[04:37] i am running the kubuntu natty daily 2011021.1 and when i update with kpackagekit i get the following error message E: Error http://ppa.launchpad.net natty/main Sources [04:37] 404 Not Found [04:38] i have checked all the sources in the kubuntu software and other software [05:00] cpatrick08: it seems you added your own source becuase there is no ppa in natty file [05:00] ok [05:05] Anyone else's X explode after latest updates to Natty? [05:13] Wanderer, I think the topic addresses that; you may also want to get the rss feed of Natty changes to keep apprised of such [05:14] http://feeds.ubuntu-nl.org/NattyChanges [05:14] was reading the topic, thats about a week old, think it's still valid? [05:15] seems to be tons of X issues, so perhaps *that* particular one is fixed, but I'd be wary [05:16] Ok, now that I've borked my X server completely... What package(s) _should_ I install to try and get things back to working again? xorg? xserver-xorg? [05:16] slyrus: X segfaulting? [05:16] dies on startup, it seems [05:17] same here [05:17] any ideas in which log files I might look to see evidence of it dying? [05:18] /var/log/Xorg.0.log ? [05:19] no, hasn't been touched since 1/31/11... [05:20] I probably left my system in a hosed state dist-upgrading in the middle of the partial upgrade cycle [05:20] try and just execute "X [05:20] "X" even [05:21] what? I have updated but not rebooted. I am frightened now :( [05:21] looks like glew-utils is in a funky state [05:21] edgy: don't reboot [05:21] x is borked [05:21] Wanderer: so what can I do now? [05:22] tells me xserver-xorg isn't installed and that I need to install it -- which leads me back to my original question about which package [05:22] I'll try reinstall xserver-xorg and see what that does [05:22] edgy: just wait until the X release is done I guess [05:23] Wanderer: any bug filed for this? [05:24] I'm sure there are, check the topic [05:25] OK, that worked. yea. [05:26] Wanderer: but I upgraded to the latest and it's working I mean version 1.9.99 [05:26] mine worked fine until reboot [05:27] then X wouldn't restart [05:27] Wanderer: what's the error you get in the log file? [05:27] X segfaults [05:27] so I get X, but I'm still back to things like unity not working (and X (?) continuing to try to launch it, pegging the CPU) [05:27] Wanderer: what's the version of xserver-xorg-input-evdev you are using? [05:28] it's the 2.6.0 ubuntu6 [05:28] but I tried dropping that one package to ubuntu 4-5 and the previous 1.X version [05:28] no change [05:30] Wanderer: what's your vga card? [05:31] Nvidia 585 [05:33] Wanderer: then I don't know. I am using ati and it's working but i didn't recheck after the the updates of today [05:34] ugh. yeah, nautilus is segfaulting like crazy... [05:49] look at that... [05:49] the google to the rescue. removing groundcontrol (which removes python-nautilus) seems to fix the problem. [05:49] hth did that get installed in the first place? [07:29] hi, having trouble booting the +1 daily onto bare metal [07:29] always spits out radeon, evergreen errors. Any way to disable this? [09:18] any notable difference in natty boot speed comparing to maverick? [10:13] hey all [11:19] updates still breaking nvidia [12:49] Hi [12:49] I am having problems for 11.04 usb install, with loop filesystem. [12:50] cannot mount /dev/loop0 [12:50] Any help? [13:07] hm... did nouveau get offical 3D support o.O? [13:07] (or why do I have working compositing without nvidia-current and libgl1-mesa-dri-experimental?) [13:08] yofel: depending on what card you have, nouveau provides some 3d, yes [13:09] 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation GT218 [NVS 3100M] (rev a2) [13:09] well, let's see how well it works for a while ^^ [13:09] that I'm getting low-res plymouth on boot feels odd though [13:09] * yofel goes looking for reports [13:15] video corruption on .38 kernel with nvidia cards anyone? [13:17] not yet.. [13:25] yofel: can you point me to troubleshooting procedures? [13:28] better ask that in #ubuntu-x, I'm clueless there [15:34] I thought the X server was fully uploaded [15:34] and I did a dist-upgrade [15:34] now I get this error: [15:35] http://paste.ubuntu.com/561450/ [15:36] cdbs: I'm fully up-to-date and just passed an apt-get upgrade --fix-policy run even (with ubuntu-desktop installed) [15:36] If I do a dist-upgrade, it wants to: [15:36] The following packages will be REMOVED: [15:36] cryptsetup xserver-xorg-video-all xserver-xorg-video-nouveau [15:36] Removing cryptsetup will probably break my encrypted rootfs initramfs? [15:37] Sounds like you guys are on outdated mirrors [15:37] Although I dunno about the cryptsetup stuff [15:37] here it upgraded X fine.. [15:37] erf, xserver is still horked [15:37] Is there some problem with the deps? [15:37] But I have -nouveau and such and everything is upgraded [15:37] cdbs: Yeah, your mirror doesn't have the driver rebuilds [15:37] yofel: did it ask to remove any packages on it ? [15:38] Amaranth: FYI I am on archive.ubuntu.com :) [15:38] mine still wants to remove googleearth and nvidia-current [15:38] cdbs: apt-get update then :) [15:38] I'm using http://nl.archive.ubuntu.com [15:38] Volkodav: Yep, nvidia has to go [15:38] Amaranth: did one a few moments ago [15:38] Volkodav: xserver DDX ABI changed, nvidia needs to build a new driver against it [15:38] well, I don't have googleearth installed [15:38] Amaranth: is the new nvidia package ready though ? [15:39] is there a way to make sure the mirrors are up to date? I'm using mirrors.kernel.org [15:39] and even nvidia 270 with ignoreABI doesn't work with new X [15:39] so no point in having it installed [15:39] * yofel is on VESA currently [15:39] Wanderer: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archivemirrors [15:39] Right, because for some reason nvidia hooks in to the input and video interfaces and the ABI changed on both [15:39] Vol: reading, thanks [15:39] afaik ignoreABI only applies to video [15:40] so I understand there is no nvidia package yet ? [15:40] compiled against new X I mean [15:41] Volkodav: There may be a beta [15:42] so this is the scenario: [15:42] unless you use xorg-edgers maybe [15:42] It wouldn't be in edgers [15:42] ah ok [15:42] And using edgers right now breaks things [15:42] the installed drivers provide xserver-xorg-video-8 [15:42] and the new core package breaks -8 and needs -9 [15:42] cdbs: But only on your system :) [15:42] though apt has packages that provide -9, it is failing [15:43] it should forcefully install them all [15:43] current nvidia beta is 270.18, and that didn't work here, so we'll have to wait [15:44] I think I'll put of updating for a w hile :) [15:44] put off rather [15:44] anyone with nvidia shouldn't update ;) [15:44] oh, I think 270.18 had support for xserver 1.10 rc1 but the ABI changed again before final [15:44] maybe a big "NVIDIA BROKEN" in topic :) [15:44] everytime I am running apt-get -f install, its installing 1 package and then failing [15:44] so this seems to be the only solution [15:45] well we'll wait then [15:45] coz_: It's well known that running a development version will break nvidia and fglrx [15:45] It does every cycle [15:45] yep [15:45] coz_: well, you can use nouveau, but that freezes all the time here [15:45] no urgent need [15:46] yofel, it really no big deal at this point... I didnt update so things are working well... i will just wait :) [15:46] yep, better choice [15:47] yofel, it didn't work? [15:47] Yay! Worked! [15:47] I had to run apt-get -f install 13 times [15:47] bjsnider: I got an X segfault with ignoreABI, but I can try it again later [15:50] ok, anl.gov is up to date, and ipv6, but my X is still horked [15:50] bad timing, the one week I needed it stable I upgrade [15:50] crap [15:52] alpha 2 tomorrow? [15:54] planned for tomorrow, yep === Quintasan_ is now known as Quintasan [15:54] yofel, ok cool.. I suppose :) [15:54] so I'm hosed til then atleast? [15:55] Wanderer, if the nvidia stuff is fixed by tomorrow... I doubt it [15:55] in what way is X hosed for you? [15:57] yofel: X segfaults when it tries to start [15:57] I tried backing down the evdev, no change [15:57] got the backtrace? [15:58] (I mean, is it really evdev that crashes it?) [15:58] I get 9 lines when it segs, I dont see anything related to evdev, but that's the highest hit from googling and worth a shot [15:58] I don't do much coding so I'm in somewhat familiar waters here [15:59] can you pastebin the crash if you have it? [15:59] hmm, let me see if I can get it [15:59] the trace I mean [15:59] right [15:59] and I still only have 256 colors with intel on my eeePC o.O (945GME) [16:00] http://paste.ubuntu.com/561462/ [16:01] yep, that looks like about what I got when I tried it [16:01] nvidias fault [16:02] remove nvidia-current and delete /etc/X11/xorg.conf [16:02] that'll give you nouveau [16:03] you can also deactivate the driver in jockey [16:04] ok, I'm not using nvidia-current, I downloaded the latest [16:04] do I need to install xserver-xorg-nvidia ? [16:05] you downloaded the latest what? [16:05] no, xserver-xorg-video-nouveau should already be installed [16:05] er, wait [16:05] latest nvidia drivers from nvidia.com [16:05] (what bjsnider said) [16:05] ugh, why do i bother [16:06] .. [16:06] been using those for 6 months, had problems with performance in wine [16:06] Wanderer: run the .run with... --uninstall I think, reinstall all X packages and hope for the best [16:07] Wanderer, a sudo /usr/bin/nvidia-installer --uninstall should uninstall the downloaded driver [16:07] k [16:07] i'm trying to get the .run files disabled. it's a small packaging change to jcokey-common but it would work [16:07] bjsnider: how? [16:08] so if you have jockey-common, which everybody does, you wouldn't be able to use the nvidia-installer [16:08] they're already disabled for everybody that has nvidia-common, but not enough systems have that package [16:09] yofel, a year ago code was added to the nvidia-installer at canonical's request to facilitate this feature [16:09] ah [16:09] nvidia already explicitly tells people not to use their installer, but people do anyway [16:10] hehe [16:10] I have 2 nouveu packages, libdrm, no xorg [16:11] installing xserver-xorg-video-nouveau === ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu+1 to: Natty Narwhal 11.04 | Milestones: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyReleaseSchedule | Maverick/10.10 support in #ubuntu | Alpha 1 Released: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/natty/alpha1 | New X.org stack uploaded, known issues: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2011-February/032378.html [16:12] ok, if I'm not supposed to use .run, how do I install it? [16:12] I've been doing it from command line with a "sh Nv......" [16:14] ok, package installed, starting "X" says no devices [16:22] you need to reboot for nouveau to work [16:24] k [16:24] question as I've not used nouveau that I know of [16:25] I use wine to play warcraft on weekends, the reason I went to the nvidia packages was due to performance issues. will I have that with nouveau or is it better than the "nv" driver? === jpds changed the topic of #ubuntu+1 to: Natty Narwhal 11.04 | Milestones: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyReleaseSchedule | Maverick/10.10 support in #ubuntu | Alpha 1 Released: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/natty/alpha1 [16:26] Wanderer: nouveau is better than nv, but not really stable here [16:27] at least not as stable as nvidia [16:27] ok, I'm still getting the No devices after reboot [16:27] lets give it a try then and see if I can use nouv or if I have to back down to mav for a couple weeks [16:28] how do I regen the xorg.conf to use the nouv drivers? === gpc changed the topic of #ubuntu+1 to: Natty Narwhal 11.04 | Milestones: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyReleaseSchedule | Maverick/10.10 support in #ubuntu | Alpha 1 Released: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/natty/alpha1 | New X.org stack uploaded, known issues: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2011-February/032378.html [16:33] Wanderer: you delete it [16:33] I did [16:33] nouveau doesn't need a xorg.conf [16:34] then ran "X" and it says it can't find any devices [16:34] oh [16:34] did you un-blacklist the nouveau module? [16:35] ah, that may be it [16:36] rebooting [16:37] ok, got X [16:38] hmm, not logging in [16:39] looks like kde [16:39] fluxbox works [16:39] fluxbox is nice :) [16:41] yeah, just used to kde, havne't used flux or black in a decade [16:42] probably since enlightenment e15 was dev === JanC_ is now known as JanC [17:09] Is it a known bug that upgrading plymouth 0.8.2-2ubuntu9->0.8.2-2ubuntu13 breaks because of the dependency change with libdrm-nouveau1->libdrmnouveau1a ? [17:14] hmm, progress but no libGL [17:41] MTecknology: you need to remove libdrm-nouveau1, that's old [17:42] yofel: ya, but shouldn't the package manager be able to handle that? [17:42] it should, if nothing else is depending on the old lib [17:44] yofel: aptitude upgrade won't make the change; I pop open aptitude, press U, and then it tries to resolve the issue, it does so fine but having to go through that is probably a bug.. [17:45] aptitude upgrade [17:45] is aptitude safe-upgrade, it won't remove *any* deps in that state [17:45] you need to use aptitude full-upgrade for that [17:45] oh... [17:45] that will do the same as apt-get dist-upgrade [17:45] I feel kinda dumb now.. [17:46] thanks :) [17:46] aptitude safe-upgrade will only remove things that apt-get autoremove would remove too after an apt-get upgrade [17:47] I forgot that upgrade was safe-upgrade [18:03] I need to backrev my kernel down to allow me to run vmware workstation, the kernels in Natty removed some critical kernel options that vmware needs [18:04] How do back down to a 2.6.32-2.6.36 kernel? [18:04] http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/ [18:04] they all here [18:05] Is there a sources.list entry I can use to pull those? [18:05] http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/ [18:05] Cannot resolve hostname [18:07] it resolves here allright [18:07] wget likes it, epiphany does not [18:07] pulling them now [18:15] ugh [18:16] Could not find /boot/grub/menu.lst file. Would you like /boot/grub/menu.lst generated for you? (y/N) [18:16] Natty doesn't support that [18:16] but these kernels reuqire it [18:16] shit, it's using a generic on e === test__ is now known as trijntje === test_ is now known as trijntje === donvito2 is now known as donvito [19:01] ugh, so with grub-pc, I now have to update the grub params in 4 places [19:02] huh? [19:02] usually you only edit /etc/default/grub [19:02] Sorry, 3: /etc/default/grub, /etc/initramfs-tools/modules, /boot/grub/grub.cfg [19:02] you *never* edit /boot/grub/grub.cfg [19:02] and now there's no way to tell it to boot a non-0 kernel [19:02] update-grub generates and overwrites that file [19:03] what do you mean by non-0? you mean other than the one at the top of the list? [19:03] Starting from menuentry 0 in /boot/grub/grub.cfg, my target kernel is 6 in the list, so I put GRUB_DEFAULT=6 in /etc/default/grub, and it boots 0 anyway [19:04] did you run update-grub after changing that? [19:04] There's no other way to see what the kernel list order is... why-o-why people add exponential levels of complexity for no logical reason, is beyond me [19:04] Yes, I did [19:05] hm... this did work last time I tried it (a long time ago) [19:05] I have no grub boot menu, so I have no idea what kernel it's booting (that too, was removed) [19:05] Is everything moving to a "ONLY my grandmother can use it" model? [19:05] It seems like all the features, power, flexibility and ease of use is being ripped out of Ubuntu (and likewise KDE and GNOME are doing the same thing too) [19:06] if your grand mother can use it that means someone more experienced should have no issues [19:06] you get to the grub menu by holding left shift pressed before grub comes up, or by changing [19:06] GRUB_HIDDEN_TIMEOUT=0 [19:06] GRUB_HIDDEN_TIMEOUT_QUIET=true [19:06] gpc, My grandmother would use it unconfigured, I like to customize my installs.. can't do that anymore [19:06] setuid: yes you can, you just need to look a little deeper now. [19:07] I commented #GRUB_HIDDEN_TIMEOUT=0 out here, works fine [19:07] gpc, No, not true... look at gdm for example, the whole customization bit was ripped out [19:07] Look at fontconfig, ripped out the ability to render bitmap fonts [19:07] so no 6pt or smaller fonts [19:07] cosmetics... [19:10] Sure, if you consider removing leather seats from a sports car and replacing them with a park bench "cosmetics" :) [19:11] setuid: you were talking about customizing grub, I doubt your grand mother would ever do that. Now your complaining about font sizes. [19:12] yofel: Ugh, I see why it doesn't work... the 6th kernel is behind a grub menu opton called "Previous Linux versions", which I have to interactively enter to change [19:12] Well, the 4th through nth kernels are, that is [19:12] oh... I would count *that* as a bug [19:13] yeah, that was added recently [19:15] So no way to set a previous kernel as the default? [19:16] or... how do I "flatten" that menu system so it shows all the available kernels from the top-level grub menu? [19:18] I don't know that, but file a bug about the default setting being ignored in the menu, that shouldn't happen [19:18] ubuntu-bug grub-pc [19:51] Doesn't seem to be a way to point it to the kernel I want, so I'll remove everything except memtest, leaving only the kernel I want [19:54] Lovely, an update to current, removes the nvidia drivers and all dkms modules [19:54] (Reading database ... 285781 files and directories currently installed.) [19:54] Removing nvidia-173 ... [19:54] Removing all DKMS Modules [20:19] setuid: yeah, wondering when nvidia-current will be rebuilt for natty :S [20:20] indeed [20:21] * popey builds it locally to test [20:23] we could rebuilt it in the x-updates ppa if you think it would help [20:26] The nouveau driver drives me nuts [20:27] * yofel escaped to vesa [20:27] Every time I move the cursor it disappears [20:27] it doesn't seem to recognise my external monitor [20:28] or the native resolution/aspect ratio of the laptop's display. I'm not sure if that's an issue with my configuration though [20:28] hm, that didn't happen here, I just got an X freeze every ~20min [20:28] filing a bug about the resolution issue anyhow [20:31] oops. apport hook for xserver-xorg-video-nouveau got an assert error. [20:31] rmcbride: I had same resolution prob. wouldn't do 1680x945, just 1024x768 [20:40] good day all [20:42] Installing nvidia-173 remove xorg?! [20:43] s/remove/removes/ [20:43] That's kind of ... unintuitive. Let's intsall the nvidia drivers, and then remove everything that depends on them [20:46] well, the current nvidia drivers aren't compatible with current x server [20:46] so they won't install together with it [20:47] Specifically to me it wails about unsupported ABI version... [20:49] It's so much better than installing it and breaking you system, per say. [20:51] yeah, nvidia-current doesn't have that package check yet (I think) [20:54] correct [20:54] Xserver 1.10 does not support nvidia-current at this time [21:01] the 270 blob is supported at least partially. if someone wants to test it by rebuilding it in pbuilder i can rebuilt it in x-updates (assuming it works) [21:03] hey guys [21:03] the appmenu needs some serious work [21:03] cuz the way it is now... [21:04] who uses the appmenu? [21:05] I use the gnome panel version so I can get used to it while I'm not into Unity [21:07] ok guys, we won't be rebuilding nvidia-current until a new blob is released because it would be futile [21:07] o/ [21:07] it makes pidgin crash [21:07] it flashes when opening a new app [21:07] it crashes too [21:08] bjsnider, ok ,, I dont intend to update so all is fine on t his end :) [21:10] bjsnider: so you're saying I should not go looking for the 270 blob and try building it in my pbuilder? [21:11] rmcbride, it wouldn't work with this xserver [21:11] bjsnider: OK [21:11] as soon as a new 270 blob is released, the same day, we will have it in the x-updates ppa [21:28] heya, is there a good upgrade path for nvidia users? [21:28] as upgrade-manager wants to remove nvidia drivers [21:29] should I back of to nouveau first? [21:37] graingert, dont update [21:37] graingert, as soon as a new 270 blob is released, the same day, we will have it in the x-updates ppa [21:38] so I need to add that ppa? [21:38] graingert, we won't be rebuilding nvidia-current until a new blob is released because it would be futile [21:38] graingert, no no nvidia driver at the moment [21:38] okay can I change to nouveau? [21:38] coz_, [21:39] graingert, I believe if you remove the installed driver it s hould revert to nouveau [21:39] and remove the nvidia xorg.conf? [21:39] jocky-gtk seems to have borked :( [21:39] no, you should disable it first (not sure what'll happen to xorg.conf otherwise) [21:39] try jockey-cli [21:39] er [21:39] jockey-text [21:40] doesn't give any options [21:40] ooh dbus has gone mental [21:40] yaaaay [21:40] hokay I'll do it from the root terminal [21:40] Any updates on why xorg* is being pulled? [21:41] you just missed it [21:41] nv, nouveau, nvidia rips out all of X [21:41] are you sure? [21:41] that sounds bad [21:41] nouveau should work.. [21:41] Yes, absolutely sure [21:41] one sec, pastebot'ing [21:41] nouveau does work [21:41] aaalso [21:42] nvidia-96 and 173 won't install [21:42] -current will break X when you install it [21:42] yes that's becuase of the new x-stack [21:42] yofel, Right, installing them rips out most of xorg [21:42] yes, intentionally [21:42] can't you just make nvidia-current an empty package? [21:42] installing nouveau does not rip out X, though. It is used when the hardware drivers are pulled out [21:43] so it will not rip out x [21:43] http://pastebin.com/MUwLZU8p [21:43] then fill it in when everything is fine [21:43] -current won't rip out X, it will break it [21:43] graingert: why bother? [21:43] No, it removes xorg-* [21:43] See the above pastebot [21:43] er, pastebin [21:43] _if_ it does as setuid claims, to everyone [21:44] dropping out to neuveau should be the behaivour [21:44] ah, so it does [21:44] yep, you'll have to use nouveau [21:44] Nouveau still restricts us to 2D only, no 3D, right? [21:44] I think it depends on the card [21:45] some minimal 3d available for some cards [21:45] well it has 3D for some cards, and with libgl1-mesa-dri-experimental for some more [21:45] Well, on any nvidia card in notebooks, it does [21:45] I believe it works with metacities compositor [21:45] it did have 3D on my quadro nvs 3100M [21:45] it should [21:45] I don't use metacity or compiz or any of that dreck, but it has a HUGE impact on 2D speed in X [21:45] worked with kwin here [21:46] setuid, but what about wobbly windows :(? [21:46] setuid, to many people that's what linux is [21:46] huh? I found nouveau 2D to be very fast, with or without 3D [21:46] graingert, pick up your laptop and wobble it [21:46] heh [21:46] yofel, driver is still 'nv', right? [21:46] no [21:46] nouveau [21:46] setuid, but that means I have to put effort into being anoying and reducing my workrate [21:46] and nouveau doesn't need a xorg.conf [21:47] yofel, My laptop requires xorg.conf [21:47] why o.O? [21:48] yofel, Because the default xorg.conf, or the default X witout xorg.conf is nowhere near optimized for actual real usage [21:48] IOW, proper gamma, proper refresh rate, etc. [21:48] setuid, you set that in the monitor prefs in the gui [21:48] well, I do need to set something for nvidia, but nouveau works ok without one [21:48] http://pastebin.com/JN3rW00E [21:49] after disabling nvidia-glx-* [21:49] can I kill x and start it again? [21:49]