, it is overpriced, very bad android adaptions, very bad touchscreen
[18:48] <GrueMaster> I was emailed info on this:  http://www.tangent-tycoon.com
[18:48] <rsalveti> very bad android adaptations is kind of expected
[18:48] <rsalveti> but not a bad touchscreen
[18:48] <GrueMaster> I asked if we could get some eval units to install a real OS, but no reply.
[18:48] <rsalveti> GrueMaster: very very ugly hehe :-)
[18:49] <rsalveti> ubuntu should be a lot better
[18:49] <GrueMaster> 120GB HD.  2Gb ram.  Just to run Win7 POS edition.
[18:50] <rsalveti> ouch
[18:50]  * rsalveti takes a break
[18:50]  * ogra thinks the galaxy is the only serious ipad competitor atm
[18:51] <GrueMaster> 1.87 lbs.  I think my netbook is lighter.
[18:51] <ogra> yeah
[18:51] <ogra> mine surely is (700grams)
[18:51] <ogra> :)
[18:53] <GrueMaster> Heh.  To get the extended battery version, you have to buy it with Win7 Pro.
[18:53] <GrueMaster> $100 difference.
[18:53] <GrueMaster> $595 or $695.