[00:00] <ailo> Well, I suppose what is the normal case for most people writing new music today, custom symbols, custom noteheads, custom rhythms
[00:01] <ailo> "custom rhythms" lol
[00:01] <rlameiro> lol
[00:02] <rlameiro> well, in theory you can edit each note.... its a PITA but it is somethin
[00:02] <ailo> It's a great medium for getting musicians to read complicated info and be able to play it right from the sheet, but it's not easy to work with for the arranger/composer sometimes
[00:02] <rlameiro> right click over a note
[00:02] <rlameiro> are you a classical composer?
[00:03] <ailo> I have the schooling, but I don't really do much of that now
[00:03] <rlameiro> hummm
[00:03] <rlameiro> nice :D
[00:04] <rlameiro> where are you from?
[00:04] <ailo> It's great when you arrange classical music, musicals and so on. Then it works really fast
[00:04] <rlameiro> sweden
[00:04] <rlameiro> ?
[00:04] <ailo> Yeah, Sweden
[00:04] <rlameiro> Yeah, i nailed it
[00:04] <rlameiro> telia never disapoint me
[00:05] <ailo> I went to this school http://www.gotlandstonsattarskola.com/index-eng.php
[00:05] <ailo> Didn't pursue College
[00:06] <rlameiro> nice concept
[00:06] <ailo> Very good school, where you get to work with both student musicians, but also professional musicians
[00:06] <ailo> They also have electroacoustic courses, where they use MaxMSP
[00:07] <rlameiro> yeah yeah
[00:07] <rlameiro> always the same
[00:07] <rlameiro> i am getting tired ....
[00:07] <rlameiro> always MaxMSP
[00:07] <ailo> Don't know now, but at that time it was Mac, ProTools and MaxMSP
[00:08] <rlameiro> ailo: its almost eveywhere like that
[00:09] <rlameiro> they doesnt know anything else :(
[00:09] <ailo> I learned about puredata at that time, but it was difficult to install on Windows at the time. Now is a different story
[00:09] <ailo> And, I'm not on windows anymore myself of course
[00:09] <rlameiro> well, windows????
[00:09] <rlameiro> lol
[00:09] <rlameiro> pd on windows still is kinda weird...
[00:09] <ailo> You think?
[00:10] <rlameiro> noooooooo
[00:10] <ailo> I found a bug that only affects Linux, which annoys me a lot
[00:10] <ailo> If you do graph on parent on a patch, and open/close it enough times, pd will crash
[00:11] <rlameiro> the famous one :D
[00:11] <ailo> It is?
[00:11] <rlameiro> if it is not that is one quit close
[00:11] <rlameiro> i saw something about it on pdlist some time ago
[00:12] <ailo> I like to open some patches separately when needed, but this bug makes it impossible, so I need to keep everything open all the time
[00:12] <ailo> Anyway, on Windows, I guess at least the latency is worse
[00:13] <rlameiro> well not just the latency
[00:13] <rlameiro> a lot of externals doesnt run
[00:13] <ailo> Ok, so it needs some more work
[00:15] <ailo> I wouldn't be surprised if Windows will become another *nix distro sooner or later.
[00:15] <rlameiro> me either
[00:15] <rlameiro> neither*
[00:17] <paultag> they'd be more apt to be a BSD
[00:17] <paultag> or a *nux
[00:18] <paultag> they love nonfree software way too much
[00:18] <paultag> like OSX, really
[00:19] <rlameiro> well, i dont believe they would use linux
[00:19] <rlameiro> but hey, Oracle does, why not MS
[00:19] <paultag> because Oracle's not in the OS biz ;)
[00:21] <rlameiro> welll. microsft isnt either now
[00:21] <rlameiro> lol
[00:22] <rlameiro> they are on the bloatware bussines
[00:22] <paultag> I'd be remiss if I were to call microshaft product software
[00:22] <rlameiro> lol
[00:23] <ailo> What are the reasons behind Linux not being the natural base for Commercial OS's
[00:23] <ailo> Seems like they would save themselves a lot of work
[00:23] <paultag> ailo: none, in my mind
[00:23] <rlameiro> anyone could duplicate it at home
[00:23] <rlameiro> and need to make a lot of stuff GPL :D
[00:23] <paultag> ailo: but most companies see it as "their" system where "they" have total control over it
[00:24] <ailo> They can always keep the front end non-free
[00:24] <paultag> ailo: if someone like Microsoft sold Linux based systems, linus would have more power then their CEO
[00:24] <rlameiro> ailo: well, not exactly
[00:24] <paultag> ailo: until they get fed up and fork it, which would lead to a fragmented ecosystem where patches might not apply both ways
[00:24] <rlameiro> the OS itself is pretty tied to the kernel
[00:24] <paultag> rlameiro: that's not true at all
[00:24] <rlameiro> the rest are jus applications
[00:24] <paultag> rlameiro: we have Debian GNU/kBSD, Debian GNU/Hurd and Debian GNU/Linux
[00:24] <ailo> X Window system seems like an obstacle
[00:25] <rlameiro> The OS is the Kernel + drivers + interface
[00:25] <rlameiro> the rest are just applications
[00:25] <paultag> rlameiro: no, that's the kernel
[00:25] <paultag> rlameiro: that's all ring 0 code
[00:25] <rlameiro> as I said :D
[00:25] <paultag> rlameiro: but our OS is ring 1 and out
[00:25] <rlameiro> all the rest is applications
[00:25] <paultag> rlameiro: like the GNU userland and GLibC
[00:25] <paultag> rlameiro: no, the rest are librarys and then applications :)
[00:25] <paultag> libraries
[00:26] <rlameiro> paultag: true :D
[00:26] <rlameiro> forgot the Libs ... shame on me
[00:26] <ailo> They could always strip down what they want to keep secret
[00:26] <paultag> rlameiro: so as long as you write for POSIX standards ( read: GNU Userland ), the kernel ( ring0 code ) can be whatever you want ( NT Kernel, BSD Kernel, Linux Kernel, HURD kernel )
[00:26] <paultag> rlameiro: so one of the most flexable parts in the GNU OS is the Kernel
[00:26] <rlameiro> yeap
[00:27] <paultag> since the libraries act as a good middleman
[00:27] <paultag> so:
[00:27] <paultag> 00:24 < rlameiro> the OS itself is pretty tied to the kernel
[00:27] <paultag> is not right ;)
[00:27] <paultag> </pedantic mode>
[00:27] <rlameiro> hummmm not very clear that sentence indeed
[00:28] <rlameiro> I was thinking microkernel mode :D
[00:28] <rlameiro> lol
[00:28] <rlameiro> like the nevercoming hurd
[00:28] <paultag> rlameiro: bsd is a kind of microkernel
[00:28] <rlameiro> well, but in true an os is a kernel plus Glibc. ....
[00:28] <rlameiro> paultag: yeap, MACH
[00:28] <paultag> rlameiro: the OS is the whole system
[00:29] <rlameiro> minix
[00:29] <rlameiro> well i dont thing nano is part of the OS
[00:29] <paultag> XNU ;)
[00:29] <rlameiro> or firefox...
[00:29] <paultag> rlameiro: they are
[00:29] <rlameiro> well, then we have a problem :D
[00:30] <paultag> An operating system (OS) is software, consisting of programs and data, that runs on computers  and manages computer hardware resources[1]  and provides common services for efficient execution of various application software.An operating system (OS) is software, consisting of programs and data, that runs on computers  and manages computer hardware resources[1]  and provides common services for efficient execution of various application software
[00:30] <paultag> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operating_system
[00:30] <rlameiro> .....  and provides common services for efficient execution of various application software
[00:30] <paultag> humm, guess that could be made to exclude applications
[00:30] <paultag> I never make the distinction :)
[00:31] <rlameiro> hence nano != partof the OS
[00:31] <rlameiro> even busybox ....
[00:31] <rlameiro> or bash or something like that
[00:31] <paultag> well they are all applications :P
[00:32] <rlameiro> yeap
[00:32] <rlameiro> that was my idea
[00:32]  * paultag heads back to work
[00:33] <rlameiro> paultag: good luck then :D
[04:55] <col0ur> Timidity or Fluidsynth?
[04:57] <holstein> depends
[04:57] <holstein> whats the application col0ur ?
[04:57] <col0ur> well
[04:57] <col0ur> for ScummVM tbh
[04:57] <holstein> i direct all my MIDI questions to #opensourcemusicians
[04:58] <col0ur> alright, will try. thanks :)
[17:09] <eviljames> Is it true that -rt support was dropped in ubuntu because it didn't mix well with proprietary nvidia drivers?
[17:28] <astraljava> -rt patch isn't provided for nearly all kernel versions, so that's one part. UKT didn't want to provide support for even the ones where patches were available, reasons unknown to me but no doubt valid in their sense. So it was up to community to provide packages containing either vanilla kernel or the ubuntu flavor with the -rt patch on top, but not enough effort was provided for testing, bugfixing etc.
[17:31] <astraljava> For long it was a one-man-show for an italian wizard called Alessio, but nowadays he's concentrating on -lowlatency and other kernel development.
[17:45] <eviljames> ah
[17:45] <eviljames> astraljava: That clarifies, thank you!
[17:47] <eviljames> I just snagged some info off their wiki as well looks like I'll be investigating what patches they put into the kernel and rolling my own
[17:47] <astraljava> eviljames: Sounds like a plan. :)
[17:48] <eviljames> Apparently kxstudio has a PPA (whatever that means..? :P) for the rt kernel.. you'll have to excuse my ignorance about ubuntu-specific terms, I'm an old slacker
[17:49] <astraljava> Personal Package Archive
[17:49] <astraljava> Yeah those are handy
[17:52] <astraljava> But you have to be careful with them, the packages are provided by community members, and you can't ask for official support for them at all.
[17:53] <eviljames> Yeah, I have my own personal package archive, but they're all Slackware packages.. :/
[17:53] <eviljames> So I'll probably start using other people's PPAs (trusted, of course) and then roll my own in time.
[17:55] <astraljava> That should work.