/srv/irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/01/11/#ubuntu-beginners.txt

eviljamesheheh00:00
eviljamesRed-Raven: no worries, start reading the documentation, it'll be more clear than I am anyway :D00:00
eviljameshave fun00:00
Red-Raveni will:)00:00
nit-witnatty , natty , natty00:10
ChrisDruifnit-wit: What's with natty?00:11
nit-witChrisDruif, just having fun at others exspese.:)00:11
ChrisDruifExpanse? :P00:12
stlsaintChrisDruif: sup00:12
eviljameslvm / raid / ubuntu experts around?00:12
ChrisDruifUbuntu experts? :P00:14
eviljames*shrug* if there is such a thing ;)00:14
nit-witopps installed compiz and lost the desktop it is back. *exspense was the word of the day00:15
pigy1_althow can i update flash player, cant watch utube via firefox00:18
johnny77Is anyone familiar with Openbox? I'm playing around with setting up a Openbox session.00:51
ChrisDruifjohnny77: You might be better off in #lubuntu seeing LXDE uses OpenBox :)00:52
johnny77ChrisDruif: I have LXDE installed and like it, but noticed that I could login to an "Openbox Session". Not knowing what that was I Googled it. Now I have no idea if I should be using LXDE, Gnome/Openbox, Openbox, or try Blackbox or Fluxbox.00:54
ChrisDruifOpenBox is just one part of the Desktop Environment :) (Bit late and a few beers too many to remember what it exactly does :P)00:57
ChrisDruifLemma check what is does again :P00:57
ChrisDruifAhh...Window Managers :D00:58
ChrisDruifHere you've got a comparison of the WM's in Linux: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_window_managers00:59
ChrisDruifDefault Gnome uses Metacity :) In Ubuntu is Compiz installed as well :)01:00
ChrisDruifBut it's all your own preference :)01:00
* JackyAlcine be bracck01:01
* hajour giggles his idea s?01:02
hajouroops wrong chat01:02
ChrisDruifxD01:03
ChrisDruifjohnny77: Don't mind those two for once :)01:03
ChrisDruifjohnny77: Did that help you anything?01:06
johnny77ChrisDruif: Yeah, it helped.... I know a lot has to do with preference, but I really don't want to install them all, just to see which I liked. Being new to Ubuntu I'm not sure how it's all put together. Is it better to run LXDE or just openbox? What do I loose if I just run openbox?01:08
ChrisDruifDid you install LXDE or Lubuntu? :)01:08
johnny77ChanServ: I just don't know how all the pieces of the puzzle fit together.01:09
johnny77ChrisDruif: LXDE01:09
johnny77ChrisDruif: oops, that last that one post was supposed to go to you Chris. :)01:09
ChrisDruifYeah, I guessed it was :P01:10
ChrisDruifAs was noticed on that comparison site I gave you is LXDE by default shipped with Xfwm, a compositing window manager...01:11
ChrisDruifCompositing wm's can do all sorts of things with windows, instead of just showing them side-by-side, cascaded etc....they can do things like Wobbly Windows (morphing and what-not)... ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compositing_window_manager )01:14
ChrisDruifThis is apposed to OpenBox, which only allows stacking (few more things as well) ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stacking_window_manager )01:15
ChrisDruifSo that would be the trade-off :)01:16
=== JackyAlcine is now known as webjadmin
ChrisDruifI must say only Compix is really advanced in manipulating windows (Wobbly Windows, transparency etc)01:16
johnny77ChrisDruif: When I installed LXDE from the Software Center, it installed Openbox as the WM.01:17
ChrisDruifOw...then Wikipedia must be out of date or something :)01:17
=== webjadmin is now known as JackyAlcine
ChrisDruifHere is a small explanation about what a Desktop Environment means in Unix-systems: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desktop_environment#Desktop_environments_for_the_X_Window_System01:18
nit-witjohnny77, look n synaptic with lxde and see if it installed, U would avois the software center it misses dependencies, and you can't see all that is being installed.01:21
nit-wit*in01:21
ChrisDruifnit-wit: You can select to see "technical" packages in USC :P01:22
ChrisDruifBut when searching, I do prefer synaptic thou O:-)01:23
nit-witChrisDruif, that may be so but synaptic all around is a better learning environment it has more applicability.01:23
johnny77nit-wit: XFWM is not installed on my computer. If that is what you wanted me to check.01:23
nit-witjohnny77, I just run in a terminal sudo apt-get install lxde,01:24
johnny77nit-wit: I'm not trying to be difficult, but why?01:25
ChrisDruifAlright my lovelies, you've found each other...I'll leave you two alone :)01:25
nit-witjohnny77, that is the way I do it as I know I have the repositories open, and I'm a exsperienced user.01:25
ChrisDruifOff to bed :)01:25
johnny77ChrisDruif: bye01:26
nit-witChrisDruif, mmmmmmm:)01:26
johnny77nit-wit: oh, ok... I've installed programs with terminal and am working on getting more familiar with it.01:26
nit-witjohnny77, open box may have been installed already but you didn't get the lxde meta package not sure01:27
nit-witjohnny77, it takes awhile I started with computer only 4 years ago, but with open source01:27
johnny77nit-wit: Yes, I have the LXDE meta package installed.01:28
apehedHello, I have a question. I have a computer which runs an old version of debian linux. I need to use an Asus-PCI-G31 (RaLink RT2561/RT61 802.11g PCI) wifi card instead of ethernet on this computer now. I am unable to get it working on debian. If I burn the ubuntu cd, will it automatically work? I am thinking of just installing ubuntu on the computer instead.01:34
nit-witjohnny77, so the desktop I forget what it is called at the login window isn't in the bottom bar.01:43
red-paladin2Sorry I am apehed I lost my connection I was hoping someone could let me know if I install ubuntu 10.10 if I could use my asus ralink card out of the box01:48
JackyAlcineThere's a chance; you should check if the card's supported by Linux.01:49
red-paladin2I know it is01:50
nit-witred-paladin2, http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en#hl=en&site=webhp&&sa=X&ei=OrcrTaz1EIzg4wbLsc2ZCg&sqi=2&ved=0CBcQvwUoAQ&q=asus+ralink+card+maverick+meerkat&spell=1&fp=ad508277c3b23a0601:51
nit-witred-paladin2, seems to need a bit of tweaking from what I read01:51
JackyAlcineThen it shall.01:53
st33med11.04: coming soon awwwright...01:53
red-paladin2Thanks for the reply01:56
red-paladin2so just to confirm, if I burn a cd of ubuntu-10.10-desktop-i386.iso, use that to install the system, It should automatically be able to use the card as easy as a windows PC? I just have to follow those instructions if it won't shut off?01:57
JackyAlcineHopefully.02:01
red-paladin2:)02:02
nit-witred-paladin2, it looks like it may not just be plug and play did you look at the google links?02:08
red-paladin2yeah I did02:13
red-paladin2there is a lot of conflicting info02:13
frank1_anyone know if orb can be run through virtual box?02:13
frank1_or of another linux program that i can use to access my tunes from my blackberry?02:14
red-paladin2supposedly yamipod works02:15
red-paladin2but I have no experience so don't listen to me :(02:15
frank1_ill listen to anyone at this point02:16
frank1_i dont have a computer at work and the only internet i have is my berry02:16
nit-witred-paladin2, I think the advice of trying the live cd is a good start.:)02:17
red-paladin2ok02:17
frank1_i want to be able to play my music through a stereo and ipods just dont offer the storage space i require02:17
red-paladin2thanks02:17
red-paladin2nit-wit, thanks. I hope this works I'm in big trouble if not :((( I thank you for your help02:21
Red-Ravenhey. what have you guys been discussing?02:22
nit-witred-paladin2, good luck use the Ubuntu Forums a well if needed02:23
frank1_well im trying to find an orb alternative02:23
frank1_with no such luck02:23
frank1_wanted to try running it through vb but now that wont even open02:24
Red-Raven_network connection had to restart to install virtual box.02:24
Red-Raven_ooh your using VB to?02:25
Red-Raven_im setting it up for the first time today.02:25
frank1_i have been using virtual box for a while but today when i boot up its not wanting to work02:25
red-paladin2Going to reboot and try it, see you nit-wit02:25
nit-witred-paladin2, see yah.:)02:26
Red-Raven_um, ok i did something wrong with VB. i set it up like it told me to, but for some reason it never asked for the ISO. so of course, it said fatal error: no bootable disk or something. so how do i point it towards the ISO file on my desktop?02:32
Red-Ravenanyone know whats going on?02:38
nit-witRed-Raven, use the setting on the made machine and add the ISO in staorage click on the ISO picture and look to the right of the screen and navigate to the ISO. Shabang02:46
nit-wit*storage02:46
nit-witRed-Raven, settings is in the top bar set the display in settings to 128mib all the way to the right as well02:48
nit-witbrb02:48
nit-witRed-Raven, did you see my post on loading the SO02:59
nit-wit*ISO02:59
Red-Raven_no sry.03:09
nit-witRed-Raven_,  use the setting on the made machine and add the ISO in staorage click on the ISO picture and look to the right of the screen and navigate to the ISO03:11
nit-witRed-Raven_,  settings is in the top bar set the display in settings to 128mib all the way to the right as well03:11
Red-Raven_IDE controler?03:12
nit-witRed-Raven_, open the settings do yo see that03:14
nit-wit*you03:14
Red-Raven_says detected i686 CPU needs a 64 bit. unable to boot. im running a 64 bit.03:15
Red-Raven_(i did what u said)03:15
Red-Raven_also said use kernal appropriate for CPU.03:15
nit-witRed-Raven_, not sure but isn't that a 32 bit not sure about that.03:15
Red-Raven_im dual-booting a 64 bit. VB should run it.03:16
nit-witRed-Raven_, when do you get this error and your sure your loading the from the cd icon?03:17
gnumerousubuntu 10.04. how do i configure my wireless modem to not start when i turn my computer on?03:17
nit-witgnumerous, I would try #ubuntu03:17
Red-Raven_yes. i get it when i boot up the virtual machine.03:17
nit-witRed-Raven_, let me look on google03:18
gnumerousnit-wit: okay, thanks03:18
Red-Raven_...unplug ur modem? idk.03:18
Red-Raven_*im new. just tying to help03:18
nit-witRed-Raven_, it looks as it should work open the setting and set the ide to ICH^03:20
nit-wit*ICH603:20
Red-Raven_ok03:21
Red-Raven_what ever that is, it wasn't there03:22
nit-witRed-Raven_, from this page Warning03:23
nit-witOn any host, you should enable the I/O APIC for virtual machines that you intend to use in 64-bit mode. This is especially true for 64-bit Windows VMs. See the section called “"Advanced" tab”. In addition, for 64-bit Windows guests, you should make sure that the VM uses the Intel networking device, since there is no 64-bit driver support for the AMD PCNet card; see the section called “Virtual networking hardware”.http://ww03:23
nit-witw.virtualbox.org/manual/ch03.html03:23
nit-witRed-Raven_, it is the right panel but take a look at the page03:23
Red-Raven_k hold on03:24
nit-witRed-Raven_, you might try a 32 bit to get orientated it looks like the 64bit is a bit of a setup. I have only used the 32bit.03:24
Red-Raven_ok. found the ich6 but same result.03:26
nit-witRed-Raven_, I haven't used the 64 bit so thats about it from my exsperience the 32 bit has always worked for me.03:27
Red-Raven_32 worked. wonder why 64 didn't.03:27
Red-Raven_its up! will i have to install to save files?03:29
nit-witRed-Raven_, it looks from that page that it needs some more adjustment, there is a virtualbox channel I think hold on03:29
Red-Raven_sok, i need to get to bed. but thx for all the help!03:30
nit-witRed-Raven_, #vbox03:30
nit-witRed-Raven_, cool take it easy.:)\03:30
Red-Raven_thx. ill save it.03:30
nit-witRed-Raven_, 233 people listed probably get some answers.03:33
serg_hi all. is there any outcome: I have toshiba L655 laptop with hm55 mobile intel chipset. ACPI no recognized. tried all kernels up to 37 rc2 with ubunu 10.1004:03
serg_no battery. no sensors ...etc04:03
JackyAlcine:D04:26
Cheri703if I wanted to remove only files with a certain ending, could I do a rm -R *.bak ? would that get rid of any files in subfolders with that extension?04:27
terrorinbionope04:28
terrorinbioas you dont have folders with Ãnames foooo.bak04:28
terrorinbioI do sometimes rm -rf *.r* a I am deleting rar files ,)04:29
Cheri703why not .rar?04:30
terrorinbiobecouse rar pakes r01 r02 r03... packages too04:30
terrorinbiomakes04:30
Cheri703gotcha04:31
terrorinbioif you feel unsure about removing so many files with a hmmm04:31
Cheri703I guess I'm looking for an rm equivalent of "copy-contents"04:31
terrorinbiowhat was that word04:31
terrorinbiowild card04:31
terrorinbioyou can press tabkey and it will change the *.bak into a list of files that's going to be removed04:32
terrorinbioatleast a smart shell would do i04:32
terrorinbiodo it04:32
Cheri703hmm...ok04:32
Cheri703well, I have a few hundred folders I want it to go through...04:32
Cheri703and it doesn't want to :/04:32
terrorinbio:D04:33
terrorinbioput some music on and enjoy deleting :D04:34
st33med:D04:34
terrorinbiothat could be done with a shell script, find blaa |grep *.bak and then rm what it finds04:35
terrorinbio:D04:35
Cheri703eh, I went back to my other way: did a search, ctrl a, del, hold enter for a while, wait for it to catch up, hold enter for a while, repeat :)04:36
terrorinbio:D04:36
Cheri703unrelated question: is there a way to find out what version of id3 tags a particular model of ipod supports?04:37
stlsaintnight folks04:37
terrorinbioCheri703, you should have bought sandisk sansa clip or something like that ;)04:39
Cheri703this was free04:39
Cheri703it's an older one04:39
terrorinbiowell, that's my favourite gadget, free gadget04:39
Cheri703exactly, free always matches, and free is always state of the art :D04:39
sergio_salfredeHi. a little bit offtopic) is it possibe to get last 100 messages on channel. If my connection broken I can't check if someone answered my question..04:40
terrorinbiosorry, I wasnt here ;)04:41
Cheri703when was it sergio_salfrede ?04:41
terrorinbiosergio_salfrede, what was your question04:41
terrorinbiomaybe we could help04:41
sergio_salfredeabout hm5504:41
sergio_salfredeintel chipset04:41
IAmNotThatGuysergio_salfrede, if its is official channel, then look at irclogs.ubuntu.com04:41
terrorinbioahhh, nope04:41
terrorinbiohave you googled for toshiba hardware?04:41
JackyAlcineThey need to attach Skype to the Messaging indicator menu.04:42
JackyAlcinesmh.04:42
terrorinbioJackyAlcine, are you going to make skype opensouced?04:42
terrorinbiosourced04:42
JackyAlcineI mean, they have an interactive API.04:44
sergio_salfredeI've found that thread http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1641931&highlight=l65504:44
JackyAlcineand another thing; why can't libnotify show like up to 5 or 6 notifications at a time.04:44
sergio_salfredenot solved04:44
JackyAlcineor even a configurable amount.04:44
JackyAlcinesounds like a job! :D04:44
JoeMaverickSettJackyAlcine: yeah, you should work on them. ;)04:45
sergio_salfredeterrorinbio what does it mean google for toshiba hw ?04:46
sergio_salfredetoshiba doesn't provide any support for linux unfort.04:47
Sayganhello06:24
terrorinbiohi06:24
Sayganim having trouble installing winehq06:24
Saygani installed ubuntu on my laptop- im completely new to all of this- i do not have the drivers to get internet06:25
terrorinbioheini.kuusela-opas@vattenfall.com06:25
terrorinbioasdasdasd06:25
terrorinbiowindows...06:25
Sayganso i am trying to get everything from my desktop (windows 7)06:25
terrorinbiohttps://help.ubuntu.com/community/Wine06:25
terrorinbioyou cant :D06:25
terrorinbiowine aint that great for running windows software06:26
terrorinbioit can run something and it might require some work, but you really should try to seek opensource alternatives for the windows softwares06:26
Sayganah- peachy06:26
Saygangot any better suggestions?06:27
JackyAlcine?06:27
terrorinbioyes06:27
JackyAlcineWhat's the issue, Saygan?06:27
JackyAlcineI heard glass aka Windows.06:27
JackyAlcinelol06:27
terrorinbiorun windows in a virtual computer if you need something from it06:27
terrorinbio*nixes are state of mind06:28
Sayganok I'll try that06:28
terrorinbioyou just gotta let go all those propietary things ;)06:28
terrorinbiobut read that wiki06:28
Sayganjacky- my problem is i need the drivers for my wireless card to work on my laptop- and the drivers are all .exe files06:29
terrorinbioI've played some windows games under wine06:29
terrorinbiosaygan, you should have mentioned that06:29
terrorinbioit's about ndisrwapper06:29
terrorinbiohttps://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/Driver/Ndiswrapper06:30
Sayganhaha i did terror06:30
Sayganooh!06:30
Sayganthanks mate- i'll give this a go06:31
Sayganbugger06:34
Saygandoesn't look like its going to work06:34
Sayganthe driver i need isn't on the list06:35
terrorinbioand your computer is?06:35
terrorinbiohp dell what06:35
terrorinbio?06:35
Sayganhp dv500006:35
SayganRealtek RTL8139/810x Family Fast Ethernet NIC Driver <- driver i need06:36
terrorinbiothat's ethernet06:36
terrorinbionot wireless06:36
Sayganaye- twas hoping that'd be easier to connect ot first06:37
Sayganas for wireless its broadcom06:37
Sayganbut the HP site doesn't give much more a description06:38
terrorinbiohttps://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/Driver/bcm43xx that's for the wireless06:38
Sayganthanks06:39
terrorinbiobut06:39
terrorinbioif you say "ifconfig" in terminal06:39
terrorinbiodo you see eth0?06:39
Sayganone sec- laptop is dying gotta plug it in06:40
Sayganok gimme a sec I'll let you know hwat it says06:43
Saygank got it06:44
Sayganbroadcom BCM431106:44
Sayganok terror- do i type in the command exactly as it is displayed?06:49
terrorinbio3without ""06:49
Sayganbecause if i do it does not work like is says06:49
Sayganok now its working06:50
Sayganmust have typed it wrong- i wasn't getting the PCI- ID06:50
terrorinbiodo you see eth0?06:51
Sayganeth0 in the terminal? no06:53
Saygansorry if i sound stupid but i have never done any of this before06:53
terrorinbioyou have installed ubuntu 10.10?06:54
Saygan10.0406:55
Sayganlucid06:55
terrorinbiomaybe you should try 10.1006:55
terrorinbiogot a newer kernel06:55
Saygank06:56
Sayganwifidocs at least supports the driver i need06:56
MrAnthropeThis may not be exactly ubuntu related. I'm trying to use an app on my Android phone called Remote Transmission to remotely pause/resume torrents in Transmission. I have no idea how to use it.07:39
MrAnthropeI opened Transmission Preferences and went to the Web tab and configured all that.07:39
MrAnthropeand it works in the web page. But not on my app. It just says connection error.07:40
nit-witMrAnthrope, is the IP blocking torrents07:47
MrAnthropeI have authentication turned on and the "allow only this IP address access" turned off.07:47
MrAnthropeI'm not actually trying to torrent on my phone. Just view what I'm torrenting on Transmission.07:48
MrAnthropeOn my PC.07:48
nit-witMrAnthrope, I see hmm I wouldn't know I guess.07:48
MrAnthrope:)07:49
MrAnthropeI'm thinking I have the wrong IP address in my phone to tell it to connect to my PC.07:50
red-paladinhey nit-wit07:55
nit-witred-paladin, hey07:56
red-paladinremember me?07:56
nit-witred-paladin,  I remember the name but not what you were doing07:56
red-paladinwith the asus pci wifi card on the debian disaster box07:57
nit-witred-paladin, the card and the upgrade07:57
nit-witred-paladin, so what did you do07:57
red-paladinyeah. I used the live cd and it worked right on startup07:57
nit-witred-paladin, thats generally a good sign07:58
red-paladinso far no problems at all. even downloaded / installed the OS on the computer over wifi07:58
nit-witred-paladin, the ralink card it's all coming back now07:58
red-paladinit works at my house on my router, so unless something truly bizarre happens, it should connect to his router no problem07:58
nit-witred-paladin, is it a single install no dual booting07:59
red-paladinwell basically I didn't mention the reason I came to bug you guys about it was I had a real tight deadline and assured the guy I would get it working08:00
red-paladinso I just installed an extra HDD in there and installed ubuntu on that08:00
red-paladinonce everything appeared to be working, I copied all the personal files across08:00
red-paladinI wanted to make sure I didn't end up with a failed ubuntu install over a messed up debian08:00
red-paladinI only had one blank CD-R in the house08:01
nit-witred-paladin, sounds good08:01
=== JackyAlcine is now known as webjadmin
=== webjadmin is now known as JackyAlcine
Silver_Fox_Hello.10:10
iktHello Silver_Fox_ :)10:12
Silver_Fox_Hello ikt =)10:13
JackyAlcine:D10:20
jermzaUbuntu recognises my graphic card.  There is even a setting in the System > Admin menu.  When I tweak the colours and quit the application, my screen looks great.  However, Ubuntu doesn't load those settings until I open that app.  How do I make those settings default?11:57
jermzaAnyone?12:04
head_victimjermza: what application?12:05
jermzaNvidia X-server settings12:06
head_victimjermza: most likely due to not running it at root12:06
head_victimjermza: go to a terminal and type in "gksudo nvidia-settings" it will open up the application12:06
head_victimThen make the changes and save it to file and it should hold12:07
jermzaI can open the settings from System > Admin > NVIDIA X Server Settings12:08
head_victimYeah but I have had issues in the past getting it to save as it wasn't runnning as sudo12:08
head_victimIf you use the command line it will open the same app but as a sudo user12:08
ChrisDruifhead_victim: you mean gksudo ;)12:09
ChrisDruifSeeing you want to open an graphical app...12:09
head_victimChrisDruif: yeah gksudo is an implimentation of sudo and the command I used did specify gksudo ;)12:09
head_victimYou joined in late :D12:09
ChrisDruifIndeed I did O:-)12:10
head_victimjermza: did you give that a try?12:12
jermzayes12:12
jermzawill restart and see what happens12:12
* Daniel0108 pushed rev3 (fix) of ERRE13:00
wolfpackRecently I started facing new problem. when I try to run synaptic package manger ...it displays for few seconds then goes off.I tried to collect bug report for it using "ubuntu-bug synapitc" command but the same thing is happening with it also  ...When i try to run it from terminal I am getting SEGMENTAION FAULT Any help on it???13:06
iktheya13:08
iktif you head into the system logs, what error do you see specifically relating to synaptic file manager wolfpack ?13:09
iktis it similar to this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic/+bug/40036213:09
ubot2Launchpad bug 400362 in synaptic (Ubuntu) "Synaptic Package Manager closes with segmentation fault (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Medium,Invalid]13:09
wolfpackikt how to check for sytem logs ...is it /var/log?13:15
wolfpackikt yes it is same as in the BUG provided by you13:19
iktah ok13:21
iktsorry for not responding quicker, the fix is in the launchpad page :)13:21
iktgnights :)13:22
wolfpacki tried it but now i am getting13:23
wolfpackE: Could not open file /var/cache/apt/pkgcache.bin - open (2: No such file or directory) E: _cache->open() failed, please report.13:23
wolfpackikt13:24
* Daniel0108 pushed rev26 of libopenmary13:50
* Daniel0108 pushed rev27 of libopenmary(fix)13:53
mani_my wifi router is not working in ubuntu 10.1016:34
mani_is there anyone to help me out please16:34
Daniel0108hi mani_ :)16:34
mani_Hi bro16:34
Daniel0108what's the problem with your router?16:34
mani_can you help me bro?16:34
mani_i have a wireless router in my house16:34
mani_TP-LINK router. it works fine in windows 716:35
Daniel0108hmm16:35
Daniel0108so it's software related, your router is fine :)16:35
mani_but in ubuntu 10.10 it connects and signals shown there but web sites doesn't open16:35
mani_same as that internet not connected16:35
Daniel0108press Alt+F2 and enter gnome-terminal16:36
Daniel0108a window (terminal) opens, there you enter: sudo apt-get update16:36
Daniel0108and tell me if that works16:36
mani_just these 2 steps?16:36
Daniel0108not really ;)16:37
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=== AbhiJit is now known as Guest9097
=== AbhiJit_ is now known as AbhiJit
jermzaSilly question.... does Ubuntu require file extensions?18:07
jermzaFor example, file.txt versus file18:08
johnny77I'm trying to set up a openbox session, but I can't seem to get Dropbox to load. Can anyone help?18:08
Daniel0108not really ;)18:08
Daniel0108jermza: ^18:08
jermzaSo, when saving files, I don't have to worry about typing an extension at the end18:09
jermzaIf I'm, say, saving a Gimp file, I don't have to type "mygraphic.xcf"18:09
jermzaI can simply save it as "mygraphic"?18:09
yax51heres another silly question, why when I am trying to get the system updates for 10.04. why does it ask for lubuntu 10.10 disc? (I'm not even running that)18:10
IAmNotThatGuyjermza, when you select the name, you can also select the other file extensions at the save screen.18:10
pleia2jermza: your file.txt example was different, a program still needs to know what format to save a file in (.jpg, .png, .xcf, etc)18:11
jermzaWhat I'm asking is: Do I need to worry about saving the Gimp extension when saving a Gimp file?18:11
pleia2gimp should give you a default extension in the save screen, it's in the bottom right18:12
=== nuboon2age_ is now known as nUboon2Age
Daniel0108jermza: after saving as .xcf you can remove the extension ;)18:13
Daniel0108gimp just needs to know that you are saving as .xcf :P18:13
IAmNotThatGuyyax51, your Ubuntu asks you to put lubuntu disk? you installed lxde ?18:13
jermzaI see that, if you leave out the extension, it changes the icon in Nautilus.18:13
yax51no, thats the strange part....18:13
Daniel0108jermza: really? I tested it and it didn't change the icon, lol18:14
IAmNotThatGuyjermza, lemme check for you. give me a minute18:15
jermzaAnd, let's say I've removed the extension and give that file to someone using a Windows machine, will their machine read it (despite the extension missing)?18:15
Daniel0108jermza: I think windows needs the extensions18:15
IAmNotThatGuyjemark, when you hit save, it will display the file type at the bottom right of the save window. better dont delete the extension. all files need an extension18:16
Daniel0108jermza: why do you want to delete the extensions, do you have a specific reason?18:17
jermzaJust asking, really18:17
IAmNotThatGuyjermza, do not delete the file type18:17
IAmNotThatGuyand good luck :)18:18
jermzaI was playing in Pitivi and, when rendering a video, it asked me what to name it.18:18
IAmNotThatGuyyax51, and you installed anything new?18:18
Daniel0108jermza: yeah, if you don't have a specific reason to remove the file type, it's better to leave it added18:18
jermzaBut when it saved the file, it didn't give the file an extension.18:18
Daniel0108jermza yeah, some programs do this, gedit does this too18:18
IAmNotThatGuyyax51, there?18:19
jermzaThis is confusing18:19
IAmNotThatGuyjohnny77, I am not with openbox. lemme look at google18:19
jermzaI made a short video clip for a mate.  PitiVi saved the file without an extension.  I want to send it to him, but he has a Windows PC.  How will I know if he can play it or not?18:20
yax51IAmNotThatGuy: sorry, afk for moment, I did make a 10.10 install disk for my desktop recently18:20
IAmNotThatGuyno worries yax51 and you used startup disk creator. and can you report the exact screenshot of what you get?18:21
IAmNotThatGuy!imagebin | yax5118:21
ubot2yax51: Screenshots can be made with the [PrtScr] button. Want to show us a screenshot of your problem? Upload an image to http://tinyurl.com/imagebin and post a link to it.18:21
johnny77IAmNotThatGuy: I've looked at a few things on google, but don't know enough yet to know if a two+ year old post can still apply.18:21
IAmNotThatGuyOkies lemme look johnny7718:22
Red-Ravenhey.18:22
jermzaAnyone?18:24
Red-Ravenquestion please? (im new so i may not be able to help. but shoot away.)18:25
yax51IAmNotThatGuy: http://imagebin.org/13219718:25
yax51whats up?18:25
yax51red-raven: ever et your xp machine working?18:25
Red-Ravenyah.18:25
yax51yay you!18:26
IAmNotThatGuyyax51, it will be good if you can tell the name of  the package it stops and shows this error. just see and tell here. no image needed18:26
Red-Ravenits running fine. i installed the Lubuntu environment but im having problems with that.18:26
yax51IAmNotThatGuy: the package is called evince18:27
IAmNotThatGuyGrrrrr! Nowai. its just a document viewer :/18:28
Red-Ravenwhats it doing?18:28
IAmNotThatGuyyax51, just uncheck evince and try updating. we all will be here. just do that and report back :]18:29
IAmNotThatGuywithing that time, I ll hook up the reasons if there is some18:29
Red-Raven_wtf. stupip out-dated rueter.18:30
Red-Raven_stupod*18:30
IAmNotThatGuyRed-Raven_, Language18:30
Red-Raven_ugh cant spell18:30
yax51ok, I am unchecking what it seems to be hanging up on, but then it just goes to the next the one and hangs up again.....18:30
IAmNotThatGuyawwh!18:31
IAmNotThatGuythen it should be some internal bug. it showed any error at the time of making a maverick disk?18:31
IAmNotThatGuyI mean 10.10 disk18:31
yax51no...the disc was good,a nd installed fine on my desktop18:32
yax51I wonder if I should just go ahead and install maverick anyway......18:33
nit-witRed-Raven_, did you get the virtual going?18:34
IAmNotThatGuyyax51, if you wish to install maverick, then just do it ;)18:35
Red-Raven__yup. thx! just deciding what ISOs to get now.18:36
yax51Im thinking that might be a good, gotta stay up to date right ;)18:36
IAmNotThatGuy(;18:36
Red-Raven__ugh! freaking machine. actually, i think it might be a driver issue with my parents  ancient pc. its the same as my old XP rig i think.18:37
Red-Ravenso any ideas for some distros to try out?18:42
yax51so, heres another dumb question, when I do an install of maverick, I will need to wipe this partition and basically re-install any packages I already have right?18:49
yax51red-raven: you could always try XP :P18:51
yax51red-raven: I've got a machine that already has in installed for you ;)18:52
Red-Ravenhey. had a near-death experience there. shut down my parents pc (with the rueter) and thought, while it was down, might as well check the hardware for fun. opened it up, found it was the same as my xp rig, closed it a botted it tup. then it freaked and was all like "checking IDE" or whatever. so i shut it down, rebooted again, same thing, so i let it run. apparently, all it wanted me to do was set the date and time.18:56
yax51thats awesome!18:57
Red-Ravenawesome how?18:57
Red-Ravenhey can i boot the XP off an external HD with a backup of my whole system on it?19:02
* JackyAlcine is now reading trackback.19:19
yax51Red-Raven: you should be able to, as long as the external HD is bootable....19:20
JackyAlcineRed-Raven__: use the MBR tool in Windows (you have to download that for WinXp) to make your HDD bootable19:22
Red-Raven__cool. only problem is, my laptop is 64 bit and the XP is 32. so it couldn't boot off the 64 bit version of win7.19:22
* JackyAlcine is all caught up. ;D19:24
Red-Raven_back. missed anything since last time i posted.19:26
Red-Raven_what the crap. this is so irritating.19:38
Red-Raven_any suggestions for ISOs to try out in virtualbox?19:39
yax51BSD?19:39
holsteini want to look at http://distrowatch.com/table.php?distribution=xpud19:39
Red-Raven_looks nice.19:40
Red-Raven_i can't figure something out though. when i boot up a virtual machine, do i click install or try? it asks me when i boot up my ubuntu virtual machine every time.19:41
holsteinRed-Raven_: you have to eject the fake CD19:42
holsteinits just like a normal machine19:42
holsteinwhen it boots up19:42
holsteinyou have told it to boot the CD19:42
holsteinad the CD is the image19:42
holsteinthe .iso image that is being used as a CD19:43
holsteinso you can either 'eject that cd'19:43
holsteinOR run it live19:43
holsteinOR install it19:43
holsteinwhatever you want to do19:43
holsteini say experiment around19:43
Red-Raven_so click try and then eject the ISO?19:43
holsteinif you have the hard drive space19:43
holsteinyou'll not break the host system19:44
holsteinRed-Raven_: you'll always boot the live CD19:44
holsteinas long as its in the virtual machines fake CD drive19:44
holsteinOR you'll be asked to boot it at least19:44
Red-Raven_i have the vitual machine set to boot from the ISO. that works, but it will ask me if i want to install or try ubuntu just like a live cd.19:45
holsteinright19:45
holsteinSO you choose19:45
Red-Raven_but if i click install wont that take up even more HD space?19:46
holsteinRed-Raven_: take up some hard drive space !19:46
holsteinthere really cheap now19:46
Red-Raven_so when i boot it up again, i can just point it towards the install and delete the ISO>19:47
Red-Raven_?*19:47
holsteinif you want to delete it19:47
holsteinthe vBox contol panel is where you do that19:47
holsteinimagine that the little fake room your fake machines are in19:47
holsteinjust go in there, and eject the CD19:48
Red-Raven_or just right click the icon and delete...19:48
holsteindelete it if you want...19:48
holsteinRed-Raven_: i dont remember what it looks like19:48
Red-Raven_so once i pick install i dont need the ISO.19:48
holsteinand what all the jagon is19:48
holsteinjargon*19:48
holsteinRed-Raven_: right, just like on your machine now19:48
holsteinits isntalled19:48
holsteinand you dont need the disc anymore19:49
Red-Raven_ok that makes sense. so it will still take up HD space just like any other OS install would?19:49
holsteinlike any other *file would19:50
holsteinas far as your host OS is concerned19:50
holsteinthat just a big file it cant read19:50
holstein.vdk's or something19:50
holsteini forget te extension19:50
holsteinthe*19:50
holsteinto your guest OS, thats its hard drive19:50
Red-Raven_oh. so then the only real advantage of Vbox is being able to run multiple OSs at once and being able to run them from ISOs?19:51
holsteinnah19:51
holsteintheres all kinds of advantages19:51
holsteinsay you have windows installed19:51
holsteinand it gets a virus19:51
holsteinyou just revert to a snapshot of when it didnt have a virus19:51
holsteinan old copy of this fake HD19:52
holsteinOR19:52
holsteinyou want to have a server running19:52
holsteinubuntu server19:52
holsteinand you get new hardware19:52
holsteinand want to move it19:52
holsteinyou just copy the little fake hard drive19:52
holsteinand take it over to Vbox running on another machine19:52
holsteinthe advantage is that its virtual19:52
holsteinand all that that can mean19:52
holsteinand be helpful for your use case19:53
holsteinits handy to boot up iso images without burning CD's19:53
holsteinRed-Raven__: http://paste.ubuntu.com/552943/19:54
Red-Ravenright, so you can try them. i think i get it better now. i have a 500GB external i can use for all this stuff.19:55
holsteinright19:56
holsteinand you dont have to mess with GRUB19:56
Red-Ravenok cool.19:56
holsteinor partition any physical HD19:56
Red-RavenYES!19:56
holsteinyou can totally break everything19:56
holsteinand delete a file19:57
holsteinand life is good19:57
Red-Ravenisn't that the best way to learn? by breaking it?19:57
holsteinits one way ;)19:58
Red-Ravensweeet. breaking stuff is fun.19:58
holsteinalso19:58
holsteinthe networking setups in there19:58
holsteinyou can have several machines talking to each other19:58
holsteinonly to each other19:58
holsteinand really learn some things that way19:58
Red-Ravenok. so say i wanted my laptop (in ubuntu) and my old XP (running ubuntu aswell) to so that. how would i go about setting them up?19:59
jermzaI plugged my iPhone into the USB and Ubuntu said that it can't mount the phone.  Wha do I do now?20:00
Red-Ravenah, the eternal battle between iOS devises and Linux.20:00
Red-Ravendevices*20:00
holsteinRed-Raven: exactly the point20:00
holsteinyou can install XP and buntu20:00
holsteinin Vbox20:01
holsteinsave the states20:01
holsteinand start trying things20:01
holsteinsamba20:01
holsteinor whatever20:01
holsteinall kinds of networking experiments20:01
holsteinwithout breaking your current setups20:01
jermzaSo, basically, iPhones don't work on Ubuntu?20:01
holsteinjermza: you read https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PortableDevices/iPhone ?20:02
holsteiniphone may not work *with* ubuntu20:02
Red-Raventhere are ways i think. i've just heard a lot aboutt how iOS devices don't play nice with Linux.20:02
holsteinany drive can be mounted, not sure if apple allows that device to be used that way or not20:02
holsteinseems like there are some packages to try though, if you have not20:03
jermzaI've tried nothing yet.20:03
jermzaI'm a newbie.20:03
holsteinjermza: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PortableDevices/iPhone is where i would start then20:04
Red-Ravenso i can just install Vbox on both machines, run the same OS in VB, and then get them talking?20:04
holsteinRed-Raven: on whatever machine youw ant20:04
holsteinyou want*20:04
holsteinyou install Vbox20:04
holsteinthen you install a test case of both XP and buntu20:04
holsteinnetwork them together inside Vbox20:04
holsteinand start hacking away at them20:04
Red-Ravenoh so i only need 1 machine running two OSs?20:05
holsteinthats one way to be sure you're not going to break anything in action20:05
holsteinRed-Raven: you can run as many vitual machines as your hardware will allow20:05
Red-Ravenawesome!20:05
holsteinand on those machines, you can run whatever OS you want20:05
holsteinwhatever is compatible*20:06
Red-Raveni might get away with 2 Vboxs on my 2GB RAM.20:06
Red-Ravenyah but you can't get all ISOs (like OS X)20:07
holsteinwell, you probably can20:07
holsteinbut im not hopping through any hoop for that20:07
Sayganhas anyone here ever installed WifiDocsDriverbcm43xx on 10.10 without internet access?20:07
holsteinSaygan: i'll need to soon20:07
holsteincan you find the .deb somewhere?20:08
Red-Ravenwait, about the 2 GB RAM or OS X?20:08
Sayganhttps://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs/Driver/bcm43xx20:08
holsteinRed-Raven: OSX20:09
Sayganim following those directions- however- when i type in the directions into the terminal says no such file or directory20:09
Red-Ravenok20:09
holstein2 gigs is plenty20:09
Red-Ravenyah should be able to run two on top of the host.20:09
* holstein looking Saygan 20:09
Sayganthx20:09
holsteinSaygan: but, you did get bcmwl-kernel-source from somewhere?20:10
holsteinand install it?20:10
Sayganim new to all of this- super noob- so im sort of jumping around trying different things hoping that something will work- as for step 1- it says command not found20:12
holsteinSaygan: you cant hook it up wired?20:12
holsteintemporarily?20:12
Sayganyou mean ethernet cable?20:13
holsteinyup20:13
holsteinthats the *easy way20:13
Saygani suppose i could try20:13
holsteinjust plug it in20:13
Saygantho i dont know if i have the drivers for my ethernet card20:13
holsteinSaygan: only one way to find out :)20:14
Sayganguess we'll see- gotta go upstairs brb20:14
holsteinSaygan:20:14
Sayganaye?20:14
holsteinadditional drivers is what you'll be looking for20:14
holsteinsystem - addministration - additional drivers20:15
Sayganyup i know where to find it20:15
holsteinIF you are not prompted auto-magically20:15
holsteinSaygan: COOL20:15
SayganI'll check it out once i hook it up- going now20:15
Red-Ravenis there a way to use Ubuntu (not the sever version, just 10.10) as a server? or do you need server edition?20:15
Sayganauto-magically..haha i like that20:15
holsteinhehe20:15
holsteinRed-Raven: you can run servers on the desktop version20:15
holsteinyou can install the server version20:16
holsteinand install gnome on top of it20:16
holsteinor whatever20:16
holsteinubuntuserver = ubuntu20:16
holsteinall the same packages20:16
Red-Ravenok but to make like a server that i could access anywhere, i would need server edition?20:16
holsteinRed-Raven: you can do whatever you want20:17
Red-Ravenoh so server edition is just ubuntu without the GUI?20:17
holsteinall the same packages are at your disposal20:17
holsteinRed-Raven: bacially20:17
holsteinbascially*20:17
Red-Ravenawsome! i could leave it running all the time and use it like a cloud!20:17
holsteinsure20:17
Red-RavenOMG.....i just pooped my pants.....20:18
Red-Raven(little exageration lol)20:18
Red-Raveni have got to try that. and as long as its running and im on wifi, i can connect to it anywhere?20:19
holsteinsure20:19
holsteinconnecting safely is the trick20:19
Red-Ravenso others dont break in to your server?20:20
holsteinright20:20
Red-Ravenoh.....why not just use a password?20:20
holsteinyou'll need to read about all that20:21
holsteindo what you're comfortable with20:21
Red-Ravenok i will.20:21
holsteinhttps://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSH20:21
holsteinstart there20:21
holsteinmaybe run something locally20:21
ShootEmUpHello Everyone!20:21
Red-Ravenbut unlesss they were a fellow techy with a personal vendata against me, why break into my server?20:22
JackyAlcineHey ShootEmUp :D20:22
Sayganholstein- i owe you a truckload of cookies- the delicious kind20:22
holsteinSaygan: :)20:22
holsteingood news20:22
holsteini still have to get those packages and do it without internet access at an install fest soon20:23
holsteinSaygan: so i appreciate that link you dropped :)20:23
Saygangood luck20:23
ShootEmUpHey JackyAlcine, holstein, and Red-Raven20:23
Saygannp20:23
Saygananother guy from here sent it to me last night20:23
Red-Ravenhey shootemup!20:23
holsteinRed-Raven: might be a bot20:23
holsteinhacking you20:23
holsteinthen what...20:23
ShootEmUpRed-Raven, whats your problem?20:24
Red-Ravenim toast.20:24
holsteinno bots yet ShootEmUp20:24
ShootEmUpwhy?20:24
Red-Ravennothing suprisingly.20:24
holsteinjust in theory *20:24
holsteintalking about remote access to home20:24
Red-Ravenim considering turning my ol XP into a personal server. but apparently its the personal part that will be difficult.20:25
holsteinput ubuntu server on it20:25
ShootEmUpwhy?20:25
ShootEmUpRed-Raven, why?20:25
holsteinOR something like http://freenas.org/FreeNAS20:25
Red-Ravenfun?20:25
holsteinfood...20:25
Red-Ravenand its just cool.20:25
ShootEmUpI ment why is the personal par thard?20:27
ShootEmUpRed-Raven_, disconnect issues?20:29
Red-Raven_yah.20:30
ShootEmUphappens20:30
Red-Raven_bad drivers or something on the ruter's side.20:31
Red-Raven_old pc to.20:31
Red-Raven_what is BSD's speciality?20:31
Red-Raven_anyone know what BSD specializes in?20:50
holsteinlol20:51
Red-Raven_?20:52
holsteinRed-Raven_: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berkeley_Software_Distribution20:52
Red-Raven_i swear i was just there...20:52
Red-Raven_oh ok. it was under the "technology" part. so its designed to be a sandbox kind of thing for people who want to make there own apps?20:55
Red-Raven_anyone have a basic guide on setting up a home server on ubuntu 10.10? (Not server edition)22:04
CensoredBiscuitumm hello Red-Raven_22:06
CensoredBiscuitwhat are you wanting this server to do?22:06
Red-Raven_hello.22:06
Red-Raven_i just want it to act like a basic cloud for my house. ill venture into mating it out of the house, adding virtual machines, and all that stuff later. i just want to try it in home.22:07
Red-Raven_getting*22:07
ChrisDruifAnd what should this "cloud" do for you? Hold back-ups of all your machines? Run a few other background apps?22:08
Red-Raven_for the moment, just make its files (text docs, pics, etc) available to the house. not enough HD space for backups. im not sure what you mean with background apps22:10
ChrisDruifRunning a bittorrent client and what not :)22:10
Red-Raven_oh ok.22:11
Red-Raven_but yah, for now just that basic stuff.22:11
VoidoathFinally!22:12
VoidoathI'm in the chatroom...22:12
Red-Raven_YAY! (why are we chearing???)22:12
ChrisDruifGood going Voidoath :)22:12
ChrisDruifYou might like this Red-Raven_: https://help.ubuntu.com/6.06/ubuntu/serverguide/C/network-file-system.html22:14
Red-Raven_cool thx! is it the same as setting up a server though?22:16
VoidoathIf I need help with a guide will you read the (short) guide or should I explain the problems as I go?22:18
ChrisDruifI don't really know, I haven't tried it yet...however on a server you can install a desktop :)22:18
Red-Raven_i have an old 10 GB internal HDD from a historically old gatway. any suggestions besides putting it in another computer? (something useful. im not smashing it for fun)22:27
JackyAlcineRed-Raven_: Yup, just use it as swap22:28
Red-Raven_slow much?22:28
JackyAlcineRed-Raven_: Hm, backup for photos?22:29
Red-Raven_why not. ill put it in, figue out what to do with it. thhing is, the way my pc is set up, i have to put it into an old CD bay, so it will be very loose.22:30
Red-Raven_but why not? im doing it.22:30
JackyAlcineCool. I need to get me a tower.22:32
JackyAlcineMy rig's a laptop connected to a CRT because I broke the LCD. >_<22:32
johnny77does anyone know how to get the screen saver to work in an Openbox session or at least turn off the screen?22:32
Red-Raven_its LOUD. theyre fun for learning hardware and stuff.22:33
JackyAlcineyour tower? Or the drive22:34
Red-Raven_the tower.22:34
Red-Raven_no way am i putting this hard drive in my rig. switched it on, its the oudest, most annoying thing ive every heard!22:46
Red-Raven_how do i make Gparted see this old HDD?23:01
ChrisDruifRed-Raven_: Is it mounted?23:03
Red-Raven_guess not.23:03
Red-Raven_its old though. it has win98 on it i beleive.23:03
ChrisDruifI don't know :P Can you see it in Nautilus?23:03
Red-Raven_doesn't look like it,23:04
ChrisDruifWhich Ubuntu are you running atm?23:05
Red-Raven_it shows a "file system" and "21 Gb file system". the 21 is definatly the XP partition. the other might be the linux side.23:05
Red-Raven_ubuntu 10.1023:05
ChrisDruifOn the top you've got places...do you see the drive there?23:06
Red-Raven_just see the 21GB there.23:06
Red-Raven_i went to computer and i found the full 80 GB system (my HDD) and "file system" again. i think that's it.23:07
ChrisDruifWell...then GParted should see the drive...HOWEVER :P You have to switch to the correct drive (I know, XP system makes more sense (showing all partitions))23:08
ChrisDruifIn the top right you'll see the system's drive...23:08
Red-Raven_i don't think thats itnow. i found a file in it called GRUB. Linux never touched that HDD, so its probably the linux partition of my HDD>23:08
Red-Raven_.*23:09
johnny77I'm told to add a command to "~/.xinitrc", but I can't find it. Would it be ok just to create it?23:09
Red-Raven_yah i see that, but i click and the only option is my 80 GB HDD.23:10
Red-Raven_should i try booting from that HDD maybe?23:10
ChrisDruifIn that "Filesystem" you've mentioned....does it show an eject icon next to it?23:11
Red-Raven_no. and now im sure it the linux partition.23:12
ChrisDruifMaybe it just shows it's there and not mounted?23:13
Red-Raven_no. the 10GB HDD im trying to use is no where in here.23:13
ChrisDruifThen I don't know...23:15
ChrisDruifjohnny77: Maybe you should try #lubuntu...they've got more experience with OpenBox :)23:15
Red-Raven_ill search around.23:16
Red-Raven_crap. rebooted, got a secondary hard disk drive 0 failure.23:18
ChrisDruifAlright...23:18
Red-Raven_yah....probably NOT good....23:18
ChrisDruifIndeed...23:18
Red-Raven_and now my F# keys dont work....23:20
ChrisDruifThat's also not cool...23:21
Red-Raven_any way to just wipe it without all this?23:21
ChrisDruifI don't know...sorry23:22
ChrisDruifReally tired and a tiny bit sick...23:22
Red-Raven_sok.23:22
ChrisDruifAlso it's past midnigt here :P23:23
Red-Raven_oh. where are you?23:24
ChrisDruifHolland :)23:24
ChrisDruifhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChrisDruif23:24
Red-Raven_oh cool! im in america. its...boaring.23:26
ChrisDruifWhat, America?23:26
ChrisDruifOr my wiki?23:26
Red-Raven_america.23:26
ChrisDruifWhy so?23:26
Red-Raven_well, at least, Florida is anyways.23:26
ChrisDruifYour in Florida? =-O23:26
Red-Raven_all we have is beaches, palm trees, and retires/snow birds.23:27
ChrisDruifI would love that :D Being able to surf each day  :D23:27
Red-Raven_you would think you could, but the water actually gets bitter cold in the winter.23:28
ChrisDruifYeah, but still better surfing water then in Holland...23:29
ChrisDruifBiggest waves are about 1m (3ft?)23:30
Red-Raven_hm. well, i can't surf.23:30
ChrisDruifI would need to learn it...but when there's a will, there's a way :)23:31
Red-Raven_yah. i really don't have time though. Honors and AP classes in high school :P23:32

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